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Chicago Line

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  • Dicarlo, Gino
    Was there a derailment on the Chicago Line in New York this week? I was traveling west on the Thruway This past Weds., and I must have saw 15 trains slowly
    Message 1 of 23 , Apr 24, 2005
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      Chicago Line

      Was there a derailment on the Chicago Line in New York this week?  I was traveling west on the Thruway
      This past Weds., and I must have saw 15 trains slowly moving in both directions.  I wish I was down at
      Guy Park railfanning that day!

      Gino

      Gino DiCarlo
      Imaging

      Quad/Imaging
      A Division of Quad/Graphics

      Saratoga Springs, New York
      518-581-4276 phone
      gino.dicarlo@...
      www.QG.com

    • choochoo1802@webtv.net
      There was a frieght train that broke a knuckle in Syracuse,and put the train in emergency.Not allowing any trains go by until it was inspected. Created a
      Message 2 of 23 , Apr 24, 2005
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        There was a frieght train that broke a knuckle in Syracuse,and put the
        train in emergency.Not allowing any trains go by until it was inspected.
        Created a turmoil,plus the Dispatcher or the DeWitt yardmaster accused
        the engineer of doing it on purpose over the radio.DeWitt is very
        congested lately.
        A young 25 year old kid for the CSX from outside the area came in as
        Terminal Manager and thought he can run the place. First thing he did
        was to eliminate early quits,now nothing is moving in Syracuse.Mark
      • paul larner
        No, CSX is in the middle of a level three screw up. Level three is that level of managers just below the top but high enough to be insulated form the real
        Message 3 of 23 , Apr 24, 2005
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          No, CSX is in the middle of a level three screw up. Level three is that
          level of managers just below the top but high enough to be insulated form
          the real world. Remember we're from CSX; we know it all and we care for
          you.

          Everyone's making a lot of money, this is a good thing.

          PKL

          >From: "Dicarlo, Gino" <Gino.Dicarlo@...>
          >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
          >To: <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
          >Subject: [FJGRailroad] Chicago Line
          >Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 18:22:14 -0500
          >
          >Was there a derailment on the Chicago Line in New York this week? I was
          >traveling west on the Thruway
          >This past Weds., and I must have saw 15 trains slowly moving in both
          >directions. I wish I was down at
          >Guy Park railfanning that day!
          >
          >Gino
          >
          >Gino DiCarlo
          >Imaging
          >
          > > Quad/Imaging
          > > A Division of Quad/Graphics
          > >
          >Saratoga Springs, New York
          >518-581-4276 phone
          >gino.dicarlo@...
          > > www.QG.com
          > >
        • Gino's Railpage
          What is early quits? Gino ... -- www.ginosrailpage.com www.fjgrr.com
          Message 4 of 23 , Apr 25, 2005
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            What is "early quits?"

            Gino

            On 4/24/05, choochoo1802@... <choochoo1802@...> wrote:
            > There was a frieght train that broke a knuckle in Syracuse,and put the
            > train in emergency.Not allowing any trains go by until it was inspected.
            > Created a turmoil,plus the Dispatcher or the DeWitt yardmaster accused
            > the engineer of doing it on purpose over the radio.DeWitt is very
            > congested lately.
            > A young 25 year old kid for the CSX from outside the area came in as
            > Terminal Manager and thought he can run the place. First thing he did
            > was to eliminate early quits,now nothing is moving in Syracuse.Mark
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Visit Gino's Railpage at
            > http://www.ginosrailpage.com and http://fjgrr.org
            > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation at
            > http://gcdranet.homelinux.com/
            > Visit Pete Seftons Lost Landmark Page
            > http://www.lostlandmarks.org
            > Visit Charles P. Woolever's Existing Railroad Stations in New York State at
            > http://ny.existingstations.com/
            >
            >
            > ________________________________
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            > To visit your group on the web, go to:
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FJGRailroad/
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > FJGRailroad-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


            --
            www.ginosrailpage.com
            www.fjgrr.com
          • stevefjg30
            This is a report from the battle field we are winning this one!!!! Down with those southern !#!#!!#!!#^%^%^%&.Oh yea and it s making train crews lots of
            Message 5 of 23 , Apr 26, 2005
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              This is a report from the battle field we are winning this one!!!!
              Down with those southern !#!#!!#!!#^%^%^%&.Oh yea and it's making
              train crews lots of money.I wish i was.Another derailment in the yard
              last night two in three days Outlaws all over.They asked for this one
              Work by the rules or else your gone .There finding you cant work by
              the rules and run a railroad~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They will never learn
              this is not Atlanta /Jacksonville or Waycross We stand up to these
              Pepole and they dont like it.TO BAD!!!!!!!!!Time to go to the battle
              field midnights are getting old Quick!!!!!

              Steve









              --- In FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com, "paul larner" <pklarner@h...>
              wrote:
              > No, CSX is in the middle of a level three screw up. Level three is
              that
              > level of managers just below the top but high enough to be
              insulated form
              > the real world. Remember we're from CSX; we know it all and we
              care for
              > you.
              >
              > Everyone's making a lot of money, this is a good thing.
              >
              > PKL
              >
              > >From: "Dicarlo, Gino" <Gino.Dicarlo@q...>
              > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
              > >To: <FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com>
              > >Subject: [FJGRailroad] Chicago Line
              > >Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 18:22:14 -0500
              > >
              > >Was there a derailment on the Chicago Line in New York this week?
              I was
              > >traveling west on the Thruway
              > >This past Weds., and I must have saw 15 trains slowly moving in
              both
              > >directions. I wish I was down at
              > >Guy Park railfanning that day!
              > >
              > >Gino
              > >
              > >Gino DiCarlo
              > >Imaging
              > >
              > > > Quad/Imaging
              > > > A Division of Quad/Graphics
              > > >
              > >Saratoga Springs, New York
              > >518-581-4276 phone
              > >gino.dicarlo@q...
              > > > www.QG.com
              > > >
            • choochoo1802@webtv.net
              Steve- Are you in Frontier Yard? I heard its a mess in Buffalo also. We have over 400 cars interchanged to CSX in Syracuse,but the problem is that they are
              Message 6 of 23 , Apr 26, 2005
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                Steve- Are you in Frontier Yard? I heard its a mess in Buffalo also. We
                have over 400 cars interchanged to CSX in Syracuse,but the problem is
                that they are not in DeWitt where they are suppose to be.They are
                scattered all over the place.Give it more time,it will start hitting the
                media. Mark
              • choochoo1802@webtv.net
                Paul- Whats it like along the Hudson? Mark
                Message 7 of 23 , Apr 26, 2005
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                  Paul- Whats it like along the Hudson? Mark
                • choochoo1802@webtv.net
                  Gino-Most crews are guaranteed 8 hours of pay for their assigned jobs.If you get your work done in less than 8 hours,its call an early quit with 8 hours
                  Message 8 of 23 , Apr 26, 2005
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                    Gino-Most crews are guaranteed 8 hours of pay for their assigned jobs.If
                    you get your work done in less than 8 hours,its call an early quit with
                    8 hours pay.What they are trying to do with CSX in yards,that they
                    adding more work on their assigned job.Once you take away an incentive,
                    progress will slow down.Mark
                  • paul larner
                    The Hudson doesn t handle much freight. Most traffic for the city runs on the River Line, former West Shore. The B&A was pretty good last week s trip because
                    Message 9 of 23 , Apr 26, 2005
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                      The Hudson doesn't handle much freight. Most traffic for the city runs on
                      the River Line, former West Shore. The B&A was pretty good last week's trip
                      because everything must have been tied up west. On the Mohawk, where I've
                      made but one trip in several month, I had the best day in many months.
                      Bring it on.

                      The press doesn't give a rats ass about us. We will be presented as
                      stealing time and the majority of folks would consider us obstructionists.
                      The state doesn't really care; CSX knows they can buy about anyone in state
                      government for the right price. As an aside, in this area I have seen a few
                      cases where public employees have been prosecuted for stealing time. I
                      thought it was a little absurd, politics I'm sure, but a crime nevertheless.

                      Give CSX managers what they want - comply with all the rules even when they
                      are illogical. The best way to change a bad rule or practice is to comply.
                      Never give the impression that we are not already complying. That's suicide
                      and just asking for more attention from management and the FRA. It makes us
                      look bad., especially after a tragic incident (of which CSX has had a few
                      lately in this area). We alays copmply with the rules, even the foolish
                      ones - like calling signals over the radio. Just keep talking over the DS
                      and anyone else - it's the rule. Stop and walk through whenever the "flag"
                      isn't at his post. I know walking through seems too much like work for some
                      guys. We walked .9 of a mile at Syracuse the other day because CSX screwed
                      up the message and then didn't allow the DS discretion to correct it. The
                      culture and style of the NS management, now infiltrating CSX I hear, is not
                      conducive to good relationships between educated employees and themselves.

                      There's a better solution to the early quit issue. T&E are different because
                      they have a contract that specifies a minimun of eight once work is
                      performed. It isn't stealing if the work is done but you can't sign off at
                      11 pm if you go home at 9:30 pm. You have to sign off at 9:30. Should
                      something unfortunate happen to you between 9:30 and 11:00 you're still on
                      duty but at home, in your local tavern, or whatever. That's one problem
                      FELA. T&E get eight for the start.

                      If you're in one of the other crafts, that's a little different; surely
                      there must be something to be accomplished around your shops. Hard to get
                      sympathy from a general public that has to stay their full shift in their
                      jobs. Cultures are hard to change; doesn't mean its ethically right. If we
                      ran our own shop, how would we feel about paying eight hours for four or
                      six. Do you watch the Monster Shop or Orange County Choppers on TV? Think
                      any of those guys would last if they took early quits? Early quits is not
                      an issue to put before the public. The lip service would have you believe
                      there is nothing wrong with expecting eight hours work for eight hours pay,
                      if that the way the contract is written. Reality demontrates that even when
                      employees stay the full eight hours they actually work about six hours.

                      PKL



                      >From: choochoo1802@...
                      >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                      >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                      >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line
                      >Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2005 22:57:23 -0400
                      >
                      >Paul- Whats it like along the Hudson? Mark
                      >
                    • choochoo1802@webtv.net
                      With us its not stealing time.If we start at 0900 and work until 1500.We put down on our time sheet as off duty at 1500. Then we have a section to fill out as
                      Message 10 of 23 , Apr 27, 2005
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                        With us its not stealing time.If we start at 0900 and work until 1500.We
                        put down on our time sheet as off duty at 1500. Then we have a section
                        to fill out as worked for 6 hours,paid but not worked for 2 hours,total
                        is 8 hours. We work until management says so anyway,regardless its 6
                        hours,9 hours or 12 hours ( of which is no choice).Early quits for us is
                        seldom.We're working 10-12 hours per day.Mark
                      • paul larner
                        That s the good thing. If you show the actual hours worked then you can t be charged with stealing time. I heard a couple fellows were charged with stealing
                        Message 11 of 23 , Apr 27, 2005
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                          That's the good thing. If you show the actual hours worked then you can't
                          be charged with stealing time. I heard a couple fellows were charged with
                          stealing time; I don't recall whether it was Selkirk or elsewhere, nor were
                          the circumstances clear. Another critical point is that managers are
                          allowing it. Once this happens it becomes part of the culture and is
                          expected. I maintain it's a good thing to have a few bones for employees.
                          Budget for them. It's a ploy for managers if done properly. The employee
                          think's he's getting away with something, a little something for nothing.
                          As a turnaround the employee is more willing to get his job done quickly
                          because he's geting a bit of gravy. A win win situation playing on human
                          nature. The danger is that once it becomes part of the culture, what
                          happens when a new manager comes in from outside.

                          If anyone ever wondered why promotions at a particular location don't come
                          from the ranks, it is to avoid these issues. Good workers get promoted then
                          are sent to other locations to do their supervision. Could breaking the
                          "culture" be the reason so many former CR managers are no longer employed at
                          CSX. (Remember UP took over SP) We went through the same process here. Took
                          steps and a couple changes at the top. I hadn't experienced this process
                          before I arrived here. I liked it. You did your job and every one got a
                          bone at the end of the tour. It was apparent in attitudes; that has
                          changed. There were more serious problems though. Auditing cash sales was
                          allowed to slip through the cracks; rules were not enforced. Most of us
                          knowing what's expected of us will comply. Forever it seems I have
                          emphasized that any rule not enforced doesn't exist. There was evidence of
                          that here. Several cases where one of us landed in trouble should properly
                          have been laid on management's attitude toward monitoring and compliance.
                          Many companies don't do a root cause analysis of their employee failures
                          because the results usually point to a manager at some level. Being on the
                          bottom level of the pyramid I can only presume other things were lax as
                          well.

                          Taking "bonuses" from employees working hard with a belief these are
                          entitlements, is difficult, though not impossible. Unless you get a gifted
                          manager with the balls to push back a bit to his manager, the process is
                          counter productive. Look at what's happening now. Even gifted managers are
                          up against a wall, too. They'd like to keep their jobs as well, so often
                          feel obligated, threatened, to push issues further than they might
                          otherwise.

                          Level Three. The board of directors expects profitability, a favorable
                          public image, and a days work for a days pay. The chairman passes the
                          message to the president who drops it on his department heads. Insulated
                          and largely isolated from the real world where the capital is produced,
                          decisions are made without a true picture of how things are. Why do you
                          suppose a company would shut down half of it's capacity and still try to run
                          a schedule as if nothing had changed? What about fleeting trains during a
                          work process? Was someone not listening or afraid to speak up? Sieg heil.

                          Cultural change is as painful corporately as it is internationally. Success
                          at every level is not to become a victim. This feeling applies to our
                          managers and to us. Our pants all go on the same way. My wife speaks to
                          more folks around the industry than I have in a number of years, she hears
                          "the railroad" is no longer a "fun" place to work. People don't like their
                          working situation anymore, at all levels. I suspect it isn't our industry
                          alone. Does it all have to do with money?

                          Basta.

                          PKL



                          >From: choochoo1802@...
                          >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                          >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                          >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line
                          >Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2005 07:58:17 -0400
                          >
                          >With us its not stealing time.If we start at 0900 and work until 1500.We
                          >put down on our time sheet as off duty at 1500. Then we have a section
                          >to fill out as worked for 6 hours,paid but not worked for 2 hours,total
                          >is 8 hours. We work until management says so anyway,regardless its 6
                          >hours,9 hours or 12 hours ( of which is no choice).Early quits for us is
                          >seldom.We're working 10-12 hours per day.Mark
                          >
                        • stevefjg30
                          No I m in Selkirk.Another derailment last night in the yard!!!!! Steve L ... We ... the
                          Message 12 of 23 , Apr 27, 2005
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                            No I'm in Selkirk.Another derailment last night in the yard!!!!!

                            Steve L







                            --- In FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com, choochoo1802@w... wrote:
                            > Steve- Are you in Frontier Yard? I heard its a mess in Buffalo also.
                            We
                            > have over 400 cars interchanged to CSX in Syracuse,but the problem is
                            > that they are not in DeWitt where they are suppose to be.They are
                            > scattered all over the place.Give it more time,it will start hitting
                            the
                            > media. Mark
                          • choochoo1802@webtv.net
                            Steve-Is that hump yard still there,and if so how many humps are there? Mark
                            Message 13 of 23 , Apr 27, 2005
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                              Steve-Is that hump yard still there,and if so how many humps are there?
                              Mark
                            • Stephen G. Myers
                              Which Steve? Steve Myers works out of Frontier yard, but is in Jacksonville Florida until Sunday. Steve s wife
                              Message 14 of 23 , Apr 28, 2005
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                                Which Steve? Steve Myers works out of Frontier yard, but is in
                                Jacksonville Florida until Sunday.
                                Steve's wife
                                On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 22:56:29 -0400 choochoo1802@... writes:
                                >
                                > Steve- Are you in Frontier Yard? I heard its a mess in Buffalo
                                > also. We
                                > have over 400 cars interchanged to CSX in Syracuse,but the problem
                                > is
                                > that they are not in DeWitt where they are suppose to be.They are
                                > scattered all over the place.Give it more time,it will start hitting
                                > the
                                > media. Mark
                                >
                                >
                                >
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                                >
                                >
                                > Visit Gino's Railpage at
                                > http://www.ginosrailpage.com and http://fjgrr.org
                                > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation at
                                > http://gcdranet.homelinux.com/
                                > Visit Pete Seftons Lost Landmark Page
                                > http://www.lostlandmarks.org
                                > Visit Charles P. Woolever's Existing Railroad Stations in New York
                                > State at
                                > http://ny.existingstations.com/
                                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                              • choochoo1802@webtv.net
                                I had the two Steve s mixed up. Mark
                                Message 15 of 23 , Apr 28, 2005
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                                  I had the two Steve's mixed up. Mark
                                • Gerald Snyder
                                  Unfortunately, yes, it all has to do with money. I know I used to enjoy going to work at least some days, but top management seems to have adopted the
                                  Message 16 of 23 , Apr 28, 2005
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                                    Unfortunately, yes, it all has to do with money. I
                                    know I used to enjoy going to work at least some days,
                                    but top management seems to have adopted the
                                    squeeze-all-you-can-out-of-them attitude and
                                    everything has become a one way street. They
                                    constantly remind you that you're being paid to do
                                    your job, not put in x number of hours, so if the day
                                    becomes 10 or 12 hours long because things have to get
                                    done, so be it. And being on salary means overtime
                                    does nothing for your take-home. Nobody remembers the
                                    60 hours last week when you need an hour for the
                                    doctor this week - just be sure you make it up this
                                    week. And if you have to come in weekends or days
                                    off, that's just part of the job - no comp time for
                                    that. But the part that really bothers me is that the
                                    bean counters are starting to impact our ability to do
                                    the technically right thing, which is what has kept us
                                    out of trouble for the last 50 years. Just look at
                                    what's happened to NASA. There's some things that
                                    just can't be done faster, better, and cheaper. End of
                                    rant. Time to go see my son get inducted into the
                                    Nation Honor Society.
                                    Jerry
                                    --- paul larner <pklarner@...> wrote:

                                    > That's the good thing. If you show the actual hours
                                    > worked then you can't
                                    > be charged with stealing time. I heard a couple
                                    > fellows were charged with
                                    > stealing time; I don't recall whether it was Selkirk
                                    > or elsewhere, nor were
                                    > the circumstances clear. Another critical point is
                                    > that managers are
                                    > allowing it. Once this happens it becomes part of
                                    > the culture and is
                                    > expected. I maintain it's a good thing to have a
                                    > few bones for employees.
                                    > Budget for them. It's a ploy for managers if done
                                    > properly. The employee
                                    > think's he's getting away with something, a little
                                    > something for nothing.
                                    > As a turnaround the employee is more willing to get
                                    > his job done quickly
                                    > because he's geting a bit of gravy. A win win
                                    > situation playing on human
                                    > nature. The danger is that once it becomes part of
                                    > the culture, what
                                    > happens when a new manager comes in from outside.
                                    >
                                    > If anyone ever wondered why promotions at a
                                    > particular location don't come
                                    > from the ranks, it is to avoid these issues. Good
                                    > workers get promoted then
                                    > are sent to other locations to do their supervision.
                                    > Could breaking the
                                    > "culture" be the reason so many former CR managers
                                    > are no longer employed at
                                    > CSX. (Remember UP took over SP) We went through the
                                    > same process here. Took
                                    > steps and a couple changes at the top. I hadn't
                                    > experienced this process
                                    > before I arrived here. I liked it. You did your
                                    > job and every one got a
                                    > bone at the end of the tour. It was apparent in
                                    > attitudes; that has
                                    > changed. There were more serious problems though.
                                    > Auditing cash sales was
                                    > allowed to slip through the cracks; rules were not
                                    > enforced. Most of us
                                    > knowing what's expected of us will comply. Forever
                                    > it seems I have
                                    > emphasized that any rule not enforced doesn't exist.
                                    > There was evidence of
                                    > that here. Several cases where one of us landed in
                                    > trouble should properly
                                    > have been laid on management's attitude toward
                                    > monitoring and compliance.
                                    > Many companies don't do a root cause analysis of
                                    > their employee failures
                                    > because the results usually point to a manager at
                                    > some level. Being on the
                                    > bottom level of the pyramid I can only presume other
                                    > things were lax as
                                    > well.
                                    >
                                    > Taking "bonuses" from employees working hard with a
                                    > belief these are
                                    > entitlements, is difficult, though not impossible.
                                    > Unless you get a gifted
                                    > manager with the balls to push back a bit to his
                                    > manager, the process is
                                    > counter productive. Look at what's happening now.
                                    > Even gifted managers are
                                    > up against a wall, too. They'd like to keep their
                                    > jobs as well, so often
                                    > feel obligated, threatened, to push issues further
                                    > than they might
                                    > otherwise.
                                    >
                                    > Level Three. The board of directors expects
                                    > profitability, a favorable
                                    > public image, and a days work for a days pay. The
                                    > chairman passes the
                                    > message to the president who drops it on his
                                    > department heads. Insulated
                                    > and largely isolated from the real world where the
                                    > capital is produced,
                                    > decisions are made without a true picture of how
                                    > things are. Why do you
                                    > suppose a company would shut down half of it's
                                    > capacity and still try to run
                                    > a schedule as if nothing had changed? What about
                                    > fleeting trains during a
                                    > work process? Was someone not listening or afraid
                                    > to speak up? Sieg heil.
                                    >
                                    > Cultural change is as painful corporately as it is
                                    > internationally. Success
                                    > at every level is not to become a victim. This
                                    > feeling applies to our
                                    > managers and to us. Our pants all go on the same
                                    > way. My wife speaks to
                                    > more folks around the industry than I have in a
                                    > number of years, she hears
                                    > "the railroad" is no longer a "fun" place to work.
                                    > People don't like their
                                    > working situation anymore, at all levels. I suspect
                                    > it isn't our industry
                                    > alone. Does it all have to do with money?
                                    >
                                    > Basta.
                                    >
                                    > PKL
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > >From: choochoo1802@...
                                    > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line
                                    > >Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2005 07:58:17 -0400
                                    > >
                                    > >With us its not stealing time.If we start at 0900
                                    > and work until 1500.We
                                    > >put down on our time sheet as off duty at 1500.
                                    > Then we have a section
                                    > >to fill out as worked for 6 hours,paid but not
                                    > worked for 2 hours,total
                                    > >is 8 hours. We work until management says so
                                    > anyway,regardless its 6
                                    > >hours,9 hours or 12 hours ( of which is no
                                    > choice).Early quits for us is
                                    > >seldom.We're working 10-12 hours per day.Mark
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >


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                                  • joseph Klapkowski
                                    Just because we are on the topic and somewhat off the topic....I work in a non union environment. One year just before year end, I made a lot of money for my
                                    Message 17 of 23 , Apr 30, 2005
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                                      Just because we are on the topic and somewhat off the topic....I work in a
                                      non union environment. One year just before year end, I made a lot of money
                                      for my company. One deal was me thinking and the other deal was me thinking
                                      hard. When bonus time came around I was told that I was paid to be
                                      smart.........................needless to say I left shortly
                                      thereafter..........

                                      At another employer several things went wrong. I was the mechanic that fixed
                                      what was broken. I did not break the things that were broke. After the fact
                                      the finger pointing started.............I left because it started to look
                                      like they were going to point at me even though everyone else knew it was
                                      someone else higher up in management that was at fault.........

                                      Non-union and some of you might think I am an executive but really I am the
                                      mechanic in my business.

                                      I know there are lots of injustices in evry workplace but at least you guys
                                      have rules and a union to support you. I get to work long hours whenever
                                      required and get dumped on a lot. Nobody backs me up..............sorry just
                                      wanted to say that.....now back to the topic.

                                      >From: Gerald Snyder <handyman756@...>
                                      >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                      >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                      >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line
                                      >Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:39:48 -0700 (PDT)
                                      >
                                      >Unfortunately, yes, it all has to do with money. I
                                      >know I used to enjoy going to work at least some days,
                                      >but top management seems to have adopted the
                                      >squeeze-all-you-can-out-of-them attitude and
                                      >everything has become a one way street. They
                                      >constantly remind you that you're being paid to do
                                      >your job, not put in x number of hours, so if the day
                                      >becomes 10 or 12 hours long because things have to get
                                      >done, so be it. And being on salary means overtime
                                      >does nothing for your take-home. Nobody remembers the
                                      >60 hours last week when you need an hour for the
                                      >doctor this week - just be sure you make it up this
                                      >week. And if you have to come in weekends or days
                                      >off, that's just part of the job - no comp time for
                                      >that. But the part that really bothers me is that the
                                      >bean counters are starting to impact our ability to do
                                      >the technically right thing, which is what has kept us
                                      >out of trouble for the last 50 years. Just look at
                                      >what's happened to NASA. There's some things that
                                      >just can't be done faster, better, and cheaper. End of
                                      >rant. Time to go see my son get inducted into the
                                      >Nation Honor Society.
                                      >Jerry
                                      >--- paul larner <pklarner@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > > That's the good thing. If you show the actual hours
                                      > > worked then you can't
                                      > > be charged with stealing time. I heard a couple
                                      > > fellows were charged with
                                      > > stealing time; I don't recall whether it was Selkirk
                                      > > or elsewhere, nor were
                                      > > the circumstances clear. Another critical point is
                                      > > that managers are
                                      > > allowing it. Once this happens it becomes part of
                                      > > the culture and is
                                      > > expected. I maintain it's a good thing to have a
                                      > > few bones for employees.
                                      > > Budget for them. It's a ploy for managers if done
                                      > > properly. The employee
                                      > > think's he's getting away with something, a little
                                      > > something for nothing.
                                      > > As a turnaround the employee is more willing to get
                                      > > his job done quickly
                                      > > because he's geting a bit of gravy. A win win
                                      > > situation playing on human
                                      > > nature. The danger is that once it becomes part of
                                      > > the culture, what
                                      > > happens when a new manager comes in from outside.
                                      > >
                                      > > If anyone ever wondered why promotions at a
                                      > > particular location don't come
                                      > > from the ranks, it is to avoid these issues. Good
                                      > > workers get promoted then
                                      > > are sent to other locations to do their supervision.
                                      > > Could breaking the
                                      > > "culture" be the reason so many former CR managers
                                      > > are no longer employed at
                                      > > CSX. (Remember UP took over SP) We went through the
                                      > > same process here. Took
                                      > > steps and a couple changes at the top. I hadn't
                                      > > experienced this process
                                      > > before I arrived here. I liked it. You did your
                                      > > job and every one got a
                                      > > bone at the end of the tour. It was apparent in
                                      > > attitudes; that has
                                      > > changed. There were more serious problems though.
                                      > > Auditing cash sales was
                                      > > allowed to slip through the cracks; rules were not
                                      > > enforced. Most of us
                                      > > knowing what's expected of us will comply. Forever
                                      > > it seems I have
                                      > > emphasized that any rule not enforced doesn't exist.
                                      > > There was evidence of
                                      > > that here. Several cases where one of us landed in
                                      > > trouble should properly
                                      > > have been laid on management's attitude toward
                                      > > monitoring and compliance.
                                      > > Many companies don't do a root cause analysis of
                                      > > their employee failures
                                      > > because the results usually point to a manager at
                                      > > some level. Being on the
                                      > > bottom level of the pyramid I can only presume other
                                      > > things were lax as
                                      > > well.
                                      > >
                                      > > Taking "bonuses" from employees working hard with a
                                      > > belief these are
                                      > > entitlements, is difficult, though not impossible.
                                      > > Unless you get a gifted
                                      > > manager with the balls to push back a bit to his
                                      > > manager, the process is
                                      > > counter productive. Look at what's happening now.
                                      > > Even gifted managers are
                                      > > up against a wall, too. They'd like to keep their
                                      > > jobs as well, so often
                                      > > feel obligated, threatened, to push issues further
                                      > > than they might
                                      > > otherwise.
                                      > >
                                      > > Level Three. The board of directors expects
                                      > > profitability, a favorable
                                      > > public image, and a days work for a days pay. The
                                      > > chairman passes the
                                      > > message to the president who drops it on his
                                      > > department heads. Insulated
                                      > > and largely isolated from the real world where the
                                      > > capital is produced,
                                      > > decisions are made without a true picture of how
                                      > > things are. Why do you
                                      > > suppose a company would shut down half of it's
                                      > > capacity and still try to run
                                      > > a schedule as if nothing had changed? What about
                                      > > fleeting trains during a
                                      > > work process? Was someone not listening or afraid
                                      > > to speak up? Sieg heil.
                                      > >
                                      > > Cultural change is as painful corporately as it is
                                      > > internationally. Success
                                      > > at every level is not to become a victim. This
                                      > > feeling applies to our
                                      > > managers and to us. Our pants all go on the same
                                      > > way. My wife speaks to
                                      > > more folks around the industry than I have in a
                                      > > number of years, she hears
                                      > > "the railroad" is no longer a "fun" place to work.
                                      > > People don't like their
                                      > > working situation anymore, at all levels. I suspect
                                      > > it isn't our industry
                                      > > alone. Does it all have to do with money?
                                      > >
                                      > > Basta.
                                      > >
                                      > > PKL
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > >From: choochoo1802@...
                                      > > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                      > > >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                      > > >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line
                                      > > >Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2005 07:58:17 -0400
                                      > > >
                                      > > >With us its not stealing time.If we start at 0900
                                      > > and work until 1500.We
                                      > > >put down on our time sheet as off duty at 1500.
                                      > > Then we have a section
                                      > > >to fill out as worked for 6 hours,paid but not
                                      > > worked for 2 hours,total
                                      > > >is 8 hours. We work until management says so
                                      > > anyway,regardless its 6
                                      > > >hours,9 hours or 12 hours ( of which is no
                                      > > choice).Early quits for us is
                                      > > >seldom.We're working 10-12 hours per day.Mark
                                      > > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >__________________________________________________
                                      >Do You Yahoo!?
                                      >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
                                      >http://mail.yahoo.com
                                    • paul larner
                                      There will be another revolution if our government doesn t figure out a new way to redistribute wealth. At some point the working class, middle class, will no
                                      Message 18 of 23 , Apr 30, 2005
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        There will be another revolution if our government doesn't figure out a new
                                        way to redistribute wealth. At some point the working class, middle class,
                                        will no longer take it. The Industrial Revolution is largely responsible
                                        for saving the heads of the ruling classes in western Europe and America at
                                        the turn and following into the ninteenth century. What now for us as our
                                        US industrialists and our government move our jobs to foreign countries
                                        while continuing to amass and flaunt their great wealth. What will save
                                        the US standard of living for the folks who aren't able to fill the fewer
                                        and fewer well paying jobs?

                                        It is offered we will be able to invest a portion of our social security in
                                        the stock market thereby partaking in the joy of belonging to the investing
                                        class. That paltry percentage of an already small percentage will buy a
                                        daily cup of coffee as consolation at the end of ones working career. We
                                        have IRA's and 401k's now that are far better in amount available for
                                        investment and return. Problem with a company investment plan - you are
                                        telling your employer your level of surplus income. That should not be any
                                        of his business. Today twenty or so years later the price is being paid as
                                        employers force workers to give back in terms of contributions for health
                                        care, pensions and yes, social security and RRR.

                                        Amtrak has proposed Amtrak employees only we be taken out of RRR and put in
                                        SSS and also that we be exempt from the railway labor act. Can you believe
                                        there are people here that vote Republican. They say they believe the
                                        Republicans are helping them. We are being asked to contribute to our health
                                        care while the company won't give us the number of paid sick days the other
                                        crafts receive. It's a no brainer, a win/win. I'd gladly give a $100 a
                                        month in contribution for ten days paid leave each year.

                                        Does the word scumbag come to anyone else's mind.

                                        PKL

                                        >From: "joseph Klapkowski" <riverlinejoe@...>
                                        >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                        >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                        >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line
                                        >Date: Sun, 01 May 2005 03:19:51 +0000
                                        >
                                        >Just because we are on the topic and somewhat off the topic....I work in a
                                        >non union environment. One year just before year end, I made a lot of money
                                        >for my company. One deal was me thinking and the other deal was me thinking
                                        >hard. When bonus time came around I was told that I was paid to be
                                        >smart.........................needless to say I left shortly
                                        >thereafter..........
                                        >
                                        >At another employer several things went wrong. I was the mechanic that
                                        >fixed
                                        >what was broken. I did not break the things that were broke. After the fact
                                        >the finger pointing started.............I left because it started to look
                                        >like they were going to point at me even though everyone else knew it was
                                        >someone else higher up in management that was at fault.........
                                        >
                                        >Non-union and some of you might think I am an executive but really I am the
                                        >mechanic in my business.
                                        >
                                        >I know there are lots of injustices in evry workplace but at least you guys
                                        >have rules and a union to support you. I get to work long hours whenever
                                        >required and get dumped on a lot. Nobody backs me up..............sorry
                                        >just
                                        >wanted to say that.....now back to the topic.
                                        >
                                        > >From: Gerald Snyder <handyman756@...>
                                        > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                        > >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                        > >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line
                                        > >Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:39:48 -0700 (PDT)
                                        > >
                                        > >Unfortunately, yes, it all has to do with money. I
                                        > >know I used to enjoy going to work at least some days,
                                        > >but top management seems to have adopted the
                                        > >squeeze-all-you-can-out-of-them attitude and
                                        > >everything has become a one way street. They
                                        > >constantly remind you that you're being paid to do
                                        > >your job, not put in x number of hours, so if the day
                                        > >becomes 10 or 12 hours long because things have to get
                                        > >done, so be it. And being on salary means overtime
                                        > >does nothing for your take-home. Nobody remembers the
                                        > >60 hours last week when you need an hour for the
                                        > >doctor this week - just be sure you make it up this
                                        > >week. And if you have to come in weekends or days
                                        > >off, that's just part of the job - no comp time for
                                        > >that. But the part that really bothers me is that the
                                        > >bean counters are starting to impact our ability to do
                                        > >the technically right thing, which is what has kept us
                                        > >out of trouble for the last 50 years. Just look at
                                        > >what's happened to NASA. There's some things that
                                        > >just can't be done faster, better, and cheaper. End of
                                        > >rant. Time to go see my son get inducted into the
                                        > >Nation Honor Society.
                                        > >Jerry
                                        > >--- paul larner <pklarner@...> wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > > > That's the good thing. If you show the actual hours
                                        > > > worked then you can't
                                        > > > be charged with stealing time. I heard a couple
                                        > > > fellows were charged with
                                        > > > stealing time; I don't recall whether it was Selkirk
                                        > > > or elsewhere, nor were
                                        > > > the circumstances clear. Another critical point is
                                        > > > that managers are
                                        > > > allowing it. Once this happens it becomes part of
                                        > > > the culture and is
                                        > > > expected. I maintain it's a good thing to have a
                                        > > > few bones for employees.
                                        > > > Budget for them. It's a ploy for managers if done
                                        > > > properly. The employee
                                        > > > think's he's getting away with something, a little
                                        > > > something for nothing.
                                        > > > As a turnaround the employee is more willing to get
                                        > > > his job done quickly
                                        > > > because he's geting a bit of gravy. A win win
                                        > > > situation playing on human
                                        > > > nature. The danger is that once it becomes part of
                                        > > > the culture, what
                                        > > > happens when a new manager comes in from outside.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > If anyone ever wondered why promotions at a
                                        > > > particular location don't come
                                        > > > from the ranks, it is to avoid these issues. Good
                                        > > > workers get promoted then
                                        > > > are sent to other locations to do their supervision.
                                        > > > Could breaking the
                                        > > > "culture" be the reason so many former CR managers
                                        > > > are no longer employed at
                                        > > > CSX. (Remember UP took over SP) We went through the
                                        > > > same process here. Took
                                        > > > steps and a couple changes at the top. I hadn't
                                        > > > experienced this process
                                        > > > before I arrived here. I liked it. You did your
                                        > > > job and every one got a
                                        > > > bone at the end of the tour. It was apparent in
                                        > > > attitudes; that has
                                        > > > changed. There were more serious problems though.
                                        > > > Auditing cash sales was
                                        > > > allowed to slip through the cracks; rules were not
                                        > > > enforced. Most of us
                                        > > > knowing what's expected of us will comply. Forever
                                        > > > it seems I have
                                        > > > emphasized that any rule not enforced doesn't exist.
                                        > > > There was evidence of
                                        > > > that here. Several cases where one of us landed in
                                        > > > trouble should properly
                                        > > > have been laid on management's attitude toward
                                        > > > monitoring and compliance.
                                        > > > Many companies don't do a root cause analysis of
                                        > > > their employee failures
                                        > > > because the results usually point to a manager at
                                        > > > some level. Being on the
                                        > > > bottom level of the pyramid I can only presume other
                                        > > > things were lax as
                                        > > > well.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Taking "bonuses" from employees working hard with a
                                        > > > belief these are
                                        > > > entitlements, is difficult, though not impossible.
                                        > > > Unless you get a gifted
                                        > > > manager with the balls to push back a bit to his
                                        > > > manager, the process is
                                        > > > counter productive. Look at what's happening now.
                                        > > > Even gifted managers are
                                        > > > up against a wall, too. They'd like to keep their
                                        > > > jobs as well, so often
                                        > > > feel obligated, threatened, to push issues further
                                        > > > than they might
                                        > > > otherwise.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Level Three. The board of directors expects
                                        > > > profitability, a favorable
                                        > > > public image, and a days work for a days pay. The
                                        > > > chairman passes the
                                        > > > message to the president who drops it on his
                                        > > > department heads. Insulated
                                        > > > and largely isolated from the real world where the
                                        > > > capital is produced,
                                        > > > decisions are made without a true picture of how
                                        > > > things are. Why do you
                                        > > > suppose a company would shut down half of it's
                                        > > > capacity and still try to run
                                        > > > a schedule as if nothing had changed? What about
                                        > > > fleeting trains during a
                                        > > > work process? Was someone not listening or afraid
                                        > > > to speak up? Sieg heil.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Cultural change is as painful corporately as it is
                                        > > > internationally. Success
                                        > > > at every level is not to become a victim. This
                                        > > > feeling applies to our
                                        > > > managers and to us. Our pants all go on the same
                                        > > > way. My wife speaks to
                                        > > > more folks around the industry than I have in a
                                        > > > number of years, she hears
                                        > > > "the railroad" is no longer a "fun" place to work.
                                        > > > People don't like their
                                        > > > working situation anymore, at all levels. I suspect
                                        > > > it isn't our industry
                                        > > > alone. Does it all have to do with money?
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Basta.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > PKL
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > >From: choochoo1802@...
                                        > > > >Reply-To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > > >To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > > >Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line
                                        > > > >Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2005 07:58:17 -0400
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > >With us its not stealing time.If we start at 0900
                                        > > > and work until 1500.We
                                        > > > >put down on our time sheet as off duty at 1500.
                                        > > > Then we have a section
                                        > > > >to fill out as worked for 6 hours,paid but not
                                        > > > worked for 2 hours,total
                                        > > > >is 8 hours. We work until management says so
                                        > > > anyway,regardless its 6
                                        > > > >hours,9 hours or 12 hours ( of which is no
                                        > > > choice).Early quits for us is
                                        > > > >seldom.We're working 10-12 hours per day.Mark
                                        > > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >__________________________________________________
                                        > >Do You Yahoo!?
                                        > >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
                                        > >http://mail.yahoo.com
                                        >
                                        >
                                      • Stephen G. Myers
                                        The new management team was sent to Selkirk with a purpose. He/they are not doing it on their own. Steve
                                        Message 19 of 23 , May 1, 2005
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                                          The new management team was sent to Selkirk with a purpose. He/they
                                          are not doing it on their own.

                                          Steve














                                          > congested lately.
                                          > A young 25 year old kid for the CSX from outside the area came in
                                          > as
                                          > Terminal Manager and thought he can run the place. First thing he
                                          > did
                                          > was to eliminate early quits,now nothing is moving in Syracuse.Mark
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                                        • Stephen G. Myers
                                          I have been in Pueblo, Selkirk, and Jacksonville for the last three weeks. We are reopening a closed yard in Buffalo. Steve
                                          Message 20 of 23 , May 1, 2005
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                                            I have been in Pueblo, Selkirk, and Jacksonville for the last three
                                            weeks. We are reopening a closed yard in Buffalo.

                                            Steve




                                            On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 22:56:29 -0400 choochoo1802@... writes:
                                            >
                                            > Steve- Are you in Frontier Yard? I heard its a mess in Buffalo
                                            > also. We
                                            > have over 400 cars interchanged to CSX in Syracuse,but the problem
                                          • Stephen G. Myers
                                            Selkirk, NY and Frontier Yard in Buffalo are both hump yards. Steve M
                                            Message 21 of 23 , May 1, 2005
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                                              Selkirk, NY and Frontier Yard in Buffalo are both hump yards.

                                              Steve M











                                              On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 22:49:17 -0400 choochoo1802@... writes:
                                              >
                                              > Steve-Is that hump yard still there,and if so how many humps are
                                              > there?
                                              > Mark
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                                              > --------------------~-->
                                              > What would our lives be like without music, dance, and theater?
                                              > Donate or volunteer in the arts today at Network for Good!
                                              > http://us.click.yahoo.com/Tcy2bD/SOnJAA/cosFAA/j2LplB/TM
                                              > --------------------------------------------------------------------~->

                                              >
                                              >
                                              > Visit Gino's Railpage at
                                              > http://www.ginosrailpage.com and http://fjgrr.org
                                              > Visit The Greater Capital District Railfan Assocation at
                                              > http://gcdranet.homelinux.com/
                                              > Visit Pete Seftons Lost Landmark Page
                                              > http://www.lostlandmarks.org
                                              > Visit Charles P. Woolever's Existing Railroad Stations in New York
                                              > State at
                                              > http://ny.existingstations.com/
                                              > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                            • Stephen G. Myers
                                              It is all a part of the JACK WELCH school of management, screw everyone while you squeeze a buck into two. Maximize equipment utilization and reduce inventory
                                              Message 22 of 23 , May 1, 2005
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                It is all a part of the JACK WELCH school of management, screw
                                                everyone while you squeeze a buck into two. Maximize equipment
                                                utilization and reduce inventory and labor, keep the money moving,
                                                contract it all out to reduce taxes, labor costs, and retirements.

                                                Steve Myers




                                                On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:39:48 -0700 (PDT) Gerald Snyder
                                                <handyman756@...> writes:
                                                > Unfortunately, yes, it all has to do with money. I
                                                > know I used to enjoy going to work at least some days,
                                                > but top management seems to have adopted the
                                                > squeeze-all-you-can-out-of-them attitude and
                                                > everything has become a one way street. They
                                                > constantly remind you that you're being paid to do
                                                > your job, not put in x number of hours, so if the day
                                                > becomes 10 or 12 hours long because things have to get
                                                > done, so be it. And being on salary means overtime
                                                > does nothing for your take-home. Nobody remembers the
                                                > What would our lives be like without music, dance, and theater?
                                                > Donate or volunteer in the arts today at Network for Good!
                                                > http://us.click.yahoo.com/Tcy2bD/SOnJAA/cosFAA/j2LplB/TM
                                              • Dicarlo, Gino
                                                Easy to confuse you guys. You re both Steves and you both work for CSX! Gino ... From: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                Message 23 of 23 , May 1, 2005
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                                                  Message
                                                  Easy to confuse you guys.  You're both Steves and you both work for CSX!
                                                   
                                                  Gino
                                                  -----Original Message-----
                                                  From: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen G. Myers
                                                  Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 8:54 AM
                                                  To: FJGRailroad@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Subject: Re: [FJGRailroad] Re: Chicago Line

                                                  Which Steve? Steve Myers works out of Frontier yard, but is in
                                                  Jacksonville Florida until Sunday.
                                                  Steve's wife
                                                  On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 22:56:29 -0400 choochoo1802@... writes:
                                                  >
                                                  > Steve- Are you in Frontier Yard?  I heard its a mess in Buffalo
                                                  > also. We
                                                  > have over 400 cars interchanged to CSX in Syracuse,but the problem
                                                  > is
                                                  > that they are not in DeWitt where they are suppose to be.They are
                                                  > scattered all over the place.Give it more time,it will start hitting
                                                  > the
                                                  > media. Mark
                                                  >
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