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Re: [Electronics_101] using welder to zap new life into dead ni-cad batteries

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     Batteries will blow up doing that by a new one ________________________________ From: Reese To: Electronics_101@yahoogroups.com Sent:
    Message 1 of 12 , Dec 1, 2011
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       Batteries will blow up doing that by a new one



      ________________________________
      From: Reese <reeza@...>
      To: Electronics_101@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 12:06 PM
      Subject: Re: [Electronics_101] using welder to zap new life into dead ni-cad batteries



       

      At 10:54 AM 11/30/2011, jongkung01 wrote:

      >Hi electronics fans,
      >
      >
      >Please see this video:
      >
      >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H60xtiY8gXE&feature=youtu.be
      >
      >=====
      >
      >My friend has 3 dead dewalt batteries. I have 1 dead (craftsman)
      >battery. We both would like to try this method...

      I've had both Milwaukee and Ridgid cordless tool batteries go dead. When
      I removed the screws (tamper-resistant in one case), I could clearly see
      that one or more cells had failed insulation on the side and was shorting
      to ground. Attempting to jumpstart such a battery (with a bad cell like
      that) can only end badly. I suggest you do some disassembly yourself and
      see if you still think a jumpstart is advisable, after you've seen what
      the problem is.

      Reese




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • jong kung
      ... There are a lot of people on youtube zapping ni-cad batteries.  None of them says they will blow up.  Have you seen them blow up or have you had that
      Message 2 of 12 , Dec 1, 2011
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        > Batteries will blow up doing that ...



        There are a lot of people on youtube "zapping" ni-cad batteries.  None
        of them says they will blow up.  Have you seen them blow up or have you
        had that experience?



        =====



        > ... by a new one



        That's what me and my friend was trying to avoid.  My friend's DeWalt
        battery is more expensive than some new battery + drill sets.



        My battery is discontinued so I cannot get it even I wanted to spend the money.



        Besides, we are here to learn.  It would be nice if you had a SAFE way to rejuvenate dead batteries.





        Jong





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Rodney Jackson
        Hello Jong. I found the video rather disturbing. Playing with electricity with water on the floor everywhere is Just asking for trouble. Since the pack is
        Message 3 of 12 , Dec 1, 2011
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          Hello Jong. I found the video rather disturbing. Playing with electricity
          with water on the floor everywhere is

          Just asking for trouble. Since the pack is no longer available, are you
          able to access the inside of the case?

          If so, you might find new cells to fit into the case and this will overcome
          the problem. I personally have never had any lasting

          Luck with zapping a battery. A few (2 or 3) uses of the pack and back to
          square one again.



          Rod


          That's what me and my friend was trying to avoid. My friend's DeWalt
          battery is more expensive than some new battery + drill sets.

          My battery is discontinued so I cannot get it even I wanted to spend the
          money.

          Besides, we are here to learn. It would be nice if you had a SAFE way to
          rejuvenate dead batteries.

          Jong

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • orvillefpike
          To me, all the guy is doing is feeding the dead battery with 40 Vdc to 50 Vdc. It doesn t matter if it comes from a 200 Amp welding machine, there won t be
          Message 4 of 12 , Dec 2, 2011
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            To me, all the guy is doing is feeding the dead battery with 40 Vdc to 50 Vdc. It doesn't matter if it comes from a 200 Amp welding machine, there won't be more current flowing.

            --- In Electronics_101@yahoogroups.com, "Rodney Jackson" <rodney.jackson@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            >
            > Hello Jong. I found the video rather disturbing. Playing with electricity
            > with water on the floor everywhere is
            >
            > Just asking for trouble. Since the pack is no longer available, are you
            > able to access the inside of the case?
            >
            > If so, you might find new cells to fit into the case and this will overcome
            > the problem. I personally have never had any lasting
            >
            > Luck with zapping a battery. A few (2 or 3) uses of the pack and back to
            > square one again.
            >
            >
            >
            > Rod
            >
            >
            > That's what me and my friend was trying to avoid. My friend's DeWalt
            > battery is more expensive than some new battery + drill sets.
            >
            > My battery is discontinued so I cannot get it even I wanted to spend the
            > money.
            >
            > Besides, we are here to learn. It would be nice if you had a SAFE way to
            > rejuvenate dead batteries.
            >
            > Jong
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • Frank P
            Jong, Here is a guy that says he has what you need: http://resurrection.uniquedynamics.com/ I don t know, I m a bit skeptical about the claims. Frank P.
            Message 5 of 12 , Dec 2, 2011
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              Jong,
              Here is a guy that says he has what you need:

              http://resurrection.uniquedynamics.com/

              I don't know, I'm a bit skeptical about the claims.

              Frank P.

              --- In Electronics_101@yahoogroups.com, "Rodney Jackson" <rodney.jackson@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              > Hello Jong. I found the video rather disturbing. Playing with electricity
              > with water on the floor everywhere is
              >
              > Just asking for trouble. Since the pack is no longer available, are you
              > able to access the inside of the case?
              >
              > If so, you might find new cells to fit into the case and this will overcome
              > the problem. I personally have never had any lasting
              >
              > Luck with zapping a battery. A few (2 or 3) uses of the pack and back to
              > square one again.
              >
              >
              >
              > Rod
              >
              >
              > That's what me and my friend was trying to avoid. My friend's DeWalt
              > battery is more expensive than some new battery + drill sets.
              >
              > My battery is discontinued so I cannot get it even I wanted to spend the
              > money.
              >
              > Besides, we are here to learn. It would be nice if you had a SAFE way to
              > rejuvenate dead batteries.
              >
              > Jong
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • Andrew Mathison (Alice)
              I recently bought a charger for almost any battery size as long as it s either NICAD or NIMH chemistry. It automatically regenerates any battery with problems
              Message 6 of 12 , Dec 2, 2011
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                I recently bought a charger for almost any battery size as long as it's
                either NICAD or NIMH chemistry. It automatically regenerates any battery
                with problems (not packs) and has recovered most batteries, 15 in all (3 it
                could not recover), that I planned to throw out as my old (recently defunct)
                charger said were all no good..from Active Energy here in Germany..maybe a
                similar one is available where you live..

                Regards

                Andy




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Stefan Trethan
                I looked at that website and also the rambo battery pages. The impression I get is that I would hate his guts if I met this guy (Richard P. Cadway) in
                Message 7 of 12 , Dec 2, 2011
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                  I looked at that website and also the "rambo battery" pages. The
                  impression I get is that I would hate his guts if I met this guy
                  (Richard P. Cadway) in person. He does this stuff, just like we all
                  talk about here and many of us have done, but doesn't really quite
                  understand exactly what he is doing. Now that isn't a problem, nobody
                  knows what he is doing all of the time, but this guy just goes out and
                  makes money from whatever he knows anyway, never mind if he is
                  completely right or not.

                  The information you'll get there you can find for free here and
                  everywhere on the web. I'm certain he is using high current and
                  nothing special.

                  I can't put my finger on it exactly, but I am just left with a strong
                  sense that I would not get along with this person.

                  ST

                  On Fri, Dec 2, 2011 at 6:27 PM, Frank P <qz9090@...> wrote:
                  > Jong,
                  > Here is a guy that says he has what you need:
                  >
                  > http://resurrection.uniquedynamics.com/
                  >
                  > I don't know, I'm a bit skeptical about the claims.
                  >
                  > Frank P.
                  >
                • jong kung
                  ... I don t know, I m a bit skeptical about the claims. I used to have AA battery charger with built-in circuit to keep AA battery from building up internal
                  Message 8 of 12 , Dec 2, 2011
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                    >
                    I don't know, I'm a bit skeptical about the claims.



                    I used to have AA battery charger with built-in circuit to keep AA
                    battery from building up internal resistance.  As far as I know it was
                    ONLY to help PREVENT the battery from going bad.



                    Essentially it wasn't all that complicated.  It would just drain the
                    battery before charging.  I don't know how they work on battery that
                    already built up internal resistance.





                    Jong






                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • jong kung
                    ... 50 Vdc. It doesn t matter ... There could be some sense to this.  I have a smart charger for my NiMH batteries.   But it is too smart.  When I plug in
                    Message 9 of 12 , Dec 2, 2011
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                      > To me, all the guy is doing is feeding the dead


                      > battery with 40 Vdc to
                      50 Vdc. It doesn't matter


                      > if it comes from a 200 Amp welding machine,



                      > there won't be more current flowing.






                      There could be some sense to this.  I have a smart charger for my NiMH
                      batteries.   But it is too smart.  When I plug in my dead batteries
                      (really dead from dis-use for months), the charger senses low / zero
                      voltage and assumes it is internally shorted.  So it doesn't even try to
                      charge it.  When this happens, I plug the AA battery in the old style
                      dumb charger for about 1 minute.  That's enough to give the battery some
                      voltage.  Then when I plug them into the smart charger it goes right
                      into full speed charging mode.





                      There are some batteries that aren't dead but the smart charger refuse
                      to try. But there are batteries that are dead (really dead).  My
                      Craftsman batteries are really dead.  The only charger they gave me is a
                      dumb charger.  It never refuse to charge. 








                      Jong










                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Andrew Mathison (Alice)
                      To me, all the guy is doing is feeding the dead battery with 40 Vdc to 50 Vdc. It doesn t matter if it comes from a 200 Amp welding machine, there won t be
                      Message 10 of 12 , Dec 3, 2011
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                        To me, all the guy is doing is feeding the dead battery with 40 Vdc to 50
                        Vdc. It doesn't matter if it comes from a 200 Amp welding machine, there
                        won't be more current flowing.

                        Absolutely and fully correct, but will everyone here understand why? I doubt
                        it!!

                        Many will still believe that you need a welding outfit!!!! DDDUUUUUHHHHH!

                        Regards

                        Andy




                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • corderbo1
                        I rebuild my battery packs when ever they need it. Some of the cases are harder to open than others but I have always found a way. Once inside, I isolate the
                        Message 11 of 12 , Dec 3, 2011
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                          I rebuild my battery packs when ever they need it. Some of the cases are harder to open than others but I have always found a way. Once inside, I isolate the defective cell and replace it with an identical cell that I purchase from allbattery.com. Measure your old battery cell, Diameter, length, milliamp rating, etc. and you should be able to find a replacement and solder it into place and then put the case back on. Been doing it for years with no problems. I personally think that the "zapping" of batterys to try and clear the short that is killing a cell is dangerous and ill advised.

                          Bob

                          --- In Electronics_101@yahoogroups.com, jong kung <jongkung01@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > > Batteries will blow up doing that ...
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > There are a lot of people on youtube "zapping" ni-cad batteries.  None
                          > of them says they will blow up.  Have you seen them blow up or have you
                          > had that experience?
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > =====
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > > ... by a new one
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > That's what me and my friend was trying to avoid.  My friend's DeWalt
                          > battery is more expensive than some new battery + drill sets.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > My battery is discontinued so I cannot get it even I wanted to spend the money.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Besides, we are here to learn.  It would be nice if you had a SAFE way to rejuvenate dead batteries.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Jong
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                        • Stefan Trethan
                          Good advise, rebuilding can often result in a better-than-new pack and is much more worthwhile than this zapping business. Soldering cells without tabs is
                          Message 12 of 12 , Dec 3, 2011
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                            Good advise, rebuilding can often result in a better-than-new pack and
                            is much more worthwhile than this zapping business.

                            Soldering cells without tabs is problematic because it can easily
                            damage the rubber seal on the positive end. This is not immediately
                            apparent but the cell will not live long. After a time you can usually
                            notice greenish or white crystals around where cells seals are
                            leaking. Probably you used tabbed cells so that would not be an issue.
                            I have made a spot welder for welding cells, it is very easy to make
                            from an old microwave oven transformer. With that you can weld to any
                            type of cell, even button cells which must never ever be soldered to
                            directly, they really do explode.

                            If one cell in a pack is already dead, I would not be inclined to
                            change just that, there are likely others that are already weakening
                            unless this is a new pack with a factory defective cell. However a
                            complete set of high quality cells may cost as much as a replacement
                            battery so it is not a cheap option to change them all.

                            ST

                            On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 10:21 PM, corderbo1 <corderbo@...> wrote:
                            > I rebuild my battery packs when ever they need it.  Some of the cases are harder to open than others but I have always found a way.  Once inside, I isolate the defective cell and replace it with an identical cell that I purchase from allbattery.com.  Measure your old battery cell, Diameter, length, milliamp rating, etc. and you should be able to find a replacement and solder it into place and then put the case back on.  Been doing it for years with no problems.  I personally think that the "zapping" of batterys to try and clear the short that is killing a cell is dangerous and ill advised.
                            >
                            > Bob
                            >
                            > --- In Electronics_101@yahoogroups.com, jong kung <jongkung01@...> wrote:
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> > Batteries will blow up doing that ...
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> There are a lot of people on youtube "zapping" ni-cad batteries.  None
                            >> of them says they will blow up.  Have you seen them blow up or have you
                            >> had that experience?
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> =====
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> > ... by a new one
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> That's what me and my friend was trying to avoid.  My friend's DeWalt
                            >> battery is more expensive than some new battery + drill sets.
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> My battery is discontinued so I cannot get it even I wanted to spend the money.
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> Besides, we are here to learn.  It would be nice if you had a SAFE way to rejuvenate dead batteries.
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> Jong
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >>
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > ------------------------------------
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