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Re: Why Doesn't ECKankar Have More and Higher H.I.s?

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  • prometheus_973
    Hello Again, I reread this and just couldn t help but add a few more comments and observations. shabdmoksha wrote: ...After Paul Twitchell translated it
    Message 1 of 38 , Jan 7, 2012
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      Hello Again,
      I reread this and just
      couldn't help but add
      a few more comments
      and observations.

      shabdmoksha wrote:
      ...After Paul Twitchell translated
      it [Eckankar] became a cosmic
      consciousness path. There are
      several reasons for this. A reason
      why there are also no Masters
      in Eckankar is because currently
      Eckankar creates followers and
      not spiritual masters... when Paul
      died he gave Rebazar the rod of
      power and brought the true path
      of Eckankar non-public and at
      that moment the outer Eckankar
      became an offshoot.

      ME: Okay. So is Rebazar Tarzs
      in charge of this "non-public"
      secret cult or is Paul Twitchell,
      as the true Mahanta? Both, the
      Mahanta title (1969) and the
      Rebazar character were dreamed
      up and created by a proven liar
      and plagiarist, Paul Twitchell.

      If anyone has a copy of PT's
      "Difficulties Of Becoming The
      Living ECK Master" you can
      read where Paul states (pgs.
      38-48) that he went to Paris
      and then to India (for the 1st
      time) when he was 15 years
      old to study under Sudar Singh
      (970th LEM). Remember, too,
      that PT was born in 1918.

      PT also states that he received
      his 2nd initiation from Sudar
      Singh. I believe when Klemp
      retold this he stated that Paul
      was then handed off to Rebazar.
      However, Paul claims he revisited
      India (2nd trip) and had been
      told that he'd find Rebazar
      in Darjeeling (pgs.70-71).
      It was 1947 and his first
      meeting with Rebazar. Paul
      claims to have stayed with
      RT for "six or seven months"
      and "got the third and forth...
      and went up through about
      the seventh at this particular
      time."

      Later, (pg. 71) circa 1951,
      Paul claims to have returned
      to India (3rd trip), and to
      Rebazar, and "got the finish
      of my initiations."

      I'm assuming that Twitchell
      is saying that the "finish" of
      his initiations were the 8th-
      12th! Since Twit states that
      Sudar Singh (970th LEM) was
      already dead in 1947 for his
      first meeting with Rebazar,
      on his second trip to India,
      that RT would have made PT
      the LEM in 1951. After all,
      Paul was "finished" with his
      initiations and there was an
      opening for the LEM position
      since RT was merely "filling-in"
      and had been for four years!

      Lies are always harder to
      remember than the truth.

      It's true that Twitchell was
      the original creator of:
      Rebazar; Sudar; Eckankar;
      the Mahanta; and of all the
      other Eckankar Masters of
      the Ancient Order of Bullshitters
      and even of the term "ECK."
      That, however, is why this
      line of delusional thought
      leads to, simply, another
      false religion, a waste of
      time, and to more and more
      delusion.

      But, delusion can make
      people happy but it's
      a distraction and causes
      fuzzy perspectives. The
      clarity to other layers of
      reality is, thus, impeded
      by limitations of dogma,
      rules, and programming
      to inspire magical thinking.
      And, there's always the
      needed verification by
      an expert authority figure
      or "master" other than
      Self. Someone guy always
      has or is seeking power
      over others. With religion,
      it's living/being a codependent
      follower! It's like being
      in a jail cell, except, you
      have the key. Therefore,
      you feel protected from
      harm.

      I don't want to jerk the rug
      out of under anyone as much
      as I want to take their crutch
      away and say, "You're healed!
      Now walk on Your own Path!"

      Prometheus


      prometheus wrote:
      Hello All,
      Well, it seems that this
      needs a response merely
      to correct some of the
      inaccurate info on Darwin
      if nothing else.

      Re: Why Doesn't ECKankar Have More and Higher H.I.s?


      ----- Forwarded Message -----
      From: shabdamoksha <shabdamoksha@...>
      To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Friday, January 6, 2012 8:09 PM
      Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: Why Doesn't ECKankar Have More and
      Higher H.I.s?


      Dear Eckankar Survivors Anonymous,

      Responding to your recent post titled: "Why doesn't Eckankar have more and
      Higher HI's?" I emailed Prometheus a response but I will repeat it here. I am an
      Ex-Eckist who was a former member of Eckankar for over 17 years. During that
      time I had several leadership positions such as a state wide service leader.

      ME: This leadership position
      must have been a very long
      time ago. I recall State and
      Local Rep positions. Actually
      I forget all the titles. It's like
      trying to remember the various
      words describing ECKankar...
      A Way of Life, The Path of
      Total Awareness, The Ancient
      Science of Soul Travel etc.,
      etc. BTW- Was "The Ancient
      Science of Soul Travel" title
      inspired by Paul's connection
      with Scientology?


      The reason that Eckankar cannot give higher initiation levels is because
      Eckankar can only bring individuals up to the mental plane. Cosmic consciousness
      is the highest level that Eckankar can bring individuals. That is true now but
      it wasn't true during Paul Twichell's time. After Paul Twitchell translated it
      became a cosmic consciousness path. There are several reasons for this. A reason
      why there are also no Masters in Eckankar is because currentlly Eckankar creates
      followers and not spiritual masters. As I explained it brings people to cosmic
      consciousness.


      ME: No! ECKankar (Klemp) can
      and does sell higher initiation
      levels... just not that many 8ths
      or 9ths. And they're as invalid
      as any other religious initiation
      being handed out and sold via
      membership requirements (fees/
      donations). Consciousness has
      to be recognized and achieved
      by the individual and not handed
      out by others. Paul Twitchell was
      no "master" he was a conman,
      liar, wannabe and plagiarist.
      Cosmic Consciousness is merely
      a term used by New Age Westernized
      religious sects to describe the
      benefits of their brand of religion.



      The first reason is that in 1971 when Paul Twitcell translated he never declared
      a successor. He only left a list of six names. The Eckankar leadership which
      included Gail Twitchell, Patty Simpson and others chose Darwin Gross who was not
      a Master but only a ninth initiate. Instead when Paul died he gave Rebazar the
      rod of power and brought the true path of Eckankar non-public and at that moment
      the outer Eckankar became an offshoot. It was at that moment that Eckankar was
      no longer the highest path to God even though it claimed to be.


      ME: Darwin was dating Gail behind
      Paul's back. DG had only been
      an EK member since around 1968
      and was a third initiate at the time
      of Paul's death. Gail claimed to
      have had a dream where Paul told
      her that Darwin was to be the LEM.
      Gail was running the show and
      had the Board's support. Darwin
      was made a 5th initiate by the EK
      Board in order to receive the Rod
      of ECK Power on Oct 22, 1971...
      35 days after Paul's death.

      The Rebazar fill-in story was
      one that was dreamed up by
      Klemp. After all, there was no
      need for a fill-in Mahanta since
      the Mahanta was still Paul and
      the story is that there has always
      been a Mahanta whether in a
      physical body or not... not every
      LEM is a Mahanta. A picture was
      done showing Paul giving the
      Rod to Darwin.

      Klemp altered this story to fit
      the dogma requiring a LEM to
      pass the Rod. And, HK inferred
      that Darwin was a 13th initiate
      and was merely a Mahanta "in
      training" and not a "full" Mahanta
      like himself. Thus, the Blue
      Carnations given to Darwin
      when he went on stage only
      indicated that DG was a
      Mahanta-in-Training.

      Only the LEM needs a physical
      body. The ECK dogma requires
      the LEM to pass the Rod (position)
      to the next LEM. Thus, the ageless,
      imaginary Rebazar who Paul
      dreamed up to initiate him is
      the natural choice for fill-in.
      Rebazar Tarzs, supposedly,
      has his same 500 year old
      physical body and took the
      place of the Living ECK Master
      (Paul) for 35 days in order to
      pass the Rod of ECK Power
      to a fake Master (Darwin) who,
      later, passed it to Klemp! This
      way Klemp can die while in
      office and RT, via Joan's dream,
      can pass the Rod to her choice.

      Of course, Rebazar didn't really
      fill-in as LEM for 35 days because
      he was nowhere in sight! He
      didn't attend any "physical"
      meetings or take any calls
      or make himself available as
      Klemp would have ECKists
      imagine. It didn't happen!
      Can't these longtime ECKists
      remember? No memos or
      articles either! Besides, did
      RT really have to fill-in for
      35 days as LEM as Klemp
      claims? RT, actually, only
      needed to fill-in for 35 seconds
      in order to Pass the Rod.



      Paul Twitchell made a guarantee that initiates can usually reach God Realization
      in 25 years and he guaranteed an initiate can reach God Realization in this life
      time or the next.

      My friend said: If that guarantee is true than all Eckists would reach it in the
      (next) life. Paul brought initiates up through initiations quickly. The reason
      modern Eckankar has what is called "The Glass Ceiling in Eckankar" is for two
      reasons.

      The first reason is it would disturb the status quo.

      The second reason is that Harold although a good person he is only a sharadda, a
      sixth initiate.

      I do not care to talk negatively about people for when I was in Eckankar he
      helped to bring me many inner experiences, love, and some karmic help. However
      even though a shradda is not a spiritual Master, a sixth initiate is still a
      powerful spiritual being.


      ME: Wait a minute! God Realization,
      as well as, Self Mastery and Spiritual
      Freedom was guaranteed for "this"
      lifetime as long as one reached the
      5th. There was no "next" lifetime
      after reaching the 2nd initiation!
      BTW- Klemp is a liar, deceiver and
      an arrogant wannabe. He sought
      those phony book awards by fellow
      publishing companies and paid to be
      listed in Who's Who. HK's not a 6th
      either. Twit created a bunch of
      initiation levels as carrots to be
      dangled in order to appease egos,
      thus, they're all phony and Twitchell,
      their creator, was the phoniest!
      No one has power over you unless
      you give them power... remember
      that? You helped yourself by thinking
      it was someone else. You could
      have placed your attention and
      faith in other areas or with non-living
      "masters" and had the same outcome
      and benefits. What they (the religious
      conmen) don't want you to know
      is that as Soul... YOU are your
      own teacher and master.

      Sure, you can take tid-bits and
      insights from others but don't
      rely upon them...that's the trap!
      Take responsibility and invent
      your own personal relationship
      and religion with YOU and Spirit.
      Besides, what has Klemp said
      that Paul didn't already say via
      his plagiarism of Sant Mat...
      which was another phony religion.


      While a former member of Eckankar, my partner had an extremely high level of
      success in spiritual exercises on the inner planes mostly in the lower worlds.
      (They were not his imagination) But after 29 years of successful practice he was
      still only a 4th initiate. He hit the "Glass Ceiling in Eckankar" and could go
      no higher. He felt trapped in the lower worlds and blamed himself. Physically he
      was practically dyeing from lack of adequate outflow in spite of his loving
      efforts. He was having lots of inner experiences with Paul Twitchell, Rebazar,
      and other Masters. I also had many inner experiences but felt held back.

      ME: I had some very phenomenal
      experiences prior to Eckankar, while
      in TM, and these weren't imagined
      either. BTW- This 4th hadn't hit the
      "Glass Ceiling in Eckankar." Maybe
      for the outer effort he wanted to
      put into it he had. The "outflow"
      supposedly comes from volunteering
      for intros, as a Satsang Arahata,
      and for local leadership positions,
      etc. There had to be something
      "wrong" with a person who has 29
      years in and is still a 4th. Did he
      fall asleep during meetings, classes,
      and at the EWS and say he was
      getting it all on the "inner?" That's
      frowned upon by RESAs and is
      probably why he wasn't promoted
      if that was the case. I knew of a
      guy who was a 4th with the same
      amount of time as a 4th and this
      was his problem. Maybe it was
      the same guy. I think he finally
      got promoted to the 5th when
      a friend of his became the RESA.

      Shortly after this we called out to God for God Realization. Our call was
      answered and we both had profound light and sound God Worlds experiences with
      the true successor of Paul Twitchel. We had profound experiences of being
      brought up to higher states of consciousness much more quickly than Eckankar.
      Eckankar is currently only an offshoot and no longer the highest path to God.


      ME: And who was the "true successor"
      of Paul.... Bernie Madeoff (sic?)? Gail?
      Oops! It couldn't be Gail since it has to
      be a guy right? That old negative atom
      polarity thingie right? So, Eckankar is
      an offshoot of an offshoot of an offshoot.
      What does that make this other "highest
      path?" Sikhism had the Radasoami offshoot.
      Ruhani Satsang was the offshoot of this
      that Twitchell joined under Kirpal Singh
      and then he created his own offshoot
      Eckankar. So, do you follow the offshoot
      created by Twitchell? True, Klemp created
      his own offshoot of the original Eckankar
      created by Twitchell.


      No person is perfect and it is pointless to dwell on the many human flaws of
      individuals. It is a common misconception that Spiritual Masters are made of
      plastic, perfect beings incapable of human mistakes and human emotions. Yes, as
      many say Paul made human mistakes, because masters are not perfect as many
      falsely assume. Masters have emotions and make human errors. The mythology that
      masters are perfect is a myth that keeps people believing that Mastership is an
      impossible goal of some far distant future, never to be had by any humble
      person. But Paul was a true Master even though he made some mistakes. People can
      dwell on such superficiality of his tiny mistakes until the cows jump over the
      moon but they will never learn the truth because they don't want God.

      ME: Is Rebazar Tarzs perfect?
      What mistakes has he made?
      You see, Rebazar is perfect
      because Rebazar is imaginary!
      Rebazar's existence is myth!


      When I shared with a few close friends in Eckankar about my God Realization
      experience they were so focused on their initiation, status, dogma, personality
      worship, habit pattern thought that they didn't hear a word of it or care to
      know anything about it. They built a 12 foot high wall of fear and were quick to
      judge me. Another friend did care and his life changed overnight.

      I feel too many people prefer spiritual fluff, distractions, status, dogma, or
      the safety of closed off beliefs to embracing God. All I wanted was God. And I
      prayed to God for three days to be shown who is the true Mahanta who could bring
      me to God and my call was answered. What is the point of being in Eckankar if
      not to connect with God, and reach self and God Realization in this life and not
      a million years from now.

      It is like Paul Twichell once said: Only the bold and adventurous find God.

      Many people don't want a true connection with God, Self Realization, or God
      Realization because they are afraid to become the spiritual giant that they
      already are. I am a spiritual master now and it doesn't concern me if no one
      believes me or knows. But I am concerned if people who want to truly connect
      with God or God Realization don't because they are being misled by people who
      don't love them truly.
      May the blessings be, Shabdamoksha [end]


      ME: God Realization experiences
      are subjective. It was probably
      a Cosmic Consciousness experience.
      Just kidding. However, a rose
      is still a rose by any other name.
      I try not to get caught up in
      classifying, pigeon holing, and
      judging my own private, personal,
      unique spiritual experiences.
      What do I know? True, people
      do go for the religious bullshit.
      New Agers are just as much the
      suckers and fools (not for God)
      as the hugely populated religions.

      BTW- Twit also stated (long ago)
      in the Square Peg article that he
      was a Cliffhanger and that the
      Cliffhanger is his own religion!
      There's a point in everyone's
      life when they has learned enough
      that they no longer need to be
      a joiner. Soul doesn't need mental
      plane dogma and a physical plane
      religion or a master. IT is the Master
      and always has a relationship with
      Spirit...

      Prometheus
    • prometheus_973
      Hello Diana, You ve got my curiosity. Please tell me/us more! Prometheus Diana Stanley wrote: I met a perfect soul. He did not want followers and did not have
      Message 38 of 38 , Jan 12, 2012
      • 0 Attachment
        Hello Diana,
        You've got my curiosity.
        Please tell me/us more!

        Prometheus


        Diana Stanley wrote:
        I met a perfect soul.

        He did not want
        followers and did
        not have a spiritual
        path.

        You could listen to
        his words and apply
        them to your spiritual
        life.

        He only would let
        people attend his
        talk for two weeks,
        no charge.

        He said everyone has
        a guru inside. You are
        already connected to
        the highest.

        He gave no initiations
        or put anyone higher
        than another.

        He introdced me to
        a way of spiritual
        thinking that I apply
        every day.

        Diana

        prometheus wrote:
        >
        > Hello All,
        > Well, it seems that this
        > needs a response merely
        > to correct some of the
        > inaccurate info on Darwin
        > if nothing else.
        >
        > Re: Why Doesn't ECKankar Have More and Higher H.I.s?
        >
        >
        > ----- Forwarded Message -----
        > From: shabdamoksha <shabdamoksha@...>
        > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Friday, January 6, 2012 8:09 PM
        > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: Why Doesn't ECKankar Have More and
        Higher H.I.s?
        >
        >
        > Dear Eckankar Survivors Anonymous,
        >
        > Responding to your recent post titled: "Why doesn't Eckankar have more and
        Higher HI's?" I emailed Prometheus a response but I will repeat it here. I am an
        Ex-Eckist who was a former member of Eckankar for over 17 years. During that
        time I had several leadership positions such as a state wide service leader.
        >
        > ME: This leadership position
        > must have been a very long
        > time ago. I recall State and
        > Local Rep positions. Actually
        > I forget all the titles. It's like
        > trying to remember the various
        > words describing ECKankar...
        > A Way of Life, The Path of
        > Total Awareness, etc., etc.
        >
        >
        > The reason that Eckankar cannot give higher initiation levels is because
        Eckankar can only bring individuals up to the mental plane. Cosmic consciousness
        is the highest level that Eckankar can bring individuals. That is true now but
        it wasn't true during Paul Twichell's time. After Paul Twitchell translated it
        became a cosmic consciousness path. There are several reasons for this. A reason
        why there are also no Masters in Eckankar is because currentlly Eckankar creates
        followers and not spiritual masters. As I explained it brings people to cosmic
        consciousness.
        >
        >
        > ME: No! ECKankar (Klemp) can
        > and does sell higher initiation
        > levels... just not that many 8ths
        > or 9ths. And they're as invalid
        > as any other religious initiation
        > being handed out and sold via
        > membership requirements (fees/
        > donations). Consciousness has
        > to be recognized and achieved
        > by the individual and not handed
        > out by others. Paul Twitchell was
        > no "master" he was a conman,
        > liar, wannabe and plagiarist.
        > Cosmic Consciousness is merely
        > a term used by New Age Westernized
        > religious sects to describe the
        > benefits of their brand of religion.
        >
        >
        >
        > The first reason is that in 1971 when Paul Twitcell translated he never
        declared a successor. He only left a list of six names. The Eckankar leadership
        which included Gail Twitchell, Patty Simpson and others chose Darwin Gross who
        was not a Master but only a ninth initiate. Instead when Paul died he gave
        Rebazar the rod of power and brought the true path of Eckankar non-public and at
        that moment the outer Eckankar became an offshoot. It was at that moment that
        Eckankar was no longer the highest path to God even though it claimed to be.
        >
        >
        > ME: Darwin was dating Gail behind
        > Paul's back. DG had only been
        > an EK member since around 1968
        > and was a third initiate at the time
        > of Paul's death. Gail claimed to
        > have had a dream where Paul told
        > her that Darwin was to be the LEM.
        > Gail was running the show and
        > had the Board's support. Darwin
        > was made a 5th initiate by the EK
        > Board in order to receive the Rod
        > of ECK Power on Oct 22, 1971...
        > 35 days after Paul's death.
        >
        > The Rebazar fill-in story was
        > one that was dreamed up by
        > Klemp. After all, there was no
        > need for a fill-in Mahanta since
        > the Mahanta was still Paul and
        > the story is that there has always
        > been a Mahanta whether in a
        > physical body or not... not every
        > LEM is a Mahanta. A picture was
        > done showing Paul giving the
        > Rod to Darwin.
        >
        > Klemp altered this story to fit
        > the dogma requiring a LEM to
        > pass the Rod. And, HK inferred
        > that Darwin was a 13th initiate
        > and was merely a Mahanta "in
        > training" and not a "full" Mahanta
        > like himself. Thus, the Blue
        > Carnations given to Darwin
        > when he went on stage only
        > indicated that DG was a
        > Mahanta-in-Training.
        >
        > Only the LEM needs a physical
        > body. The ECK dogma requires
        > the LEM to pass the Rod (position)
        > to the next LEM. Thus, the ageless,
        > imaginary Rebazar who Paul
        > dreamed up to initiate him is
        > the natural choice for fill-in.
        > Rebazar Tarzs, supposedly,
        > has his same 500 year old
        > physical body and took the
        > place of the Living ECK Master
        > (Paul) for 35 days in order to
        > pass the Rod of ECK Power
        > to a fake Master (Darwin) who,
        > later, passed it to Klemp! This
        > way Klemp can die while in
        > office and RT, via Joan's dream,
        > can pass the Rod to her choice.
        >
        > Of course, Rebazar didn't really
        > fill-in as LEM for 35 days because
        > he was nowhere in sight! He
        > didn't attend any "physical"
        > meetings or take any calls
        > or make himself available as
        > Klemp would have ECKists
        > imagine. It didn't happen!
        > Can't these longtime ECKists
        > remember? No memos or
        > articles either! Besides, did
        > RT really have to fill-in for
        > 35 days as LEM as Klemp
        > claims? RT, actually, only
        > needed to fill-in for 35 seconds
        > in order to Pass the Rod.
        >
        >
        >
        > Paul Twitchell made a guarantee that initiates can usually reach God
        Realization in 25 years and he guaranteed an initiate can reach God Realization
        in this life time or the next.
        >
        > My friend said: If that guarantee is true than all Eckists would reach it in
        the (next) life. Paul brought initiates up through initiations quickly. The
        reason modern Eckankar has what is called "The Glass Ceiling in Eckankar" is for
        two reasons.
        >
        > The first reason is it would disturb the status quo.
        >
        > The second reason is that Harold although a good person he is only a sharadda,
        a sixth initiate.
        >
        > I do not care to talk negatively about people for when I was in Eckankar he
        helped to bring me many inner experiences, love, and some karmic help. However
        even though a shradda is not a spiritual Master, a sixth initiate is still a
        powerful spiritual being.
        >
        >
        > ME: Wait a minute! God Realization,
        > as well as, Self Mastery and Spiritual
        > Freedom was guaranteed for "this"
        > lifetime as long as one reached the
        > 5th. There was no "next" lifetime
        > after reaching the 2nd initiation!
        > BTW- Klemp is a liar, deceiver and
        > an arrogant wannabe. He sought
        > those phony book awards by fellow
        > publishing companies and paid to be
        > listed in Who's Who. HK's not a 6th
        > either. Twit created a bunch of
        > initiation levels as carrots to be
        > dangled in order to appease egos,
        > thus, they're all phony and Twitchell,
        > their creator, was the phoniest!
        > No one has power over you unless
        > you give them power... remember
        > that? You helped yourself by thinking
        > it was someone else. You could
        > have placed your attention and
        > faith in other areas or with non-living
        > "masters" and had the same outcome
        > and benefits. What they (the religious
        > conmen) don't want you to know
        > is that as Soul... YOU are your
        > own teacher and master.
        >
        > Sure, you can take tid-bits and
        > insights from others but don't
        > rely upon them...that's the trap!
        > Take responsibility and invent
        > your own personal relationship
        > and religion with YOU and Spirit.
        > Besides, what has Klemp said
        > that Paul didn't already say via
        > his plagiarism of Sant Mat...
        > which was another phony religion.
        >
        >
        > While a former member of Eckankar, my partner had an extremely high level of
        success in spiritual exercises on the inner planes mostly in the lower worlds.
        (They were not his imagination) But after 29 years of successful practice he was
        still only a 4th initiate. He hit the "Glass Ceiling in Eckankar" and could go
        no higher. He felt trapped in the lower worlds and blamed himself. Physically he
        was practically dyeing from lack of adequate outflow in spite of his loving
        efforts. He was having lots of inner experiences with Paul Twitchell, Rebazar,
        and other Masters. I also had many inner experiences but felt held back.
        >
        > ME: I had some very phenomenal
        > experiences prior to Eckankar, while
        > in TM, and these weren't imagined
        > either. BTW- This 4th hadn't hit the
        > "Glass Ceiling in Eckankar." Maybe
        > for the outer effort he wanted to
        > put into it he had. The "outflow"
        > supposedly comes from volunteering
        > for intros, as a Satsang Arahata,
        > and for local leadership positions,
        > etc. There had to be something
        > "wrong" with a person who has 29
        > years in and is still a 4th. Did he
        > fall asleep during meetings, classes,
        > and at the EWS and say he was
        > getting it all on the "inner?" That's
        > frowned upon by RESAs and is
        > probably why he wasn't promoted
        > if that was the case. I knew of a
        > guy who was a 4th with the same
        > amount of time as a 4th and this
        > was his problem. Maybe it was
        > the same guy. I think he finally
        > got promoted to the 5th when
        > a friend of his became the RESA.
        >
        > Shortly after this we called out to God for God Realization. Our call was
        answered and we both had profound light and sound God Worlds experiences with
        the true successor of Paul Twitchel. We had profound experiences of being
        brought up to higher states of consciousness much more quickly than Eckankar.
        Eckankar is currently only an offshoot and no longer the highest path to God.
        >
        >
        > ME: And who was the "true successor"
        > of Paul.... Bernie Madeoff (sic?)? Gail?
        > Oops! It couldn't be Gail since it has to
        > be a guy right? That old negative atom
        > polarity thingie right? So, Eckankar is
        > an offshoot of an offshoot of an offshoot.
        > What does that make this other "highest
        > path?" Sikhism had the Radasoami offshoot.
        > Ruhani Satsang was the offshoot of this
        > that Twitchell joined under Kirpal Singh
        > and then he created his own offshoot
        > Eckankar. So, do you follow the offshoot
        > created by Twitchell? True, Klemp created
        > his own offshoot of the original Eckankar
        > created by Twitchell.
        >
        >
        > No person is perfect and it is pointless to dwell on the many human flaws of
        individuals. It is a common misconception that Spiritual Masters are made of
        plastic, perfect beings incapable of human mistakes and human emotions. Yes, as
        many say Paul made human mistakes, because masters are not perfect as many
        falsely assume. Masters have emotions and make human errors. The mythology that
        masters are perfect is a myth that keeps people believing that Mastership is an
        impossible goal of some far distant future, never to be had by any humble
        person. But Paul was a true Master even though he made some mistakes. People can
        dwell on such superficiality of his tiny mistakes until the cows jump over the
        moon but they will never learn the truth because they don't want God.
        >
        > ME: Is Rebazar Tarzs perfect?
        > What mistakes has he made?
        > You see, Rebazar is perfect
        > because Rebazar is imaginary!
        > Rebazar's existence is myth!
        >
        >
        > When I shared with a few close friends in Eckankar about my God Realization
        experience they were so focused on their initiation, status, dogma, personality
        worship, habit pattern thought that they didn't hear a word of it or care to
        know anything about it. They built a 12 foot high wall of fear and were quick to
        judge me. Another friend did care and his life changed overnight.
        >
        > I feel too many people prefer spiritual fluff, distractions, status, dogma, or
        the safety of closed off beliefs to embracing God. All I wanted was God. And I
        prayed to God for three days to be shown who is the true Mahanta who could bring
        me to God and my call was answered. What is the point of being in Eckankar if
        not to connect with God, and reach self and God Realization in this life and not
        a million years from now.
        >
        > It is like Paul Twichell once said: Only the bold and adventurous find God.
        >
        > Many people don't want a true connection with God, Self Realization, or God
        Realization because they are afraid to become the spiritual giant that they
        already are. I am a spiritual master now and it doesn't concern me if no one
        believes me or knows. But I am concerned if people who want to truly connect
        with God or God Realization don't because they are being misled by people who
        don't love them truly.
        > May the blessings be, Shabdamoksha [end]
        >
        >
        > ME: God Realization experiences
        > are subjective. It was probably
        > a Cosmic Consciousness experience.
        > Just kidding. However, a rose
        > is still a rose by any other name.
        > I try not to get caught up in
        > classifying, pigeon holing, and
        > judging my own private, personal,
        > unique spiritual experiences.
        > What do I know? True, people
        > do go for the religious bullshit.
        > New Agers are just as much the
        > suckers and fools (not for God)
        > as the hugely populated religions.
        >
        > BTW- Twit also stated (long ago)
        > in the Square Peg article that he
        > was a Cliffhanger and that the
        > Cliffhanger is his own religion!
        > There's a point in everyone's
        > life when they has learned enough
        > that they no longer need to be
        > a joiner. Soul doesn't need mental
        > plane dogma and a physical plane
        > religion or a master. IT is the Master
        > and always has a relationship with
        > Spirit...
        >
        > Prometheus
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