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Re: [Exex-gay] Introduction

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  • ForstmannHF@wmconnect.com
    Hello Shane, and let me make MY introduction here, too! I just joined this group the other day, and I actually forgot to make my introductory post!!! I was a
    Message 1 of 16 , Mar 5, 2003
      Hello Shane, and let me make MY introduction here, too!  I just joined this group the other day, and I actually forgot to make my introductory post!!!

      I was a bit confused by the group's title, but I think I'll like it here.  My name is Herman, but I shorten it to Herm....that's what I like people to refer to me as.  I come from a small town in Texas about 50 miles to the South of Dallas.  I'm 27 (soon enough to be 28) years old, and I've been out of the closet as a happily gay man since I was 18.  Ok, so there WAS a time when it was not so happy for me....

      I was actually dragged out of the closet, kicking and screaming.  I was attending the last church I ever regularly attended, and right around my 18th birthday, I told a friend that I THOUGHT I could trust with a secret that I was gay.  Next thing I know, he spreads it through our Youth Group in church, and then the Pastor found out!!!!  

      I've always had a deep attachment to children, and they to me.  As a gay male, this is one strike against me, in most people's eyes.  They tend to presume automatically that I am molesting their children, just because I'm gay.  I HATE this way of thinking, because it seems to me that they should worry about my trying to steal their husbands, brothers, sons, whatever than molest their children.  I would not do any of these things, but I would rather they think of me as a "manhunter" than a child molester.

      Well, this issue came up with the Pastor of the church.  There was a 5-year-old boy named Michael that I had a rather strong attachment to.  He would almost always sit either right by me, or even in my lap during church.  Now, I can understand in a way how people could think things about his sitting in my lap, but it was NOT a dirty thing!  Anyway, the Pastor told me that if I truly were gay, which I did not deny, then I had to "stay away from the children" of the church.  I asked him how I was to explain to Michael why I had to REJECT him all of a sudden and without apparent cause?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  So, I chose, after thinking HARD about it for a while, to leave the church.  I figured that Michael and the other kids might miss me or feel bad for a while, but they could deal with my leaving better than they could deal with being rejected.  I know what rejection from adults feels like, and I was NOT about to put that burden on a child's shoulder purposely!!!!

      Anyway, that's how I came out.  I figured since everyone in the church knew, it was the right time for EVERYONE to know.  The only person with whom I have not discussed the subject is my maternal grandmother.  She knows, but we don't discuss it because I know how she feels about it.  All my aunts, uncles, cousins, and my mother, brother, and sister know and accept it.  Actually, I'm quite GLAD I came out.  It took a little time, but everyone got used to it, and now, they treat the issue of having an openly gay man in the family with lightness and sometimes comedy, which tickles me!  

      I don't really know what else to say, except this :  I am single, and I WAS looking for a partner in my life, BUT I've recently decided I won't look anymore.  If someone comes along, and it happens, it happens, but I'm taking the energy and dedication of my search and placing the same amount of emphasis on being there for my nieces and nephews and godsons.  I've decided "my babies" need me more than I need a companion.

      Love to all,

      Herm

      p.s.  If anyone has questions of me, feel more than free to ask away.  I'm not a very private person.  I don't keep secrets about myself that often, and I am always willing to share my life with anyone who wants to share it!

      H
    • Life Coach
      I think that makes it clear now Shane. I used to be ordained with the Assemblies of God and had my own evangelistic organisation. When, after 22 years of
      Message 2 of 16 , Mar 6, 2003

        I think that makes it clear now Shane.  I used to be ordained with the Assemblies of God and had my own evangelistic organisation.  When, after 22 years of believing God would change me, I had to finally admit I was a gay man for life it meant that I lost the ministry I had built up, my marriage and my two wonderful daughters.

         

        That was in 1991……..now I have redefined my beliefs and live a wonderful life of resolution.  My wife has remarried and my daughters love their gay Dad.  I’m a very blessed man.

         

        You can read the first chapter of my book in the files section on our home page.  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Exex-gay

         

         

        Anthony V-B

        Moderator

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Traygurr da Horsie [mailto:traygurr@...]
        Sent: Thursday, 6 March 2003 15:33
        To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [Exex-gay] Introduction

         


        --- Life Coach <lifecoach@...> wrote:

        > HI Shane
        >
        > Welcome and thanks for sharing.
        >
        > So are you a gay man?
        >
        > Anthony
        > Moderator



        *Big Grins*

        Ya,you could say that? <LOL>

        I am indeed a male that is attracted to other males
        physicaly,emotionaly and sexualy.

        I have battled this since a very young age and dispite
        several failed attemps of going str8,even threw
        countless prayers and confessions and fasting my
        feelings towards other males never changed but instead
        only grew stronger and recently I believe that God has
        finally led me to be happy with who and what I am and
        tought me to understand that everything happens for a
        reason.

        So finally I am delivered :)

        But I am delivered from hating myself....and delivered
        from thoughts that I will never have a realationship
        with God because of the way I am.

        So to answer your question,yes I am a gay man.

        A very differant one,but thats besides the point ;)

        More about me later *grins*



        Peace,

        Traygurr






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      • Traygurr da Horsie
        ... *Nods and understands* I have indeed read the first chapter and was looking forward to reading the rest of it but the site link will not open on my PC and
        Message 3 of 16 , Mar 6, 2003
          --- Life Coach <lifecoach@...> wrote:
          > I think that makes it clear now Shane. I used to be
          > ordained with the
          > Assemblies of God and had my own evangelistic
          > organisation. When, after 22
          > years of believing God would change me, I had to
          > finally admit I was a gay
          > man for life it meant that I lost the ministry I had
          > built up, my marriage
          > and my two wonderful daughters.
          >
          > That was in 1991....now I have redefined my beliefs
          > and live a wonderful
          > life of resolution. My wife has remarried and my
          > daughters love their gay
          > Dad. I'm a very blessed man.
          >
          > You can read the first chapter of my book in the
          > files section on our home
          > page. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Exex-gay
          >
          >
          > Anthony V-B
          > Moderator



          *Nods and understands*

          I have indeed read the first chapter and was looking
          forward to reading the rest of it but the site link
          will not open on my PC and appears to no longer be
          there or atleast down...

          I find atleast the beginings of what I have read about
          you very interesting and would like to read the rest
          of your life story if it is still indeed available.

          I myself in return am also a very open and honest
          person and am willing to share my own experiences and
          battles to any of those that may ask or wonder.


          Peace,Love and oats,

          TraYgurr



          __________________________________________________
          Do you Yahoo!?
          Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more
          http://taxes.yahoo.com/
        • Life Coach
          Would you like me to email the first chapter to you personally Anthony V-B ... From: Traygurr da Horsie [mailto:traygurr@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, 7 March 2003
          Message 4 of 16 , Mar 6, 2003

            Would you like me to email the first chapter to you personally

             

            Anthony V-B

             

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Traygurr da Horsie [mailto:traygurr@...]
            Sent: Friday, 7 March 2003 14:45
            To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [Exex-gay] Introduction

             


            --- Life Coach <lifecoach@...> wrote:

            > I think that makes it clear now Shane.  I used to be
            > ordained with the
            > Assemblies of God and had my own evangelistic
            > organisation.  When, after 22
            > years of believing God would change me, I had to
            > finally admit I was a gay
            > man for life it meant that I lost the ministry I had
            > built up, my marriage
            > and my two wonderful daughters.
            >
            > That was in 1991....now I have redefined my beliefs
            > and live a wonderful
            > life of resolution.  My wife has remarried and my
            > daughters love their gay
            > Dad.  I'm a very blessed man.
            >
            > You can read the first chapter of my book in the
            > files section on our home
            > page.  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Exex-gay
            >
            >
            > Anthony V-B
            > Moderator



            *Nods and understands*

            I have indeed read the first chapter and was looking
            forward to reading the rest of it but the site link
            will not open on my PC and appears to no longer be
            there or atleast down...

            I find atleast the beginings of what I have read about
            you very interesting and would like to read the rest
            of your life story if it is still indeed available.

            I myself in return am also a very open and honest
            person and am willing to share my own experiences and
            battles to any of those that may ask or wonder.


            Peace,Love and oats,

            TraYgurr



            __________________________________________________
            Do you Yahoo!?
            Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more
            http://taxes.yahoo.com/


            To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            Ex-exgays-unsubscribe@egroups.com



            Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
          • Bob Beer
            Hi there. I ll not bore you with the series of events that got me to this group but anyway, here I am. I thought I d post my own experience in hope that it
            Message 5 of 16 , Mar 14, 2005
              Hi there.

              I'll not bore you with the series of events that got me to this group
              but anyway, here I am. I thought I'd post my own experience in hope
              that it may be helpful to someone.

              I had same-sex attractions from very early on, though I didn't
              realize the sexual aspect of them till the hormones kicked in at
              around 13 or 14. Then certain dreams left...um, little doubt as to
              where I was headed. :)

              Although I knew the word "faggot" and knew what attitudes towards
              gays were, I had never thought of myself as sick or needing to be
              changed. I did know what would happen if my being gay became general
              knowledge in 1971 in Iowa City, Iowa. I came out to my family and
              they were wonderful about it.

              My religious background was...complicated. Dad a Southern Baptist,
              Mom raised alternate Sundays in the Greek Orthodox and Presbyterian
              churches, we went to Presbyterian church for a while, became members
              and never went back to the church. Lived sort of "religion free"
              till 8th grade when dad came home and annouced that we were all going
              to be Lutherans. That's a story in itself. I had lots of questions
              which were not approved of, like "how does Jesus' dying make me a
              better person if I just believe?" The answer was basically "we can't
              understand it but we have to believe it, otherwise we go to hell."
              But how can you make yourself "just believe" something?

              In College I met a woman who became a close friend, who was Christian
              Scientist. We argued all the normal stuff, like "what would you do
              if you broke your leg and the bone was sticking out...." etc. Her
              answers were not what I expected, and though I thought some of it was
              a bit odd, it did seem based on some sort of understanding instead of
              blind belief. I bought Science and Health and started reading it, and
              found it interesting. The idea of a God that was spiritual, that
              included both male and female qualities (of course..how could He give
              to us what he didn't include himself?), and man in Gods spiritual
              image and likeness, including all. There seemed to be no basis to
              attack gays from such a position. This was a community I wanted to
              be part of and accepted by, and that was the beginning of the
              problem. (And perhaps the basic problem in what many people, not
              only gays and lesbians, deal with in religious communities the world
              over.)

              So I was surprised when I went to the church that people there could
              be just as prejudiced as anyone else. Homosexuality was lumped in
              with "adultry" by them (though not in anything the founder of the
              religion ever wrote). I went on a 13-year stint of trying to be
              healed of homosexuality. Sometimes I believed I really had been,
              too...until the opportunity came to become close to a woman, and I
              realized that as much as I might love her, I couldn't use her to
              prove some personal point.

              After 13 years of ignoring my preferences (interrupted by some really
              interesting "backsliding" followed by lots of guilt and running
              around in mental circles), I finally decided "enough of this." It
              was time to either be done with it, or live my life as a happy gay
              man.

              So I called a practitioner, someone in the CS church who helps people
              through prayer, and (if he/she is a good one, keeps person opinions
              out of it). We started working together, and after about 3 days of
              praying and listening, my prayers were answered, not by an "answer,"
              but rather by a question: "Why is it wrong for me to love a man?"
              And I realized that in 13 years of struggle, I had never really asked
              that question in an honest way. I had come up with all sorts of
              reasons why I shouldn't, but never looked honestly into myself, to
              see why I believed what I did.

              So I asked the practitioner. He said "there is nothing wrong with
              loving a man. But why the sex?" I said "why do you have sex?" He
              gave me a line about procreation. So I asked him "after your last
              child was born, did you stop?" "Of course not" was his
              answer. "Then why do you have sex?" I asked again. He gave a more
              realistic answer: "Because it is an expression of our love and
              oneness." "That is why *I* want to have sex" I answered. He came
              back with "but at least there is the *idea* of procreation!"
              Okay...but they had been married for 40 years, and with one child and
              no more likely to be dropped off by Mr. Stork, it seemed to me that
              the only idea about procreation in this case was that of how to
              prevent it. So I asked him (yeah, I was a bit snide
              here), "So...it's okay for you and your wife to have sex for the joy
              of it, as long as you keep in mind that the rubber might break?" He
              did't like that...

              I had pretty much written off religion for a long time, but
              eventually I did feel a need to have some sort of spiritual
              practice. I really didn't know what to do -- I really didn't feel
              like returning to a church where I felt I had to watch my back or
              defend myself (the organist came out to me a year later). :) So I
              just asked the question to God and waited. The answer came in an
              interesting way: I met four people over the next week, under
              extremely different circumstances, who I really clicked spiritually
              with and who went to the same church. I checked it out, and though I
              knew it wouldn't be my "permanent spiritual home," it was exactly
              what I needed at the time: a place that affirmed me and "gave me
              permission" to trust the answers I received to my prayer. As Jesus
              said, "The kingdom of God is within you." Probably one of the most
              significant things he ever said, and one of the most ignored by big
              religion!

              It's been a long time since then. Coming out (again) was not easy,
              it wasn't a "sudden weight lifted" for me. But I did see how much
              energy and mental space I'd devoted to hiding my tracks. I am out
              all of my friends back home, and a good number of them here (I live
              in Istanbul; it's not *quite* so easy here) but I find that accepting
              myself and putting no conditions on God's love is much more important
              to my well-being than having others know and/or approve of me.

              I think one of the most important things I have ever learned, much of
              which came from this experience, is to question what I believe -- am
              I believing simply because it was told to me and I never questioned
              it? If I decide to believe something, why do choose to believe it?
              It's a question that many religious authorities would rather we
              didn't ask ourselves (let alone others), but somehow I think Jesus
              would have approved. :)

              bob
            • braden rico
              Dear Bob: Thank you for sharing. I too have been blessed by Christian Science. It got me through a very bad patch in the eighties. I think we may have
              Message 6 of 16 , Mar 20, 2005

                Dear Bob:

                  Thank you for sharing. I too have been blessed by Christian Science. It got me through a very bad patch in the eighties. I think we may have corresponded before on another board.

                   Wow! Istanbul! Saturday nights must be rocking there!


                Braden Rico
                >From: "Bob Beer" <sazji@...> >Reply-To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com >To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [Exex-gay] Introduction >Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:54:53 -0000 > > >Hi there. > >I'll not bore you with the series of events that got me to this group >but anyway, here I am. I thought I'd post my own experience in hope >that it may be helpful to someone. > >I had same-sex attractions from very early on, though I didn't >realize the sexual aspect of them till the hormones kicked in at >around 13 or 14. Then certain dreams left...um, little doubt as to >where I was headed. :) > >Although I knew the word "faggot" and knew what attitudes towards >gays were, I had never thought of myself as sick or needing to be >changed. I did know what would happen if my being gay became general >knowledge in 1971 in Iowa City, Iowa. I came out to my family and >they were wonderful about it. > >My religious background was...complicated. Dad a Southern Baptist, >Mom raised alternate Sundays in the Greek Orthodox and Presbyterian >churches, we went to Presbyterian church for a while, became members >and never went back to the church. Lived sort of "religion free" >till 8th grade when dad came home and annouced that we were all going >to be Lutherans. That's a story in itself. I had lots of questions >which were not approved of, like "how does Jesus' dying make me a >better person if I just believe?" The answer was basically "we can't >understand it but we have to believe it, otherwise we go to hell." >But how can you make yourself "just believe" something? > >In College I met a woman who became a close friend, who was Christian >Scientist. We argued all the normal stuff, like "what would you do >if you broke your leg and the bone was sticking out...." etc. Her >answers were not what I expected, and though I thought some of it was >a bit odd, it did seem based on some sort of understanding instead of >blind belief. I bought Science and Health and started reading it, and >found it interesting. The idea of a God that was spiritual, that >included both male and female qualities (of course..how could He give >to us what he didn't include himself?), and man in Gods spiritual >image and likeness, including all. There seemed to be no basis to >attack gays from such a position. This was a community I wanted to >be part of and accepted by, and that was the beginning of the
                >problem. (And perhaps the basic problem in what many people, not >only gays and lesbians, deal with in religious communities the world >over.) > >So I was surprised when I went to the church that people there could >be just as prejudiced as anyone else. Homosexuality was lumped in >with "adultry" by them (though not in anything the founder of the >religion ever wrote). I went on a 13-year stint of trying to be >healed of homosexuality. Sometimes I believed I really had been, >too...until the opportunity came to become close to a woman, and I >realized that as much as I might love her, I couldn't use her to >prove some personal point. > >After 13 years of ignoring my preferences (interrupted by some really >interesting "backsliding" followed by lots of guilt and running >around in mental circles), I finally decided "enough of this." It >was time to either be done with it, or live my life as a happy gay >man. > >So I called a practitioner, someone in the CS church who helps people >through prayer, and (if he/she is a good one, keeps person opinions >out of it). We started working together, and after about 3 days of >praying and listening, my prayers were answered, not by an "answer," >but rather by a question: "Why is it wrong for me to love a man?" >And I realized that in 13 years of struggle, I had never really asked >that question in an honest way. I had come up with all sorts of >reasons why I shouldn't, but never looked honestly into myself, to >see why I believed what I did. > >So I asked the practitioner. He said "there is nothing wrong with >loving a man. But why the sex?" I said "why do you have sex?" He >gave me a line about procreation. So I asked him "after
                your last >child was born, did you stop?" "Of course not" was his >answer. "Then why do you have sex?" I asked again. He gave a more >realistic answer: "Because it is an expression of our love and >oneness." "That is why *I* want to have sex" I answered. He came >back with "but at least there is the *idea* of procreation!" >Okay...but they had been married for 40 years, and with one child and >no more likely to be dropped off by Mr. Stork, it seemed to me that >the only idea about procreation in this case was that of how to >prevent it. So I asked him (yeah, I was a bit snide >here), "So...it's okay for you and your wife to have sex for the joy >of it, as long as you keep in mind that the rubber might break?" He >did't like that... > >I had pretty much written off religion for a long time, but >eventually I did feel a need to have some sort of spiritual >practice. I really didn't know what to do -- I really didn't feel >like returning to a church where I felt I had to watch my back or >defend myself (the organist came out to me a year later). :) So I >just asked the question to God and waited. The answer came in an >interesting way: I met four people over the next week, under >extremely different circumstances, who I really clicked spiritually >with and who went to the same church. I checked it out, and though I >knew it wouldn't be my "permanent spiritual home," it was exactly >what I needed at the time: a place that affirmed me and "gave me >permission" to trust the answers I received to my prayer. As Jesus >said, "The kingdom of God is within you." Probably one of the most >significant things he ever said, and one of the most ignored by big >religion! > >It's been a long time since then. Coming out (again) was not easy, >it wasn't a "sudden weight lifted" for me. But I did see how much >energy and mental space I'd devoted to hiding my tracks. I am out >all of my friends back home, and a good number of them here (I live >in Istanbul; it's not *quite* so easy here) but I find that accepting >myself and putting no conditions on God's love is much more important >to my well-being than having others know and/or approve of me. > >I think one of the most important things I have ever learned, much of >which came from this experience, is to question what I believe -- am >I believing simply because it was told to me and I never questioned >it? If I decide to believe something, why do choose to believe it? >It's a question that many religious authorities would rather we >didn't ask ourselves (let alone others), but somehow I think Jesus >would have approved. :) > >bob > > >


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              • Elaine
                Hello all, my name is Elaine, I am 54 and am living in Fl with my husband and two adult children. I had a nephew whom I was very close too, he passed a number
                Message 7 of 16 , Jan 17, 2007
                   
                  Hello all, my name is Elaine, I am 54 and am living in Fl with my husband and two adult children.
                  I had a nephew whom I was very close too, he passed a number of years ago from AIDS, this was before they had the meds that they have now to prolong life.
                  I wanted to understand him and all the gay people I knew and grew to love though him.It was important for him that I understnad... My quest has been to understnad the thinking and feelings of gay people, transgendered and every other aspect of living.
                  I havce read so much and have read nearly every theory there is on the subject..I have certain beleifs but whats most important is I offer you all the support that is in me to each and every one of you on your quest for a happy life, you are entitled to that. I just wanted you to know that I am lurking around on here and wish you all the best. Will try and pop in from time to time if thats okay with you all. Pardon any typos I have MS and my fingers often hit more than one key.
                  Hugs
                  Elaine
                • Yowee
                  Hi Elaine Welcome to the group. I look forward to getting to know you through your posts. Enjoy Jesus = HOPE Yowee Hope Is Vital A ministry to HIV+
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jan 18, 2007

                    Hi Elaine

                    Welcome to the group. I look forward to getting to know you through your posts.

                    Enjoy

                    Jesus = HOPE
                     
                    Yowee
                     
                    Hope
                    Is
                    Vital
                    A ministry to HIV+ Christians


                    --- In Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com, "Elaine" <elfv@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > Hello all, my name is Elaine, I am 54 and am living in Fl with my husband and two adult children.
                    > I had a nephew whom I was very close too, he passed a number of years ago from AIDS, this was before they had the meds that they have now to prolong life.
                    > I wanted to understand him and all the gay people I knew and grew to love though him.It was important for him that I understnad... My quest has been to understnad the thinking and feelings of gay people, transgendered and every other aspect of living.
                    > I havce read so much and have read nearly every theory there is on the subject..I have certain beleifs but whats most important is I offer you all the support that is in me to each and every one of you on your quest for a happy life, you are entitled to that. I just wanted you to know that I am lurking around on here and wish you all the best. Will try and pop in from time to time if thats okay with you all. Pardon any typos I have MS and my fingers often hit more than one key.
                    > Hugs
                    > Elaine
                    >

                  • Korry Korry
                    ... Welcome, Elaine. In terms of understanding gay people, though, there isn t a heckuva lot to get. We re just people like you. Or to paraphrase a great
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jan 18, 2007
                      --- Elaine <elfv@...> wrote:

                      > I wanted to understand him and all the gay people
                      > I knew and grew to love though him.

                      Welcome, Elaine. In terms of understanding gay people,
                      though, there isn't a heckuva lot to "get." We're just
                      people like you. Or to paraphrase a great writer:

                      "I am a gay. Hath not a gay eyes? hath not a gay
                      hands, organs, dimensions, senses, affections,
                      passions? fed with the same food, hurt with the same
                      weapons, subject to the same diseases, healed by the
                      same means, warmed and cooled by the same winter and
                      summer, as a straight is? If you prick us, do we not
                      bleed? if you tickle us, do we not laugh? if you
                      poison us, do we not die?"

                      Korry



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