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Re: [FateRPG] Dark Sun Defiling Mechanism

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  • Brian Sniffen
    Give defilers free tags on those consequences and Defilers will be something to fear! -- Brian Sniffen
    Message 1 of 19 , Sep 2, 2010
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      Give defilers free tags on those consequences and Defilers will be
      something to fear!

      --
      Brian Sniffen

      On Sep 2, 2010, at 9:54 AM, Fred Hicks <evilhat@...> wrote:

      > Give locations stress boxes based on how lush/alive/pure it is. Magic
      > inflicts stress on the location; when consequences happen, they don't
      > go away, and the land is corrupted; if taken out, the entirety of it
      > goes the way of wasteland.
      >
      > On Thursday, September 2, 2010, yog_slogoth <yog_slogoth@...> wrote:
      >> Hi,
      >>
      >> I have been a great fan of the Dark Sun campaign setting from the beginning in the 90's, and with the newest version out I could convince my players to give it a try. Since we had a very good Diaspora campaign I thought of using Fate as the system to play with, especially Legends of Anglerre. From what I read it gives you a toolbox for creating campaign worlds, so it should be able to work. The biggest problem I came to think of: Is there a chance to emulate Defiling in a proper way? Does anybody know or have an idea?
      >>
      >> Thanks in Advance
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> ------------------------------------
      >>
      >> | Fate * http://www.faterpg.com/
      >> | SOTC * http://www.evilhat.com/?spirit
      >> | DFRPG * http://www.dresdenfilesrpg.com/Yahoo! Groups Links
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >
      > --
      > Fred Hicks
      > Evil Hat Productions, LLC
      > www.evilhat.com
      >
      >
      > ------------------------------------
      >
      > | Fate * http://www.faterpg.com/
      > | SOTC * http://www.evilhat.com/?spirit
      > | DFRPG * http://www.dresdenfilesrpg.com/Yahoo! Groups Links
      >
      >
      >
    • chris@zerneeak.com
      In 4th ed Defiling is now a free At-Will power for everyone who uses the arcane power source. When you roll to hit with an arcane power and miss you have the
      Message 2 of 19 , Sep 2, 2010
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        In 4th ed Defiling is now a free At-Will power for everyone who uses the arcane power source. When you roll to hit with an arcane power and miss you have the option to use the defile power which allows you to re-roll. If you do this it does x (can't remember what x is) amount of damage to everyone within 5 squares of you.

        I thought this was a great way to represent defiling in 4e. In Fate I would use the Sponsored Magic rules from Dresden. Essentially their is an aspect called Defiling that all spellcasters have access to. They can tag this aspect anytime they want but each they do they get a defiling token. The GM has an option to compel those tokens without awarding fate points.

        You might add the option that those defiling tokens could be used for other things like giving another character a minor consequence or putting a new aspect on the scene.

        ------------------------------------
        friends don't let friends use IE6 Upgrade IE8 : Switch FF3
        Chris Czerniak

        On Thu Sep 2 6:38 , Emmanuel Kanter sent:

         

        how does it work in the original? I have a dark sun 1st edition ad&d box, but it might have changed to second edition, I don't know... I don't remember the original rules.


        Do they change in 4E?

        Emi

        On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 8:07 AM, yog_slogoth <yog_slogoth@...> wrote:
         

        Hi,

        I have been a great fan of the Dark Sun campaign setting from the beginning in the 90's, and with the newest version out I could convince my players to give it a try. Since we had a very good Diaspora campaign I thought of using Fate as the system to play with, especially Legends of Anglerre. From what I read it gives you a toolbox for creating campaign worlds, so it should be able to work. The biggest problem I came to think of: Is there a chance to emulate Defiling in a proper way? Does anybody know or have an idea?

        Thanks in Advance



      • yog_slogoth
        Sounds like a clean and easy idea!
        Message 3 of 19 , Sep 2, 2010
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          Sounds like a clean and easy idea!

          --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, Brian Sniffen <bts@...> wrote:
          >
          > Give defilers free tags on those consequences and Defilers will be
          > something to fear!
          >
          > --
          > Brian Sniffen
          >
          > On Sep 2, 2010, at 9:54 AM, Fred Hicks <evilhat@...> wrote:
          >
          > > Give locations stress boxes based on how lush/alive/pure it is. Magic
          > > inflicts stress on the location; when consequences happen, they don't
          > > go away, and the land is corrupted; if taken out, the entirety of it
          > > goes the way of wasteland.
          > >
          > > On Thursday, September 2, 2010, yog_slogoth <yog_slogoth@...> wrote:
          > >> Hi,
          > >>
          > >> I have been a great fan of the Dark Sun campaign setting from the beginning in the 90's, and with the newest version out I could convince my players to give it a try. Since we had a very good Diaspora campaign I thought of using Fate as the system to play with, especially Legends of Anglerre. From what I read it gives you a toolbox for creating campaign worlds, so it should be able to work. The biggest problem I came to think of: Is there a chance to emulate Defiling in a proper way? Does anybody know or have an idea?
          > >>
          > >> Thanks in Advance
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>
          > >> ------------------------------------
          > >>
          > >> | Fate * http://www.faterpg.com/
          > >> | SOTC * http://www.evilhat.com/?spirit
          > >> | DFRPG * http://www.dresdenfilesrpg.com/Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>
          > >
          > > --
          > > Fred Hicks
          > > Evil Hat Productions, LLC
          > > www.evilhat.com
          > >
          > >
          > > ------------------------------------
          > >
          > > | Fate * http://www.faterpg.com/
          > > | SOTC * http://www.evilhat.com/?spirit
          > > | DFRPG * http://www.dresdenfilesrpg.com/Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
        • yog_slogoth
          This is very similar to Brians idea and i must say, I like it.
          Message 4 of 19 , Sep 2, 2010
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            This is very similar to Brians idea and i must say, I like it.
          • yog_slogoth
            Sounds like a good idea, but in the moment I d prefer the idea of giving every mage the possibility to invoke the aspect Defiling . Mechanical sligthly
            Message 5 of 19 , Sep 2, 2010
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              Sounds like a good idea, but in the moment I'd prefer the idea of giving every mage the possibility to invoke the aspect "Defiling". Mechanical sligthly clearer in my eyes.

              Maybe I will add a stunt like "Master Defiler", which allows to draw the energy for a spell not only from plants, but this would make more complicated...


              --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, Travis Heldibridle <travis.heldibridle@...> wrote:
              >
              > I'd be quick to jump on the extra stress track, but be careful it doesn't
              > add a lot of book keeping. I'd have site stress reset after each scene so
              > that, if you tend to reuse locations, you won't have to have a running total
              > of stress for several locations. Basically: Nature bounces back quickly
              > unless it is taken out in the course of a scene. If that happens the
              > location is changed dramatically in some way from that point on to reflect
              > it's corrupt nature.
              >
              > Additionally...
              >
              > (I think) Defiler magic should be the standard. Preserver magic should be
              > the result of a stunt that allows the mage to cast without the negative
              > effects of defiler magic. Defiling is the easy path. One must commit to the
              > path of the preserver.
              >
              > I'd probably apply a blanket -2 to magic rolls that occur in corrupted
              > zones, and maybe include a stunt that allows a defiler to avoid corrupting
              > the earth (or avoid the -2 penalty for casting in a corrupted zone) by
              > drawing on the life force of creatures around them. Everyone near the
              > caster, friend or foe, would take a single hit of stress from spells the
              > defiler casts using this stunt.
              > The rest I'd handle in the narrative.
              >
              >
              >
              > On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 10:21 AM, yog_slogoth <yog_slogoth@...> wrote:
              >
              > >
              > >
              > > I really like the idea of stress-levels for a site, and yes there should be
              > > a way to read the level of defilement apart from the obvious. I think Nature
              > > is a good idea or maybe its an occupation-specific stunt for druids. Hmm,
              > > but right now I think Nature is better suited.
              > >
              > > --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com <FateRPG%40yahoogroups.com>, Renato
              > > <renato.ramonda@> wrote:
              > >
              > > >
              > > > On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 3:54 PM, Fred Hicks <evilhat@> wrote:
              > > > > Give locations stress boxes based on how lush/alive/pure it is. Magic
              > > > > inflicts stress on the location; when consequences happen, they don't
              > > > > go away, and the land is corrupted; if taken out, the entirety of it
              > > > > goes the way of wasteland.
              > > >
              > > > Also, allow Nature (or similar) Assessment rolls to "read" the local
              > > > Defilement stress track value when there are no visible Consequences
              > > > yet.
              > > >
              > > > This should add some spice even for careful defilers (and Preservers,
              > > > I guess) since they could be found even if not going blatant?
              > > >
              > > > What do you think?
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > --
              > > > Renato Ramonda
              > > > -------------------------------
              > > > The ship has kinda sailed, you know, the barn's door 's open
              > > > the cows are out, and the bag is really devoid of CATS!
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
            • yog_slogoth
              Reading that again, this sounds to me like a good mechanism for Psionics... But I think it is easier to grasp if just give them the Domination, Alertness and
              Message 6 of 19 , Sep 3, 2010
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                Reading that again, this sounds to me like a good mechanism for Psionics...

                But I think it is easier to grasp if just give them the Domination, Alertness and Telekinsis Power Skills, because we have two players new to Fate.

                --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, Jan Willms <isenhertz@...> wrote:
                >
                > On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 16:32, yog_slogoth <yog_slogoth@...> wrote:
                > > It doesnt sound bad, but I dont know magic in DFRPG works. Could you give a short explanations about this "tapping the Essence"?
                >
                > Okay, I'll try to sum it up (the usual suspects can fill in for things
                > I miss or get wrong):
                >
                > In DFRPG, there are three skills that govern spellcasting: Lore
                > (representing knowledge of the arcane), Conviction (how much force a
                > practitioner brings to the table), and Discipline (how much control
                > the practitioner has over said force).
                >
                > When casting a spell, you decide the power of the spell by determining
                > how many Shifts to pour into it. Since magic in DFRPG comes from
                > within the caster (barring special cases), you take Mental Stress for
                > casting: 1 point if the spell's power level is >= your Conviction,
                > with 1 extra point per Shift above that. (So a spellcaster with a
                > Conviction of Great +3 takes one point of Mental Stress for a spell
                > with a power level of 3, but 2 for a level 4 spell, 3 for level 5, and
                > so on.) You can cast way above your weight class if you're prepared to
                > suffer for it (taking consequences), and if you can't control the
                > spell (rolling Discipline against the spell's intended level) you risk
                > backlash (additional Physical damage) or fallout (spellpower bleeding
                > into the environment, causing havoc -- also a good source of
                > Defilement).
                >
                > Jan
                >
              • Antti Kautiainen
                Use the Dresden mecahnics of Power Gathering, but instead of having limit of energy coming skill causing mental stress on character, each level/shift of effect
                Message 7 of 19 , Sep 4, 2010
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                  Use the Dresden mecahnics of Power Gathering, but instead of having limit of
                  energy

                  coming skill causing mental stress on character, each level/shift of effect
                  drains life force
                  from the location, causing damage to plants and so forth. And the effect should
                  splash

                  over to neighboring areas / zones, if the ffect is high enough. The level of
                  shifts is equal

                  to stress damage done. The skill of energy gathering gathers energy from
                  surroudnign area.
                  The Preservers would use thier internal reservoir in addition to surrouding
                  taking some of

                  the stress as mental stress, but thus limiting the damage done to surroudnigns.
                  I would
                  use the Dresden mechanics on this - they can cast spells equal to the Discipline
                  with only
                  one level of stress to the surrounding area, and every shift above the
                  Dsicipline skill would
                  cause additional level of stress to surroudings - and to be preserver requires
                  you take

                  Preserver Stunt of Discipline allowing energy gathering without consuming
                  energy. I would
                  force Preserver to take the same stress as the surrouding area takes as Mental
                  stress.

                  Thus Defilers would have lots more power to use - but their energy use has
                  consequence
                  of killing plants. Preservers has to stress their own lifeforce in order to
                  control teh flow of

                  energy.

                  The Clerics of Athas should use just Mental Stress for spellcastign like
                  Presrevers does -

                  but they would never damage surroundings, but require theri own element in order
                  to cast
                  spells at all.

                  Yours Katusu



                  ----- Original Message ----
                  From: yog_slogoth <yog_slogoth@...>
                  To: FateRPG@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Thu, September 2, 2010 2:07:27 PM
                  Subject: [FateRPG] Dark Sun Defiling Mechanism

                  Hi,

                  I have been a great fan of the Dark Sun campaign setting from the beginning in
                  the 90's, and with the newest version out I could convince my players to give it
                  a try. Since we had a very good Diaspora campaign I thought of using Fate as the
                  system to play with, especially Legends of Anglerre. From what I read it gives
                  you a toolbox for creating campaign worlds, so it should be able to work. The
                  biggest problem I came to think of: Is there a chance to emulate Defiling in a
                  proper way? Does anybody know or have an idea?

                  Thanks in Advance



                  ------------------------------------

                  | Fate * http://www.faterpg.com/
                  | SOTC * http://www.evilhat.com/?spirit
                  | DFRPG * http://www.dresdenfilesrpg.com/Yahoo! Groups Links
                • Antti Kautiainen
                  As I said in my post, it is better to have Preserver as stunt of the energy gathering skill - that is way better description of the Arcane magic difference of
                  Message 8 of 19 , Sep 4, 2010
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                    As I said in my post, it is better to have Preserver as stunt of the energy
                    gathering skill - that

                    is way better description of the Arcane magic difference of Preserver and
                    Defiler. 1st Edition
                    did botch a lot in Athas, as it created two different classes for Definer and
                    Preserver - in 3rd
                    Edition Preserver was a Feat.

                    But the stress on location depending how much vegetation it has is the way to go
                    - and naturally
                    this track won't suddenly heal - it takes years to recover from damage done by
                    defiling. Preserver
                    uses his will to control the magic in fashion it drains as little energy from
                    plants it can, and thus
                    causes himself mental stress - in addition damaging surrounding less.

                    Psionism is a bit more difficult, but taking it into account how Dark Sun is
                    depicted in

                    fiction, I would go with path making psionics least consuming of supernatural
                    powers - and make
                    psionics to use three skills - one for attack, one for defense, and one for
                    focusing and activating
                    powers - and the different styles of defense and offense should be stunts (or
                    optional stunts) allwing
                    psionic to take one attack power for each level of Psionic Attack he has, and
                    one defense for each
                    level of Psionic Defense. Psionic combat is naturally Mental Stress COnflict -
                    and non-psionics have

                    passive resistance but could not do anything but take damage in. I would say
                    non-psioncs has
                    their Conviction as automatic "threshold" defense - psionicist has to bypass it
                    in order to create
                    connection required for Psionic Combat.

                    I would go with no sterss on psionci powers with shifts up to your Conviction /
                    Psionic Control,

                    and 1 stress for every two shifts above Conviction - but allowing Psionicist
                    only to gather as much
                    power per round he has Conviction - this would make powerful effects more time
                    consuming. AFter
                    energy is gathered, antoehr roll is made how well the energy is controlled and
                    thus wehtehr the

                    psionci can do what he wants. The psionci has to take shifts causing 1 mental
                    damage shift for

                    every level he fails to acquire on control. Gatherign psionic energy is easy -
                    easy way to burn
                    yourself as I think the Dark sun seems to indicate. Psionics may have their own
                    sterss chart
                    in additional to Mental Stress which they can take stress from psionci powers
                    and damage.


                    Yours Kautsu



                    ----- Original Message ----
                    From: yog_slogoth <yog_slogoth@...>
                    To: FateRPG@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Fri, September 3, 2010 10:12:11 AM
                    Subject: [FateRPG] Re: Dark Sun Defiling Mechanism

                    Reading that again, this sounds to me like a good mechanism for Psionics...

                    But I think it is easier to grasp if just give them the Domination, Alertness
                    and Telekinsis Power Skills, because we have two players new to Fate.

                    --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, Jan Willms <isenhertz@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 16:32, yog_slogoth <yog_slogoth@...> wrote:
                    > > It doesnt sound bad, but I dont know magic in DFRPG works. Could you give a
                    >short explanations about this "tapping the Essence"?
                    >
                    > Okay, I'll try to sum it up (the usual suspects can fill in for things
                    > I miss or get wrong):
                    >
                    > In DFRPG, there are three skills that govern spellcasting: Lore
                    > (representing knowledge of the arcane), Conviction (how much force a
                    > practitioner brings to the table), and Discipline (how much control
                    > the practitioner has over said force).
                    >
                    > When casting a spell, you decide the power of the spell by determining
                    > how many Shifts to pour into it. Since magic in DFRPG comes from
                    > within the caster (barring special cases), you take Mental Stress for
                    > casting: 1 point if the spell's power level is >= your Conviction,
                    > with 1 extra point per Shift above that. (So a spellcaster with a
                    > Conviction of Great +3 takes one point of Mental Stress for a spell
                    > with a power level of 3, but 2 for a level 4 spell, 3 for level 5, and
                    > so on.) You can cast way above your weight class if you're prepared to
                    > suffer for it (taking consequences), and if you can't control the
                    > spell (rolling Discipline against the spell's intended level) you risk
                    > backlash (additional Physical damage) or fallout (spellpower bleeding
                    > into the environment, causing havoc -- also a good source of
                    > Defilement).
                    >
                    > Jan
                    >




                    ------------------------------------

                    | Fate * http://www.faterpg.com/
                    | SOTC * http://www.evilhat.com/?spirit
                    | DFRPG * http://www.dresdenfilesrpg.com/Yahoo! Groups Links
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