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Re: a grain of truth

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  • prometheus_973
    Hello Diana, interesting and thought provoking! I see it somewhat semantically different (I think). Maybe it s that all consciousness Is divided into
    Message 1 of 7 , Sep 26, 2011
      Hello Diana,
      interesting and thought provoking!
      I see it somewhat semantically
      different (I think).

      Maybe it's that all consciousness
      Is divided into individual states/
      units/Souls. But I also see that
      all "units" are unified and share
      the (non-religious) Divine essence
      of Being. I don't really see the
      "atom" correlation as much since
      human thoughts are extremely
      powerful while not containing
      atoms, although, thoughts can
      control and manipulate atoms
      in/of the physical universe.

      I don't see that consciousness
      is comprised of atoms, either,
      since thoughts are not comprised
      of atoms, although, the atoms
      that comprise our bodies and
      minds create thoughts (dreams)
      and individual consciousness.
      Brain chemistry and its pathways
      are important, as well, so sometimes
      it's the arrangement of various
      atoms and their interactions
      with/to one another.

      I will say that it appears that
      there are almost infinite degrees
      and combinations for these atoms
      to be arranged and to function
      at any given point in time. Thus,
      "Truth" becomes more a social/
      religious/scientific term and
      theory is merely a degree of
      faith via observation.

      As far as consciousness remaining
      after the individual dies... I don't
      know. Where is it? What impact does
      it have, and on whom or what? Who
      says it does remain and how do they
      know? It sounds like a nice thought
      and a reassuring pov, but....? Then,
      again, there's the "Soul" view which
      is very similar.

      The one thing that I've observed and
      experienced is that there are individual
      (Soul) patterns, choices, and fate, as
      well as, "nudges" and quiet "whispers"
      that we all experience during our lives.
      IMO, people are merely the human/individual
      and physical expressions of the Divine
      Consciousness while Soul/Spirit is the
      conduit and observer within. However,
      many are unaware of or reject this, and
      similar philosophies, and choose to follow
      ego and/or religion.


      Prometheus



      dianastanley wrote:
      >
      > Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self, that counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and when a form is available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which to know it self. Someone said counciousness is like a whale looking at its own tail. we are the tail. Because we are in seppret forms counsessness itdendifies with the individual form and comes to believe it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that as children. We have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different from everyone else.

      > Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of counciousness in it.
      > when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
      > of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
      > Diana

      > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Hello Tyson,
      > > Welcome to the site. I'd like
      > > to respond to your comments.
      > >
      > >
      > > Tyson wrote:
      > >
      > > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we always
      > > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
      > > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences
      > > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or be a mediocre fiction
      > > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta
      > > consciousness."
      > >
      > >
      > > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
      > > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
      > > ETC. from personal and private experiences
      > > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
      > > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
      > > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
      > > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
      > > yet, we are one with one another via the
      > > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
      > >
      > >
      > > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus, Siddharta, Krishna ect..) paul
      > > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a con mans
      > > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we already
      > > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to open the
      > > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound current.
      > > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self seeking
      > > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat nam
      > > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides from the
      > > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that
      > > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion only
      > > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The nine silent ones do
      > > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
      > >
      > >
      > > ME: Those mentioned above were
      > > "extroverted" masters. However,
      > > IMO, there are many more who are
      > > "introverted" masters and many of
      > > those live "now" and are/were not
      > > of the ancient past. Today, most
      > > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
      > > (and more negative versus positive)
      > > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
      > > a bipolar narcissistic world.
      > >
      > > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
      > > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
      > > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
      > > in order to leave the body through
      > > the top of the head.
      > >
      > > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
      > > another name for God other than
      > > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
      > > the "c."
      > >
      > > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
      > > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
      > > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
      > > their truth as a religion. One can take
      > > and use some of what another has
      > > learned via their own revelations into
      > > the Divine in order to prime one's own
      > > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
      > > up to You directing You.
      > >
      > > We all need to become our own spiritual
      > > leader/teacher and take responsibility
      > > instead of following others. I'll admit
      > > that Jesus did have some very good
      > > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
      > > who lead us today, religious/political,
      > > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
      > > They all give lip service to those lessons
      > > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
      > > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
      > > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
      > > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
      > > almost all of his initiations including the
      > > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
      > > who say one thing and and do another.
      > >
      > >
      > > Prometheus
      > >
      >
    • dianastanley43
      I m afraid my quantum phyisics is showing.Instead of atom you could say unit of counciousness. I see counciousness as something all things exist in not that
      Message 2 of 7 , Sep 27, 2011
        I'm afraid my quantum phyisics is showing.Instead of atom you could say unit of counciousness. I see counciousness as something all things exist in not that it exists in us although it seems like it as we are used to feeling sepperate from all other things.
        I believe God,so to speak,can only beaware of itself in it's creations. So in a way we are the body and mind of IT. I didn't put it very well but when you talk on this level it is hard to find the right words. Why this happened I have no idea.
        Diana

        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello Diana,
        > interesting and thought provoking!
        > I see it somewhat semantically
        > different (I think).
        >
        > Maybe it's that all consciousness
        > Is divided into individual states/
        > units/Souls. But I also see that
        > all "units" are unified and share
        > the (non-religious) Divine essence
        > of Being. I don't really see the
        > "atom" correlation as much since
        > human thoughts are extremely
        > powerful while not containing
        > atoms, although, thoughts can
        > control and manipulate atoms
        > in/of the physical universe.
        >
        > I don't see that consciousness
        > is comprised of atoms, either,
        > since thoughts are not comprised
        > of atoms, although, the atoms
        > that comprise our bodies and
        > minds create thoughts (dreams)
        > and individual consciousness.
        > Brain chemistry and its pathways
        > are important, as well, so sometimes
        > it's the arrangement of various
        > atoms and their interactions
        > with/to one another.
        >
        > I will say that it appears that
        > there are almost infinite degrees
        > and combinations for these atoms
        > to be arranged and to function
        > at any given point in time. Thus,
        > "Truth" becomes more a social/
        > religious/scientific term and
        > theory is merely a degree of
        > faith via observation.
        >
        > As far as consciousness remaining
        > after the individual dies... I don't
        > know. Where is it? What impact does
        > it have, and on whom or what? Who
        > says it does remain and how do they
        > know? It sounds like a nice thought
        > and a reassuring pov, but....? Then,
        > again, there's the "Soul" view which
        > is very similar.
        >
        > The one thing that I've observed and
        > experienced is that there are individual
        > (Soul) patterns, choices, and fate, as
        > well as, "nudges" and quiet "whispers"
        > that we all experience during our lives.
        > IMO, people are merely the human/individual
        > and physical expressions of the Divine
        > Consciousness while Soul/Spirit is the
        > conduit and observer within. However,
        > many are unaware of or reject this, and
        > similar philosophies, and choose to follow
        > ego and/or religion.
        >
        >
        > Prometheus
        >
        >
        >
        > dianastanley wrote:
        > >
        > > Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self, that counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and when a form is available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which to know it self. Someone said counciousness is like a whale looking at its own tail. we are the tail. Because we are in seppret forms counsessness itdendifies with the individual form and comes to believe it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that as children. We have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different from everyone else.
        >
        > > Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of counciousness in it.
        > > when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
        > > of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
        > > Diana
        >
        > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > Hello Tyson,
        > > > Welcome to the site. I'd like
        > > > to respond to your comments.
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Tyson wrote:
        > > >
        > > > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we always
        > > > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
        > > > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences
        > > > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or be a mediocre fiction
        > > > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta
        > > > consciousness."
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
        > > > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
        > > > ETC. from personal and private experiences
        > > > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
        > > > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
        > > > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
        > > > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
        > > > yet, we are one with one another via the
        > > > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus, Siddharta, Krishna ect..) paul
        > > > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a con mans
        > > > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we already
        > > > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to open the
        > > > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound current.
        > > > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self seeking
        > > > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat nam
        > > > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides from the
        > > > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that
        > > > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion only
        > > > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The nine silent ones do
        > > > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > ME: Those mentioned above were
        > > > "extroverted" masters. However,
        > > > IMO, there are many more who are
        > > > "introverted" masters and many of
        > > > those live "now" and are/were not
        > > > of the ancient past. Today, most
        > > > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
        > > > (and more negative versus positive)
        > > > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
        > > > a bipolar narcissistic world.
        > > >
        > > > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
        > > > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
        > > > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
        > > > in order to leave the body through
        > > > the top of the head.
        > > >
        > > > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
        > > > another name for God other than
        > > > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
        > > > the "c."
        > > >
        > > > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
        > > > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
        > > > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
        > > > their truth as a religion. One can take
        > > > and use some of what another has
        > > > learned via their own revelations into
        > > > the Divine in order to prime one's own
        > > > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
        > > > up to You directing You.
        > > >
        > > > We all need to become our own spiritual
        > > > leader/teacher and take responsibility
        > > > instead of following others. I'll admit
        > > > that Jesus did have some very good
        > > > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
        > > > who lead us today, religious/political,
        > > > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
        > > > They all give lip service to those lessons
        > > > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
        > > > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
        > > > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
        > > > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
        > > > almost all of his initiations including the
        > > > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
        > > > who say one thing and and do another.
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Prometheus
        > > >
        > >
        >
      • etznab@aol.com
        I believe God, so to speak, can only be aware of itself in it s creations. That was very profound Diane. I thought your other message was, too. ... From:
        Message 3 of 7 , Sep 27, 2011
          "I believe God, so to speak, can only be aware of itself in it's
          creations."

          That was very profound Diane. I thought your other message was, too.

          -----Original Message-----
          From: dianastanley43 <dianastanley43@...>
          To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
          <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Tue, Sep 27, 2011 12:29 pm
          Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: a grain of truth

           
          I'm afraid my quantum phyisics is showing.Instead of atom you could say
          unit of counciousness. I see counciousness as something all things
          exist in not that it exists in us although it seems like it as we are
          used to feeling sepperate from all other things.
          I believe God,so to speak,can only beaware of itself in it's creations.
          So in a way we are the body and mind of IT. I didn't put it very well
          but when you talk on this level it is hard to find the right words. Why
          this happened I have no idea.
          Diana

          --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
          <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hello Diana,
          > interesting and thought provoking!
          > I see it somewhat semantically
          > different (I think).
          >
          > Maybe it's that all consciousness
          > Is divided into individual states/
          > units/Souls. But I also see that
          > all "units" are unified and share
          > the (non-religious) Divine essence
          > of Being. I don't really see the
          > "atom" correlation as much since
          > human thoughts are extremely
          > powerful while not containing
          > atoms, although, thoughts can
          > control and manipulate atoms
          > in/of the physical universe.
          >
          > I don't see that consciousness
          > is comprised of atoms, either,
          > since thoughts are not comprised
          > of atoms, although, the atoms
          > that comprise our bodies and
          > minds create thoughts (dreams)
          > and individual consciousness.
          > Brain chemistry and its pathways
          > are important, as well, so sometimes
          > it's the arrangement of various
          > atoms and their interactions
          > with/to one another.
          >
          > I will say that it appears that
          > there are almost infinite degrees
          > and combinations for these atoms
          > to be arranged and to function
          > at any given point in time. Thus,
          > "Truth" becomes more a social/
          > religious/scientific term and
          > theory is merely a degree of
          > faith via observation.
          >
          > As far as consciousness remaining
          > after the individual dies... I don't
          > know. Where is it? What impact does
          > it have, and on whom or what? Who
          > says it does remain and how do they
          > know? It sounds like a nice thought
          > and a reassuring pov, but....? Then,
          > again, there's the "Soul" view which
          > is very similar.
          >
          > The one thing that I've observed and
          > experienced is that there are individual
          > (Soul) patterns, choices, and fate, as
          > well as, "nudges" and quiet "whispers"
          > that we all experience during our lives.
          > IMO, people are merely the human/individual
          > and physical expressions of the Divine
          > Consciousness while Soul/Spirit is the
          > conduit and observer within. However,
          > many are unaware of or reject this, and
          > similar philosophies, and choose to follow
          > ego and/or religion.
          >
          >
          > Prometheus
          >
          >
          >
          > dianastanley wrote:
          > >
          > > Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self,
          that counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and
          when a form is available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which
          to know it self. Someone said counciousness is like a whale looking at
          its own tail. we are the tail. Because we are in seppret forms
          counsessness itdendifies with the individual form and comes to believe
          it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that as children. We
          have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different from
          everyone else.
          >
          > > Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of
          counciousness in it.
          > > when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
          > > of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
          > > Diana
          >
          > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com,
          "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > Hello Tyson,
          > > > Welcome to the site. I'd like
          > > > to respond to your comments.
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Tyson wrote:
          > > >
          > > > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are
          eternal thus we always
          > > > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT
          THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
          > > > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some
          spiritual experiences
          > > > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or
          be a mediocre fiction
          > > > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big
          lie of mahanta
          > > > consciousness."
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
          > > > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
          > > > ETC. from personal and private experiences
          > > > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
          > > > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
          > > > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
          > > > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
          > > > yet, we are one with one another via the
          > > > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus,
          Siddharta, Krishna ect..) paul
          > > > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body
          experiences and a con mans
          > > > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken
          in us what we already
          > > > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which
          is learning to open the
          > > > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the
          celestial sound current.
          > > > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in
          his own self seeking
          > > > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own
          selfish means. Sat nam
          > > > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches
          love, he hides from the
          > > > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come
          to believe that
          > > > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant
          to be a religion only
          > > > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The
          nine silent ones do
          > > > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > ME: Those mentioned above were
          > > > "extroverted" masters. However,
          > > > IMO, there are many more who are
          > > > "introverted" masters and many of
          > > > those live "now" and are/were not
          > > > of the ancient past. Today, most
          > > > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
          > > > (and more negative versus positive)
          > > > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
          > > > a bipolar narcissistic world.
          > > >
          > > > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
          > > > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
          > > > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
          > > > in order to leave the body through
          > > > the top of the head.
          > > >
          > > > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
          > > > another name for God other than
          > > > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
          > > > the "c."
          > > >
          > > > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
          > > > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
          > > > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
          > > > their truth as a religion. One can take
          > > > and use some of what another has
          > > > learned via their own revelations into
          > > > the Divine in order to prime one's own
          > > > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
          > > > up to You directing You.
          > > >
          > > > We all need to become our own spiritual
          > > > leader/teacher and take responsibility
          > > > instead of following others. I'll admit
          > > > that Jesus did have some very good
          > > > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
          > > > who lead us today, religious/political,
          > > > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
          > > > They all give lip service to those lessons
          > > > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
          > > > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
          > > > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
          > > > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
          > > > almost all of his initiations including the
          > > > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
          > > > who say one thing and and do another.
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Prometheus
          > > >
          > >
          >
        • prometheus_973
          Hello Diana and All, I try to steer away from any mention of Quantum Physics or Quantum Mechanics because I don t understand it and because too many scammers
          Message 4 of 7 , Sep 28, 2011
            Hello Diana and All,
            I try to steer away from
            any mention of "Quantum
            Physics or Quantum Mechanics"
            because I don't understand
            it and because too many
            scammers use these terms
            as catch words.

            Way back, after the Beatles
            and before Eckankar, I was
            a TMer and followed Maharishi.
            He only had a Bachelors degree
            in Physics (I was told), but spoke
            as an expert on Quantum Mechanics
            in relation to Transcendental
            Meditation (TM) and Unity Consciousness.

            Another scammer (from Canada)
            who claims to use Quantum Physics,
            in healing, is Adam Dreamhealer.
            I'm surprised Klemp hasn't used
            this approach to spirituality.

            Yes, it would be logical that what
            we call "God" (by various names)
            would be conscious of Itself. The
            question is more along the line
            of, How much (if any) of this GOD
            Consciousness can we experience?
            I guess that, too, depends upon
            us and each personal, conscious,
            and subconscious definition of
            who or what God is, as well as,
            numerous other subjective factors.

            We could say, and assume,
            that God is all consciousness
            and that this consciousness
            holds the physical universe(s)
            together while influencing
            other matter and non-matter.

            Could the universe be on auto
            pilot? Or, are there other factors?
            Maybe not!


            But, if God is everything, then,
            It is part of us and we are part
            of It. However, to what degree
            is our consciousness in proportion
            to God's consciousness? Does
            our intellect factor into this equation?
            To what degree are we able to
            visualize, imagine, dream, or
            delude ourselves? Why do we
            worship and follow others when
            what they (supposedly) say/said
            and do/did was their own individual
            glimpse (or not) into the God
            Consciousness?

            A true teacher shows one "how"
            to think, Not "what" to think!

            Anyway, it's an interesting
            topic and is difficult to approach
            without sounding like I'm parroting
            someone or something else as
            the Eckists and other religionists
            do. Critical thinking seems to be
            a mind function that religionists
            have relinquished over blind faith.

            Prometheus




            dianastanley wrote:
            I'm afraid my quantum phyisics
            is showing. Instead of atom you
            could say unit of counciousness.
            I see counciousness as something
            all things exist in not that it exists
            in us although it seems like it as
            we are used to feeling sepperate
            from all other things.

            I believe God, so to speak, can
            only beaware of itself in it's creations.
            So in a way we are the body and
            mind of IT. I didn't put it very well
            but when you talk on this level it
            is hard to find the right words.
            Why this happened I have no
            idea.

            Diana

            prometheus wrote:
            >
            > Hello Diana,
            > interesting and thought provoking!
            > I see it somewhat semantically
            > different (I think).
            >
            > Maybe it's that all consciousness
            > Is divided into individual states/
            > units/Souls. But I also see that
            > all "units" are unified and share
            > the (non-religious) Divine essence
            > of Being. I don't really see the
            > "atom" correlation as much since
            > human thoughts are extremely
            > powerful while not containing
            > atoms, although, thoughts can
            > control and manipulate atoms
            > in/of the physical universe.
            >
            > I don't see that consciousness
            > is comprised of atoms, either,
            > since thoughts are not comprised
            > of atoms, although, the atoms
            > that comprise our bodies and
            > minds create thoughts (dreams)
            > and individual consciousness.
            > Brain chemistry and its pathways
            > are important, as well, so sometimes
            > it's the arrangement of various
            > atoms and their interactions
            > with/to one another.
            >
            > I will say that it appears that
            > there are almost infinite degrees
            > and combinations for these atoms
            > to be arranged and to function
            > at any given point in time. Thus,
            > "Truth" becomes more a social/
            > religious/scientific term and
            > theory is merely a degree of
            > faith via observation.
            >
            > As far as consciousness remaining
            > after the individual dies... I don't
            > know. Where is it? What impact does
            > it have, and on whom or what? Who
            > says it does remain and how do they
            > know? It sounds like a nice thought
            > and a reassuring pov, but....? Then,
            > again, there's the "Soul" view which
            > is very similar.
            >
            > The one thing that I've observed and
            > experienced is that there are individual
            > (Soul) patterns, choices, and fate, as
            > well as, "nudges" and quiet "whispers"
            > that we all experience during our lives.
            > IMO, people are merely the human/individual
            > and physical expressions of the Divine
            > Consciousness while Soul/Spirit is the
            > conduit and observer within. However,
            > many are unaware of or reject this, and
            > similar philosophies, and choose to follow
            > ego and/or religion.
            >
            >
            > Prometheus
            >
            >
            >
            > dianastanley wrote:
            > >
            > > Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self, that
            counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and when a form is
            available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which to know it self. Someone
            said counciousness is like a whale looking at its own tail. we are the tail.
            Because we are in seppret forms counsessness itdendifies with the individual
            form and comes to believe it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that
            as children. We have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different
            from everyone else.
            >
            > > Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of counciousness in
            it.
            > > when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
            > > of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
            > > Diana
            >
            > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
            <prometheus_973@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Hello Tyson,
            > > > Welcome to the site. I'd like
            > > > to respond to your comments.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Tyson wrote:
            > > >
            > > > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we
            always
            > > > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT
            WE ARE
            > > > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences
            > > > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or be a mediocre
            fiction
            > > > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta
            > > > consciousness."
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
            > > > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
            > > > ETC. from personal and private experiences
            > > > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
            > > > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
            > > > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
            > > > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
            > > > yet, we are one with one another via the
            > > > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus, Siddharta, Krishna ect..)
            paul
            > > > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a
            con mans
            > > > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we
            already
            > > > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to
            open the
            > > > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound
            current.
            > > > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self
            seeking
            > > > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat
            nam
            > > > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides
            from the
            > > > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that
            > > > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion
            only
            > > > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The nine silent ones
            do
            > > > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > ME: Those mentioned above were
            > > > "extroverted" masters. However,
            > > > IMO, there are many more who are
            > > > "introverted" masters and many of
            > > > those live "now" and are/were not
            > > > of the ancient past. Today, most
            > > > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
            > > > (and more negative versus positive)
            > > > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
            > > > a bipolar narcissistic world.
            > > >
            > > > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
            > > > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
            > > > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
            > > > in order to leave the body through
            > > > the top of the head.
            > > >
            > > > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
            > > > another name for God other than
            > > > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
            > > > the "c."
            > > >
            > > > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
            > > > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
            > > > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
            > > > their truth as a religion. One can take
            > > > and use some of what another has
            > > > learned via their own revelations into
            > > > the Divine in order to prime one's own
            > > > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
            > > > up to You directing You.
            > > >
            > > > We all need to become our own spiritual
            > > > leader/teacher and take responsibility
            > > > instead of following others. I'll admit
            > > > that Jesus did have some very good
            > > > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
            > > > who lead us today, religious/political,
            > > > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
            > > > They all give lip service to those lessons
            > > > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
            > > > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
            > > > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
            > > > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
            > > > almost all of his initiations including the
            > > > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
            > > > who say one thing and and do another.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Prometheus
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