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RE: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:

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  • Mark Vaughan
    You know this is all a bit funny really. Yes I agree with some of your arguments regarding the design limitations, the radio could well be designed in a manner
    Message 1 of 11 , Feb 1 2:17 AM
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      You know this is all a bit funny really.

      Yes I agree with some of your arguments regarding the design limitations,
      the radio could well be designed in a manner where 27MHz use would have
      problems.

      But lets draw back from technicalities for a moment.



      We seem to have over the past few years had several new ham bands added to
      our list, and very simple mods have permitted us to open / wide band our kit
      to take advantage of these without any other issues.

      Worst problem area is 6M AM/SSB where it was designed to run and most don't
      very well.

      Now Yaesu didn't design our radios specifically to work these new ham bands,
      for if they had we would be able to switch just that band on, rather than
      open all HF bands.

      It would seem very improbable that our kit would not work well in the 27MHz
      area, which could equally as well be given to hams as any other space, and
      in some countries there is pressure on the authorities to actually do this.
      ( I think some want us to technically police the CB fraternity)



      27MHz is also very close to 28MHz a valid ham band in many countries, it is
      rare to find any operational restriction that close on a band edge, to
      permit the manufacturer to keep things cheap and get away with poor build
      tolerances.



      It would seem much more probable that the radio is designed to operate as
      widely as possible within the HF space, in case any additions be added,
      though there could be just that one spot still where the smoke escapes and
      who knows where that is.



      I would also think Yaesu expect these to be operated illegally on CB bands
      by a few customers as has always been the case with ham kit. Rather than
      risk many warranty returns, it would be far easier just to be sure it works
      totally there, or not at all, Yaesu already suffered from this with some of
      their early valve kit back in the 70's.



      As to antennas, whilst CB antennas are pretty cheap in construction, most
      will survive far more power than that produced by an 897 or 857 output.



      Just a few thoughts.



      So will it work, won't it work, based on the trend it probably will.



      73 Mark



      Dr. Mark Vaughan Ph'D., B.Eng. M0VAU

      Managing Director

      Vaughan Industries Ltd., reg in UK no 2561068

      Water Care Technology Ltd, reg in UK no 4129351

      Addr Unit3, Sydney House, Blackwater, Truro, Cornwall, TR4 8HH UK.

      Phone/Fax 44 (0) 1872 561288

      RSGB DRM111 (Cornwall)

      _____

      From: FT897@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FT897@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
      kc3vo@...
      Sent: 31 January 2008 19:46
      To: FT897@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:



      It is POSSIBLE to operate most HF amateur radio equipment on 27 mhz,
      although in many cases, it is not LEGAL. If operation on other than
      designed/amateur frequencies is contemplated, one must be aware of certain
      limitations, such
      as : range of the output harmonic filter, stray resonances in circuit
      components, duty cycle/mode of operation, and output power used. --Inasmuch
      as 26
      to 28 mhz is not an amateur band, and operation thereupon with amateur
      equipment is discouraged by most amateurs and regulatory agencies, sometimes
      these
      undesirable, but unavoidable, stray resonances are deliberately shifted into

      the 27 mhz region, where they will not affect proper amateur operation.
      (The plate choke in a linear amplifier is an example, as is the negative
      feedback network in a solid-state P.A. stage. ) If operating such a radio in
      AM or
      FM mode, rather than SSB/CW, duty cycle and carrier power also become
      important, and as is the case on amateur frequencies, AM carrier should
      normally be
      set at no more than 25% of the rated SSB PEP power, or 25 watts AM carrier
      for a typical 100 watt SSB radio. On FM, it is usually best to reduce output

      to 50% or less of the SSB rated power, if lengthy transmissions are
      anticipated. There is still no guarantee that your radio will perform safely
      and
      reliably on 26-28 mhz, and in many areas, the legal authorities may
      confiscate
      your money or equipment/license for such activity. I do not advise operating

      illegally, as such activity casts a bad light on amateur radio, so if you
      desire to operate on other than amateur frequencies, please use equipment
      that is
      legal for the purpose, in the approved manner. Proper operation, and respect

      for communications laws, will be in our long-term interests in keeping our
      frequency allocations or adding to them!--------73, KC3VO-Bob Curry

      **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.
      http://body.
      <http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489>
      aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Joe
      Right! And you can bet money that Yaesu is clandestinely supporting non-legal band operation of their radios. (ie: 27 MHz operation) Good for sales! After
      Message 2 of 11 , Feb 1 6:41 AM
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        Right!

        And you can bet money that Yaesu is clandestinely supporting
        non-legal band operation of their radios. (ie: 27 MHz operation) Good for
        sales!

        After all, Yaesu owes everything that it is to the CB'ers...it was the
        CB'ers that
        purchased many of the FT-101's in the 70's and put Yaesu 'on the map'!

        It seems that almost all of the 101's I see being sold today in swap meets,
        or coming out of SK sales, have 27 MHz crystals installed. HEH...they sure
        didn't come from Yaesu with them installed!

        Joe
        WA6RKN


        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Mark Vaughan" <mark@...>
        Subject: RE: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:


        > You know this is all a bit funny really.

        > I would also think Yaesu expect these to be operated illegally on CB bands
        > by a few customers as has always been the case with ham kit. Rather than
        > risk many warranty returns, it would be far easier just to be sure it
        > works
        > totally there, or not at all, Yaesu already suffered from this with some
        > of
        > their early valve kit back in the 70's.
      • Dan Schaaf
        Yes, and many FL-2100B amplifiers have been detuned on 10 m to cover the 11 meter band. I still say, if it is Illegal, then it is Illegal. Of course today s
        Message 3 of 11 , Feb 1 6:50 AM
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          Yes, and many FL-2100B amplifiers have been detuned on 10 m to cover the 11 meter band.

          I still say, if it is Illegal, then it is Illegal. Of course today's generation of people feel that the law does not apply to them. Speaking for the USA only as I do not know the laws in the UK or other countries. And I will not be part and parcel to helping someone break the law. There are laws governing being an accomplice to a crime.


          Best Regards
          Dan Schaaf
          K3ZXL www.k3zxl.com "In the Beginning, there was Spark Gap"

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Joe
          To: FT897@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 9:41 AM
          Subject: Re: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:


          Right!

          And you can bet money that Yaesu is clandestinely supporting
          non-legal band operation of their radios. (ie: 27 MHz operation) Good for
          sales!

          After all, Yaesu owes everything that it is to the CB'ers...it was the
          CB'ers that
          purchased many of the FT-101's in the 70's and put Yaesu 'on the map'!

          It seems that almost all of the 101's I see being sold today in swap meets,
          or coming out of SK sales, have 27 MHz crystals installed. HEH...they sure
          didn't come from Yaesu with them installed!

          Joe
          WA6RKN

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "Mark Vaughan" <mark@...>
          Subject: RE: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:

          > You know this is all a bit funny really.

          > I would also think Yaesu expect these to be operated illegally on CB bands
          > by a few customers as has always been the case with ham kit. Rather than
          > risk many warranty returns, it would be far easier just to be sure it
          > works
          > totally there, or not at all, Yaesu already suffered from this with some
          > of
          > their early valve kit back in the 70's.





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • ARLHS / USCGA / K2JXW / OEM
          I may be wrong, but as of a month or so ago the FCC lifted the ban on linears that cover 27 MHz, and it NEVER was illegal for hams to modify a linear to run 1
          Message 4 of 11 , Feb 1 7:08 AM
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            I may be wrong, but as of a month or so ago the FCC lifted the ban on
            linears that cover 27 MHz, and it NEVER was illegal for hams to modify a
            linear to run 1 KW in 10 Meters; in fact, even with the selling ban in
            place, most 10 M linear manufacturers provided mod info so licensed hams
            could make the change and "upgrade."

            Nevertheless, it is STILL illegal to have a 27 MHz linear running more than
            the legal limit.

            K2JXW



            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "Dan Schaaf" <dan-schaaf@...>
            To: <FT897@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 9:50 AM
            Subject: Re: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:


            > Yes, and many FL-2100B amplifiers have been detuned on 10 m to cover the
            > 11 meter band.
            >
            > I still say, if it is Illegal, then it is Illegal. Of course today's
            > generation of people feel that the law does not apply to them. Speaking
            > for the USA only as I do not know the laws in the UK or other countries.
            > And I will not be part and parcel to helping someone break the law. There
            > are laws governing being an accomplice to a crime.
            >
            >
            > Best Regards
            > Dan Schaaf
            > K3ZXL www.k3zxl.com "In the Beginning, there was Spark Gap"
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: Joe
            > To: FT897@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 9:41 AM
            > Subject: Re: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:
            >
            >
            > Right!
            >
            > And you can bet money that Yaesu is clandestinely supporting
            > non-legal band operation of their radios. (ie: 27 MHz operation) Good for
            > sales!
            >
            > After all, Yaesu owes everything that it is to the CB'ers...it was the
            > CB'ers that
            > purchased many of the FT-101's in the 70's and put Yaesu 'on the map'!
            >
            > It seems that almost all of the 101's I see being sold today in swap
            > meets,
            > or coming out of SK sales, have 27 MHz crystals installed. HEH...they
            > sure
            > didn't come from Yaesu with them installed!
            >
            > Joe
            > WA6RKN
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: "Mark Vaughan" <mark@...>
            > Subject: RE: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:
            >
            > > You know this is all a bit funny really.
            >
            > > I would also think Yaesu expect these to be operated illegally on CB
            > bands
            > > by a few customers as has always been the case with ham kit. Rather
            > than
            > > risk many warranty returns, it would be far easier just to be sure it
            > > works
            > > totally there, or not at all, Yaesu already suffered from this with
            > some
            > > of
            > > their early valve kit back in the 70's.
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
          • Mark Vaughan
            It s against the law in the UK as well, but seems they sacked all the officers that check up on illegal transmitters, and all of a sudden there s a big boom in
            Message 5 of 11 , Feb 1 11:00 AM
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              It's against the law in the UK as well, but seems they sacked all the
              officers that check up on illegal transmitters, and all of a sudden there's
              a big boom in them.

              In the old days this would lead to lots of TVI and people complaining but
              now most people receive TV by satellite or digital interference is less of
              an issue.



              Now here's a totally contradictory thought, if we tell more CBers how to get
              powerful kit up and running, they might cause enough trouble to get the
              Ofcom officers reemployed and we can send them out to stop issues that do
              interfere with ham. At present I have reported an awful lot of illegal
              activity, not a single guy with a burner, but importers selling tons of
              illegal kit and Ofcom don't want to know.



              We even have service engineers cooking themselves on commercial masts
              because no one want's to monitor them.



              As regards legal issues I think there are a few countries that don't require
              approved kit for CB use, and if your in a country where CB is better
              monitored than your Ham bands, perhaps the ability for use in emergency is a
              good thing where approval doesn't apply.



              73 Mark



              Dr. Mark Vaughan Ph'D., B.Eng. M0VAU

              Managing Director

              Vaughan Industries Ltd., reg in UK no 2561068

              Water Care Technology Ltd, reg in UK no 4129351

              Addr Unit3, Sydney House, Blackwater, Truro, Cornwall, TR4 8HH UK.

              Phone/Fax 44 (0) 1872 561288

              RSGB DRM111 (Cornwall)

              _____

              From: FT897@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FT897@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dan
              Schaaf
              Sent: 01 February 2008 14:50
              To: FT897@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:



              Yes, and many FL-2100B amplifiers have been detuned on 10 m to cover the 11
              meter band.

              I still say, if it is Illegal, then it is Illegal. Of course today's
              generation of people feel that the law does not apply to them. Speaking for
              the USA only as I do not know the laws in the UK or other countries. And I
              will not be part and parcel to helping someone break the law. There are laws
              governing being an accomplice to a crime.

              Best Regards
              Dan Schaaf
              K3ZXL www.k3zxl.com "In the Beginning, there was Spark Gap"

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Joe
              To: FT897@yahoogroups. <mailto:FT897%40yahoogroups.com> com
              Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 9:41 AM
              Subject: Re: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:

              Right!

              And you can bet money that Yaesu is clandestinely supporting
              non-legal band operation of their radios. (ie: 27 MHz operation) Good for
              sales!

              After all, Yaesu owes everything that it is to the CB'ers...it was the
              CB'ers that
              purchased many of the FT-101's in the 70's and put Yaesu 'on the map'!

              It seems that almost all of the 101's I see being sold today in swap meets,
              or coming out of SK sales, have 27 MHz crystals installed. HEH...they sure
              didn't come from Yaesu with them installed!

              Joe
              WA6RKN

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "Mark Vaughan" <mark@.... <mailto:mark%40vil.uk.com> com>
              Subject: RE: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:

              > You know this is all a bit funny really.

              > I would also think Yaesu expect these to be operated illegally on CB bands
              > by a few customers as has always been the case with ham kit. Rather than
              > risk many warranty returns, it would be far easier just to be sure it
              > works
              > totally there, or not at all, Yaesu already suffered from this with some
              > of
              > their early valve kit back in the 70's.

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • G7IZR
              The law on selling 10m only equipment was relaxed, that s why there are tons of SSB CB s for sale. What illegal imports are you talking about? Nick
              Message 6 of 11 , Feb 1 12:39 PM
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                The law on selling 10m only equipment was relaxed, that's why there are
                tons of SSB CB's for sale. What illegal imports are you talking about?

                Nick


                Mark Vaughan wrote:
                >
                > At present I have reported an awful lot of illegal
                > activity, not a single guy with a burner, but importers selling tons of
                > illegal kit and Ofcom don't want to know.
                >
              • Mark Vaughan
                The first complaint issued regarded GMR/FRS radio kit from the USA which is illegal in the UK, both hand helds that are pretty harmless, and an Ebayer that was
                Message 7 of 11 , Feb 1 1:57 PM
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                  The first complaint issued regarded GMR/FRS radio kit from the USA which is
                  illegal in the UK, both hand helds that are pretty harmless, and an Ebayer
                  that was bringing in base station units with 200W output. He also had 200W
                  PMR446 transceivers. Ofcom didn't want to know, though ebay chucked the guy
                  but I'm sure he's still trading, two years ago he was bringing in 7
                  container loads at a time and proud of it.



                  Then another guy was bringing in VHF stuff in the business PMR bands and
                  selling for any one to use without license, again no response from Ofcom. We
                  had a load of Arabic speakers on these both in the PMR and Ham VHF bands
                  somewhere local at the time just after 911, which seemed strange, and risky
                  but still no authority was bothered.



                  So I made contact with the director of investigation, and I'm afraid it
                  doesn't make any difference at that level either, despite claiming they will
                  police things they can't be bothered.



                  Locally we have a Tesco's petrol station, the pumps of which when replaced
                  knock out VHF for a half to one mile range of the station, an EMC issue,
                  again no response.

                  I knew the Ofcom inspector fairly well, and when he was employed he would
                  have acted upon these issues, now it seems if you want an issue sorted you
                  do it in the courts yourself under the environmental act. At least that is
                  what Ofcom has suggested to commercial operators.



                  Now if you do 75mph and use a mic, and bite an apple that might be another
                  issue :-)



                  73 Mark



                  Dr. Mark Vaughan Ph'D., B.Eng. M0VAU

                  Managing Director

                  Vaughan Industries Ltd., reg in UK no 2561068

                  Water Care Technology Ltd, reg in UK no 4129351

                  Addr Unit3, Sydney House, Blackwater, Truro, Cornwall, TR4 8HH UK.

                  Phone/Fax 44 (0) 1872 561288

                  RSGB DRM111 (Cornwall)

                  _____

                  From: FT897@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FT897@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                  G7IZR
                  Sent: 01 February 2008 20:39
                  To: FT897@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:



                  The law on selling 10m only equipment was relaxed, that's why there are
                  tons of SSB CB's for sale. What illegal imports are you talking about?

                  Nick

                  Mark Vaughan wrote:
                  >
                  > At present I have reported an awful lot of illegal
                  > activity, not a single guy with a burner, but importers selling tons of
                  > illegal kit and Ofcom don't want to know.
                  >





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • G7IZR
                  That explains something, thanks!! Every time I drive near our local, 2m is wiped out for around half a mile. I wondered what it was!!!
                  Message 8 of 11 , Feb 1 2:34 PM
                  • 0 Attachment
                    That explains something, thanks!! Every time I drive near our local, 2m
                    is wiped out for around half a mile. I wondered what it was!!!

                    Mark Vaughan wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > Locally we have a Tesco's petrol station, the pumps of which when replaced
                    > knock out VHF for a half to one mile range of the station, an EMC issue,
                    > again no response.
                    >
                  • Mark Vaughan
                    That s curious, I take it your Tesco s isn t in Camborne. Dr. Mark Vaughan Ph D., B.Eng. M0VAU Managing Director Vaughan Industries Ltd., reg in UK no 2561068
                    Message 9 of 11 , Feb 1 2:58 PM
                    • 0 Attachment
                      That's curious, I take it your Tesco's isn't in Camborne.



                      Dr. Mark Vaughan Ph'D., B.Eng. M0VAU

                      Managing Director

                      Vaughan Industries Ltd., reg in UK no 2561068

                      Water Care Technology Ltd, reg in UK no 4129351

                      Addr Unit3, Sydney House, Blackwater, Truro, Cornwall, TR4 8HH UK.

                      Phone/Fax 44 (0) 1872 561288

                      RSGB DRM111 (Cornwall)

                      _____

                      From: FT897@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FT897@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                      G7IZR
                      Sent: 01 February 2008 22:34
                      To: FT897@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [FT897] ft-597 on 27mhz-Not advised, But:



                      That explains something, thanks!! Every time I drive near our local, 2m
                      is wiped out for around half a mile. I wondered what it was!!!

                      Mark Vaughan wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > Locally we have a Tesco's petrol station, the pumps of which when replaced
                      > knock out VHF for a half to one mile range of the station, an EMC issue,
                      > again no response.
                      >





                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Ian Fletcher
                      Thanks for everyone input into this subject....lol...I didnt really want to attract so much attention about the legalities of the use but your points are duly
                      Message 10 of 11 , Feb 2 1:55 AM
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                        Thanks for everyone input into this subject....lol...I didnt really want to attract so much attention about the legalities of the use but your points are duly noted and much appreciated..
                        At the moment I do not use the 897 on 27mhz due the previous problem and rely on dedicated 27mhz equipment.

                        Ian


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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