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Filling the Void

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  • Freefrom
    Hi all and Prometheus, in one of your previous posts you stated something to the effect that those in eckankar can t let it go because they would have to then
    Message 1 of 5 , Oct 5, 2005
      Hi all and Prometheus,

      in one of your previous posts you stated something to the
      effect that those in eckankar can't let it go because they would have
      to then experience a void or shall we say an emptiness with the
      absence of the org to believe in. YOu said that staring into the void
      was really becoming aware that the void is you as Soul.

      At times this has been my experience too but in a slightly different
      way, in that there is a void or emptiness often discussed in other
      forms of mysticism where there is a paradox. The emtiness is also
      experienced as the ultimate fullness. What most eckist in transition
      are really experiencing as well is a grieving process that can at
      times bring up sadness as well as fear and irritability etc.. WHen the
      process is not resisted or there is a simply being with what is as it
      is then sometimes the authentic realization can peek through, at least
      in my experience. Accepting feelings as human and spiritual is also
      for me a very important truth.

      The problem I have with Ford's book, is that the second half is his
      attempt to fill the void that arises from the realization that
      eckankar is a fraudulent religion. Some of his ideas may be ok, but
      then I find myself back into having to learn new affirmations and the
      HCS way of talking, just as in eckankar there was eck talk that one
      had to learn in order to fit in. I think IMO that Ford would do much
      better if he became more eclectic and less "teachy" and stay as far
      away from Betty and Mario types and their conspiracy dogma as
      possible. I believe that there is a rather nasty post from Betty about
      Graham F. and the fact that he was questioning some of Fords spiritual
      excercises, kind of like, "how dare he!".

      Don't get me wrong. I feel that Ford is a brave soul and most of the
      book is great. But the second half of the book and what comes across
      the HCS BB is not the next step necessarily, IMO. A lot of it is sort
      of like Science of Mind or Church of Religious Science etc. Some of it
      I like and some of it I don't really care for. The freedom for me is
      to pick and choose and compare without having that cult feeling of
      oppression hanging over me. Just some thoughts.

      Freefrom
    • mishmisha9
      Hi, Freefrom! I like what you say here and agree! The thing about Ford that I feel is the most important is his book--the first part of it!! The rest of it is
      Message 2 of 5 , Oct 5, 2005
        Hi, Freefrom!

        I like what you say here and agree! The thing about Ford that I feel
        is the most important is his book--the first part of it!! The rest
        of it is interesting. I think he felt compelled to offer suggestions
        on what the next step could be for those of us who have left a
        religious teaching, in particular Eckankar. He felt that ex-eckists
        would feel that void and would want some guidance as they shed the
        effects and recover from the eck experience. He goes into a lot of
        detail and offers ways that work for him in developing spiritual
        exercises. I was not interested much in his affirmations, nice as
        they seem, because they are not my words and I was not comfortable
        trying to say them. The same thing with his spiritual exercises. He
        does say that these are only suggestions that work for him right
        now, and that one can develop something differently that will work
        for oneself. So, I am trying to construct my own thing-- I don't
        feel I need or desire to even model it after Ford's or anyone
        else's. In order to recognize myself as my own inner master, I have
        to free myself from the suggestions that come from others as well
        intended as they might be. I do like hearing what others do, and I
        might adapt something for myself, but if I copy exactly--well, I
        would not be listening to my inner self, but instead I would be
        paying attention to someone else's. That would be a false path to
        follow, in my opinion.

        But there is a certain comaraderie in discussion groups, such as
        here and also on BBs like Ford's. We can learn from each other as
        well as have fun. I have to admit that I enjoy the humorous posts--
        makes it fun too!

        I certainly do not know what Ford's vision is for HCS, but I
        continue to support him in part because of the importance of his
        book. "Confessions" needs to be kept alive for others to read in
        order to see the truth about eckankar. There is no other book like
        it that will affect those eckists who are searching for answers
        about PT and Eckankar. However, I do agree about the second half of
        the book--that it does seem to steer people into maintaining the
        course when change is actually what is needed in order to move on. I
        am interested in reading Ford's next book which I thought would be
        published by now. I figure that he will make it more clear as to his
        intentions and goals for HCS in it. At least I might understand him
        better after reading it, I hope!

        I agree too that there have been many posters who have put up a lot
        of nonsense on Ford's BBs. They persist in keeping it going, and I
        also believe that they keep people away who might have made the BBs
        much more sane and sensible. The free range that is allowed for
        anyone and everyone for the most part has made TS and HCS look
        really peculiar at times. I don't think many good posters remain
        there as was in the beginning. The like-mindedness that seems to
        exist there is not something I would like to be associated with at
        all! And that is why I don't participate any longer on those BBs. It
        became too nutty, nasty and rude!

        So, yes, I agree with your points here very strongly, but I also
        want to continue to encourage people to read the first part
        of "Confessions of a God Seeker."

        By the way, did you notice Mario's recent post on TS? TS posted an
        interesting response. : ) Too funny!

        I have reposted a couple of James Davis' posts from Ford's BBs,
        because many eckists do not know that he left eckankar and those who
        are aware that he left do not know his reasons.

        Mish




        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Freefrom"
        <eckchains@y...> wrote:
        > Hi all and Prometheus,
        >
        > in one of your previous posts you stated something to the
        > effect that those in eckankar can't let it go because they would
        have
        > to then experience a void or shall we say an emptiness with the
        > absence of the org to believe in. YOu said that staring into the
        void
        > was really becoming aware that the void is you as Soul.
        >
        > At times this has been my experience too but in a slightly
        different
        > way, in that there is a void or emptiness often discussed in other
        > forms of mysticism where there is a paradox. The emtiness is also
        > experienced as the ultimate fullness. What most eckist in
        transition
        > are really experiencing as well is a grieving process that can at
        > times bring up sadness as well as fear and irritability etc.. WHen
        the
        > process is not resisted or there is a simply being with what is as
        it
        > is then sometimes the authentic realization can peek through, at
        least
        > in my experience. Accepting feelings as human and spiritual is also
        > for me a very important truth.
        >
        > The problem I have with Ford's book, is that the second half is his
        > attempt to fill the void that arises from the realization that
        > eckankar is a fraudulent religion. Some of his ideas may be ok, but
        > then I find myself back into having to learn new affirmations and
        the
        > HCS way of talking, just as in eckankar there was eck talk that one
        > had to learn in order to fit in. I think IMO that Ford would do
        much
        > better if he became more eclectic and less "teachy" and stay as far
        > away from Betty and Mario types and their conspiracy dogma as
        > possible. I believe that there is a rather nasty post from Betty
        about
        > Graham F. and the fact that he was questioning some of Fords
        spiritual
        > excercises, kind of like, "how dare he!".
        >
        > Don't get me wrong. I feel that Ford is a brave soul and most of
        the
        > book is great. But the second half of the book and what comes
        across
        > the HCS BB is not the next step necessarily, IMO. A lot of it is
        sort
        > of like Science of Mind or Church of Religious Science etc. Some
        of it
        > I like and some of it I don't really care for. The freedom for me
        is
        > to pick and choose and compare without having that cult feeling of
        > oppression hanging over me. Just some thoughts.
        >
        > Freefrom
      • prometheus_973
        Hi Freefrom, I m glad you replied to this post. eckchains wrote: Hi all and Prometheus, in one of your previous posts you stated something to the effect that
        Message 3 of 5 , Oct 5, 2005
          Hi Freefrom,

          I'm glad you replied to this post.

          eckchains wrote:
          Hi all and Prometheus,

          in one of your previous posts you stated something to the
          effect that those in eckankar can't let it go because they would have
          to then experience a void or shall we say an emptiness with the
          absence of the org to believe in. YOu said that staring into the void
          was really becoming aware that the void is you as Soul.

          ##### Yes, sometimes the void stares back and this is when one can
          see one's Self and Its freedom.

          At times this has been my experience too but in a slightly different
          way, in that there is a void or emptiness often discussed in other
          forms of mysticism where there is a paradox. The emtiness is also
          experienced as the ultimate fullness. What most eckist in transition
          are really experiencing as well is a grieving process that can at
          times bring up sadness as well as fear and irritability etc.. WHen
          the process is not resisted or there is a simply being with what is
          as it is then sometimes the authentic realization can peek through,
          at least in my experience. Accepting feelings as human and spiritual
          is also for me a very important truth.

          ##### Well said! I agree completely! Sometimes one just needs to let
          go and accept change, and sometimes one has no other real choice
          once the truth is known. Eventually the void is filled in with
          greater knowledge of one's own Beingness and this brings strength.
          People (Eckists) become too comfortable with their discomforts with
          the Eck teachings, but unfortunately see the flaws as being their
          own.

          The problem I have with Ford's book, is that the second half is his
          attempt to fill the void that arises from the realization that
          eckankar is a fraudulent religion. Some of his ideas may be ok, but
          then I find myself back into having to learn new affirmations and the
          HCS way of talking, just as in eckankar there was eck talk that one
          had to learn in order to fit in. I think IMO that Ford would do much
          better if he became more eclectic and less "teachy" and stay as far
          away from Betty and Mario types and their conspiracy dogma as
          possible. I believe that there is a rather nasty post from Betty
          about Graham F. and the fact that he was questioning some of Fords
          spiritual excercises, kind of like, "how dare he!".

          ##### Yes, the first part of Ford's book is great for Eckists to
          read! The second part was interesting, but by that time I was really
          wary about buying into anything else being sold or presented to me.
          I needed some time to regroup and rediscover Me. The B&M crap is
          what really sent Ford's BBs downhill. They had their own agenda
          since day one and they still love preaching it over and over, and
          they always have to be right! It's too bad they never do any real
          research into what they're promoting... very narrow thinking!

          Don't get me wrong. I feel that Ford is a brave soul and most of the
          book is great. But the second half of the book and what comes across
          the HCS BB is not the next step necessarily, IMO. A lot of it is sort
          of like Science of Mind or Church of Religious Science etc. Some of
          it I like and some of it I don't really care for. The freedom for me
          is to pick and choose and compare without having that cult feeling of
          oppression hanging over me. Just some thoughts.

          ##### I have to agree once again! Ford's book was/is a necessary
          step in freeing many Eckists. It's too bad that he didn't have a
          real clear idea for the direction of his BBs. I'm not sure if his
          HCS can be salvaged, or what shape it might take in the future. It's
          difficult to get something going, especially, if one is honest and
          not selling snake oil like so many are now-a-days.

          Prometheus
        • ctecvie
          Hi Freefrom, good observations! ... Exactly. It s a separation, after all! And as you say, the better we are able to deal with this process and not stifle it,
          Message 4 of 5 , Oct 6, 2005
            Hi Freefrom,

            good observations!

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Freefrom"
            <eckchains@y...> wrote:
            > Hi all and Prometheus,
            >
            > in one of your previous posts you stated something to the
            > effect that those in eckankar can't let it go because they would
            >have
            > to then experience a void or shall we say an emptiness with the
            > absence of the org to believe in. YOu said that staring into the
            >void
            > was really becoming aware that the void is you as Soul.
            >
            > At times this has been my experience too but in a slightly different
            > way, in that there is a void or emptiness often discussed in other
            > forms of mysticism where there is a paradox. The emtiness is also
            > experienced as the ultimate fullness. What most eckist in transition
            > are really experiencing as well is a grieving process that can at
            > times bring up sadness as well as fear and irritability etc.. WHen
            >the
            > process is not resisted or there is a simply being with what is as
            >it
            > is then sometimes the authentic realization can peek through, at
            >least
            > in my experience. Accepting feelings as human and spiritual is also
            > for me a very important truth.

            Exactly. It's a separation, after all! And as you say, the better we
            are able to deal with this process and not stifle it, the faster
            we'll get over it. Of course it comes very often in waves - at least
            that's my experience, but with every wave it gets weaker and weaker.
            >
            > The problem I have with Ford's book, is that the second half is his
            > attempt to fill the void that arises from the realization that
            > eckankar is a fraudulent religion. Some of his ideas may be ok, but
            > then I find myself back into having to learn new affirmations and
            >the
            > HCS way of talking, just as in eckankar there was eck talk that one
            > had to learn in order to fit in. I think IMO that Ford would do much
            > better if he became more eclectic and less "teachy" and stay as far
            > away from Betty and Mario types and their conspiracy dogma as
            > possible. I believe that there is a rather nasty post from Betty
            >about
            > Graham F. and the fact that he was questioning some of Fords
            >spiritual
            > excercises, kind of like, "how dare he!".

            When I first left Eckankar, I was grateful for the second part of
            Ford's book because it gave me something to do. I think that the void
            was exactly what I feared, and perhaps it wouldn't have done me any
            good to stop abruptly doing the spiritual exercises. As time passed,
            I realized that I could do very well without the affirmations and
            beliefs of another person, and those exercises just faded away. Of
            course we can always learn from other people and their exercises but,
            as Mish pointed out, we have to adapt them for ourselves - modify
            them so that they become ours.

            I think Ford's organization is way too much "ecky" - those membership
            cards, the gatherings ... reminded me a lot of the Eckankar seminars.
            No wonder it became a haven for those who have not really left
            Eckankar! And people like the Betty and Mario type have damaged the
            image of Ford a lot, IMO. Many people left because of the weird
            topics, and all the weirdos, ex- and Eckists, posting there.
            >
            > Don't get me wrong. I feel that Ford is a brave soul and most of the
            > book is great.

            I think it took a lot of courage to leave the cult after so many
            years! And then being attacked by Eckists and ex-Eckists likewise! I
            think, too, that most of his book is great - it certainly did a world
            of good to people like me!

            > But the second half of the book and what comes across
            > the HCS BB is not the next step necessarily, IMO. A lot of it is
            >sort
            > of like Science of Mind or Church of Religious Science etc. Some of
            >it
            > I like and some of it I don't really care for. The freedom for me is
            > to pick and choose and compare without having that cult feeling of
            > oppression hanging over me. Just some thoughts.

            Yeah, exactly - well said!
            Ingrid
          • ewickings@aol.com
            In a message dated 10/6/2005 12:56:29 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, eckchains@y ... attempt to fill the void that arises from the realization that eckankar is
            Message 5 of 5 , Oct 6, 2005
              In a message dated 10/6/2005 12:56:29 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, eckchains@... writes:
              >The problem I have with Ford's book, is that the second half is his
              attempt to fill the void that arises from the realization that
              eckankar is a fraudulent religion. Some of his ideas may be ok, but
              then I find myself back into having to learn new affirmations and the
              HCS way of talking, just as in eckankar there was eck talk that one
              had to learn in order to fit in.
              *** I had similar feelings about Ford's book.  At one time I thought he had mentioned separating the two halves of the book "Confessions".   Although I do understand maybe his intentions of providing someone with an alternative way of exploring one's own authentic self, or higher power.  Similar to a counselor assisting someone with *difficulties*; they provide you with the tools then set you free.  It's up to the individual to try it or not.  Is it another crutch, or an honest attempt at not pulling the rug out from under a persons foundation completely?  I never felt Ford intended to create another new age religion.  Although some have hammered him for what appeared to be just that!   And only Ford knows what is / was in his heart when he set out to write his book.
               
              What has followed with his BB's seems to resemble the flip side of a.r.e.    Where the a.r.e. group was actually started by eckist, and anti eck bashing ensued, creating a cess pool of ignorance!   Ford's BBs have somewhat become the anti ex-eckist group, many having been big posters for the cult over at a.r.e.  not so anonymously...  ;-)    
               
                     
              > I think IMO that Ford would do much better if he
              <snip>
              >stay as far away from Betty and Mario types and their conspiracy dogma as possible. I believe that there is a rather nasty post from Betty about
              Graham F. and the fact that he was questioning some of Fords spiritual
              excercises, kind of like, "how dare he!".
              ***  I remember her post to Graham.  I found it rather puzzling....  as if she were disillusioned by Graham wanting to move on with his own exploration, rather than joining the B and M train.  (I posted a comment similar to that effect, back then)   I think Ford was being open minded with the BBs and allowing what he felt was self exploration.  Further analysis would indicate; B and M aught to be looked at as a BM, and should be flushed!   I did notice awhile back that the HCS BB requires a membership sign in to read most of the postings.   So maybe he intended for that BB to more controlled?  But from what I did see back in the day when I did have a log in, B and M were pretty much running that too....   is that still the case?
              >The freedom for me is to pick and choose and compare without having that cult feeling of oppression hanging over me. Just some thoughts.
              ***  Same here!   :-)  I received as a b-day gift a little book by Louise L. Hay titled  "Meditations to Heal Your Life".   I really enjoy picking it up now and then and reading an affirmation.  I don't find it necessary to do so everyday.....  thought I would share one that really speaks volumes.
               
              "I am the main authority in my world"
               
              I am the author of my life.  No person, place, or thing has any power over me, for I am the only thinker in my mind.  As a child I accepted authority figures as gods.  Now I am learning to take back my power and become my own authority figure.  I now accept myself as a powerful, responsible being.  As I meditate every morning, I get in touch with my own inner wisdom.  The school of life is deeply fulfilling as we come to know that we are all students and all teachers.  We each have come to learn something and to teach something.  As I listen to my thoughts, I gently guide my mind toward trusting my own inner wisdom.  Grow and blossom and entrust all your affairs on Earth to Your Divine Source.  All is well.....    
               
                 


               
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