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Re: [FS32NGModelrail] further fiddling

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  • Woodie Greene
    Kim-I know that everybody has their own favorite way to make water , and here is one I have used and like. I use what is called finish epoxy which is about
    Message 1 of 9 , Mar 27, 2008
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      Kim-I know that everybody has their own favorite way to make "water", and here is one I have used and like. I use what is called "finish epoxy" which is about a 20 minute setting time, dries clear, and actually has the viscosity (sp) of water just about. I have used this for various water effects and it can be "whipped" into waves and eddys in the water. I don't know if this stuff is available where you live, but here in the US, it is used as a final coat on model aircraft. In that application, the epoxy is painted on and it levels itself and produces a wonderful and tough finish. For water, I will put down maybe 1/4 inch or so at a time and if needed, I will put tinting into it (I use acrylic paint for the tints). To produce ripples, etc..I wait for about 15 minutes or so and then start working the pour, it will almost suddenly set up and looks quite realistic. I wish I had a photo of this for you, but these days, I model arid scenery with little water seen. Good luck with this, as I said, everybody will have a different way, this one works for me.
             Woodie
       
       
       
      kkimmarsh <kkimmarsh@...> wrote:
      good afternoon everybody just when i thought i could move on from water .
      ;i had to rip up the example that i posted,big problems.it would not
      dry all over and the top that had dried was attracting moisture-what
      was all this about.i could move on and go back to varnishes ,but the
      resin result is so amazing that i really wanted it.
      the professional advice became a 4 cornered connection with each
      corner telling a different story.the 2 corners on the telephone
      generally had the attitude"it will be right mate just wack it
      together"[australia n slang for shove your head where the sun never
      shines}.
      the other two sides were the part time shop sales women.one of which
      started to make sense.
      my water is 2mm thick max[2 eights of a inch] and is quite difficult
      to get to dry at that thickness.there is a product around that is
      called a 100 coats of varnish in one application that will work-very
      expensive and takes two weeks to go off.back to the epoxy.there are 4
      hardners[catilists] that you can use.they depend on the mass of the
      resin ie-thick resin slow hardner thin fast.first i was sold something
      that was too slow but even with a very fast product there is no gurantee.
      so i redid the stucco base i really like it and let it all dry over
      night.the next day i mixed up the epoxy-20% hardners plus the
      transparent dies and poar away .it should dry in 40 minutes no way.
      it has been quite a hot day and the only way it started to work was to
      leave it in the sun.5 hours later about 90% was dry.
      most likely all this has been perfected in a antique copy of model
      railroader but to me it looks amazing.so much of modelling is very
      precise is is totally random .
      i also had no chance as a kid ,i spent some time with my grandparents
      in far north tropical australia.my grandfather was a gas fitter at
      the gas works and of course they put all such industries in the
      mangrove swamps also in the same swamp was all the scuttled equipment
      left over from the 11war.the final touch was the railway.
      cheers kim.


    • kim marsh
      goodmorning evan i have been looking at mangroves for a while,amazing how they can grow in salt water.they have very distinctive trunk growth.they seem
      Message 2 of 9 , Mar 28, 2008
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        goodmorning evan i have been looking at mangroves for a while,amazing how they can grow in salt water.they have very distinctive trunk growth.they seem difficult as yet i have not tried .do you have good referance if not i can post some pics cheers kim
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 12:44 AM
        Subject: [FS32NGModelrail] Re: further fiddling

        Hi Kim
        Are you going to have a mangrove swamp. I am planning one for my
        estuary scene, and am looking for ideas on how to model realistic
        looking mangroves. My idea at present is to use bleached, then dyed
        tea leaves, and idea I remember from a Railway Modeller of about
        1956, and from memory the resultant trees looked very realistic -
        memory has probably built them up more than they deserved, though.

        evan

        --- In FS32NGModelrail@ yahoogroups. com, "kkimmarsh" <kkimmarsh@. ..>
        wrote:
        >

        > i also had no chance as a kid ,i spent some time with my
        grandparents
        > in far north tropical australia.my grandfather was a gas fitter at
        > the gas works and of course they put all such industries in the
        > mangrove swamps also in the same swamp was all the scuttled
        equipment
        > left over from the 11war.the final touch was the railway.
        > cheers kim.
        >


        No virus found in this incoming message.
        Checked by AVG.
        Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.22.1/1348 - Release Date: 3/28/2008 10:58 AM
      • Evan James
        I walk my dog along the banks of a mangrove estuary in Auckland every day, and am always looking at it from a modelling point of view. I fancy having the tide
        Message 3 of 9 , Apr 3, 2008
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          I walk my dog along the banks of a mangrove estuary in Auckland every
          day, and am always looking at it from a modelling point of view.
          I fancy having the tide half out, when there are rivulettes of water
          coming out of the mangroves into the main channel.
          Full tide is booring, although nice to look at on a fine day, half in
          hasn't got too many features and low tide is just a sea of mud flats,
          although that is when the dog likes it because the mangroves are full
          of tasty - to a dog - dead and decaying things.

          evan


          --- In FS32NGModelrail@yahoogroups.com, "kim marsh" <kkimmarsh@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > goodmorning evan i have been looking at mangroves for a
          while,amazing how they can grow in salt water.they have very
          distinctive trunk growth.they seem difficult as yet i have not
          tried .do you have good referance if not i can post some pics cheers
          kim
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: Evan James
          > To: FS32NGModelrail@yahoogroups.com
          > Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 12:44 AM
          > Subject: [FS32NGModelrail] Re: further fiddling
          >
          >
          > Hi Kim
          > Are you going to have a mangrove swamp. I am planning one for my
          > estuary scene, and am looking for ideas on how to model realistic
          > looking mangroves. My idea at present is to use bleached, then
          dyed
          > tea leaves, and idea I remember from a Railway Modeller of about
          > 1956, and from memory the resultant trees looked very realistic -
          > memory has probably built them up more than they deserved, though.
          >
          > evan
          >
          > --- In FS32NGModelrail@yahoogroups.com, "kkimmarsh" <kkimmarsh@>
          > wrote:
          > >
          >
          > > i also had no chance as a kid ,i spent some time with my
          > grandparents
          > > in far north tropical australia.my grandfather was a gas fitter
          at
          > > the gas works and of course they put all such industries in the
          > > mangrove swamps also in the same swamp was all the scuttled
          > equipment
          > > left over from the 11war.the final touch was the railway.
          > > cheers kim.
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --------------------------------------------------------------------
          ----------
          >
          >
          > No virus found in this incoming message.
          > Checked by AVG.
          > Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.22.1/1348 - Release Date:
          3/28/2008 10:58 AM
          >
        • Evan James
          Further to this, I have found that the best way to recreate a base for the water is to simply go down to a bridge, wharf, etc, over the piece of water you wish
          Message 4 of 9 , Apr 4, 2008
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            Further to this, I have found that the best way to recreate a base for the water is to simply
            go down to a bridge, wharf, etc, over the piece of water you wish to re-create and point a
            camera straight at the water. That way you can get all the colour variations in the water
            without having to tax your artistic skills. In my case it was for around a wharf, and the
            resulting pic that I used had all the variations in colour, including little slicks of oil float
            out from under the piers and the sun glinting off the water. I got the pic printed out at my
            local photo centre and then blew it up to A3 on a photocopier. On the layout I simply got
            put a piece of wavy glass over it, which had its limitations, That scene has now gone, put I
            am planning similar scenes on current layout and I like the sound of the finish expoxy. It
            will probably need some experimentation on whether or not I can pour it straight over the
            paper, or I would have to seal the paper first.

            evan


            --- In FS32NGModelrail@yahoogroups.com, Woodie Greene <mogollonry@...> wrote:
            >
            > Kim-I know that everybody has their own favorite way to make "water", and here is one I
            have used and like. I use what is called "finish epoxy" which is about a 20 minute setting
            time, dries clear, and actually has the viscosity (sp) of water just about. I have used this for
            various water effects and it can be "whipped" into waves and eddys in the water. I don't
            know if this stuff is available where you live, but here in the US, it is used as a final coat on
            model aircraft. In that application, the epoxy is painted on and it levels itself and produces
            a wonderful and tough finish. For water, I will put down maybe 1/4 inch or so at a time
            and if needed, I will put tinting into it (I use acrylic paint for the tints). To produce ripples,
            etc..I wait for about 15 minutes or so and then start working the pour, it will almost
            suddenly set up and looks quite realistic. I wish I had a photo of this for you, but these
            days, I model arid scenery with little water seen. Good luck with
            > this, as I said, everybody will have a different way, this one works for me.
            > Woodie
          • Woodie Greene
            Evan-you could pour the epoxy over the paper with no problems, I would do a trial first though. I have tried many products to make water over the years and
            Message 5 of 9 , Apr 4, 2008
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              Evan-you could pour the epoxy over the paper with no problems, I would do a trial first though. I have tried many products to make "water" over the years and the finish epoxy is my favorite. I use a 20 minute type which is clear (not like the yellowish quick dry variety) and has the viscosity (almost) of water! If you want it to dry nice & flat, then just pour it and watch it dry. If you want ripples, etc., then wait about 15 minutes and begin messing with the pour, working it until it gets to a gel state & then let it dry. You can tint it with food coloring, or I use Tamiya acrylic paints to tint the epoxy. I wouldn't do over about 1/4 inch pour at a time, but you can get several pours and there is no "seam" or lamination look. All I can say is to get some epoxy and try it, you will develop your own technique.
              This stuff is made for model plane finishes and you know how nitpickey those guys are-it works wonderfully.
                         Woodie
              Evan James <bce@...> wrote:
              Further to this, I have found that the best way to recreate a base for the water is to simply
              go down to a bridge, wharf, etc, over the piece of water you wish to re-create and point a
              camera straight at the water. That way you can get all the colour variations in the water
              without having to tax your artistic skills. In my case it was for around a wharf, and the
              resulting pic that I used had all the variations in colour, including little slicks of oil float
              out from under the piers and the sun glinting off the water. I got the pic printed out at my
              local photo centre and then blew it up to A3 on a photocopier. On the layout I simply got
              put a piece of wavy glass over it, which had its limitations, That scene has now gone, put I
              am planning similar scenes on current layout and I like the sound of the finish expoxy. It
              will probably need some experimentation on whether or not I can pour it straight over the
              paper, or I would have to seal the paper first.

              evan

              --- In FS32NGModelrail@ yahoogroups. com, Woodie Greene <mogollonry@ ...> wrote:
              >
              > Kim-I know that everybody has their own favorite way to make "water", and here is one I
              have used and like. I use what is called "finish epoxy" which is about a 20 minute setting
              time, dries clear, and actually has the viscosity (sp) of water just about. I have used this for
              various water effects and it can be "whipped" into waves and eddys in the water. I don't
              know if this stuff is available where you live, but here in the US, it is used as a final coat on
              model aircraft. In that application, the epoxy is painted on and it levels itself and produces
              a wonderful and tough finish. For water, I will put down maybe 1/4 inch or so at a time
              and if needed, I will put tinting into it (I use acrylic paint for the tints). To produce ripples,
              etc..I wait for about 15 minutes or so and then start working the pour, it will almost
              suddenly set up and looks quite realistic. I wish I had a photo of this for you, but these
              days, I model arid scenery with little water seen. Good luck with
              > this, as I said, everybody will have a different way, this one works for me.
              > Woodie


            • Woodie Greene
              Sorry guys, I believe I posted 2 messages dealing with making epoxy water. I forgot about the earlier message-this is a senior moment (or habit)...Don t mean
              Message 6 of 9 , Apr 4, 2008
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                Sorry guys, I believe I posted 2 messages dealing with making epoxy water. I forgot about the earlier message-this is a senior moment (or habit)...Don't mean to waste your time with too much drivel.
                          Woodie

                Woodie Greene <mogollonry@...> wrote:
                Kim-I know that everybody has their own favorite way to make "water", and here is one I have used and like. I use what is called "finish epoxy" which is about a 20 minute setting time, dries clear, and actually has the viscosity (sp) of water just about. I have used this for various water effects and it can be "whipped" into waves and eddys in the water. I don't know if this stuff is available where you live, but here in the US, it is used as a final coat on model aircraft. In that application, the epoxy is painted on and it levels itself and produces a wonderful and tough finish. For water, I will put down maybe 1/4 inch or so at a time and if needed, I will put tinting into it (I use acrylic paint for the tints). To produce ripples, etc..I wait for about 15 minutes or so and then start working the pour, it will almost suddenly set up and looks quite realistic. I wish I had a photo of this for you, but these days, I model arid scenery with little water seen. Good luck with this, as I said, everybody will have a different way, this one works for me.
                       Woodie
                 
                 
                 
                kkimmarsh <kkimmarsh@unwired. com.au> wrote:
                good afternoon everybody just when i thought i could move on from water .
                ;i had to rip up the example that i posted,big problems.it would not
                dry all over and the top that had dried was attracting moisture-what
                was all this about.i could move on and go back to varnishes ,but the
                resin result is so amazing that i really wanted it.
                the professional advice became a 4 cornered connection with each
                corner telling a different story.the 2 corners on the telephone
                generally had the attitude"it will be right mate just wack it
                together"[australia n slang for shove your head where the sun never
                shines}.
                the other two sides were the part time shop sales women.one of which
                started to make sense.
                my water is 2mm thick max[2 eights of a inch] and is quite difficult
                to get to dry at that thickness.there is a product around that is
                called a 100 coats of varnish in one application that will work-very
                expensive and takes two weeks to go off.back to the epoxy.there are 4
                hardners[catilists] that you can use.they depend on the mass of the
                resin ie-thick resin slow hardner thin fast.first i was sold something
                that was too slow but even with a very fast product there is no gurantee.
                so i redid the stucco base i really like it and let it all dry over
                night.the next day i mixed up the epoxy-20% hardners plus the
                transparent dies and poar away .it should dry in 40 minutes no way.
                it has been quite a hot day and the only way it started to work was to
                leave it in the sun.5 hours later about 90% was dry.
                most likely all this has been perfected in a antique copy of model
                railroader but to me it looks amazing.so much of modelling is very
                precise is is totally random .
                i also had no chance as a kid ,i spent some time with my grandparents
                in far north tropical australia.my grandfather was a gas fitter at
                the gas works and of course they put all such industries in the
                mangrove swamps also in the same swamp was all the scuttled equipment
                left over from the 11war.the final touch was the railway.
                cheers kim.



              • kim marsh
                hey woodie dont give up your water skills yet with global warming the deserts of texas will be prime real estate cheers kim ... From: Woodie Greene To:
                Message 7 of 9 , Apr 4, 2008
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                  hey woodie dont give up your water skills yet with global warming the deserts of texas will be prime real estate
                  cheers kim
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Friday, March 28, 2008 11:41 AM
                  Subject: Re: [FS32NGModelrail] further fiddling

                  Kim-I know that everybody has their own favorite way to make "water", and here is one I have used and like. I use what is called "finish epoxy" which is about a 20 minute setting time, dries clear, and actually has the viscosity (sp) of water just about. I have used this for various water effects and it can be "whipped" into waves and eddys in the water. I don't know if this stuff is available where you live, but here in the US, it is used as a final coat on model aircraft. In that application, the epoxy is painted on and it levels itself and produces a wonderful and tough finish. For water, I will put down maybe 1/4 inch or so at a time and if needed, I will put tinting into it (I use acrylic paint for the tints). To produce ripples, etc..I wait for about 15 minutes or so and then start working the pour, it will almost suddenly set up and looks quite realistic. I wish I had a photo of this for you, but these days, I model arid scenery with little water seen. Good luck with this, as I said, everybody will have a different way, this one works for me.
                         Woodie
                   
                   
                   
                  kkimmarsh <kkimmarsh@unwired. com.au> wrote:
                  good afternoon everybody just when i thought i could move on from water .
                  ;i had to rip up the example that i posted,big problems.it would not
                  dry all over and the top that had dried was attracting moisture-what
                  was all this about.i could move on and go back to varnishes ,but the
                  resin result is so amazing that i really wanted it.
                  the professional advice became a 4 cornered connection with each
                  corner telling a different story.the 2 corners on the telephone
                  generally had the attitude"it will be right mate just wack it
                  together"[australia n slang for shove your head where the sun never
                  shines}.
                  the other two sides were the part time shop sales women.one of which
                  started to make sense.
                  my water is 2mm thick max[2 eights of a inch] and is quite difficult
                  to get to dry at that thickness.there is a product around that is
                  called a 100 coats of varnish in one application that will work-very
                  expensive and takes two weeks to go off.back to the epoxy.there are 4
                  hardners[catilists] that you can use.they depend on the mass of the
                  resin ie-thick resin slow hardner thin fast.first i was sold something
                  that was too slow but even with a very fast product there is no gurantee.
                  so i redid the stucco base i really like it and let it all dry over
                  night.the next day i mixed up the epoxy-20% hardners plus the
                  transparent dies and poar away .it should dry in 40 minutes no way.
                  it has been quite a hot day and the only way it started to work was to
                  leave it in the sun.5 hours later about 90% was dry.
                  most likely all this has been perfected in a antique copy of model
                  railroader but to me it looks amazing.so much of modelling is very
                  precise is is totally random .
                  i also had no chance as a kid ,i spent some time with my grandparents
                  in far north tropical australia.my grandfather was a gas fitter at
                  the gas works and of course they put all such industries in the
                  mangrove swamps also in the same swamp was all the scuttled equipment
                  left over from the 11war.the final touch was the railway.
                  cheers kim.



                  No virus found in this incoming message.
                  Checked by AVG.
                  Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.22.6/1360 - Release Date: 4/4/2008 6:02 PM
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