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Broadalbin and a few other tidbits

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  • pklarner@hotmail.com
    The following is some supplemental data sifted from the valuation books of 1924-1928 (and perhaps one or two other places). The railroads investment in the
    Message 1 of 13 , Jul 26 8:07 AM
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      The following is some supplemental data sifted from the valuation
      books of 1924-1928 (and perhaps one or two other places).

      The railroads investment in the passenger station which it shows as
      built in 1895 was $2,808.20. In as much as the building was a gift
      this would appear to represent only the amount exxpended when the
      building was rebuilt and reduced in size in 1912. No other dates
      were found for the actual reconstruction or reason. Furniture
      consisted of 2 flat top desks, 1 office chair and 1 ticket case.

      The freight house was built in 1911 at a cost of $1,213.95;
      investment at the time of valuation shown as $3,342.90(???).

      The section houses are two: old one (1895) described as "small
      section and tool house" $99.60, and the new (1907) "large s&th"
      $685.67.

      The turntable is shown as built in 1896.

      The dates on the other turntables are: Fonda (1894), Gloversville
      (1902), and Northville (1890)

      The Vail's Mills passenger shelter was built in 1907. Name changed to
      Vail Mills in 1911 reflected for the first time in employee timetable
      of June 18, 1911. A curious side note to this name change is that
      while the name "officially" changed, the supplements for several
      years used the old spelling. Railroad wise for speaking purposes
      Vail's Mills was used by many.

      There were two switches, including the Junction, to Broadalbin and 7
      in the Broadalbin yards. The points of the spur track at Vail's
      Mills faced north (east). The switches at Broadalbin would be the
      coal pocket, south end of the runaround, turntable, crossovers, the
      warehouse and the mill. All were No. 9 frogs except the turntable
      which was a No. 7.

      The junction switch was protected by a distant signal 2,000 feet
      north on the Northville main.

      Gotta do other things now.

      PKL
    • Dicarlo, Gino
      Paul, You said the turntable was built in 1896, but you later said that for the other turntables. the Gloversville turntable was built in 1902. Which one was
      Message 2 of 13 , Jul 26 8:24 AM
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        Paul,

        You said the turntable was built in 1896, but you later said that for the
        other turntables. the Gloversville turntable
        was built in 1902. Which one was built in 1896? Also, what did you mean by
        the Junction switch being protected
        by a distant signal 2000 feet north on the Northville Main?

        Gino

        > ----------
        > From: pklarner@...
        > Reply To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2001 11:07 AM
        > To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [FJGRailroad] Broadalbin and a few other tidbits
        >
        > The following is some supplemental data sifted from the valuation
        > books of 1924-1928 (and perhaps one or two other places).
        >
        > The railroads investment in the passenger station which it shows as
        > built in 1895 was $2,808.20. In as much as the building was a gift
        > this would appear to represent only the amount exxpended when the
        > building was rebuilt and reduced in size in 1912. No other dates
        > were found for the actual reconstruction or reason. Furniture
        > consisted of 2 flat top desks, 1 office chair and 1 ticket case.
        >
        > The freight house was built in 1911 at a cost of $1,213.95;
        > investment at the time of valuation shown as $3,342.90(???).
        >
        > The section houses are two: old one (1895) described as "small
        > section and tool house" $99.60, and the new (1907) "large s&th"
        > $685.67.
        >
        > The turntable is shown as built in 1896.
        >
        > The dates on the other turntables are: Fonda (1894), Gloversville
        > (1902), and Northville (1890)
        >
        > The Vail's Mills passenger shelter was built in 1907. Name changed to
        > Vail Mills in 1911 reflected for the first time in employee timetable
        > of June 18, 1911. A curious side note to this name change is that
        > while the name "officially" changed, the supplements for several
        > years used the old spelling. Railroad wise for speaking purposes
        > Vail's Mills was used by many.
        >
        > There were two switches, including the Junction, to Broadalbin and 7
        > in the Broadalbin yards. The points of the spur track at Vail's
        > Mills faced north (east). The switches at Broadalbin would be the
        > coal pocket, south end of the runaround, turntable, crossovers, the
        > warehouse and the mill. All were No. 9 frogs except the turntable
        > which was a No. 7.
        >
        > The junction switch was protected by a distant signal 2,000 feet
        > north on the Northville main.
        >
        > Gotta do other things now.
        >
        > PKL
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
        > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
        >
        > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At
        > http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/
        >
        > Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
        > in New York State at
        > http://ny.existingstations.com/
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        >
        >
        >
      • paul larner
        The Broadalbin turntable was bult in 1896. The Gloversville and others were built during the years shown. Remember that years shown are the fiscal years
        Message 3 of 13 , Jul 26 8:51 AM
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          The Broadalbin turntable was bult in 1896. The Gloversville and others were
          built during the years shown. Remember that years shown are the fiscal
          years which ended June 30 during that period, so the actual year of
          installation could have been in the last six months of the preceding
          calendar year.

          A distant signal in this case was a semaphore type, they had several it
          turns out, which would indicate to an approaching train that the switch is
          lined for the branch rather than through. See attachment.

          Paul




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        • paul larner
          Addendum: I think this is the signal for the junction. At first I thought it might be the one for Mayfield but the background isn t right. The Mayfield one
          Message 4 of 13 , Jul 26 8:54 AM
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            Addendum: I think this is the signal for the junction. At first I thought
            it might be the one for Mayfield but the background isn't right. The
            Mayfield one should have the hills much closer.

            Gotta get the kids and go to the Museum.

            Paul

            >From: "Dicarlo, Gino" <Gino.Dicarlo@...>
            >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
            >To: "'FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com'" <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
            >Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Broadalbin and a few other tidbits
            >Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 10:24:01 -0500
            >
            >Paul,
            >
            >You said the turntable was built in 1896, but you later said that for the
            >other turntables. the Gloversville turntable
            >was built in 1902. Which one was built in 1896? Also, what did you mean
            >by
            >the Junction switch being protected
            >by a distant signal 2000 feet north on the Northville Main?
            >
            >Gino
            >
            > > ----------
            > > From: pklarner@...
            > > Reply To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
            > > Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2001 11:07 AM
            > > To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
            > > Subject: [FJGRailroad] Broadalbin and a few other tidbits
            > >
            > > The following is some supplemental data sifted from the valuation
            > > books of 1924-1928 (and perhaps one or two other places).
            > >
            > > The railroads investment in the passenger station which it shows as
            > > built in 1895 was $2,808.20. In as much as the building was a gift
            > > this would appear to represent only the amount exxpended when the
            > > building was rebuilt and reduced in size in 1912. No other dates
            > > were found for the actual reconstruction or reason. Furniture
            > > consisted of 2 flat top desks, 1 office chair and 1 ticket case.
            > >
            > > The freight house was built in 1911 at a cost of $1,213.95;
            > > investment at the time of valuation shown as $3,342.90(???).
            > >
            > > The section houses are two: old one (1895) described as "small
            > > section and tool house" $99.60, and the new (1907) "large s&th"
            > > $685.67.
            > >
            > > The turntable is shown as built in 1896.
            > >
            > > The dates on the other turntables are: Fonda (1894), Gloversville
            > > (1902), and Northville (1890)
            > >
            > > The Vail's Mills passenger shelter was built in 1907. Name changed to
            > > Vail Mills in 1911 reflected for the first time in employee timetable
            > > of June 18, 1911. A curious side note to this name change is that
            > > while the name "officially" changed, the supplements for several
            > > years used the old spelling. Railroad wise for speaking purposes
            > > Vail's Mills was used by many.
            > >
            > > There were two switches, including the Junction, to Broadalbin and 7
            > > in the Broadalbin yards. The points of the spur track at Vail's
            > > Mills faced north (east). The switches at Broadalbin would be the
            > > coal pocket, south end of the runaround, turntable, crossovers, the
            > > warehouse and the mill. All were No. 9 frogs except the turntable
            > > which was a No. 7.
            > >
            > > The junction switch was protected by a distant signal 2,000 feet
            > > north on the Northville main.
            > >
            > > Gotta do other things now.
            > >
            > > PKL
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
            > > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
            > >
            > > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At
            > > http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/
            > >
            > > Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
            > > in New York State at
            > > http://ny.existingstations.com/
            > >
            > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
            >http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            > >
            > >
            > >


            _________________________________________________________________
            Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
          • Dicarlo, Gino
            Now I know what you re saying. I didn t realize that the FJG has such nice signals like that. I also didn t know that they had a method of telling what was
            Message 5 of 13 , Jul 26 9:06 AM
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              Now I know what you're saying. I didn't realize that the FJG has such nice
              signals
              like that. I also didn't know that they had a method of telling what was
              heading
              South from Northville that the switch wasn't switched in the right
              direction...

              Gino

              > ----------
              > From: paul larner
              > Reply To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2001 11:51 AM
              > To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Broadalbin and a few other tidbits
              >
              > <<File: Broad. Jct. distant signal, 200 ft. north.jpg>>
              > The Broadalbin turntable was bult in 1896. The Gloversville and others
              > were
              > built during the years shown. Remember that years shown are the fiscal
              > years which ended June 30 during that period, so the actual year of
              > installation could have been in the last six months of the preceding
              > calendar year.
              >
              > A distant signal in this case was a semaphore type, they had several it
              > turns out, which would indicate to an approaching train that the switch is
              >
              > lined for the branch rather than through. See attachment.
              >
              > Paul
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > _________________________________________________________________
              > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
              >
              >
              > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
              > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
              >
              > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At
              > http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/
              >
              > Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
              > in New York State at
              > http://ny.existingstations.com/
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >
              >
            • mwilber@webtv.net
              Paul-Were there any home signals along with the distance signals on this line , or just the one signal for the switch ahead?Did the switch stands have lights
              Message 6 of 13 , Jul 26 11:06 AM
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                Paul-Were there any "home signals" along with the distance signals on
                this line , or just the one signal for the switch ahead?Did the switch
                stands have lights on them too? Does anybody knows how the track dept
                was divided up back then (section gangs)?What crews took care of which
                sections? When I worked there we just had one crew handling Fonda to
                Broadalbin.Of course I realize the times were different. Mark
                I guess Im full of questions today!
              • Dicarlo, Gino
                All of them good questions Mark, and I know that Paul has the answers to them just because he spoke about some of those things last night at our meeting! For
                Message 7 of 13 , Jul 26 11:17 AM
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                  All of them good questions Mark, and I know that Paul has the answers to
                  them
                  just because he spoke about some of those things last night at our meeting!
                  For those of you wondering, the meeting last night was hosted by Gordon
                  Cornell
                  who is the Town and Village of Broadalbin's historian. He took us in and
                  around
                  Broadalbin and pointed out the Railroad sites. Very good stuff which I
                  captured
                  on video tape. I'm going to have to see how it came out and it will be
                  available
                  to our members who couldn't join us!

                  Gino

                  > ----------
                  > From: mwilber@...
                  > Reply To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2001 2:06 PM
                  > To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Broadalbin and a few other tidbits
                  >
                  > Paul-Were there any "home signals" along with the distance signals on
                  > this line , or just the one signal for the switch ahead?Did the switch
                  > stands have lights on them too? Does anybody knows how the track dept
                  > was divided up back then (section gangs)?What crews took care of which
                  > sections? When I worked there we just had one crew handling Fonda to
                  > Broadalbin.Of course I realize the times were different. Mark
                  > I guess Im full of questions today!
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
                  > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
                  >
                  > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At
                  > http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/
                  >
                  > Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
                  > in New York State at
                  > http://ny.existingstations.com/
                  >
                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • paul larner
                  Neither did I until I saw it in the inventory by that piece of the track. I have pics of several semaphore signals used on the line so it appears they had
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jul 26 6:36 PM
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                    Neither did I until I saw it in the inventory by that piece of the track. I
                    have pics of several semaphore signals used on the line so it appears they
                    had some form of in track circuitry to activate them.

                    The one's I know of off the top of my head are: northward just north of W.
                    Main St. Johnstown; northward between Mason and Matthew St., Johnstown;
                    southward between Townsend Ave. and Harrison St.; southward 2000 feet north
                    of Broadalbin Jct.; southward about the same distance north of Mayfield
                    station. There may well have been others. I will have to look for them now
                    and see what I can uncover about their installation, operation and removal.
                    I have a lamp from one of these semaphores that I had at the meeting a
                    couple months ago.

                    PKL


                    >From: "Dicarlo, Gino" <Gino.Dicarlo@...>
                    >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                    >To: "'FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com'" <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                    >Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Broadalbin and a few other tidbits
                    >Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 11:06:57 -0500
                    >
                    >Now I know what you're saying. I didn't realize that the FJG has such
                    >nice
                    >signals
                    >like that. I also didn't know that they had a method of telling what was
                    >heading
                    >South from Northville that the switch wasn't switched in the right
                    >direction...
                    >
                    >Gino
                    >
                    > > ----------
                    > > From: paul larner
                    > > Reply To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                    > > Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2001 11:51 AM
                    > > To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                    > > Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Broadalbin and a few other tidbits
                    > >
                    > > <<File: Broad. Jct. distant signal, 200 ft. north.jpg>>
                    > > The Broadalbin turntable was bult in 1896. The Gloversville and others
                    > > were
                    > > built during the years shown. Remember that years shown are the fiscal
                    > > years which ended June 30 during that period, so the actual year of
                    > > installation could have been in the last six months of the preceding
                    > > calendar year.
                    > >
                    > > A distant signal in this case was a semaphore type, they had several it
                    > > turns out, which would indicate to an approaching train that the switch
                    >is
                    > >
                    > > lined for the branch rather than through. See attachment.
                    > >
                    > > Paul
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > _________________________________________________________________
                    > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at
                    >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
                    > > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
                    > >
                    > > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At
                    > > http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/
                    > >
                    > > Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
                    > > in New York State at
                    > > http://ny.existingstations.com/
                    > >
                    > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                    >http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >


                    _________________________________________________________________
                    Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
                  • paul larner
                    The alignment of the trackwork was split differently at different stages in the company s life. The divisions were marked by steel plate signs mounted on rail
                    Message 9 of 13 , Jul 26 7:35 PM
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                      The alignment of the trackwork was split differently at different stages in
                      the company's life. The divisions were marked by steel plate signs mounted
                      on rail posts adjacent to the roadbed and were probably there when you were
                      working on the line but lost in the brush. They are something to look for
                      when we are all in town on the 11th. There were only three.

                      Before I go any farther there are four semaphores inventoried. Could only
                      locate three in the inventory though - Johnstown, B. Jct and Mayfield. The
                      other two locations must have come later.

                      Section one was headquartered at Fonda and had a motor car and a push car;
                      Section two at Johnstown had only a hand car and a push car;
                      Section three, Gloversville - hand car and push car
                      Section four was at Mayfield - hand car and push car;
                      Section five was at Northvile with a motor car, hand car and pushcar;
                      Section six was Broadalbin - hand car and push car.

                      During the forties and into the fifties there were four sections: 1, 2, 3,
                      6. As the men retired and the money became tighter they were consolidated
                      until there was only one - a foreman and four men.

                      I know of no home signals on the steam line. All the main line switche
                      stands had lamps and a few others as seen in the pic of Spring Street posted
                      today.

                      PKL

                      >
                      >Paul-Were there any "home signals" along with the distance signals on
                      >this line , or just the one signal for the switch ahead?Did the switch
                      >stands have lights on them too? Does anybody knows how the track dept
                      >was divided up back then (section gangs)?What crews took care of which
                      >sections? When I worked there we just had one crew handling Fonda to
                      >Broadalbin.Of course I realize the times were different. Mark
                      > I guess Im full of questions today!
                      >


                      _________________________________________________________________
                      Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
                    • mwilber@webtv.net
                      Interesting! I think I learned more with this group about the FJG, than the 5 years that I worked on it. Thanks - Mark
                      Message 10 of 13 , Jul 27 9:18 AM
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                        Interesting! I think I learned more with this group about the FJG, than
                        the 5 years that I worked on it. Thanks - Mark
                      • Walt Danylak
                        ... ... Does anybody knows how the track dept was divided up back then (section gangs)? Mark, The following is from the PSC Inspection in 1907: The track
                        Message 11 of 13 , Jul 29 7:24 PM
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                          --- In FJGRailroad@y..., mwilber@w... wrote:
                          ... Does anybody knows how the track dept was divided up back then
                          (section gangs)?

                          Mark,

                          The following is from the PSC Inspection in 1907:

                          "The track sections are about 5.3 miles in length and the average
                          force maintained upon each consists of a foreman and five laborers.
                          Each gang is provided with flags, lanterns and torpedoes, and all
                          portions of the road are patrolled daily by some member of the
                          section force."

                          Granted, this was in the heyday, but it should give you some idea of
                          the maintance done at that time.

                          During the 1950's there was at least one section crew of about 4 or 5
                          men that maintained the ROW. They operated out of Gloversville with a
                          motorized handcar and trailers as needed. The car was stored just
                          south of the roundhouse in a tool shed somewhat similiar to the one
                          in Broadalbin. As kids we always refered to the car as a "Putt-Putt"
                          due to the sound it made when running.

                          Walt
                        • choochoo1802@webtv.net
                          Walt-I remember somebody once told me that a handcart got away with a worker on it and struck a vehicle at the Vail Mills crossing.Either the worker was killed
                          Message 12 of 13 , Jul 29 7:36 PM
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                            Walt-I remember somebody once told me that a handcart got away with a
                            worker on it and struck a vehicle at the Vail Mills crossing.Either the
                            worker was killed or serious injured .Do you know if there is any truth
                            in it? Or maybe somebody else knows anything about it. Mark
                          • skalbfel@ix.netcom.com
                            Re: The car was stored just south of the roundhouse in a tool shed somewhat similiar to the one in Broadalbin. See Picture #30 in the 1928 ICC archive for a
                            Message 13 of 13 , Jul 30 11:37 AM
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                              Re: The car was stored just south of the roundhouse in a tool shed
                              somewhat similiar to the one in Broadalbin.

                              See Picture #30 in the 1928 ICC archive for a picture of the toolhouse
                              referred to.
                              Saul
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