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Can extras have their own Fate points?

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  • Joe Formoso
    Over on RPG.net, there s a discussion going on about creating a Ghostbusters setting for Fate Core. One of the really interesting ideas floated was setting up
    Message 1 of 7 , Feb 23, 2013
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      Over on RPG.net, there's a discussion going on about creating a
      Ghostbusters setting for Fate Core. One of the really interesting ideas
      floated was setting up the Ghostbusters franchise that the characters
      belong to as an extra with its own aspects, skills, etc. A really elegant
      use of the Fate Fractal, I thought -- I can't think of another system
      that could so easily accomodate the way a franchise can have facets that
      don't specifically belong to a particular member of the franchise.

      However, I'm not sure how the Fate point economy works when the
      franchise is, as it were, taking actions. Let's say there's a hostile
      newspaper trying to smear the franchise, so the players want to invoke
      the franchise's "But the kids love us" aspect to add to their Media
      roll. Where does that Fate point come from? If the GM compels the
      franchise's "This building should be condemned" aspect, who gets the
      Fate point? (Yes, a lot of the example aspects in the thread are quotes
      from the movies. I consider this a virtue of the discussion, honestly.)

      Can the franchise have its own pool of Fate points? Or do the
      characters sort of freewheel how the Fate points move in these
      situations?


      --Joe
    • ReaperWolf
      The GB franchise would be an Organization with it s own skills, aspects, and Fate Points which the PCs controlled provided the franchise wasn t revoked by the
      Message 2 of 7 , Feb 23, 2013
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        The GB franchise would be an Organization with it's own skills, aspects, and Fate Points which the PCs controlled provided the franchise wasn't revoked by the parent GBI Organization.

        No idea how FATE Core handles organizations but this is how Starblazer Adventures/Legends of Anglerre would handle it.

        >>ReaperWolf
      • J B Bell
        I think the notion of just use the Fate fractal is pretty on target. The question is how to manage those Fate points. For Ghostbusters specifically, you want
        Message 3 of 7 , Feb 23, 2013
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          I think the notion of "just use the Fate fractal" is pretty on target. The question is how to manage those Fate points.

          For Ghostbusters specifically, you want the players to be scrambling to keep the franchise alive. I'd give it a refresh of no more than one or two, or maybe none at all. Lean hard on the franchise so that it's gasping for Fate points. Then allow players (with suitable narrative justification) to spend their own Fate points to invoke the franchise's Aspects when it comes to the crunch and the franchise is out of its own Fate supply.

          Definitely advance the org just as PCs do--so a Major Milestone would allow an increase to Refresh, etc.

          Another idea would be to steal Diaspora's Wealth stress track. In that game you must pay to keep up your ship. The roll to handle upkeep always "succeeds", but any lack of shifts must be made up by doing what Fate Core would call "succeeding at cost". Maybe have a shared challenge at the end of every session, modified by how well PCs worked to help out the business, with one lead player who has the best skill at doing business (bureaucracy?).

          What ever you do, the franchise should start off quite beleaguered even if the PCs are quite competent. It's a constant story-pump to have a variety of lingering Consequences sitting on your franchise so you have to keep going out and busting ghosts, and you have to worry about the cases you're taking on that save the world but don't make any money. You get the idea, I hope!

          Please post your actual play as this game progresses, it's a great universe to play in.

          --JB
        • gremlin1384
          Fate Core s revised Extras chapter doesn t specifically show any examples of extras with fate points of their own. However, according to the Bronze Rule/Fate
          Message 4 of 7 , Feb 23, 2013
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            Fate Core's revised Extras chapter doesn't specifically show any examples of extras with fate points of their own. However, according to the Bronze Rule/Fate Fractal, there's no reason why an extra couldn't have fate points of its own. They could be assumed as part of the premise, or contributed by the PCs, or whatever. And the GB franchise could have stress tracks, too, if you wanted: "Containment Grid" stress?

            So... basically what ReaperWolf said--Fate Core can handle it the same way LoA did if you so choose.

            --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "ReaperWolf" <lilcoyote@...> wrote:
            >
            > The GB franchise would be an Organization with it's own skills, aspects, and Fate Points which the PCs controlled provided the franchise wasn't revoked by the parent GBI Organization.
            >
            > No idea how FATE Core handles organizations but this is how Starblazer Adventures/Legends of Anglerre would handle it.
            >
            > >>ReaperWolf
            >
          • Joe Formoso
            ... That s a great idea -- the franchise would get a low refresh, and then players *can* spend their own Fate points with appropriate justification. Compels
            Message 5 of 7 , Feb 23, 2013
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              On Sat, 23 Feb 2013, J B Bell wrote:

              > For Ghostbusters specifically, you want the players to be scrambling
              > to keep the franchise alive. I'd give it a refresh of no more than
              > one or two, or maybe none at all. Lean hard on the franchise so that
              > it's gasping for Fate points. Then allow players (with suitable
              > narrative justification) to spend their own Fate points to invoke the
              > franchise's Aspects when it comes to the crunch and the franchise is
              > out of its own Fate supply.
              ----------
              That's a great idea -- the franchise would get a low refresh,
              and then players *can* spend their own Fate points with appropriate
              justification. Compels on the franchise go to the franchise.

              > Another idea would be to steal Diaspora's Wealth stress track. In that
              > game you must pay to keep up your ship. The roll to handle upkeep
              > always "succeeds", but any lack of shifts must be made up by doing
              > what Fate Core would call "succeeding at cost". Maybe have a shared
              > challenge at the end of every session, modified by how well PCs worked
              > to help out the business, with one lead player who has the best skill
              > at doing business (bureaucracy?).
              ----------
              I've never played Diaspora, but I think I follow the gist, and
              it sounds good. I was thinking that a "Finances" stress track for the
              franchise would be appropriate, along with a "PR" stress track.

              > Please post your actual play as this game progresses, it's a great
              > universe to play in.
              ----------
              In truth, I wasn't even thinking about playing it until the
              thread started up on RPG.net. Now that I've seen so many great ideas,
              I'm thinking pretty seriously about giving it a swing. As I've never
              played Fate (either as a GM or a player), that should be pretty funny.

              But should I give it a shot, I'll definitely keep (and share)
              notes.


              --Joe
            • Joe Formoso
              ... Sounds great -- especially the idea of keeping refresh for the franchise low, and making sure its got problems that are going to put pressure on it. The
              Message 6 of 7 , Feb 23, 2013
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                On Sun, 24 Feb 2013, gremlin1384 wrote:

                > Fate Core's revised Extras chapter doesn't specifically show any
                > examples of extras with fate points of their own. However, according to
                > the Bronze Rule/Fate Fractal, there's no reason why an extra couldn't
                > have fate points of its own. They could be assumed as part of the
                > premise, or contributed by the PCs, or whatever.
                ----------
                Sounds great -- especially the idea of keeping refresh for the
                franchise low, and making sure its got problems that are going to put
                pressure on it. The standard "This building should be condemned" and
                "This magnificent feast represents the last of the petty cash" kinds of
                things as aspects. Heck, maybe it *only* has a Main Problem as an
                aspect to start the campaign, and if you want to get postive aspects
                (say, "But the kids love us"), you have to create them (likely against
                established opposition -- unfriendly newspaper, city hall, whoever).

                > And the GB franchise could have stress tracks, too, if you
                > wanted: "Containment Grid" stress?
                ----------
                I was thinking "Finances" and "Public Relations" as stress
                tracks. But "Containment Grid" is pretty great -- because you're just
                not really inhabiting the setting if you don't have the possibility of
                catastrophic containment failure.

                > So... basically what ReaperWolf said--Fate Core can handle it the same
                > way LoA did if you so choose.
                ----------
                An excellent suggestion -- this is where my lack of familiarity
                with *any* incarnation of Fate is a hindrance. Also, I wasn't entirely
                sure that there *wasn't* a method for handling an extra's Fate points
                in the revised Extras chapter, which I had just managed to miss.


                --Joe
              • Chester Mealer
                Here s my take on it. Rarely is the organization going to act rather the players will be acting as members of the organization. So the org gets no FP, but
                Message 7 of 7 , Feb 23, 2013
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                  Here's my take on it. Rarely is the organization going to "act" rather the players will be acting as members of the organization. So the org gets no FP, but you can compel the players based on the org's aspects and they'll get FP like normal, likewise they can tag the org's aspect(s) as if it was their own. 

                  The main skill I could see the org having is "resources" most of the other skills are the result of a specific individual completing the task. For times when it really is about the organization it'll likely still be a player acting as the org, so just give compel FP to that player and let any player spend the FP to tag the aspect on behalf of the organization.

                  The main effect of this is simplified book-keeping, which is not to be underestimated.

                  Chester Mealer


                  On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 10:29 PM, Joe Formoso <jformoso@...> wrote:
                   

                  On Sun, 24 Feb 2013, gremlin1384 wrote:

                  > Fate Core's revised Extras chapter doesn't specifically show any
                  > examples of extras with fate points of their own. However, according to
                  > the Bronze Rule/Fate Fractal, there's no reason why an extra couldn't
                  > have fate points of its own. They could be assumed as part of the
                  > premise, or contributed by the PCs, or whatever.
                  ----------
                  Sounds great -- especially the idea of keeping refresh for the
                  franchise low, and making sure its got problems that are going to put
                  pressure on it. The standard "This building should be condemned" and
                  "This magnificent feast represents the last of the petty cash" kinds of
                  things as aspects. Heck, maybe it *only* has a Main Problem as an
                  aspect to start the campaign, and if you want to get postive aspects
                  (say, "But the kids love us"), you have to create them (likely against
                  established opposition -- unfriendly newspaper, city hall, whoever).


                  > And the GB franchise could have stress tracks, too, if you
                  > wanted: "Containment Grid" stress?
                  ----------
                  I was thinking "Finances" and "Public Relations" as stress
                  tracks. But "Containment Grid" is pretty great -- because you're just
                  not really inhabiting the setting if you don't have the possibility of
                  catastrophic containment failure.


                  > So... basically what ReaperWolf said--Fate Core can handle it the same
                  > way LoA did if you so choose.
                  ----------
                  An excellent suggestion -- this is where my lack of familiarity
                  with *any* incarnation of Fate is a hindrance. Also, I wasn't entirely
                  sure that there *wasn't* a method for handling an extra's Fate points
                  in the revised Extras chapter, which I had just managed to miss.

                  --Joe


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