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Re: Heeswijk

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  • GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA)
    Good message Peter! I work for the company that prints Historic Preservation and yes, railroad depots are a common interest that many groups fight to save. I
    Message 1 of 24 , Feb 13 3:11 PM
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      Good message Peter! I work for the company that prints Historic Preservation
      and yes, railroad depots are a common interest that many groups fight to
      save. I guess no one around here have thought about it! This is something
      we may want to look into. You say Faust has been in the station for twenty
      years? I swear that when I first photographed her in 1985, she was a stable.
      I think I have pictures of horse trailers out front and horses coming out
      of the place. I always thought it was kind of ironic that trains picked
      up people there 60 years earlier and now it was horses waiting for trailers...

      Gino
    • GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA)
      Speaking of Sacandaga Park s minature Steamer. I thought it was funny that people took the train to Sacandaga Park from miles South just to have a ride on the
      Message 2 of 24 , Feb 13 3:14 PM
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        Speaking of Sacandaga Park's minature Steamer. I thought it was funny
        that people took the train to Sacandaga Park from miles South just to
        have a ride on the minature train. That's a whole day of railroading.
        Wasn't there also a ride at the park that was pretty much a trolley
        simulator? Sacandaga Park was a regualr Steam Town USA in its time...

        Gino
      • Randy & Lorraine Decker
        Pete I said that basically in my last message I I m of the opinion that if someone moves into an area and these rules are already in place then they should
        Message 3 of 24 , Feb 13 3:52 PM
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          Pete I said that basically in my last message I I'm of the opinion that
          if someone moves into an area and these rules are already in place then they
          should be abided by. These districts are very beautiful as a rule but if
          these rules are put in place after someone already lives there you may be
          able to fine someone if they paint their house purple and put big pink
          stripes on it. but no one can stop a person from tearing down and rebuilding
          their home for any reason When I say you have to take the good with the bad
          I simply mean our constitutional rights here. We have enough bureaucratic
          controls as it is and as much as I would hate to see the Station torn down
          If it is privately owned and I was the guy who owned it I sure would not
          want people I have never met telling me what I can or cannot do with it.
          But I do agree with you this park should become a historic district. I said
          that in my first message I think there are many in the park who feel this
          way also they just had a vote this last year about paving the circle It was
          voted down by the park residents. I think they take care of themselves
          pretty well and I think if they had the historic title attached to the park
          if they all decided to change something they all vote for they may be
          stopped by people that do not live there and sometimes these things get out
          of hand they are affraid of someone deciding what color they can paint
          their camp or stopping them from putting a small addition on one side
          because of historic preservation? I would be a little worried about haveing
          the historic preservation burocrats involved if it were my home as well It
          is easy looking at it from the outside and wanting to see things stay the
          same but that is up to them anfd they have been doing preety good so far. I
          am pretty sure the park association was against Foust and his outdoor art
          projects for some time if they had their way you would not have enjoyed His
          crazy art projects! I think they are real neet as well my kids love his
          stuf and play on the trails and with the weird sculptures every summer.
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: <psefton@...>
          To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
          Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 12:14 PM
          Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk


          > From: psefton@...
          >
          > I understand what you're saying, Randy. However, even besides the
          questions
          > of "should" or "good", I
          > don't think the historic property issue is quite so straightforward.
          >
          > Here in the Washington, DC area historic districts are a big deal.
          >
          > What happens frequently is that someone pays big bucks to move onto a
          street
          > of Victorian row houses for
          > the charm & atmosphere. The last thing thing they want is for the guy
          across
          > the street to decide "I'm sick of Victorians " and
          > saw huge picture windows in the front of his house across the street or
          even
          > tear it down to build a split level. So they form
          > a committee to petition for a historic district.
          >
          > The committee draws up a statement which describes the unifying
          > architectural theme of the area (say, row houses built by
          > retail tradesmen of the Victorian era) and a set of by-laws about what
          > modifications can and can't be made. Then they circulate
          > a petition which 50% of the people in the block have to sign. If they get
          > enough signatures, a public hearing is held and the block
          > becomes a historic district. Then everyone on the block has to abide by
          the
          > by-laws.
          >
          > I agree that this sounds bureaucratic but there are definite benefits.
          When
          > done correctly, a historic district enhances the values of everyone's
          > property by preserving the look and feel of a desireable neighborhood.
          > Secondly, people are willing to invest in doing period rehab if they
          > have the assurance that someone is not going to build something in glaring
          > contrast next door. A lot of people in the Old Town Alexandria historic
          > district have made $100s of $K on their district this way.
          >
          > as you note, everything is a trade-off. The idea here is that what I do
          > affects my neighbor's property and vice versa.
          >
          > > Hey Pete I agree that old Station is a great place and worthy of some
          > > historic recognition and the park area itself as well! If this was
          done
          > > before the current owners bought this place this might help but with a
          > > privately owned structure no person or government agency can stop
          someone
          > > from altering or doing anything they want with it if it is in clear
          title.
          > > And that is the way it should be even in this case have to take the
          good
          > > with the bad.
          >
          >
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          >
          > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
          >
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          > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
          >
        • psefton@crosslink.net
          true---as you point out people do give up some rights in exchange for benefits--but that s true of zoning of any type--although in the case of the historic
          Message 4 of 24 , Feb 13 4:17 PM
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            true---as you point out people do give up some rights in exchange for
            benefits--but that's true of zoning of any type--although in the case of the
            historic district, the rules are set by the owners, not outsiders without
            an interest in the properties.

            I surely don't mean to be an outsider suggesting how the people in the Park
            should run their town, especially since they're very good at taking care of
            what's left. . To show how foolish that can be, last winter we heard a
            winter rumor that a major Northville Main Street building was demolished to
            make way for the new post office. In July I was telling Mr. Mead (?), the
            Benson historian, that we were relieved to discover that, instead of the
            FJG-linked Northville House Hotel, it was "only" the little white house that
            had been the VFW HQ since Korea. Mr. Mead looked kind of sick and said "you
            know, that was the oldest house in Northville". It went back to 1818". I
            kicked myself in the rear end all the way out 7 Hills Road.



            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Randy & Lorraine Decker <rldecker@...>
            To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
            Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 6:52 PM
            Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk


            > From: "Randy & Lorraine Decker" <rldecker@...>
            >
            > Pete I said that basically in my last message I I'm of the opinion that
            > if someone moves into an area and these rules are already in place then
            they
            > should be abided by. These districts are very beautiful as a rule but if
            > these rules are put in place after someone already lives there you may be
            > able to fine someone if they paint their house purple and put big pink
            > stripes on it. but no one can stop a person from tearing down and
            rebuilding
            > their home for any reason When I say you have to take the good with the
            bad
            > I simply mean our constitutional rights here. We have enough bureaucratic
            > controls as it is and as much as I would hate to see the Station torn down
            > If it is privately owned and I was the guy who owned it I sure would not
            > want people I have never met telling me what I can or cannot do with it.
            > But I do agree with you this park should become a historic district. I
            said
            > that in my first message I think there are many in the park who feel this
            > way also they just had a vote this last year about paving the circle It
            was
            > voted down by the park residents. I think they take care of themselves
            > pretty well and I think if they had the historic title attached to the
            park
            > if they all decided to change something they all vote for they may be
            > stopped by people that do not live there and sometimes these things get
            out
            > of hand they are affraid of someone deciding what color they can paint
            > their camp or stopping them from putting a small addition on one side
            > because of historic preservation? I would be a little worried about
            haveing
            > the historic preservation burocrats involved if it were my home as well
            It
            > is easy looking at it from the outside and wanting to see things stay the
            > same but that is up to them anfd they have been doing preety good so far.
            I
            > am pretty sure the park association was against Foust and his outdoor art
            > projects for some time if they had their way you would not have enjoyed
            His
            > crazy art projects! I think they are real neet as well my kids love his
            > stuf and play on the trails and with the weird sculptures every summer.
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: <psefton@...>
            > To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
            > Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 12:14 PM
            > Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk
            >
            >
            > > From: psefton@...
            > >
            > > I understand what you're saying, Randy. However, even besides the
            > questions
            > > of "should" or "good", I
            > > don't think the historic property issue is quite so straightforward.
            > >
            > > Here in the Washington, DC area historic districts are a big deal.
            > >
            > > What happens frequently is that someone pays big bucks to move onto a
            > street
            > > of Victorian row houses for
            > > the charm & atmosphere. The last thing thing they want is for the guy
            > across
            > > the street to decide "I'm sick of Victorians " and
            > > saw huge picture windows in the front of his house across the street or
            > even
            > > tear it down to build a split level. So they form
            > > a committee to petition for a historic district.
            > >
            > > The committee draws up a statement which describes the unifying
            > > architectural theme of the area (say, row houses built by
            > > retail tradesmen of the Victorian era) and a set of by-laws about what
            > > modifications can and can't be made. Then they circulate
            > > a petition which 50% of the people in the block have to sign. If they
            get
            > > enough signatures, a public hearing is held and the block
            > > becomes a historic district. Then everyone on the block has to abide by
            > the
            > > by-laws.
            > >
            > > I agree that this sounds bureaucratic but there are definite benefits.
            > When
            > > done correctly, a historic district enhances the values of everyone's
            > > property by preserving the look and feel of a desireable neighborhood.
            > > Secondly, people are willing to invest in doing period rehab if they
            > > have the assurance that someone is not going to build something in
            glaring
            > > contrast next door. A lot of people in the Old Town Alexandria historic
            > > district have made $100s of $K on their district this way.
            > >
            > > as you note, everything is a trade-off. The idea here is that what I do
            > > affects my neighbor's property and vice versa.
            > >
            > > > Hey Pete I agree that old Station is a great place and worthy of some
            > > > historic recognition and the park area itself as well! If this was
            > done
            > > > before the current owners bought this place this might help but with
            a
            > > > privately owned structure no person or government agency can stop
            > someone
            > > > from altering or doing anything they want with it if it is in clear
            > title.
            > > > And that is the way it should be even in this case have to take the
            > good
            > > > with the bad.
            > >
            > >
            > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
            > >
            > > FREE ADVICE FROM REAL PEOPLE! Xpertsite has thousands of experts who
            > > are willing to answer your questions for FREE. Go to Xpertsite today
            > > and put your mind to rest.
            > > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/XpersiteCPC ">Click Here</a>
            > >
            > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
            > >
            > > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
            > > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
            > >
            >
            >
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            > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
            >
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            > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
            >
          • Randy & Lorraine Decker
            Gino This has been looked into. My Father as the County Historian has already contacted the owners and urged them to do so. As for the Station itself this
            Message 5 of 24 , Feb 13 4:35 PM
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              Gino This has been looked into. My Father as the County Historian has
              already contacted the owners and urged them to do so. As for the Station
              itself this is up to the owners to decide you cant make a building that is
              rivately owned a historic site and the laws have been changed anyway this
              agency does not have the power it once did because of the complaints by
              property owners. I hate to rain on the parade here I have been in touch
              with what has happened here just reporting the results so far objectively
              this time. You guy's all know I am just as passionate about what is left of
              the RR as anyone, and I am very happy to see the response here I certainly
              think this great station is worthy of evry advantage available but unless
              one of us hits the lottery it is at the hands of the owners to do as they
              see fit. Just to let you know they are very proud of the old place and they
              do not want to see it torn down but the roof is starting to have problems
              and if they dont get at it soon it will be in trouble. Does anyone have a
              guess about the miniature train yet???
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA) <GDICARLO@...>
              To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
              Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 6:11 PM
              Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk


              > From: "GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA)" <GDICARLO@...>
              >
              > Good message Peter! I work for the company that prints Historic
              Preservation
              > and yes, railroad depots are a common interest that many groups fight to
              > save. I guess no one around here have thought about it! This is
              something
              > we may want to look into. You say Faust has been in the station for
              twenty
              > years? I swear that when I first photographed her in 1985, she was a
              stable.
              > I think I have pictures of horse trailers out front and horses coming out
              > of the place. I always thought it was kind of ironic that trains picked
              > up people there 60 years earlier and now it was horses waiting for
              trailers...
              >
              > Gino
              >
              > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
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              > Points, no hidden fees, and much more. Get NextCard today and get the
              > credit you deserve. Apply now. Get your NextCard Visa at
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              > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
              >
              > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
              > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
              >
            • Randy & Lorraine Decker
              Gino check out page 34 in my book. The miniature train ride and hundreds maybe thousands just like it across the country were very popular a miniaturized
              Message 6 of 24 , Feb 13 5:06 PM
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                Gino check out page 34 in my book. The miniature train ride and hundreds
                maybe thousands just like it across the country were very popular a
                miniaturized steam engine was a technical marvel at that time I have had
                some of the old timers I have interviewed tell me they would ride the train
                all day when they went there as kids and I have been told by what few of the
                employee's who remember the steam that the little train was the best job on
                the railroad !! I have always wondered about the Coach the Railroad bought
                for the park that is the photo I have on page 34 this seemed to be an odd
                attraction at this time. I guess you have to look at what it would be
                comparable today people put an awful lot of quarters in the arcade version
                of a race car simulator. By the way I have an interesting story that wasd
                told to my wife(she did not take the guy's name though) she was selling some
                antiques in the flanger that is located at the old Northville lumber supply
                on rt30 just south of Northville This guy told her he was driving in a car
                in a small town in Pennsylvania and was stopped at a red light when one
                block to his left a train went by with two or three coaches. As he watched
                the train go by he noticed the last coach go by and on the side it said
                something like Sacandaga Touring Car (I am hoping one of you guy's might be
                this person???) he said he got so excited he ran the red light to try to
                catch this train as he turned on the next block on aroad that ran parrelell
                to the tracks the red lights were flashing and he was pulled over and given
                a ticket by the local policeman as he watched the train dissapear in the
                distance. After he was finished he started down the road after the train
                again and not seeing anyone in the rear view mirror he ran the next couple
                of stop signs to make up time. The red lights were soon flashing again and
                the same policeman asked him what the hurry was he told the cop he was
                trying to cathch thre train because of the writing on the coach. The
                policeman told him to turn off his engine and step out of the car! After he
                got out he thought he was going to have trouble with this officer the
                policeman told him to light a cigarette and relax the train goes up to the
                other end of the city and comes back in about 5 minites!!!! Railfans we
                really are quite a bunch!!!! GBy the way the cop did not give him the other
                tickets and I do not know the rest of the story I sure wish I had talked to
                this guy I would like to know if Hales touring car that was under a pole
                barn at the park is still around?? This is a great story but like so many
                of these rumers it is most likely not accurate. But is doesent hurt to
                wish.
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA) <GDICARLO@...>
                To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
                Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 6:14 PM
                Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk


                > From: "GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA)" <GDICARLO@...>
                >
                > Speaking of Sacandaga Park's minature Steamer. I thought it was funny
                > that people took the train to Sacandaga Park from miles South just to
                > have a ride on the minature train. That's a whole day of railroading.
                > Wasn't there also a ride at the park that was pretty much a trolley
                > simulator? Sacandaga Park was a regualr Steam Town USA in its time...
                >
                > Gino
                >
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                > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
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              • psefton@crosslink.net
                Gino, you must be right about the horses--- tho 1985 is getting to be a shockingly long time ago. The depot definitely was a stable at one point. Faust must
                Message 7 of 24 , Feb 13 8:04 PM
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                  Gino, you must be right about the horses---'tho 1985 is getting to be a
                  shockingly long time ago.

                  The depot definitely was a stable at one point. Faust must have moved in
                  soon after, as he became friendly with my elderly great-uncle, who was out
                  of commission by 1990. My great-uncle felt he had invented a new type of
                  steel waterwheel and gave Faust the prototype
                  to incorporate in a sculpture. It's there in the Artpark to this day. Some
                  of the depot was used to store vending machines and some is Faust's studio,
                  I believe.

                  There are some buildings left from the Park, especially at the top of the
                  old Midway. There are also a number of beautiful cottages that look like 3/4
                  scale replicas of Victorian houses. Hope these will be in Randy's book.

                  Unfortunately the hotels are gone. I think the Pines was deliberately burned
                  to make way for the resevoir. Ironically, fire was how they got rid of most
                  of the buildings that weren't worth moving across the whole valley.
                  Supposedly the smoke was so thick from the brush, trees, and buildings that
                  it was hard to see at times.

                  The High Rock, a big plain meat-and-potatoes type building, burned sometime
                  after WWII. I remember the Orchard, which was fairly small, boarded up on
                  the edge of the golf course in the mid-1960s. It disappeared one winter. The
                  Adirondack had a new owner in 1975, and burned just after Labor Day. A
                  cousin who is exactly my age worked there that summer. I'll have to ask what
                  he remembers about its 88th and last season.

                  For a vintage wooden hotel experience (If you haven't seen them already), I
                  recommend the Northville House, which is now a beauty shop and doctor's
                  office on Main Street, or the Broadalbin, which is around the corner from
                  that town's depot. It still has a 1920's style dining room and the pizza is
                  pretty good. There's also Hunts Hotel in Wells but that doesn't have a FJG
                  link that I'm aware of.



                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA) <GDICARLO@...>
                  To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
                  Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 6:11 PM
                  Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk


                  > From: "GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA)" <GDICARLO@...>
                  >
                  > Good message Peter! I work for the company that prints Historic
                  Preservation
                  > and yes, railroad depots are a common interest that many groups fight to
                  > save. I guess no one around here have thought about it! This is
                  something
                  > we may want to look into. You say Faust has been in the station for
                  twenty
                  > years? I swear that when I first photographed her in 1985, she was a
                  stable.
                  > I think I have pictures of horse trailers out front and horses coming out
                  > of the place. I always thought it was kind of ironic that trains picked
                  > up people there 60 years earlier and now it was horses waiting for
                  trailers...
                  >
                  > Gino
                  >
                  > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
                  >
                  > Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa. Rates as low as 2.9 percent
                  > Intro or 9.9 percent Fixed APR, online balance transfers, Rewards
                  > Points, no hidden fees, and much more. Get NextCard today and get the
                  > credit you deserve. Apply now. Get your NextCard Visa at
                  > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative1 ">Click Here</a>
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                  >
                  > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
                  > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
                  >
                • GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA)
                  Paul, What has happened to the structure in Perth? Too bad it is gone! Gino
                  Message 8 of 24 , Feb 13 8:32 PM
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                    Paul,

                    What has happened to the structure in Perth? Too bad it is gone!

                    Gino
                  • paul larner
                    For what its worth, I think the place looks like a junk yard. I don t believe what s being done with the station could be called preservation by even the
                    Message 9 of 24 , Feb 13 8:38 PM
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                      For what its worth, I think the place looks like a junk yard. I don't
                      believe what's being done with the station could be called preservation by
                      even the wildest stretch of the imagination. The building will eventually
                      become uninhabitable from lack of maintenance. It a cheap rent for whoever
                      is in there and when it falls apart he will move to another cheap rent until
                      it falls apart. If he cared he would clean it up a bit. If he had any
                      sense of history he would do what it takes to get the grant money or
                      whatever to restore it. I'm not a new waver to me there is no "art" created
                      at that place. For those who live in the Albany area and listen to morning
                      radio on PYX, it's more like Billy's "arts and crafts."

                      The "waiting room" that was at Perth is there no more.

                      Paul


                      >From: "Randy & Lorraine Decker" <rldecker@...>
                      >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@onelist.com
                      >To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
                      >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk
                      >Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 18:52:59 -0500
                      >
                      >Pete I said that basically in my last message I I'm of the opinion that
                      >if someone moves into an area and these rules are already in place then
                      >they
                      >should be abided by. These districts are very beautiful as a rule but if
                      >these rules are put in place after someone already lives there you may be
                      >able to fine someone if they paint their house purple and put big pink
                      >stripes on it. but no one can stop a person from tearing down and
                      >rebuilding
                      >their home for any reason When I say you have to take the good with the
                      >bad
                      >I simply mean our constitutional rights here. We have enough bureaucratic
                      >controls as it is and as much as I would hate to see the Station torn down
                      >If it is privately owned and I was the guy who owned it I sure would not
                      >want people I have never met telling me what I can or cannot do with it.
                      >But I do agree with you this park should become a historic district. I
                      >said
                      >that in my first message I think there are many in the park who feel this
                      >way also they just had a vote this last year about paving the circle It
                      >was
                      >voted down by the park residents. I think they take care of themselves
                      >pretty well and I think if they had the historic title attached to the park
                      >if they all decided to change something they all vote for they may be
                      >stopped by people that do not live there and sometimes these things get out
                      >of hand they are affraid of someone deciding what color they can paint
                      >their camp or stopping them from putting a small addition on one side
                      >because of historic preservation? I would be a little worried about
                      >haveing
                      >the historic preservation burocrats involved if it were my home as well It
                      >is easy looking at it from the outside and wanting to see things stay the
                      >same but that is up to them anfd they have been doing preety good so far.
                      >I
                      >am pretty sure the park association was against Foust and his outdoor art
                      >projects for some time if they had their way you would not have enjoyed
                      >His
                      >crazy art projects! I think they are real neet as well my kids love his
                      >stuf and play on the trails and with the weird sculptures every summer.
                      >----- Original Message -----
                      >From: <psefton@...>
                      >To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
                      >Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 12:14 PM
                      >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk
                      >
                      >
                      > > From: psefton@...
                      > >
                      > > I understand what you're saying, Randy. However, even besides the
                      >questions
                      > > of "should" or "good", I
                      > > don't think the historic property issue is quite so straightforward.
                      > >
                      > > Here in the Washington, DC area historic districts are a big deal.
                      > >
                      > > What happens frequently is that someone pays big bucks to move onto a
                      >street
                      > > of Victorian row houses for
                      > > the charm & atmosphere. The last thing thing they want is for the guy
                      >across
                      > > the street to decide "I'm sick of Victorians " and
                      > > saw huge picture windows in the front of his house across the street or
                      >even
                      > > tear it down to build a split level. So they form
                      > > a committee to petition for a historic district.
                      > >
                      > > The committee draws up a statement which describes the unifying
                      > > architectural theme of the area (say, row houses built by
                      > > retail tradesmen of the Victorian era) and a set of by-laws about what
                      > > modifications can and can't be made. Then they circulate
                      > > a petition which 50% of the people in the block have to sign. If they
                      >get
                      > > enough signatures, a public hearing is held and the block
                      > > becomes a historic district. Then everyone on the block has to abide by
                      >the
                      > > by-laws.
                      > >
                      > > I agree that this sounds bureaucratic but there are definite benefits.
                      >When
                      > > done correctly, a historic district enhances the values of everyone's
                      > > property by preserving the look and feel of a desireable neighborhood.
                      > > Secondly, people are willing to invest in doing period rehab if they
                      > > have the assurance that someone is not going to build something in
                      >glaring
                      > > contrast next door. A lot of people in the Old Town Alexandria historic
                      > > district have made $100s of $K on their district this way.
                      > >
                      > > as you note, everything is a trade-off. The idea here is that what I do
                      > > affects my neighbor's property and vice versa.
                      > >
                      > > > Hey Pete I agree that old Station is a great place and worthy of some
                      > > > historic recognition and the park area itself as well! If this was
                      >done
                      > > > before the current owners bought this place this might help but with
                      >a
                      > > > privately owned structure no person or government agency can stop
                      >someone
                      > > > from altering or doing anything they want with it if it is in clear
                      >title.
                      > > > And that is the way it should be even in this case have to take the
                      >good
                      > > > with the bad.
                      > >
                      > >
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                      > > and put your mind to rest.
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                      > >
                      > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                      > >
                      > > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
                      > > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
                      > >
                      >

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                    • Randy & Lorraine Decker
                      Paul I have to agree, as to the condition of the station, and the artwork is not my style but Faust loves that old place and art is objective anyway. A non
                      Message 10 of 24 , Feb 13 9:41 PM
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Paul I have to agree, as to the condition of the station, and the artwork
                        is not my style but Faust loves that old place and art is objective anyway.
                        A non profit organization has a chance at getting money's for a restoration
                        project like this. but Private owners, like what we have at the station,
                        have almost no chance at this. My dad has been trying to help several
                        groups gain access to this money but it is drying up! it has been abused by
                        so many people who have "connections" in the past you have to have a real
                        good established group with some background in preservation and a long list
                        of endorsements etc. etc. etc. etc. It is a real bureaucracy. I sure wish
                        my Dad still had his health It would be interesting to try and design a
                        proposal to the County then the State and federal as well as the owners, to
                        see that a deal could be worked out so this Station could end up in the
                        hands of a local historic minded group. Problem what seems to happen is when
                        these groups try to form the only people who really put the work and do the
                        leg work are pushed aside by those who have their own ideas about who is to
                        have the "control" and get the political credit for a project like this
                        these people seem to come from the woodwork once a project is started, and
                        use their political connections and their influence to stand under the
                        banner of the project but when and if the work does not progress they bow
                        out, and leave the people still involved fighting with the powers (because
                        of misinformation) that can help a project like this. Because of the damage
                        can be done behind closed doors when this happens, picking up the pieces
                        takes time and if the group is not strong and has personal agendas to
                        contend with it can create doubt on the parts of the local officials as to
                        weather this project can be done and they do not want to support it anymore
                        because they are afraid it may fail and they want no political attachment to
                        a failed project. I would bet there is a way to get grant money for this. A
                        good chunk of it would have to be used to buy it and there are thousands of
                        projects like this across the country lobbying for this money . This would
                        have to be done by people who have no agenda of their own. Just a group of
                        dedicated people of one mind who have time with all the things life and
                        family etc. etc. to take on a project like this ! I am part of a group of
                        loose knit fj&g fans that are trying to restore the boxcar museum my dad has
                        been trying to establish in Gloversville this will take uncountable man
                        hours to accomplish But the desire is there and a little money but not much
                        else is going for this yet but as it gets going I think we will gain more
                        and more support and a project like this is certainly worth any effort we
                        can muster. As for the Partners who own the Sacandaga Station I think you
                        are right Paul they are going to let that great FJ&G landmark go to pot! but
                        perhaps if this happens there will be enough outrage and devaluing of this
                        property a group could make something good happen here. I am only talking
                        from the small experience I have with these things I have been involved in
                        many but only as a laborer I know something of construction and rehabbing
                        and all aspects of the building and finishing trades but I abhor the
                        politics that are necessary to see a project like this through. So far I
                        have not had anyone agree with me on these points I am not stating this as
                        the last and only opinion about this topic? My orriginal intent was to let
                        you all know the station was not as safe as was thought and this has been
                        looked intoat least on the surface> I have left a few lengthy messages
                        about the park?? Does anyone have any comments about this ?? I love to
                        talk about the Park and I love to here any information about this great
                        place There is so much to learn about this park? I asked about the
                        miniature train?? I think it is an interesting question I never really
                        thought about the workings of a railroad in any detail beforew I got into
                        this group. I have seen so many photo's of the little train heading to
                        sport islane and the heading back agan across the foot bridge And I know
                        there was just a very short run near the end of the midway Does any one
                        want to guess How the train was turned? The answer is not rocket science.
                        But it is pretty neet. I like the detail this group gets into it makes you
                        think a little deeper about how and why the Railroad did what it did
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: paul larner <pklarner@...>
                        To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
                        Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 11:38 PM
                        Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk


                        > From: "paul larner" <pklarner@...>
                        >
                        > For what its worth, I think the place looks like a junk yard. I don't
                        > believe what's being done with the station could be called preservation by
                        > even the wildest stretch of the imagination. The building will eventually
                        > become uninhabitable from lack of maintenance. It a cheap rent for
                        whoever
                        > is in there and when it falls apart he will move to another cheap rent
                        until
                        > it falls apart. If he cared he would clean it up a bit. If he had any
                        > sense of history he would do what it takes to get the grant money or
                        > whatever to restore it. I'm not a new waver to me there is no "art"
                        created
                        > at that place. For those who live in the Albany area and listen to
                        morning
                        > radio on PYX, it's more like Billy's "arts and crafts."
                        >
                        > The "waiting room" that was at Perth is there no more.
                        >
                        > Paul
                        >
                        >
                        > >From: "Randy & Lorraine Decker" <rldecker@...>
                        > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@onelist.com
                        > >To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
                        > >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk
                        > >Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 18:52:59 -0500
                        > >
                        > >Pete I said that basically in my last message I I'm of the opinion
                        that
                        > >if someone moves into an area and these rules are already in place then
                        > >they
                        > >should be abided by. These districts are very beautiful as a rule but if
                        > >these rules are put in place after someone already lives there you may be
                        > >able to fine someone if they paint their house purple and put big pink
                        > >stripes on it. but no one can stop a person from tearing down and
                        > >rebuilding
                        > >their home for any reason When I say you have to take the good with the
                        > >bad
                        > >I simply mean our constitutional rights here. We have enough
                        bureaucratic
                        > >controls as it is and as much as I would hate to see the Station torn
                        down
                        > >If it is privately owned and I was the guy who owned it I sure would not
                        > >want people I have never met telling me what I can or cannot do with it.
                        > >But I do agree with you this park should become a historic district. I
                        > >said
                        > >that in my first message I think there are many in the park who feel
                        this
                        > >way also they just had a vote this last year about paving the circle It
                        > >was
                        > >voted down by the park residents. I think they take care of themselves
                        > >pretty well and I think if they had the historic title attached to the
                        park
                        > >if they all decided to change something they all vote for they may be
                        > >stopped by people that do not live there and sometimes these things get
                        out
                        > >of hand they are affraid of someone deciding what color they can paint
                        > >their camp or stopping them from putting a small addition on one side
                        > >because of historic preservation? I would be a little worried about
                        > >haveing
                        > >the historic preservation burocrats involved if it were my home as well
                        It
                        > >is easy looking at it from the outside and wanting to see things stay the
                        > >same but that is up to them anfd they have been doing preety good so far.
                        > >I
                        > >am pretty sure the park association was against Foust and his outdoor art
                        > >projects for some time if they had their way you would not have enjoyed
                        > >His
                        > >crazy art projects! I think they are real neet as well my kids love his
                        > >stuf and play on the trails and with the weird sculptures every summer.
                        > >----- Original Message -----
                        > >From: <psefton@...>
                        > >To: <FJGRailroad@onelist.com>
                        > >Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 12:14 PM
                        > >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > > From: psefton@...
                        > > >
                        > > > I understand what you're saying, Randy. However, even besides the
                        > >questions
                        > > > of "should" or "good", I
                        > > > don't think the historic property issue is quite so straightforward.
                        > > >
                        > > > Here in the Washington, DC area historic districts are a big deal.
                        > > >
                        > > > What happens frequently is that someone pays big bucks to move onto a
                        > >street
                        > > > of Victorian row houses for
                        > > > the charm & atmosphere. The last thing thing they want is for the guy
                        > >across
                        > > > the street to decide "I'm sick of Victorians " and
                        > > > saw huge picture windows in the front of his house across the street
                        or
                        > >even
                        > > > tear it down to build a split level. So they form
                        > > > a committee to petition for a historic district.
                        > > >
                        > > > The committee draws up a statement which describes the unifying
                        > > > architectural theme of the area (say, row houses built by
                        > > > retail tradesmen of the Victorian era) and a set of by-laws about what
                        > > > modifications can and can't be made. Then they circulate
                        > > > a petition which 50% of the people in the block have to sign. If they
                        > >get
                        > > > enough signatures, a public hearing is held and the block
                        > > > becomes a historic district. Then everyone on the block has to abide
                        by
                        > >the
                        > > > by-laws.
                        > > >
                        > > > I agree that this sounds bureaucratic but there are definite benefits.
                        > >When
                        > > > done correctly, a historic district enhances the values of everyone's
                        > > > property by preserving the look and feel of a desireable neighborhood.
                        > > > Secondly, people are willing to invest in doing period rehab if they
                        > > > have the assurance that someone is not going to build something in
                        > >glaring
                        > > > contrast next door. A lot of people in the Old Town Alexandria
                        historic
                        > > > district have made $100s of $K on their district this way.
                        > > >
                        > > > as you note, everything is a trade-off. The idea here is that what I
                        do
                        > > > affects my neighbor's property and vice versa.
                        > > >
                        > > > > Hey Pete I agree that old Station is a great place and worthy of
                        some
                        > > > > historic recognition and the park area itself as well! If this
                        was
                        > >done
                        > > > > before the current owners bought this place this might help but
                        with
                        > >a
                        > > > > privately owned structure no person or government agency can stop
                        > >someone
                        > > > > from altering or doing anything they want with it if it is in clear
                        > >title.
                        > > > > And that is the way it should be even in this case have to take
                        the
                        > >good
                        > > > > with the bad.
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > --------------------------- ONElist
                        Sponsor ----------------------------
                        > > >
                        > > > FREE ADVICE FROM REAL PEOPLE! Xpertsite has thousands of experts who
                        > > > are willing to answer your questions for FREE. Go to Xpertsite today
                        > > > and put your mind to rest.
                        > > > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/XpersiteCPC ">Click Here</a>
                        > > >
                        > >
                        > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                        > > >
                        > > > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
                        > > > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
                        > > >
                        > >
                        >
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                      • paul larner
                        I don t know. It may have been bulldozed but the possibility exists that the younger Pikul may have taken it to restore as the gas station he remembered as a
                        Message 11 of 24 , Feb 14 4:35 AM
                        • 0 Attachment
                          I don't know. It may have been bulldozed but the possibility exists that
                          the younger Pikul may have taken it to restore as the gas station he
                          remembered as a child. He had this interest and I presumed from talking
                          with him the means. It hasn't been a high priority for me, with work and
                          the project. I'll see what I can find out.

                          Paul


                          >From: "GINO DICARLO (QUAD GRAPHICS, SARATOGA)" <GDICARLO@...>
                          >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@onelist.com
                          >To: FJGRailroad@onelist.com
                          >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Heeswijk
                          >Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 23:32:03 -0500 (CDT)
                          >
                          >Paul,
                          >
                          >What has happened to the structure in Perth? Too bad it is gone!
                          >
                          >Gino

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