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Re: Eckankar Renews, Revitalizes, Revamps, Repeats, and Regurgitates

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  • prometheus_973
    Hello Janice and All, Yes, Klemp states that: Eckankar is taking a vital step to bring a new spiritual opportunity to you, your fellow Eckists, and spiritual
    Message 1 of 8 , Jul 23, 2013
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      Hello Janice and All,
      Yes, Klemp states that:
      "Eckankar is taking a vital
      step to bring a new spiritual
      opportunity to you, your
      fellow Eckists, and spiritual
      seekers around the world."

      The New ECK Study Program
      (2013) is based upon a 1970
      quote from PT's first Shariyat
      and the borrowed dogma from
      Sant Mat and a similar prophecy
      from the Judeo-Christian Bible
      as well as the Book of Mormon,
      et al.:

      "ECK [Spirit] is life itself, the
      Audible Life Stream. The time
      is coming that will bring ECK
      to the world as a universal
      spiritual belief. Mankind will
      accept it. ECK will serve all
      races of people and all countries."

      Harold is "updating the presentation"
      of the ECK discourses and the
      ECK study program with a "greater
      current" of the Light and Sound
      of God. Really! I don't know how
      he's doing it... more words(?) or
      why he's waited so long but that's
      the talk.

      Here's more from Klemp's business
      partner and the President of Eckankar,
      Peter Skelskey (he knows where the
      bodies are buried):

      "All available resources of time,
      energy, creativity, and finances
      are being put forth to support
      Sri Harold's vision for the future
      of the ECK teachings on earth."

      Wow! That sounds oddly familiar.

      "The costs are substantial, yet
      the spiritual benefits to mankind
      are beyond measure."

      That sound familiar too!

      I wonder if Peter and Harold
      will supply a financial report
      in order to show where all of
      these "costs" are going? LOL!

      ECK Mission Fund Goal -
      Eckankar has set an initial
      fund-raising goal for 2013
      of $3,000,000 to help support
      this program.

      Peter continues:
      "Will you lend your heart and
      hands to this great effort? Your
      gifts, in whatever amount, are
      truly appreciated. It will take
      each and every one of us to
      make it happen. You are the
      heart and soul of the ECK mission.
      You are a Co-worker with the
      Mahanta."

      See, now we all know that's Bullshit
      because we were never "Co-workers"
      "with" Sugmad or with the Mahanta.
      We were always "Underlings" versus
      Co-workers. It's a hierarchy! There's
      no equality! You work "For" the higher
      ups and not "with" the higher ups.
      You are evaluated by the higher ups,
      therefore, you are not peer to them.
      There is only the facade of Soul=Soul
      and of being a "Co-worker." It's
      double-talk, and smoke and mirrors.

      Here's more:
      "Your gifts of love and service will
      help many others find their way home
      to God. I thank you from the bottom
      of my heart for your help with this
      great mission."

      From the bottom of your heart?
      Can't you be more original than that?

      "PS If you want information on including
      Eckankar in your will or estate plans,
      check the designated box on the donation
      form and return it in the enclosed envelope.

      Also, if you would like to make a donation
      via the Eckankar website, visit xxxxxxxxx/
      Donate to make a secure donation via the
      Internet."

      "Learn to give, without ever
      thinking of a reward. That's
      how to find the treasures of
      heaven." --Sri HK The Language of Soul

      Of course there are several problems
      with the above quote. First, it's a
      lie. Next, Eckists expect and are
      owed rewards via outer Initiations.
      That's the way it's been set-up,
      except, Klemp (a narcissist) refuses
      to follow the established rules.
      And, let's talk about this "heaven"
      which is promised and is dangled
      like a carrot in lieu of higher initiations.
      Define this "heaven?" Where or what
      is it? What "level?" It's just words!
      It doesn't exist but if it did......
      Klemp would be the last one to
      know! Plus, Religious Dogma
      designed for the masses will
      never get you there (heaven) if
      there is even such a "place" or
      state. Isn't this obvious by now?!

      Prometheus

      Janice Pfeiffer wrote:
      Oh wow, that sounds like more money in dues since every now and then a guilt trip will be laid on everybody to give and give some more to spread the word of the Eck especially since they haven't been very successful in dragging in more suckers. Hey, somebody has got to pay!

      prometheus wrote:

      Yes, more redundancy! After
      almost twenty years of promising
      "change" Klemp has finally
      decided how he is going to
      accomplish this. Unfortunately,
      HK's not stepping down, but
      there's always the hope that
      he will... only to be dashed to
      pieces after every Oct. 22. In
      any case, here are some of the
      incredible "program" changes
      ready to take place to revitalize
      a dying, stagnant, insignificant
      and inherited religious scam:

      * New discourse format with audio
      CD and dynamic workbook activities

      * Revitalized study program with
      updated discourses in sequence for
      chelas who have completed the first
      seventeen years of ECK study

      * Family membership to include two
      discourses and two copies of the Mystic
      World

      * Letter of Light youth newsletter to
      be included with each membership
      with children under 18

      * Easy membership donation options.
      You may give as you are able. You can
      now make monthly donations using a
      credit card in the amount of your choosing.

      See! What a change! What a revitalization!
      Whatever!!!

      Prometheus
    • Sharon
      Ha, I bet the new study program is the same old, same old - maybe they ve just rearranged the order in which they send them out again? When I first joined, I
      Message 2 of 8 , Jul 24, 2013
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        Ha, I bet the "new" study program is the same old, same old - maybe they've just rearranged the order in which they send them out again?

        When I first joined, I couldn't wait to get those "higher" discourses, looked forward to learning all those great spirichul secruds they promised - except as the years went on, they changed the order of the discourses around so formerly "high" ones were sent a lot sooner, and I eventually learned that a lot of the material was already in the "public" books - so much for those promises, and the warnings about how the profane non-eckist would self-destruct if they were allowed to peek at them!

        Hey, if anyone's got the new stuff, hope they'll make them public, scan & post them in the files here and at eckankartruth.

        Looking back - I've been out since '98 - in spite of all those death-threats about what happens when one leaves, I'd have to say the worst thing is I've got more hairs on my chin than I did back then. <gg> And the usual arthritis - except the hips & knees are mostly just fine, altho I know quite a few non-eckists who've needed new ones.

        Otherwise, my life is totally awesomely wonderful and I couldn't be happier!! Well, except I wish I was younger again. <sigh>

        Anyway - hi everyone!!!! Hope life is treating everyone well - and for any newbie exes out there, yeah it's a bit rough at first but hang in there, it takes a little time to wash the eck-crud out, but OMG you are going to be SO happy you woke up & got out!

        Think Snow, everyone!!

        Hugs,

        Sharon



        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello Janice and All,
        > Yes, Klemp states that:
        > "Eckankar is taking a vital
        > step to bring a new spiritual
        > opportunity to you, your
        > fellow Eckists, and spiritual
        > seekers around the world."
        >
        > The New ECK Study Program
        > (2013) is based upon a 1970
        > quote from PT's first Shariyat
        > and the borrowed dogma from
        > Sant Mat and a similar prophecy
        > from the Judeo-Christian Bible
        > as well as the Book of Mormon,
        > et al.:
        >
        > "ECK [Spirit] is life itself, the
        > Audible Life Stream. The time
        > is coming that will bring ECK
        > to the world as a universal
        > spiritual belief. Mankind will
        > accept it. ECK will serve all
        > races of people and all countries."
        >
        > Harold is "updating the presentation"
        > of the ECK discourses and the
        > ECK study program with a "greater
        > current" of the Light and Sound
        > of God. Really! I don't know how
        > he's doing it... more words(?) or
        > why he's waited so long but that's
        > the talk.
        >
        > Here's more from Klemp's business
        > partner and the President of Eckankar,
        > Peter Skelskey (he knows where the
        > bodies are buried):
        >
        > "All available resources of time,
        > energy, creativity, and finances
        > are being put forth to support
        > Sri Harold's vision for the future
        > of the ECK teachings on earth."
        >
        > Wow! That sounds oddly familiar.
        >
        > "The costs are substantial, yet
        > the spiritual benefits to mankind
        > are beyond measure."
        >
        > That sound familiar too!
        >
        > I wonder if Peter and Harold
        > will supply a financial report
        > in order to show where all of
        > these "costs" are going? LOL!
        >
        > ECK Mission Fund Goal -
        > Eckankar has set an initial
        > fund-raising goal for 2013
        > of $3,000,000 to help support
        > this program.
        >
        > Peter continues:
        > "Will you lend your heart and
        > hands to this great effort? Your
        > gifts, in whatever amount, are
        > truly appreciated. It will take
        > each and every one of us to
        > make it happen. You are the
        > heart and soul of the ECK mission.
        > You are a Co-worker with the
        > Mahanta."
        >
        > See, now we all know that's Bullshit
        > because we were never "Co-workers"
        > "with" Sugmad or with the Mahanta.
        > We were always "Underlings" versus
        > Co-workers. It's a hierarchy! There's
        > no equality! You work "For" the higher
        > ups and not "with" the higher ups.
        > You are evaluated by the higher ups,
        > therefore, you are not peer to them.
        > There is only the facade of Soul=Soul
        > and of being a "Co-worker." It's
        > double-talk, and smoke and mirrors.
        >
        > Here's more:
        > "Your gifts of love and service will
        > help many others find their way home
        > to God. I thank you from the bottom
        > of my heart for your help with this
        > great mission."
        >
        > From the bottom of your heart?
        > Can't you be more original than that?
        >
        > "PS If you want information on including
        > Eckankar in your will or estate plans,
        > check the designated box on the donation
        > form and return it in the enclosed envelope.
        >
        > Also, if you would like to make a donation
        > via the Eckankar website, visit xxxxxxxxx/
        > Donate to make a secure donation via the
        > Internet."
        >
        > "Learn to give, without ever
        > thinking of a reward. That's
        > how to find the treasures of
        > heaven." --Sri HK The Language of Soul
        >
        > Of course there are several problems
        > with the above quote. First, it's a
        > lie. Next, Eckists expect and are
        > owed rewards via outer Initiations.
        > That's the way it's been set-up,
        > except, Klemp (a narcissist) refuses
        > to follow the established rules.
        > And, let's talk about this "heaven"
        > which is promised and is dangled
        > like a carrot in lieu of higher initiations.
        > Define this "heaven?" Where or what
        > is it? What "level?" It's just words!
        > It doesn't exist but if it did......
        > Klemp would be the last one to
        > know! Plus, Religious Dogma
        > designed for the masses will
        > never get you there (heaven) if
        > there is even such a "place" or
        > state. Isn't this obvious by now?!
        >
        > Prometheus
        >
        > Janice Pfeiffer wrote:
        > Oh wow, that sounds like more money in dues since every now and then a guilt trip will be laid on everybody to give and give some more to spread the word of the Eck especially since they haven't been very successful in dragging in more suckers. Hey, somebody has got to pay!
        >
        > prometheus wrote:
        >
        > Yes, more redundancy! After
        > almost twenty years of promising
        > "change" Klemp has finally
        > decided how he is going to
        > accomplish this. Unfortunately,
        > HK's not stepping down, but
        > there's always the hope that
        > he will... only to be dashed to
        > pieces after every Oct. 22. In
        > any case, here are some of the
        > incredible "program" changes
        > ready to take place to revitalize
        > a dying, stagnant, insignificant
        > and inherited religious scam:
        >
        > * New discourse format with audio
        > CD and dynamic workbook activities
        >
        > * Revitalized study program with
        > updated discourses in sequence for
        > chelas who have completed the first
        > seventeen years of ECK study
        >
        > * Family membership to include two
        > discourses and two copies of the Mystic
        > World
        >
        > * Letter of Light youth newsletter to
        > be included with each membership
        > with children under 18
        >
        > * Easy membership donation options.
        > You may give as you are able. You can
        > now make monthly donations using a
        > credit card in the amount of your choosing.
        >
        > See! What a change! What a revitalization!
        > Whatever!!!
        >
        > Prometheus
        >
      • prometheus_973
        Hello Sharon and All, Glad you are doing well as are most of us who have left the cult and the lies, delusions, and codependency. Correct! These are the same
        Message 3 of 8 , Jul 24, 2013
        • 0 Attachment
          Hello Sharon and All,
          Glad you are doing well as
          are most of us who have left
          the cult and the lies, delusions,
          and codependency.

          Correct! These are the same
          17 discourses, except, they've
          been tweaked (edited), repackaged,
          and include a workbook and
          a CD. Klemp can't come up
          with anything better worth
          saying which, obviously, proves
          he's not what he claims.

          And, if one reads comments
          and perspectives from the Dali
          Lama or a host of other "spiritual"
          masters you will see that Klemp
          does not even come close to
          these higher levels of intellect
          or of consciousness.

          This is a problem for ECKists
          since Klemp claims, as the
          Mahanta, to be of the "Highest
          Consciousness" on earth and
          of all other Planes.

          Therefore, ECKists have to put
          their blinders on and not read
          other authors. Except, most
          EKists do read Rumi (a Muslim)
          and enjoy his perspectives of
          god/spirit. Why, then, can't Klemp
          express himself more cleverly
          and with more inspiration and
          spirituality than Rumi had? This
          is why EKists are in denial. They
          have no choice, unless, they begin
          to question why that huge elephant
          is standing in the corner of the room.

          Really, Klemp can't even expand
          upon the words of Rumi or of 2nd
          initiate Jesus or the Buddha. And,
          since HK is incapable of being more
          than his and PT's redundant and
          borrowed (past) thoughts and 20/20
          hindsights don't expect much from
          these discourses. What ever happened
          to prophecy? HK claims to be a
          Modern Prophet but he never proves
          it. This is one more thing that EKists
          are in denial about.

          There's actually a long list of topics
          that each ECkist must come to deny
          and never question (out loud). After
          awhile one simply accepts more and
          more lies, distortions, promises,
          assumptions, and hearsay testimonials
          on "faith."

          The belief or faith is reinforced via
          self-hypnotic suggestions and from
          the talks and discourses which result
          in "special" dreams. This self-
          hypnosis via desires has EKists look
          for "signs" to reenforce their faith.
          Others experience what seems to
          be paranormal activities as proof
          of faith and see this as Higher
          Consciousness expectation and
          promise. Little do they understand
          that Klemp had nothing to do with
          their subjective awareness of their
          mental inner/outer surroundings.

          Prometheus

          Sharon wrote:
          Ha, I bet the "new" study program is the same old, same old - maybe they've just
          rearranged the order in which they send them out again?

          When I first joined, I couldn't wait to get those "higher" discourses, looked
          forward to learning all those great spirichul secruds they promised - except as
          the years went on, they changed the order of the discourses around so formerly
          "high" ones were sent a lot sooner, and I eventually learned that a lot of the
          material was already in the "public" books - so much for those promises, and the
          warnings about how the profane non-eckist would self-destruct if they were
          allowed to peek at them!

          Hey, if anyone's got the new stuff, hope they'll make them public, scan & post
          them in the files here and at eckankartruth.

          Looking back - I've been out since '98 - in spite of all those death-threats
          about what happens when one leaves, I'd have to say the worst thing is I've got
          more hairs on my chin than I did back then. <gg> And the usual arthritis -
          except the hips & knees are mostly just fine, altho I know quite a few
          non-eckists who've needed new ones.

          Otherwise, my life is totally awesomely wonderful and I couldn't be happier!!
          Well, except I wish I was younger again. <sigh>

          Anyway - hi everyone!!!! Hope life is treating everyone well - and for any
          newbie exes out there, yeah it's a bit rough at first but hang in there, it
          takes a little time to wash the eck-crud out, but OMG you are going to be SO
          happy you woke up & got out!

          Think Snow, everyone!!

          Hugs,

          Sharon




          prometheus wrote:
          >
          > Hello Janice and All,
          > Yes, Klemp states that:
          > "Eckankar is taking a vital
          > step to bring a new spiritual
          > opportunity to you, your
          > fellow Eckists, and spiritual
          > seekers around the world."
          >
          > The New ECK Study Program
          > (2013) is based upon a 1970
          > quote from PT's first Shariyat
          > and the borrowed dogma from
          > Sant Mat and a similar prophecy
          > from the Judeo-Christian Bible
          > as well as the Book of Mormon,
          > et al.:
          >
          > "ECK [Spirit] is life itself, the
          > Audible Life Stream. The time
          > is coming that will bring ECK
          > to the world as a universal
          > spiritual belief. Mankind will
          > accept it. ECK will serve all
          > races of people and all countries."
          >
          > Harold is "updating the presentation"
          > of the ECK discourses and the
          > ECK study program with a "greater
          > current" of the Light and Sound
          > of God. Really! I don't know how
          > he's doing it... more words(?) or
          > why he's waited so long but that's
          > the talk.
          >
          > Here's more from Klemp's business
          > partner and the President of Eckankar,
          > Peter Skelskey (he knows where the
          > bodies are buried):
          >
          > "All available resources of time,
          > energy, creativity, and finances
          > are being put forth to support
          > Sri Harold's vision for the future
          > of the ECK teachings on earth."
          >
          > Wow! That sounds oddly familiar.
          >
          > "The costs are substantial, yet
          > the spiritual benefits to mankind
          > are beyond measure."
          >
          > That sound familiar too!
          >
          > I wonder if Peter and Harold
          > will supply a financial report
          > in order to show where all of
          > these "costs" are going? LOL!
          >
          > ECK Mission Fund Goal -
          > Eckankar has set an initial
          > fund-raising goal for 2013
          > of $3,000,000 to help support
          > this program.
          >
          > Peter continues:
          > "Will you lend your heart and
          > hands to this great effort? Your
          > gifts, in whatever amount, are
          > truly appreciated. It will take
          > each and every one of us to
          > make it happen. You are the
          > heart and soul of the ECK mission.
          > You are a Co-worker with the
          > Mahanta."
          >
          > See, now we all know that's Bullshit
          > because we were never "Co-workers"
          > "with" Sugmad or with the Mahanta.
          > We were always "Underlings" versus
          > Co-workers. It's a hierarchy! There's
          > no equality! You work "For" the higher
          > ups and not "with" the higher ups.
          > You are evaluated by the higher ups,
          > therefore, you are not peer to them.
          > There is only the facade of Soul=Soul
          > and of being a "Co-worker." It's
          > double-talk, and smoke and mirrors.
          >
          > Here's more:
          > "Your gifts of love and service will
          > help many others find their way home
          > to God. I thank you from the bottom
          > of my heart for your help with this
          > great mission."
          >
          > From the bottom of your heart?
          > Can't you be more original than that?
          >
          > "PS If you want information on including
          > Eckankar in your will or estate plans,
          > check the designated box on the donation
          > form and return it in the enclosed envelope.
          >
          > Also, if you would like to make a donation
          > via the Eckankar website, visit xxxxxxxxx/
          > Donate to make a secure donation via the
          > Internet."
          >
          > "Learn to give, without ever
          > thinking of a reward. That's
          > how to find the treasures of
          > heaven." --Sri HK The Language of Soul
          >
          > Of course there are several problems
          > with the above quote. First, it's a
          > lie. Next, Eckists expect and are
          > owed rewards via outer Initiations.
          > That's the way it's been set-up,
          > except, Klemp (a narcissist) refuses
          > to follow the established rules.
          > And, let's talk about this "heaven"
          > which is promised and is dangled
          > like a carrot in lieu of higher initiations.
          > Define this "heaven?" Where or what
          > is it? What "level?" It's just words!
          > It doesn't exist but if it did......
          > Klemp would be the last one to
          > know! Plus, Religious Dogma
          > designed for the masses will
          > never get you there (heaven) if
          > there is even such a "place" or
          > state. Isn't this obvious by now?!
          >
          > Prometheus
          >
          > Janice Pfeiffer wrote:
          > Oh wow, that sounds like more money in dues since every now and then a guilt
          trip will be laid on everybody to give and give some more to spread the word of
          the Eck especially since they haven't been very successful in dragging in more
          suckers. Hey, somebody has got to pay!
          >
          > prometheus wrote:
          >
          > Yes, more redundancy! After
          > almost twenty years of promising
          > "change" Klemp has finally
          > decided how he is going to
          > accomplish this. Unfortunately,
          > HK's not stepping down, but
          > there's always the hope that
          > he will... only to be dashed to
          > pieces after every Oct. 22. In
          > any case, here are some of the
          > incredible "program" changes
          > ready to take place to revitalize
          > a dying, stagnant, insignificant
          > and inherited religious scam:
          >
          > * New discourse format with audio
          > CD and dynamic workbook activities
          >
          > * Revitalized study program with
          > updated discourses in sequence for
          > chelas who have completed the first
          > seventeen years of ECK study
          >
          > * Family membership to include two
          > discourses and two copies of the Mystic
          > World
          >
          > * Letter of Light youth newsletter to
          > be included with each membership
          > with children under 18
          >
          > * Easy membership donation options.
          > You may give as you are able. You can
          > now make monthly donations using a
          > credit card in the amount of your choosing.
          >
          > See! What a change! What a revitalization!
          > Whatever!!!
          >
          > Prometheus
        • noneckchains
          To those who actually want to believe that klemp is the highest state of consciousness, well anything that he utters, no matter how inane or outright dumb, is
          Message 4 of 8 , Jul 25, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            To those who actually want to believe that klemp is the highest state of consciousness, well anything that he utters, no matter how inane or outright dumb, is considered some kind of golden wisdom. The eckist may actually believe that he is being a shifty Godman that is showing proof of no ego or some other absurd rationalization.

            Non ;)

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hello Sharon and All,
            > Glad you are doing well as
            > are most of us who have left
            > the cult and the lies, delusions,
            > and codependency.
            >
            > Correct! These are the same
            > 17 discourses, except, they've
            > been tweaked (edited), repackaged,
            > and include a workbook and
            > a CD. Klemp can't come up
            > with anything better worth
            > saying which, obviously, proves
            > he's not what he claims.
            >
            > And, if one reads comments
            > and perspectives from the Dali
            > Lama or a host of other "spiritual"
            > masters you will see that Klemp
            > does not even come close to
            > these higher levels of intellect
            > or of consciousness.
            >
            > This is a problem for ECKists
            > since Klemp claims, as the
            > Mahanta, to be of the "Highest
            > Consciousness" on earth and
            > of all other Planes.
            >
            > Therefore, ECKists have to put
            > their blinders on and not read
            > other authors. Except, most
            > EKists do read Rumi (a Muslim)
            > and enjoy his perspectives of
            > god/spirit. Why, then, can't Klemp
            > express himself more cleverly
            > and with more inspiration and
            > spirituality than Rumi had? This
            > is why EKists are in denial. They
            > have no choice, unless, they begin
            > to question why that huge elephant
            > is standing in the corner of the room.
            >
            > Really, Klemp can't even expand
            > upon the words of Rumi or of 2nd
            > initiate Jesus or the Buddha. And,
            > since HK is incapable of being more
            > than his and PT's redundant and
            > borrowed (past) thoughts and 20/20
            > hindsights don't expect much from
            > these discourses. What ever happened
            > to prophecy? HK claims to be a
            > Modern Prophet but he never proves
            > it. This is one more thing that EKists
            > are in denial about.
            >
            > There's actually a long list of topics
            > that each ECkist must come to deny
            > and never question (out loud). After
            > awhile one simply accepts more and
            > more lies, distortions, promises,
            > assumptions, and hearsay testimonials
            > on "faith."
            >
            > The belief or faith is reinforced via
            > self-hypnotic suggestions and from
            > the talks and discourses which result
            > in "special" dreams. This self-
            > hypnosis via desires has EKists look
            > for "signs" to reenforce their faith.
            > Others experience what seems to
            > be paranormal activities as proof
            > of faith and see this as Higher
            > Consciousness expectation and
            > promise. Little do they understand
            > that Klemp had nothing to do with
            > their subjective awareness of their
            > mental inner/outer surroundings.
            >
            > Prometheus
            >
            > Sharon wrote:
            > Ha, I bet the "new" study program is the same old, same old - maybe they've just
            > rearranged the order in which they send them out again?
            >
            > When I first joined, I couldn't wait to get those "higher" discourses, looked
            > forward to learning all those great spirichul secruds they promised - except as
            > the years went on, they changed the order of the discourses around so formerly
            > "high" ones were sent a lot sooner, and I eventually learned that a lot of the
            > material was already in the "public" books - so much for those promises, and the
            > warnings about how the profane non-eckist would self-destruct if they were
            > allowed to peek at them!
            >
            > Hey, if anyone's got the new stuff, hope they'll make them public, scan & post
            > them in the files here and at eckankartruth.
            >
            > Looking back - I've been out since '98 - in spite of all those death-threats
            > about what happens when one leaves, I'd have to say the worst thing is I've got
            > more hairs on my chin than I did back then. <gg> And the usual arthritis -
            > except the hips & knees are mostly just fine, altho I know quite a few
            > non-eckists who've needed new ones.
            >
            > Otherwise, my life is totally awesomely wonderful and I couldn't be happier!!
            > Well, except I wish I was younger again. <sigh>
            >
            > Anyway - hi everyone!!!! Hope life is treating everyone well - and for any
            > newbie exes out there, yeah it's a bit rough at first but hang in there, it
            > takes a little time to wash the eck-crud out, but OMG you are going to be SO
            > happy you woke up & got out!
            >
            > Think Snow, everyone!!
            >
            > Hugs,
            >
            > Sharon
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > prometheus wrote:
            > >
            > > Hello Janice and All,
            > > Yes, Klemp states that:
            > > "Eckankar is taking a vital
            > > step to bring a new spiritual
            > > opportunity to you, your
            > > fellow Eckists, and spiritual
            > > seekers around the world."
            > >
            > > The New ECK Study Program
            > > (2013) is based upon a 1970
            > > quote from PT's first Shariyat
            > > and the borrowed dogma from
            > > Sant Mat and a similar prophecy
            > > from the Judeo-Christian Bible
            > > as well as the Book of Mormon,
            > > et al.:
            > >
            > > "ECK [Spirit] is life itself, the
            > > Audible Life Stream. The time
            > > is coming that will bring ECK
            > > to the world as a universal
            > > spiritual belief. Mankind will
            > > accept it. ECK will serve all
            > > races of people and all countries."
            > >
            > > Harold is "updating the presentation"
            > > of the ECK discourses and the
            > > ECK study program with a "greater
            > > current" of the Light and Sound
            > > of God. Really! I don't know how
            > > he's doing it... more words(?) or
            > > why he's waited so long but that's
            > > the talk.
            > >
            > > Here's more from Klemp's business
            > > partner and the President of Eckankar,
            > > Peter Skelskey (he knows where the
            > > bodies are buried):
            > >
            > > "All available resources of time,
            > > energy, creativity, and finances
            > > are being put forth to support
            > > Sri Harold's vision for the future
            > > of the ECK teachings on earth."
            > >
            > > Wow! That sounds oddly familiar.
            > >
            > > "The costs are substantial, yet
            > > the spiritual benefits to mankind
            > > are beyond measure."
            > >
            > > That sound familiar too!
            > >
            > > I wonder if Peter and Harold
            > > will supply a financial report
            > > in order to show where all of
            > > these "costs" are going? LOL!
            > >
            > > ECK Mission Fund Goal -
            > > Eckankar has set an initial
            > > fund-raising goal for 2013
            > > of $3,000,000 to help support
            > > this program.
            > >
            > > Peter continues:
            > > "Will you lend your heart and
            > > hands to this great effort? Your
            > > gifts, in whatever amount, are
            > > truly appreciated. It will take
            > > each and every one of us to
            > > make it happen. You are the
            > > heart and soul of the ECK mission.
            > > You are a Co-worker with the
            > > Mahanta."
            > >
            > > See, now we all know that's Bullshit
            > > because we were never "Co-workers"
            > > "with" Sugmad or with the Mahanta.
            > > We were always "Underlings" versus
            > > Co-workers. It's a hierarchy! There's
            > > no equality! You work "For" the higher
            > > ups and not "with" the higher ups.
            > > You are evaluated by the higher ups,
            > > therefore, you are not peer to them.
            > > There is only the facade of Soul=Soul
            > > and of being a "Co-worker." It's
            > > double-talk, and smoke and mirrors.
            > >
            > > Here's more:
            > > "Your gifts of love and service will
            > > help many others find their way home
            > > to God. I thank you from the bottom
            > > of my heart for your help with this
            > > great mission."
            > >
            > > From the bottom of your heart?
            > > Can't you be more original than that?
            > >
            > > "PS If you want information on including
            > > Eckankar in your will or estate plans,
            > > check the designated box on the donation
            > > form and return it in the enclosed envelope.
            > >
            > > Also, if you would like to make a donation
            > > via the Eckankar website, visit xxxxxxxxx/
            > > Donate to make a secure donation via the
            > > Internet."
            > >
            > > "Learn to give, without ever
            > > thinking of a reward. That's
            > > how to find the treasures of
            > > heaven." --Sri HK The Language of Soul
            > >
            > > Of course there are several problems
            > > with the above quote. First, it's a
            > > lie. Next, Eckists expect and are
            > > owed rewards via outer Initiations.
            > > That's the way it's been set-up,
            > > except, Klemp (a narcissist) refuses
            > > to follow the established rules.
            > > And, let's talk about this "heaven"
            > > which is promised and is dangled
            > > like a carrot in lieu of higher initiations.
            > > Define this "heaven?" Where or what
            > > is it? What "level?" It's just words!
            > > It doesn't exist but if it did......
            > > Klemp would be the last one to
            > > know! Plus, Religious Dogma
            > > designed for the masses will
            > > never get you there (heaven) if
            > > there is even such a "place" or
            > > state. Isn't this obvious by now?!
            > >
            > > Prometheus
            > >
            > > Janice Pfeiffer wrote:
            > > Oh wow, that sounds like more money in dues since every now and then a guilt
            > trip will be laid on everybody to give and give some more to spread the word of
            > the Eck especially since they haven't been very successful in dragging in more
            > suckers. Hey, somebody has got to pay!
            > >
            > > prometheus wrote:
            > >
            > > Yes, more redundancy! After
            > > almost twenty years of promising
            > > "change" Klemp has finally
            > > decided how he is going to
            > > accomplish this. Unfortunately,
            > > HK's not stepping down, but
            > > there's always the hope that
            > > he will... only to be dashed to
            > > pieces after every Oct. 22. In
            > > any case, here are some of the
            > > incredible "program" changes
            > > ready to take place to revitalize
            > > a dying, stagnant, insignificant
            > > and inherited religious scam:
            > >
            > > * New discourse format with audio
            > > CD and dynamic workbook activities
            > >
            > > * Revitalized study program with
            > > updated discourses in sequence for
            > > chelas who have completed the first
            > > seventeen years of ECK study
            > >
            > > * Family membership to include two
            > > discourses and two copies of the Mystic
            > > World
            > >
            > > * Letter of Light youth newsletter to
            > > be included with each membership
            > > with children under 18
            > >
            > > * Easy membership donation options.
            > > You may give as you are able. You can
            > > now make monthly donations using a
            > > credit card in the amount of your choosing.
            > >
            > > See! What a change! What a revitalization!
            > > Whatever!!!
            > >
            > > Prometheus
            >
          • Janice Pfeiffer
            While I was in the org, whenever I heard HK speak, I felt like I had to slow down my hearing. my thinking and my feelings because he was so incredibly slow,
            Message 5 of 8 , Jul 26, 2013
            • 0 Attachment
              While I was in the org, whenever I heard HK speak, I felt like I had to slow down my hearing. my thinking and my feelings because he was so incredibly slow, bland and unimaginative and every fiber of my being was aware of it.  I made continued pitiful attempts to say that my attitude was to blame and I needed to learn respect and appreciation for the LEM.  In fact, I beat myself up a lot because try though I might, I couldn't get past those ideas about HKs deficiencies.  I didn't talk about him at all while I tried to reconcile myself about the LEM. There was some pretty good stuff in all the books I read and so I just tried to stop myself from thinking about the obvious idiot who no one would dare call an idiot and who was touted as the most developed, the most powerful and the most remarkable individual living in physical form.  Today, I am proud to say that I have forgotten all about that ridiculous self denial and I am pleased to be able to say that I believe HK to border on being mentally challenged and most definitely, I feel his talks show blatant lack of inspiration and creativity.  I say these things with out malice but state I do have a need to express what I tried to deny as a good eckist.  I just couldn't get to the point of total disillusion as other good eckist and I could not get mesmerized by the power that this man was touted as having since it wasn't evidenced by his thoughts, words or deeds.   In fact, he showed blatant immaturity and so did a lot of the H.Is..  So I will simple say it now like I SEE it is.  Him who look and act like idiot, most likely is idiot. 

              From: noneckchains <eckchains@...>
              To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Friday, July 26, 2013 1:32 AM
              Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: Eckankar Renews, Revitalizes, Revamps, Repeats, and Regurgitates
               
              To those who actually want to believe that klemp is the highest state of consciousness, well anything that he utters, no matter how inane or outright dumb, is considered some kind of golden wisdom. The eckist may actually believe that he is being a shifty Godman that is showing proof of no ego or some other absurd rationalization.

              Non ;)

              --- In mailto:EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous%40yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hello Sharon and All,
              > Glad you are doing well as
              > are most of us who have left
              > the cult and the lies, delusions,
              > and codependency.
              >
              > Correct! These are the same
              > 17 discourses, except, they've
              > been tweaked (edited), repackaged,
              > and include a workbook and
              > a CD. Klemp can't come up
              > with anything better worth
              > saying which, obviously, proves
              > he's not what he claims.
              >
              > And, if one reads comments
              > and perspectives from the Dali
              > Lama or a host of other "spiritual"
              > masters you will see that Klemp
              > does not even come close to
              > these higher levels of intellect
              > or of consciousness.
              >
              > This is a problem for ECKists
              > since Klemp claims, as the
              > Mahanta, to be of the "Highest
              > Consciousness" on earth and
              > of all other Planes.
              >
              > Therefore, ECKists have to put
              > their blinders on and not read
              > other authors. Except, most
              > EKists do read Rumi (a Muslim)
              > and enjoy his perspectives of
              > god/spirit. Why, then, can't Klemp
              > express himself more cleverly
              > and with more inspiration and
              > spirituality than Rumi had? This
              > is why EKists are in denial. They
              > have no choice, unless, they begin
              > to question why that huge elephant
              > is standing in the corner of the room.
              >
              > Really, Klemp can't even expand
              > upon the words of Rumi or of 2nd
              > initiate Jesus or the Buddha. And,
              > since HK is incapable of being more
              > than his and PT's redundant and
              > borrowed (past) thoughts and 20/20
              > hindsights don't expect much from
              > these discourses. What ever happened
              > to prophecy? HK claims to be a
              > Modern Prophet but he never proves
              > it. This is one more thing that EKists
              > are in denial about.
              >
              > There's actually a long list of topics
              > that each ECkist must come to deny
              > and never question (out loud). After
              > awhile one simply accepts more and
              > more lies, distortions, promises,
              > assumptions, and hearsay testimonials
              > on "faith."
              >
              > The belief or faith is reinforced via
              > self-hypnotic suggestions and from
              > the talks and discourses which result
              > in "special" dreams. This self-
              > hypnosis via desires has EKists look
              > for "signs" to reenforce their faith.
              > Others experience what seems to
              > be paranormal activities as proof
              > of faith and see this as Higher
              > Consciousness expectation and
              > promise. Little do they understand
              > that Klemp had nothing to do with
              > their subjective awareness of their
              > mental inner/outer surroundings.
              >
              > Prometheus
              >
              > Sharon wrote:
              > Ha, I bet the "new" study program is the same old, same old - maybe they've just
              > rearranged the order in which they send them out again?
              >
              > When I first joined, I couldn't wait to get those "higher" discourses, looked
              > forward to learning all those great spirichul secruds they promised - except as
              > the years went on, they changed the order of the discourses around so formerly
              > "high" ones were sent a lot sooner, and I eventually learned that a lot of the
              > material was already in the "public" books - so much for those promises, and the
              > warnings about how the profane non-eckist would self-destruct if they were
              > allowed to peek at them!
              >
              > Hey, if anyone's got the new stuff, hope they'll make them public, scan & post
              > them in the files here and at eckankartruth.
              >
              > Looking back - I've been out since '98 - in spite of all those death-threats
              > about what happens when one leaves, I'd have to say the worst thing is I've got
              > more hairs on my chin than I did back then. <gg> And the usual arthritis -
              > except the hips & knees are mostly just fine, altho I know quite a few
              > non-eckists who've needed new ones.
              >
              > Otherwise, my life is totally awesomely wonderful and I couldn't be happier!!
              > Well, except I wish I was younger again. <sigh>
              >
              > Anyway - hi everyone!!!! Hope life is treating everyone well - and for any
              > newbie exes out there, yeah it's a bit rough at first but hang in there, it
              > takes a little time to wash the eck-crud out, but OMG you are going to be SO
              > happy you woke up & got out!
              >
              > Think Snow, everyone!!
              >
              > Hugs,
              >
              > Sharon
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > prometheus wrote:
              > >
              > > Hello Janice and All,
              > > Yes, Klemp states that:
              > > "Eckankar is taking a vital
              > > step to bring a new spiritual
              > > opportunity to you, your
              > > fellow Eckists, and spiritual
              > > seekers around the world."
              > >
              > > The New ECK Study Program
              > > (2013) is based upon a 1970
              > > quote from PT's first Shariyat
              > > and the borrowed dogma from
              > > Sant Mat and a similar prophecy
              > > from the Judeo-Christian Bible
              > > as well as the Book of Mormon,
              > > et al.:
              > >
              > > "ECK [Spirit] is life itself, the
              > > Audible Life Stream. The time
              > > is coming that will bring ECK
              > > to the world as a universal
              > > spiritual belief. Mankind will
              > > accept it. ECK will serve all
              > > races of people and all countries."
              > >
              > > Harold is "updating the presentation"
              > > of the ECK discourses and the
              > > ECK study program with a "greater
              > > current" of the Light and Sound
              > > of God. Really! I don't know how
              > > he's doing it... more words(?) or
              > > why he's waited so long but that's
              > > the talk.
              > >
              > > Here's more from Klemp's business
              > > partner and the President of Eckankar,
              > > Peter Skelskey (he knows where the
              > > bodies are buried):
              > >
              > > "All available resources of time,
              > > energy, creativity, and finances
              > > are being put forth to support
              > > Sri Harold's vision for the future
              > > of the ECK teachings on earth."
              > >
              > > Wow! That sounds oddly familiar.
              > >
              > > "The costs are substantial, yet
              > > the spiritual benefits to mankind
              > > are beyond measure."
              > >
              > > That sound familiar too!
              > >
              > > I wonder if Peter and Harold
              > > will supply a financial report
              > > in order to show where all of
              > > these "costs" are going? LOL!
              > >
              > > ECK Mission Fund Goal -
              > > Eckankar has set an initial
              > > fund-raising goal for 2013
              > > of $3,000,000 to help support
              > > this program.
              > >
              > > Peter continues:
              > > "Will you lend your heart and
              > > hands to this great effort? Your
              > > gifts, in whatever amount, are
              > > truly appreciated. It will take
              > > each and every one of us to
              > > make it happen. You are the
              > > heart and soul of the ECK mission.
              > > You are a Co-worker with the
              > > Mahanta."
              > >
              > > See, now we all know that's Bullshit
              > > because we were never "Co-workers"
              > > "with" Sugmad or with the Mahanta.
              > > We were always "Underlings" versus
              > > Co-workers. It's a hierarchy! There's
              > > no equality! You work "For" the higher
              > > ups and not "with" the higher ups.
              > > You are evaluated by the higher ups,
              > > therefore, you are not peer to them.
              > > There is only the facade of Soul=Soul
              > > and of being a "Co-worker." It's
              > > double-talk, and smoke and mirrors.
              > >
              > > Here's more:
              > > "Your gifts of love and service will
              > > help many others find their way home
              > > to God. I thank you from the bottom
              > > of my heart for your help with this
              > > great mission."
              > >
              > > From the bottom of your heart?
              > > Can't you be more original than that?
              > >
              > > "PS If you want information on including
              > > Eckankar in your will or estate plans,
              > > check the designated box on the donation
              > > form and return it in the enclosed envelope.
              > >
              > > Also, if you would like to make a donation
              > > via the Eckankar website, visit xxxxxxxxx/
              > > Donate to make a secure donation via the
              > > Internet."
              > >
              > > "Learn to give, without ever
              > > thinking of a reward. That's
              > > how to find the treasures of
              > > heaven." --Sri HK The Language of Soul
              > >
              > > Of course there are several problems
              > > with the above quote. First, it's a
              > > lie. Next, Eckists expect and are
              > > owed rewards via outer Initiations.
              > > That's the way it's been set-up,
              > > except, Klemp (a narcissist) refuses
              > > to follow the established rules.
              > > And, let's talk about this "heaven"
              > > which is promised and is dangled
              > > like a carrot in lieu of higher initiations.
              > > Define this "heaven?" Where or what
              > > is it? What "level?" It's just words!
              > > It doesn't exist but if it did......
              > > Klemp would be the last one to
              > > know! Plus, Religious Dogma
              > > designed for the masses will
              > > never get you there (heaven) if
              > > there is even such a "place" or
              > > state. Isn't this obvious by now?!
              > >
              > > Prometheus
              > >
              > > Janice Pfeiffer wrote:
              > > Oh wow, that sounds like more money in dues since every now and then a guilt
              > trip will be laid on everybody to give and give some more to spread the word of
              > the Eck especially since they haven't been very successful in dragging in more
              > suckers. Hey, somebody has got to pay!
              > >
              > > prometheus wrote:
              > >
              > > Yes, more redundancy! After
              > > almost twenty years of promising
              > > "change" Klemp has finally
              > > decided how he is going to
              > > accomplish this. Unfortunately,
              > > HK's not stepping down, but
              > > there's always the hope that
              > > he will... only to be dashed to
              > > pieces after every Oct. 22. In
              > > any case, here are some of the
              > > incredible "program" changes
              > > ready to take place to revitalize
              > > a dying, stagnant, insignificant
              > > and inherited religious scam:
              > >
              > > * New discourse format with audio
              > > CD and dynamic workbook activities
              > >
              > > * Revitalized study program with
              > > updated discourses in sequence for
              > > chelas who have completed the first
              > > seventeen years of ECK study
              > >
              > > * Family membership to include two
              > > discourses and two copies of the Mystic
              > > World
              > >
              > > * Letter of Light youth newsletter to
              > > be included with each membership
              > > with children under 18
              > >
              > > * Easy membership donation options.
              > > You may give as you are able. You can
              > > now make monthly donations using a
              > > credit card in the amount of your choosing.
              > >
              > > See! What a change! What a revitalization!
              > > Whatever!!!
              > >
              > > Prometheus
              >

            • prometheus_973
              Hello Janice, Thanks for sharing your insights. I can relate to what you ve experienced. I always tried, like others, to buy into the whole spiel, about the
              Message 6 of 8 , Jul 27, 2013
              • 0 Attachment
                Hello Janice,
                Thanks for sharing your
                insights. I can relate to
                what you've experienced.

                I always tried, like others,
                to buy into the whole spiel,
                about the Mahanta, but there
                were just too many holes in
                the logic. I really tried and
                at one time thought it was
                me who was the problem.

                However, I was an observer
                and I looked and listened
                closely to what the H.I.s
                were doing and saying
                (behind closed doors too).
                It was schizophrenic and
                hypocritical at best. Still,
                they were 6ths and 7ths.
                Why was that? To violate
                the Four Zoas and yet the
                Mahanta knew nothing
                about it and would promote
                them! The whole goal was
                that next initiation, more
                and more were needed
                to reach that ultimate goal.

                Eckankar became a second
                job... in sales. And to be a
                good salesman you have to
                believe in the product.... or
                at least make it sound like
                you do. I could talk the talk
                and I had plenty of phenomenal
                experiences to walk the walk.

                However, the real problem
                was not sounding like every
                one else in a New Age religion
                or philosophy. One's described
                "spiritual benefits" sounded
                like every other religious
                testimonial. This is why many
                ECKists don't like reading
                non-approved books, although,
                many do. Most EKists don't
                want to clutter their minds
                with mental complexities.
                Thus, simple minded books
                on Animal Angels fulfills
                their non-discourse needs.

                Many H.I.s don't really buy
                into Klemp's Guidelines or
                his (and Twitchell's) exaggerated
                description of the Mahanta's
                abilities. After all, shouldn't
                some of that "All Knowingness"
                and Prophecy carryover into
                the Physical? Klemp is a low
                scale pretender who can only
                get away with his act when
                using it on those who have
                already bought and drank
                the kool-aid. They have
                nothing else except for
                Eckankar, their friends,
                their hopes, everything
                is illusion, especially, those
                initiations. Thus, Eckankar
                and it's dogma, ECK Masters,
                etc. is all fictional.

                I wonder how EKists justify
                having a Garden of Eden
                (see Polarians) with Adom
                and Ede... another letter
                switch around, addition
                and omission used by PT.
                ECKists have laughed at
                Christians for believing
                in a Garden of Eden when,
                if they'd read and pay attention,
                would see that Eckankar had
                one as well.... the same one!

                Prometheus







                Janice Pfeiffer wrote:
                While I was in the org, whenever I heard HK speak, I felt like I had to slow down my hearing. my thinking and my feelings because he was so incredibly slow, bland and unimaginative and every fiber of my being was aware of it. I made continued pitiful attempts to say that my attitude was to blame and I needed to learn respect and appreciation for the LEM. In fact, I beat myself up a lot because try though I might, I couldn't get past those ideas about HKs deficiencies. I didn't talk about him at all while I tried to reconcile myself about the LEM. There was some pretty good stuff in all the books I read and so I just tried to stop myself from thinking about the obvious idiot who no one would dare call an idiot and who was touted as the most developed, the most powerful and the most remarkable individual living in physical form. Today, I am proud to say that I have forgotten all about that ridiculous self denial and I am pleased to be able to say that I believe HK to border on being mentally challenged and most definitely, I feel his talks show blatant lack of inspiration and creativity. I say these things with out malice but state I do have a need to express what I tried to deny as a good eckist. I just couldn't get to the point of total disillusion as other good eckist and I could not get mesmerized by the power that this man was touted as having since it wasn't evidenced by his thoughts, words or deeds. In fact, he showed blatant immaturity and so did a lot of the H.Is.. So I will simple say it now like I SEE it is. Him who look and act like idiot, most likely is idiot.

                eckchains wrote:


                To those who actually want to believe that klemp is the highest state of consciousness, well anything that he utters, no matter how inane or outright dumb, is considered some kind of golden wisdom. The eckist may actually believe that he is being a shifty Godman that is showing proof of no ego or some other absurd rationalization.

                Non ;)

                prometheus wrote:
                >
                > Hello Sharon and All,
                > Glad you are doing well as
                > are most of us who have left
                > the cult and the lies, delusions,
                > and codependency.
                >
                > Correct! These are the same
                > 17 discourses, except, they've
                > been tweaked (edited), repackaged,
                > and include a workbook and
                > a CD. Klemp can't come up
                > with anything better worth
                > saying which, obviously, proves
                > he's not what he claims.
                >
                > And, if one reads comments
                > and perspectives from the Dali
                > Lama or a host of other "spiritual"
                > masters you will see that Klemp
                > does not even come close to
                > these higher levels of intellect
                > or of consciousness.
                >
                > This is a problem for ECKists
                > since Klemp claims, as the
                > Mahanta, to be of the "Highest
                > Consciousness" on earth and
                > of all other Planes.
                >
                > Therefore, ECKists have to put
                > their blinders on and not read
                > other authors. Except, most
                > EKists do read Rumi (a Muslim)
                > and enjoy his perspectives of
                > god/spirit. Why, then, can't Klemp
                > express himself more cleverly
                > and with more inspiration and
                > spirituality than Rumi had? This
                > is why EKists are in denial. They
                > have no choice, unless, they begin
                > to question why that huge elephant
                > is standing in the corner of the room.
                >
                > Really, Klemp can't even expand
                > upon the words of Rumi or of 2nd
                > initiate Jesus or the Buddha. And,
                > since HK is incapable of being more
                > than his and PT's redundant and
                > borrowed (past) thoughts and 20/20
                > hindsights don't expect much from
                > these discourses. What ever happened
                > to prophecy? HK claims to be a
                > Modern Prophet but he never proves
                > it. This is one more thing that EKists
                > are in denial about.
                >
                > There's actually a long list of topics
                > that each ECkist must come to deny
                > and never question (out loud). After
                > awhile one simply accepts more and
                > more lies, distortions, promises,
                > assumptions, and hearsay testimonials
                > on "faith."
                >
                > The belief or faith is reinforced via
                > self-hypnotic suggestions and from
                > the talks and discourses which result
                > in "special" dreams. This self-
                > hypnosis via desires has EKists look
                > for "signs" to reenforce their faith.
                > Others experience what seems to
                > be paranormal activities as proof
                > of faith and see this as Higher
                > Consciousness expectation and
                > promise. Little do they understand
                > that Klemp had nothing to do with
                > their subjective awareness of their
                > mental inner/outer surroundings.
                >
                > Prometheus
                >
                > Sharon wrote:
                > Ha, I bet the "new" study program is the same old, same old - maybe they've just
                > rearranged the order in which they send them out again?
                >
                > When I first joined, I couldn't wait to get those "higher" discourses, looked
                > forward to learning all those great spirichul secruds they promised - except as
                > the years went on, they changed the order of the discourses around so formerly
                > "high" ones were sent a lot sooner, and I eventually learned that a lot of the
                > material was already in the "public" books - so much for those promises, and the
                > warnings about how the profane non-eckist would self-destruct if they were
                > allowed to peek at them!
                >
                > Hey, if anyone's got the new stuff, hope they'll make them public, scan & post
                > them in the files here and at eckankartruth.
                >
                > Looking back - I've been out since '98 - in spite of all those death-threats
                > about what happens when one leaves, I'd have to say the worst thing is I've got
                > more hairs on my chin than I did back then. <gg> And the usual arthritis -
                > except the hips & knees are mostly just fine, altho I know quite a few
                > non-eckists who've needed new ones.
                >
                > Otherwise, my life is totally awesomely wonderful and I couldn't be happier!!
                > Well, except I wish I was younger again. <sigh>
                >
                > Anyway - hi everyone!!!! Hope life is treating everyone well - and for any
                > newbie exes out there, yeah it's a bit rough at first but hang in there, it
                > takes a little time to wash the eck-crud out, but OMG you are going to be SO
                > happy you woke up & got out!
                >
                > Think Snow, everyone!!
                >
                > Hugs,
                >
                > Sharon
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > prometheus wrote:
                > >
                > > Hello Janice and All,
                > > Yes, Klemp states that:
                > > "Eckankar is taking a vital
                > > step to bring a new spiritual
                > > opportunity to you, your
                > > fellow Eckists, and spiritual
                > > seekers around the world."
                > >
                > > The New ECK Study Program
                > > (2013) is based upon a 1970
                > > quote from PT's first Shariyat
                > > and the borrowed dogma from
                > > Sant Mat and a similar prophecy
                > > from the Judeo-Christian Bible
                > > as well as the Book of Mormon,
                > > et al.:
                > >
                > > "ECK [Spirit] is life itself, the
                > > Audible Life Stream. The time
                > > is coming that will bring ECK
                > > to the world as a universal
                > > spiritual belief. Mankind will
                > > accept it. ECK will serve all
                > > races of people and all countries."
                > >
                > > Harold is "updating the presentation"
                > > of the ECK discourses and the
                > > ECK study program with a "greater
                > > current" of the Light and Sound
                > > of God. Really! I don't know how
                > > he's doing it... more words(?) or
                > > why he's waited so long but that's
                > > the talk.
                > >
                > > Here's more from Klemp's business
                > > partner and the President of Eckankar,
                > > Peter Skelskey (he knows where the
                > > bodies are buried):
                > >
                > > "All available resources of time,
                > > energy, creativity, and finances
                > > are being put forth to support
                > > Sri Harold's vision for the future
                > > of the ECK teachings on earth."
                > >
                > > Wow! That sounds oddly familiar.
                > >
                > > "The costs are substantial, yet
                > > the spiritual benefits to mankind
                > > are beyond measure."
                > >
                > > That sound familiar too!
                > >
                > > I wonder if Peter and Harold
                > > will supply a financial report
                > > in order to show where all of
                > > these "costs" are going? LOL!
                > >
                > > ECK Mission Fund Goal -
                > > Eckankar has set an initial
                > > fund-raising goal for 2013
                > > of $3,000,000 to help support
                > > this program.
                > >
                > > Peter continues:
                > > "Will you lend your heart and
                > > hands to this great effort? Your
                > > gifts, in whatever amount, are
                > > truly appreciated. It will take
                > > each and every one of us to
                > > make it happen. You are the
                > > heart and soul of the ECK mission.
                > > You are a Co-worker with the
                > > Mahanta."
                > >
                > > See, now we all know that's Bullshit
                > > because we were never "Co-workers"
                > > "with" Sugmad or with the Mahanta.
                > > We were always "Underlings" versus
                > > Co-workers. It's a hierarchy! There's
                > > no equality! You work "For" the higher
                > > ups and not "with" the higher ups.
                > > You are evaluated by the higher ups,
                > > therefore, you are not peer to them.
                > > There is only the facade of Soul=Soul
                > > and of being a "Co-worker." It's
                > > double-talk, and smoke and mirrors.
                > >
                > > Here's more:
                > > "Your gifts of love and service will
                > > help many others find their way home
                > > to God. I thank you from the bottom
                > > of my heart for your help with this
                > > great mission."
                > >
                > > From the bottom of your heart?
                > > Can't you be more original than that?
                > >
                > > "PS If you want information on including
                > > Eckankar in your will or estate plans,
                > > check the designated box on the donation
                > > form and return it in the enclosed envelope.
                > >
                > > Also, if you would like to make a donation
                > > via the Eckankar website, visit xxxxxxxxx/
                > > Donate to make a secure donation via the
                > > Internet."
                > >
                > > "Learn to give, without ever
                > > thinking of a reward. That's
                > > how to find the treasures of
                > > heaven." --Sri HK The Language of Soul
                > >
                > > Of course there are several problems
                > > with the above quote. First, it's a
                > > lie. Next, Eckists expect and are
                > > owed rewards via outer Initiations.
                > > That's the way it's been set-up,
                > > except, Klemp (a narcissist) refuses
                > > to follow the established rules.
                > > And, let's talk about this "heaven"
                > > which is promised and is dangled
                > > like a carrot in lieu of higher initiations.
                > > Define this "heaven?" Where or what
                > > is it? What "level?" It's just words!
                > > It doesn't exist but if it did......
                > > Klemp would be the last one to
                > > know! Plus, Religious Dogma
                > > designed for the masses will
                > > never get you there (heaven) if
                > > there is even such a "place" or
                > > state. Isn't this obvious by now?!
                > >
                > > Prometheus
                > >
                > > Janice Pfeiffer wrote:
                > > Oh wow, that sounds like more money in dues since every now and then a guilt
                > trip will be laid on everybody to give and give some more to spread the word of
                > the Eck especially since they haven't been very successful in dragging in more
                > suckers. Hey, somebody has got to pay!
                > >
                > > prometheus wrote:
                > >
                > > Yes, more redundancy! After
                > > almost twenty years of promising
                > > "change" Klemp has finally
                > > decided how he is going to
                > > accomplish this. Unfortunately,
                > > HK's not stepping down, but
                > > there's always the hope that
                > > he will... only to be dashed to
                > > pieces after every Oct. 22. In
                > > any case, here are some of the
                > > incredible "program" changes
                > > ready to take place to revitalize
                > > a dying, stagnant, insignificant
                > > and inherited religious scam:
                > >
                > > * New discourse format with audio
                > > CD and dynamic workbook activities
                > >
                > > * Revitalized study program with
                > > updated discourses in sequence for
                > > chelas who have completed the first
                > > seventeen years of ECK study
                > >
                > > * Family membership to include two
                > > discourses and two copies of the Mystic
                > > World
                > >
                > > * Letter of Light youth newsletter to
                > > be included with each membership
                > > with children under 18
                > >
                > > * Easy membership donation options.
                > > You may give as you are able. You can
                > > now make monthly donations using a
                > > credit card in the amount of your choosing.
                > >
                > > See! What a change! What a revitalization!
                > > Whatever!!!
                > >
                > > Prometheus
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