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RE: [FJGRailroad] FJ&G Dispatching

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  • Paul Larner
    FJ&G moved trains on the authorities of timetable schedule and train orders. Their rule book followed the standard code. Rule 94. For the movement of trains
    Message 1 of 13 , Jun 12, 2013
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      FJ&G moved trains on the authorities of timetable schedule and train orders.  Their rule book followed the standard code.
       
      Rule 94.  For the movement of trains not provided for by time-table, train orders will be issues by authority and over the signature of the Superintendent.  They must contain neither information nor instructions not essential for such movements.
       
      They must be brief and clear; in the prescribed forms where applicable; and without erasure, alteration or interlineation.
       
      PKL
       

      To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
      From: etozorak@...
      Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 20:03:28 +0000
      Subject: [FJGRailroad] FJ&G Dispatching

       
      In the 1950s, how were the trains dispatched? Some were listed in the timetable, but how were meets coordinated without signals?

      Thanks in advance.


    • Aaron Keller
      This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with
      Message 2 of 13 , Jun 15, 2013
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        This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

        A newspaper account exists detailing a string of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

        To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

        And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

        -Aaron
      • Paul Larner
        Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958. So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.
        Message 3 of 13 , Jun 15, 2013
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          Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.
           
          Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.
           
          Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.
           
          PKL
           

           

          To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
          From: akeller_1979@...
          Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700
          Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

           
          This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

          A newspaper account exists detailing a string of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

          To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

          And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

          -Aaron


        • johnsesonske
          During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but
          Message 4 of 13 , Jun 15, 2013
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            During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
             
            My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
             
            I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
             
            John
            -----Original Message-----
            From: Paul Larner <pklarner@...>
            To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm
            Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

             
            Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.
             
            Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.
             
            Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.
             
            PKL
             

             

            To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
            From: akeller_1979@...
            Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700
            Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

             
            This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

            A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

            To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

            And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

            -Aaron

          • Mark Wilber
            There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there
            Message 5 of 13 , Jun 16, 2013
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              There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there between 1978 and 1983.There were times that if we were in Sangerfield working,we could here the conversations in Cortland.

              From: "jsesonske@..." <jsesonske@...>
              To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 12:41 AM
              Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
               
              During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
               
              My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
               
              I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
               
              John
              -----Original Message----- From: Paul Larner <pklarner@...> To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
               
              Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.   Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.   Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.   PKL    
              To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com From: akeller_1979@... Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700 Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching 
              This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

              A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

              To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

              And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

              -Aaron

            • Mark Wilber
              Let me correct my last message. We had hand held radios on the FJG when I worked there from 1978 to 1983 +. On the NYSW,we had repeaters in the Cassville NY
              Message 6 of 13 , Jun 16, 2013
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                Let me correct my last message. We had hand held radios on the FJG when I worked there from 1978 to 1983 +. On the NYSW,we had repeaters in the Cassville NY for the Utica side,mostly for communications between Utica and SherburneNY. Between Norwich and Binghamton would use the Chenango Forks repeater.There was another one in Jamesville that we would use between Jamesville and Homer. Between Cortland and Binghamton would also use the Chenango Forks repeater. There was an area between Sherburne and Norwich,and also in the Cortland area that was dark. When radio would fail,we also had track phones to use along the line.

                From: Mark Wilber <mwilber2001@...>
                To: "FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com" <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 11:08 AM
                Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                 
                There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there between 1978 and 1983.There were times that if we were in Sangerfield working,we could here the conversations in Cortland.

                From: "jsesonske@..." <jsesonske@...>
                To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 12:41 AM
                Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                 
                During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
                 
                My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
                 
                I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
                 
                John
                -----Original Message----- From: Paul Larner <pklarner@...> To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                 
                Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.   Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.   Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.   PKL    
                To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com From: akeller_1979@... Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700 Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching 
                This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

                A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

                To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

                And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

                -Aaron

              • Charlie Vosburgh
                This is off subject but I believe there has been a washout on the CSX Mohawk division near Yost putting the Chicago line out of service. They have been
                Message 7 of 13 , Jun 16, 2013
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                  This is off subject but I believe there has been a washout on the CSX Mohawk division near Yost putting the Chicago line out of service.  They  have been hauling shot rock and riprap from Carver's quarry in Rockwood around the clock, starting Saturday afternoon.  Traffic is moving on the other line by track foreman direction.  The canal was drained in advance of the heavy rain that was forecast at Lock 14 and 15.  Charlie
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 11:08 AM
                  Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                   

                  There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there between 1978 and 1983.There were times that if we were in Sangerfield working,we could here the conversations in Cortland.

                  From: "jsesonske@..." <jsesonske@...>
                  To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 12:41 AM
                  Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                   
                  During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
                   
                  My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
                   
                  I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
                   
                  John
                  -----Original Message----- From: Paul Larner <pklarner@...> To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                   
                  Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.   Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.   Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.   PKL    
                  To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com From: akeller_1979@... Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700 Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching  
                  This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

                  A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

                  To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

                  And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

                  -Aaron

                  No virus found in this message.
                  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                  Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6413 - Release Date: 06/15/13

                • johnsesonske
                  There is some sort of washout or issue along TK 2 right on the east side of the Lock 13 dam structure. On Saturday TK 2 was closed from CP-184 on the east side
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jun 16, 2013
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                    There is some sort of washout or issue along TK 2 right on the east side of the Lock 13 dam structure. On Saturday TK 2 was closed from CP-184 on the east side of Fonda to CP-198 on the east side of Nelliston. TK 1 was fully in service under control of a local foreman and with a 20mph or 30mph restriction. All trains were getting backed up including Amtrak but trains were flowing.
                     
                    As you said, a lot of rip rap was coming in by truck and being dumped along the ROW by Lock 13.
                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: Charlie Vosburgh <crvosburgh@...>
                    To: FJGRailroad <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Sun, Jun 16, 2013 1:00 pm
                    Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                     
                    
                    This is off subject but I believe there has been a washout on the CSX Mohawk division near Yost putting the Chicago line out of service.  They  have been hauling shot rock and riprap from Carver's quarry in Rockwood around the clock, starting Saturday afternoon.  Traffic is moving on the other line by track foreman direction.  The canal was drained in advance of the heavy rain that was forecast at Lock 14 and 15.  Charlie
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 11:08 AM
                    Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                     
                    There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there between 1978 and 1983.There were times that if we were in Sangerfield working,we could here the conversations in Cortland.

                    From: "jsesonske@..." <jsesonske@...>
                    To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 12:41 AM
                    Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                     
                    During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
                     
                    My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
                     
                    I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
                     
                    John
                    -----Original Message----- From: Paul Larner <pklarner@...> To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                     
                    Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.   Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.   Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.   PKL    
                    To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com From: akeller_1979@... Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700 Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching  
                    This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

                    A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

                    To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

                    And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

                    -Aaron

                    No virus found in this message.
                    Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                    Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6413 - Release Date: 06/15/13
                  • Gino's Railpage
                    What s the status of the Chicago Line today? Gino
                    Message 9 of 13 , Jun 17, 2013
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                      What's the status of the Chicago Line today?

                      Gino

                      On Jun 16, 2013 1:00 PM, "Charlie Vosburgh" <crvosburgh@...> wrote:
                       

                      This is off subject but I believe there has been a washout on the CSX Mohawk division near Yost putting the Chicago line out of service.  They  have been hauling shot rock and riprap from Carver's quarry in Rockwood around the clock, starting Saturday afternoon.  Traffic is moving on the other line by track foreman direction.  The canal was drained in advance of the heavy rain that was forecast at Lock 14 and 15.  Charlie
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 11:08 AM
                      Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                       

                      There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there between 1978 and 1983.There were times that if we were in Sangerfield working,we could here the conversations in Cortland.

                      From: "jsesonske@..." <jsesonske@...>
                      To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 12:41 AM
                      Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                       
                      During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
                       
                      My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
                       
                      I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
                       
                      John
                      -----Original Message----- From: Paul Larner <pklarner@...> To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                       
                      Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.   Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.   Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.   PKL    
                      To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com From: akeller_1979@... Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700 Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching  
                      This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

                      A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

                      To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

                      And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

                      -Aaron

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                      Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                      Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6413 - Release Date: 06/15/13

                    • Charlie Vosburgh
                      Gino The problem was caused at Lock 13. They have been rehabing the dam structure and with the high water that we have had, the water went between the dam
                      Message 10 of 13 , Jun 17, 2013
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Gino  The problem was caused at Lock 13.  They have been rehabing the dam structure and with the high water that we have had, the water went between the dam and the ROW.  They are still hauling stone today and I understand that other quarrys have been providing stone as well, that comes from an operator at Lock 14.  This all started Thursday night.  Had the scanner on and sounds like they are still down to one track at this time.  Charlie
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        Sent: Monday, June 17, 2013 1:03 PM
                        Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                         

                        What's the status of the Chicago Line today?

                        Gino

                        On Jun 16, 2013 1:00 PM, "Charlie Vosburgh" <crvosburgh@...> wrote:
                         

                        This is off subject but I believe there has been a washout on the CSX Mohawk division near Yost putting the Chicago line out of service.  They  have been hauling shot rock and riprap from Carver's quarry in Rockwood around the clock, starting Saturday afternoon.  Traffic is moving on the other line by track foreman direction.  The canal was drained in advance of the heavy rain that was forecast at Lock 14 and 15.  Charlie
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 11:08 AM
                        Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                         

                        There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there between 1978 and 1983.There were times that if we were in Sangerfield working,we could here the conversations in Cortland.

                        From: "jsesonske@..." <jsesonske@...>
                        To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 12:41 AM
                        Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                         
                        During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
                         
                        My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
                         
                        I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
                         
                        John
                        -----Original Message----- From: Paul Larner <pklarner@...> To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                         
                        Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.   Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.   Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.   PKL    
                        To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com From: akeller_1979@... Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700 Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching  
                        This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

                        A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

                        To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

                        And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

                        -Aaron

                        No virus found in this message.
                        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                        Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6413 - Release Date: 06/15/13

                        No virus found in this message.
                        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                        Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6417 - Release Date: 06/16/13

                      • Gino's Railpage
                        They should reroute some of the traffic to the West Shore! Maybe drag some stone from Cushing to Utica and then back up the Chicago Line. Oh, wait a minute.
                        Message 11 of 13 , Jun 17, 2013
                        • 0 Attachment
                          They should reroute some of the traffic to the West Shore!  Maybe drag some stone from Cushing to Utica and then back up the Chicago Line.

                          Oh, wait a minute.  That message was 45 years too late!

                          Gino


                          On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 3:15 PM, Charlie Vosburgh <crvosburgh@...> wrote:
                           

                          Gino  The problem was caused at Lock 13.  They have been rehabing the dam structure and with the high water that we have had, the water went between the dam and the ROW.  They are still hauling stone today and I understand that other quarrys have been providing stone as well, that comes from an operator at Lock 14.  This all started Thursday night.  Had the scanner on and sounds like they are still down to one track at this time.  Charlie
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          Sent: Monday, June 17, 2013 1:03 PM
                          Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                           

                          What's the status of the Chicago Line today?

                          Gino

                          On Jun 16, 2013 1:00 PM, "Charlie Vosburgh" <crvosburgh@...> wrote:
                           

                          This is off subject but I believe there has been a washout on the CSX Mohawk division near Yost putting the Chicago line out of service.  They  have been hauling shot rock and riprap from Carver's quarry in Rockwood around the clock, starting Saturday afternoon.  Traffic is moving on the other line by track foreman direction.  The canal was drained in advance of the heavy rain that was forecast at Lock 14 and 15.  Charlie
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 11:08 AM
                          Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                           

                          There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there between 1978 and 1983.There were times that if we were in Sangerfield working,we could here the conversations in Cortland.

                          From: "jsesonske@..." <jsesonske@...>
                          To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                          Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 12:41 AM
                          Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                           
                          During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
                           
                          My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
                           
                          I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
                           
                          John
                          -----Original Message----- From: Paul Larner <pklarner@...> To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching
                           
                          Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.   Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.   Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.   PKL    
                          To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com From: akeller_1979@... Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700 Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching  
                          This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  

                          A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  

                          To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  

                          And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)

                          -Aaron

                          No virus found in this message.
                          Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                          Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6413 - Release Date: 06/15/13

                          No virus found in this message.
                          Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                          Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6417 - Release Date: 06/16/13




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                        • Patrick lavallee
                          Good one Gino. Patrick Lavallee Sent on the TELUS Mobility network with BlackBerry ... From: Gino s Railpage Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2013
                          Message 12 of 13 , Jun 17, 2013
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Good one Gino.
                            Patrick Lavallee
                            Sent on the TELUS Mobility network with BlackBerry

                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: Gino's Railpage <fjgrailroad@...>
                            Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2013 02:12:59
                            To: <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                            Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                             





                            They should reroute some of the traffic to the West Shore!  Maybe drag some stone from Cushing to Utica and then back up the Chicago Line.

                            Oh, wait a minute.  That message was 45 years too late!

                            Gino




                            On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 3:15 PM, Charlie Vosburgh <crvosburgh@... <mailto:crvosburgh@...> > wrote:

                             




                            Gino  The problem was caused at Lock 13.  They have been rehabing the dam structure and with the high water that we have had, the water went between the dam and the ROW.  They are still hauling stone today and I understand that other quarrys have been providing stone as well, that comes from an operator at Lock 14.  This all started Thursday night.  Had the scanner on and sounds like they are still down to one track at this time.  Charlie


                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: Gino's
                            Railpage <mailto:fjgrailroad@...>
                            To: FJGrailroad <mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Monday, June 17, 2013 1:03 PM
                            Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                             


                            What's the status of the Chicago Line today?
                            Gino
                            On Jun 16, 2013 1:00 PM, "Charlie Vosburgh" <crvosburgh@... <mailto:crvosburgh@...> > wrote:

                             




                            This is off subject but I believe there has been a washout on the CSX Mohawk division near Yost putting the Chicago line out of service.  They  have been hauling shot rock and riprap from Carver's quarry in Rockwood around the clock, starting Saturday afternoon.  Traffic is moving on the other line by track foreman direction.  The canal was drained in advance of the heavy rain that was forecast at Lock 14 and 15.  Charlie
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: Mark Wilber <mailto:mwilber2001@...>
                            To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com <mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 11:08 AM
                            Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                             



                            There was a repeater in the Jamesville area,one in the Cassville NY area,and one in the Chenango Forks area.We had hand held radios when I worked there between 1978 and 1983.There were times that if we were in Sangerfield working,we could here the conversations in Cortland.





                            From: "jsesonske@... <mailto:jsesonske@...> " <jsesonske@... <mailto:jsesonske@...> >
                            To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com <mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 12:41 AM
                            Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching



                             


                            During the DO days the Cooperstown Dispatcher controlled movement on the FJ&G. I do not recall it being a dial up system where you hear the phone ringing but that was a long time ago. On the S&NC you actually hear a phone call over the scanner.
                             
                            My notes show the FJ&G to Cooperstown frequency as 162.000
                             
                            I do know that in the late 80's the times I was at Lock 13 in Randall I could hear the NYSW loud and clear on my scanner. They had a strong radio system. Back in the late 80's I could clearly hear all NYSW radio conversations going on in Utica on my hand held scanner while I was in Syracuse. This was back when the NYSW only went as far north as Jamesville and the Utica line was the main route north and south.
                             
                            John


                            -----Original Message----- From: Paul Larner <pklarner@... <mailto:pklarner@...> > To: FJGRailroad <fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com <mailto:fjgrailroad@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Sat, Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm Subject: RE: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching

                             




                            Radio communication between the dispatcher and the locomotive was established in 1958.  So far as I know there was no use of individual hand sets on the FJ&G.  Hand or lamp signals were used to communicate among train crew members.  I have no specific recollection of what the practice was during the DO.  What you suggest re dialing in was, and is, standard operating practice on many roads.   Railroads go dark when the signal system fails; when radios fail they go silent.  Railroad rules are written for the eventuality that both communication and signals will fail.  What happens today when the radio system fails, with so few employees in the field, may result in a cessation of movement, certainly a bit of delay.  However if there are enough men in the field to fulfill the protocol established by the operating rules business could continue.  That was not a problem on the FJ&G.  Those men knew how to do their jobs with or without radio communication.   Perhaps Mark, if he's still on here, can fill us in on DOs radio practice.   PKL    

                            To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com <mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com> From: akeller_1979@... <mailto:akeller_1979@...> Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2013 12:57:32 -0700 Subject: [FJGRailroad] Re: FJ&G Dispatching  







                            This raises another interesting question about the use of radios on the railroad.  When did it start, and how were they used?  Did the diesels arrive with radios installed, thus beginning the "Radio Equipped" era on the FJ&G?  


                            A newspaper account exists detailing a str ing of vandalism on the railroad at some point in the 50s or 60s.  Damaged were several locations on the railroad right of way proper AND the railroad's radio repeter, which was listed as having been installed on Ayers Hill.  I always thought this was odd, as normally kids vandalizing a railroad switch or boxcar would not then travel to a point not actually on the right of way to damage communications circuits.  I never fully researched the incident to ascertain whether arrests were made.  It's been ten years since I've read those articles.  


                            To the topic at hand, did the railroad go "dark" after the repeater was damaged?  


                            And when DO came onto the scene, my understanding is that the crews had to dial in Cooperstown via the locomotive radios.  Where was the repeater or repeaters for this system and what was the range?  (The Saratoga & North Creek roughly uses the same type of set up to dial Iowa-Pacific dispatchers in Chicago.)


                            -Aaron








                            No virus found in this message.
                            Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
                            Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6413 - Release Date: 06/15/13







                            No virus found in this message.
                            Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
                            Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6417 - Release Date: 06/16/13





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