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RE: [FJGRailroad] Amtrak

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  • mwilber@webtv.net
    Paul-Are you usually alone in the cab,or are there two of you like the frieght jobs?Mark
    Message 1 of 26 , Feb 4, 2002
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      Paul-Are you usually alone in the cab,or are there two of you like the
      frieght jobs?Mark
    • mwilber@webtv.net
      Steve-Dont forget arm rests,air conditioning and seats that recline. Mark
      Message 2 of 26 , Feb 4, 2002
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        Steve-Dont forget arm rests,air conditioning and seats that recline.
        Mark
      • Richard A. Finn
        Steve, It s called PORK by the politicians.
        Message 3 of 26 , Feb 4, 2002
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          Steve,  It's called "PORK" by the politicians.

          Knixrule1@... wrote:

           Amtrak is a political potato, started by Nixon it is still the baby of
          the democrats.  It shows the difference between the two parties belief
          systems, one to privatize and the other to control everything.  It
          reminds me of the mess called Conrail in her early years, forever
          creating five year plans to become profitable but couldn't  wean her from
          the free and easy tax dollars.  She was the joke of the railroad industry
          and lived with names like "different circus-same clowns".  It was under
          Reagan that Conrail was told to crap or get off the pot, Elizabeth Dole
          as payback for Bobs help getting Ron elected, was named sec of
          transportation.  Bags of money were exchanged and out came Elizabeths
          backing for the entire system to be sold to the NS.  This created the
          "let Conrail be Conrail" movement and turned big blue into a real
          railroad.  Amtrak is well established in New York state, and we pay very
          high taxes for such benefits.  THe northeast makes money with passenger
          rail service but when the republicans put the squeeze on Amtrak to be
          profitable and free of tax dollars, they turn to attract freight from
          profitable private railroads to attach at the end of their trains.
          Amtrak tried to bid on the UPS business and take it from the private
          sector.  Is it right for a quasi-governmental company to use your track
          and then go after your business while supporting themselves with tax
          dollars ?  It is like the post office selling ties and coffee cups while
          offering poor mail service and Joes Tie Shop next door has to pay
          property taxes, sales taxes, license and registration fees but is trying
          to make a living selling ties.  Why was super steel built in Schenectady
          county and the old turbos reserected when there was no need for the
          factory?  Why did state and local politicians flock to the ribbon
          cutting, but now the doors are quietly closing at super steel, and who
          payed for the little game of reviving "locomotive building in
          Schenectady"?  There will be an Amtrak and they will grow and cut back
          depending on who runs Washington, my concern is for the working man just
          trying to make a living and retirement.  I love trains and to me, the
          more the merrier, but Amtrak does have some problems to solve, if Uncle
          Sam stepped in back in the 1960's to help passenger service, rather than
          force, rape, and tax the rail industry to death while paying to build and
          maintain roads for trucks and busses, rivers and canals for barges, and
          airports and controllers for planes, we might have a better rail system
          for passengers.
           

              Steve Myers
          ________________________________________________________________

        • Knixrule1@juno.com
          Alone. Mark, you have no signals on the Susie-Q ? The D & H has to wait for a form D every time they leave Selkirk yard. Steve
          Message 4 of 26 , Feb 4, 2002
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            Alone. Mark, you have no signals on the Susie-Q ? The D & H has to wait
            for a form D every time they leave Selkirk yard.

            Steve
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          • mwilber@webtv.net
            Steve-Only signal we have on the whole NYSW is at Chenango Forks.They just put in an automatic switch,so it to became an interlocking CP Forks.Of course when
            Message 5 of 26 , Feb 4, 2002
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              Steve-Only signal we have on the whole NYSW is at Chenango Forks.They
              just put in an automatic switch,so it to became an interlocking CP
              Forks.Of course when we run to NJ we have signals on the NS Southern
              Tier from CP BD to CP HJ. At CP HJ we then go onto the Hudson Secondary
              (Form D Territory) to station point Pelton.At Pelton then the tracks
              become the NYSW (southern Div.) all the way to Little Ferry NJ. From CP
              BD to CP HJ is about 130 miles and CP HJ to Pelton is about 20 miles.
              From Binghamton to Little Ferry is about a total 250 miles.If we have
              clear signals all the way we can do it in 9 hours. Mark
            • paul larner
              Canadian workers enjoy a leverage against corporate domination not known by the US worker. ...
              Message 6 of 26 , Feb 5, 2002
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                Canadian workers enjoy a leverage against corporate domination not known by
                the US worker.

                >From: Knixrule1@...
                >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Amtrak
                >Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 08:58:52 -0500
                >
                >all the engineers I meet just want soft seats and leg room such as a wide
                >cab Paul. Thats where the Canadians win, better lights, better seats,
                >better creature comforts, even a hot plate and microwave.
                >
                > Steve Myers
                >________________________________________________________________
                >GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
                >Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
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              • paul larner
                The Amtrak engineer is usually alone. Jobs which operate over six hours straight away receive a second engineer by contract. The Rutland job is some sort of
                Message 7 of 26 , Feb 5, 2002
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                  The Amtrak engineer is usually alone. Jobs which operate over six hours
                  straight away receive a second engineer by contract. The Rutland job is
                  some sort of anomaly. While operating less than six hours straight away,
                  there is no time at Rutland during the day for a break so a second man is
                  supplied by assigning two of the Montreal job second engineers to the train
                  as their fifth day. There is a nother day filled out by someone and for the
                  rest of it a man is placed on the job from the spare board. The night job
                  is given a second engineer when the spare board is slow to work off the
                  guarantee. On the night job we are not let out of Rutland until the VTR's
                  Whitehall freight leaves so there is a bit of time for a mealbreak.

                  PKL


                  >From: mwilber@...
                  >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                  >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                  >Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Amtrak
                  >Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 10:26:01 -0500 (EST)
                  >
                  >Paul-Are you usually alone in the cab,or are there two of you like the
                  >frieght jobs?Mark
                  >
                  >
                  >


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                • paul larner
                  That s important to keep in mind. A principal function of Amtrak is to provide pork in the politician s district. Pork keeps the poor folks fed and the
                  Message 8 of 26 , Feb 5, 2002
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                    That's important to keep in mind. A principal function of Amtrak is to
                    provide pork in the politician's district. Pork keeps the poor folks fed
                    and the politicians fat. Many of us decry pork but a far greater number of
                    us live off it, not just Amtrak - everywhere. Pork is good for the US
                    economy. Back to Canada, they call their pork socialism.

                    It's a form of redistribution. Just depends on whose getting forked and
                    who's eating. Everybody gets their share, rich and poor alike.
                    Unfortunately it's the middle income earner who is paying a disproportionate
                    share of the bill. Reagan nailed us to the cross with his tax increases,
                    then Bush1; nasty Bill did a major restructuring with his tax package (I
                    believe his only piece of legislation he ever got through in 8 years) when
                    he still had a Democratic congress in 1993 when he redistributed the burde
                    to the very wealth and corporations. He redistributed a significant amount
                    down to the lower income levels be he too provided nothing to the working
                    middle class (40 to 200 M)

                    What's this got to do with railroads?

                    PKL



                    >From: "Richard A. Finn" <ransjfinn@...>
                    >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                    >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                    >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Amtrak
                    >Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 10:38:31 -0500
                    >
                    >Steve, It's called "PORK" by the politicians.
                    >
                    >Knixrule1@... wrote:
                    >
                    > > Amtrak is a political potato, started by Nixon it is still the baby
                    > > of
                    > > the democrats. It shows the difference between the two parties belief
                    > >
                    > > systems, one to privatize and the other to control everything. It
                    > > reminds me of the mess called Conrail in her early years, forever
                    > > creating five year plans to become profitable but couldn't wean her
                    > > from
                    > > the free and easy tax dollars. She was the joke of the railroad
                    > > industry
                    > > and lived with names like "different circus-same clowns". It was
                    > > under
                    > > Reagan that Conrail was told to crap or get off the pot, Elizabeth
                    > > Dole
                    > > as payback for Bobs help getting Ron elected, was named sec of
                    > > transportation. Bags of money were exchanged and out came Elizabeths
                    > > backing for the entire system to be sold to the NS. This created the
                    > > "let Conrail be Conrail" movement and turned big blue into a real
                    > > railroad. Amtrak is well established in New York state, and we pay
                    > > very
                    > > high taxes for such benefits. THe northeast makes money with
                    > > passenger
                    > > rail service but when the republicans put the squeeze on Amtrak to be
                    > > profitable and free of tax dollars, they turn to attract freight from
                    > > profitable private railroads to attach at the end of their trains.
                    > > Amtrak tried to bid on the UPS business and take it from the private
                    > > sector. Is it right for a quasi-governmental company to use your
                    > > track
                    > > and then go after your business while supporting themselves with tax
                    > > dollars ? It is like the post office selling ties and coffee cups
                    > > while
                    > > offering poor mail service and Joes Tie Shop next door has to pay
                    > > property taxes, sales taxes, license and registration fees but is
                    > > trying
                    > > to make a living selling ties. Why was super steel built in
                    > > Schenectady
                    > > county and the old turbos reserected when there was no need for the
                    > > factory? Why did state and local politicians flock to the ribbon
                    > > cutting, but now the doors are quietly closing at super steel, and who
                    > >
                    > > payed for the little game of reviving "locomotive building in
                    > > Schenectady"? There will be an Amtrak and they will grow and cut back
                    > >
                    > > depending on who runs Washington, my concern is for the working man
                    > > just
                    > > trying to make a living and retirement. I love trains and to me, the
                    > > more the merrier, but Amtrak does have some problems to solve, if
                    > > Uncle
                    > > Sam stepped in back in the 1960's to help passenger service, rather
                    > > than
                    > > force, rape, and tax the rail industry to death while paying to build
                    > > and
                    > > maintain roads for trucks and busses, rivers and canals for barges,
                    > > and
                    > > airports and controllers for planes, we might have a better rail
                    > > system
                    > > for passengers.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Steve Myers
                    > > ________________________________________________________________


                    _________________________________________________________________
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                  • Knixrule1@juno.com
                    Paul, I have strong conservative leanings, but I agree with you. Oh the poor working man, how long can they pile these bricks on his back? Steve On Tue, 05
                    Message 9 of 26 , Feb 5, 2002
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                      Paul,

                      I have strong conservative leanings, but I agree with you. Oh the
                      poor working man, how long can they pile these bricks on his back?

                      Steve

                      On Tue, 05 Feb 2002 11:06:47 -0500 "paul larner" <pklarner@...>
                      writes:
                      > That's important to keep in mind. A principal function of Amtrak is
                      > to
                      > provide pork in the politician's district. Pork keeps the poor
                      > folks fed
                      > and the politicians fat. Many of us decry pork but a far greater
                      > number of
                      > us live off it, not just Amtrak - everywhere. Pork is good for the
                      > US
                      > economy. Back to Canada, they call their pork socialism.
                      >
                      > It's a form of redistribution. Just depends on whose getting forked
                      > and
                      > who's eating. Everybody gets their share, rich and poor alike.
                      > Unfortunately it's the middle income earner who is paying a
                      > disproportionate
                      > share of the bill. Reagan nailed us to the cross with his tax
                      > increases,
                      > then Bush1; nasty Bill did a major restructuring with his tax
                      > package (I
                      > believe his only piece of legislation he ever got through in 8
                      > years) when
                      > he still had a Democratic congress in 1993 when he redistributed the
                      > burde
                      > to the very wealth and corporations. He redistributed a significant
                      > amount
                      > down to the lower income levels be he too provided nothing to the
                      > working
                      > middle class (40 to 200 M)
                      >
                      > What's this got to do with railroads?
                      >
                      > PKL
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > >From: "Richard A. Finn" <ransjfinn@...>
                      > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                      > >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                      > >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Amtrak
                      > >Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 10:38:31 -0500
                      > >
                      > >Steve, It's called "PORK" by the politicians.
                      > >
                      > >Knixrule1@... wrote:
                      > >
                      > > > Amtrak is a political potato, started by Nixon it is still the
                      > baby
                      > > > of
                      > > > the democrats. It shows the difference between the two parties
                      > belief
                      > > >
                      > > > systems, one to privatize and the other to control everything.
                      > It
                      > > > reminds me of the mess called Conrail in her early years, forever
                      > > > creating five year plans to become profitable but couldn't wean
                      > her
                      > > > from
                      > > > the free and easy tax dollars. She was the joke of the railroad
                      > > > industry
                      > > > and lived with names like "different circus-same clowns". It was
                      > > > under
                      > > > Reagan that Conrail was told to crap or get off the pot,
                      > Elizabeth
                      > > > Dole
                      > > > as payback for Bobs help getting Ron elected, was named sec of
                      > > > transportation. Bags of money were exchanged and out came
                      > Elizabeths
                      > > > backing for the entire system to be sold to the NS. This
                      > created the
                      > > > "let Conrail be Conrail" movement and turned big blue into a real
                      > > > railroad. Amtrak is well established in New York state, and we
                      > pay
                      > > > very
                      > > > high taxes for such benefits. THe northeast makes money with
                      > > > passenger
                      > > > rail service but when the republicans put the squeeze on Amtrak
                      > to be
                      > > > profitable and free of tax dollars, they turn to attract freight
                      > from
                      > > > profitable private railroads to attach at the end of their
                      > trains.
                      > > > Amtrak tried to bid on the UPS business and take it from the
                      > private
                      > > > sector. Is it right for a quasi-governmental company to use your
                      > > > track
                      > > > and then go after your business while supporting themselves with
                      > tax
                      > > > dollars ? It is like the post office selling ties and coffee
                      > cups
                      > > > while
                      > > > offering poor mail service and Joes Tie Shop next door has to pay
                      > > > property taxes, sales taxes, license and registration fees but is
                      > > > trying
                      > > > to make a living selling ties. Why was super steel built in
                      > > > Schenectady
                      > > > county and the old turbos reserected when there was no need for
                      > the
                      > > > factory? Why did state and local politicians flock to the ribbon
                      > > > cutting, but now the doors are quietly closing at super steel,
                      > and who
                      > > >
                      > > > payed for the little game of reviving "locomotive building in
                      > > > Schenectady"? There will be an Amtrak and they will grow and
                      > cut back
                      > > >
                      > > > depending on who runs Washington, my concern is for the working
                      > man
                      > > > just
                      > > > trying to make a living and retirement. I love trains and to
                      > me, the
                      > > > more the merrier, but Amtrak does have some problems to solve, if
                      > > > Uncle
                      > > > Sam stepped in back in the 1960's to help passenger service,
                      > rather
                      > > > than
                      > > > force, rape, and tax the rail industry to death while paying to
                      > build
                      > > > and
                      > > > maintain roads for trucks and busses, rivers and canals for
                      > barges,
                      > > > and
                      > > > airports and controllers for planes, we might have a better rail
                      > > > system
                      > > > for passengers.
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > Steve Myers
                      > > > ________________________________________________________________
                      >
                      >
                      > _________________________________________________________________
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                    • cbrozek@rinstitute.org
                      Wow, I sent this two days ago! Hey, Yahoo is about as good as the USPS! Anyone have more info on that Amtrak Autotrain crash in Crescent City, FL earlier?
                      Message 10 of 26 , Apr 19, 2002
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                        RE: [FJGRailroad] S-1/CACV
                        Wow, I sent this two days ago!  Hey, Yahoo is about as good as the USPS!
                         
                        Anyone have more info on that Amtrak Autotrain crash in Crescent City, FL earlier?
                         
                        Chris
                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: cbrozek@... [mailto:cbrozek@...]
                        Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 4:04 PM
                        To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] S-1/CACV

                        I found these photos of S1 and S2 units from SOO and WP.  Hope this helps.
                         
                        Chris
                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: Dicarlo, Gino [mailto:Gino.Dicarlo@...]
                        Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 3:33 PM
                        To: 'FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com'
                        Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] S-1/CACV

                        Chris,
                         
                        You do know I was talking about a full scale, running engine, right?  I think Randy wanted to know
                        how close it looked to an S-2 to see if it was worth painting up like FJG/20 & 21.  An S-1 looks way
                        different than an S-2!  The LHRS needs a full scale, running locomotive for their tourist line!
                         
                        Gino
                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: cbrozek@... [mailto:cbrozek@...]
                        Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 2:33 PM
                        To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] S-1/CACV

                        Model Railroader had a review of an Atlas S1 or S2 some time back and in the review they talked about the differences between each.  I think the main differences were the size and position of the radiators and the horsepower.

                        Chris B.


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                        Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
                        in New York State at
                        http://ny.existingstations.com/


                        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

                        Visit Gino's Railpage, Now at http://www.fjgrr.com

                        Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/

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                      • Stephen G. Myers
                        Much is true here, Amtrak is a democrat baby with no real reason to tighten its belt since it is on the nipple of the taxpayer. it is a bottomless pit, all
                        Message 11 of 26 , Nov 11, 2005
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                          Much is true here, Amtrak is a democrat baby with no real reason to
                          tighten its belt since it is on the nipple of the taxpayer. it is a
                          bottomless pit, all the political appointees have been democrat clowns
                          like Dukakis, now Bush is bad to fill posts with republicans? It is hard
                          to be a train buff and watch a decline in any type of rail service, but
                          the choice is to cut spending somewhere or grow the government even more.
                          Conrail was the same scenario, don't tighten the belt because Uncle Sam
                          will pay the bills. It was only in the 1980's that Ronald Reagan put the
                          squeeze on Conrail and it turned into a well run company. My concern is
                          to see a good rail passenger service in America, paying fair and
                          competitive wages. Like the postal service or public transportation, it
                          will not turn a profit, so what price are we the taxpayers willing to
                          pay? Don't get me wrong, I feel that both parties are evil and corrupt,
                          but I do favor the core values of one party, too bad they don't stick to
                          them.

                          Steve



                          On Fri, 11 Nov 2005 11:17:31 -0500 "paul larner" <pklarner@...>
                          writes:
                          > I only know what I've heard from a couple guys supposedly up on the
                          > rr world
                          > and what little I've read. Gunn was good for Amtrak; he acted like
                          > a
                          > railroad manager - non of the touchey feeley bs we had with
                          > Warrington.
                          > Passenger service on the rail is a public service and will never
                          > make money
                          > if done right, meaning provide sservice and reasonably comfortably.
                          > It
                          > costs lots of capital dollars for redundancy to ensure
                          > dependability.
                          > Remember when railroads kept locomotives under steam and in reserve
                          > to
                          > rpotect their passenger trains? Today nothing is in reserve with
                          > facilities, equipmentand staffing at a minimum. Legitimate concern
                          > can be
                          > made of over staffing at the middle management level. There are too
                          > many
                          > "staff" positions at Amtrak, but regard that this is not limited to
                          > Amtrak.
                          > Many companies have made efforts to remove levels of management then
                          > back
                          > filled a bit. Amtrak needs to do some of that - in the right
                          > places. Tough
                          > to fire a congressman's relative, contributor or an EOC
                          > promotion/hiree.
                          >
                          > The Bush administration wants to separate the nations passenger
                          > service from
                          > the federal government, not necessarily a bad thing. They have made
                          > an offer
                          > to match state funds where the states want to keep or add needed
                          > service
                          > thus while Amtrak may go passenger service won't, if the individual
                          > states
                          > pick up the bill. New York is a state that receives substantial
                          > Amtrak
                          > service but contribute practically nothing compared to VT, MA, ME;
                          > to get
                          > out of New England, consider the contributions of CA OR IL WI MI and
                          > others
                          > for the operation of trains in their states. The issue to some
                          > extent is
                          > the flyover states don't like paying the bill for trainns ilke 48/49
                          > which
                          > have no justification considering their undependable schedules and
                          > fares.
                          >
                          > Gunn appears to believe that the feds should keep control and fund
                          > Amtrak in
                          > the same way they support so many other industries and
                          > transportation
                          > systems. This isn't a bad position either but it conflicts with the
                          >
                          > administration. Frankly I believe cronyism is at work here too.
                          > Any spin
                          > off or dissolution would benefit someone and we need to know who the
                          > players
                          > are and their relationship if any with principals in the republican
                          > party.
                          > It appears Gunn wasn't having any of it. Note that John Snow, read
                          > CSX, is
                          > secretary of the treasury. CSX is Amtrak's no. 1 destroyer of
                          > service.
                          > Their inability to get their own act together has earned them the
                          > worst
                          > reputation in the industry for service. My thought without facts is
                          > that it
                          > has exceeeds the fiasco of mis judgement following the UP-SP merger.
                          > Amtrak
                          > is a fly in their balm; having it gone would facilitate their
                          > overburdened
                          > system. Bottom line is Gunn was good for Amtrak. IF you accept
                          > that the
                          > fed should fund rail service the same way if funds the airports and
                          >
                          > interstate highway sytem then you should support Gunn. Both
                          > positions have
                          > merit but the Bush guys have a tendency to do things without
                          > thinking them
                          > through. My votes with Gunn.
                          >
                          > PKL
                          >
                          > >From: "Dicarlo, Gino" <Gino.Dicarlo@...>
                          > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                          > >To: <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                          > >Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] FW: statement from Dave Gunn
                          > >Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 06:07:17 -0600
                          > >
                          > >What's going on here Paul. How do you feel about this?
                          > >
                          > >Gino
                          > >
                          > >-----Original Message-----
                          > >From: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                          > [mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com]
                          > >On Behalf Of paul larner
                          > >Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2005 11:33 PM
                          > >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                          > >Subject: [FJGRailroad] FW: statement from Dave Gunn
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > >From: CRengineer@...
                          > > >To: CRengineer@...
                          > > >Subject: statement from Dave Gunn Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2005 21:57:43
                          > EST
                          > > >
                          > > >"The Board members came in this morning and asked me to resign.
                          > I
                          > > >refused,
                          > > >so
                          > > >they fired me," Gunn said in an interview with Railway Age
                          > Editor
                          > >William
                          > > >C.
                          > > >Vantuono.
                          > > >
                          > > >"I feel at least that I did the right, honorable thing. I wasn't
                          > going
                          > > >to abandon our people." He said that the Bush Administrations
                          > people
                          > > >wanted to implement their plan, which is destroying Amtrak. "I
                          > stood in
                          > >
                          > > >their way," he said. "That's why they fired me..."
                          > > >
                          > > >"If you want an example of getting fired for producing good
                          > numbers,
                          > > >this
                          > > >is
                          > > >it," he said. "It's an upside-down world we live in..."
                          > > >
                          > > >"Anything they all tell you is bullshit," Gunn told Railway Age
                          > in his
                          > > >characteristically frank, shoot-from-the hip manner. Citing the
                          > 93-6
                          > > >vote in the Senate approving an Amtrak reauthorization bill
                          > earmarking
                          > > >nearly $12 billion in
                          > > >mostly capital investment over the next few years, Gunn said it
                          > doesn't
                          > > >compute. "The Administration is serious about taking this place
                          > >apart..."
                          > > >
                          > > >What happens next? The Administration is running out of time,
                          > Gunn told
                          > >
                          > > >Railway Age. "They have to do a lot of the dirty stuff this
                          > year,
                          > > >because next year is an election year, and what they've got in
                          > mind
                          > > >will be very unpopular."
                          > >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
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                        • SheilaDanylak@aol.com
                          Well put Steve... couldn t agree with you more.... Phil and Sheila
                          Message 12 of 26 , Nov 11, 2005
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                            Well put Steve... couldn't agree with you more....
                                                                                                     Phil and Sheila
                          • paul larner
                            The vote on the Amtrak funding bill which was overwhelmingly bi partisan provided sufficient funding for enough years forward to protect Amtrak from the
                            Message 13 of 26 , Nov 11, 2005
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                              The vote on the Amtrak funding bill which was overwhelmingly bi partisan
                              provided sufficient funding for enough years forward to protect Amtrak from
                              the cronyism of the Bush administration in their give away of Amtrak and its
                              assets. If Amtrak went bankrupt who do you think would get the Penn
                              Station property? The cronies who now hold the mortgage. And what of the
                              rest of it's assets. The name Timothy Mellon comes to mind and what his
                              grab was on the B&M - real estate. This water is deep.

                              Amtrak has issues, no denial. Much of those problems come from underfunding
                              of the capital needs. If amtrak were treated like the other transportation
                              entities funded by the national government, comparisons could more easily be
                              made (and they could be more easily hidden) Is rail transportation more
                              important to the national economy that air or highway transport? Hard to
                              tell but I don't believe this administration believes it is.

                              Thought just ran through my mind - when you talk about not trusting either
                              party - you know it is quite possible this administration doesn't really
                              care one whit what's best for the country - only what's best for themselves.

                              Public servants no longer see their responsibilities as public service.
                              They concentrate on getting reelected. Remember John Kennedy's statement:
                              "Ask not what my country can do for me, but what can I do for my country?"
                              Where is that spirit today. Appropriate on Veterans Day when men, who long
                              ago passed the age when men went to war, are now taken from established jobs
                              and growing families to possibly die for our freedom. I hope we will all
                              say thank you when we meet a young man or woman who has served. (That's
                              from my perspective. Some of you who read this may find those serving
                              overseas today are half a generation older than you.)

                              PKL

                              >From: "Stephen G. Myers" <Knixrule1@...>
                              >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                              >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                              >Subject: [FJGRailroad] Amtrak
                              >Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:27:30 -0500
                              >
                              > Much is true here, Amtrak is a democrat baby with no real reason to
                              >tighten its belt since it is on the nipple of the taxpayer. it is a
                              >bottomless pit, all the political appointees have been democrat clowns
                              >like Dukakis, now Bush is bad to fill posts with republicans? It is hard
                              >to be a train buff and watch a decline in any type of rail service, but
                              >the choice is to cut spending somewhere or grow the government even more.
                              > Conrail was the same scenario, don't tighten the belt because Uncle Sam
                              >will pay the bills. It was only in the 1980's that Ronald Reagan put the
                              >squeeze on Conrail and it turned into a well run company. My concern is
                              >to see a good rail passenger service in America, paying fair and
                              >competitive wages. Like the postal service or public transportation, it
                              >will not turn a profit, so what price are we the taxpayers willing to
                              >pay? Don't get me wrong, I feel that both parties are evil and corrupt,
                              >but I do favor the core values of one party, too bad they don't stick to
                              >them.
                              >
                              > Steve
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >On Fri, 11 Nov 2005 11:17:31 -0500 "paul larner" <pklarner@...>
                              >writes:
                              > > I only know what I've heard from a couple guys supposedly up on the
                              > > rr world
                              > > and what little I've read. Gunn was good for Amtrak; he acted like
                              > > a
                              > > railroad manager - non of the touchey feeley bs we had with
                              > > Warrington.
                              > > Passenger service on the rail is a public service and will never
                              > > make money
                              > > if done right, meaning provide sservice and reasonably comfortably.
                              > > It
                              > > costs lots of capital dollars for redundancy to ensure
                              > > dependability.
                              > > Remember when railroads kept locomotives under steam and in reserve
                              > > to
                              > > rpotect their passenger trains? Today nothing is in reserve with
                              > > facilities, equipmentand staffing at a minimum. Legitimate concern
                              > > can be
                              > > made of over staffing at the middle management level. There are too
                              > > many
                              > > "staff" positions at Amtrak, but regard that this is not limited to
                              > > Amtrak.
                              > > Many companies have made efforts to remove levels of management then
                              > > back
                              > > filled a bit. Amtrak needs to do some of that - in the right
                              > > places. Tough
                              > > to fire a congressman's relative, contributor or an EOC
                              > > promotion/hiree.
                              > >
                              > > The Bush administration wants to separate the nations passenger
                              > > service from
                              > > the federal government, not necessarily a bad thing. They have made
                              > > an offer
                              > > to match state funds where the states want to keep or add needed
                              > > service
                              > > thus while Amtrak may go passenger service won't, if the individual
                              > > states
                              > > pick up the bill. New York is a state that receives substantial
                              > > Amtrak
                              > > service but contribute practically nothing compared to VT, MA, ME;
                              > > to get
                              > > out of New England, consider the contributions of CA OR IL WI MI and
                              > > others
                              > > for the operation of trains in their states. The issue to some
                              > > extent is
                              > > the flyover states don't like paying the bill for trainns ilke 48/49
                              > > which
                              > > have no justification considering their undependable schedules and
                              > > fares.
                              > >
                              > > Gunn appears to believe that the feds should keep control and fund
                              > > Amtrak in
                              > > the same way they support so many other industries and
                              > > transportation
                              > > systems. This isn't a bad position either but it conflicts with the
                              > >
                              > > administration. Frankly I believe cronyism is at work here too.
                              > > Any spin
                              > > off or dissolution would benefit someone and we need to know who the
                              > > players
                              > > are and their relationship if any with principals in the republican
                              > > party.
                              > > It appears Gunn wasn't having any of it. Note that John Snow, read
                              > > CSX, is
                              > > secretary of the treasury. CSX is Amtrak's no. 1 destroyer of
                              > > service.
                              > > Their inability to get their own act together has earned them the
                              > > worst
                              > > reputation in the industry for service. My thought without facts is
                              > > that it
                              > > has exceeeds the fiasco of mis judgement following the UP-SP merger.
                              > > Amtrak
                              > > is a fly in their balm; having it gone would facilitate their
                              > > overburdened
                              > > system. Bottom line is Gunn was good for Amtrak. IF you accept
                              > > that the
                              > > fed should fund rail service the same way if funds the airports and
                              > >
                              > > interstate highway sytem then you should support Gunn. Both
                              > > positions have
                              > > merit but the Bush guys have a tendency to do things without
                              > > thinking them
                              > > through. My votes with Gunn.
                              > >
                              > > PKL
                              > >
                              > > >From: "Dicarlo, Gino" <Gino.Dicarlo@...>
                              > > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                              > > >To: <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                              > > >Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] FW: statement from Dave Gunn
                              > > >Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 06:07:17 -0600
                              > > >
                              > > >What's going on here Paul. How do you feel about this?
                              > > >
                              > > >Gino
                              > > >
                              > > >-----Original Message-----
                              > > >From: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                              > > [mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com]
                              > > >On Behalf Of paul larner
                              > > >Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2005 11:33 PM
                              > > >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                              > > >Subject: [FJGRailroad] FW: statement from Dave Gunn
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > >From: CRengineer@...
                              > > > >To: CRengineer@...
                              > > > >Subject: statement from Dave Gunn Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2005 21:57:43
                              > > EST
                              > > > >
                              > > > >"The Board members came in this morning and asked me to resign.
                              > > I
                              > > > >refused,
                              > > > >so
                              > > > >they fired me," Gunn said in an interview with Railway Age
                              > > Editor
                              > > >William
                              > > > >C.
                              > > > >Vantuono.
                              > > > >
                              > > > >"I feel at least that I did the right, honorable thing. I wasn't
                              > > going
                              > > > >to abandon our people." He said that the Bush Administrations
                              > > people
                              > > > >wanted to implement their plan, which is destroying Amtrak. "I
                              > > stood in
                              > > >
                              > > > >their way," he said. "That's why they fired me..."
                              > > > >
                              > > > >"If you want an example of getting fired for producing good
                              > > numbers,
                              > > > >this
                              > > > >is
                              > > > >it," he said. "It's an upside-down world we live in..."
                              > > > >
                              > > > >"Anything they all tell you is bullshit," Gunn told Railway Age
                              > > in his
                              > > > >characteristically frank, shoot-from-the hip manner. Citing the
                              > > 93-6
                              > > > >vote in the Senate approving an Amtrak reauthorization bill
                              > > earmarking
                              > > > >nearly $12 billion in
                              > > > >mostly capital investment over the next few years, Gunn said it
                              > > doesn't
                              > > > >compute. "The Administration is serious about taking this place
                              > > >apart..."
                              > > > >
                              > > > >What happens next? The Administration is running out of time,
                              > > Gunn told
                              > > >
                              > > > >Railway Age. "They have to do a lot of the dirty stuff this
                              > > year,
                              > > > >because next year is an election year, and what they've got in
                              > > mind
                              > > > >will be very unpopular."
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                              >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > Visit The FJ&G Store At http://www.cafepress.com/fjgrr
                              > > Visit Pete Seftons Lost Landmark Page
                              > > http://www.lostlandmarks.org
                              > > Visit Charles P. Woolever's Existing Railroad Stations in New York
                              > > State at
                              > > http://ny.existingstations.com/
                              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
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