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Re: A new start

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  • prometheus_973
    Hello Aimee, Why not simply let your ECK membership lapse? Christianity is even a bigger scam, than Eckankar, since most of these churches don t follow Jesus
    Message 1 of 13 , Oct 5, 2011
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      Hello Aimee,
      Why not simply let your
      ECK membership lapse?

      Christianity is even a bigger
      scam, than Eckankar, since
      most of these churches don't
      follow Jesus' teachings 100%.
      They tend to revert back to
      the Old Testament teachings
      which Jesus had issues with
      and was correcting.

      Here's an interesting approach:
      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/05/science-vs-spirituality-war-of-the-worldviews_n_987121.html

      This is "Science vs Spirituality"
      with a physicist, Leonard Mlodinow,
      who worked on a book with Stephen
      Hawkings and with Deepak Chopra
      who was once involved with TM
      and Maharishi.

      Apparently Chopra was teaching
      Mlodinow about "consciousness"
      (and meditation) while Mlodinow
      was teaching Chopra about physics.
      However, I'm not sure what makes
      Chopra an expert on consciousness
      since Maharishi (his mentor) was
      a conman like Twitchell. TM is a
      religion (a sect of Hinduism), but
      many Western followers see it as
      a "scientific" method to raise consciousness
      and reduce stress.

      Anyway, you might want to
      check it out and/or buy the
      book from Amazon.com

      However, what's the need with
      joining another religion? Is it
      a need for being part of a social
      community? If so, then volunteer
      or join a secular community group.

      Remember, with any religion,
      there's always the pecking order
      i.e. hierarchy and some authority
      figure interpreting scripture for
      you and telling you what to believe.
      Be your own religion! Doesn't
      Soul=Soul? We are all equal in
      Spirit... right! It's all subjective
      and what fits one doesn't always
      fit another, nor was It supposed to!

      Allow Soul's newly found spiritual
      freedom and your own clarity
      of mind to fill-in the void left
      when leaving Eckankar. You are
      no longer Codependent, but it
      takes time to heal. Maybe a 12
      Step Group would help. Check
      the listings in your area.

      Prometheus
      p.s. It shouldn't take you as
      long to get your "land legs"
      as someone else like an H.I.
      with 25-35 years in the cult.
      It also depends upon how
      much you bought into it and
      upon your psychologically
      addictive susceptibility.

      The brain-washing becomes
      more intense with each higher
      initiation. Thus, 8th & 9th
      initiates are, truly, lost Souls!
      The higher one goes and the
      longer they stay the more
      delusional and narrow minded
      they become.


      williamsaimee86@...> wrote:
      >
      > My name is aimee. I was
      a part of Eckankar since 1999.
      >
      > My sister and her husband
      are eckist and so are her kids.
      She lives 10 minutes away.
      They worship Harold and many
      high initiates.
      >
      > I have stopped my membership.
      I will cancel it by mail this week.
      My biggest question is how do
      you feel safe in the world with
      out feeling like you need the
      protection of the mahanta.
      >
      > it scared me a lot to take that
      pendant off. What on earth do
      I do to be strong outside of
      eckankar. I think am going to
      go back to christianity.
      >
      > I feel lost. If anyone wants
      to be friends please send me
      a note.
      >
      > I want to get better. How
      long will it take for me to get
      my land legs?
      >
      > Thanks for reading this.
      >
      > Aimee
      >
    • Tyson
      Message 2 of 13 , Oct 9, 2011
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        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello Aimee,
        > Why not simply let your
        > ECK membership lapse?
        >
        > Christianity is even a bigger
        > scam, than Eckankar, since
        > most of these churches don't
        > follow Jesus' teachings 100%.
        > They tend to revert back to
        > the Old Testament teachings
        > which Jesus had issues with
        > and was correcting.
        >
        > Here's an interesting approach:
        > http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/05/science-vs-spirituality-war-of-the-worldviews_n_987121.html
        >
        > This is "Science vs Spirituality"
        > with a physicist, Leonard Mlodinow,
        > who worked on a book with Stephen
        > Hawkings and with Deepak Chopra
        > who was once involved with TM
        > and Maharishi.
        >
        > Apparently Chopra was teaching
        > Mlodinow about "consciousness"
        > (and meditation) while Mlodinow
        > was teaching Chopra about physics.
        > However, I'm not sure what makes
        > Chopra an expert on consciousness
        > since Maharishi (his mentor) was
        > a conman like Twitchell. TM is a
        > religion (a sect of Hinduism), but
        > many Western followers see it as
        > a "scientific" method to raise consciousness
        > and reduce stress.
        >
        > Anyway, you might want to
        > check it out and/or buy the
        > book from Amazon.com
        >
        > However, what's the need with
        > joining another religion? Is it
        > a need for being part of a social
        > community? If so, then volunteer
        > or join a secular community group.
        >
        > Remember, with any religion,
        > there's always the pecking order
        > i.e. hierarchy and some authority
        > figure interpreting scripture for
        > you and telling you what to believe.
        > Be your own religion! Doesn't
        > Soul=Soul? We are all equal in
        > Spirit... right! It's all subjective
        > and what fits one doesn't always
        > fit another, nor was It supposed to!
        >
        > Allow Soul's newly found spiritual
        > freedom and your own clarity
        > of mind to fill-in the void left
        > when leaving Eckankar. You are
        > no longer Codependent, but it
        > takes time to heal. Maybe a 12
        > Step Group would help. Check
        > the listings in your area.
        >
        > Prometheus
        > p.s. It shouldn't take you as
        > long to get your "land legs"
        > as someone else like an H.I.
        > with 25-35 years in the cult.
        > It also depends upon how
        > much you bought into it and
        > upon your psychologically
        > addictive susceptibility.
        >
        > The brain-washing becomes
        > more intense with each higher
        > initiation. Thus, 8th & 9th
        > initiates are, truly, lost Souls!
        > The higher one goes and the
        > longer they stay the more
        > delusional and narrow minded
        > they become.
        >
        >
        > williamsaimee86@> wrote:
        > >
        > > My name is aimee. I was
        > a part of Eckankar since 1999.
        > >
        > > My sister and her husband
        > are eckist and so are her kids.
        > She lives 10 minutes away.
        > They worship Harold and many
        > high initiates.
        > >
        > > I have stopped my membership.
        > I will cancel it by mail this week.
        > My biggest question is how do
        > you feel safe in the world with
        > out feeling like you need the
        > protection of the mahanta.
        > >
        > > it scared me a lot to take that
        > pendant off. What on earth do
        > I do to be strong outside of
        > eckankar. I think am going to
        > go back to christianity.
        > >
        > > I feel lost. If anyone wants
        > to be friends please send me
        > a note.
        > >
        > > I want to get better. How
        > long will it take for me to get
        > my land legs?
        > >
        > > Thanks for reading this.
        > >
        > > Aimee
        > >I have embraced a lot of my beliefs in relation to christianity. I can never again buy into the idea of a god that requires a sacrifice. Jesus came to teach and was killed for it.I believe as soul we have the capability to be aware of gods spirits omnipresence. I think this is what jesus did. Now that I dont buy into the Mahanta lie, I believe Christ,Krishna,Siddarta,Mahammed all lived in higher consciousness. I love the teachings of Paramahansa Yogananda. He teaches that christ consciousness is our higher self. Paul also stole from his books. The blue star is what paramahansa says is a manifestation of the holy ghost. The holy ghost tends to appear to people in the way they view the sacred,thus the virgin mary visions. I believe any teacher of the spiritual can help awaken us to our subconscious mind. A teacher can help but is not necessary as Sant mat would have one believe. Soul = Soul. Your own inner self is your best guide. For eckists the mind cloaks this as the mahanta or the fictional rebazar, but actually harold is taking credit for the divine nature that is already present within soul. I think this is why paul and harold both stressed dream study because waking impressions and subliminal messages can color our dreams thus the eck masters come to life. What is corny in eck is that only harold and paul have pictures that our not works of art(fantasy). The dreaming mind loves fantasy. I was into the occult at a young age. I have had OBE experiences. Some were great some were scary. I am willing to bet that Harold can not soul travel at will. The tigers fang is a perfect title for eckankar. The story about a lier who claimes to have fought and killed a tiger. One of the things I have kept from my involvement with eckankar is a study of hinduism. Today I call god Ram because it feels comfortable and eckist dont use this name for God. I still catch myself saying mahanta just as a child I said help me jesus. I am getting over it.
        >
      • prometheus_973
        Hello Tyson and All, I agree that the Klemps (Harold and Joan) are as much frauds, thieves and liars as were the Twitchells (Paul and Gail). However, (IMO) the
        Message 3 of 13 , Oct 10, 2011
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          Hello Tyson and All,
          I agree that the Klemps
          (Harold and Joan) are
          as much frauds, thieves
          and liars as were the
          Twitchells (Paul and Gail).

          However, (IMO) the "Virgin"
          Mary is as much of a myth
          as is Mohammad having a
          "higher consciousness."

          BTW- Isn't it strange/ironic
          that Klemp, as LEM and
          Mahanta, is supposed to
          be a teacher, but isn't/doesn't!
          What new or profound things
          does he teach?

          Being in Eckankar is like
          being forever stuck in
          high school, and not as
          faculty! HK does fulfill
          the role of boss/master/
          superintendent, however,
          via his RESA police and
          his Guidelines (rules).
          Klemp Does Not fulfill the
          role of a spiritual teacher...
          nor do his Arahatas! The
          ECKankar teachings are
          old and redundant and based
          upon plagiarized Sant Mat
          text blended with "feel good"
          and embellished stories.
          These, too, require an
          active imagination and/or
          magical thinking.

          As far as these "stories"
          go, that Klemp adds to,
          clarifies and uses as spiritual
          filler, nothing written in
          an EK publication can
          be challenged because
          it has been "approved."

          In Eckankar only those
          "spiritual" stories having
          "written approval" from the
          ESC can be shared "outside"
          of a small group discussion
          at an EWS, a Roundtable
          discussion, or a Satsang
          class. Even stories shared
          (on stage) at Regional
          Seminars are supposed
          to have RESA approval.
          Trust is a real issue within
          Klemp's RESA hierarchy.


          And, yes, after years and
          years of self-induced brainwashing
          it is still hard to let go of
          the "mahanta" think. Instead,
          I talk to mySelf, Soul, recognizing
          It is both me and Spirit, or
          seeing I AM IT and IT IS ME,
          WE ARE ONE. Actually, just
          seeing, thinking, knowing,
          realizing and reprogramming
          ourselves to see the "WE"
          of Soul = Soul + Spirit is
          a good and more realistic
          spiritual substitute for
          anything else out there.

          It's good to stand on one's
          own two feet instead of being
          Codependent upon a fake
          Master and a phony named
          Mahanta. It's surprisingly
          calming to take the "intermediary"
          out of the equation. For
          Catholics it's like taking the
          priest (and Pope) out of the
          equation. Actually, except
          for how he's selected, Klemp
          and the Pope have a lot in
          common.

          Here's a tip for those ECKists
          getting fed up with the B.S.-
          Only "after" leaving Eckankar
          will you experience true Clarity
          of mind (stress free) as well
          as Contentment. It's nice being
          your own "master."

          Prometheus


          Tyson wrote:
          I have embraced a lot
          of my beliefs in relation
          to christianity. I can
          never again buy into
          the idea of a god that
          requires a sacrifice.

          Jesus came to teach
          and was killed for it.
          I believe as soul we
          have the capability
          to be aware of gods
          spirits omnipresence.
          I think this is what
          jesus did.

          Now that I dont buy
          into the Mahanta lie,
          I believe Christ, Krishna,
          Siddarta, Mahammed
          all lived in higher
          consciousness.

          I love the teachings of
          Paramahansa Yogananda.
          He teaches that christ
          consciousness is our
          higher self. Paul also
          stole from his books.

          The blue star is what
          paramahansa says is
          a manifestation of the
          holy ghost. The holy
          ghost tends to appear
          to people in the way
          they view the sacred,
          thus the virgin mary
          visions.

          I believe any teacher
          of the spiritual can
          help awaken us to our
          subconscious mind.
          A teacher can help
          but is not necessary
          as Sant mat would
          have one believe.

          Soul = Soul. Your
          own inner self is
          your best guide.
          For eckists the mind
          cloaks this as the
          mahanta or the
          fictional rebazar,
          but actually harold
          is taking credit for
          the divine nature
          that is already present
          within soul. I think
          this is why paul and
          harold both stressed
          dream study because
          waking impressions
          and subliminal messages
          can color our dreams
          thus the eck masters
          come to life.

          What is corny in eck
          is that only harold
          and paul have pictures
          that are not works
          of art (fantasy). The
          dreaming mind loves
          fantasy.

          I was into the occult
          at a young age. I have
          had OBE experiences.
          Some were great some
          were scary. I am willing
          to bet that Harold can
          not soul travel at will.

          The tigers fang is
          a perfect title for
          eckankar. The story
          about a lier who
          claimes to have
          fought and killed
          a tiger. One of the
          things I have kept
          from my involvement
          with eckankar is
          a study of hinduism.

          Today I call god Ram
          because it feels comfortable
          and eckist dont use
          this name for God.
          I still catch myself
          saying mahanta just
          as a child I said help
          me jesus. I am getting
          over it.


          Prometheus wrote:
          Hello Aimee,
          > Why not simply let your
          > ECK membership lapse?
          >
          > Christianity is even a bigger
          > scam, than Eckankar, since
          > most of these churches don't
          > follow Jesus' teachings 100%.
          > They tend to revert back to
          > the Old Testament teachings
          > which Jesus had issues with
          > and was correcting.
          >
          > Here's an interesting approach:

          http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/05/science-vs-spirituality-war-of-the-worl\
          dviews_n_987121.html

          > This is "Science vs Spirituality"
          > with a physicist, Leonard Mlodinow,
          > who worked on a book with Stephen
          > Hawkings and with Deepak Chopra
          > who was once involved with TM
          > and Maharishi.
          >
          > Apparently Chopra was teaching
          > Mlodinow about "consciousness"
          > (and meditation) while Mlodinow
          > was teaching Chopra about physics.
          > However, I'm not sure what makes
          > Chopra an expert on consciousness
          > since Maharishi (his mentor) was
          > a conman like Twitchell. TM is a
          > religion (a sect of Hinduism), but
          > many Western followers see it as
          > a "scientific" method to raise consciousness
          > and reduce stress.
          >
          > Anyway, you might want to
          > check it out and/or buy the
          > book from Amazon.com
          >
          > However, what's the need with
          > joining another religion? Is it
          > a need for being part of a social
          > community? If so, then volunteer
          > or join a secular community group.
          >
          > Remember, with any religion,
          > there's always the pecking order
          > i.e. hierarchy and some authority
          > figure interpreting scripture for
          > you and telling you what to believe.
          > Be your own religion! Doesn't
          > Soul=Soul? We are all equal in
          > Spirit... right! It's all subjective
          > and what fits one doesn't always
          > fit another, nor was It supposed to!
          >
          > Allow Soul's newly found spiritual
          > freedom and your own clarity
          > of mind to fill-in the void left
          > when leaving Eckankar. You are
          > no longer Codependent, but it
          > takes time to heal. Maybe a 12
          > Step Group would help. Check
          > the listings in your area.
          >
          > Prometheus
          > p.s. It shouldn't take you as
          > long to get your "land legs"
          > as someone else like an H.I.
          > with 25-35 years in the cult.
          > It also depends upon how
          > much you bought into it and
          > upon your psychologically
          > addictive susceptibility.
          >
          > The brain-washing becomes
          > more intense with each higher
          > initiation. Thus, 8th & 9th
          > initiates are, truly, lost Souls!
          > The higher one goes and the
          > longer they stay the more
          > delusional and narrow minded
          > they become.
          >
          >
          > williamsaimee86@> wrote:
          > >
          > > My name is aimee. I was
          > a part of Eckankar since 1999.
          > >
          > > My sister and her husband
          > are eckist and so are her kids.
          > She lives 10 minutes away.
          > They worship Harold and many
          > high initiates.
          > >
          > > I have stopped my membership.
          > I will cancel it by mail this week.
          > My biggest question is how do
          > you feel safe in the world with
          > out feeling like you need the
          > protection of the mahanta.
          > >
          > > it scared me a lot to take that
          > pendant off. What on earth do
          > I do to be strong outside of
          > eckankar. I think am going to
          > go back to christianity.
          > >
          > > I feel lost. If anyone wants
          > to be friends please send me
          > a note.
          > >
          > > I want to get better. How
          > long will it take for me to get
          > my land legs?
          > >
          > > Thanks for reading this.
          > >
          > > Aimee
        • Sharon
          Hi Aimee - I m sorry it s taken me so long to reply to your post - and where does time go? Good grief, what happened to October? Is everything just going
          Message 4 of 13 , Oct 20, 2011
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            Hi Aimee -

            I'm sorry it's taken me so long to reply to your post - and where does time go? Good grief, what happened to October? Is everything just going faster, or is it me getting slower? I'm so slow, I'm almost going backwards! <gg>

            I know how you're feeling - I went through it too, and it was pretty scarey! I left back in 1998 - and the first time I resigned, I was so lost, I rejoined a few days later and even sent them a check! <gg>

            My final resignation letter is at:
            http://www.angelfire.com/hi2/eckankarsurvivors/data.html
            Down at the bottom, and there's a link there to another letter I sent to them.

            That first resignation - well, it's hard to explain how I felt. Lost, floating. In addition to the "formal" spiritual exercises & nightly "hu", I also sang hu frequently thru the day, and talked to the "mahanta" in my head. I was really lost without it.

            But, by this time, I'd taken a 2nd hard look at all the crap in the "teachings". Of course, I remembered all those threats but I never felt they applied to me, because there was no way I'd ever leave, so I didn't have to worry about becoming a mental vegetable & spending endless lost wandering incarnations before "the master" forgave me and took me back. After all, I'd read that I'd made the mistake of leaving in past lives. No way would I make that mistake again!!

            Getting better is a process. It doesn't happen overnight. I still considered myself an eckist "on the inner", in my own way, for a little bit after I left. Along the way, I'd take time to look back every so often, and I could always see how much better I was. And after a few years, I didn't even remember my "anniversary" or think about it very much at all. So, it's been about 13 years now - and it's absolutely meaningless to me now. Silly, even. Like those dumb things we did in high school that we don't even remember, and when we do, we laugh at ourselves!!

            Except, ekult isn't exactly a laughing matter, because it does harm people, and it's still sucking in new people.

            I was very fortunate that I had friends in the "real world" who didn't even know about ekult, so my "outer" life basically stayed "normal". I wasn't very involved over the years aside from some bookstudies & satsangs rarely, and then worship services when they started them. My son was young, eckthings were usually on weeknights and way past bedtime by the time we got home. It's sort of funny - I think my son was around 12 when we went to the first "worship service", and afterwards he said he didn't want to go again, because he didn't feel "Spirit" there. And that was true, I didn't feel it, couldn't pinpoint why until now - it was all that typical eckcrap!! I didn't get to any large seminars until the last years - and they only make me feel uncomfy, like something was wrong.

            Anyway, I often go on & on & on but want to keep this short. Oh - almost forgot, I believe it was December after I left that I was sitting at the computer on a Saturday, an ice storm was on the way, and honest - I heard this voice saying "Get to Mass, NOW!!!" I jumped, and looked behind me. <gg> I said okay, but there's an ice storm on the way and I do NOT want to wreck my car!! Weird, because I'd been Catholic for maybe 2-3 years in elementary school, barely long enough to make my first communion, then my mother joined the Jehovah's Witnesses - that made me hate God and pray for eternal death at Armageddon! <gg> Anyway, I went to Mass, it was a truly beautiful spiritual experience. Around the same time, another former eckist told me he really got a lot from Yogananda's "Self Realization Fellowship" and sent me some books & tapes.

            I'm remembering - at that first Mass, I got "inner" orders to take Communion. Now, I was pre-Vatican II, so in m my mind that was a big no-no. <gg> But, I did it - and it was, well...a truly beautiful spiritual experience. Later, I talked to the priest, went to Confession (freaked out in that dark confessional!), went to a some Catholic classes, etc. Ha, laughing here, I even volunteered to work one of the game booths at the summer festival!! <gg> So, I did the Catholic thing for about a year. Then other things interfered. But, to this day, sometimes I still feel like going to Mass, except I usually don't know what day it is, I'm always running a day or two behind, so I never remember there's Saturday evening mass. Sundays are out, because even when I wake up early, it takes me a few hours to get moving. <gg>

            Self-Realization Fellowship - that was great, too!! I took their monthly "lessons" for a year, and ohmigod, what a *big* difference from ekult's crappy worthless discourses!!
            One thing I especially loved about Yogananda was that he emphasized God over Guru.

            Oh, I also sort of returned to Wicca, which I gave up when I joined ekult because it was "lower". That was sort of hard to do, because I love the woods & moon & candles & herbs, and all that stuff. I went back to my old "magic" spot and my old beloved oaks, and did a beautiful midnight purification ritual for myself on Samhain.

            Okay, so it can be argued that Catholicism & SRF, and even some Wiccan groups, are cults. Well, when I was an eckist and went to a.r.e., I remember posting as an eckist that okay, maybe it was a cult for some eckists, but it wasn't a cult for me! I was wrong. I had *no* idea how totally brainwashed and controlled I was!!

            And, that's how I was about Catholicism & SRF - they weren't at all cultic for me. I was like I'd been before ekult, not good at following strict orders or anything - heck, as a Catholic kid I'd go to Methodist bible school & services and not feel a bit guilty, other than confessing them. <gg> I always sort of took what "felt" right from everywhere, and did things my way. Never could "get" Jesus - the "saviour" and "blood of Christ" stuff/ I liked him and his teachings, though. Still do.

            Throughout my life, and even moreso after I joined ekult, I always read a lot of spiritual works from other religions, for example I really loved the writings of Catholic saints - actually, there was a lot of ekult in them. For example, ekult's "spiritual exercises" are IMO taken from the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius of Loyola, founder of the Jesuits. Klemp mentioned Catholic great Thomas Merton in a discourse, so I figured it was okay - I *love* Merton!

            Anyway, there is absolutely *no* freedom of mind or spirit in ekult - just a bunch of cultic programming and mixed messages. So, now I don't "believe" in anything other than possibilities. What's between me & "God" is personal, I do it however I feel like it at any given moment, and just as often I'm sort of an atheist, and "believe" in aliens, etc. My personal spirituality is just that - personal!! I am who I am, and if that doesn't work for "God" - Him/Her/It/Them/Whatever - well, tough!!

            Okay, I was just rambling, if you'd like, feel free to write to me and I'll try to help. I think the best way to deal with your sister, etc., is to stay close but just don't discuss ekult, or anything "spiritual" - I do hope that's possible!! It's sad, but over the years I've heard from so many people who were ostracized and shunned by eckist family members, and that's just not right!! Many former members still have eckist friends, true friends - but quite often they find that without ekult, there's just no real basis for true friendship.

            Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible. Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer work.

            Gotta go, be happy!!

            Hugs,

            Sharon




            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "williamsaimee86" <williamsaimee86@...> wrote:
            >
            > My name is aimee. I was a part of Eckankar since 1999.
            >
            > My sister and her husband are eckist and so are her kids. She lives 10 minutes away. They worship Harold and many high initiates.
            >
            > I have stopped my membership. I will cancel it by mail this week. My biggest question is how do you feel safe in the world with out feeling like you need the protection of the mahanta.
            >
            > it scared me a lot to take that pendant off. What on earth do I do to be strong outside of eckankar. I think am going to go back to christianity.
            >
            > I feel lost. If anyone wants to be friends please send me a note.
            >
            > I want to get better. How long will it take for me to get my land legs?
            >
            > Thanks for reading this.
            >
            > Aimee
            >

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "williamsaimee86" <williamsaimee86@...> wrote:
            >
            > My name is aimee. I was a part of Eckankar since 1999.
            >
            > My sister and her husband are eckist and so are her kids. She lives 10 minutes away. They worship Harold and many high initiates.
            >
            > I have stopped my membership. I will cancel it by mail this week. My biggest question is how do you feel safe in the world with out feeling like you need the protection of the mahanta.
            >
            > it scared me a lot to take that pendant off. What on earth do I do to be strong outside of eckankar. I think am going to go back to christianity.
            >
            > I feel lost. If anyone wants to be friends please send me a note.
            >
            > I want to get better. How long will it take for me to get my land legs?
            >
            > Thanks for reading this.
            >
            > Aimee
            >
          • Sharon
            Whoops, Aimee - I forgot something really important! Laughter!! It ll get you through the roughest spots, because you might find yourself feeling pretty bad,
            Message 5 of 13 , Oct 20, 2011
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              Whoops, Aimee - I forgot something really important! Laughter!!

              It'll get you through the roughest spots, because you might find yourself feeling pretty bad, rent some funny videos, read jokes, oh I'd recommend funny animals on Animal Planet and YouTube!

              And, you can even laugh at some of the most horrible stuff in ekult's "teachings" - okay, on the one hand they're pretty grim, but on the other hand, they're hilarious!! Like, the nonsense about dying in your sleep from black magicians if you don't have the "mahanta" to protect you! Good grief, we're adults, this crap is *so* hilarious, how did we take it seriously?

              Take care!

              Hugs,

              Sharon
            • dianastanley43
              Amimee I know how you feel. I have been out of Eck some 30 yrs. I got out when Darwin went crazy. I remember thinking maybe Paul is still the mahanta and
              Message 6 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                Amimee I know how you feel. I have been out of Eck some 30 yrs. I got out when Darwin went crazy. I remember thinking maybe Paul is still the mahanta and rebazar is still around. That kept me going for a while untill I had to admit the trough. Eck never was a spiritual path it was all a figment of Pauls imajination. I tried some other paths and finally after a time I realized I had the ability to contact directly what I had been looking for. It took me a few yrs to finally feel I was finally on the right path,my own.
                It was the most painful experience I had ever had.
                Much love Diana

                --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...> wrote:
                >
                >
                > Hi Aimee -
                >
                > I'm sorry it's taken me so long to reply to your post - and where does time go? Good grief, what happened to October? Is everything just going faster, or is it me getting slower? I'm so slow, I'm almost going backwards! <gg>
                >
                > I know how you're feeling - I went through it too, and it was pretty scarey! I left back in 1998 - and the first time I resigned, I was so lost, I rejoined a few days later and even sent them a check! <gg>
                >
                > My final resignation letter is at:
                > http://www.angelfire.com/hi2/eckankarsurvivors/data.html
                > Down at the bottom, and there's a link there to another letter I sent to them.
                >
                > That first resignation - well, it's hard to explain how I felt. Lost, floating. In addition to the "formal" spiritual exercises & nightly "hu", I also sang hu frequently thru the day, and talked to the "mahanta" in my head. I was really lost without it.
                >
                > But, by this time, I'd taken a 2nd hard look at all the crap in the "teachings". Of course, I remembered all those threats but I never felt they applied to me, because there was no way I'd ever leave, so I didn't have to worry about becoming a mental vegetable & spending endless lost wandering incarnations before "the master" forgave me and took me back. After all, I'd read that I'd made the mistake of leaving in past lives. No way would I make that mistake again!!
                >
                > Getting better is a process. It doesn't happen overnight. I still considered myself an eckist "on the inner", in my own way, for a little bit after I left. Along the way, I'd take time to look back every so often, and I could always see how much better I was. And after a few years, I didn't even remember my "anniversary" or think about it very much at all. So, it's been about 13 years now - and it's absolutely meaningless to me now. Silly, even. Like those dumb things we did in high school that we don't even remember, and when we do, we laugh at ourselves!!
                >
                > Except, ekult isn't exactly a laughing matter, because it does harm people, and it's still sucking in new people.
                >
                > I was very fortunate that I had friends in the "real world" who didn't even know about ekult, so my "outer" life basically stayed "normal". I wasn't very involved over the years aside from some bookstudies & satsangs rarely, and then worship services when they started them. My son was young, eckthings were usually on weeknights and way past bedtime by the time we got home. It's sort of funny - I think my son was around 12 when we went to the first "worship service", and afterwards he said he didn't want to go again, because he didn't feel "Spirit" there. And that was true, I didn't feel it, couldn't pinpoint why until now - it was all that typical eckcrap!! I didn't get to any large seminars until the last years - and they only make me feel uncomfy, like something was wrong.
                >
                > Anyway, I often go on & on & on but want to keep this short. Oh - almost forgot, I believe it was December after I left that I was sitting at the computer on a Saturday, an ice storm was on the way, and honest - I heard this voice saying "Get to Mass, NOW!!!" I jumped, and looked behind me. <gg> I said okay, but there's an ice storm on the way and I do NOT want to wreck my car!! Weird, because I'd been Catholic for maybe 2-3 years in elementary school, barely long enough to make my first communion, then my mother joined the Jehovah's Witnesses - that made me hate God and pray for eternal death at Armageddon! <gg> Anyway, I went to Mass, it was a truly beautiful spiritual experience. Around the same time, another former eckist told me he really got a lot from Yogananda's "Self Realization Fellowship" and sent me some books & tapes.
                >
                > I'm remembering - at that first Mass, I got "inner" orders to take Communion. Now, I was pre-Vatican II, so in m my mind that was a big no-no. <gg> But, I did it - and it was, well...a truly beautiful spiritual experience. Later, I talked to the priest, went to Confession (freaked out in that dark confessional!), went to a some Catholic classes, etc. Ha, laughing here, I even volunteered to work one of the game booths at the summer festival!! <gg> So, I did the Catholic thing for about a year. Then other things interfered. But, to this day, sometimes I still feel like going to Mass, except I usually don't know what day it is, I'm always running a day or two behind, so I never remember there's Saturday evening mass. Sundays are out, because even when I wake up early, it takes me a few hours to get moving. <gg>
                >
                > Self-Realization Fellowship - that was great, too!! I took their monthly "lessons" for a year, and ohmigod, what a *big* difference from ekult's crappy worthless discourses!!
                > One thing I especially loved about Yogananda was that he emphasized God over Guru.
                >
                > Oh, I also sort of returned to Wicca, which I gave up when I joined ekult because it was "lower". That was sort of hard to do, because I love the woods & moon & candles & herbs, and all that stuff. I went back to my old "magic" spot and my old beloved oaks, and did a beautiful midnight purification ritual for myself on Samhain.
                >
                > Okay, so it can be argued that Catholicism & SRF, and even some Wiccan groups, are cults. Well, when I was an eckist and went to a.r.e., I remember posting as an eckist that okay, maybe it was a cult for some eckists, but it wasn't a cult for me! I was wrong. I had *no* idea how totally brainwashed and controlled I was!!
                >
                > And, that's how I was about Catholicism & SRF - they weren't at all cultic for me. I was like I'd been before ekult, not good at following strict orders or anything - heck, as a Catholic kid I'd go to Methodist bible school & services and not feel a bit guilty, other than confessing them. <gg> I always sort of took what "felt" right from everywhere, and did things my way. Never could "get" Jesus - the "saviour" and "blood of Christ" stuff/ I liked him and his teachings, though. Still do.
                >
                > Throughout my life, and even moreso after I joined ekult, I always read a lot of spiritual works from other religions, for example I really loved the writings of Catholic saints - actually, there was a lot of ekult in them. For example, ekult's "spiritual exercises" are IMO taken from the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius of Loyola, founder of the Jesuits. Klemp mentioned Catholic great Thomas Merton in a discourse, so I figured it was okay - I *love* Merton!
                >
                > Anyway, there is absolutely *no* freedom of mind or spirit in ekult - just a bunch of cultic programming and mixed messages. So, now I don't "believe" in anything other than possibilities. What's between me & "God" is personal, I do it however I feel like it at any given moment, and just as often I'm sort of an atheist, and "believe" in aliens, etc. My personal spirituality is just that - personal!! I am who I am, and if that doesn't work for "God" - Him/Her/It/Them/Whatever - well, tough!!
                >
                > Okay, I was just rambling, if you'd like, feel free to write to me and I'll try to help. I think the best way to deal with your sister, etc., is to stay close but just don't discuss ekult, or anything "spiritual" - I do hope that's possible!! It's sad, but over the years I've heard from so many people who were ostracized and shunned by eckist family members, and that's just not right!! Many former members still have eckist friends, true friends - but quite often they find that without ekult, there's just no real basis for true friendship.
                >
                > Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible. Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer work.
                >
                > Gotta go, be happy!!
                >
                > Hugs,
                >
                > Sharon
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "williamsaimee86" <williamsaimee86@> wrote:
                > >
                > > My name is aimee. I was a part of Eckankar since 1999.
                > >
                > > My sister and her husband are eckist and so are her kids. She lives 10 minutes away. They worship Harold and many high initiates.
                > >
                > > I have stopped my membership. I will cancel it by mail this week. My biggest question is how do you feel safe in the world with out feeling like you need the protection of the mahanta.
                > >
                > > it scared me a lot to take that pendant off. What on earth do I do to be strong outside of eckankar. I think am going to go back to christianity.
                > >
                > > I feel lost. If anyone wants to be friends please send me a note.
                > >
                > > I want to get better. How long will it take for me to get my land legs?
                > >
                > > Thanks for reading this.
                > >
                > > Aimee
                > >
                >
                > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "williamsaimee86" <williamsaimee86@> wrote:
                > >
                > > My name is aimee. I was a part of Eckankar since 1999.
                > >
                > > My sister and her husband are eckist and so are her kids. She lives 10 minutes away. They worship Harold and many high initiates.
                > >
                > > I have stopped my membership. I will cancel it by mail this week. My biggest question is how do you feel safe in the world with out feeling like you need the protection of the mahanta.
                > >
                > > it scared me a lot to take that pendant off. What on earth do I do to be strong outside of eckankar. I think am going to go back to christianity.
                > >
                > > I feel lost. If anyone wants to be friends please send me a note.
                > >
                > > I want to get better. How long will it take for me to get my land legs?
                > >
                > > Thanks for reading this.
                > >
                > > Aimee
                > >
                >
              • Austin Atma
                However, what s the need with joining another religion? Is it a need for being part of a social community? If so, then volunteer or join a secular community
                Message 7 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                  "However, what's the need with
                  joining another religion? Is it
                  a need for being part of a social 
                  community? If so, then volunteer 
                  or join a secular community group."

                  Sometimes I think the more religion, the more difficulty we're having connecting to the internal "pillars" of our own heart, head, and imagination.  And by "own" I just mean self/other understanding and discovery through common sense connections with life and everything in it.  

                  All too often we will choose infantile fantasy over common sense and authentic connection.  

                  Pass the chocolate and airbrushed reality ;-).

                  AA


                  On Oct 5, 2011, at 2:00 PM, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:

                   

                  Hello Aimee,
                  Why not simply let your
                  ECK membership lapse?

                  Christianity is even a bigger
                  scam, than Eckankar, since
                  most of these churches don't
                  follow Jesus' teachings 100%.
                  They tend to revert back to
                  the Old Testament teachings
                  which Jesus had issues with
                  and was correcting.

                  Here's an interesting approach:
                  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/05/science-vs-spirituality-war-of-the-worldviews_n_987121.html

                  This is "Science vs Spirituality"
                  with a physicist, Leonard Mlodinow,
                  who worked on a book with Stephen
                  Hawkings and with Deepak Chopra
                  who was once involved with TM
                  and Maharishi.

                  Apparently Chopra was teaching
                  Mlodinow about "consciousness"
                  (and meditation) while Mlodinow
                  was teaching Chopra about physics.
                  However, I'm not sure what makes
                  Chopra an expert on consciousness
                  since Maharishi (his mentor) was
                  a conman like Twitchell. TM is a
                  religion (a sect of Hinduism), but
                  many Western followers see it as
                  a "scientific" method to raise consciousness
                  and reduce stress.

                  Anyway, you might want to
                  check it out and/or buy the
                  book from Amazon.com

                  However, what's the need with
                  joining another religion? Is it
                  a need for being part of a social
                  community? If so, then volunteer
                  or join a secular community group.

                  Remember, with any religion,
                  there's always the pecking order
                  i.e. hierarchy and some authority
                  figure interpreting scripture for
                  you and telling you what to believe.
                  Be your own religion! Doesn't
                  Soul=Soul? We are all equal in
                  Spirit... right! It's all subjective
                  and what fits one doesn't always
                  fit another, nor was It supposed to!

                  Allow Soul's newly found spiritual
                  freedom and your own clarity
                  of mind to fill-in the void left
                  when leaving Eckankar. You are
                  no longer Codependent, but it
                  takes time to heal. Maybe a 12
                  Step Group would help. Check
                  the listings in your area.

                  Prometheus
                  p.s. It shouldn't take you as
                  long to get your "land legs"
                  as someone else like an H.I.
                  with 25-35 years in the cult.
                  It also depends upon how
                  much you bought into it and
                  upon your psychologically
                  addictive susceptibility.

                  The brain-washing becomes
                  more intense with each higher
                  initiation. Thus, 8th & 9th
                  initiates are, truly, lost Souls!
                  The higher one goes and the
                  longer they stay the more
                  delusional and narrow minded
                  they become.

                  williamsaimee86@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > My name is aimee. I was
                  a part of Eckankar since 1999.
                  >
                  > My sister and her husband
                  are eckist and so are her kids.
                  She lives 10 minutes away.
                  They worship Harold and many
                  high initiates.
                  >
                  > I have stopped my membership.
                  I will cancel it by mail this week.
                  My biggest question is how do
                  you feel safe in the world with
                  out feeling like you need the
                  protection of the mahanta.
                  >
                  > it scared me a lot to take that
                  pendant off. What on earth do
                  I do to be strong outside of
                  eckankar. I think am going to
                  go back to christianity.
                  >
                  > I feel lost. If anyone wants
                  to be friends please send me
                  a note.
                  >
                  > I want to get better. How
                  long will it take for me to get
                  my land legs?
                  >
                  > Thanks for reading this.
                  >
                  > Aimee
                  >

                • Austin Atma
                  ... Or if you don t watch out it/freedom will settle into you... The old cliche of be yourself is apt, but if we ve been adapting to religion, bosses,
                  Message 8 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                    On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...> wrote:

                    > Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible. Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer work.

                    Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                    The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                    The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and determination to be free. ~ AA
                  • etznab@aol.com
                    Original Lyrics: And did you exchange A walk on part in the war For a lead role in a cage? http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml @ 2
                    Message 9 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                      Original Lyrics:

                      And did you exchange
                      A walk on part in the war
                      For a lead role in a cage?

                      http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml

                      @ 2 minutes, 48 seconds

                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAchKt2xjsw

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: Austin Atma <austinatma@...>
                      To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                      <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Fri, Oct 21, 2011 6:04 pm
                      Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A new start

                       


                      On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...>
                      wrote:

                      > Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just
                      be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind
                      off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible.
                      Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to
                      spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer
                      work.

                      Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                      The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to
                      religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way
                      as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                      The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a
                      walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from
                      the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and
                      determination to be free. ~ AA
                    • Austin Atma
                      War = life Cage = alleged security of lotus eating ;-)
                      Message 10 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                        War = life

                        Cage = alleged security of lotus eating ;-)

                        On Oct 21, 2011, at 6:15 PM, etznab@... wrote:

                         

                        Original Lyrics:

                        And did you exchange
                        A walk on part in the war
                        For a lead role in a cage?

                        http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml

                        @ 2 minutes, 48 seconds

                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAchKt2xjsw

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: Austin Atma <austinatma@...>
                        To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                        <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Fri, Oct 21, 2011 6:04 pm
                        Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A new start

                         

                        On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" &lt;brighttigress@...&gt;
                        wrote:

                        &gt; Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just
                        be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind
                        off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible.
                        Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to
                        spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer
                        work.

                        Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                        The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to
                        religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way
                        as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                        The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a
                        walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from
                        the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and
                        determination to be free. ~ AA


                      • Austin Atma
                        And thanks!
                        Message 11 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                          And thanks!  

                          On Oct 21, 2011, at 6:15 PM, etznab@... wrote:

                           

                          Original Lyrics:

                          And did you exchange
                          A walk on part in the war
                          For a lead role in a cage?

                          http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml

                          @ 2 minutes, 48 seconds

                          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAchKt2xjsw

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: Austin Atma <austinatma@...>
                          To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                          <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Fri, Oct 21, 2011 6:04 pm
                          Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A new start

                           

                          On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" &lt;brighttigress@...&gt;
                          wrote:

                          &gt; Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just
                          be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind
                          off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible.
                          Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to
                          spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer
                          work.

                          Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                          The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to
                          religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way
                          as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                          The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a
                          walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from
                          the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and
                          determination to be free. ~ AA


                        • Austin Atma
                          How about Tom Petty, Like a Refugee ;-) Eckists who have traveled overland to Turkey to escape the totalitarian regime of Eckraq. What are we doctors
                          Message 12 of 13 , Oct 21, 2011
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                            How about Tom Petty, Like a Refugee ;-)

                            Eckists who have traveled overland to "Turkey" to escape the totalitarian regime of Eckraq.  What are we doctors without borders? 

                            On Oct 21, 2011, at 6:15 PM, etznab@... wrote:

                             

                            Original Lyrics:

                            And did you exchange
                            A walk on part in the war
                            For a lead role in a cage?

                            http://www.amiright.com/misheard/song/wishyouwerehere.shtml

                            @ 2 minutes, 48 seconds

                            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAchKt2xjsw

                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: Austin Atma <austinatma@...>
                            To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                            <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Fri, Oct 21, 2011 6:04 pm
                            Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A new start

                             

                            On Oct 20, 2011, at 11:55 AM, "Sharon" &lt;brighttigress@...&gt;
                            wrote:

                            &gt; Anyway, you *will* settle into freedom, and you'll love it!! Just
                            be patient, be good to yourself - try to do things to take your mind
                            off it, see "normal" people and do "normal" things as much as possible.
                            Get fresh air & exercise - trees are very healing!! If you used to
                            spend a lot of time on cultstuff, if you're able, do some volunteer
                            work.

                            Or if you don't watch out it/freedom will settle into you...

                            The old cliche of "be yourself" is apt, but if we've been adapting to
                            religion, bosses, spouses, children, and everything else in such a way
                            as to loose track of our own direction it does take time.

                            The line from Pink Floyd fits as we "trade a lead role in a cage for a
                            walk on part in a war..." may have garbled it but walking away from
                            the gilded cage is very rewarding. But takes strength and
                            determination to be free. ~ AA


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