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Re: [FateRPG] Achtung! Cthulhu How would you add tentacles to FATE?

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  • John Till
    My experience with running a Diaspora campaign for several months now leaves me with a very different impression of FATE than I have had from running SOTC,
    Message 1 of 12 , Mar 17, 2012
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      My experience with running a Diaspora campaign for several months now leaves me with a very different impression of FATE than I have had from running SOTC, Starblazer Adventures, and LOA. A similar game engine produces a much less pulpy, much more serious tone: one amenable to conspiracy (we have a lot of them) and I would imagine even horror games.

      John 

      Sent from my iPad

      On Mar 17, 2012, at 1:40 PM, Bill Burdick <bill.burdick@...> wrote:

       

      I've found that fate point-draining mechanisms like the doom clock work really well for scaring players in a horror setting.


      On Friday, March 16, 2012, subzerolondon <chris@...> wrote:
      >  
      >
      > There was an argument here
      > http://ryanmacklin.com/2011/10/horror-games-die-mechanics/
      >
      > The main issue was re-rolls spoiling the threat of failing a roll. However I think these can be circumvented
      >>
      >> Why is it claimed FATE can't do Cthulhu? Sanity stress track and
      >> consequences ought to cover Cthulhu's downward spiral into madness
      >> perfectly well, surely?

      Bill
      >
      >

    • Travis Casey
      However, as Trail of Cthulhu points out, a lot of Cthulhu stories - even some of Lovecraft s own - have a very pulpy feel to them. Consider, for example, The
      Message 2 of 12 , Mar 18, 2012
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        However, as Trail of Cthulhu points out, a lot of Cthulhu stories - even some of Lovecraft's own - have a very pulpy feel to them. Consider, for example, "The Call of Cthulhu." it's got a big fight with lots of cultists, and has Cthulhu forced to return under the sea not by some eldritch ritual nor even a super-science device, but by running a ship into him!

        --
        Travis Casey
        efindel@...
      • Jess Nevins
        ... In the broadest sense, sure, Lovecraft s stories are pulp, simply because some of them appeared in pulps. However, one of the, if not -the-, core tenets of
        Message 3 of 12 , Mar 18, 2012
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          -----Original Message-----
          >From: Travis Casey <efindel@...>
          >
          >However, as Trail of Cthulhu points out, a lot of Cthulhu stories - even some of Lovecraft's own - have a very pulpy feel to them. Consider, for example, "The Call of Cthulhu." it's got a big fight with lots of cultists, and has Cthulhu forced to return under the sea not by some eldritch ritual nor even a super-science device, but by running a ship into him!

          In the broadest sense, sure, Lovecraft's stories are pulp, simply because some of them
          appeared in pulps.

          However, one of the, if not -the-, core tenets of pulp stories, across genres, is that
          what we (humans) do -matters-. That we can permanently solve crime, defeat evil, conquer
          the West and the solar system/universe, that we will win and those who oppose us will lose,
          that good triumphs over evil.

          The core of the Cthulhu mythos is the opposite: that nothing we do matters, that we
          ourselves don't matter. The good/evil dialectic is irrelevant.

          In that sense Lovecraft's stories are anti-pulp.

          jess
        • Travis Casey
          ... I m not sure that I d agree with that -- there s plenty of pulp works that aren t hopeful in tone, even leaving out all Cthulhu stories. The hero pulps
          Message 4 of 12 , Mar 18, 2012
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            On Mar 18, 2012, at 4:00 PM, Jess Nevins wrote:

            However, one of the, if not -the-, core tenets of pulp stories, across genres, is that

            what we (humans) do -matters-. That we can permanently solve crime, defeat evil, conquer
            the West and the solar system/universe, that we will win and those who oppose us will lose,
            that good triumphs over evil.

            The core of the Cthulhu mythos is the opposite: that nothing we do matters, that we
            ourselves don't matter. The good/evil dialectic is irrelevant.

            In that sense Lovecraft's stories are anti-pulp. 

            I'm not sure that I'd agree with that -- there's plenty of pulp works that aren't hopeful in tone, even leaving out all Cthulhu stories.  The "hero pulps" that spawned superhero fiction are mostly hopeful, but gangster and detective pulps often aren't, and many stories that today would be classified as "noir" appeared in the pulps.

            In any case, though, I'd call that an issue of campaign tone, and not one of mechanics.  I honestly don't see anything about it that would make FATE be ill-suited for Cthulhu.

            --
            Travis Casey
            Reality is vastly overrated.



          • Jess Nevins
            ... A minute fraction of the overall pulps. Taken as a whole, my assessment remains accurate. jess
            Message 5 of 12 , Mar 18, 2012
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              > I'm not sure that I'd agree with that -- there's plenty of pulp works that aren't hopeful in tone, even leaving out all Cthulhu stories.

              A minute fraction of the overall pulps. Taken as a whole, my assessment remains accurate.

              jess
            • subzerolondon
              I suppose then you could ask will we have big fights with lots of Cultists, Nazi s, eldritch creatures and do crazy things with man made inventions to save the
              Message 6 of 12 , Mar 19, 2012
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                I suppose then you could ask will we have big fights with lots of Cultists, Nazi's, eldritch creatures and do crazy things with man made inventions to save the world - of course, will it be dark, terrifying, fear inspiring - definitely.

                Will it be pulp sacharine goodness no, this is where FATE is strong in that the very thought of losing should inspire FATE players with thoughts of all manner of terrible consequences and new Aspects their characters will gain in the 'post Cthulhu apocalypse'...

                I see FATE as rewarding characters for losing with even greater characterisation. Typical pulp stories, like space opera have the good guys winning in the end (but usually to discover an even more dastardly plot to defeat in the next instalment). The more noir style stories I imagine around the Cthulhu mythos are hinged on the very real threat to the world, and very real losses being suffered. It is totally hopeless, it is doomed to failure, but we can survive another day. As all civilisations have done throughout time, men with spears and spells have somehow defeated Cthulhu's minions down the ages. So the context is dark - it is not so much as winning but staving off defeat for another day, another age.



                --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, Jess Nevins <jjnevins@...> wrote:
                >
                > -----Original Message-----
                > >From: Travis Casey <efindel@...>
                > >
                > >However, as Trail of Cthulhu points out, a lot of Cthulhu stories - even some of Lovecraft's own - have a very pulpy feel to them. Consider, for example, "The Call of Cthulhu." it's got a big fight with lots of cultists, and has Cthulhu forced to return under the sea not by some eldritch ritual nor even a super-science device, but by running a ship into him!
                >
                > In the broadest sense, sure, Lovecraft's stories are pulp, simply because some of them
                > appeared in pulps.
                >
                > However, one of the, if not -the-, core tenets of pulp stories, across genres, is that
                > what we (humans) do -matters-. That we can permanently solve crime, defeat evil, conquer
                > the West and the solar system/universe, that we will win and those who oppose us will lose,
                > that good triumphs over evil.
                >
                > The core of the Cthulhu mythos is the opposite: that nothing we do matters, that we
                > ourselves don't matter. The good/evil dialectic is irrelevant.
                >
                > In that sense Lovecraft's stories are anti-pulp.
                >
                > jess
                >
              • subzerolondon
                I firmly believe it s very much based on the GM s decision to run the game in a harder style or not, the variations of FATE can encourage this, but any system
                Message 7 of 12 , Mar 19, 2012
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                  I firmly believe it's very much based on the GM's decision to run the game in a harder style or not, the variations of FATE can encourage this, but any system can be run dark, LoA in fact has some very dark elements in the Anglerre setting.

                  I have run an old space opera rpg...Starships & Spacemen as a horror game (pretty much Star Trek with the no.s filed off). It was classic pulpy goodness but I simply made it more horrific and dangerous. One of the messages in Starblazer was to change or use the rules as you see fit to play the game you want. The first Starblazer playtest campaign had horrific alien minds possessing pirates who assaulted a space station and subsequently became undead. The horror when the players learned they got aboard their ship was priceless.

                  So we can make an Achtung! Cthulhu do whatever we want it to do, though of course my aim is to make life as easy as possible for those GM's who aren't as experienced or indeed new to GM'ing

                  --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, John Till <tallgeese.wing@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > My experience with running a Diaspora campaign for several months now leaves me with a very different impression of FATE than I have had from running SOTC, Starblazer Adventures, and LOA. A similar game engine produces a much less pulpy, much more serious tone: one amenable to conspiracy (we have a lot of them) and I would imagine even horror games.
                  >
                  > John
                  >
                  > Sent from my iPad
                  >
                  > On Mar 17, 2012, at 1:40 PM, Bill Burdick <bill.burdick@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > I've found that fate point-draining mechanisms like the doom clock work really well for scaring players in a horror setting.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > On Friday, March 16, 2012, subzerolondon <chris@...> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > There was an argument here
                  > > > http://ryanmacklin.com/2011/10/horror-games-die-mechanics/
                  > > >
                  > > > The main issue was re-rolls spoiling the threat of failing a roll. However I think these can be circumvented
                  > > >>
                  > > >> Why is it claimed FATE can't do Cthulhu? Sanity stress track and
                  > > >> consequences ought to cover Cthulhu's downward spiral into madness
                  > > >> perfectly well, surely?
                  > >
                  > > Bill
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
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