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  • Cate
    What are the thoughts on a corset for under a Tudor gown? Yes? No? Maybe? Cate
    Message 1 of 9 , Dec 18, 2007
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      What are the thoughts on a corset for under a Tudor gown? Yes? No?
      Maybe?
      Cate
    • L T
      Yes!, if you want to create a garment that will have a more period fit in the torso. You have to decide if you want to wear the close fitting support
      Message 2 of 9 , Dec 19, 2007
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        Yes!, if you want to create a garment that will have a
        more "period" fit in the torso. You have to decide if
        you want to wear the close fitting support
        undergarment for 6-8 hours and still be able to move
        and dance in it. Once you have a corset you are happy
        with you can use it for other dresses.

        If you are very hesitant about wearing a corset then
        consider adding some light support to the gown bodice
        itself so it fits with a smoother line and don't worry
        about the corset (yet). That might be a good
        compromise if you are still learning how to sew and
        fit garments.

        For example, I have a commercially purchased bodice
        that has light metal strips near the front lacing
        grommet holes which keep the vertical line of the
        bodice front closure relatively stiff and smooth
        (bends a bit with me when I move). The rest of the
        bodice does not have any additional supports but they
        were probably left off since this is a generic
        multisize garment sold to the general public who won't
        be wearing a corset. I bought it in the summer at a
        GNEW and didn't want something too structured to wear
        for court since I knew I would be out fencing most of
        the day and the thought of crawling into a corset when
        hot and tired at days end wasn't appealing. I just
        wanted a decent looking colored bodice to go over a
        long skirt - you know, the standard scadian pseudo ren
        garb. It was one step further along in having some
        better looking garb in my closet.

        If instead I knew I was going to be at an SCA event
        where I wasn't doing a sport, like fencing, I would be
        more interested in wearing a corset for Ren garb
        because it would have time during the day to warm
        against my torso and stretch/flex a smidge. It would
        also affect my posture and movement (plus those hoop
        skirts under the gown are fun to swirl around).

        If you aren't in a rush to make the tudor gown you
        could try making a corset and then wear it under your
        regular street clothes to a dance practice. That would
        give you a chance to see how you move in it and to
        find out if it pulls or pinches at all. If the thought
        of making the tudor gown sounds like enough work then
        add some light support in it and skip the corset (you
        could leave a generous seam allowance in case you want
        to modify the gown later if the material won't mark
        permanently along the seam lines).

        If you are using a dress dummy that is a close
        approximation of "you" then you may want to corset it
        when working on future tudor or ren gowns. I'm not an
        experienced sewer but even I know that wearing
        something underneath that changes your shape and
        posture will have some effect on fitting an
        overgarment.

        If you attend Birka you will most likely find corset
        materials being sold by some merchants and check out
        garb made by others.

        Bryn







        --- Cate <kelley@...> wrote:

        > What are the thoughts on a corset for under a Tudor
        > gown? Yes? No?
        > Maybe?
        > Cate
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        > (Yahoo! ID required)
        >
        > mailto:EndeweardeTailor-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
        >
        >
        >



        ____________________________________________________________________________________
        Be a better friend, newshound, and
        know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
      • Wendi
        I second that! Yes, as someone who sometimes does and sometimes doesn t wear a corset under my Tudor gowns. The line of the bodice is better with a corset,
        Message 3 of 9 , Dec 19, 2007
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          I second that! Yes, as someone who sometimes does and sometimes
          doesn't wear a corset under my Tudor gowns. The line of the bodice is
          better with a corset, it keeps those unsightly bulges and wrinkles
          away and makes you stand and sit much more regally. Good posture is
          enforced. I bought my corset in Bali, it was part of their
          traditional garb, but it is modern. I haven't tried to make my own
          corset. I really like the one I have, since it has enough stretch not
          to strangle. I haven't seen any good corsets for sale in the states,
          unless you go on-line or make your own. If you put enough sturdy
          boning in a bodice, you can get away without one, but I think a good
          corset is an investment, like a hoop skirt, you really don't need more
          than one. Look at castlegardencreations.com they will custom make one
          for you. They also sell hoop skirts, and that chaperone you were
          looking into before.

          http://www.castlegardencreations.com/store.php?crn=73&rn=352&action=show_detail

          http://www.castlegardencreations.com/store.php?crn=72&rn=335&action=show_detail

          Were you thinking of dancing in Tudor style?
          Gwen.

          --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, L T <ladybrynmillar@...> wrote:
          >
          > Yes!, if you want to create a garment that will have a
          > more "period" fit in the torso. You have to decide if
          > you want to wear the close fitting support
          > undergarment for 6-8 hours and still be able to move
          > and dance in it. Once you have a corset you are happy
          > with you can use it for other dresses.
          >
          > If you are very hesitant about wearing a corset then
          > consider adding some light support to the gown bodice
          > itself so it fits with a smoother line and don't worry
          > about the corset (yet). That might be a good
          > compromise if you are still learning how to sew and
          > fit garments.
          >
          > For example, I have a commercially purchased bodice
          > that has light metal strips near the front lacing
          > grommet holes which keep the vertical line of the
          > bodice front closure relatively stiff and smooth
          > (bends a bit with me when I move). The rest of the
          > bodice does not have any additional supports but they
          > were probably left off since this is a generic
          > multisize garment sold to the general public who won't
          > be wearing a corset. I bought it in the summer at a
          > GNEW and didn't want something too structured to wear
          > for court since I knew I would be out fencing most of
          > the day and the thought of crawling into a corset when
          > hot and tired at days end wasn't appealing. I just
          > wanted a decent looking colored bodice to go over a
          > long skirt - you know, the standard scadian pseudo ren
          > garb. It was one step further along in having some
          > better looking garb in my closet.
          >
          > If instead I knew I was going to be at an SCA event
          > where I wasn't doing a sport, like fencing, I would be
          > more interested in wearing a corset for Ren garb
          > because it would have time during the day to warm
          > against my torso and stretch/flex a smidge. It would
          > also affect my posture and movement (plus those hoop
          > skirts under the gown are fun to swirl around).
          >
          > If you aren't in a rush to make the tudor gown you
          > could try making a corset and then wear it under your
          > regular street clothes to a dance practice. That would
          > give you a chance to see how you move in it and to
          > find out if it pulls or pinches at all. If the thought
          > of making the tudor gown sounds like enough work then
          > add some light support in it and skip the corset (you
          > could leave a generous seam allowance in case you want
          > to modify the gown later if the material won't mark
          > permanently along the seam lines).
          >
          > If you are using a dress dummy that is a close
          > approximation of "you" then you may want to corset it
          > when working on future tudor or ren gowns. I'm not an
          > experienced sewer but even I know that wearing
          > something underneath that changes your shape and
          > posture will have some effect on fitting an
          > overgarment.
          >
          > If you attend Birka you will most likely find corset
          > materials being sold by some merchants and check out
          > garb made by others.
          >
          > Bryn
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --- Cate <kelley@...> wrote:
          >
          > > What are the thoughts on a corset for under a Tudor
          > > gown? Yes? No?
          > > Maybe?
          > > Cate
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > > (Yahoo! ID required)
          > >
          > > mailto:EndeweardeTailor-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          ____________________________________________________________________________________
          > Be a better friend, newshound, and
          > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
          http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
          >
        • Cate
          I m thinking of making a Tudor style gown - I have a bunch of black cotton velvet. Gwen - what kind of waist does your gown have? If I m looking at the
          Message 4 of 9 , Dec 20, 2007
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            I'm thinking of making a Tudor style gown - I have a bunch of black
            cotton velvet. Gwen - what kind of waist does your gown have? If
            I'm looking at the pictures right, it seems that the earlier gowns
            have a straight waist, but the later (1540's or so) come to a point
            in the front. Some also seem to have the skirts gathered a bit in
            the back, but straight in the front. Does that make sense?
            Thanks,
            Cate

            --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, "Wendi"
            <lobster_kelaguen@...> wrote:
            >
            > I second that! Yes, as someone who sometimes does and sometimes
            > doesn't wear a corset under my Tudor gowns. The line of the
            bodice is
            > better with a corset, it keeps those unsightly bulges and wrinkles
            > away and makes you stand and sit much more regally. Good posture
            is
            > enforced. I bought my corset in Bali, it was part of their
            > traditional garb, but it is modern. I haven't tried to make my own
            > corset. I really like the one I have, since it has enough stretch
            not
            > to strangle. I haven't seen any good corsets for sale in the
            states,
            > unless you go on-line or make your own. If you put enough sturdy
            > boning in a bodice, you can get away without one, but I think a
            good
            > corset is an investment, like a hoop skirt, you really don't need
            more
            > than one. Look at castlegardencreations.com they will custom make
            one
            > for you. They also sell hoop skirts, and that chaperone you were
            > looking into before.
            >
            > http://www.castlegardencreations.com/store.php?
            crn=73&rn=352&action=show_detail
            >
            > http://www.castlegardencreations.com/store.php?
            crn=72&rn=335&action=show_detail
            >
            > Were you thinking of dancing in Tudor style?
            > Gwen.
            >
            > --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, L T <ladybrynmillar@>
            wrote:
            > >
            > > Yes!, if you want to create a garment that will have a
            > > more "period" fit in the torso. You have to decide if
            > > you want to wear the close fitting support
            > > undergarment for 6-8 hours and still be able to move
            > > and dance in it. Once you have a corset you are happy
            > > with you can use it for other dresses.
            > >
            > > If you are very hesitant about wearing a corset then
            > > consider adding some light support to the gown bodice
            > > itself so it fits with a smoother line and don't worry
            > > about the corset (yet). That might be a good
            > > compromise if you are still learning how to sew and
            > > fit garments.
            > >
            > > For example, I have a commercially purchased bodice
            > > that has light metal strips near the front lacing
            > > grommet holes which keep the vertical line of the
            > > bodice front closure relatively stiff and smooth
            > > (bends a bit with me when I move). The rest of the
            > > bodice does not have any additional supports but they
            > > were probably left off since this is a generic
            > > multisize garment sold to the general public who won't
            > > be wearing a corset. I bought it in the summer at a
            > > GNEW and didn't want something too structured to wear
            > > for court since I knew I would be out fencing most of
            > > the day and the thought of crawling into a corset when
            > > hot and tired at days end wasn't appealing. I just
            > > wanted a decent looking colored bodice to go over a
            > > long skirt - you know, the standard scadian pseudo ren
            > > garb. It was one step further along in having some
            > > better looking garb in my closet.
            > >
            > > If instead I knew I was going to be at an SCA event
            > > where I wasn't doing a sport, like fencing, I would be
            > > more interested in wearing a corset for Ren garb
            > > because it would have time during the day to warm
            > > against my torso and stretch/flex a smidge. It would
            > > also affect my posture and movement (plus those hoop
            > > skirts under the gown are fun to swirl around).
            > >
            > > If you aren't in a rush to make the tudor gown you
            > > could try making a corset and then wear it under your
            > > regular street clothes to a dance practice. That would
            > > give you a chance to see how you move in it and to
            > > find out if it pulls or pinches at all. If the thought
            > > of making the tudor gown sounds like enough work then
            > > add some light support in it and skip the corset (you
            > > could leave a generous seam allowance in case you want
            > > to modify the gown later if the material won't mark
            > > permanently along the seam lines).
            > >
            > > If you are using a dress dummy that is a close
            > > approximation of "you" then you may want to corset it
            > > when working on future tudor or ren gowns. I'm not an
            > > experienced sewer but even I know that wearing
            > > something underneath that changes your shape and
            > > posture will have some effect on fitting an
            > > overgarment.
            > >
            > > If you attend Birka you will most likely find corset
            > > materials being sold by some merchants and check out
            > > garb made by others.
            > >
            > > Bryn
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > --- Cate <kelley@> wrote:
            > >
            > > > What are the thoughts on a corset for under a Tudor
            > > > gown? Yes? No?
            > > > Maybe?
            > > > Cate
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > > >
            > > > (Yahoo! ID required)
            > > >
            > > > mailto:EndeweardeTailor-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            _____________________________________________________________________
            _______________
            > > Be a better friend, newshound, and
            > > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
            > http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
            > >
            >
          • L T
            What pictures are you looking at when you refer to the Tudor gown style? Just curious.. The authors of the Tudor Tailor book have a website
            Message 5 of 9 , Dec 20, 2007
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              What pictures are you looking at when you refer to the
              Tudor gown style? Just curious..

              The authors of the Tudor Tailor book have a website
              http://www.kissthefrog.co.uk/wwwtudortailor/

              They now have a few patterns (including a corset
              pattern) on their sales page here:
              http://www.kissthefrog.co.uk/wwwtudortailor/sales.htm

              You can order the Tudor Tailor book from Amazon but it
              takes a few weeks to arrive.

              One image of the back of a gathered skirt in the TT
              book mentions that it has been knife pleated. The
              front is flat to match the bodice front opening. So
              that everything fits together the front of the skirt
              is left flat but the back is pleated so the entire
              skirt waistline will fit to the bodice (and it looks
              pretty). The authors probably have a sewing machine
              with some type of gathering attachment on it (like a
              pleating foot).

              Many English womens gowns were a separate bodice and
              skirt - the skirt in that case would be cartridge
              pleated and attached to a waistband (from what I
              understand). There may be a separate closer fitting
              kirtle underneath. There may also be other skirts.

              One cheat used by some costumers who prefer to avoid
              tedious hand sewing is to use a drapery tape that has
              a couple of sturdy strings already inserted into
              channels. You sew the curtain panel fabric flat onto
              the tape and then with a couple of tugs, instant
              pleated drapes (or in our case, gathered skirt). JoAnn
              and some Mardens stores sell this (or used to the last
              time I checked - at JoAnns check the drapery section
              if it isn't with the rest of the notions). With some
              strategic planning with where the flat and gathered
              parts of the skirt-to-bodice areas will be, this might
              be an easy way to adjust the fit in the back.

              The black cotton velvet you plan to use sounds lovely.


              Bryn

              --- Cate <kelley@...> wrote:

              > I'm thinking of making a Tudor style gown - I have a
              > bunch of black
              > cotton velvet. Gwen - what kind of waist does your
              > gown have? If
              > I'm looking at the pictures right, it seems that the
              > earlier gowns
              > have a straight waist, but the later (1540's or so)
              > come to a point
              > in the front. Some also seem to have the skirts
              > gathered a bit in
              > the back, but straight in the front. Does that make
              > sense?
              > Thanks,
              > Cate
              >
              > --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, "Wendi"
              > <lobster_kelaguen@...> wrote:
              > >
              > > I second that! Yes, as someone who sometimes does
              > and sometimes
              > > doesn't wear a corset under my Tudor gowns. The
              > line of the
              > bodice is
              > > better with a corset, it keeps those unsightly
              > bulges and wrinkles
              > > away and makes you stand and sit much more
              > regally. Good posture
              > is
              > > enforced. I bought my corset in Bali, it was part
              > of their
              > > traditional garb, but it is modern. I haven't
              > tried to make my own
              > > corset. I really like the one I have, since it
              > has enough stretch
              > not
              > > to strangle. I haven't seen any good corsets for
              > sale in the
              > states,
              > > unless you go on-line or make your own. If you
              > put enough sturdy
              > > boning in a bodice, you can get away without one,
              > but I think a
              > good
              > > corset is an investment, like a hoop skirt, you
              > really don't need
              > more
              > > than one. Look at castlegardencreations.com they
              > will custom make
              > one
              > > for you. They also sell hoop skirts, and that
              > chaperone you were
              > > looking into before.
              > >
              > > http://www.castlegardencreations.com/store.php?
              > crn=73&rn=352&action=show_detail
              > >
              > > http://www.castlegardencreations.com/store.php?
              > crn=72&rn=335&action=show_detail
              > >
              > > Were you thinking of dancing in Tudor style?
              > > Gwen.
              > >
              > > --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, L T
              > <ladybrynmillar@>
              > wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Yes!, if you want to create a garment that will
              > have a
              > > > more "period" fit in the torso. You have to
              > decide if
              > > > you want to wear the close fitting support
              > > > undergarment for 6-8 hours and still be able to
              > move
              > > > and dance in it. Once you have a corset you are
              > happy
              > > > with you can use it for other dresses.
              > > >
              > > > If you are very hesitant about wearing a corset
              > then
              > > > consider adding some light support to the gown
              > bodice
              > > > itself so it fits with a smoother line and don't
              > worry
              > > > about the corset (yet). That might be a good
              > > > compromise if you are still learning how to sew
              > and
              > > > fit garments.
              > > >
              > > > For example, I have a commercially purchased
              > bodice
              > > > that has light metal strips near the front
              > lacing
              > > > grommet holes which keep the vertical line of
              > the
              > > > bodice front closure relatively stiff and smooth
              > > > (bends a bit with me when I move). The rest of
              > the
              > > > bodice does not have any additional supports but
              > they
              > > > were probably left off since this is a generic
              > > > multisize garment sold to the general public who
              > won't
              > > > be wearing a corset. I bought it in the summer
              > at a
              > > > GNEW and didn't want something too structured to
              > wear
              > > > for court since I knew I would be out fencing
              > most of
              > > > the day and the thought of crawling into a
              > corset when
              > > > hot and tired at days end wasn't appealing. I
              > just
              > > > wanted a decent looking colored bodice to go
              > over a
              > > > long skirt - you know, the standard scadian
              > pseudo ren
              > > > garb. It was one step further along in having
              > some
              > > > better looking garb in my closet.
              > > >
              > > > If instead I knew I was going to be at an SCA
              > event
              > > > where I wasn't doing a sport, like fencing, I
              > would be
              > > > more interested in wearing a corset for Ren garb
              > > > because it would have time during the day to
              > warm
              > > > against my torso and stretch/flex a smidge. It
              > would
              > > > also affect my posture and movement (plus those
              > hoop
              > > > skirts under the gown are fun to swirl around).
              > > >
              > > > If you aren't in a rush to make the tudor gown
              > you
              > > > could try making a corset and then wear it under
              > your
              > > > regular street clothes to a dance practice. That
              > would
              > > > give you a chance to see how you move in it and
              > to
              > > > find out if it pulls or pinches at all. If the
              > thought
              > > > of making the tudor gown sounds like enough work
              > then
              > > > add some light support in it and skip the corset
              > (you
              > > > could leave a generous seam allowance in case
              > you want
              > > > to modify the gown later if the material won't
              > mark
              > > > permanently along the seam lines).
              > > >
              > > > If you are using a dress dummy that is a close
              > > > approximation of "you" then you may want to
              > corset it
              > > > when working on future tudor or ren gowns. I'm
              > not an
              > > > experienced sewer but even I know that wearing
              > > > something underneath that changes your shape and
              > > > posture will have some effect on fitting an
              > > > overgarment.
              > > >
              > > > If you attend Birka you will most likely find
              > corset
              > > > materials being sold by some merchants and check
              > out
              > > > garb made by others.
              > > >
              > > > Bryn
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > --- Cate <kelley@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > > What are the thoughts on a corset for under a
              > Tudor
              > > > > gown? Yes? No?
              > > > > Maybe?
              > > > > Cate
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > > > >
              > > > > (Yahoo! ID required)
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > mailto:EndeweardeTailor-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              >
              === message truncated ===



              ____________________________________________________________________________________
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            • Cate
              I was looking at some by Holbein and others of King Henry s daughters and wives. Your skill at sewing far exceeds mine. I need a dictionary just to understand
              Message 6 of 9 , Dec 20, 2007
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                I was looking at some by Holbein and others of King Henry's
                daughters and wives.

                Your skill at sewing far exceeds mine. I need a dictionary just to
                understand what you're referring to, Bryn. I have to keep it very
                simple, but thanks. :-)
                Cate

                --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, L T <ladybrynmillar@...>
                wrote:
                >
                > What pictures are you looking at when you refer to the
                > Tudor gown style? Just curious..
                >
                > The authors of the Tudor Tailor book have a website
                > http://www.kissthefrog.co.uk/wwwtudortailor/
                >
                > They now have a few patterns (including a corset
                > pattern) on their sales page here:
                > http://www.kissthefrog.co.uk/wwwtudortailor/sales.htm
                >
                > You can order the Tudor Tailor book from Amazon but it
                > takes a few weeks to arrive.
                >
                > One image of the back of a gathered skirt in the TT
                > book mentions that it has been knife pleated. The
                > front is flat to match the bodice front opening. So
                > that everything fits together the front of the skirt
                > is left flat but the back is pleated so the entire
                > skirt waistline will fit to the bodice (and it looks
                > pretty). The authors probably have a sewing machine
                > with some type of gathering attachment on it (like a
                > pleating foot).
                >
                > Many English womens gowns were a separate bodice and
                > skirt - the skirt in that case would be cartridge
                > pleated and attached to a waistband (from what I
                > understand). There may be a separate closer fitting
                > kirtle underneath. There may also be other skirts.
                >
                > One cheat used by some costumers who prefer to avoid
                > tedious hand sewing is to use a drapery tape that has
                > a couple of sturdy strings already inserted into
                > channels. You sew the curtain panel fabric flat onto
                > the tape and then with a couple of tugs, instant
                > pleated drapes (or in our case, gathered skirt). JoAnn
                > and some Mardens stores sell this (or used to the last
                > time I checked - at JoAnns check the drapery section
                > if it isn't with the rest of the notions). With some
                > strategic planning with where the flat and gathered
                > parts of the skirt-to-bodice areas will be, this might
                > be an easy way to adjust the fit in the back.
                >
                > The black cotton velvet you plan to use sounds lovely.
                >
                >
                > Bryn
                >
                > --- Cate <kelley@...> wrote:
                >
                > > I'm thinking of making a Tudor style gown - I have a
                > > bunch of black
                > > cotton velvet. Gwen - what kind of waist does your
                > > gown have? If
                > > I'm looking at the pictures right, it seems that the
                > > earlier gowns
                > > have a straight waist, but the later (1540's or so)
                > > come to a point
                > > in the front. Some also seem to have the skirts
                > > gathered a bit in
                > > the back, but straight in the front. Does that make
                > > sense?
                > > Thanks,
                > > Cate
                > >
                > > --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, "Wendi"
                > > <lobster_kelaguen@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > I second that! Yes, as someone who sometimes does
                > > and sometimes
                > > > doesn't wear a corset under my Tudor gowns. The
                > > line of the
                > > bodice is
                > > > better with a corset, it keeps those unsightly
                > > bulges and wrinkles
                > > > away and makes you stand and sit much more
                > > regally. Good posture
                > > is
                > > > enforced. I bought my corset in Bali, it was part
                > > of their
                > > > traditional garb, but it is modern. I haven't
                > > tried to make my own
                > > > corset. I really like the one I have, since it
                > > has enough stretch
                > > not
                > > > to strangle. I haven't seen any good corsets for
                > > sale in the
                > > states,
                > > > unless you go on-line or make your own. If you
                > > put enough sturdy
                > > > boning in a bodice, you can get away without one,
                > > but I think a
                > > good
                > > > corset is an investment, like a hoop skirt, you
                > > really don't need
                > > more
                > > > than one. Look at castlegardencreations.com they
                > > will custom make
                > > one
                > > > for you. They also sell hoop skirts, and that
                > > chaperone you were
                > > > looking into before.
                > > >
                > > > http://www.castlegardencreations.com/store.php?
                > > crn=73&rn=352&action=show_detail
                > > >
                > > > http://www.castlegardencreations.com/store.php?
                > > crn=72&rn=335&action=show_detail
                > > >
                > > > Were you thinking of dancing in Tudor style?
                > > > Gwen.
                > > >
                > > > --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, L T
                > > <ladybrynmillar@>
                > > wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > Yes!, if you want to create a garment that will
                > > have a
                > > > > more "period" fit in the torso. You have to
                > > decide if
                > > > > you want to wear the close fitting support
                > > > > undergarment for 6-8 hours and still be able to
                > > move
                > > > > and dance in it. Once you have a corset you are
                > > happy
                > > > > with you can use it for other dresses.
                > > > >
                > > > > If you are very hesitant about wearing a corset
                > > then
                > > > > consider adding some light support to the gown
                > > bodice
                > > > > itself so it fits with a smoother line and don't
                > > worry
                > > > > about the corset (yet). That might be a good
                > > > > compromise if you are still learning how to sew
                > > and
                > > > > fit garments.
                > > > >
                > > > > For example, I have a commercially purchased
                > > bodice
                > > > > that has light metal strips near the front
                > > lacing
                > > > > grommet holes which keep the vertical line of
                > > the
                > > > > bodice front closure relatively stiff and smooth
                > > > > (bends a bit with me when I move). The rest of
                > > the
                > > > > bodice does not have any additional supports but
                > > they
                > > > > were probably left off since this is a generic
                > > > > multisize garment sold to the general public who
                > > won't
                > > > > be wearing a corset. I bought it in the summer
                > > at a
                > > > > GNEW and didn't want something too structured to
                > > wear
                > > > > for court since I knew I would be out fencing
                > > most of
                > > > > the day and the thought of crawling into a
                > > corset when
                > > > > hot and tired at days end wasn't appealing. I
                > > just
                > > > > wanted a decent looking colored bodice to go
                > > over a
                > > > > long skirt - you know, the standard scadian
                > > pseudo ren
                > > > > garb. It was one step further along in having
                > > some
                > > > > better looking garb in my closet.
                > > > >
                > > > > If instead I knew I was going to be at an SCA
                > > event
                > > > > where I wasn't doing a sport, like fencing, I
                > > would be
                > > > > more interested in wearing a corset for Ren garb
                > > > > because it would have time during the day to
                > > warm
                > > > > against my torso and stretch/flex a smidge. It
                > > would
                > > > > also affect my posture and movement (plus those
                > > hoop
                > > > > skirts under the gown are fun to swirl around).
                > > > >
                > > > > If you aren't in a rush to make the tudor gown
                > > you
                > > > > could try making a corset and then wear it under
                > > your
                > > > > regular street clothes to a dance practice. That
                > > would
                > > > > give you a chance to see how you move in it and
                > > to
                > > > > find out if it pulls or pinches at all. If the
                > > thought
                > > > > of making the tudor gown sounds like enough work
                > > then
                > > > > add some light support in it and skip the corset
                > > (you
                > > > > could leave a generous seam allowance in case
                > > you want
                > > > > to modify the gown later if the material won't
                > > mark
                > > > > permanently along the seam lines).
                > > > >
                > > > > If you are using a dress dummy that is a close
                > > > > approximation of "you" then you may want to
                > > corset it
                > > > > when working on future tudor or ren gowns. I'm
                > > not an
                > > > > experienced sewer but even I know that wearing
                > > > > something underneath that changes your shape and
                > > > > posture will have some effect on fitting an
                > > > > overgarment.
                > > > >
                > > > > If you attend Birka you will most likely find
                > > corset
                > > > > materials being sold by some merchants and check
                > > out
                > > > > garb made by others.
                > > > >
                > > > > Bryn
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > --- Cate <kelley@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > > What are the thoughts on a corset for under a
                > > Tudor
                > > > > > gown? Yes? No?
                > > > > > Maybe?
                > > > > > Cate
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > > > > >
                > > > > > (Yahoo! ID required)
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > mailto:EndeweardeTailor-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > >
                > === message truncated ===
                >
                >
                >
                >
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              • L T
                Hi, I m not that experienced with sewing but I have read about different techniques and pay attention to what people are doing to make ren and italian garb.
                Message 7 of 9 , Dec 21, 2007
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                  Hi,

                  I'm not that experienced with sewing but I have read
                  about different techniques and pay attention to what
                  people are doing to make ren and italian garb. I've
                  had to figure for myself how to sew based on what I
                  read and try.

                  Here is an example of the drapery tape
                  http://www.beaconfabric.com/vindex.html?cat221.htm

                  It would likely be found in the drapery section of a
                  sewing store.

                  Here are some different types of pleats
                  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleat

                  Cartridge pleating was used in period (from what I
                  understand).

                  Here is an article on cartridge pleating (by hand)
                  http://www.elizabethancostume.net/cartpleat/

                  and another
                  http://www.extremecostuming.com/articles/cartridgepleating101.html

                  You can see why some people choose to use a modern
                  convenience like drapery tape to have a pleated effect
                  without worrying exactly what type of pleat is used -
                  it gets the job done.

                  I thought it was worth mentioning that short cut
                  sewing trick if it would make it easier for you to
                  decide how to construct your garment. I will probably
                  try using the pleating tape next time I make a
                  gathered skirt if I don't want to try cartridge
                  pleating by hand.

                  Bryn

                  --- Cate <kelley@...> wrote:

                  > I was looking at some by Holbein and others of King
                  > Henry's
                  > daughters and wives.
                  >
                  > Your skill at sewing far exceeds mine. I need a
                  > dictionary just to
                  > understand what you're referring to, Bryn. I have
                  > to keep it very
                  > simple, but thanks. :-)
                  > Cate



                  ____________________________________________________________________________________
                  Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
                  http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
                • Wendi
                  Hi, I never thought of drapery tape, very interesting. I used the Costume Connection Inc. Early Tudor pattern for my dress. They try to be very accurate.
                  Message 8 of 9 , Dec 21, 2007
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                    Hi,
                    I never thought of drapery tape, very interesting.

                    I used the Costume Connection Inc. Early Tudor pattern for my dress.
                    They try to be very accurate. Either waist styles are fine, but I
                    like the waist to come to a point, because I find it more slimming and
                    pleasing to my eye. It is also the more common style, unless you are
                    in Northern Europe, say Germany, Sweden, Finland, etc. The pleating
                    from the back stops several inches before the opening in the center of
                    the top skirt to make the sides of the opening lie flat. Use a very
                    wide fold to give the opening more weight, some ladies also use a wide
                    trim. The opening should reveal the underskirt which is often a
                    sumptuous brocade to contrast with a velvet gown, or vis-versa, which
                    may be matched to an under-sleeve, should you choose that style.

                    There are many wonderful sleeve styles, you know how much I love
                    sleeves! My pattern has four different styles and you are welcomed to
                    borrow it. Just don't follow the two-colored bodice, Tudor style had
                    solid bodices, unless you were say, German and had those nifty laces.

                    Remember that you need enough fabric in your underskirt to be able to
                    get over your hoop skirt. Since the top skirt is usually split, it's
                    not so much of an issue.


                    I have a book that Margaret lent me that has lots of amazing pictures
                    on Tudor gowns. I'll try to remember to bring the book and my pattern
                    to dance practice. I would love to see what kind of underskirt
                    material you will use, you could be so dramatic. Here's a trick used
                    by many Tudor ladies, only use your sumptuous accent material on the
                    part of the underskirt that shows through, the rest is hidden, so can
                    be any less expensive fabric. Don't forget the trim around the
                    neck-line.

                    Gwen.

                    --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, L T <ladybrynmillar@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hi,
                    >
                    > I'm not that experienced with sewing but I have read
                    > about different techniques and pay attention to what
                    > people are doing to make ren and italian garb. I've
                    > had to figure for myself how to sew based on what I
                    > read and try.
                    >
                    > Here is an example of the drapery tape
                    > http://www.beaconfabric.com/vindex.html?cat221.htm
                    >
                    > It would likely be found in the drapery section of a
                    > sewing store.
                    >
                    > Here are some different types of pleats
                    > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleat
                    >
                    > Cartridge pleating was used in period (from what I
                    > understand).
                    >
                    > Here is an article on cartridge pleating (by hand)
                    > http://www.elizabethancostume.net/cartpleat/
                    >
                    > and another
                    > http://www.extremecostuming.com/articles/cartridgepleating101.html
                    >
                    > You can see why some people choose to use a modern
                    > convenience like drapery tape to have a pleated effect
                    > without worrying exactly what type of pleat is used -
                    > it gets the job done.
                    >
                    > I thought it was worth mentioning that short cut
                    > sewing trick if it would make it easier for you to
                    > decide how to construct your garment. I will probably
                    > try using the pleating tape next time I make a
                    > gathered skirt if I don't want to try cartridge
                    > pleating by hand.
                    >
                    > Bryn
                    >
                    > --- Cate <kelley@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > I was looking at some by Holbein and others of King
                    > > Henry's
                    > > daughters and wives.
                    > >
                    > > Your skill at sewing far exceeds mine. I need a
                    > > dictionary just to
                    > > understand what you're referring to, Bryn. I have
                    > > to keep it very
                    > > simple, but thanks. :-)
                    > > Cate
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    ____________________________________________________________________________________
                    > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
                    > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
                    >
                  • Cate
                    It would be intersting to see the book - more pictures never hurts - and I like your suggestion about minimizing the amount of nice fabric needed for the
                    Message 9 of 9 , Dec 21, 2007
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                      It would be intersting to see the book - more pictures never hurts -
                      and I like your suggestion about minimizing the amount of "nice"
                      fabric needed for the underskirt, that helps, too.

                      I hope you have fun singing on Sunday - it sounds like it will be
                      neat.
                      Cate

                      --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, "Wendi"
                      <lobster_kelaguen@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Hi,
                      > I never thought of drapery tape, very interesting.
                      >
                      > I used the Costume Connection Inc. Early Tudor pattern for my
                      dress.
                      > They try to be very accurate. Either waist styles are fine, but I
                      > like the waist to come to a point, because I find it more slimming
                      and
                      > pleasing to my eye. It is also the more common style, unless you
                      are
                      > in Northern Europe, say Germany, Sweden, Finland, etc. The pleating
                      > from the back stops several inches before the opening in the center
                      of
                      > the top skirt to make the sides of the opening lie flat. Use a very
                      > wide fold to give the opening more weight, some ladies also use a
                      wide
                      > trim. The opening should reveal the underskirt which is often a
                      > sumptuous brocade to contrast with a velvet gown, or vis-versa,
                      which
                      > may be matched to an under-sleeve, should you choose that style.
                      >
                      > There are many wonderful sleeve styles, you know how much I love
                      > sleeves! My pattern has four different styles and you are welcomed
                      to
                      > borrow it. Just don't follow the two-colored bodice, Tudor style
                      had
                      > solid bodices, unless you were say, German and had those nifty
                      laces.
                      >
                      > Remember that you need enough fabric in your underskirt to be able
                      to
                      > get over your hoop skirt. Since the top skirt is usually split,
                      it's
                      > not so much of an issue.
                      >
                      >
                      > I have a book that Margaret lent me that has lots of amazing
                      pictures
                      > on Tudor gowns. I'll try to remember to bring the book and my
                      pattern
                      > to dance practice. I would love to see what kind of underskirt
                      > material you will use, you could be so dramatic. Here's a trick
                      used
                      > by many Tudor ladies, only use your sumptuous accent material on the
                      > part of the underskirt that shows through, the rest is hidden, so
                      can
                      > be any less expensive fabric. Don't forget the trim around the
                      > neck-line.
                      >
                      > Gwen.
                      >
                      > --- In EndeweardeTailor@yahoogroups.com, L T <ladybrynmillar@>
                      wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Hi,
                      > >
                      > > I'm not that experienced with sewing but I have read
                      > > about different techniques and pay attention to what
                      > > people are doing to make ren and italian garb. I've
                      > > had to figure for myself how to sew based on what I
                      > > read and try.
                      > >
                      > > Here is an example of the drapery tape
                      > > http://www.beaconfabric.com/vindex.html?cat221.htm
                      > >
                      > > It would likely be found in the drapery section of a
                      > > sewing store.
                      > >
                      > > Here are some different types of pleats
                      > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleat
                      > >
                      > > Cartridge pleating was used in period (from what I
                      > > understand).
                      > >
                      > > Here is an article on cartridge pleating (by hand)
                      > > http://www.elizabethancostume.net/cartpleat/
                      > >
                      > > and another
                      > > http://www.extremecostuming.com/articles/cartridgepleating101.html
                      > >
                      > > You can see why some people choose to use a modern
                      > > convenience like drapery tape to have a pleated effect
                      > > without worrying exactly what type of pleat is used -
                      > > it gets the job done.
                      > >
                      > > I thought it was worth mentioning that short cut
                      > > sewing trick if it would make it easier for you to
                      > > decide how to construct your garment. I will probably
                      > > try using the pleating tape next time I make a
                      > > gathered skirt if I don't want to try cartridge
                      > > pleating by hand.
                      > >
                      > > Bryn
                      > >
                      > > --- Cate <kelley@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > > I was looking at some by Holbein and others of King
                      > > > Henry's
                      > > > daughters and wives.
                      > > >
                      > > > Your skill at sewing far exceeds mine. I need a
                      > > > dictionary just to
                      > > > understand what you're referring to, Bryn. I have
                      > > > to keep it very
                      > > > simple, but thanks. :-)
                      > > > Cate
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      >
                      ______________________________________________________________________
                      ______________
                      > > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
                      > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
                      > >
                      >
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