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Re: A new start

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  • prometheus_973
    Hello Tyson and All, I agree that the Klemps (Harold and Joan) are as much frauds, thieves and liars as were the Twitchells (Paul and Gail). However, (IMO) the
    Message 1 of 13 , Oct 10, 2011
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      Hello Tyson and All,
      I agree that the Klemps
      (Harold and Joan) are
      as much frauds, thieves
      and liars as were the
      Twitchells (Paul and Gail).

      However, (IMO) the "Virgin"
      Mary is as much of a myth
      as is Mohammad having a
      "higher consciousness."

      BTW- Isn't it strange/ironic
      that Klemp, as LEM and
      Mahanta, is supposed to
      be a teacher, but isn't/doesn't!
      What new or profound things
      does he teach?

      Being in Eckankar is like
      being forever stuck in
      high school, and not as
      faculty! HK does fulfill
      the role of boss/master/
      superintendent, however,
      via his RESA police and
      his Guidelines (rules).
      Klemp Does Not fulfill the
      role of a spiritual teacher...
      nor do his Arahatas! The
      ECKankar teachings are
      old and redundant and based
      upon plagiarized Sant Mat
      text blended with "feel good"
      and embellished stories.
      These, too, require an
      active imagination and/or
      magical thinking.

      As far as these "stories"
      go, that Klemp adds to,
      clarifies and uses as spiritual
      filler, nothing written in
      an EK publication can
      be challenged because
      it has been "approved."

      In Eckankar only those
      "spiritual" stories having
      "written approval" from the
      ESC can be shared "outside"
      of a small group discussion
      at an EWS, a Roundtable
      discussion, or a Satsang
      class. Even stories shared
      (on stage) at Regional
      Seminars are supposed
      to have RESA approval.
      Trust is a real issue within
      Klemp's RESA hierarchy.


      And, yes, after years and
      years of self-induced brainwashing
      it is still hard to let go of
      the "mahanta" think. Instead,
      I talk to mySelf, Soul, recognizing
      It is both me and Spirit, or
      seeing I AM IT and IT IS ME,
      WE ARE ONE. Actually, just
      seeing, thinking, knowing,
      realizing and reprogramming
      ourselves to see the "WE"
      of Soul = Soul + Spirit is
      a good and more realistic
      spiritual substitute for
      anything else out there.

      It's good to stand on one's
      own two feet instead of being
      Codependent upon a fake
      Master and a phony named
      Mahanta. It's surprisingly
      calming to take the "intermediary"
      out of the equation. For
      Catholics it's like taking the
      priest (and Pope) out of the
      equation. Actually, except
      for how he's selected, Klemp
      and the Pope have a lot in
      common.

      Here's a tip for those ECKists
      getting fed up with the B.S.-
      Only "after" leaving Eckankar
      will you experience true Clarity
      of mind (stress free) as well
      as Contentment. It's nice being
      your own "master."

      Prometheus


      Tyson wrote:
      I have embraced a lot
      of my beliefs in relation
      to christianity. I can
      never again buy into
      the idea of a god that
      requires a sacrifice.

      Jesus came to teach
      and was killed for it.
      I believe as soul we
      have the capability
      to be aware of gods
      spirits omnipresence.
      I think this is what
      jesus did.

      Now that I dont buy
      into the Mahanta lie,
      I believe Christ, Krishna,
      Siddarta, Mahammed
      all lived in higher
      consciousness.

      I love the teachings of
      Paramahansa Yogananda.
      He teaches that christ
      consciousness is our
      higher self. Paul also
      stole from his books.

      The blue star is what
      paramahansa says is
      a manifestation of the
      holy ghost. The holy
      ghost tends to appear
      to people in the way
      they view the sacred,
      thus the virgin mary
      visions.

      I believe any teacher
      of the spiritual can
      help awaken us to our
      subconscious mind.
      A teacher can help
      but is not necessary
      as Sant mat would
      have one believe.

      Soul = Soul. Your
      own inner self is
      your best guide.
      For eckists the mind
      cloaks this as the
      mahanta or the
      fictional rebazar,
      but actually harold
      is taking credit for
      the divine nature
      that is already present
      within soul. I think
      this is why paul and
      harold both stressed
      dream study because
      waking impressions
      and subliminal messages
      can color our dreams
      thus the eck masters
      come to life.

      What is corny in eck
      is that only harold
      and paul have pictures
      that are not works
      of art (fantasy). The
      dreaming mind loves
      fantasy.

      I was into the occult
      at a young age. I have
      had OBE experiences.
      Some were great some
      were scary. I am willing
      to bet that Harold can
      not soul travel at will.

      The tigers fang is
      a perfect title for
      eckankar. The story
      about a lier who
      claimes to have
      fought and killed
      a tiger. One of the
      things I have kept
      from my involvement
      with eckankar is
      a study of hinduism.

      Today I call god Ram
      because it feels comfortable
      and eckist dont use
      this name for God.
      I still catch myself
      saying mahanta just
      as a child I said help
      me jesus. I am getting
      over it.


      Prometheus wrote:
      Hello Aimee,
      > Why not simply let your
      > ECK membership lapse?
      >
      > Christianity is even a bigger
      > scam, than Eckankar, since
      > most of these churches don't
      > follow Jesus' teachings 100%.
      > They tend to revert back to
      > the Old Testament teachings
      > which Jesus had issues with
      > and was correcting.
      >
      > Here's an interesting approach:

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/05/science-vs-spirituality-war-of-the-worl\
      dviews_n_987121.html

      > This is "Science vs Spirituality"
      > with a physicist, Leonard Mlodinow,
      > who worked on a book with Stephen
      > Hawkings and with Deepak Chopra
      > who was once involved with TM
      > and Maharishi.
      >
      > Apparently Chopra was teaching
      > Mlodinow about "consciousness"
      > (and meditation) while Mlodinow
      > was teaching Chopra about physics.
      > However, I'm not sure what makes
      > Chopra an expert on consciousness
      > since Maharishi (his mentor) was
      > a conman like Twitchell. TM is a
      > religion (a sect of Hinduism), but
      > many Western followers see it as
      > a "scientific" method to raise consciousness
      > and reduce stress.
      >
      > Anyway, you might want to
      > check it out and/or buy the
      > book from Amazon.com
      >
      > However, what's the need with
      > joining another religion? Is it
      > a need for being part of a social
      > community? If so, then volunteer
      > or join a secular community group.
      >
      > Remember, with any religion,
      > there's always the pecking order
      > i.e. hierarchy and some authority
      > figure interpreting scripture for
      > you and telling you what to believe.
      > Be your own religion! Doesn't
      > Soul=Soul? We are all equal in
      > Spirit... right! It's all subjective
      > and what fits one doesn't always
      > fit another, nor was It supposed to!
      >
      > Allow Soul's newly found spiritual
      > freedom and your own clarity
      > of mind to fill-in the void left
      > when leaving Eckankar. You are
      > no longer Codependent, but it
      > takes time to heal. Maybe a 12
      > Step Group would help. Check
      > the listings in your area.
      >
      > Prometheus
      > p.s. It shouldn't take you as
      > long to get your "land legs"
      > as someone else like an H.I.
      > with 25-35 years in the cult.
      > It also depends upon how
      > much you bought into it and
      > upon your psychologically
      > addictive susceptibility.
      >
      > The brain-washing becomes
      > more intense with each higher
      > initiation. Thus, 8th & 9th
      > initiates are, truly, lost Souls!
      > The higher one goes and the
      > longer they stay the more
      > delusional and narrow minded
      > they become.
      >
      >
      > williamsaimee86@> wrote:
      > >
      > > My name is aimee. I was
      > a part of Eckankar since 1999.
      > >
      > > My sister and her husband
      > are eckist and so are her kids.
      > She lives 10 minutes away.
      > They worship Harold and many
      > high initiates.
      > >
      > > I have stopped my membership.
      > I will cancel it by mail this week.
      > My biggest question is how do
      > you feel safe in the world with
      > out feeling like you need the
      > protection of the mahanta.
      > >
      > > it scared me a lot to take that
      > pendant off. What on earth do
      > I do to be strong outside of
      > eckankar. I think am going to
      > go back to christianity.
      > >
      > > I feel lost. If anyone wants
      > to be friends please send me
      > a note.
      > >
      > > I want to get better. How
      > long will it take for me to get
      > my land legs?
      > >
      > > Thanks for reading this.
      > >
      > > Aimee
    • Sharon
      Hi Aimee - I m sorry it s taken me so long to reply to your post - and where does time go? Good grief, what happened to October? Is everything just going
      Message 2 of 13 , Oct 20, 2011
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        Hi Aimee -

        I'm sorry it's taken me so long to reply to your post - and where does time go? Good grief, what happened to October? Is everything just going faster, or is it me getting slower? I'm so slow, I'm almost going backwards! <gg>

        I know how you're feeling - I went through it too, and it was pretty scarey! I left back in 1998 - and the first time I resigned, I was so lost, I rejoined a few days later and even sent them a check! <gg>

        My final resignation letter is at:
        http://www.angelfire.com/hi2/eckankarsurvivors/data.html
        Down at the bottom, and there's a link there to another letter I sent to them.

        That first resignation - well, it's hard to explain how I felt. Lost, floating. In addition to the "formal" spiritual exercises & nightly "hu", I also sang hu frequently thru the day, and talked to the "mahanta" in my head. I was really lost without it.

        But, by this time, I'd taken a 2nd hard look at all the crap in the "teachings". Of course, I remembered all those threats but I never felt they applied to me, because there was no way I'd ever leave, so I didn't have to worry about becoming a mental vegetable & spending endless lost wandering incarnations before "the master" forgave me and took me back. After all, I'd read that I'd made the mistake of leaving in past lives. No way would I make that mistake again!!

        Getting better is a process. It doesn't happen overnight. I still considered myself an eckist "on the inner", in my own way, for a little bit after I left. Along the way, I'd take time to look back every so often, and I could always see how much better I was. And after a few years, I didn't even remember my "anniversary" or think about it very much at all. So, it's been about 13 years now - and it's absolutely meaningless to me now. Silly, even. Like those dumb things we did in high school that we don't even remember, and when we do, we laugh at ourselves!!

        Except, ekult isn't exactly a laughing matter, because it does harm people, and it's still sucking in new people.

        I was very fortunate that I had friends in the "real world" who didn't even know about ekult, so my "outer" life basically stayed "normal". I wasn't very involved over the years aside from some bookstudies & satsangs rarely, and then worship services when they started them. My son was young, eckthings were usually on weeknights and way past bedtime by the time we got home. It's sort of funny - I think my son was around 12 when we went to the first "worship service", and afterwards he said he didn't want to go again, because he didn't feel "Spirit" there. And that was true, I didn't feel it, couldn't pinpoint why until now - it was all that typical eckcrap!! I didn't get to any large seminars until the last years - and they only make me feel uncomfy, like something was wrong.

        Anyway, I often go on & on & on but want to keep this short. Oh - almost forgot, I believe it was December after I left that I was sitting at the computer on a Saturday, an ice storm was on the way, and honest - I heard this voice saying "Get to Mass, NOW!!!" I jumped, and looked behind me. <gg> I said okay, but there's an ice storm on the way and I do NOT want to wreck my car!! Weird, because I'd been Catholic for maybe 2-3 years in elementary school, barely long enough to make my first communion, then my mother joined the Jehovah's Witnesses - that made me hate God and pray for eternal death at Armageddon! <gg> Anyway, I went to Mass, it was a truly beautiful spiritual experience. Around the same time, another former eckist told me he really got a lot from Yogananda's "Self Realization Fellowship" and sent me some books & tapes.

        I'm remembering - at that first Mass, I got "inner" orders to take Communion. Now, I was pre-Vatican II, so in m my mind that was a big no-no. <gg> But, I did it - and it was, well...a truly beautiful spiritual experience. Later, I talked to the priest, went to Confession (freaked out in that dark confessional!), went to a some Catholic classes, etc. Ha, laughing here, I even volunteered to work one of the game booths at the summer festival!! <gg> So, I did the Catholic thing for about a year. Then other things interfered. But, to this day, sometimes I still feel like going to Mass, except I usually don't know what day it is, I'm always running a day or two behind, so I never remember there's Saturday evening mass. Sundays are out, because even when I wake up early, it takes me a few hours to get moving. <gg>

        Self-Realization Fellowship - that was great, too!! I took their monthly "lessons" for a year, and ohmigod, what a *big* difference from ekult's crappy worthless discourses!!
        One thing I especially loved about Yogananda was that he emphasized God over Guru.

        Oh, I also sort of returned to Wicca, which I gave up when I joined ekult because it was "lower". That was sort of hard to do, because I love the woods & moon & candles & herbs, and all that stuff. I went back to my old "magic" spot and my old beloved oaks, and did a beautiful midnight purification ritual for myself on Samhain.

        Okay, so it can be argued that Catholicism & SRF, and even some Wiccan groups, are cults. Well, when I was an eckist and went to a.r.e., I remember posting as an eckist that okay, maybe it was a cult for some eckists, but it wasn't a cult for me! I was wrong. I had *no* idea how totally brainwashed and controlled I was!!

        And, that's how I was about Catholicism & SRF - they weren't at all cultic for me. I was like I'd been before ekult, not good at following strict orders or anything - heck, as a Catholic kid I'd go to Methodist bible school & services and not feel a bit guilty, other than confessing them. <gg> I always sort of took what "felt" right from everywhere, and did things my way. Never could "get" Jesus - the "saviour" and "blood of Christ" stuff/ I liked him and his teachings, though. Still do.

        Throughout my life, and even moreso after I joined ekult, I always read a lot of spiritual works from other religions, for example I really loved the writings of Catholic saints - actually, there was a lot of ekult in them. For example, ekult's "spiritual exercises" are IMO taken from the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius of Loyola, founder of the Jesuits. Klemp mentioned Catholic great Thomas Merton in a discourse, so I figured it was okay - I *love* Merton!

        Anyway, there is absolutely *no* freedom of mind or spirit in ekult - just a bunch of cultic programming and mixed messages. So, now I don't "believe" in anything other than possibilities. What's between me & "God" is personal, I do it however I feel like it at any given moment, and just as often I'm sort of an atheist, and "believe" in aliens, etc. My personal spirituality is just that - personal!! I am who I am, and if that doesn't work for "God" - Him/Her/It/Them/Whatever - well, tough!!

        Okay, I was just rambling, if you'd like, feel free to write to me and I'll try to help. I think the best way to deal with your sister, etc., is to stay close but just don't discuss ekult, or anything "spiritual" - I do hope that's possible!! It's sad, but over the years I've heard from so many people who were ostracized and shunned by eckist family members, and that's just not right!! Many former members still have eckist friends, true friends - but quite often they find that without ekult, there's just no real basis for true friendship.

        Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible. Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer work.

        Gotta go, be happy!!

        Hugs,

        Sharon




        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "williamsaimee86" <williamsaimee86@...> wrote:
        >
        > My name is aimee. I was a part of Eckankar since 1999.
        >
        > My sister and her husband are eckist and so are her kids. She lives 10 minutes away. They worship Harold and many high initiates.
        >
        > I have stopped my membership. I will cancel it by mail this week. My biggest question is how do you feel safe in the world with out feeling like you need the protection of the mahanta.
        >
        > it scared me a lot to take that pendant off. What on earth do I do to be strong outside of eckankar. I think am going to go back to christianity.
        >
        > I feel lost. If anyone wants to be friends please send me a note.
        >
        > I want to get better. How long will it take for me to get my land legs?
        >
        > Thanks for reading this.
        >
        > Aimee
        >

        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "williamsaimee86" <williamsaimee86@...> wrote:
        >
        > My name is aimee. I was a part of Eckankar since 1999.
        >
        > My sister and her husband are eckist and so are her kids. She lives 10 minutes away. They worship Harold and many high initiates.
        >
        > I have stopped my membership. I will cancel it by mail this week. My biggest question is how do you feel safe in the world with out feeling like you need the protection of the mahanta.
        >
        > it scared me a lot to take that pendant off. What on earth do I do to be strong outside of eckankar. I think am going to go back to christianity.
        >
        > I feel lost. If anyone wants to be friends please send me a note.
        >
        > I want to get better. How long will it take for me to get my land legs?
        >
        > Thanks for reading this.
        >
        > Aimee
        >
      • Sharon
        Whoops, Aimee - I forgot something really important! Laughter!! It ll get you through the roughest spots, because you might find yourself feeling pretty bad,
        Message 3 of 13 , Oct 20, 2011
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          Whoops, Aimee - I forgot something really important! Laughter!!

          It'll get you through the roughest spots, because you might find yourself feeling pretty bad, rent some funny videos, read jokes, oh I'd recommend funny animals on Animal Planet and YouTube!

          And, you can even laugh at some of the most horrible stuff in ekult's "teachings" - okay, on the one hand they're pretty grim, but on the other hand, they're hilarious!! Like, the nonsense about dying in your sleep from black magicians if you don't have the "mahanta" to protect you! Good grief, we're adults, this crap is *so* hilarious, how did we take it seriously?

          Take care!

          Hugs,

          Sharon
        • dianastanley43
          Amimee I know how you feel. I have been out of Eck some 30 yrs. I got out when Darwin went crazy. I remember thinking maybe Paul is still the mahanta and
          Message 4 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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            Amimee I know how you feel. I have been out of Eck some 30 yrs. I got out when Darwin went crazy. I remember thinking maybe Paul is still the mahanta and rebazar is still around. That kept me going for a while untill I had to admit the trough. Eck never was a spiritual path it was all a figment of Pauls imajination. I tried some other paths and finally after a time I realized I had the ability to contact directly what I had been looking for. It took me a few yrs to finally feel I was finally on the right path,my own.
            It was the most painful experience I had ever had.
            Much love Diana

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > Hi Aimee -
            >
            > I'm sorry it's taken me so long to reply to your post - and where does time go? Good grief, what happened to October? Is everything just going faster, or is it me getting slower? I'm so slow, I'm almost going backwards! <gg>
            >
            > I know how you're feeling - I went through it too, and it was pretty scarey! I left back in 1998 - and the first time I resigned, I was so lost, I rejoined a few days later and even sent them a check! <gg>
            >
            > My final resignation letter is at:
            > http://www.angelfire.com/hi2/eckankarsurvivors/data.html
            > Down at the bottom, and there's a link there to another letter I sent to them.
            >
            > That first resignation - well, it's hard to explain how I felt. Lost, floating. In addition to the "formal" spiritual exercises & nightly "hu", I also sang hu frequently thru the day, and talked to the "mahanta" in my head. I was really lost without it.
            >
            > But, by this time, I'd taken a 2nd hard look at all the crap in the "teachings". Of course, I remembered all those threats but I never felt they applied to me, because there was no way I'd ever leave, so I didn't have to worry about becoming a mental vegetable & spending endless lost wandering incarnations before "the master" forgave me and took me back. After all, I'd read that I'd made the mistake of leaving in past lives. No way would I make that mistake again!!
            >
            > Getting better is a process. It doesn't happen overnight. I still considered myself an eckist "on the inner", in my own way, for a little bit after I left. Along the way, I'd take time to look back every so often, and I could always see how much better I was. And after a few years, I didn't even remember my "anniversary" or think about it very much at all. So, it's been about 13 years now - and it's absolutely meaningless to me now. Silly, even. Like those dumb things we did in high school that we don't even remember, and when we do, we laugh at ourselves!!
            >
            > Except, ekult isn't exactly a laughing matter, because it does harm people, and it's still sucking in new people.
            >
            > I was very fortunate that I had friends in the "real world" who didn't even know about ekult, so my "outer" life basically stayed "normal". I wasn't very involved over the years aside from some bookstudies & satsangs rarely, and then worship services when they started them. My son was young, eckthings were usually on weeknights and way past bedtime by the time we got home. It's sort of funny - I think my son was around 12 when we went to the first "worship service", and afterwards he said he didn't want to go again, because he didn't feel "Spirit" there. And that was true, I didn't feel it, couldn't pinpoint why until now - it was all that typical eckcrap!! I didn't get to any large seminars until the last years - and they only make me feel uncomfy, like something was wrong.
            >
            > Anyway, I often go on & on & on but want to keep this short. Oh - almost forgot, I believe it was December after I left that I was sitting at the computer on a Saturday, an ice storm was on the way, and honest - I heard this voice saying "Get to Mass, NOW!!!" I jumped, and looked behind me. <gg> I said okay, but there's an ice storm on the way and I do NOT want to wreck my car!! Weird, because I'd been Catholic for maybe 2-3 years in elementary school, barely long enough to make my first communion, then my mother joined the Jehovah's Witnesses - that made me hate God and pray for eternal death at Armageddon! <gg> Anyway, I went to Mass, it was a truly beautiful spiritual experience. Around the same time, another former eckist told me he really got a lot from Yogananda's "Self Realization Fellowship" and sent me some books & tapes.
            >
            > I'm remembering - at that first Mass, I got "inner" orders to take Communion. Now, I was pre-Vatican II, so in m my mind that was a big no-no. <gg> But, I did it - and it was, well...a truly beautiful spiritual experience. Later, I talked to the priest, went to Confession (freaked out in that dark confessional!), went to a some Catholic classes, etc. Ha, laughing here, I even volunteered to work one of the game booths at the summer festival!! <gg> So, I did the Catholic thing for about a year. Then other things interfered. But, to this day, sometimes I still feel like going to Mass, except I usually don't know what day it is, I'm always running a day or two behind, so I never remember there's Saturday evening mass. Sundays are out, because even when I wake up early, it takes me a few hours to get moving. <gg>
            >
            > Self-Realization Fellowship - that was great, too!! I took their monthly "lessons" for a year, and ohmigod, what a *big* difference from ekult's crappy worthless discourses!!
            > One thing I especially loved about Yogananda was that he emphasized God over Guru.
            >
            > Oh, I also sort of returned to Wicca, which I gave up when I joined ekult because it was "lower". That was sort of hard to do, because I love the woods & moon & candles & herbs, and all that stuff. I went back to my old "magic" spot and my old beloved oaks, and did a beautiful midnight purification ritual for myself on Samhain.
            >
            > Okay, so it can be argued that Catholicism & SRF, and even some Wiccan groups, are cults. Well, when I was an eckist and went to a.r.e., I remember posting as an eckist that okay, maybe it was a cult for some eckists, but it wasn't a cult for me! I was wrong. I had *no* idea how totally brainwashed and controlled I was!!
            >
            > And, that's how I was about Catholicism & SRF - they weren't at all cultic for me. I was like I'd been before ekult, not good at following strict orders or anything - heck, as a Catholic kid I'd go to Methodist bible school & services and not feel a bit guilty, other than confessing them. <gg> I always sort of took what "felt" right from everywhere, and did things my way. Never could "get" Jesus - the "saviour" and "blood of Christ" stuff/ I liked him and his teachings, though. Still do.
            >
            > Throughout my life, and even moreso after I joined ekult, I always read a lot of spiritual works from other religions, for example I really loved the writings of Catholic saints - actually, there was a lot of ekult in them. For example, ekult's "spiritual exercises" are IMO taken from the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius of Loyola, founder of the Jesuits. Klemp mentioned Catholic great Thomas Merton in a discourse, so I figured it was okay - I *love* Merton!
            >
            > Anyway, there is absolutely *no* freedom of mind or spirit in ekult - just a bunch of cultic programming and mixed messages. So, now I don't "believe" in anything other than possibilities. What's between me & "God" is personal, I do it however I feel like it at any given moment, and just as often I'm sort of an atheist, and "believe" in aliens, etc. My personal spirituality is just that - personal!! I am who I am, and if that doesn't work for "God" - Him/Her/It/Them/Whatever - well, tough!!
            >
            > Okay, I was just rambling, if you'd like, feel free to write to me and I'll try to help. I think the best way to deal with your sister, etc., is to stay close but just don't discuss ekult, or anything "spiritual" - I do hope that's possible!! It's sad, but over the years I've heard from so many people who were ostracized and shunned by eckist family members, and that's just not right!! Many former members still have eckist friends, true friends - but quite often they find that without ekult, there's just no real basis for true friendship.
            >
            > Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible. Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer work.
            >
            > Gotta go, be happy!!
            >
            > Hugs,
            >
            > Sharon
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "williamsaimee86" <williamsaimee86@> wrote:
            > >
            > > My name is aimee. I was a part of Eckankar since 1999.
            > >
            > > My sister and her husband are eckist and so are her kids. She lives 10 minutes away. They worship Harold and many high initiates.
            > >
            > > I have stopped my membership. I will cancel it by mail this week. My biggest question is how do you feel safe in the world with out feeling like you need the protection of the mahanta.
            > >
            > > it scared me a lot to take that pendant off. What on earth do I do to be strong outside of eckankar. I think am going to go back to christianity.
            > >
            > > I feel lost. If anyone wants to be friends please send me a note.
            > >
            > > I want to get better. How long will it take for me to get my land legs?
            > >
            > > Thanks for reading this.
            > >
            > > Aimee
            > >
            >
            > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "williamsaimee86" <williamsaimee86@> wrote:
            > >
            > > My name is aimee. I was a part of Eckankar since 1999.
            > >
            > > My sister and her husband are eckist and so are her kids. She lives 10 minutes away. They worship Harold and many high initiates.
            > >
            > > I have stopped my membership. I will cancel it by mail this week. My biggest question is how do you feel safe in the world with out feeling like you need the protection of the mahanta.
            > >
            > > it scared me a lot to take that pendant off. What on earth do I do to be strong outside of eckankar. I think am going to go back to christianity.
            > >
            > > I feel lost. If anyone wants to be friends please send me a note.
            > >
            > > I want to get better. How long will it take for me to get my land legs?
            > >
            > > Thanks for reading this.
            > >
            > > Aimee
            > >
            >
          • Austin Atma
            However, what s the need with joining another religion? Is it a need for being part of a social community? If so, then volunteer or join a secular community
            Message 5 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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              "However, what's the need with
              joining another religion? Is it
              a need for being part of a social 
              community? If so, then volunteer 
              or join a secular community group."

              Sometimes I think the more religion, the more difficulty we're having connecting to the internal "pillars" of our own heart, head, and imagination.  And by "own" I just mean self/other understanding and discovery through common sense connections with life and everything in it.  

              All too often we will choose infantile fantasy over common sense and authentic connection.  

              Pass the chocolate and airbrushed reality ;-).

              AA


              On Oct 5, 2011, at 2:00 PM, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:

               

              Hello Aimee,
              Why not simply let your
              ECK membership lapse?

              Christianity is even a bigger
              scam, than Eckankar, since
              most of these churches don't
              follow Jesus' teachings 100%.
              They tend to revert back to
              the Old Testament teachings
              which Jesus had issues with
              and was correcting.

              Here's an interesting approach:
              http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/05/science-vs-spirituality-war-of-the-worldviews_n_987121.html

              This is "Science vs Spirituality"
              with a physicist, Leonard Mlodinow,
              who worked on a book with Stephen
              Hawkings and with Deepak Chopra
              who was once involved with TM
              and Maharishi.

              Apparently Chopra was teaching
              Mlodinow about "consciousness"
              (and meditation) while Mlodinow
              was teaching Chopra about physics.
              However, I'm not sure what makes
              Chopra an expert on consciousness
              since Maharishi (his mentor) was
              a conman like Twitchell. TM is a
              religion (a sect of Hinduism), but
              many Western followers see it as
              a "scientific" method to raise consciousness
              and reduce stress.

              Anyway, you might want to
              check it out and/or buy the
              book from Amazon.com

              However, what's the need with
              joining another religion? Is it
              a need for being part of a social
              community? If so, then volunteer
              or join a secular community group.

              Remember, with any religion,
              there's always the pecking order
              i.e. hierarchy and some authority
              figure interpreting scripture for
              you and telling you what to believe.
              Be your own religion! Doesn't
              Soul=Soul? We are all equal in
              Spirit... right! It's all subjective
              and what fits one doesn't always
              fit another, nor was It supposed to!

              Allow Soul's newly found spiritual
              freedom and your own clarity
              of mind to fill-in the void left
              when leaving Eckankar. You are
              no longer Codependent, but it
              takes time to heal. Maybe a 12
              Step Group would help. Check
              the listings in your area.

              Prometheus
              p.s. It shouldn't take you as
              long to get your "land legs"
              as someone else like an H.I.
              with 25-35 years in the cult.
              It also depends upon how
              much you bought into it and
              upon your psychologically
              addictive susceptibility.

              The brain-washing becomes
              more intense with each higher
              initiation. Thus, 8th & 9th
              initiates are, truly, lost Souls!
              The higher one goes and the
              longer they stay the more
              delusional and narrow minded
              they become.

              williamsaimee86@...> wrote:
              >
              > My name is aimee. I was
              a part of Eckankar since 1999.
              >
              > My sister and her husband
              are eckist and so are her kids.
              She lives 10 minutes away.
              They worship Harold and many
              high initiates.
              >
              > I have stopped my membership.
              I will cancel it by mail this week.
              My biggest question is how do
              you feel safe in the world with
              out feeling like you need the
              protection of the mahanta.
              >
              > it scared me a lot to take that
              pendant off. What on earth do
              I do to be strong outside of
              eckankar. I think am going to
              go back to christianity.
              >
              > I feel lost. If anyone wants
              to be friends please send me
              a note.
              >
              > I want to get better. How
              long will it take for me to get
              my land legs?
              >
              > Thanks for reading this.
              >
              > Aimee
              >

            • Austin Atma
              ... Or if you don t watch out it/freedom will settle into you... The old cliche of be yourself is apt, but if we ve been adapting to religion, bosses,
              Message 6 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...> wrote:

                > Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible. Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer work.

                Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and determination to be free. ~ AA
              • etznab@aol.com
                Original Lyrics: And did you exchange A walk on part in the war For a lead role in a cage? http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml @ 2
                Message 7 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                  Original Lyrics:

                  And did you exchange
                  A walk on part in the war
                  For a lead role in a cage?

                  http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml

                  @ 2 minutes, 48 seconds

                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAchKt2xjsw

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Austin Atma <austinatma@...>
                  To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                  <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Fri, Oct 21, 2011 6:04 pm
                  Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A new start

                   


                  On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...>
                  wrote:

                  > Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just
                  be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind
                  off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible.
                  Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to
                  spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer
                  work.

                  Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                  The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to
                  religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way
                  as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                  The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a
                  walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from
                  the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and
                  determination to be free. ~ AA
                • Austin Atma
                  War = life Cage = alleged security of lotus eating ;-)
                  Message 8 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                    War = life

                    Cage = alleged security of lotus eating ;-)

                    On Oct 21, 2011, at 6:15 PM, etznab@... wrote:

                     

                    Original Lyrics:

                    And did you exchange
                    A walk on part in the war
                    For a lead role in a cage?

                    http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml

                    @ 2 minutes, 48 seconds

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAchKt2xjsw

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: Austin Atma <austinatma@...>
                    To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                    <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Fri, Oct 21, 2011 6:04 pm
                    Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A new start

                     

                    On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" &lt;brighttigress@...&gt;
                    wrote:

                    &gt; Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just
                    be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind
                    off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible.
                    Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to
                    spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer
                    work.

                    Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                    The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to
                    religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way
                    as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                    The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a
                    walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from
                    the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and
                    determination to be free. ~ AA


                  • Austin Atma
                    And thanks!
                    Message 9 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                      And thanks!  

                      On Oct 21, 2011, at 6:15 PM, etznab@... wrote:

                       

                      Original Lyrics:

                      And did you exchange
                      A walk on part in the war
                      For a lead role in a cage?

                      http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml

                      @ 2 minutes, 48 seconds

                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAchKt2xjsw

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: Austin Atma <austinatma@...>
                      To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                      <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Fri, Oct 21, 2011 6:04 pm
                      Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A new start

                       

                      On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" &lt;brighttigress@...&gt;
                      wrote:

                      &gt; Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just
                      be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind
                      off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible.
                      Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to
                      spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer
                      work.

                      Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                      The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to
                      religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way
                      as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                      The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a
                      walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from
                      the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and
                      determination to be free. ~ AA


                    • Austin Atma
                      How about Tom Petty, Like a Refugee ;-) Eckists who have traveled overland to Turkey to escape the totalitarian regime of Eckraq. What are we doctors
                      Message 10 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                        How about Tom Petty, Like a Refugee ;-)

                        Eckists who have traveled overland to "Turkey" to escape the totalitarian regime of Eckraq.  What are we doctors without borders? 

                        On Oct 21, 2011, at 6:15 PM, etznab@... wrote:

                         

                        Original Lyrics:

                        And did you exchange
                        A walk on part in the war
                        For a lead role in a cage?

                        http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml

                        @ 2 minutes, 48 seconds

                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAchKt2xjsw

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: Austin Atma <austinatma@...>
                        To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                        <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Fri, Oct 21, 2011 6:04 pm
                        Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A new start

                         

                        On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" &lt;brighttigress@...&gt;
                        wrote:

                        &gt; Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just
                        be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind
                        off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible.
                        Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to
                        spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer
                        work.

                        Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                        The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to
                        religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way
                        as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                        The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a
                        walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from
                        the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and
                        determination to be free. ~ AA


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