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Re: No wonder Harold did a lot of editing!

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  • prometheus_973
    Hi Leigh, Actually I have looked at the Eckankar.org site and saw that there are only five Twitchell books listed for sale. The Shariyats 1 & 2, The Tiger s
    Message 1 of 13 , Dec 15, 2005
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      Hi Leigh,
      Actually I have looked at the Eckankar.org site and saw that there
      are only five Twitchell books listed for sale. The Shariyats 1 & 2,
      The Tiger's Fang, Stranger by the River, and Eckankar The Key to
      Secret Worlds. I didn't include The newer Tiger's Fang comic book...
      which is probably a more accurate category for Twitch's
      manuscript! : )

      The other non-Klemp ECK books seem to be written by Mary Carroll
      Moore, Linda C. Anderson, and Debbie Johnson. So, it does seem like
      Klemp has been doing some house cleaning on a gradual basis as
      to "ween off" and Not to shock Eckists too much.

      The purpose in keeping "Stranger by the River" is that it helps to
      verify (supposedly) the existance of Rebazar Tarzs. And, RT
      validates Twitch who validates Gross who validates Klemp and then RT
      re-validates Klemp again!

      Plus, let's not forget that the Holy Books of Eckankar, the
      Shariyats, are written by Twitchell. Klemp, and those who may come
      after him, can only add to these with their own Shariyats or edit
      Twitchell's ... more. However, I don't see it worth the effort to
      write more Shariyats when Eckists seem fine with reading between the
      lines to find their own version of (inner) truth regardless of what
      Klemp tries to sell them on the outer.

      Yes, Eckists should question HK's book policy, but the sounds of
      silence pervade as Eckists quietly march in step along a very long
      and very winding road. LOL!

      Prometheus


      l2eigh wrote:

      And,why still use "Stranger by the River" and other books by PT?


      Hi Prometheus:
      It's not just this... why still publish books written by
      people who've left Eckankar or who've been asked to leave (as in the
      case of Patti Simpson)? Whether you consided this practice
      disingenuous or worse it's certainly confusing, and should be
      questionable for that reason alone.

      Leigh
    • mishmisha9
      Hi, Leigh! The word confusing is the key to keeping eckists in the org. Everything is kept mysterious and secret which creates the confusion. The confusion
      Message 2 of 13 , Dec 16, 2005
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        Hi, Leigh!

        The word "confusing" is the key to keeping eckists in the org.
        Everything is kept mysterious and secret which creates the
        confusion. The confusion is justified and deemed okay because it is
        just part of the teachings. When the chela advances, he will
        understand better. Yada, yada! The confusion is just an indication
        that the chela has not advanced enough to "know." So, this validates
        the quite "normal" confusion which in turn makes the chela feel that
        all is right with the teachings in eckankar. The confusion helps to
        control those who question. As to Twitchell's books disappearing,
        well, truly eckists should wonder why they are not available now. It
        would seem that Twitchell's total writings would be of great
        interest and important to the present day teachings in eckankar.
        Certainly something is "rotten in Denmark!"

        Mish

        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "l2eigh"
        <lgrif@m...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        > And,why still use "Stranger by the River" and other books by PT?
        >
        >
        > Hi Prometheus:
        > It's not just this... why still publish books
        written by
        > people who've left Eckankar or who've been asked to leave (as in
        the
        > case of Patti Simpson)? Whether you consided this practice
        disingenuous
        > or worse it's certainly confusing, and should be questionable
        for
        > that reason alone.
        >
        > Leigh
        >
      • prometheus_973
        Hi Mish, It does seem strange that the founder of Eckankar (and modern day prophet/savior), Paul Twitchell, doesn t have all of his books available for sale
        Message 3 of 13 , Dec 16, 2005
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          Hi Mish,

          It does seem strange that the founder of Eckankar (and modern day
          prophet/savior), Paul Twitchell, doesn't have all of his books
          available for sale from the religion that he created! Paul must be
          spinnibg in his grave, or was he cremated? How disappointed he must
          be in little Harry Klemp! All of that Eck donation money for guilted
          staircases and such, but none left to reprint the historical
          beginnings and wisdom of such an advanced spiritual path! <sigh>

          What could be the reasons for Not offering these books? Is it true
          that some of the Paul's early writings might Not "fit" perfectly
          with today's consciousness? But wouldn't Christians want to read
          every word that Jesus had spoken?! Then again, maybe some Christian
          leaders wouldn't want every thought and word of Jesus's shared with
          the world. What would these leaders fear? That the wisdom wouldn't
          apply to the modern world or that people would just be confused by
          unfiltered and unedited wisdom. Maybe the thought would be, Why
          create more confusion for people? Maybe little Harry is thinking,
          Why create more confusion for Eckists? Actually, Klemp is saving
          Eckists from the truth about Twitchell, and the scam of Eckankar.
          For Eckists, ignorance really is bliss! Besides, little Harry would
          be out of a high paying job with great perks if Eckists figured it
          all out too soon!

          Prometheus



          mishmisha wrote:

          The word "confusing" is the key to keeping eckists in the org.
          Everything is kept mysterious and secret which creates the
          confusion. The confusion is justified and deemed okay because it is
          just part of the teachings. When the chela advances, he will
          understand better. Yada, yada! The confusion is just an indication
          that the chela has not advanced enough to "know." So, this validates
          the quite "normal" confusion which in turn makes the chela feel that
          all is right with the teachings in eckankar. The confusion helps to
          control those who question. As to Twitchell's books disappearing,
          well, truly eckists should wonder why they are not available now. It
          would seem that Twitchell's total writings would be of great
          interest and important to the present day teachings in eckankar.
          Certainly something is "rotten in Denmark!"

          Mish
        • ctecvie
          Hello Prometheus, ... *** Little Harry wanted the temple to last till eternity - so maybe he thought some gold couldn t hurt! Perhaps he wanted to set a
          Message 4 of 13 , Dec 17, 2005
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            Hello Prometheus,

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
            <prometheus_973@y...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi Mish,
            >
            > It does seem strange that the founder of Eckankar (and modern day
            > prophet/savior), Paul Twitchell, doesn't have all of his books
            > available for sale from the religion that he created! Paul must be
            > spinnibg in his grave, or was he cremated? How disappointed he
            >must
            > be in little Harry Klemp! All of that Eck donation money for
            >guilted
            > staircases and such, but none left to reprint the historical
            > beginnings and wisdom of such an advanced spiritual path! <sigh>

            *** Little Harry wanted the temple to last till eternity - so maybe
            he thought some gold couldn't hurt! Perhaps he wanted to set a
            monument for himself, in stone, marble, gold and the like! This is
            better as books because books can get lost quite easily -
            discontinue them, burn them, discredit them ... whatever.

            >
            > What could be the reasons for Not offering these books? Is it true
            > that some of the Paul's early writings might Not "fit" perfectly
            > with today's consciousness? But wouldn't Christians want to read
            > every word that Jesus had spoken?! Then again, maybe some
            >Christian
            > leaders wouldn't want every thought and word of Jesus's shared
            >with
            > the world. What would these leaders fear? That the wisdom wouldn't
            > apply to the modern world or that people would just be confused by
            > unfiltered and unedited wisdom. Maybe the thought would be, Why
            > create more confusion for people? Maybe little Harry is thinking,
            > Why create more confusion for Eckists? Actually, Klemp is saving
            > Eckists from the truth about Twitchell, and the scam of Eckankar.
            > For Eckists, ignorance really is bliss! Besides, little Harry
            >would
            > be out of a high paying job with great perks if Eckists figured it
            > all out too soon!

            Yeah - I think PT said things that would not be consistent with the
            course Eckankar is steering today - and this could be embarrassing
            for the leaders (by the way is it Little Harry Himself or rather
            Peter Skelskey who is steering the Eckankar boat?). And imagine how
            embarrassing it would be if suddenly the original version
            of "Letters to Gail" came up! LOL!

            Ingrid
          • l2eigh
            Hi Mish: Oh, I certainly agree that confusing and confusion make up the heart of Eckankar. The dangerous thing is to settle down (accept this), to become
            Message 5 of 13 , Dec 17, 2005
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              Hi Mish:
              Oh, I certainly agree that "confusing" and "confusion" make
              up the heart of Eckankar. The dangerous thing is to "settle down"
              (accept this), to become peaceful and content, carrying this nest of
              emptines and meaninglessness inside you.
              Incidentally, happy holidays to you and everyone on this
              list.

              Leigh



              --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "mishmisha9"
              <mishmisha9@y...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi, Leigh!
              >
              > The word "confusing" is the key to keeping eckists in the org.
              > Everything is kept mysterious and secret which creates the
              > confusion. The confusion is justified and deemed okay because it
              is
              > just part of the teachings. When the chela advances, he will
              > understand better. Yada, yada! The confusion is just an indication
              > that the chela has not advanced enough to "know." So, this
              validates
              > the quite "normal" confusion which in turn makes the chela feel
              that
              > all is right with the teachings in eckankar. The confusion helps
              to
              > control those who question. As to Twitchell's books disappearing,
              > well, truly eckists should wonder why they are not available now.
              It
              > would seem that Twitchell's total writings would be of great
              > interest and important to the present day teachings in eckankar.
              > Certainly something is "rotten in Denmark!"
              >
              > Mish
            • prometheus_973
              Hi Ingrid and All, It seems Klemp can do and say anything without having it questioned by Eckists. But, that s what has always made Eckankar a cult! Klemp
              Message 6 of 13 , Dec 17, 2005
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                Hi Ingrid and All,
                It seems Klemp can do and say anything without having it questioned
                by Eckists. But, that's what has always made Eckankar a cult! Klemp
                eliminates and edits Twitchell's original material while only
                sharing shallow, common place, embellished, or contradicting
                accounts of perceived "spiritual" wisdom.

                In Klemp's 2005 EWWS talk he states, "Enthusiasm is infectious.
                People respond. Missionary work is fun." Yet this is from a person
                who has been employed by Eckankar for 35 years! It's been part of
                his paid job to do missionary work. So once again... talk is a cheap
                commodity for Little Harry. Besides, aren't Eckists supposed to be
                neither for or against anything? Does "enthusiasm" depict detachment
                or contentment? Or, do Eckists just demonstrate or act "as if" they
                have enthusiasm, as well as, love in their hearts?!

                It's funny that Klemp found out that some people at the local Unity
                Church referred to him as "Big" Harry, and he in turn flipped that
                to compare himself to the mythological coal mining hero of "Big"
                John. But I see him more as the mythological thief of "Little" John
                who helped Robin Hood to rob the rich and give to the poor. Instead,
                however, the irony is that Klemp is not a physically large or strong
                man as Little John was, and that Klemp steals from the poor Eckists
                to make himself rich! Therefore, I have thus crowned Shree Klemp as
                Little Harry!



                Ingrid wrote:

                Hello Prometheus,

                Prometheus wrote:
                It does seem strange that the founder of Eckankar (and modern day
                prophet/savior), Paul Twitchell, doesn't have all of his books
                available for sale from the religion that he created! Paul must be
                spinnibg in his grave, or was he cremated? How disappointed he must
                be in little Harry Klemp! All of that Eck donation money for guilted
                staircases and such, but none left to reprint the historical
                beginnings and wisdom of such an advanced spiritual path! <sigh>

                Ingrid: Little Harry wanted the temple to last till eternity - so
                maybe he thought some gold couldn't hurt! Perhaps he wanted to set a
                monument for himself, in stone, marble, gold and the like! This is
                better as books because books can get lost quite easily -
                discontinue them, burn them, discredit them ... whatever.



                *****I think your're correct! Klemp built a monument to himself! How
                could any future LEM/Mahanta deny, edit, or delete this? Hmmmmm.
                Actually, in time Klemp's material, reputation, and works could be
                seen in its true light and easily be reduced to nothing of substance.




                Prometheus: What could be the reasons for Not offering these books?
                Is it true that some of the Paul's early writings might Not "fit"
                perfectly with today's consciousness? But wouldn't Christians want
                to read every word that Jesus had spoken?! Then again, maybe some
                Christian leaders wouldn't want every thought and word of Jesus's
                shared with the world. What would these leaders fear? That the
                wisdom wouldn't apply to the modern world or that people would just
                be confused by unfiltered and unedited wisdom. Maybe the thought
                would be, Why create more confusion for people? Maybe little Harry
                is thinking, Why create more confusion for Eckists? Actually, Klemp
                is saving Eckists from the truth about Twitchell, and the scam of
                Eckankar. For Eckists, ignorance really is bliss! Besides, little
                Harry would be out of a high paying job with great perks if Eckists
                figured it all out too soon!

                Ingrid: Yeah - I think PT said things that would not be consistent
                with the course Eckankar is steering today - and this could be
                embarrassing for the leaders (by the way is it Little Harry Himself
                or rather Peter Skelskey who is steering the Eckankar boat?). And
                imagine how embarrassing it would be if suddenly the original
                version of "Letters to Gail" came up! LOL!


                *****It could be that Joan is doing more steering than Peter! Peter
                is just waiting in the wings and being a yes man and lap dog for
                now. The question for Little Harry and Joan is, Who can be trusted
                Not to do to Klemp that Klemp did to Gross?!

                Prometheus
              • mishmisha9
                Hi, Leigh! Proof of this confusion is readily seen in the posts by eckists on the non-official eck chat sites--if you care to check out Chela Chat and Hu Chat.
                Message 7 of 13 , Dec 17, 2005
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                  Hi, Leigh!

                  Proof of this confusion is readily seen in the posts by eckists on
                  the non-official eck chat sites--if you care to check out Chela Chat
                  and Hu Chat. They seem to have a problem agreeing about what is
                  meant in the teachings! As for karma, eckists, instead of getting
                  rid of it, seem to rope more and more of it in, because they feel
                  they have to deal with certain situations/relationships instead of
                  saying "I pass." LOL! Many struggle hanging in unhealthy
                  relationships because they are looking for the higher meaning of it
                  all--and try to make something work that is too badly broken to
                  begin with. I believe that eckists are taught to be delusional more
                  than any other thing and this is what they are "learning from the
                  teachings!" LOL! Too bad they won't read Ford Johnson's
                  book "Confessions of a God Seeker" so that a light bulb might be
                  turned on in their muddled minds. It's really sad. This also applies
                  to those former eckists who continue to cling to the "truths" they
                  learned in eckankar--they still want to believe that they evolved
                  because of those special eck teachings! The truth is (IMO) that they
                  will not evolve until they let go of this delusional eck thinking--
                  and until they accept the fact they were duped by the
                  false/deceptive teachings in eckankar, these individuals will also
                  continue to operate in a delusional state of consciousness
                  and remain stuck, much like the eckists who remain trapped in
                  eckankar right now.

                  Happy Holidays to you too, and of course to everyone else who
                  participates by posting and/or reading here!

                  Mish

                  --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "l2eigh"
                  <lgrif@m...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi Mish:
                  > Oh, I certainly agree that "confusing" and "confusion"
                  make
                  > up the heart of Eckankar. The dangerous thing is to "settle down"
                  > (accept this), to become peaceful and content, carrying this nest
                  of
                  > emptines and meaninglessness inside you.
                  > Incidentally, happy holidays to you and everyone on this
                  > list.
                  >
                  > Leigh
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "mishmisha9"
                  > <mishmisha9@y...> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hi, Leigh!
                  > >
                  > > The word "confusing" is the key to keeping eckists in the org.
                  > > Everything is kept mysterious and secret which creates the
                  > > confusion. The confusion is justified and deemed okay because it
                  > is
                  > > just part of the teachings. When the chela advances, he will
                  > > understand better. Yada, yada! The confusion is just an
                  indication
                  > > that the chela has not advanced enough to "know." So, this
                  > validates
                  > > the quite "normal" confusion which in turn makes the chela feel
                  > that
                  > > all is right with the teachings in eckankar. The confusion helps
                  > to
                  > > control those who question. As to Twitchell's books
                  disappearing,
                  > > well, truly eckists should wonder why they are not available
                  now.
                  > It
                  > > would seem that Twitchell's total writings would be of great
                  > > interest and important to the present day teachings in eckankar.
                  > > Certainly something is "rotten in Denmark!"
                  > >
                  > > Mish
                  >
                • ctecvie
                  Hello Mish, ... *** Today, we met an eckist who has brought quite some members to Eckankar. He is confused, too, because he has been a member for 24 years now
                  Message 8 of 13 , Dec 18, 2005
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                    Hello Mish,

                    --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "mishmisha9"
                    <mishmisha9@y...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hi, Leigh!
                    >
                    > Proof of this confusion is readily seen in the posts by eckists on
                    > the non-official eck chat sites--if you care to check out Chela
                    >Chat
                    > and Hu Chat.

                    *** Today, we met an eckist who has brought quite some members to
                    Eckankar. He is confused, too, because he has been a member for 24
                    years now and really has done more than his share - but still no 5th
                    initiation. The thing is that he isn't very complying to the
                    guidelines, has never sent in any initiation reports and such. He
                    knows that he doesn't fit and that this is why. He was excluded from
                    vahana work by the resas. He said that some months ago, he had seen
                    that a postering workshop was planned and asked himself why he was
                    not asked because that was what he had been doing for 20 years or
                    so. Well, he is still very much into the "higher/lower/master"
                    stuff, but we have given him the website address for background
                    information about Eckankar.

                    > They seem to have a problem agreeing about what is
                    > meant in the teachings! As for karma, eckists, instead of getting
                    > rid of it, seem to rope more and more of it in, because they feel
                    > they have to deal with certain situations/relationships instead of
                    > saying "I pass." LOL! Many struggle hanging in unhealthy
                    > relationships because they are looking for the higher meaning of
                    >it
                    > all--and try to make something work that is too badly broken to
                    > begin with.

                    *** That's the point - they think that they are resolving karma but
                    instead are staying in unhealthy situations because they think it
                    has to be that way. The power we have is to decide whether we want
                    to stay or leave to look for other, better circumstances to learn
                    what we have to learn. Of course we "run away" - but I firmly
                    believe that this "running away" is very often very helpful. For me
                    anyway, as this enabled me to eventually see that what I ran from
                    was in fact the same problem every time. Had I stayed where I was, I
                    never would have been able to realize this.

                    >I believe that eckists are taught to be delusional more
                    > than any other thing and this is what they are "learning from the
                    > teachings!" LOL! Too bad they won't read Ford Johnson's
                    > book "Confessions of a God Seeker" so that a light bulb might be
                    > turned on in their muddled minds. It's really sad.

                    *** The Eckist I spoke of wanted to know in one sentence what Ford's
                    book was all about. No way to tell him in one sentence! It's even
                    not possible to describe Eckankar in one sentence. I finally broke
                    it down to "I can have all the love and protection I need without
                    the mahanta".

                    >This also applies
                    > to those former eckists who continue to cling to the "truths" they
                    > learned in eckankar--they still want to believe that they evolved
                    > because of those special eck teachings! The truth is (IMO) that
                    >they
                    > will not evolve until they let go of this delusional eck thinking--
                    > and until they accept the fact they were duped by the
                    > false/deceptive teachings in eckankar, these individuals will also
                    > continue to operate in a delusional state of consciousness
                    > and remain stuck, much like the eckists who remain trapped in
                    > eckankar right now.

                    ***They are still stuck in that higher/lower thinking. Just as this
                    Eckist said that a certain tincture he is making comes from
                    the "highest and purest" source. I told him that it was highest and
                    purest because his heart was in it. So weird, at least for me, to
                    think that there is a "highest" out there whereas we can find it in
                    our own heart if we are pure and honest!
                    >
                    > Happy Holidays to you too, and of course to everyone else who
                    > participates by posting and/or reading here!

                    *** Happy Holidays to all, too!
                    Ingrid
                  • prometheus_973
                    Hi Mish, The problem that many Eckists have, with reading Ford s book Confessions, is that they are fearful of the book and believe that words which
                    Message 9 of 13 , Dec 18, 2005
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                      Hi Mish,

                      The problem that many Eckists have, with reading Ford's
                      book "Confessions," is that they are fearful of the book and believe
                      that words which criticize Eckankar are negative. Therefore, why
                      would someone, an Eckist, that is so pure, positive, and spiritual
                      <smile> want to expose theirself to negativity? They forget,
                      however, that negativity surrounds them and all of us, and that one
                      should not deny it exists. Negativity (conflict) is a means to
                      personal and spiritual growth... is it not?

                      Many current Eckists who have "read" Confessions of a God Seeker
                      actually did a speed read because of their fear. They feared that
                      doubt would enter their minds and that Eckankar would not be able to
                      withstand the scruntiny of truth which they have denied seeing and
                      questioning over the years. Therefore, these Eckists (and some
                      former Eckists) did a "Paul Twitchell" and skimmed Confessions, but
                      did so with a closed or semi-closed mind. People, in general, are
                      fearful of change and of having comfortable delusions and
                      rationalizations shattered. Eckankar, and religion in general, is
                      like having your own private and indestructible "spiritual" security
                      blanket. Yours keeps you safe, it's always better than the next
                      person's, you are always farther along with a personal relationship
                      with the Inner (Whatever), or can see from a higher perspective...
                      right?! This is simply how our minds (and egos) work and there are
                      those who take advantage of this.

                      Paul Twitchell was not unique when we look at history. There are
                      thousands and thousands of con men and women doing their own unique
                      scam at any given moment! This has always been the case! Some of
                      these people even have good intentions, at times, but what they sell
                      is what they can see we all want and need. Is it any wonder that
                      both financial and spiritual security (peace of mind) is such big
                      business!

                      Happy Holidays Everyone!

                      Prometheus




                      mishmisha wrote:
                      Hi Leigh,
                      Proof of this confusion is readily seen in the posts by eckists on
                      the non-official eck chat sites--if you care to check out Chela Chat
                      and Hu Chat. They seem to have a problem agreeing about what is
                      meant in the teachings! As for karma, eckists, instead of getting
                      rid of it, seem to rope more and more of it in, because they feel
                      they have to deal with certain situations/relationships instead of
                      saying "I pass." LOL!

                      Many struggle hanging in unhealthy relationships because they are
                      looking for the higher meaning of it all--and try to make something
                      work that is too badly broken to begin with. I believe that eckists
                      are taught to be delusional more than any other thing and this is
                      what they are "learning from the teachings!" LOL!

                      Too bad they won't read Ford Johnson's book "Confessions of a God
                      Seeker" so that a light bulb might be turned on in their muddled
                      minds. It's really sad. This also applies to those former eckists
                      who continue to cling to the "truths" they learned in eckankar--they
                      still want to believe that they evolved because of those special eck
                      teachings!

                      The truth is (IMO) that they will not evolve until they let go of
                      this delusional eck thinking--and until they accept the fact they
                      were duped by the false/deceptive teachings in eckankar, these
                      individuals will also continue to operate in a delusional state of
                      consciousness and remain stuck, much like the eckists who remain
                      trapped in eckankar right now.

                      Happy Holidays to you too, and of course to everyone else who
                      participates by posting and/or reading here!

                      Mish
                    • prometheus_973
                      Hi Ingrid, It seems that this Eckist doesn t understand his place in the hierarchy. Under the RESA structure one must be a team member and follow the rules
                      Message 10 of 13 , Dec 18, 2005
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                        Hi Ingrid,
                        It seems that this Eckist doesn't understand his place in the
                        hierarchy. Under the RESA structure one must be a team member and
                        follow the rules (spoken and unspoken), know the Mahanta's mission,
                        but especially comply with the written guidelines. Does he know
                        there are even guidelines for postering? I was quite an enthusiastic
                        vahana at one time, but eventually mellowed when I continuously saw
                        the overwhelming flaws. How could such flaws exist in H.I. chelas
                        and the Eckankar org if this was the highest spiritual path in all
                        of the universes of Sugmad?! This was very confusing, didn't make
                        sense, and caused me a lot of conflict! This chela (a 4th?) will
                        never be trusted with a higher initiation if he cannot work within
                        or understand the RESA structure. The standards are much stricter
                        for today's Eckists than in the past. However, this is the big
                        problem with Eckankar... all of those old timer H.I.s that reject
                        the Guidelines! I don't blame them! Eckankar has become very
                        controlling, narrow of focus, and a top heavy business (religion)!
                        And, that glass ceiling of initiation (the 7th) is starting to show
                        more cracks! LOL!

                        Prometheus


                        Ingrid wrote:

                        Today, we met an eckist who has brought quite some members to
                        Eckankar. He is confused, too, because he has been a member for 24
                        years now and really has done more than his share - but still no 5th
                        initiation. The thing is that he isn't very complying to the
                        guidelines, has never sent in any initiation reports and such. He
                        knows that he doesn't fit and that this is why. He was excluded from
                        vahana work by the resas. He said that some months ago, he had seen
                        that a postering workshop was planned and asked himself why he was
                        not asked because that was what he had been doing for 20 years or
                        so. Well, he is still very much into the "higher/lower/master"
                        stuff, but we have given him the website address for background
                        information about Eckankar.

                        The Eckist I spoke of wanted to know in one sentence what Ford's
                        book was all about. No way to tell him in one sentence! It's even
                        not possible to describe Eckankar in one sentence. I finally broke
                        it down to "I can have all the love and protection I need without
                        the mahanta".

                        They are still stuck in that higher/lower thinking. Just as this
                        Eckist said that a certain tincture he is making comes from
                        the "highest and purest" source. I told him that it was highest and
                        purest because his heart was in it. So weird, at least for me, to
                        think that there is a "highest" out there whereas we can find it in
                        our own heart if we are pure and honest!

                        Happy Holidays to all, too!

                        Ingrid
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