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Re: [Exex-gay] HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE

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  • Kapitano
    ... Myth. ... Meaningless. ... And how do these mechanisms operate? How does the local genone know about the size of the local population? And why do these
    Message 1 of 14 , Aug 13, 1999
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      americo-petit wrote:
      >In pure biological terms (forget about morality & religion) It's been
      >demonstrated in experiment with lab rats that when populations grow,
      >some male rats change their sexual behaviour and become attracted to
      >the same gender.

      Myth.

      >Why that happens? Well, Nature.

      Meaningless.

      >It have its own mechanisms to stop reproduction.

      And how do these mechanisms operate? How does
      the local genone 'know' about the size of the local population?
      And why do these mechanisms apparantly not function in
      Africa and India?

      > But we humans changed the rules, we help the
      > elder and keep them alive while Nature do the opposite,

      And how are humans able to change the rules? By an effort
      of will?
      And why should a species want to break these supposed
      rules? Indeed, how could it become aware that the rules could
      be broken?
      No. More likely the rules were never there to be broken. But
      if you'd ever studied the behavior of other animals, you'd know
      that.

      >So do we have to overcome homosexuality?. It is up to
      >you, but at least, as males with penis within our legs, we should
      >find the proper female to have a baby with,

      Solipsistic voluntarism combined with essentialist moral coercion.
      In other words: a complete contradition, between two adjacent
      sentences.

      > Sorry my English

      Don't worry about English. Worry about Logic.



      --
      Kapitano.
      200 vicars all going "mmmmmmmmmmmmmm"
    • Kapitano
      ... If we all knew, there would be no need for you to tell us. You defeat your own argument. Trying to pretend that we all secretly agree with you won t make
      Message 2 of 14 , Aug 16, 1999
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        > SORRY, I WAS POINTING IN THE WRONG DIRECTION, YOU GUYS KNOW WHAT YOU
        > WANT AND YOU HAVE IT. IN THE BOTTON LINE WE ALL KNOW IT IS ABSOLUTLY
        > INCORRECT YOUR FEELINGS,

        If we all knew, there would be no need for you to tell us. You defeat
        your own argument.
        Trying to pretend that we all secretly agree with you won't make you
        right. It just makes you look stupid.

        > YOUR MOTIVATIONS, YOUR FANTASIES, ETC. AGAIN
        > IN STRICTLY BIOLOGICAL TERMS. GO TO THE ZOO CLOSEST TO YOUR NEIBORHOOD
        > AND YOULL UNDERSTAND MY POSITION.

        You seem to think only humans have gay sex. If you had ever been to a
        zoo, or read a book on zoology, you would know that this is simply untrue.

        > I DO NOT PROFESS ANY RELIGION, NEVERTHELESS I GREW UP IN A CHRISTIAN
        > ENVIRONMENT.
        >
        > SORRY GUY, BUT AS YOU ARE USING YOUR SEX IN THE WRONG DIRECTION, THE
        > OBJECT YOU ARE USING TO FIND PLEASURE IS DISTORTED, YOU DO NOT KNOW
        > WHAT VAGINA AND PENNIS ARE FOR, SORRY THIS IS MORE THAN ENTERTAIMENT.

        What a strange argument. First you say that using the penis for
        homosexual sex is like misusing a tool, for instance, using a spanner to
        knock in nails instead of using a hammer.
        Then you say this misuse is a result of ignorance. Thus you imply that
        people have to be *educated* into using their bodies (tools) in the correct
        way.
        Now, what determines which uses for bodily-tools are correct and which
        are incorrect? It seems you believe there is a moral code in the universe,
        an
        authority which has an absolute right to tell people how they should behave.
        Where does this code come from? Where does it get it's authority? From
        nowhere - it just *exists*, and just *has* absolute authority.
        In other words, you are suggesting an absolute moral code, that exists
        *as if* it were created by God. But you say you don't believe in God.

        You are trying to use 'Nature' or 'The Universe' in place of 'God' to
        justify your own prejudices.

        > YOU JUST LOOSE YOUR TIME ON EARTH.

        Are you *sure* you're not a christian?

        > I DONT THINK I WILL CONTINUE POSTING, SWIMING AGAIST THE RIVER FLOW IS
        > VERY HARD, FOR ME, FOR YOU AND FOR EVERYONE.

        Yes. It must be very difficult for you, attacking people who can
        fight back.

        > IF ONE DAY YOU SEE NATURE AND YOU UNDERSTAND MY POSITION, GIVE A CALL:

        We understand your positon perfectly. That's why we know what's wrong
        with it.

        What a fucked up man that was.


        --
        Kapitano
        Better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick
      • americo_petit@yahoo.com
        In pure biological terms (forget about morality & religion) It s been demonstrated in experiment with lab rats that when populations grow, some male rats
        Message 3 of 14 , Aug 9, 2001
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          In pure biological terms (forget about morality & religion) It's been
          demonstrated in experiment with lab rats that when populations grow,
          some male rats change their sexual behaviour and become attracted to
          the same gender. Why that happens? Well, Nature…, friends, (call it
          Lord, God, or whatever, is Nature) It have its own mechanisms to stop
          reproduction. The point is why you?, why me?. Why us?, Why we where
          selected by nature to stop reproduction?. Why my close friend has a
          loving wife, a loving child and a loving life?. That is the point.
          Homosexuality in pure biological terms is a mistake, its wrong, sex
          is there in your body my dear friend (Penis) with only a single
          purpose in life, and that is reproduction. The orgasm and the
          pleasure you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a
          reward from nature for you to reproduce life on earth. If you deny
          your true and ultimate mission in life (in biological terms again)
          you are just doing anything here and you deserve to die, in fact, not
          being able to reproduce yourself is a way of dying. It means you are
          not strong, good enough and you do not deserve to reproduce life on
          earth, that is the law of God (of nature) you can see the application
          of this law in the animal reign. Weaker animals are just food for
          others, those strong animal, those that are able to fight, those are
          allowed to reproduce. But we humans changed the rules, we help the
          elder and keep them alive while Nature do the opposite, We cure
          children who were born with inherited diseases, Nature do the
          opposite. Animals with inherited diseases do not have the reward of
          reproduction. So do we have to overcome homosexuality?. It is up to
          you, but at least, as males with penis within our legs, we should
          find the proper female to have a baby with, if you do so then Men you
          just accomplished your mission on earth…

          I respect your believes, but penis with penis or penis with ass,
          doesn't make any sense for Nature, that is my point, I would like to
          listen to your suggestions.

          Sorry my English

          Thanks
        • David
          Americo, I find your posting offensive and actually quite rediculous. To claim that we are only here to reproduce, well, I choose not to use the words I m
          Message 4 of 14 , Aug 9, 2001
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            Americo, I find your posting offensive and actually quite
            rediculous. To claim that we are only here to reproduce, well, I
            choose not to use the words I'm really thinking. Anyway I truly
            think you are mistaken and should definitely keep this theory to
            yourself. Dave
            --- americo_petit@... wrote:
            > In pure biological terms (forget about morality & religion) It's
            > been
            > demonstrated in experiment with lab rats that when populations
            > grow,
            > some male rats change their sexual behaviour and become attracted
            > to
            > the same gender. Why that happens? Well, Nature�, friends, (call it
            >
            > Lord, God, or whatever, is Nature) It have its own mechanisms to
            > stop
            > reproduction. The point is why you?, why me?. Why us?, Why we
            > where
            > selected by nature to stop reproduction?. Why my close friend has
            > a
            > loving wife, a loving child and a loving life?. That is the point.
            >
            > Homosexuality in pure biological terms is a mistake, its wrong, sex
            >
            > is there in your body my dear friend (Penis) with only a single
            > purpose in life, and that is reproduction. The orgasm and the
            > pleasure you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a
            > reward from nature for you to reproduce life on earth. If you deny
            >
            > your true and ultimate mission in life (in biological terms again)
            > you are just doing anything here and you deserve to die, in fact,
            > not
            > being able to reproduce yourself is a way of dying. It means you
            > are
            > not strong, good enough and you do not deserve to reproduce life on
            >
            > earth, that is the law of God (of nature) you can see the
            > application
            > of this law in the animal reign. Weaker animals are just food for
            > others, those strong animal, those that are able to fight, those
            > are
            > allowed to reproduce. But we humans changed the rules, we help the
            >
            > elder and keep them alive while Nature do the opposite, We cure
            > children who were born with inherited diseases, Nature do the
            > opposite. Animals with inherited diseases do not have the reward of
            >
            > reproduction. So do we have to overcome homosexuality?. It is up to
            >
            > you, but at least, as males with penis within our legs, we should
            > find the proper female to have a baby with, if you do so then Men
            > you
            > just accomplished your mission on earth�
            >
            > I respect your believes, but penis with penis or penis with ass,
            > doesn't make any sense for Nature, that is my point, I would like
            > to
            > listen to your suggestions.
            >
            > Sorry my English
            >
            > Thanks
            >
            >
            >


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          • Anthony Venn-Brown
            Just when I thought it was getting too quiet in the group you posted this message Americo. I’m sure this will hot things up. I have to go to work now and
            Message 5 of 14 , Aug 9, 2001
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              Just when I thought it was getting too quiet in the group you posted this message Americo.  I’m sure this will hot things up. 

               

              I have to go to work now and won’t have time to post in length. All I can say at this point is that you have never experienced real and genuine intimacy between two men and if you are gay have not realised the beauty of loving making two gay can enjoy.

               

              Anthony

              Moderator

              http://www.yahoo.com/group/Exex-gay

              "There is the illusion that homosexuals only have sex and heterosexuals fall in love..  Boy George"

               

              -----Original Message-----
              From: americo_petit@... [mailto:americo_petit@...]
              Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 7:55 AM
              To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [Exex-gay] HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE

               

              In pure biological terms (forget about morality & religion) It's been
              demonstrated in experiment with lab rats that when populations grow,
              some male rats change their sexual behaviour and become attracted to
              the same gender. Why that happens? Well, Nature…, friends, (call it
              Lord, God, or whatever, is Nature) It have its own mechanisms to stop
              reproduction.  The point is why you?, why me?.  Why us?, Why we where
              selected by nature to stop reproduction?.  Why my close friend has a
              loving wife, a loving child and a loving life?.  That is the point. 
              Homosexuality in pure biological terms is a mistake, its wrong, sex
              is there in your body my dear friend (Penis) with only a single
              purpose in life, and that is reproduction. The orgasm and the
              pleasure you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a
              reward from nature for you to reproduce life on earth.  If you deny
              your true and ultimate mission in life (in biological terms again)
              you are just doing anything here and you deserve to die, in fact, not
              being able to reproduce yourself is a way of dying. It means you are
              not strong, good enough and you do not deserve to reproduce life on
              earth, that is the law of God (of nature) you can see the application
              of this law in the animal reign. Weaker animals are just food for
              others, those strong animal, those that are able to fight, those are
              allowed to reproduce.  But we humans changed the rules, we help the
              elder and keep them alive while Nature do the opposite, We cure
              children who were born with inherited diseases, Nature do the
              opposite. Animals with inherited diseases do not have the reward of
              reproduction. So do we have to overcome homosexuality?. It is up to
              you, but at least, as males with penis within our legs, we should
              find the proper female to have a baby with, if you do so then Men you
              just accomplished your mission on earth…

              I respect your believes, but penis with penis or penis with ass,
              doesn't make any sense for Nature, that is my point, I would like to
              listen to your suggestions.

              Sorry my English

              Thanks




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              Ex-exgays-unsubscribe@egroups.com



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            • Erny
              Americo.... I certainly cannot figure you out. Are you trying everything possible to get out of the fact that you are a gay man who is looking for a way out
              Message 6 of 14 , Aug 9, 2001
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                Americo....

                I certainly cannot figure you out. Are you trying everything possible
                to get out of the fact that you are a gay man who is looking for a way out
                of this situation? If so...quit looking at lab rats. We are human beings.
                To through out my own morality, as you suggest...is to throw me out. Being
                a gay man is a blessing and God, nature, and morality are basic to my life
                and I won't be throwing any of those out of the equation.
                If you are trying to invade a private sector with nonsense then I would
                appreciate that you disengage yourself from this group. If you are trying
                to accept yourself as a gay man but are falling into these ignorant traps
                that others may be spewing toward you...then we can assist you. Make up
                your mind. This group is here to assist those who are struggling. Since
                you wrote, quite some time ago, it seems you are trying every avenue to deny
                your God given orientation and this will lead you into many difficult realms
                that would possibly mess up your life.
                But...I digress. I'm sorry, I must agree with David. I find your
                posting terribly offensive and very ridiculus. Be true to yourself and stop
                wasting your time or ours with these propostorus and erroneous claims.

                Blessings in your search,
                Erny


                ----- Original Message -----
                From: <americo_petit@...>
                To: <Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 2:54 PM
                Subject: [Exex-gay] HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE


                In pure biological terms (forget about morality & religion) It's been
                demonstrated in experiment with lab rats that when populations grow,
                some male rats change their sexual behaviour and become attracted to
                the same gender. Why that happens? Well, Nature., friends, (call it
                Lord, God, or whatever, is Nature) It have its own mechanisms to stop
                reproduction. The point is why you?, why me?. Why us?, Why we where
                selected by nature to stop reproduction?. Why my close friend has a
                loving wife, a loving child and a loving life?. That is the point.
                Homosexuality in pure biological terms is a mistake, its wrong, sex
                is there in your body my dear friend (Penis) with only a single
                purpose in life, and that is reproduction. The orgasm and the
                pleasure you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a
                reward from nature for you to reproduce life on earth. If you deny
                your true and ultimate mission in life (in biological terms again)
                you are just doing anything here and you deserve to die, in fact, not
                being able to reproduce yourself is a way of dying. It means you are
                not strong, good enough and you do not deserve to reproduce life on
                earth, that is the law of God (of nature) you can see the application
                of this law in the animal reign. Weaker animals are just food for
                others, those strong animal, those that are able to fight, those are
                allowed to reproduce. But we humans changed the rules, we help the
                elder and keep them alive while Nature do the opposite, We cure
                children who were born with inherited diseases, Nature do the
                opposite. Animals with inherited diseases do not have the reward of
                reproduction. So do we have to overcome homosexuality?. It is up to
                you, but at least, as males with penis within our legs, we should
                find the proper female to have a baby with, if you do so then Men you
                just accomplished your mission on earth.

                I respect your believes, but penis with penis or penis with ass,
                doesn't make any sense for Nature, that is my point, I would like to
                listen to your suggestions.

                Sorry my English

                Thanks




                To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                Ex-exgays-unsubscribe@egroups.com



                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              • Anthony Venn-Brown
                Dear americo Can you answer some questions for us so we can gauge where you’re coming from. Are you gay? If you are then is your sexual orientation causing
                Message 7 of 14 , Aug 11, 2001
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                  Dear americo

                   

                  Can you answer some questions for us so we can gauge where you’re coming from.

                   

                  Are you gay?

                   

                  If you are then is your sexual orientation causing you difficulties?  Your postings don’t seem to be looking for help or discuss things with an open mind. 

                   

                  What type of religious background do you come from?

                   

                  Your posting caused a bit of stir because the majority of people in this group are very happy being gay and have a much broader understanding of penis’s and vagina’s than you are suggesting.

                   

                  If you want to keep posting I suggest you answer these questions so we know where you’re coming from. At the moment I’m a little confused about 1. Your acceptance of your sexuality and 2. Your motives for posting.

                   

                  Please clarify.

                   

                  Anthony

                  Moderator

                  http://www.yahoo.com/group/Exex-gay

                  "There is the illusion that homosexuals only have sex and heterosexuals fall in love..  Boy George"

                   

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Erny [mailto:erny6@...]
                  Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 9:02 AM
                  To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [Exex-gay] HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE

                   

                  Americo....

                      I certainly cannot figure you out.  Are you trying everything possible
                  to get out of the fact that you are a gay man who is looking for a way out
                  of this situation?  If so...quit looking at lab rats.  We are human beings.
                  To through out my own morality, as you suggest...is to throw me out.  Being
                  a gay man is a blessing and God, nature, and morality are basic to my life
                  and I won't be throwing any of those out of the equation.
                      If you are trying to invade a private sector with nonsense then I would
                  appreciate that you disengage yourself from this group.  If you are trying
                  to accept yourself as a gay man but are falling into these ignorant traps
                  that others may be spewing toward you...then we can assist you.  Make up
                  your mind.  This group is here to assist those who are struggling.  Since
                  you wrote, quite some time ago, it seems you are trying every avenue to deny
                  your God given orientation and this will lead you into many difficult realms
                  that would possibly mess up your life.
                      But...I digress.  I'm sorry, I must agree with David.  I find your
                  posting terribly offensive and very ridiculus.  Be true to yourself and stop
                  wasting your time or ours with these propostorus and erroneous claims.

                  Blessings in your search,
                  Erny


                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: <americo_petit@...>
                  To: <Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 2:54 PM
                  Subject: [Exex-gay] HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE


                  In pure biological terms (forget about morality & religion) It's been
                  demonstrated in experiment with lab rats that when populations grow,
                  some male rats change their sexual behaviour and become attracted to
                  the same gender. Why that happens? Well, Nature., friends, (call it
                  Lord, God, or whatever, is Nature) It have its own mechanisms to stop
                  reproduction.  The point is why you?, why me?.  Why us?, Why we where
                  selected by nature to stop reproduction?.  Why my close friend has a
                  loving wife, a loving child and a loving life?.  That is the point.
                  Homosexuality in pure biological terms is a mistake, its wrong, sex
                  is there in your body my dear friend (Penis) with only a single
                  purpose in life, and that is reproduction. The orgasm and the
                  pleasure you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a
                  reward from nature for you to reproduce life on earth.  If you deny
                  your true and ultimate mission in life (in biological terms again)
                  you are just doing anything here and you deserve to die, in fact, not
                  being able to reproduce yourself is a way of dying. It means you are
                  not strong, good enough and you do not deserve to reproduce life on
                  earth, that is the law of God (of nature) you can see the application
                  of this law in the animal reign. Weaker animals are just food for
                  others, those strong animal, those that are able to fight, those are
                  allowed to reproduce.  But we humans changed the rules, we help the
                  elder and keep them alive while Nature do the opposite, We cure
                  children who were born with inherited diseases, Nature do the
                  opposite. Animals with inherited diseases do not have the reward of
                  reproduction. So do we have to overcome homosexuality?. It is up to
                  you, but at least, as males with penis within our legs, we should
                  find the proper female to have a baby with, if you do so then Men you
                  just accomplished your mission on earth.

                  I respect your believes, but penis with penis or penis with ass,
                  doesn't make any sense for Nature, that is my point, I would like to
                  listen to your suggestions.

                  Sorry my English

                  Thanks




                  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  Ex-exgays-unsubscribe@egroups.com



                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/





                  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  Ex-exgays-unsubscribe@egroups.com



                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                • lincolnrep@aol.com
                  Friends: Americo sent us his incredible maundering that orgasm and the pleasure you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a reward from nature for
                  Message 8 of 14 , Aug 11, 2001
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                    Friends:
                    Americo sent us his incredible maundering that "orgasm and the pleasure
                    you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a reward from nature
                    for you to reproduce life on earth." Of course this is nonsense, but it does
                    deserve to be addressed. I believe firmly that sex was the first form of
                    entertainment. Back when there was no television, no movies, no books, there
                    was nohing pleasurable other than (1) the enjoyment of views provided by
                    nature, (2) masturbation, and (3) sexual intercourse. There were and still
                    are no rules about how to enjoy these three original pleasures and those
                    pleasures remain available to all of us down to this very moment.
                    In the view of certain religions, homosex is "wrong." In Americo's view
                    it is "in pure biological terms is a mistake, its wrong" and I'm sure he gets
                    this exceptional notion from what the religious say. I think it's a good idea
                    to examine why religious thought adopted rules concerning sexual pleasure
                    and in doing so, perhaps we can therapize Americo. The religious view was
                    necessary in the early days, I suppose, to keep the tribe from dying out and
                    to expand it so that it could hold more territory. As a result of that view,
                    people were brainwashed to believe that any sex other than procreative sex
                    was "wrong."
                    Americo confuses the law of God with the laws of nature. There is no law
                    of nature (i.e., biological imperitive) about using sex only for procreation.
                    Any imperitive that there might be is connected solely to religious thought
                    (i.e., the law of God as announced by men). By now, the religious command to
                    multipy and replenish the earth has been more than fulfilled -- we now are
                    faced with overpopulation and a resulting famine that will kill off billions
                    of people.
                    Religious thought hasn't had a new thought in at least 2000 years -- this
                    is a mind blower in its own right! For Americo, the time has come to wake up
                    and smell the coffee, have a new thought, and leave the religion-based
                    brainwash in the ditch, where it belongs.
                    Nature created each of us as we are. I was born gay, have always been
                    gay, and will die gay. Being gay is not a matter of choice. It has never
                    been a matter of choice and it never will be.
                    Lee
                  • americo_petit@yahoo.com
                    ... coming ... NOP, BUT I DO HAVE SSA ... Your ... open ... SORRY, I WAS POINTING IN THE WRONG DIRECTION, YOU GUYS KNOW WHAT YOU WANT AND YOU HAVE IT. IN THE
                    Message 9 of 14 , Aug 13, 2001
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                      --- In Exex-gay@y..., "Anthony Venn-Brown" <avb@m...> wrote:
                      > Dear americo
                      >
                      > Can you answer some questions for us so we can gauge where you're
                      coming
                      > from.
                      >
                      > Are you gay?

                      NOP, BUT I DO HAVE SSA

                      >
                      > If you are then is your sexual orientation causing you difficulties?
                      Your
                      > postings don't seem to be looking for help or discuss things with an
                      open
                      > mind.

                      SORRY, I WAS POINTING IN THE WRONG DIRECTION, YOU GUYS KNOW WHAT YOU
                      WANT AND YOU HAVE IT. IN THE BOTTON LINE WE ALL KNOW IT IS ABSOLUTLY
                      INCORRECT YOUR FEELINGS, YOUR MOTIVATIONS, YOUR FANTASIES, ETC. AGAIN
                      IN STRICTLY BIOLOGICAL TERMS. GO TO THE ZOO CLOSEST TO YOUR NEIBORHOOD
                      AND YOULL UNDERSTAND MY POSITION.

                      > What type of religious background do you come from?

                      I DO NOT PROFESS ANY RELIGION, NEVERTHELESS I GREW UP IN A CHRISTIAN
                      ENVIRONMENT.

                      > Your posting caused a bit of stir because the majority of people in
                      this
                      > group are very happy being gay and have a much broader understanding
                      of
                      > penis's and vagina's than you are suggesting.

                      SORRY GUY, BUT AS YOU ARE USING YOUR SEX IN THE WRONG DIRECTION, THE
                      OBJECT YOU ARE USING TO FIND PLEASURE IS DISTORTED, YOU DO NOT KNOW
                      WHAT VAGINA AND PENNIS ARE FOR, SORRY THIS IS MORE THAN ENTERTAIMENT.
                      YOU JUST LOOSE YOUR TIME ON EARTH.


                      > If you want to keep posting I suggest you answer these questions so
                      we know
                      > where you're coming from. At the moment I'm a little confused about
                      1. Your
                      > acceptance of your sexuality and 2. Your motives for posting.

                      I DONT THINK I WILL CONTINUE POSTING, SWIMING AGAIST THE RIVER FLOW IS
                      VERY HARD, FOR ME, FOR YOU AND FOR EVERYONE.

                      GET A LIFE, THATS IT,

                      IF ONE DAY YOU SEE NATURE AND YOU UNDERSTAND MY POSITION, GIVE A CALL:
                      americo_petit@...



                      >
                      > Please clarify.
                      >
                      > Anthony
                      > Moderator
                      > http://www.yahoo.com/group/Exex-gay
                      <http://www.egroups.com/group/Exex-gay>
                      > "There is the illusion that homosexuals only have sex and
                      heterosexuals fall
                      > in love.. Boy George"
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: Erny [mailto:erny6@h...]
                      > Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 9:02 AM
                      > To: Exex-gay@y...
                      > Subject: Re: [Exex-gay] HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE
                      >
                      > Americo....
                      >
                      > I certainly cannot figure you out. Are you trying everything
                      possible
                      > to get out of the fact that you are a gay man who is looking for a
                      way out
                      > of this situation? If so...quit looking at lab rats. We are human
                      beings.
                      > To through out my own morality, as you suggest...is to throw me out.
                      Being
                      > a gay man is a blessing and God, nature, and morality are basic to
                      my life
                      > and I won't be throwing any of those out of the equation.
                      > If you are trying to invade a private sector with nonsense then
                      I would
                      > appreciate that you disengage yourself from this group. If you are
                      trying
                      > to accept yourself as a gay man but are falling into these ignorant
                      traps
                      > that others may be spewing toward you...then we can assist you.
                      Make up
                      > your mind. This group is here to assist those who are struggling.
                      Since
                      > you wrote, quite some time ago, it seems you are trying every avenue
                      to deny
                      > your God given orientation and this will lead you into many
                      difficult realms
                      > that would possibly mess up your life.
                      > But...I digress. I'm sorry, I must agree with David. I find
                      your
                      > posting terribly offensive and very ridiculus. Be true to yourself
                      and stop
                      > wasting your time or ours with these propostorus and erroneous
                      claims.
                      >
                      > Blessings in your search,
                      > Erny
                      >
                      >
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: <americo_petit@y...>
                      > To: <Exex-gay@y...>
                      > Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 2:54 PM
                      > Subject: [Exex-gay] HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE
                      >
                      >
                      > In pure biological terms (forget about morality & religion) It's
                      been
                      > demonstrated in experiment with lab rats that when populations grow,
                      > some male rats change their sexual behaviour and become attracted to
                      > the same gender. Why that happens? Well, Nature., friends, (call it
                      > Lord, God, or whatever, is Nature) It have its own mechanisms to
                      stop
                      > reproduction. The point is why you?, why me?. Why us?, Why we
                      where
                      > selected by nature to stop reproduction?. Why my close friend has a
                      > loving wife, a loving child and a loving life?. That is the point.
                      > Homosexuality in pure biological terms is a mistake, its wrong, sex
                      > is there in your body my dear friend (Penis) with only a single
                      > purpose in life, and that is reproduction. The orgasm and the
                      > pleasure you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a
                      > reward from nature for you to reproduce life on earth. If you deny
                      > your true and ultimate mission in life (in biological terms again)
                      > you are just doing anything here and you deserve to die, in fact,
                      not
                      > being able to reproduce yourself is a way of dying. It means you are
                      > not strong, good enough and you do not deserve to reproduce life on
                      > earth, that is the law of God (of nature) you can see the
                      application
                      > of this law in the animal reign. Weaker animals are just food for
                      > others, those strong animal, those that are able to fight, those are
                      > allowed to reproduce. But we humans changed the rules, we help the
                      > elder and keep them alive while Nature do the opposite, We cure
                      > children who were born with inherited diseases, Nature do the
                      > opposite. Animals with inherited diseases do not have the reward of
                      > reproduction. So do we have to overcome homosexuality?. It is up to
                      > you, but at least, as males with penis within our legs, we should
                      > find the proper female to have a baby with, if you do so then Men
                      you
                      > just accomplished your mission on earth.
                      >
                      > I respect your believes, but penis with penis or penis with ass,
                      > doesn't make any sense for Nature, that is my point, I would like to
                      > listen to your suggestions.
                      >
                      > Sorry my English
                      >
                      > Thanks
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
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                      > Ex-exgays-unsubscribe@egroups.com
                      >
                      >
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                    • eswie55@hotmail.com
                      Dear Americo, apart from penis I have got brains and something what people call the soul and I am definitely not looking for examples and inspirations in the
                      Message 10 of 14 , Aug 13, 2001
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                        Dear Americo,

                        apart from "penis" I have got brains and something what people call
                        the soul and I am definitely not looking for examples and
                        inspirations in the ZOO - my ancestors made this important step
                        forward centuries ago. First I felt angry with your comments but then
                        I realised what your dreams and feelings must look like and you know
                        what - it´s a waste of energy to feel angry in that case. I really
                        feel sorry for you. Stay in peace - Genek -(not looking at reality
                        through his penis)
                      • lincolnrep@aol.com
                        Kapitano: There is no need to argue with the poor soul. He s admitted he s not gay. He clearly has no idea what he s talking about. And from what he writes
                        Message 11 of 14 , Aug 13, 2001
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Kapitano:
                          There is no need to argue with the poor soul. He's admitted he's not gay.
                          He clearly has no idea what he's talking about. And from what he writes it
                          is clear that he's obsessed with sex. I for one intend to ignore any further
                          postings from this person and humbly suggest that the moderator not allow any
                          more of his ignorant rantings to be exposed to the rest of us.
                          Lee
                        • Anthony Venn-Brown
                          Americo’s post certainly gained responses. One thing that surprised me was the lack of praise of anal sex. I was waiting for someone to do it. It’s
                          Message 12 of 14 , Aug 16, 2001
                          • 0 Attachment

                            Americo’s post certainly gained responses.

                             

                            One thing that surprised me was the lack of praise of anal sex.  I was waiting for someone to do it.

                             

                            It’s obvious that Americo has dropped his bundle and run but his posting has highlighted an important issue.  

                             

                            Male to male sex. Is it unnatural?

                             

                            I used to think it was unnatural too, Americo for a number of reasons.

                             

                            1. I was the product of a society that only championed reproductive sex.
                            2. I’d been raped by a man when I was sixteen and never saw anal sex as a love making experience between two individuals but an experience of violation and pain.
                            3. I, like many in society, saw the anus as dirty and therefore not a sexual organ. ( what a ridiculous thought to separate the penis and anus.  They both have a function of releasing waste from the body)
                            4. I had never had the experience, sorry the ecstasy, of giving to the one you love and having your man on top of you and inside you, telling you how much he loves. (phew……I getting hot at the thought.)

                             

                            Americo’s post demonstrates a lack of understanding and experience.  Hoping he experiences the transformation.

                             

                            Anthony

                            Moderator

                            http://www.yahoo.com/group/Exex-gay

                            "There is the illusion that homosexuals only have sex and heterosexuals fall in love..  Boy George"

                             

                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: lincolnrep@... [mailto:lincolnrep@...]
                            Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2001 8:31 AM
                            To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [Exex-gay] HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE

                             

                            Friends:
                               Americo sent us his incredible maundering that "orgasm and the pleasure
                            you receive in your brain through your penis, is just a reward from nature
                            for you to reproduce life on earth."  Of course this is nonsense, but it does
                            deserve to be addressed.  I believe firmly that sex was the first form of
                            entertainment.  Back when there was no television, no movies, no books, there
                            was nohing pleasurable other than (1) the enjoyment of views provided by
                            nature, (2) masturbation, and (3) sexual intercourse.  There were and still
                            are no rules about how to enjoy these three original pleasures and those
                            pleasures remain available to all of us down to this very moment. 
                               In the view of certain religions, homosex is "wrong."  In Americo's view
                            it is "in pure biological terms is a mistake, its wrong" and I'm sure he gets
                            this exceptional notion from what the religious say. I think it's a good idea
                            to examine why religious thought  adopted rules concerning sexual pleasure
                            and in doing so, perhaps we can therapize Americo.  The religious view was
                            necessary in the early days, I suppose, to keep the tribe from dying out and
                            to expand it so that it could hold more territory.  As a result of that view,
                            people were brainwashed to believe that any sex other than procreative sex
                            was "wrong." 
                               Americo confuses the law of God with the laws of nature.  There is no law
                            of nature (i.e., biological imperitive) about using sex only for procreation.
                            Any imperitive that there might be is connected solely to religious thought
                            (i.e., the law of God as announced by men).  By now, the religious command to
                            multipy and replenish the earth has been more than fulfilled -- we now are
                            faced with overpopulation and a resulting famine that will kill off billions
                            of people.
                               Religious thought hasn't had a new thought in at least 2000 years -- this
                            is a mind blower in its own right!  For Americo, the time has come to wake up
                            and smell the coffee, have a new thought, and leave the religion-based
                            brainwash in the ditch, where it belongs.
                               Nature created each of us as we are.  I was born gay, have always been
                            gay, and will die gay.  Being gay is not a matter of choice.  It has never
                            been a matter of choice and it never will be.
                            Lee


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                          • Anthony Venn-Brown
                            Americo you say you are not gay but have same sex attraction. Can you define the difference because I don’t understand Anthony Moderator
                            Message 13 of 14 , Aug 16, 2001
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                              Americo you say you are not gay but have same sex attraction.  Can you define the difference because I don’t understand

                               

                              Anthony

                              Moderator

                              http://www.yahoo.com/group/Exex-gay

                              "There is the illusion that homosexuals only have sex and heterosexuals fall in love..  Boy George"

                               

                              -----Original Message-----
                              From: americo_petit@... [mailto:americo_petit@...]
                              Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2001 1:28 AM
                              To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: [Exex-gay] Re: HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE

                               

                              --- In Exex-gay@y..., "Anthony Venn-Brown" <avb@m...> wrote:

                              > Dear americo
                              >
                              > Can you answer some questions for us so we can gauge where you're
                              coming
                              > from.
                              >
                              > Are you gay?

                              NOP, BUT I DO HAVE SSA

                              >

                            • Anthony Venn-Brown
                              I understand what you’ve said Lee. As moderator I would want to encourage free speech and not block someone like Americo. If there is the occasional crap
                              Message 14 of 14 , Aug 16, 2001
                              • 0 Attachment

                                I understand what you’ve said Lee.  As moderator I would want to encourage free speech and not block someone like Americo.  If there is the occasional crap then we can just hit the delete button.

                                 

                                I don’t think we’ll change his mind but his posting has served a purpose.

                                 

                                1. It awakened a recently quiet group
                                2. It gave people the opportunity to respond and declare their truth.

                                 

                                Both valuable don’t you think?

                                 

                                …….having said that….. if anyone constantly tries to steer the discussion of this group in an inappropriate way then I would have no hesitation in blocking them so we can devote ourselves to more edifying communication. 

                                 

                                How’s that?

                                 

                                Anthony Venn-Brown

                                avb@...

                                http://home.gay.com/avb/delfin.html

                                 

                                -----Original Message-----
                                From: lincolnrep@... [mailto:lincolnrep@...]
                                Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2001 5:49 AM
                                To: Exex-gay@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [Exex-gay] Re: HOMOSEXUALITY AND NATURE

                                 

                                Kapitano:
                                   There is no need to argue with the poor soul.  He's admitted he's not gay.
                                He clearly has no idea what he's talking about.  And from what he writes it
                                is clear that he's obsessed with sex.  I for one intend to ignore any further
                                postings from this person and humbly suggest that the moderator not allow any
                                more of his ignorant rantings to be exposed to the rest of us.
                                Lee


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