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Re: karma

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  • Diana Stanley
    I belive our bodies and the mindstuff can be recyled and use to create a new form for Spirit to utalize but our personality is not reincarnated The personality
    Message 1 of 16 , Jul 13, 2012
      I belive our bodies and the mindstuff can be recyled and use to create a new form for Spirit to utalize but our personality is not reincarnated The personality is created by our personal experience in this life. It doesn't cross over to another life. A new personality is created every time Spitit asumes a physical form. Diana


      --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
      >
      > The jury is still out for
      > me. Now, as far as all of
      > those different types of
      > karma that's different....
      > it's even more difficult
      > to see or buy into since
      > experts, like Twit and Klemp,
      > are mostly conmen. However,
      > buying into the cause and
      > effect of daily karma is
      > more believable and is
      > something people can
      > see or at least understand
      > at times. At other times
      > it doesn't equate.
      >
      > Basically, we're born,
      > we live, we die. All matter
      > decomposes and changes
      > its form within a set time
      > frame. But, these experiences
      > and memories of days,
      > months, and years are
      > all tied together in a
      > continuous Now because,
      > in reality, time is an illusion.
      >
      > The how and why of our
      > lives sometimes seems
      > within our awareness and
      > control, to a degree, but
      > mostly it's a crap shoot
      > that relies upon the fate
      > of our path via our conscious
      > and unconscious decisions.
      > Our choices and attitudes
      > either help or hinder us
      > (delay us) in achieving
      > what we desire most, IMO,
      > happiness and contentment
      > and some knowledge of
      > the "How" and "Why."
      >
      > With most people, however,
      > we've rationalized and deluded
      > ourselves to believe what we
      > and others have come to conveniently
      > think, sell, or believe and have
      > been convinced of what we need
      > and desire.
      >
      > Prometheus
      >
      > "Diana Stanley" wrote:
      > >
      > > I do'nt believe in Karma!
      > > diana
      > >
      >
    • prometheus_973
      Hello Diana, That s interesting. IMO we all have ancestral DNA that brings forth choices that help or hinder with our spiritual evolution and this is how our
      Message 2 of 16 , Jul 14, 2012
        Hello Diana,
        That's interesting. IMO we all
        have ancestral DNA that brings
        forth choices that help or hinder
        with our "spiritual" evolution
        and this is how our bodies and
        mindstuff are recreated. I'm
        thinking that some DNA associated
        with personality is also passed
        on. Plus, the nurture aspect is
        where and how portions of the
        personality are newly formed
        and where heretical portions
        are stimulated. Thus, when we
        see a person who has a personality
        completely different from close
        family members it could be that
        this is simply a multi-generational
        jump. Of course there are also
        physical defects and changes
        due to environmental issues,
        etc. that will affect us as well.
        Whether this could be called
        karma might be too simple and
        passive of an explanation that
        prevents more investigation,
        involvement and solutions.

        The thing is, the mind can be
        extremely powerful but all of
        us never even come close to the
        potential. Even Hawkings and
        Einstein only use(d) about 11%
        of the brain's potential.

        It does make one wonder about
        "consciousness." Is the intellect
        associated with consciousness
        in some way? Perhaps and to
        a degree, however, I'm sure that
        we know of selfish or cruel people
        who have/had great intellects.
        So, what went wrong? Is this
        a learned or physical defect
        or a choice, or both? The mind
        is powerful and can rationalize,
        dream, imagine, pretend, can
        become fearful, can become
        jealous, hateful, and is easily
        distracted from a higher potential
        i.e. Self-Mastery, Self-Responsibility
        and Spiritual Freedom. Although,
        what these terms actually mean
        is for one to become their own
        Master via their own private
        "religion" with values, partially,
        gleaned from the insights of
        others versus others subjective
        experiences. Life is a journey
        of rediscovering daily balance
        and meaning that encompasses
        a lifetime.

        Spirit and Soul are another
        matter. Maybe Soul is actually
        like being "plugged into" the
        Universal Mind (all minds)
        and generally by limitations
        like phone wire is to wireless
        or fiberoptic. But, is Spirit merely
        the Universal Mind's potential?

        And GOD? Maybe that's the
        original source which caused
        and determined our human
        split from that of other animals?
      • Janice Pfeiffer
        Well written Prometheus, thank you for your insights ... From: prometheus_973 Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: karma To:
        Message 3 of 16 , Jul 14, 2012
          Well written Prometheus, thank you for your insights

          --- On Sat, 7/14/12, prometheus_973 <prometheus_973@...> wrote:

          From: prometheus_973 <prometheus_973@...>
          Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: karma
          To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Saturday, July 14, 2012, 6:39 PM

           
          Hello Diana,
          That's interesting. IMO we all
          have ancestral DNA that brings
          forth choices that help or hinder
          with our "spiritual" evolution
          and this is how our bodies and
          mindstuff are recreated. I'm
          thinking that some DNA associated
          with personality is also passed
          on. Plus, the nurture aspect is
          where and how portions of the
          personality are newly formed
          and where heretical portions
          are stimulated. Thus, when we
          see a person who has a personality
          completely different from close
          family members it could be that
          this is simply a multi-generational
          jump. Of course there are also
          physical defects and changes
          due to environmental issues,
          etc. that will affect us as well.
          Whether this could be called
          karma might be too simple and
          passive of an explanation that
          prevents more investigation,
          involvement and solutions.

          The thing is, the mind can be
          extremely powerful but all of
          us never even come close to the
          potential. Even Hawkings and
          Einstein only use(d) about 11%
          of the brain's potential.

          It does make one wonder about
          "consciousness." Is the intellect
          associated with consciousness
          in some way? Perhaps and to
          a degree, however, I'm sure that
          we know of selfish or cruel people
          who have/had great intellects.
          So, what went wrong? Is this
          a learned or physical defect
          or a choice, or both? The mind
          is powerful and can rationalize,
          dream, imagine, pretend, can
          become fearful, can become
          jealous, hateful, and is easily
          distracted from a higher potential
          i.e. Self-Mastery, Self-Responsibility
          and Spiritual Freedom. Although,
          what these terms actually mean
          is for one to become their own
          Master via their own private
          "religion" with values, partially,
          gleaned from the insights of
          others versus others subjective
          experiences. Life is a journey
          of rediscovering daily balance
          and meaning that encompasses
          a lifetime.

          Spirit and Soul are another
          matter. Maybe Soul is actually
          like being "plugged into" the
          Universal Mind (all minds)
          and generally by limitations
          like phone wire is to wireless
          or fiberoptic. But, is Spirit merely
          the Universal Mind's potential?

          And GOD? Maybe that's the
          original source which caused
          and determined our human
          split from that of other animals?

        • prometheus_973
          Hello Harrison, Thanks! I enjoyed reading your comments. That s an interesting paraphrase of the Dali Llama: being illusory doesn t mean it s not real, but
          Message 4 of 16 , Jul 14, 2012
            Hello Harrison,
            Thanks! I enjoyed reading your
            comments. That's an interesting
            paraphrase of the Dali Llama:
            "being illusory doesn't mean it's
            not real, but rather its importance
            is illusory.

            It's quite a play on words which
            Buddhism does in order to get
            people to think with depth via
            creative introspection.

            However, I don't really agree with
            the second part (the twist) of the
            statement. To me, "it's importance"
            is Not Always "illusionary" due to
            the illusion's powerful mental
            potential to manifest and become
            "real" and to create circumstances
            that would end our physical existence
            or well being. For me, passiveness
            is self-deceit and non-attachment
            is simply a coping/survival technique
            (stress reducer) designed for the
            mind.

            However, various natural stress
            reducers do have the potential
            to alter our perspectives and to
            give us real insights into our individual
            Real Selves and that of this Real
            Life Experience and Purpose.

            Maybe, we are simply taking another
            step for the future development,
            or decline, of the Human Race and
            towards its full Mental potential.
            That's our part and our involvement
            with what we can call the Universal
            Mind's Potential. Perhaps, too, we
            are being guided, unconsciously,
            by this innate potential via video
            games and other imaginative and
            technological advances.

            Prometheus


            "harrisonferrel" wrote:
            Like so many other ideas, Karma doesn't hold water and seems to be a bastardized
            explanation of the way life works. It seems to have its origins in mythology and
            you'd need to read Joseph Campbell for an informed and intelligent look at the
            idea.

            Of course, Eckankar, as a notorious bullshit organization, goes to town with the
            karma idea. It's just another in a series of things people can latch onto by
            believing that their own mental impressions and fantasies have root in reality.

            I was recently watching a documentary on the Buddha for the third time.
            Curiously, Siddharta had an epiphany that life/nature goes through a cycle of
            being born, living, experiencing old age then decline, then at last dying. In
            the world of nature, rebirth is the next round of life that appears. This in no
            way suggests it's the same "soul" that reappears, but rather it's the way life
            works, in a cycle. And Siddharta realized that he was part of this cycle and
            there was no reason to keep trying to escape it. Instead he realized it's
            important to embrace life and these realities. All else is self-deceit. The
            illusion is that life and all of its problems has a basis in longevity and real
            importance. To paraphrase the Dalai Llama, being illusory doesn't mean it's not
            real, but rather its importance is illusory.

            Eckankar is all about manipulation of people, facts and world teachings. If
            Harold, Twitch or any of the other Disney characters had an conscience, they
            would be ashamed of what they do to people in the way of this manipulation.
          • postekcon
            Karma as taught by Ekult is very skewed and not the big picture ! Should one choose to believe in karma, it maybe better understood within contexts of
            Message 5 of 16 , Jul 25, 2012
              Karma as taught by Ekult is very skewed and not the 'big picture'!
              Should one choose to believe in karma, it maybe better understood within contexts of 'randomity' and 'quantum' theories.

              For me the jury is out.
              -Postekcon


              --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hello Harrison,
              > Thanks! I enjoyed reading your
              > comments. That's an interesting
              > paraphrase of the Dali Llama:
              > "being illusory doesn't mean it's
              > not real, but rather its importance
              > is illusory.
              >
              > It's quite a play on words which
              > Buddhism does in order to get
              > people to think with depth via
              > creative introspection.
              >
              > However, I don't really agree with
              > the second part (the twist) of the
              > statement. To me, "it's importance"
              > is Not Always "illusionary" due to
              > the illusion's powerful mental
              > potential to manifest and become
              > "real" and to create circumstances
              > that would end our physical existence
              > or well being. For me, passiveness
              > is self-deceit and non-attachment
              > is simply a coping/survival technique
              > (stress reducer) designed for the
              > mind.
              >
              > However, various natural stress
              > reducers do have the potential
              > to alter our perspectives and to
              > give us real insights into our individual
              > Real Selves and that of this Real
              > Life Experience and Purpose.
              >
              > Maybe, we are simply taking another
              > step for the future development,
              > or decline, of the Human Race and
              > towards its full Mental potential.
              > That's our part and our involvement
              > with what we can call the Universal
              > Mind's Potential. Perhaps, too, we
              > are being guided, unconsciously,
              > by this innate potential via video
              > games and other imaginative and
              > technological advances.
              >
              > Prometheus
              >
              >
              > "harrisonferrel" wrote:
              > Like so many other ideas, Karma doesn't hold water and seems to be a bastardized
              > explanation of the way life works. It seems to have its origins in mythology and
              > you'd need to read Joseph Campbell for an informed and intelligent look at the
              > idea.
              >
              > Of course, Eckankar, as a notorious bullshit organization, goes to town with the
              > karma idea. It's just another in a series of things people can latch onto by
              > believing that their own mental impressions and fantasies have root in reality.
              >
              > I was recently watching a documentary on the Buddha for the third time.
              > Curiously, Siddharta had an epiphany that life/nature goes through a cycle of
              > being born, living, experiencing old age then decline, then at last dying. In
              > the world of nature, rebirth is the next round of life that appears. This in no
              > way suggests it's the same "soul" that reappears, but rather it's the way life
              > works, in a cycle. And Siddharta realized that he was part of this cycle and
              > there was no reason to keep trying to escape it. Instead he realized it's
              > important to embrace life and these realities. All else is self-deceit. The
              > illusion is that life and all of its problems has a basis in longevity and real
              > importance. To paraphrase the Dalai Llama, being illusory doesn't mean it's not
              > real, but rather its importance is illusory.
              >
              > Eckankar is all about manipulation of people, facts and world teachings. If
              > Harold, Twitch or any of the other Disney characters had an conscience, they
              > would be ashamed of what they do to people in the way of this manipulation.
              >
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