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Repost of James P. Davis post on Truth Seeker, 9/25/2003

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  • mishmisha9
    A Repost of James Davis from Truth Seeker that explains why he left Eckankar: Rosetta Stone of God author J. Davis Responds to Confessions From: James Davis
    Message 1 of 6 , Oct 5, 2005
      A Repost of James Davis from Truth Seeker that explains why he left
      Eckankar:

      Rosetta Stone of God author J. Davis Responds to Confessions

      From: James Davis
      Being the author of a book on the Mahanta titled THE ROSETTA STONE
      OF GOD, I would like to add my voice to those who have chosen to
      leave Eckankar. I quietly left Eckankar several years ago, having
      come to many of the same conclusions Ford arrived at in his own
      book. At the time I left, I wrote a letter to Harold saying I would
      make no announcements about my leaving. But I have since learned
      that it is a very "open secret" that I left - not through any acts
      of my own, but from various Eckists in who work at the main office,
      and a few others. So I now feel it is appropriate to say a few words
      about my leaving, and about Ford's book.

      During my almost three decades in Eckankar I became increasingly
      troubled by what I perceived as the weak integrity within the
      teachings and of the leaders. At the same time I struggled against
      these impressions because I deeply WANTED Eckankar to be the ideal
      teaching I had hoped and dreamed of. I deeply WANTED to Living Eck
      Masters to be more than I was witnessing.

      I came to the point in the late Nineties where I decided to give the
      teachings the fullest and deepest study I could (both on the Inner
      and the Outer) in order to settle my doubts once and for all. I
      chose to focus on the Mahanta as the theme of my study and
      contemplation since this doctrine is the heart and soul of Eckankar.

      I spent over a year researching every word ever written or spoken on
      the Mahanta that were available to me. I poured through decades of
      my personal journals looking for clues from my own experience to
      supplement the outer teachings. I inwardly invited the Nine Silent
      Ones and the Eck Masters to help with my project. Then I set about
      writing the best book I could on all I had found.

      The finished manuscript was sent in and quickly got approved for
      publication by Harold Klemp. For a few months I was euphoric and
      felt I had finally laid to rest my misgivings about the teachings.
      But the effect soon wore off for, after all, the issues that gave
      rise to the writing were still there - as Ford's book aptly
      demonstrates. The issues can't be made to go away by an act of
      fervent devotion. Or should I say, they can be made to go away for
      awhile, or by denial. But for many people, such avoidance tactics
      wear thin after a time.

      I realized the whole writing project of THE ROSETTA STONE OF GOD had
      been an utter failure in its prime objective of settling my issues.
      Whatever value it held for others, it failed for me.

      Yet, with the publication of the book came the usual attention that
      goes with being an Eckankar author. And in this I discovered how
      eager many people are to elevate the spiritual status of those who
      are reporting intimate spiritual experiences with masters. A number
      of Eckists, including Higher Initiates, either intimated that I was
      a candidate for Eck Mastership, or openly made comments or wrote
      letters to me to this effect. Some even had "got it on the inner"
      that this was the case. Those who know me well and were privy to
      some of this, found this elevation amusing enough. But it became
      abundantly clear to me how easy a person like Paul, who could not
      only write well, but who had a certain charisma and claimed an
      abundance of experiences with inner masters, would sweep followers
      off their feet.

      I have little if any charisma, but I can write a fairly decent book.
      This apparently was sufficient for many. The experience of being on
      the receiving end of admiring Eckists was a sobering first hand look
      from the other end of the scope of my own tendency to elevate the
      leaders of Eckankar.

      I won't go into the details of the issues I have with the Eckankar
      teachings, for most of these issues are addressed in Ford's book. My
      conclusions are not the same as Ford's in all cases. For example,
      whether people such as Rebazar Tarzs are real or not real hardly
      played a part in my decision to leave, whereas Ford categorically
      asserts the Vairagi masters are pure fiction. I had decided that, if
      men like Paul and Darwin and Harold were truly the best and
      brightest candidates that a band of high inner masters would choose
      to be the head of their order and be the chosen supreme channel for
      God on Earth, than I was not interested in following such an order.

      On the other hand, I felt, if there is an order of very high masters
      similar to the Vairagi that Paul protrayed, I seriously doubted they
      would hitch their wagon to a movement like Eckankar. So the whole
      debate about whether some of these masters are real or not is not a
      central one for me personally.

      There are a few other conclusions I reached that differ a bit from
      Ford's, and this is as it should be for anyone thinking for
      themselves. But on the whole, my own research and experience support
      Ford's conclusions. If you read Ford's book, you will find a
      multitude of issues worth carefully thinking over - a number of
      which you may never have considered before.

      Incidently, Ford has been accused by some critics as being too
      mental, of not showing an attitude of love. It would be hard for
      anyone to write a book deconstructing Eckankar without seeming hard-
      hearted to an Eckankar devotee. How do you call the beloved founder
      Paul Twitchell a liar and a fraud and still sound like a Golden
      Heart? But there is more to the demonstration of love than sweet
      platitudes, warm feelings, and cute stories. Tough-love is real, and
      in the spiritual tradition it leads (or pushes) Soul onwards towards
      God. I see no love in comforting others with gentle lies, nor in
      telling them they will suffer spiritual decline and misery if they
      leave the Eckankar club. One of the primary reasons I decided to
      leave Eckankar was precisely because the pronouncements of love made
      by the leaders was contradicted all too often by their actions and
      harsh denouncement of those who disagreed with them, or those who
      choose to follow another road, or of other "inferior" paths.

      As with many who leave the Eckankar religion, I have felt a certain
      amount of loss. Not just the loss of an ideal, but the absence of a
      community of friends, and the wonderful sharing that happens at many
      Eckankar events. But I have not regretted for a moment the spiritual
      implications of leaving. To have stayed, for me, would have been a
      rejection of what Eckankar calls The Call of Soul - a call which
      urged me to let go of a religion which had served its purpose in my
      journey, and had become an impediment to my further growth.

      ####
      Truth Seeker added these comments at the end of James Davis' post:

      Thank you for coming forward. There are many who hold on to your
      book as the final validation of the mahanta. That is why Harold was
      so quick to promote it. I hope that your candor and courage will
      encourage others,who are hanging fire and holding on to this last
      fabricated vistage of Eckankar doctrine, to also have the courage to
      read the book and then act on their inner spiritual guidance. Only
      then can the Eckankar spell be broken.

      TS
    • prometheus_973
      Hi All, I thought that this post by former Eckist James Davis would be nice to revisit at this time. It just goes to show, Eckists, that there is more going on
      Message 2 of 6 , May 3 8:02 AM
        Hi All,
        I thought that this post by former Eckist James Davis would be nice
        to revisit at this time. It just goes to show, Eckists, that there
        is more going on than they are aware of... and sometimes much less!


        A Repost of James Davis from Truth Seeker (9/25/2003) that explains
        why he left Eckankar:

        Rosetta Stone of God author J. Davis Responds to Confessions

        From: James Davis
        Being the author of a book on the Mahanta titled THE ROSETTA STONE
        OF GOD, I would like to add my voice to those who have chosen to
        leave Eckankar. I quietly left Eckankar several years ago, having
        come to many of the same conclusions Ford arrived at in his own
        book. At the time I left, I wrote a letter to Harold saying I would
        make no announcements about my leaving. But I have since learned
        that it is a very "open secret" that I left - not through any acts
        of my own, but from various Eckists in who work at the main office,
        and a few others. So I now feel it is appropriate to say a few words
        about my leaving, and about Ford's book.

        During my almost three decades in Eckankar I became increasingly
        troubled by what I perceived as the weak integrity within the
        teachings and of the leaders. At the same time I struggled against
        these impressions because I deeply WANTED Eckankar to be the ideal
        teaching I had hoped and dreamed of. I deeply WANTED to Living Eck
        Masters to be more than I was witnessing.

        I came to the point in the late Nineties where I decided to give the
        teachings the fullest and deepest study I could (both on the Inner
        and the Outer) in order to settle my doubts once and for all. I
        chose to focus on the Mahanta as the theme of my study and
        contemplation since this doctrine is the heart and soul of Eckankar.

        I spent over a year researching every word ever written or spoken on
        the Mahanta that were available to me. I poured through decades of
        my personal journals looking for clues from my own experience to
        supplement the outer teachings. I inwardly invited the Nine Silent
        Ones and the Eck Masters to help with my project. Then I set about
        writing the best book I could on all I had found.

        The finished manuscript was sent in and quickly got approved for
        publication by Harold Klemp. For a few months I was euphoric and
        felt I had finally laid to rest my misgivings about the teachings.
        But the effect soon wore off for, after all, the issues that gave
        rise to the writing were still there - as Ford's book aptly
        demonstrates. The issues can't be made to go away by an act of
        fervent devotion. Or should I say, they can be made to go away for
        awhile, or by denial. But for many people, such avoidance tactics
        wear thin after a time.

        I realized the whole writing project of THE ROSETTA STONE OF GOD had
        been an utter failure in its prime objective of settling my issues.
        Whatever value it held for others, it failed for me.

        Yet, with the publication of the book came the usual attention that
        goes with being an Eckankar author. And in this I discovered how
        eager many people are to elevate the spiritual status of those who
        are reporting intimate spiritual experiences with masters. A number
        of Eckists, including Higher Initiates, either intimated that I was
        a candidate for Eck Mastership, or openly made comments or wrote
        letters to me to this effect. Some even had "got it on the inner"
        that this was the case. Those who know me well and were privy to
        some of this, found this elevation amusing enough. But it became
        abundantly clear to me how easy a person like Paul, who could not
        only write well, but who had a certain charisma and claimed an
        abundance of experiences with inner masters, would sweep followers
        off their feet.

        I have little if any charisma, but I can write a fairly decent book.
        This apparently was sufficient for many. The experience of being on
        the receiving end of admiring Eckists was a sobering first hand look
        from the other end of the scope of my own tendency to elevate the
        leaders of Eckankar.

        I won't go into the details of the issues I have with the Eckankar
        teachings, for most of these issues are addressed in Ford's book. My
        conclusions are not the same as Ford's in all cases. For example,
        whether people such as Rebazar Tarzs are real or not real hardly
        played a part in my decision to leave, whereas Ford categorically
        asserts the Vairagi masters are pure fiction. I had decided that, if
        men like Paul and Darwin and Harold were truly the best and
        brightest candidates that a band of high inner masters would choose
        to be the head of their order and be the chosen supreme channel for
        God on Earth, than I was not interested in following such an order.

        On the other hand, I felt, if there is an order of very high masters
        similar to the Vairagi that Paul protrayed, I seriously doubted they
        would hitch their wagon to a movement like Eckankar. So the whole
        debate about whether some of these masters are real or not is not a
        central one for me personally.

        There are a few other conclusions I reached that differ a bit from
        Ford's, and this is as it should be for anyone thinking for
        themselves. But on the whole, my own research and experience support
        Ford's conclusions. If you read Ford's book, you will find a
        multitude of issues worth carefully thinking over - a number of
        which you may never have considered before.

        Incidently, Ford has been accused by some critics as being too
        mental, of not showing an attitude of love. It would be hard for
        anyone to write a book deconstructing Eckankar without seeming hard-
        hearted to an Eckankar devotee. How do you call the beloved founder
        Paul Twitchell a liar and a fraud and still sound like a Golden
        Heart? But there is more to the demonstration of love than sweet
        platitudes, warm feelings, and cute stories. Tough-love is real, and
        in the spiritual tradition it leads (or pushes) Soul onwards towards
        God. I see no love in comforting others with gentle lies, nor in
        telling them they will suffer spiritual decline and misery if they
        leave the Eckankar club. One of the primary reasons I decided to
        leave Eckankar was precisely because the pronouncements of love made
        by the leaders was contradicted all too often by their actions and
        harsh denouncement of those who disagreed with them, or those who
        choose to follow another road, or of other "inferior" paths.

        As with many who leave the Eckankar religion, I have felt a certain
        amount of loss. Not just the loss of an ideal, but the absence of a
        community of friends, and the wonderful sharing that happens at many
        Eckankar events. But I have not regretted for a moment the spiritual
        implications of leaving. To have stayed, for me, would have been a
        rejection of what Eckankar calls The Call of Soul - a call which
        urged me to let go of a religion which had served its purpose in my
        journey, and had become an impediment to my further growth.

        ####
        Truth Seeker added these comments at the end of James Davis' post:

        Thank you for coming forward. There are many who hold on to your
        book as the final validation of the mahanta. That is why Harold was
        so quick to promote it. I hope that your candor and courage will
        encourage others,who are hanging fire and holding on to this last
        fabricated vistage of Eckankar doctrine, to also have the courage to
        read the book and then act on their inner spiritual guidance. Only
        then can the Eckankar spell be broken.

        TS
      • Elizabeth
        Good morning all! I wanted to revisit this excellent post, originally posted by Prometheus in May of this year. The reason I do so, is because I noticed over
        Message 3 of 6 , Dec 2, 2006
          Good morning all!

          I wanted to revisit this excellent post, originally posted by
          Prometheus in May of this year. The reason I do so, is because I
          noticed over on Hu-chat our friend Etznab asked a very important
          question (which no one on Hu-chat bothered to answer!) concerning
          James Davis the author of "The Rosetta Stone of God", (which BTW was
          *REMOVED BY ECKANKAR BY ORDER OF THE LEM KLEMP* for obvious reasons
          to us, but not to most members of ECKANKAR) that James Davis is NO
          LONGER AN ECKIST! Hence the reason KLEMP had to rewrite some
          history, as well as a replacement book titled "Those Wonderful Eck
          Masters".

          Most Eckists won't bother to question why certains books, once held
          up as TRUTH by Klemp and Company, are no longer available. Those
          that are aware of the whys, well they are told not to speak about
          it! So the secrets and the lies continue... as they did when Darwin
          Gross was booted. All this is called a cover up, to protect the
          financial structure of the business called Eckankar!

          Etznab this one is for you my friend, read below! If you have
          further questions, I am sure many of us here are willing to assist
          you in any way we can.

          I hope you are well. Wishing you a Peaceful, Wonderful Holiday
          Season!

          Elizabeth


          --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
          <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi All,
          > I thought that this post by former Eckist James Davis would be
          nice
          > to revisit at this time. It just goes to show, Eckists, that there
          > is more going on than they are aware of... and sometimes much less!
          >
          >
          > A Repost of James Davis from Truth Seeker (9/25/2003) that
          explains
          > why he left Eckankar:
          >
          > Rosetta Stone of God author J. Davis Responds to Confessions
          >
          > From: James Davis
          > Being the author of a book on the Mahanta titled THE ROSETTA STONE
          > OF GOD, I would like to add my voice to those who have chosen to
          > leave Eckankar. I quietly left Eckankar several years ago, having
          > come to many of the same conclusions Ford arrived at in his own
          > book. At the time I left, I wrote a letter to Harold saying I
          would
          > make no announcements about my leaving. But I have since learned
          > that it is a very "open secret" that I left - not through any acts
          > of my own, but from various Eckists in who work at the main
          office,
          > and a few others. So I now feel it is appropriate to say a few
          words
          > about my leaving, and about Ford's book.
          >
          > During my almost three decades in Eckankar I became increasingly
          > troubled by what I perceived as the weak integrity within the
          > teachings and of the leaders. At the same time I struggled against
          > these impressions because I deeply WANTED Eckankar to be the ideal
          > teaching I had hoped and dreamed of. I deeply WANTED to Living Eck
          > Masters to be more than I was witnessing.
          >
          > I came to the point in the late Nineties where I decided to give
          the
          > teachings the fullest and deepest study I could (both on the Inner
          > and the Outer) in order to settle my doubts once and for all. I
          > chose to focus on the Mahanta as the theme of my study and
          > contemplation since this doctrine is the heart and soul of
          Eckankar.
          >
          > I spent over a year researching every word ever written or spoken
          on
          > the Mahanta that were available to me. I poured through decades of
          > my personal journals looking for clues from my own experience to
          > supplement the outer teachings. I inwardly invited the Nine Silent
          > Ones and the Eck Masters to help with my project. Then I set about
          > writing the best book I could on all I had found.
          >
          > The finished manuscript was sent in and quickly got approved for
          > publication by Harold Klemp. For a few months I was euphoric and
          > felt I had finally laid to rest my misgivings about the teachings.
          > But the effect soon wore off for, after all, the issues that gave
          > rise to the writing were still there - as Ford's book aptly
          > demonstrates. The issues can't be made to go away by an act of
          > fervent devotion. Or should I say, they can be made to go away for
          > awhile, or by denial. But for many people, such avoidance tactics
          > wear thin after a time.
          >
          > I realized the whole writing project of THE ROSETTA STONE OF GOD
          had
          > been an utter failure in its prime objective of settling my
          issues.
          > Whatever value it held for others, it failed for me.
          >
          > Yet, with the publication of the book came the usual attention
          that
          > goes with being an Eckankar author. And in this I discovered how
          > eager many people are to elevate the spiritual status of those who
          > are reporting intimate spiritual experiences with masters. A
          number
          > of Eckists, including Higher Initiates, either intimated that I
          was
          > a candidate for Eck Mastership, or openly made comments or wrote
          > letters to me to this effect. Some even had "got it on the inner"
          > that this was the case. Those who know me well and were privy to
          > some of this, found this elevation amusing enough. But it became
          > abundantly clear to me how easy a person like Paul, who could not
          > only write well, but who had a certain charisma and claimed an
          > abundance of experiences with inner masters, would sweep followers
          > off their feet.
          >
          > I have little if any charisma, but I can write a fairly decent
          book.
          > This apparently was sufficient for many. The experience of being
          on
          > the receiving end of admiring Eckists was a sobering first hand
          look
          > from the other end of the scope of my own tendency to elevate the
          > leaders of Eckankar.
          >
          > I won't go into the details of the issues I have with the Eckankar
          > teachings, for most of these issues are addressed in Ford's book.
          My
          > conclusions are not the same as Ford's in all cases. For example,
          > whether people such as Rebazar Tarzs are real or not real hardly
          > played a part in my decision to leave, whereas Ford categorically
          > asserts the Vairagi masters are pure fiction. I had decided that,
          if
          > men like Paul and Darwin and Harold were truly the best and
          > brightest candidates that a band of high inner masters would
          choose
          > to be the head of their order and be the chosen supreme channel
          for
          > God on Earth, than I was not interested in following such an
          order.
          >
          > On the other hand, I felt, if there is an order of very high
          masters
          > similar to the Vairagi that Paul protrayed, I seriously doubted
          they
          > would hitch their wagon to a movement like Eckankar. So the whole
          > debate about whether some of these masters are real or not is not
          a
          > central one for me personally.
          >
          > There are a few other conclusions I reached that differ a bit from
          > Ford's, and this is as it should be for anyone thinking for
          > themselves. But on the whole, my own research and experience
          support
          > Ford's conclusions. If you read Ford's book, you will find a
          > multitude of issues worth carefully thinking over - a number of
          > which you may never have considered before.
          >
          > Incidently, Ford has been accused by some critics as being too
          > mental, of not showing an attitude of love. It would be hard for
          > anyone to write a book deconstructing Eckankar without seeming
          hard-
          > hearted to an Eckankar devotee. How do you call the beloved
          founder
          > Paul Twitchell a liar and a fraud and still sound like a Golden
          > Heart? But there is more to the demonstration of love than sweet
          > platitudes, warm feelings, and cute stories. Tough-love is real,
          and
          > in the spiritual tradition it leads (or pushes) Soul onwards
          towards
          > God. I see no love in comforting others with gentle lies, nor in
          > telling them they will suffer spiritual decline and misery if they
          > leave the Eckankar club. One of the primary reasons I decided to
          > leave Eckankar was precisely because the pronouncements of love
          made
          > by the leaders was contradicted all too often by their actions and
          > harsh denouncement of those who disagreed with them, or those who
          > choose to follow another road, or of other "inferior" paths.
          >
          > As with many who leave the Eckankar religion, I have felt a
          certain
          > amount of loss. Not just the loss of an ideal, but the absence of
          a
          > community of friends, and the wonderful sharing that happens at
          many
          > Eckankar events. But I have not regretted for a moment the
          spiritual
          > implications of leaving. To have stayed, for me, would have been a
          > rejection of what Eckankar calls The Call of Soul - a call which
          > urged me to let go of a religion which had served its purpose in
          my
          > journey, and had become an impediment to my further growth.
          >
          > ####
          > Truth Seeker added these comments at the end of James Davis' post:
          >
          > Thank you for coming forward. There are many who hold on to your
          > book as the final validation of the mahanta. That is why Harold
          was
          > so quick to promote it. I hope that your candor and courage will
          > encourage others,who are hanging fire and holding on to this last
          > fabricated vistage of Eckankar doctrine, to also have the courage
          to
          > read the book and then act on their inner spiritual guidance. Only
          > then can the Eckankar spell be broken.
          >
          > TS
          >
        • makiztor
          ... [....] ... [....] ... Dear Elizabeth (Hi everyone), the T.S. post about James Davis was one that I remembered reading a long time ago. Even before I ever
          Message 4 of 6 , Dec 2, 2006
            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth"
            <ewickings@...> wrote:
            >
            > Good morning all!
            >
            > I wanted to revisit this excellent post, originally posted by
            > Prometheus in May of this year. The reason I do so, is because I
            > noticed over on Hu-chat our friend Etznab asked a very important
            > question (which no one on Hu-chat bothered to answer!) concerning
            > James Davis the author of "The Rosetta Stone of God"

            [....]

            > Etznab this one is for you my friend, read below! If you have
            > further questions, I am sure many of us here are willing to assist
            > you in any way we can.
            >
            > I hope you are well. Wishing you a Peaceful, Wonderful Holiday
            > Season!
            >
            > Elizabeth

            [....]
            >
            >
            Dear Elizabeth (Hi everyone), the T.S. post about James Davis
            was one that I remembered reading a long time ago. Even before I
            ever mentioned him in a post. I thought that his book(s) talked
            about cycles - and I shared that.
            What was the question (to which you refer) that I asked?

            Etznab
          • Elizabeth
            Hello Etznab, Most Eckists will not have an honest dialog about topics such as the Eckists that have left, such as James Davis. In fact I am surprised Grace
            Message 5 of 6 , Dec 2, 2006
              Hello Etznab,

              Most Eckists will not have an honest dialog about topics such as the
              Eckists that have left, such as James Davis. In fact I am
              surprised Grace even bothered to answer even as much (or little) as
              she did.

              I knew James Davis, and attended several HI retreats and various
              meetings with him. Back in 1999 I knew he was having questions
              about the validity of the Mahanta, Eck Masters and Eckankar the
              Org., based on conversations held in a round table workshop I was
              part of with him. (He was promoting his "Rosetta" book at the
              time.)

              Basically you will need to do most of your own "Digging" to find
              the answer to the 12 cycles question. And as always, Eckists will
              have you either take it on the inner, or will claim "All Eckists
              have known about 12 year cycles and more - like mini-cycles Within
              the 12 years - having been taught by Paul Twitchell. Sri Harold
              Expanded on the system for us many years ago". BUT will they
              answer by giving you the proof you look for, say in quotes, books
              with pages listed, or how about discourses? All of which should be
              readily available right on the internet. Maybe someone from ESA can
              help you with the digging?!

              Glad you are still around Etznab. I really do enjoy your "presents"
              (spelled incorrectly for a reason!).

              Elizabeth


              Hu-chat message # 56838
              I'm not so sure about this, but maybe someone can write a follow
              Up with more details. I believe it was author James Davis who wrote
              A book called The Rosetta Stone of God (or something like that) that
              Talked about cycles. At least the number 12 was mentioned. Is there
              Any connection between this book and the twelve year cycles? I am
              Not sure.

              James Davis also wrote The Dream Weaver Chronicles (is that
              Correct?) in which he talked about history, waking dreams, and
              Cycles.

              I'm sharing this information because I believe these two books
              Could give some insight about history and cycles in general. The
              Rosetta Stone of God was all about the Mahanta, as I remember.

              Hope this helps.

              Etznab

              Hu-chat message #56845
              All Eckists have known about 12 year cycles and more - like mini-
              cycles
              Within the 12 years - having been taught by Paul Twitchell. Sri
              Harold
              Expanded on the system for us many years ago. That's how James Paul
              Davis
              Knew about them also! I believe he worked closely with Sri Harold at
              the
              Time he wrote these.
              Dream Weaver was based on what several of us had already discussed
              and
              Concluded. The other book I have not read....

              In ECK,
              Grace

              --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "makiztor"
              <etznab@...> wrote:
              >
              > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth"
              > <ewickings@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Good morning all!
              > >
              > > I wanted to revisit this excellent post, originally posted by
              > > Prometheus in May of this year. The reason I do so, is because
              I
              > > noticed over on Hu-chat our friend Etznab asked a very important
              > > question (which no one on Hu-chat bothered to answer!)
              concerning
              > > James Davis the author of "The Rosetta Stone of God"
              >
              > [....]
              >
              > > Etznab this one is for you my friend, read below! If you have
              > > further questions, I am sure many of us here are willing to
              assist
              > > you in any way we can.
              > >
              > > I hope you are well. Wishing you a Peaceful, Wonderful Holiday
              > > Season!
              > >
              > > Elizabeth
              >
              > [....]
              > >
              > >
              > Dear Elizabeth (Hi everyone), the T.S. post about James Davis
              > was one that I remembered reading a long time ago. Even before I
              > ever mentioned him in a post. I thought that his book(s) talked
              > about cycles - and I shared that.
              > What was the question (to which you refer) that I asked?
              >
              > Etznab
              >
            • prometheus_973
              Hello All, James Davis silently Quit ECKANKAR Years Ago! These comments by former ECKist James Davis show that testimonials about experiences and visitations
              Message 6 of 6 , May 27 11:12 AM
                Hello All,
                James Davis silently Quit ECKANKAR Years Ago!
                These comments by former ECKist James Davis
                show that testimonials about experiences and
                visitations with the Mahanta and other ECK "Masters"
                aren't what they seem or "appear" to be.

                I thought this was worth a revisit since many ECKists
                aren't even aware that James Davis rejected Klemp and
                the ECKANKAR (ECK) Teachings of Twitchell that were
                handed down to Gross by PT's widow Gail. Klemp merely
                took over the copyrighted materials, embellished it with
                "stories" and put his Christian spin on it to make it seem
                newly refreshed and "real" via the use of imagination!

                Enjoy the read!

                Prometheus
                ***************************************************************
                mish wrote:

                A Repost of James Davis from Truth Seeker that explains why
                he left Eckankar:

                Rosetta Stone of God author J. Davis Responds to Confessions

                From: James Davis
                Being the author of a book on the Mahanta titled THE ROSETTA
                STONE OF GOD, I would like to add my voice to those who have
                chosen to leave Eckankar. I quietly left Eckankar several years ago,
                having come to many of the same conclusions Ford arrived at in
                his own book. At the time I left, I wrote a letter to Harold saying
                I would make no announcements about my leaving. But I have since
                learned that it is a very "open secret" that I left - not through any
                acts of my own, but from various Eckists in who work at the main
                office, and a few others. So I now feel it is appropriate to say a few
                words about my leaving, and about Ford's book.

                During my almost three decades in Eckankar I became increasingly
                troubled by what I perceived as the weak integrity within the
                teachings and of the leaders. At the same time I struggled against
                these impressions because I deeply WANTED Eckankar to be the
                ideal teaching I had hoped and dreamed of. I deeply WANTED to
                Living Eck Masters to be more than I was witnessing.

                I came to the point in the late Nineties where I decided to give
                the teachings the fullest and deepest study I could (both on the
                Inner and the Outer) in order to settle my doubts once and for all.
                I chose to focus on the Mahanta as the theme of my study and
                contemplation since this doctrine is the heart and soul of Eckankar.

                I spent over a year researching every word ever written or spoken
                on the Mahanta that were available to me. I poured through decades
                of my personal journals looking for clues from my own experience
                to supplement the outer teachings. I inwardly invited the Nine Silent
                Ones and the Eck Masters to help with my project. Then I set about
                writing the best book I could on all I had found.

                The finished manuscript was sent in and quickly got approved
                for publication by Harold Klemp. For a few months I was euphoric
                and felt I had finally laid to rest my misgivings about the teachings.
                But the effect soon wore off for, after all, the issues that gave
                rise to the writing were still there - as Ford's book aptly
                demonstrates. The issues can't be made to go away by an act of
                fervent devotion. Or should I say, they can be made to go away for
                awhile, or by denial. But for many people, such avoidance tactics
                wear thin after a time.

                I realized the whole writing project of THE ROSETTA STONE OF GOD
                had been an utter failure in its prime objective of settling my issues.
                Whatever value it held for others, it failed for me.

                Yet, with the publication of the book came the usual attention
                that goes with being an Eckankar author. And in this I discovered
                how eager many people are to elevate the spiritual status of those
                who are reporting intimate spiritual experiences with masters.
                A number of Eckists, including Higher Initiates, either intimated
                that I was a candidate for Eck Mastership, or openly made comments
                or wrote letters to me to this effect. Some even had "got it on the
                inner" that this was the case. Those who know me well and were
                privy to some of this, found this elevation amusing enough. But
                it became abundantly clear to me how easy a person like Paul,
                who could not only write well, but who had a certain charisma
                and claimed an abundance of experiences with inner masters,
                would sweep followers off their feet.

                I have little if any charisma, but I can write a fairly decent book.
                This apparently was sufficient for many. The experience of being
                on the receiving end of admiring Eckists was a sobering first hand
                look from the other end of the scope of my own tendency to elevate
                the leaders of Eckankar.

                I won't go into the details of the issues I have with the Eckankar
                teachings, for most of these issues are addressed in Ford's book.
                My conclusions are not the same as Ford's in all cases. For example,
                whether people such as Rebazar Tarzs are real or not real hardly
                played a part in my decision to leave, whereas Ford categorically
                asserts the Vairagi masters are pure fiction. I had decided that,
                if men like Paul and Darwin and Harold were truly the best and
                brightest candidates that a band of high inner masters would choose
                to be the head of their order and be the chosen supreme channel
                for God on Earth, than I was not interested in following such an order.

                On the other hand, I felt, if there is an order of very high masters
                similar to the Vairagi that Paul protrayed, I seriously doubted they
                would hitch their wagon to a movement like Eckankar. So the whole
                debate about whether some of these masters are real or not is not
                a central one for me personally.

                There are a few other conclusions I reached that differ a bit
                from Ford's, and this is as it should be for anyone thinking for
                themselves. But on the whole, my own research and experience
                support Ford's conclusions. If you read Ford's book, you will find
                a multitude of issues worth carefully thinking over - a number
                of which you may never have considered before.

                Incidently, Ford has been accused by some critics as being too
                mental, of not showing an attitude of love. It would be hard for
                anyone to write a book deconstructing Eckankar without seeming
                hard-hearted to an Eckankar devotee. How do you call the beloved
                founder Paul Twitchell a liar and a fraud and still sound like a Golden
                Heart? But there is more to the demonstration of love than sweet
                platitudes, warm feelings, and cute stories. Tough-love is real, and
                in the spiritual tradition it leads (or pushes) Soul onwards towards
                God. I see no love in comforting others with gentle lies, nor in
                telling them they will suffer spiritual decline and misery if they
                leave the Eckankar club. One of the primary reasons I decided to
                leave Eckankar was precisely because the pronouncements of love
                made by the leaders was contradicted all too often by their actions
                and harsh denouncement of those who disagreed with them, or
                those who choose to follow another road, or of other "inferior" paths.

                As with many who leave the Eckankar religion, I have felt a certain
                amount of loss. Not just the loss of an ideal, but the absence of a
                community of friends, and the wonderful sharing that happens at
                many Eckankar events. But I have not regretted for a moment the
                spiritual implications of leaving. To have stayed, for me, would have
                been a rejection of what Eckankar calls The Call of Soul - a call which
                urged me to let go of a religion which had served its purpose in my
                journey, and had become an impediment to my further growth.

                ####

                Truth Seeker added these comments at the end of James Davis' post:

                Thank you for coming forward. There are many who hold on to your
                book as the final validation of the mahanta. That is why Harold was
                so quick to promote it. I hope that your candor and courage will
                encourage others,who are hanging fire and holding on to this last
                fabricated vistage of Eckankar doctrine, to also have the courage to
                read the book and then act on their inner spiritual guidance. Only
                then can the Eckankar spell be broken.

                TS
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