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Adhesives, cables, and pulleys questions (or, The return of the retractable wings)

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  • Dennis Carr
    So once upon a time, I posted here asking for insight on building a set of retractable fairy wings using a set of repurposed Leg Avenue brand dragonfly style
    Message 1 of 4 , Jan 2, 2012
      So once upon a time, I posted here asking for insight on building a set of
      retractable fairy wings using a set of repurposed Leg Avenue brand
      dragonfly style fairy wings. Well, long and short is that I have built a
      prototype version of these, and these have since been scrapped as I am
      rebuilding these, with hopes of rebulding them in time for Faeriecon West
      here in Seattle.

      (Side note - BOY, that was a pain! Goof-Off breaks down the glue quite
      nicely, but dammit, just try removing the nylon net fabric without bending
      the frames! </rant>)

      For the newer version, I purchased from McMaster-Carr
      (http://www.mcmaster.com) a pair of acetal pulleys, sleeve bearings, and
      1/4" steel studs with #20 threads on one end, so that I can get the
      nut/washer assembly place. My friendly neighborhood hardware store was
      kind enough to sell me the requisite nuts and washers for something around
      $5. To replace the fabric, I have purchased some iridescent cellphane
      that is typically used for gift baskets (Michael's Arts and Crafts,
      non-shrink variety, UPC 400100676172, composition unknown).

      So where I'm at is that I have the fulcrum assembly mostly built in such a
      way where I can affix the wing frames to the pulleys. Now, however, I'm
      stuck. It's the adhesives that are getting me.

      The first attempt on this used clear Tacky Glue, which provides NO
      adhesion whatsoever to the plastic - when the glue dries, it just comes
      right off quite unlike an Avery label from its backing, with adhesion
      quite unlike an Avery label. One of my roommates suggests a substance,
      based on a tutorial she saw on miniature fairy wings, that uses something
      that's used for mock stained glass (poly glass or something). As near as
      I can tell, these wire frames are composed of aluminum.

      As for the pulley to the stud, I'm attempting to fasten this together
      using E6000, however as I understand it, this is a flexible glue that is
      likely not correct for the application - in short, it will likely not do
      what I want.

      The third problem comes down to the pull line to use. Debating either a
      braided nylon rope, twisted wire rope, or twisting together some high test
      fishing line. (The latter would be best for keeping something in the way
      of something not entirely unlike invisible.) Keep in mind the pulleys are
      made of acetal, and that they are not notched to hold a line in place for
      this application.

      So, the questions I'm left with are as follows:

      1) How do I affix the plastic to the wire frames effectively?

      2) In regards to the pulleys, what's a better adhesive thn E6000?

      3) Short of single-wrap and some sort of epoxy, is there a good way to get
      the pull line affixed to the pulley without notching?

      -Dennis
    • Cat Devereaux
      Practice makes perfect... Question about the cellophane use... don t know the exact layout of the wings, but aren t you going to have a problem w/ cellophane
      Message 2 of 4 , Jan 3, 2012
        Practice makes perfect...

        Question about the cellophane use... don't know the exact layout of the
        wings, but aren't you going to have a problem w/ cellophane
        wrinkling/tearing???

        Glue - Tacky glue is for art projects.... things on paper. Use the
        e6000 for the cellophane to the frame. Test. You might want to score
        the alumina a bit to give extra hold. Only problem I can see is long
        term. e6000 dries cloudy/clear but eventually yellows. (Though most
        glues will yellow after a while.)

        >> As for the pulley to the stud,

        Not completely visualizing though it sounds like you're at a stress
        point. Not sure I'd want to depend on glue. Wings get big, there's
        lots of bounce. things go pop. Could you get a very narrow drill bit
        and "join" them together instead.

        However... if you're willing to try it out... JB Weld (
        http://jbweld.net/products/jbweld.php ) might do it... but I'd trust
        some version of pinning and gluing.

        Test. Test. Test.

        -Cat-
      • Dennis Carr
        On Tue, 03 Jan 2012 05:20:34 -0800 ... It s possible. All I d need to do that is ... Definitely worth a test run when I get home from class tonight. Also had
        Message 3 of 4 , Jan 3, 2012
          On Tue, 03 Jan 2012 05:20:34 -0800
          Cat Devereaux <CatDevereaux@...> wrote:

          > Practice makes perfect...
          >
          > Question about the cellophane use... don't know the exact layout of
          > the wings, but aren't you going to have a problem w/ cellophane
          > wrinkling/tearing???

          It's possible. All I'd need to do that is

          > Glue - Tacky glue is for art projects.... things on paper. Use the
          > e6000 for the cellophane to the frame. Test. You might want to
          > score the alumina a bit to give extra hold. Only problem I can see
          > is long term. e6000 dries cloudy/clear but eventually yellows.
          > (Though most glues will yellow after a while.)

          Definitely worth a test run when I get home from class tonight. Also
          had a roommate suggest super glue, so with the frame I can test both
          and see what it does.

          (As an aside, the stuff she was telling me about was Gallery Glass -
          but reading up on the descriptions of the stuff, it seems that it would
          likely hold about as well as tacky glue.)


          > >> As for the pulley to the stud,
          >
          > Not completely visualizing though it sounds like you're at a stress
          > point. Not sure I'd want to depend on glue. Wings get big, there's
          > lots of bounce. things go pop. Could you get a very narrow drill
          > bit and "join" them together instead.

          It's an idea, but improbable - I'd have to drill into 18-8 steel and
          get a pin that will fit the diameter of the hole. If anything, I could
          take the pin-and-glue suggestion with, as you suggest, JB Weld - but
          given this, I think it might be best to test out the pulley with some
          JB Weld first. Good news - the hardware store has the glue. =)

          To give you a better description, for lack of an actual drawing, the
          way I'm building it involves said pulley on said stud. The pulley
          would be affixed to the stud, the back end of which sits in a sleeve
          bearing, and the other (threaded) end is where the wings sit amidst an
          assembly of nuts and washers - and possibly some Locktite, not sure.
          (Overall weight of the wings is less than one pound, length of each wing
          is about 30" max from joint to tip.) THese assemblies sit inside of a
          porject box that is appropriately drilled to accomodate the fulcrum
          assemblies as above, and two additional holes in the bottom to allow
          for the pull cables. Overall, the action of pulling on the cables
          (wrapped to be pulled from between the pulleys to actually get them to
          move upward - running from the outside would pull them downward or
          require an over-the-shoulder pull) would cause the entire assembly to
          move the wings up; releasing the cables lowers the wings. Hopefully
          that gives you a good idea of the desired result....

          -Dennis
        • Dennis Carr
          ... Hah, hooray for dangling sentences! As I was saying, I d just need some debris in a wind, or even just some radom foreign object, to hit the cellopahne on
          Message 4 of 4 , Jan 3, 2012
            On Tue, 3 Jan 2012, Dennis Carr wrote:

            > On Tue, 03 Jan 2012 05:20:34 -0800
            > Cat Devereaux <CatDevereaux@...> wrote:
            >
            >> Practice makes perfect...
            >>
            >> Question about the cellophane use... don't know the exact layout of
            >> the wings, but aren't you going to have a problem w/ cellophane
            >> wrinkling/tearing???
            >
            > It's possible. All I'd need to do that is

            Hah, hooray for dangling sentences!\

            As I was saying, I'd just need some debris in a wind, or even just some
            radom foreign object, to hit the cellopahne on the wings and it's game
            over. This said, the stuff is surprisingly durable unless injured in some
            way - so as long as it isn't pierced, it'll do nicely.

            -Dennis
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