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Re: S2's 20 and 21

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  • Robert Schoneman
    I suspect Paul is correct. Apology on subject, but proves a point. Over here with the Cannuck National, we see paint changes almost daily, pending the unit.
    Message 1 of 19 , Jan 22, 2008
      I suspect Paul is correct.

      Apology on subject, but proves a point. Over here with the Cannuck National, we see paint
      changes almost daily, pending the unit. Granted a small obscure wannabe regional doesn't
      compare to a large wanabee railroad like CN; but it has boiled down to what's in stock in
      warehouse, and fastest, er cheapest method of recitifying and getting back on road.
      Regardless of age of unit.

      In these two views I've taken over the past few weeks, the IC, er CN SD70's undergo
      changes as sill stripes fade or wear off. On a fair portion of units now, we see patch
      jobs: Yellow sillstrpe, a section of white, yellow, white then none at all. Looks horrid.

      Despite the lack of a bath, the trailing SD70 is painted as they were built for IC. The
      yellow crap is CN. ( As we learn now recently as a suggestion from the FRA )

      http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1012937

      Same is true for IC 6011, whatever is in stock:

      http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1002234

      I suspect sill stripe will be changed next time she makes it back to her home shop, 200+
      miles away. CN closed the two big shops here in WI, and cut 80% of the workforce. VERY
      slowly do they repaint these into CN colors, usually when the unit has wore back down to
      it's primer base.

      At least one of our our small regionals know how to do it right:

      http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=740248

      ...as well as one of yours:

      http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=463401


      Well enough about WI and everyone else's RR's.

      Take Care all-

      Bob Schoneman
      Appleton, WI
    • Paul Charland
      Hi Bob, The yellow crap on CN side sills is reflective Scotch Bright used by CN since the early 70s with the delivery of their first order of GMD
      Message 2 of 19 , Jan 22, 2008
        Hi Bob,

        The "yellow crap" on CN side sills is reflective "Scotch Bright" used by
        CN since the early '70s with the delivery of their first order of GMD
        GP-40-2Ws, and then anything new or repainted into the "Zebra Stripe"
        scheme.

        Unfortunately the CN is plagued with Hunter Harris, former president of
        the IC, so you may want to address your displeasure over the WC
        situation to him. In the years since he's taken the helm of CN he's
        done a great job laying off most of CN's car control, car maintenance
        (no longer done in Canada, everything is sent to IC in the States for
        repair if it make it that far), nearly 75% of track maintenance has been
        laid off, and magically derailments have almost tripled. Harris was so
        pleased to have saved all that money he gave himself a whopping
        seventy-five million dollar bonus two years ago.

        Paul, who's grandfather die during his shift on the Canadian National.

        Robert Schoneman wrote:
        > I suspect Paul is correct.
        >
        > Apology on subject, but proves a point. Over here with the Cannuck National, we see paint
        > changes almost daily, pending the unit. Granted a small obscure wannabe regional doesn't
        > compare to a large wanabee railroad like CN; but it has boiled down to what's in stock in
        > warehouse, and fastest, er cheapest method of recitifying and getting back on road.
        > Regardless of age of unit.
        >
        > In these two views I've taken over the past few weeks, the IC, er CN SD70's undergo
        > changes as sill stripes fade or wear off. On a fair portion of units now, we see patch
        > jobs: Yellow sillstrpe, a section of white, yellow, white then none at all. Looks horrid.
        >
        > Despite the lack of a bath, the trailing SD70 is painted as they were built for IC. The
        > yellow crap is CN. ( As we learn now recently as a suggestion from the FRA )
        >
        > http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1012937
        >
        > Same is true for IC 6011, whatever is in stock:
        >
        > http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1002234
        >
        > I suspect sill stripe will be changed next time she makes it back to her home shop, 200+
        > miles away. CN closed the two big shops here in WI, and cut 80% of the workforce. VERY
        > slowly do they repaint these into CN colors, usually when the unit has wore back down to
        > it's primer base.
        >
        > At least one of our our small regionals know how to do it right:
        >
        > http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=740248
        >
        > ...as well as one of yours:
        >
        > http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=463401
        >
        >
        > Well enough about WI and everyone else's RR's.
        >
        > Take Care all-
        >
        > Bob Schoneman
        > Appleton, WI
      • Dicarlo, Gino
        Let s see em Aaron! Gino ________________________________ From: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Keller
        Message 3 of 19 , Jan 22, 2008
          Let's see 'em Aaron!
           
          Gino


          From: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Keller
          Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 10:28 AM
          To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] FJ&G RR's Alco S2 # 20 and #21

          I don't think the #21 was attached to a plate; I think the background was just painted cream (not orange).

          Somewhere I have about 20 or so tight shots of the locomotive(s) taken solely for modeling details such as this.  If anyone wants them, I will post a folder and scan them as time permits.

          -Aaron



          "d.michael holdridge" <dmike27@yahoo. com> wrote:

            I appreciate you that know the FJ&G locomotive paint detailing differences, and also appreciate you modelers that want to get it right.


          Paul Larner <pklarner@hotmail. com> wrote:
          Skip, I don't have an explanation as to "why" but that is the way they were.  Notice also that the fronts of the cabs are different colors as well, 20 orange and 21 black.  The number on the nose of the 21 is on line with the lettering on the sides whereas with the 20 the nose number is above.  The number boards are also distinctive: 20 white on black; 21 black on white.  They were a year apart and it would seem whomever wasn't looking that close.
           
          PKL





          To: FJGRailroad@ yahoogroups. com
          From: skip_8933@yahoo. com
          Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 19:15:47 +0000
          Subject: [FJGRailroad] S2's 20 and 21

          Hi all,

          I am working on getting some decals done for my S2s. It was brought to
          my attention that the front numbers on the S2s are different. It looks
          like 20 has the number applied to a plate that has a yellow
          background. On the other hand, 21 is on the orange background.

          Does anyone know why this is? My era is early 1950s, but I would
          suspect they were always this way.

          Skip




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        • Dicarlo, Gino
          Paul, Do you guys call the CN Cannuck National north of the border? ;-) Gino ________________________________ From: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
          Message 4 of 19 , Jan 22, 2008
            Paul,
             
            Do you guys call the CN "Cannuck National" north of the border? ;-)
             
            Gino


            From: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul Charland
            Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 7:54 PM
            To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: S2's 20 and 21

            Hi Bob,

            The "yellow crap" on CN side sills is reflective "Scotch Bright" used by
            CN since the early '70s with the delivery of their first order of GMD
            GP-40-2Ws, and then anything new or repainted into the "Zebra Stripe"
            scheme.

            Unfortunately the CN is plagued with Hunter Harris, former president of
            the IC, so you may want to address your displeasure over the WC
            situation to him. In the years since he's taken the helm of CN he's
            done a great job laying off most of CN's car control, car maintenance
            (no longer done in Canada, everything is sent to IC in the States for
            repair if it make it that far), nearly 75% of track maintenance has been
            laid off, and magically derailments have almost tripled. Harris was so
            pleased to have saved all that money he gave himself a whopping
            seventy-five million dollar bonus two years ago.

            Paul, who's grandfather die during his shift on the Canadian National.

            Robert Schoneman wrote:

            > I suspect Paul is correct.
            >
            > Apology on
            subject, but proves a point. Over here with the Cannuck National, we see paint
            > changes almost daily, pending the unit. Granted a small obscure
            wannabe regional doesn't
            > compare to a large wanabee railroad like CN;
            but it has boiled down to what's in stock in
            > warehouse, and fastest, er
            cheapest method of recitifying and getting back on road.
            > Regardless of
            age of unit.
            >
            > In these two views I've taken over the past few
            weeks, the IC, er CN SD70's undergo
            > changes as sill stripes fade or wear
            off. On a fair portion of units now, we see patch
            > jobs: Yellow
            sillstrpe, a section of white, yellow, white then none at all. Looks horrid.
            >
            > Despite the lack of a bath, the trailing SD70 is
            painted as they were built for IC. The
            > yellow crap is CN. ( As we learn
            now recently as a suggestion from the FRA )
            >
            >
            href="http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1012937">http://robertschone man.rrpicturearc hives.net/ showPicture. aspx?id=1012937
            >
            > Same is true for IC 6011, whatever is in stock:
            >
            >
            href="http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1002234">http://robertschone man.rrpicturearc hives.net/ showPicture. aspx?id=1002234
            >
            > I suspect sill stripe will be changed next time she makes it back to
            her home shop, 200+
            > miles away. CN closed the two big shops here in WI,
            and cut 80% of the workforce. VERY
            > slowly do they repaint these into CN
            colors, usually when the unit has wore back down to
            > it's primer
            base.
            >
            > At least one of our our small regionals know how to do it
            right:
            >
            >
            href="http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=740248">http://robertschone man.rrpicturearc hives.net/ showPicture. aspx?id=740248
            >
            > ...as well as one of yours:
            >
            >
            href="http://robertschoneman.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=463401">http://robertschone man.rrpicturearc hives.net/ showPicture. aspx?id=463401
            >
            >
            > Well enough about WI and everyone else's RR's.
            >
            > Take Care all-
            >
            > Bob Schoneman
            > Appleton,
            WI

          • Paul Charland
            No, never heard it before now. Paul
            Message 5 of 19 , Jan 22, 2008
              No, never heard it before now.

              Paul

              Dicarlo, Gino wrote:
              > Paul,
              >
              > Do you guys call the CN "Cannuck National" north of the border? ;-)
              >
              > Gino
            • Paul Larner
              When I heard that term for the first time it was in the Tupper Lake area and referred to a person whose blood was French Canadian and Indian. It also implied
              Message 6 of 19 , Jan 22, 2008
                When I heard that term for the first time it was in the Tupper Lake area and referred to a person whose blood was French Canadian and Indian.  It also implied a particular social status, hard working, but lacking wealth and in many cases opportunity (education).  My stepmother's father was an Adirondack guide, between WW1 and WW2, born in Waubeek.  I can't say we were taught not to use the term but it was reserved.
                 
                On the north side of the border does it still carry the same connotation?
                 
                PKL




                To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                From: p.charlie@...
                Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 20:48:19 -0500
                Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: S2's 20 and 21

                No, never heard it before now.

                Paul

                Dicarlo, Gino wrote:
                > Paul,
                >
                > Do you guys call the CN "Cannuck National" north of the border? ;-)
                >
                > Gino



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              • Paul Charland
                Hi Paul, I have nothing against being called a Canuck, just as I m sure if I called you a Yank or some guy an Aussie nobody would bat an eye. When it s used
                Message 7 of 19 , Jan 23, 2008
                  Hi Paul,

                  I have nothing against being called a Canuck, just as I'm sure if I
                  called you a Yank or some guy an Aussie nobody would bat an eye. When
                  it's used in an e-mail that includes such things as "a large wanabee
                  railroad like CN", or "The yellow crap is CN" it's obviously just Canada
                  bashing.

                  To take the time to bitch about CN not getting everything repainted
                  overnight is odd when WC didn't get the Algoma Central power repainted
                  overnight either but I don't remember hearing Mr Schoneman bitch about that.

                  Paul

                  Paul Larner wrote:
                  > When I heard that term for the first time it was in the Tupper Lake
                  > area and referred to a person whose blood was French Canadian and
                  > Indian. It also implied a particular social status, hard working,
                  > but lacking wealth and in many cases opportunity (education). My
                  > stepmother's father was an Adirondack guide, between WW1 and WW2,
                  > born in Waubeek. I can't say we were taught not to use the term but
                  > it was reserved.
                  >
                  > On the north side of the border does it still carry the same
                  > connotation?
                  >
                  > PKL
                • Robert Schoneman
                  Paul- Thank you very much for your reply. I m sorry to hear about your grandfather. To be legal and honest, no disrespect or offense is meant by the Cannuck
                  Message 8 of 19 , Jan 23, 2008
                    Paul-

                    Thank you very much for your reply. I'm sorry to hear about your grandfather.

                    To be legal and honest, no disrespect or offense is meant by the Cannuck termonolgy.
                    Harrison's business philosophy has turned many a family and community out here into
                    wasteland, and he is not very well respected/liked.

                    CN may have the best financial operating ratio in the nation, but they are asking for
                    trouble. CP here has started to see the light and reinvesting back into it's
                    infrastructure, and people. To better compete with the CN.

                    I love trains, period. CN used to be my favorite railroad growing up. I'm not really mad
                    at CN per se, just the normal business practices, profit maximization, and skimming at
                    the expense of the line worker that gets me going. So what is new,,,?

                    I have shots of FJ&G 20 & 21 as well that I can post by this weekend here.

                    Bob
                  • Aaron Keller
                    Gino, I ll start scanning pictures as time becomes available. And I apologize for the late replies to topics that are several days old. I ve been ridiculously
                    Message 9 of 19 , Jan 26, 2008
                      Gino,

                      I'll start scanning pictures as time becomes available.

                      And I apologize for the late replies to topics that are several days old.  I've been ridiculously busy.

                      -Aaron


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                    • Gino's Railpage
                      Aaron,, I looked all over Ebay and couldn t find any DO Line shot. Gino ... -- http://ginosrailpage.com http://fjgrr.org http://ginosmusicservice.com
                      Message 10 of 19 , Jan 27, 2008
                        Aaron,,
                         
                        I looked all over Ebay and couldn't find any DO Line shot.
                         
                        Gino

                         
                        On 1/26/08, Aaron Keller <akeller_1979@...> wrote:

                        Gino,

                        I'll start scanning pictures as time becomes available.

                        And I apologize for the late replies to topics that are several days old.  I've been ridiculously busy.

                        -Aaron


                        Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.




                        --
                        http://ginosrailpage.com
                        http://fjgrr.org
                        http://ginosmusicservice.com
                      • Robert Schoneman
                        Ditto here as well. I still have all these fj&g related disks here from last summer. If they are desired out east, I will ship back, prepaid. Robert Schoneman
                        Message 11 of 19 , Jan 27, 2008
                          Ditto here as well. I still have all these fj&g related disks here from last summer. If
                          they are desired out east, I will ship back, prepaid.

                          Robert Schoneman
                          Appleton, WI
                        • Gino's Railpage
                          Hey guys, I really liked the sound of Canuck National and wanted to tease my Canadian friend on the list! Didn t want to stir up trouble here! Bob and Paul
                          Message 12 of 19 , Jan 27, 2008
                            Hey guys, I really liked the sound of Canuck National and wanted to tease
                            my Canadian friend on the list!  Didn't want to stir up trouble here!  Bob and Paul
                            are both great guys.
                             
                            I'll stick to off-color jokes in the future!
                             
                            Gino

                             
                            On 1/23/08, Robert Schoneman <suds@...> wrote:

                            Paul-

                            Thank you very much for your reply. I'm sorry to hear about your grandfather.

                            To be legal and honest, no disrespect or offense is meant by the Cannuck termonolgy.
                            Harrison's business philosophy has turned many a family and community out here into
                            wasteland, and he is not very well respected/liked.

                            CN may have the best financial operating ratio in the nation, but they are asking for
                            trouble. CP here has started to see the light and reinvesting back into it's
                            infrastructure, and people. To better compete with the CN.

                            I love trains, period. CN used to be my favorite railroad growing up. I'm not really mad
                            at CN per se, just the normal business practices, profit maximization, and skimming at
                            the expense of the line worker that gets me going. So what is new,,,?

                            I have shots of FJ&G 20 & 21 as well that I can post by this weekend here.

                            Bob




                            --
                            http://ginosrailpage.com
                            http://fjgrr.org
                            http://ginosmusicservice.com
                          • Robert Schoneman
                            Yes, Paul is a great guy; but I don t know about this Robert fellow though. With interests that stem from Fulton Co, NY to the Milwaukee Road, and lives next
                            Message 13 of 19 , Jan 28, 2008
                              Yes, Paul is a great guy; but I don't know about this Robert fellow though.

                              With interests that stem from Fulton Co, NY to the Milwaukee Road, and lives next to the
                              Cannuck National; I've been all over purgatory and back. One thing I haven't done is work
                              at Quad. ;-)

                              BUT, my employer is Canadian. So I do have close ties to Lucifer...

                              I know this is a public list. NOTHING you can say about the CN could be offensive enough
                              to us who've seen the damage they've done.

                              Now, I'd better behave and get myself to church on Wednesday.

                              :-)

                              Bob
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