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Re: [FT897] Mobile power

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  • A.R.S. Alvin Koffman KA9QLQ
    A cig lighter should be good for 20 amps. Alvin [8*9 My homepage where you can get $7.99 a month unlimited internet nationwide. http://ka9qlq.tripod.com/home/
    Message 1 of 24 , May 3, 2003
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      A cig lighter should be good for 20 amps.
      Alvin [8*9
      My homepage where you can get $7.99 a month unlimited internet nationwide.
      http://ka9qlq.tripod.com/home/
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: k6fcw@...
      To: FT897@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 10:14 PM
      Subject: [FT897] Mobile power



      My car's auxiliary power out (formerly the cigarette lighter!) reads 12V and
      10 amps. Since P = V x I = 12 x 10 = 120 watts! Does that mean you can run
      an FT-897 through the cigarette lighter? Doesn't sound safe. What wattage
      level would be safe if 120 watts isn't? How much current through the cig
      lighter is safe? Anybody have some advice for me? (Be polite.)

      Thanks!

      Frank K6FCW



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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    • Al Allum
      Hi Frank, I use my cellphone/computer cigarette lighter receptacle for my Ft-897 also, in my Buick. It s a 15 Amp fuse I believe located under the back seat
      Message 2 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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        Hi Frank,

        I use my cellphone/computer cigarette lighter receptacle for my Ft-897 also,
        in my Buick. It's a 15 Amp fuse I believe located under the back seat if
        you ever blow it. I set the radio for 50 watts out, however, using SSB
        voice I'm sure I'm not pulling 15 Amp. I haven't blown the fuse yet, nor
        have the wires gotten warm.

        Al N8ARO



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Harold Burton
        My 2001 GMC 2500HD pickup truck has a cigarette lighter fused for 10 amps, but it also has two extra auxiliary power plugs, these are fused for 20 amps. I ve
        Message 3 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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          My 2001 GMC 2500HD pickup truck has a cigarette lighter fused for 10 amps,
          but it also has two extra auxiliary power plugs, these are fused for 20
          amps. I've operated my Yaesu FT-1500M with these plugs several times. Seems
          to work just fine, recieve is nice and quiet, have observed no iterference
          with vehicle computer. Have forgotten and had the transceiver left on while
          starting and stopping engine several times inadvertently without bad result,
          perhaps I'm just lucky or maybe this truck, which was designed for heavy
          duty hauling and towing, was just fortuitously engineered.

          Harold
          KD5SAK

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: <k6fcw@...>
          To: <FT897@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 8:30 PM
          Subject: Re: [FT897] Mobile power


          >
          > Robert (and all):
          >
          > Somewhere in the MFJ website material is a statement that a mobile rig
          should
          > not be run higher than 20W thru the cig lighter. I saw that after I
          posted
          > my inquiry. But it sounds like good advice.
          >
          > Frank K6FCW
        • Woodrick, Ed
          That s not a reading, that s a rating. The socket is probably rated for 12V @ 10amps. Now since you battery voltage while running is going to be higher than
          Message 4 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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            That's not a reading, that's a rating. The socket is probably rated for
            12V @ 10amps.

            Now since you battery voltage while running is going to be higher than
            12V, then we can pretty well assume that the rating is incorrect, or
            only a recommendation.

            But if the manufacturer has rated the socket at 10A, then that indeed
            should be the current capacity of the socket.

            But, don't forget that 120 watts refers to the current draw of the
            radio, not the output of the radio. A 100 watt radio usually draws more
            than 100 watts, due to the inefficiencies of the amplifier and the idle
            current required to power the computers and light bulbs in the radio.

            The biggest issue that will probably impact operation is the type of
            fuse that's on the circuit.

            Ed WA4YIH


            ________________________________

            From: k6fcw@... [mailto:k6fcw@...]
            Posted At: Saturday, May 03, 2003 11:15 PM
            Posted To: FT-817
            Conversation: [FT897] Mobile power
            Subject: [FT897] Mobile power



            My car's auxiliary power out (formerly the cigarette lighter!) reads 12V
            and
            10 amps. Since P = V x I = 12 x 10 = 120 watts! Does that mean you
            can run
            an FT-897 through the cigarette lighter? Doesn't sound safe. What
            wattage
            level would be safe if 120 watts isn't? How much current through the
            cig
            lighter is safe? Anybody have some advice for me? (Be polite.)

            Thanks!

            Frank K6FCW



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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          • k9ztv@socket.net
            Friends . . . ANY medium-powered ham gear powered through a cigarette lighter is a bad idea except in emergency situations. Leads should be run DIRECTLY to
            Message 5 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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              Friends . . .

              ANY medium-powered ham gear powered through a cigarette lighter is a bad
              idea except in emergency situations. Leads should be run DIRECTLY to
              the battery to take advantage of the filtering qualities of the battery
              itself.

              Kent K9ZTV



              Al Allum wrote:

              > Hi Frank,
              >
              > I use my cellphone/computer cigarette lighter receptacle for my Ft-897
              > also,
              > in my Buick. It's a 15 Amp fuse I believe located under the back seat if
              > you ever blow it. I set the radio for 50 watts out, however, using SSB
              > voice I'm sure I'm not pulling 15 Amp. I haven't blown the fuse yet, nor
              > have the wires gotten warm.
              >
              > Al N8ARO
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
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              >
              >
              >
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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • superextraclass
              Filtering qualities? Hook up an oscilloscope to an automotive battery under load. Not a very good filter at all. Direct or indirect battery hookups in an
              Message 6 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                Filtering qualities? Hook up an oscilloscope to an automotive
                battery under load. Not a very good filter at all. Direct or
                indirect battery hookups in an automotive environment need filtering.

                Marty - AG4XH


                --- In FT897@yahoogroups.com, k9ztv@s... wrote:
                > Friends . . .
                >
                > ANY medium-powered ham gear powered through a cigarette lighter is
                a bad
                > idea except in emergency situations. Leads should be run DIRECTLY
                to
                > the battery to take advantage of the filtering qualities of the
                battery
                > itself.
                >
                > Kent K9ZTV
                >
                >
                >
                > Al Allum wrote:
                >
                > > Hi Frank,
                > >
                > > I use my cellphone/computer cigarette lighter receptacle for my
                Ft-897
                > > also,
                > > in my Buick. It's a 15 Amp fuse I believe located under the back
                seat if
                > > you ever blow it. I set the radio for 50 watts out, however,
                using SSB
                > > voice I'm sure I'm not pulling 15 Amp. I haven't blown the fuse
                yet, nor
                > > have the wires gotten warm.
                > >
                > > Al N8ARO
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                > >
                > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                > >
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                camp=556&lineid=3179269&prop=egroupweb&pos=HM>
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                > > FT897-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                > >
                > >
                > >
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                Service
                > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Al Allum
                Kent, you are right, however, have you tried to run a wire through the fire wall of a new vehicle? You can hardly even see it. With my 10 year old pickup
                Message 7 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                  Kent, you are right, however, have you tried to run a wire through the fire
                  wall of a new vehicle? You can hardly even see it. With my 10 year old
                  pickup there was room to get a drill under the hood but not in my new cars.
                  And what about leased cars? :>(

                  Al N8ARO




                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • w4cng
                  My direct wired FT-897 draws 18Amps (measured inline) at 13VDC (measured at the rear of the radio) which is 234 watts consumed for 100 watts output on HF (Bird
                  Message 8 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                    My direct wired FT-897 draws 18Amps (measured inline) at 13VDC
                    (measured at the rear of the radio) which is 234 watts consumed for
                    100 watts output on HF (Bird Wattmeter Inline). I have not run it on
                    a cigarett lighter, but if I did, I would not run more than about 50
                    watts output on HF.

                    Good Luck Steve W4CNG

                    --- In FT897@yahoogroups.com, "Woodrick, Ed" <Mail-Lists.FT-817@e...>
                    wrote:
                    > That's not a reading, that's a rating. The socket is probably rated
                    for
                    > 12V @ 10amps.
                    >
                  • k9ztv@socket.net
                    Al . . . You get no argument from me about the difficulties of running wires through firewalls, having wrestled with that problem several times over the years.
                    Message 9 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                      Al . . .

                      You get no argument from me about the difficulties of running wires
                      through firewalls, having wrestled with that problem several times over
                      the years. As for leased cars . . . go ahead and plug the rig in the
                      cigarette lighter. When you blow a fuse, hope JUST a fuse is blown and
                      not one or more computer modules in that leased (read, not-your-own)
                      vehicle.

                      But there is a solution albeit outside the means and/or rpreferences of
                      some people. To my enormous delight upon taking delivery of a new 2000
                      Cadillac DHS thee years ago, there was no battery in the engine
                      compartment. Instead, they located it under the very-easily removed
                      rear seat. For once GM "had a better idea." No battery post corrosion
                      (year-round heating and air-conditioning), no threat of theft, AND . .
                      . no wires to run through firewalls! You dress them under the side
                      trim and sill-plates directly to the battery. Damn fine installation in
                      less than 5 minutes. If I WERE to lease a car with the thought of
                      mobile operation, I'd be looking around for whatever marques and models
                      have an in-car battery, a feature no doubt available even on less
                      costlier vehicles than Cadillacs.


                      My opinion only . . .

                      Kent K9ZTV


                      Al Allum wrote:

                      > Kent, you are right, however, have you tried to run a wire through the
                      > fire
                      > wall of a new vehicle? You can hardly even see it. With my 10 year old
                      > pickup there was room to get a drill under the hood but not in my new
                      > cars.
                      > And what about leased cars? :>(
                      >
                      > Al N8ARO
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
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                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Valveman
                      Hi Frank; You can t run full output power of 100W. You cannot get 100W output from 10A since a radio actually requires 200W input to put out 100W output. There
                      Message 10 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                        Hi Frank;
                        You can't run full output power of 100W.
                        You cannot get 100W output from 10A since a radio
                        actually requires 200W input to put out 100W output.
                        There is a 50% derating factor in amplifiers. So you
                        need at least 20A. I'm not sure if the FT897 likes
                        any voltage less than 13.8V. You could run the rig at
                        25-50W. The only thing is to make sure the wiring of
                        your lighter can handle it for long duration.

                        Robert VE3RPF


                        --- k6fcw@... wrote: >
                        > My car's auxiliary power out (formerly the cigarette
                        > lighter!) reads 12V and
                        > 10 amps. Since P = V x I = 12 x 10 = 120 watts!
                        > Does that mean you can run
                        > an FT-897 through the cigarette lighter? Doesn't
                        > sound safe. What wattage
                        > level would be safe if 120 watts isn't? How much
                        > current through the cig
                        > lighter is safe? Anybody have some advice for me?
                        > (Be polite.)
                        >
                        > Thanks!
                        >
                        > Frank K6FCW
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                        > removed]
                        >
                        >

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                      • Cortland
                        Frank, Most rigs should not be run from accessory power outlets -- formerly cigar lighters -- provided on motor vehicles. There are a couple of reasons.
                        Message 11 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                          Frank,

                          Most rigs should not be run from "accessory power outlets" --
                          formerly "cigar lighters" -- provided on motor vehicles. There are a
                          couple of reasons. The outlets are connected to the battery through
                          relatively high resistance wiring, and you will see a noticable and
                          perhaps objectionable voltage drop at transmit power levels. In
                          addition, they are somewhat prone to transients and noise from other
                          on-vehicle systems, with possible ill effects on the rig connected to
                          them, and, depending how they obtain power, RF on the rig may also
                          more easily affect vehicle relays, instroments and so on. For
                          temporary use, many people use a power cord with crocodile clips
                          running direct to the battery posts. But you can try. 20 watts
                          should be do-able, 50 watts just possible.

                          Good luck!

                          Cortland

                          --- In FT897@yahoogroups.com, k6fcw@a... wrote:
                          > Does that mean you can run
                          > an FT-897 through the cigarette lighter? Doesn't sound safe.
                          What wattage
                        • Cortland
                          Frank, Most rigs should not be run from accessory power outlets -- formerly cigar lighters -- provided on motor vehicles. There are a couple of reasons.
                          Message 12 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                            Frank,

                            Most rigs should not be run from "accessory power outlets" --
                            formerly "cigar lighters" -- provided on motor vehicles. There are a
                            couple of reasons. The outlets are connected to the battery through
                            relatively high resistance wiring, and you will see a noticable and
                            perhaps objectionable voltage drop at transmit power levels. In
                            addition, they are somewhat prone to transients and noise from other
                            on-vehicle systems, with possible ill effects on the rig connected to
                            them, and, depending how they obtain power, RF on the rig may also
                            more easily affect vehicle relays, instroments and so on. For
                            temporary use, many people use a power cord with crocodile clips
                            running direct to the battery posts. But you can try. 20 watts
                            should be do-able, 50 watts just possible.

                            Good luck!

                            Cortland

                            --- In FT897@yahoogroups.com, k6fcw@a... wrote:
                            > Does that mean you can run
                            > an FT-897 through the cigarette lighter? Doesn't sound safe.
                            What wattage
                          • Harold Burton
                            ... From: Björn Mohr To: Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:56 AM Subject: SV: [FT897] Mobile power My Chevy Tahoe has a
                            Message 13 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: "Björn Mohr" <bm@...>
                              To: <FT897@yahoogroups.com>
                              Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:56 AM
                              Subject: SV: [FT897] Mobile power



                              My Chevy Tahoe has a similar arrangement rated 20A each. I have used it with
                              my IC-706 and other radios without problems before finally installing
                              cabling. The Tahoe owner's manual states that shortwave equipment up to 100
                              watts are safe to use without interfering with vehicle systems.


                              73 de Björn /SM0MDG

                              Thanks for the info, maybe GM has improved the owners manual since my model
                              year (2001), my GMC owners manual gave me no shortwave specific reassurances
                              (Had to go to the GM website and do some searching to get any info re 2 way
                              radios at all.) Since my FT-1500M transceiver tops out at 50 watts the 100
                              watt limit should give me a lot of safe leeway.

                              Harold
                              KD5SAK
                            • k6fcw@aol.com
                              Robert (and all): Somewhere in the MFJ website material is a statement that a mobile rig should not be run higher than 20W thru the cig lighter. I saw that
                              Message 14 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                                Robert (and all):

                                Somewhere in the MFJ website material is a statement that a mobile rig should
                                not be run higher than 20W thru the cig lighter. I saw that after I posted
                                my inquiry. But it sounds like good advice.

                                Frank K6FCW



                                >
                                > Hi Frank;
                                > You can't run full output power of 100W.
                                > You cannot get 100W output from 10A since a radio
                                > actually requires 200W input to put out 100W output.
                                > There is a 50% derating factor in amplifiers. So you
                                > need at least 20A. I'm not sure if the FT897 likes
                                > any voltage less than 13.8V. You could run the rig at
                                > 25-50W. The only thing is to make sure the wiring of
                                > your lighter can handle it for long duration.
                                >
                                > Robert VE3RPF
                                >



                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • k6fcw@aol.com
                                Thanks, Cortland. See my previous message about the recommendation not to run a rig higher than 20W outpout with power thru a cig lighter (or whatever it s
                                Message 15 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                                  Thanks, Cortland. See my previous message about the recommendation not to
                                  run a rig higher than 20W outpout with power thru a cig lighter (or whatever
                                  it's called now!)!

                                  Frank K6FCW



                                  > But you can try. 20 watts
                                  > should be do-able, 50 watts just possible.
                                  >
                                  > Good luck!
                                  >
                                  > Cortland
                                  >



                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Valveman
                                  I have not seen that info but it could very well be possible. I suppose it may have allot to do with the length of wire going to the fuse box and then to the
                                  Message 16 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                                    I have not seen that info but it could very well be
                                    possible. I suppose it may have allot to do with the
                                    length of wire going to the fuse box and then to the
                                    battery as well as all the new electronics in today's
                                    cars. RF may be a problem and a long run can
                                    certainly act as a radiator. The best situation is to
                                    have the rig connected directly to the battery,.

                                    Robert VE3RPF


                                    --- k6fcw@... wrote: >
                                    > Robert (and all):
                                    >
                                    > Somewhere in the MFJ website material is a statement
                                    > that a mobile rig should
                                    > not be run higher than 20W thru the cig lighter. I
                                    > saw that after I posted
                                    > my inquiry. But it sounds like good advice.
                                    >
                                    > Frank K6FCW
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > >
                                    > > Hi Frank;
                                    > > You can't run full output power of 100W.
                                    > > You cannot get 100W output from 10A since a radio
                                    > > actually requires 200W input to put out 100W
                                    > output.
                                    > > There is a 50% derating factor in amplifiers. So
                                    > you
                                    > > need at least 20A. I'm not sure if the FT897
                                    > likes
                                    > > any voltage less than 13.8V. You could run the
                                    > rig at
                                    > > 25-50W. The only thing is to make sure the wiring
                                    > of
                                    > > your lighter can handle it for long duration.
                                    > >
                                    > > Robert VE3RPF
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                                    > removed]
                                    >
                                    >

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                                  • A.R.S. Alvin Koffman KA9QLQ
                                    I ran a FT-530 and 80w amp off a cig plug until I got around to wiring up a straight connect a year later. No problems, BUT my 83 Dodge Ram van doesn t have
                                    Message 17 of 24 , May 4, 2003
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                                      I ran a FT-530 and 80w amp off a cig plug until I got around to wiring up a straight connect a year later. No problems, BUT my '83 Dodge Ram van doesn't have all the StarTrek stuff under the hood ether.
                                      Alvin [8*9
                                      My homepage where you can get $7.99 a month unlimited internet nationwide.
                                      http://ka9qlq.tripod.com/home/
                                      ----- Original Message -----
                                      From: Valveman
                                      To: FT897@yahoogroups.com
                                      Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 9:43 PM
                                      Subject: Re: [FT897] Mobile power


                                      I have not seen that info but it could very well be
                                      possible. I suppose it may have allot to do with the
                                      length of wire going to the fuse box and then to the
                                      battery as well as all the new electronics in today's
                                      cars. RF may be a problem and a long run can
                                      certainly act as a radiator. The best situation is to
                                      have the rig connected directly to the battery,.

                                      Robert VE3RPF


                                      --- k6fcw@... wrote: >
                                      > Robert (and all):
                                      >
                                      > Somewhere in the MFJ website material is a statement
                                      > that a mobile rig should
                                      > not be run higher than 20W thru the cig lighter. I
                                      > saw that after I posted
                                      > my inquiry. But it sounds like good advice.
                                      >
                                      > Frank K6FCW
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > >
                                      > > Hi Frank;
                                      > > You can't run full output power of 100W.
                                      > > You cannot get 100W output from 10A since a radio
                                      > > actually requires 200W input to put out 100W
                                      > output.
                                      > > There is a 50% derating factor in amplifiers. So
                                      > you
                                      > > need at least 20A. I'm not sure if the FT897
                                      > likes
                                      > > any voltage less than 13.8V. You could run the
                                      > rig at
                                      > > 25-50W. The only thing is to make sure the wiring
                                      > of
                                      > > your lighter can handle it for long duration.
                                      > >
                                      > > Robert VE3RPF
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                                      > removed]
                                      >
                                      >

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                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Björn Mohr
                                      ... My Chevy Tahoe has a similar arrangement rated 20A each. I have used it with my IC-706 and other radios without problems before finally installing cabling.
                                      Message 18 of 24 , May 5, 2003
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                                        > My 2001 GMC 2500HD pickup truck has a cigarette lighter fused
                                        > for 10 amps, but it also has two extra auxiliary power plugs,
                                        > these are fused for 20 amps.

                                        My Chevy Tahoe has a similar arrangement rated 20A each. I have used it with
                                        my IC-706 and other radios without problems before finally installing
                                        cabling. The Tahoe owner's manual states that shortwave equipment up to 100
                                        watts are safe to use without interfering with vehicle systems.


                                        73 de Björn /SM0MDG
                                      • Al Allum
                                        Hi Group, There has been a lot of talk about not running a radio on the cigarette lighter receptacle. That being said, how do You run the power feed to the
                                        Message 19 of 24 , May 5, 2003
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                                          Hi Group,

                                          There has been a lot of talk about not running a radio on the cigarette
                                          lighter receptacle. That being said, how do "You" run the power feed to
                                          the battery on a newer automobile? How do you get through the firewall?
                                          Please share you successes.

                                          Thanks,
                                          Al N8ARO


                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • w4cng
                                          I have used the same grommet that other wires have been run thru, drilled holes next to existing grommets that I can see both sides of so I know where the
                                          Message 20 of 24 , May 5, 2003
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                                            I have used the same grommet that other wires have been run thru,
                                            drilled holes next to existing grommets that I can see both sides of
                                            so I know where the drill is going (always use a grommet on the hole
                                            to prevent chaffing the wire). In some makes the speedometer cable
                                            entry grommet is very large and has spare room in it. Stay away from
                                            the area around the fuse block if on the firewall, also stay away
                                            from the area around the brake linkages, accelerator and clutch
                                            linkages. You may find an area under the carpet near the floor to
                                            firewall junction. Most newer GM cars now have the battery under the
                                            rear seat, next to the On-Star Cell phone, so it can survive a crash
                                            and still phone for help.

                                            Good luck and Good Drilling
                                            Steve W4CNG

                                            How do you get through the firewall?
                                            > Please share you successes.
                                            >
                                            > Thanks,
                                            > Al N8ARO
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Dan Dowell
                                            I agree. Drilling holes in the fire wall in my new truck is not on my top ten list of things to do. I really dont need that type of hook up because all I
                                            Message 21 of 24 , May 5, 2003
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                                              I agree. Drilling holes in the fire wall in my new truck is not on my top
                                              ten list of things to do. I really dont need that type of hook up because
                                              all I use in the truck is a 5W FT-817. It does real well plugged into the
                                              computer AUX port next to the cigarette lighter. No noise from the engine
                                              at all. For people who do need to connect directly to the battery, going
                                              through the fire wall and all that wiring stuff done properly is a huge
                                              mystery.


                                              Dan
                                              KD5SOM













                                              Al Allum wrote:

                                              > Hi Group,
                                              >
                                              > There has been a lot of talk about not running a radio on the cigarette
                                              > lighter receptacle. That being said, how do "You" run the power feed to
                                              > the battery on a newer automobile? How do you get through the firewall?
                                              > Please share you successes.
                                              >
                                              > Thanks,
                                              > Al N8ARO
                                              >
                                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                              > FT897-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                            • Norm, W3IZ
                                              No offense intended, but why do people have a problem with drilling a hole in metal? Especially where it is not seen and when done properly will not leak or
                                              Message 22 of 24 , May 5, 2003
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                                                No offense intended, but why do people have a problem with drilling a hole in metal? Especially where it is not seen and when done properly will not leak or whistle. Ten days after I brought it home, I was under my 2001 Cavalier with an acetylene torch welding a bracket to the frame for my High Sierra antenna. My wife questioned me and I told her that I signed the papers and the car is mine to do as I please. Then I snapped down my facemask and sparked a blue flame. I painted the antenna and bracket to match the car.

                                                http://mywebpages.comcast.net/w3iz/mobile.html

                                                May I suggest that you watch a program on Discovery channel called "Monster Garage" and another called "American Chopper". If I had the shop and the talent that these guys have I would cut the fender and mount the antenna inside it and do the bodywork to make it look like it was OEM and part of the design, molded right in. Just my $.02 worth.
                                                73,
                                                Norm, W3IZ

                                                http://mywebpages.comcast.net/w3iz/w3iz.html
                                                ----- Original Message -----


                                                I agree. Drilling holes in the fire wall in my new truck is not on my top
                                                ten list of things to do.


                                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              • Bill East
                                                All cars including late model automobiles have to pass bundles of wires through the firewall. Generally they enter into the passenger compartment in locations
                                                Message 23 of 24 , May 7, 2003
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                                                  All cars including late model automobiles have to pass bundles of wires
                                                  through the firewall. Generally they enter into the passenger compartment
                                                  in locations on either side of the engine. Look for such a wiring bundle and
                                                  it is rubber grommet seal mechanism up high on the firewall.The hole for
                                                  these wires is usually far greater than necessary . I often make a small
                                                  cut in the rubber boot with a tiny pen knife . Be careful not to damage any
                                                  of the nearby wiring harness .
                                                  Then straighten out a "white" coat hanger cause it is easy to see when you
                                                  get down and look up behind the dash for the coat hanger poking through.

                                                  good luck
                                                  ve4aaz

                                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                                  From: "Al Allum" <alallum@...>
                                                  To: <FT897@yahoogroups.com>
                                                  Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 12:36
                                                  Subject: RE: [FT897] Re: Mobile power


                                                  > Hi Group,
                                                  >
                                                  > There has been a lot of talk about not running a radio on the cigarette
                                                  > lighter receptacle. That being said, how do "You" run the power feed to
                                                  > the battery on a newer automobile? How do you get through the firewall?
                                                  > Please share you successes.
                                                  >
                                                  > Thanks,
                                                  > Al N8ARO
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                                  > FT897-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
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