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Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00

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  • paul larner
    I don t recognize the name. Does anyone on the list know what he did for the FJ&G for ten years. Bus driver maybe? He makes good points about who s going to
    Message 1 of 13 , Sep 5, 2000
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      I don't recognize the name. Does anyone on the list know what he did for
      the FJ&G for ten years. Bus driver maybe? He makes good points about who's
      going to pay for it. The trail I was involved with at St. Albans (which
      didn't fly for the same nimby reasons) was matching funded by the rotary
      club and was to be maintained by the Park Commission. If a town doesn't
      have money these are not necessarily good ideas.

      PKL

      P.S. Was looking over the FJ&G deed records here tonight for the giggles of
      it and came across a familiar name purchasing a property in the town of
      Northampton from the FJ&G in 1947.


      >From: Gino And Kelly DiCarlo <dicarlos@...>
      >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
      >To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
      >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
      >Date: Tue, 05 Sep 2000 10:52:47 -0400
      >
      >Wow, this guy REALLY hates the RailTrail!
      >
      >Gino
      >
      >
      > > From: "Saul Kalbfeld" <skalbfel@...>
      > > Reply-To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
      > > Date: Tue, 05 Sep 2000 00:30:40 -0000
      > > To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
      > > Subject: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
      > >
      > > Rail Trail a big waste of taxpayers' money
      > >
      > > I worked on the FJ&G Railroad for 10 years. When I worked there, the
      > > railroad owned the land, maintained its own road bed, maintained its
      > > own traffic controllers, plowed the snow, cut the brush and policed
      > > the entire route. The railroad also paid Gloversville, Johnstown and
      > > Amsterdam city taxes, Montgomery and Fulton County taxes and school
      > > taxes to the Northville, Mayfield, Broadalbin, Johnstown, Fonda and
      > > Amsterdam school districts.
      > >
      > > The notion that the Rail Trail fiasco is going to produce some
      > > pie-in-the-sky revenue for this area is beyond ludicrous &emdash;
      > > it's absurd. This is another classic example of politicians throwing
      > > away our tax dollars. Where is this grant coming from? A member item
      > > in the state pork barrel slush fund? We've had a mugging on the
      > > trail,
      > > and last week, a man was charged with sodomy after an incident on the
      > > trail.
      > >
      > > Gloversville and Johnstown have several hundreds of miles of
      > > sidewalks to walk on. What's better than a nice brisk walk on
      > > historic Kingsboro Avenue in the summertime?
      > >
      > > By law, the railroad had to blow its whistle at all grade crossings.
      > > This used to be the chief complaint of the residents. Who is going to
      > > police this monstrosity beyond the city line to Dennie's Crossing?
      > >
      > > Please stop throwing good money after bad.
      > >
      > > ROLAND BOWERS
      > > Gloversville
      > >
      >

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    • Aaron Keller
      I have heard the name before, but know little more. I believe he worked during the DO years. -Aaron
      Message 2 of 13 , Sep 6, 2000
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        I have heard the name before, but know little more. I believe he worked
        during the DO years.

        -Aaron
      • Randy & Lorraine Decker
        I think we see your point here I am thinking your argument using the assault, mugging and did you say Rape?? are indicative of the Gloversville area and not
        Message 3 of 13 , Sep 7, 2000
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          I think we see your point here I am thinking your argument using the
          assault, mugging and did you say Rape?? are indicative of the Gloversville
          area and not the fault of the rail trail itself?? This is like the
          politicians blaming the gun or gun's and not the criminal or fool who is
          using it in a criminal way?? Seems foolish to me to blame the rail trail
          for the rapist it's like blaming the parking lot at the grocery store for a
          fender bender?? This trail to me is just a nice addition to this area and I
          do not see it ever being any monetary draw to anyone, other than the ice
          cream and hot dog stands along the route! I have made the point before
          about the snow machines in the winter these monsters race across the roads
          at hundreds of MPH when there do not seem to be lights from an approaching
          car coming! and this is much more dangerous than anyone on a bike?? I
          suppose we are going to need to be watching for BIKER GANGS NOW? Leaving
          this roadbed like it is seems to me like a big scar right across Fulton
          County and this may only be a band-aid but it is at least that and I have
          seen Tax Payers money spent much more foolishly elsewhere at least it is
          being spent foolishly right here!! I mean no offence here Roland your view
          is shared by many but lets all be fair here Gloversville needs anything it
          can get And yes by the way I aggree with you about the taxes on the
          property and I may be mistaken but I think the towns and cities are paying
          tax on their shares of this property??

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Saul Kalbfeld <skalbfel@...>
          To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
          Sent: Monday, September 04, 2000 8:30 PM
          Subject: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00


          >
          > Rail Trail a big waste of taxpayers' money
          >
          > I worked on the FJ&G Railroad for 10 years. When I worked there, the
          > railroad owned the land, maintained its own road bed, maintained its
          > own traffic controllers, plowed the snow, cut the brush and policed
          > the entire route. The railroad also paid Gloversville, Johnstown and
          > Amsterdam city taxes, Montgomery and Fulton County taxes and school
          > taxes to the Northville, Mayfield, Broadalbin, Johnstown, Fonda and
          > Amsterdam school districts.
          >
          > The notion that the Rail Trail fiasco is going to produce some
          > pie-in-the-sky revenue for this area is beyond ludicrous &emdash;
          > it's absurd. This is another classic example of politicians throwing
          > away our tax dollars. Where is this grant coming from? A member item
          > in the state pork barrel slush fund? We've had a mugging on the
          > trail,
          > and last week, a man was charged with sodomy after an incident on the
          > trail.
          >
          > Gloversville and Johnstown have several hundreds of miles of
          > sidewalks to walk on. What's better than a nice brisk walk on
          > historic Kingsboro Avenue in the summertime?
          >
          > By law, the railroad had to blow its whistle at all grade crossings.
          > This used to be the chief complaint of the residents. Who is going to
          > police this monstrosity beyond the city line to Dennie's Crossing?
          >
          > Please stop throwing good money after bad.
          >
          > ROLAND BOWERS
          > Gloversville
          >
          >
          > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
          > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
          >
          > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At
          http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/
          >
          > Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
          > in New York State at
          > http://ny.existingstations.com/
          >
        • leedarshi
          Well, Gino, I have to disagree with you. Hate seems to be extreme. I can understand someone feeling that the idea is not a good one. What I think is
          Message 4 of 13 , Sep 11, 2000
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            Well, Gino, I have to disagree with you. Hate seems to be extreme. I can
            understand someone feeling that the idea is not a good one. What I
            think is interesting is the letter from Theresa that tells of the
            Railroad Laws of 1850 and the reversionary rights. People do have rights
            and if the info Theresa found is as she described it, then that would be
            a way for land owners along the way to make their voice heard.

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "Gino And Kelly DiCarlo" <dicarlos@...>
            To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
            Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 10:52 AM
            Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
            > Wow, this guy REALLY hates the RailTrail!
            >
            > Gino
            >
            > > Subject: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
            > >
            > > Rail Trail a big waste of taxpayers' money
            > >
            > > The notion that the Rail Trail fiasco is going to produce some
            > > pie-in-the-sky revenue for this area is beyond ludicrous &emdash;
            > > it's absurd. This is another classic example of politicians throwing
            > > away our tax dollars. Where is this grant coming from? A member item
            > > in the state pork barrel slush fund? We've had a mugging on the
            > > trail,
            > > and last week, a man was charged with sodomy after an incident on
            the
            > > trail.
            > >
            > > Gloversville and Johnstown have several hundreds of miles of
            > > sidewalks to walk on. What's better than a nice brisk walk on
            > > historic Kingsboro Avenue in the summertime?
            > >
            > > By law, the railroad had to blow its whistle at all grade crossings.
            > > This used to be the chief complaint of the residents. Who is going
            to
            > > police this monstrosity beyond the city line to Dennie's Crossing?
            > >
            > > Please stop throwing good money after bad.
            > >
            > > ROLAND BOWERS
            > > Gloversville
            > >
          • Gino And Kelly DiCarlo
            Yeah I guess so! Hate is a little extreme. I meant, he really doesn t like the rail-trail! Gino
            Message 5 of 13 , Sep 11, 2000
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              Yeah I guess so! Hate is a little extreme. I meant, he really
              doesn't like the rail-trail!

              Gino


              > From: "leedarshi" <LeeDarshi@...>
              > Organization: mYSELF
              > Reply-To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
              > Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 03:44:15 -0400
              > To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
              > Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
              >
              >
              > Well, Gino, I have to disagree with you. Hate seems to be extreme. I can
              > understand someone feeling that the idea is not a good one. What I
              > think is interesting is the letter from Theresa that tells of the
              > Railroad Laws of 1850 and the reversionary rights. People do have rights
              > and if the info Theresa found is as she described it, then that would be
              > a way for land owners along the way to make their voice heard.
              >
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: "Gino And Kelly DiCarlo" <dicarlos@...>
              > To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
              > Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 10:52 AM
              > Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
              >> Wow, this guy REALLY hates the RailTrail!
              >>
              >> Gino
              >>
              >>> Subject: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
              >>>
              >>> Rail Trail a big waste of taxpayers' money
              >>>
              >>> The notion that the Rail Trail fiasco is going to produce some
              >>> pie-in-the-sky revenue for this area is beyond ludicrous &emdash;
              >>> it's absurd. This is another classic example of politicians throwing
              >>> away our tax dollars. Where is this grant coming from? A member item
              >>> in the state pork barrel slush fund? We've had a mugging on the
              >>> trail,
              >>> and last week, a man was charged with sodomy after an incident on
              > the
              >>> trail.
              >>>
              >>> Gloversville and Johnstown have several hundreds of miles of
              >>> sidewalks to walk on. What's better than a nice brisk walk on
              >>> historic Kingsboro Avenue in the summertime?
              >>>
              >>> By law, the railroad had to blow its whistle at all grade crossings.
              >>> This used to be the chief complaint of the residents. Who is going
              > to
              >>> police this monstrosity beyond the city line to Dennie's Crossing?
              >>>
              >>> Please stop throwing good money after bad.
              >>>
              >>> ROLAND BOWERS
              >>> Gloversville
              >>>
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
              > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
              >
              > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At
              > http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/
              >
              > Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
              > in New York State at
              > http://ny.existingstations.com/
              >
              >
            • paul larner
              There are a significant number of folks that don t favor bikepaths, rail trails or whatever you choose to call the public acquisition of land that was either
              Message 6 of 13 , Sep 11, 2000
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                There are a significant number of folks that don't favor bikepaths, rail
                trails or whatever you choose to call the public acquisition of land that
                was either purchased or usurped for a specific purpose, usually in the
                private sector, then taken over by the public sector for another use from
                which the folks obtain no benefit. Truthfully that's what bike paths are.
                I've biked on several that were well maintained, lighted and patroled (some,
                not all). But not to one of them did I contribute a cent of my tax dollar
                (other than any federal or state money to construct the things) and I've
                never seen one that charges a fee for use. This is a major issue. Another
                obstacle is the idea of out of towners and undesirable locals wandering
                through your "back yard".

                NIMBY. If a proposed trail was to be put adjacent to or through your
                property, what position would you really take? Especially when you enjoy
                the privacy of your pool, barbecue or sunbathing.

                Every rational point has a valid counterpoint.

                In the face of unequivocal revertion rights, for the location of Burlington
                VT bike path, on the old Rutland roadbed, the desire of the city to use the
                land for the bike path was sustained in court.

                In Vermont the bike path idea is a tourist attraction thing, and there are
                some nice ones.

                PKL


                >From: Gino And Kelly DiCarlo <dicarlos@...>
                >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
                >To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
                >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                >Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 12:28:54 -0400
                >
                >Yeah I guess so! Hate is a little extreme. I meant, he really
                >doesn't like the rail-trail!
                >
                >Gino
                >
                >
                > > From: "leedarshi" <LeeDarshi@...>
                > > Organization: mYSELF
                > > Reply-To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
                > > Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 03:44:15 -0400
                > > To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
                > > Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                > >
                > >
                > > Well, Gino, I have to disagree with you. Hate seems to be extreme. I can
                > > understand someone feeling that the idea is not a good one. What I
                > > think is interesting is the letter from Theresa that tells of the
                > > Railroad Laws of 1850 and the reversionary rights. People do have rights
                > > and if the info Theresa found is as she described it, then that would be
                > > a way for land owners along the way to make their voice heard.
                > >
                > > ----- Original Message -----
                > > From: "Gino And Kelly DiCarlo" <dicarlos@...>
                > > To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
                > > Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 10:52 AM
                > > Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                > >> Wow, this guy REALLY hates the RailTrail!
                > >>
                > >> Gino
                > >>
                > >>> Subject: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                > >>>
                > >>> Rail Trail a big waste of taxpayers' money
                > >>>
                > >>> The notion that the Rail Trail fiasco is going to produce some
                > >>> pie-in-the-sky revenue for this area is beyond ludicrous &emdash;
                > >>> it's absurd. This is another classic example of politicians throwing
                > >>> away our tax dollars. Where is this grant coming from? A member item
                > >>> in the state pork barrel slush fund? We've had a mugging on the
                > >>> trail,
                > >>> and last week, a man was charged with sodomy after an incident on
                > > the
                > >>> trail.
                > >>>
                > >>> Gloversville and Johnstown have several hundreds of miles of
                > >>> sidewalks to walk on. What's better than a nice brisk walk on
                > >>> historic Kingsboro Avenue in the summertime?
                > >>>
                > >>> By law, the railroad had to blow its whistle at all grade crossings.
                > >>> This used to be the chief complaint of the residents. Who is going
                > > to
                > >>> police this monstrosity beyond the city line to Dennie's Crossing?
                > >>>
                > >>> Please stop throwing good money after bad.
                > >>>
                > >>> ROLAND BOWERS
                > >>> Gloversville
                > >>>
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Visit Gino's F.J.G.R.R. Page at
                > > http://www.capital.net/~dicarlos/
                > >
                > > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation At
                > > http://www.trainweb.com/gcdra/
                > >
                > > Visit The Site For Existing Railroad Stations
                > > in New York State at
                > > http://ny.existingstations.com/
                > >
                > >
                >

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              • leedarshi
                What does NIMBY mean? ... From: paul larner To: Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 4:42 PM Subject: Re:
                Message 7 of 13 , Sep 12, 2000
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                  What does NIMBY mean?

                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "paul larner" <pklarner@...>
                  To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
                  Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 4:42 PM
                  Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                  > NIMBY. If a proposed trail was to be put adjacent to or through your
                  > property, what position would you really take? Especially when you
                  enjoy
                  > the privacy of your pool, barbecue or sunbathing.
                • Gino And Kelly DiCarlo
                  Here s something I ve always wondered about the FJG abandonment. Does abandonment mean that the rail carrier just leaves their railroad behind with no
                  Message 8 of 13 , Sep 12, 2000
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                    Here's something I've always wondered about the FJG abandonment. Does
                    abandonment mean that the rail carrier just leaves their railroad
                    behind with no compensation or did the county buy the right of way?
                    What did the DO get out of abandoning the FJG?

                    Gino


                    > From: "paul larner" <pklarner@...>
                    > Reply-To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
                    > Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 16:42:44 EDT
                    > To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
                    > Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                    >

                    > There are a significant number of folks that don't favor bikepaths, rail
                    > trails or whatever you choose to call the public acquisition of land that
                    > was either purchased or usurped for a specific purpose, usually in the
                    > private sector, then taken over by the public sector for another use from
                    > which the folks obtain no benefit. Truthfully that's what bike paths are.
                    > I've biked on several that were well maintained, lighted and patroled (some,
                    > not all). But not to one of them did I contribute a cent of my tax dollar
                    > (other than any federal or state money to construct the things) and I've
                    > never seen one that charges a fee for use. This is a major issue. Another
                    > obstacle is the idea of out of towners and undesirable locals wandering
                    > through your "back yard".
                    >
                    > NIMBY. If a proposed trail was to be put adjacent to or through your
                    > property, what position would you really take? Especially when you enjoy
                    > the privacy of your pool, barbecue or sunbathing.
                    >
                    > Every rational point has a valid counterpoint.
                    >
                    > In the face of unequivocal revertion rights, for the location of Burlington
                    > VT bike path, on the old Rutland roadbed, the desire of the city to use the
                    > land for the bike path was sustained in court.
                    >
                    > In Vermont the bike path idea is a tourist attraction thing, and there are
                    > some nice ones.
                    >
                    > PKL
                  • Gino And Kelly DiCarlo
                    Not in my backyard
                    Message 9 of 13 , Sep 12, 2000
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                      Not in my backyard

                      > From: "leedarshi" <LeeDarshi@...>
                      > Organization: mYSELF
                      > Reply-To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
                      > Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2000 07:53:57 -0400
                      > To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
                      > Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                      ------------------------------_->
                      >
                      > What does NIMBY mean?
                      >
                    • paul larner
                      Not In My Back Yard ... _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
                      Message 10 of 13 , Sep 12, 2000
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                        Not In My Back Yard


                        >From: "leedarshi" <LeeDarshi@...>
                        >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@egroups.com
                        >To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
                        >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                        >Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2000 07:53:57 -0400
                        >
                        >What does NIMBY mean?
                        >
                        >----- Original Message -----
                        >From: "paul larner" <pklarner@...>
                        >To: <FJGRailroad@egroups.com>
                        >Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 4:42 PM
                        >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                        > > NIMBY. If a proposed trail was to be put adjacent to or through your
                        > > property, what position would you really take? Especially when you
                        >enjoy
                        > > the privacy of your pool, barbecue or sunbathing.
                        >
                        >

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                      • leedarshi
                        Thank you. ... From: paul larner Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower s Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                        Message 11 of 13 , Sep 30, 2000
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                          Thank you.
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: "paul larner" <pklarner@...>
                          Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                          >
                          > Not In My Back Yard
                          >
                          > >From: "leedarshi" <LeeDarshi@...>
                          > >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Roland Bower's Letter to LH on 8/3/00
                          > >Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2000 07:53:57 -0400
                          > >What does NIMBY mean?
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