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a grain of truth

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  • Tyson
    Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we always manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
    Message 1 of 7 , Sep 23, 2011
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      Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we always manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job,or be a mediocre fiction writer,or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta consciousness. There are spiritual travelers(masters,Jesus,Siddharta,Krishna ect..)paul was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a con mans mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we already know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to open the spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound current. To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self seeking vanity ,used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat nam mmeans truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides from the truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion only ameans to awaken to spirit,never meant for profit. The nine silent ones do exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction.
    • prometheus_973
      Hello Tyson, Welcome to the site. I d like to respond to your comments. Tyson wrote: Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we
      Message 2 of 7 , Sep 24, 2011
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        Hello Tyson,
        Welcome to the site. I'd like
        to respond to your comments.


        Tyson wrote:

        "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we always
        manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
        NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences
        unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or be a mediocre fiction
        writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta
        consciousness."


        ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
        One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
        ETC. from personal and private experiences
        during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
        is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
        false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
        are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
        yet, we are one with one another via the
        Divine essence/creative/destructive force.


        "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus, Siddharta, Krishna ect..) paul
        was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a con mans
        mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we already
        know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to open the
        spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound current.
        To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self seeking
        vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat nam
        means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides from the
        truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that
        selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion only
        ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The nine silent ones do
        exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."


        ME: Those mentioned above were
        "extroverted" masters. However,
        IMO, there are many more who are
        "introverted" masters and many of
        those live "now" and are/were not
        of the ancient past. Today, most
        extroverts have demonic, self-centered
        (and more negative versus positive)
        tendencies/characteristics. It's become
        a bipolar narcissistic world.

        BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
        is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
        7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
        in order to leave the body through
        the top of the head.

        Also, The Path of the Masters gives
        another name for God other than
        Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
        the "c."

        And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
        Ones nor anything coming from Sant
        Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
        their truth as a religion. One can take
        and use some of what another has
        learned via their own revelations into
        the Divine in order to prime one's own
        pump, so to speak, but after that it's
        up to You directing You.

        We all need to become our own spiritual
        leader/teacher and take responsibility
        instead of following others. I'll admit
        that Jesus did have some very good
        lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
        who lead us today, religious/political,
        cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
        They all give lip service to those lessons
        of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
        and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
        forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
        Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
        almost all of his initiations including the
        12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
        who say one thing and and do another.


        Prometheus
      • dianastanley43
        Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self, that counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and when a form is available it
        Message 3 of 7 , Sep 26, 2011
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          Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self, that counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and when a form is available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which to know it self. Someone said counciousness is like a whale looking at its own tail. we are the tail. Because we are in seppret forms counsessness itdendifies with the individual form and comes to believe it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that as children. We have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different from everyone else.
          Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of counciousness in it.
          when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
          of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
          Diana
          --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hello Tyson,
          > Welcome to the site. I'd like
          > to respond to your comments.
          >
          >
          > Tyson wrote:
          >
          > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we always
          > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
          > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences
          > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or be a mediocre fiction
          > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta
          > consciousness."
          >
          >
          > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
          > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
          > ETC. from personal and private experiences
          > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
          > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
          > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
          > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
          > yet, we are one with one another via the
          > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
          >
          >
          > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus, Siddharta, Krishna ect..) paul
          > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a con mans
          > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we already
          > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to open the
          > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound current.
          > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self seeking
          > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat nam
          > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides from the
          > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that
          > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion only
          > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The nine silent ones do
          > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
          >
          >
          > ME: Those mentioned above were
          > "extroverted" masters. However,
          > IMO, there are many more who are
          > "introverted" masters and many of
          > those live "now" and are/were not
          > of the ancient past. Today, most
          > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
          > (and more negative versus positive)
          > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
          > a bipolar narcissistic world.
          >
          > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
          > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
          > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
          > in order to leave the body through
          > the top of the head.
          >
          > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
          > another name for God other than
          > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
          > the "c."
          >
          > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
          > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
          > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
          > their truth as a religion. One can take
          > and use some of what another has
          > learned via their own revelations into
          > the Divine in order to prime one's own
          > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
          > up to You directing You.
          >
          > We all need to become our own spiritual
          > leader/teacher and take responsibility
          > instead of following others. I'll admit
          > that Jesus did have some very good
          > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
          > who lead us today, religious/political,
          > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
          > They all give lip service to those lessons
          > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
          > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
          > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
          > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
          > almost all of his initiations including the
          > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
          > who say one thing and and do another.
          >
          >
          > Prometheus
          >
        • prometheus_973
          Hello Diana, interesting and thought provoking! I see it somewhat semantically different (I think). Maybe it s that all consciousness Is divided into
          Message 4 of 7 , Sep 26, 2011
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            Hello Diana,
            interesting and thought provoking!
            I see it somewhat semantically
            different (I think).

            Maybe it's that all consciousness
            Is divided into individual states/
            units/Souls. But I also see that
            all "units" are unified and share
            the (non-religious) Divine essence
            of Being. I don't really see the
            "atom" correlation as much since
            human thoughts are extremely
            powerful while not containing
            atoms, although, thoughts can
            control and manipulate atoms
            in/of the physical universe.

            I don't see that consciousness
            is comprised of atoms, either,
            since thoughts are not comprised
            of atoms, although, the atoms
            that comprise our bodies and
            minds create thoughts (dreams)
            and individual consciousness.
            Brain chemistry and its pathways
            are important, as well, so sometimes
            it's the arrangement of various
            atoms and their interactions
            with/to one another.

            I will say that it appears that
            there are almost infinite degrees
            and combinations for these atoms
            to be arranged and to function
            at any given point in time. Thus,
            "Truth" becomes more a social/
            religious/scientific term and
            theory is merely a degree of
            faith via observation.

            As far as consciousness remaining
            after the individual dies... I don't
            know. Where is it? What impact does
            it have, and on whom or what? Who
            says it does remain and how do they
            know? It sounds like a nice thought
            and a reassuring pov, but....? Then,
            again, there's the "Soul" view which
            is very similar.

            The one thing that I've observed and
            experienced is that there are individual
            (Soul) patterns, choices, and fate, as
            well as, "nudges" and quiet "whispers"
            that we all experience during our lives.
            IMO, people are merely the human/individual
            and physical expressions of the Divine
            Consciousness while Soul/Spirit is the
            conduit and observer within. However,
            many are unaware of or reject this, and
            similar philosophies, and choose to follow
            ego and/or religion.


            Prometheus



            dianastanley wrote:
            >
            > Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self, that counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and when a form is available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which to know it self. Someone said counciousness is like a whale looking at its own tail. we are the tail. Because we are in seppret forms counsessness itdendifies with the individual form and comes to believe it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that as children. We have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different from everyone else.

            > Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of counciousness in it.
            > when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
            > of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
            > Diana

            > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Hello Tyson,
            > > Welcome to the site. I'd like
            > > to respond to your comments.
            > >
            > >
            > > Tyson wrote:
            > >
            > > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we always
            > > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
            > > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences
            > > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or be a mediocre fiction
            > > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta
            > > consciousness."
            > >
            > >
            > > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
            > > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
            > > ETC. from personal and private experiences
            > > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
            > > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
            > > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
            > > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
            > > yet, we are one with one another via the
            > > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
            > >
            > >
            > > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus, Siddharta, Krishna ect..) paul
            > > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a con mans
            > > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we already
            > > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to open the
            > > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound current.
            > > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self seeking
            > > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat nam
            > > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides from the
            > > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that
            > > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion only
            > > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The nine silent ones do
            > > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
            > >
            > >
            > > ME: Those mentioned above were
            > > "extroverted" masters. However,
            > > IMO, there are many more who are
            > > "introverted" masters and many of
            > > those live "now" and are/were not
            > > of the ancient past. Today, most
            > > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
            > > (and more negative versus positive)
            > > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
            > > a bipolar narcissistic world.
            > >
            > > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
            > > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
            > > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
            > > in order to leave the body through
            > > the top of the head.
            > >
            > > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
            > > another name for God other than
            > > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
            > > the "c."
            > >
            > > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
            > > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
            > > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
            > > their truth as a religion. One can take
            > > and use some of what another has
            > > learned via their own revelations into
            > > the Divine in order to prime one's own
            > > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
            > > up to You directing You.
            > >
            > > We all need to become our own spiritual
            > > leader/teacher and take responsibility
            > > instead of following others. I'll admit
            > > that Jesus did have some very good
            > > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
            > > who lead us today, religious/political,
            > > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
            > > They all give lip service to those lessons
            > > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
            > > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
            > > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
            > > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
            > > almost all of his initiations including the
            > > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
            > > who say one thing and and do another.
            > >
            > >
            > > Prometheus
            > >
            >
          • dianastanley43
            I m afraid my quantum phyisics is showing.Instead of atom you could say unit of counciousness. I see counciousness as something all things exist in not that
            Message 5 of 7 , Sep 27, 2011
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              I'm afraid my quantum phyisics is showing.Instead of atom you could say unit of counciousness. I see counciousness as something all things exist in not that it exists in us although it seems like it as we are used to feeling sepperate from all other things.
              I believe God,so to speak,can only beaware of itself in it's creations. So in a way we are the body and mind of IT. I didn't put it very well but when you talk on this level it is hard to find the right words. Why this happened I have no idea.
              Diana

              --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hello Diana,
              > interesting and thought provoking!
              > I see it somewhat semantically
              > different (I think).
              >
              > Maybe it's that all consciousness
              > Is divided into individual states/
              > units/Souls. But I also see that
              > all "units" are unified and share
              > the (non-religious) Divine essence
              > of Being. I don't really see the
              > "atom" correlation as much since
              > human thoughts are extremely
              > powerful while not containing
              > atoms, although, thoughts can
              > control and manipulate atoms
              > in/of the physical universe.
              >
              > I don't see that consciousness
              > is comprised of atoms, either,
              > since thoughts are not comprised
              > of atoms, although, the atoms
              > that comprise our bodies and
              > minds create thoughts (dreams)
              > and individual consciousness.
              > Brain chemistry and its pathways
              > are important, as well, so sometimes
              > it's the arrangement of various
              > atoms and their interactions
              > with/to one another.
              >
              > I will say that it appears that
              > there are almost infinite degrees
              > and combinations for these atoms
              > to be arranged and to function
              > at any given point in time. Thus,
              > "Truth" becomes more a social/
              > religious/scientific term and
              > theory is merely a degree of
              > faith via observation.
              >
              > As far as consciousness remaining
              > after the individual dies... I don't
              > know. Where is it? What impact does
              > it have, and on whom or what? Who
              > says it does remain and how do they
              > know? It sounds like a nice thought
              > and a reassuring pov, but....? Then,
              > again, there's the "Soul" view which
              > is very similar.
              >
              > The one thing that I've observed and
              > experienced is that there are individual
              > (Soul) patterns, choices, and fate, as
              > well as, "nudges" and quiet "whispers"
              > that we all experience during our lives.
              > IMO, people are merely the human/individual
              > and physical expressions of the Divine
              > Consciousness while Soul/Spirit is the
              > conduit and observer within. However,
              > many are unaware of or reject this, and
              > similar philosophies, and choose to follow
              > ego and/or religion.
              >
              >
              > Prometheus
              >
              >
              >
              > dianastanley wrote:
              > >
              > > Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self, that counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and when a form is available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which to know it self. Someone said counciousness is like a whale looking at its own tail. we are the tail. Because we are in seppret forms counsessness itdendifies with the individual form and comes to believe it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that as children. We have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different from everyone else.
              >
              > > Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of counciousness in it.
              > > when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
              > > of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
              > > Diana
              >
              > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Hello Tyson,
              > > > Welcome to the site. I'd like
              > > > to respond to your comments.
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > Tyson wrote:
              > > >
              > > > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we always
              > > > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
              > > > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences
              > > > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or be a mediocre fiction
              > > > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta
              > > > consciousness."
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
              > > > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
              > > > ETC. from personal and private experiences
              > > > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
              > > > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
              > > > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
              > > > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
              > > > yet, we are one with one another via the
              > > > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus, Siddharta, Krishna ect..) paul
              > > > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a con mans
              > > > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we already
              > > > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to open the
              > > > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound current.
              > > > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self seeking
              > > > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat nam
              > > > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides from the
              > > > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that
              > > > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion only
              > > > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The nine silent ones do
              > > > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > ME: Those mentioned above were
              > > > "extroverted" masters. However,
              > > > IMO, there are many more who are
              > > > "introverted" masters and many of
              > > > those live "now" and are/were not
              > > > of the ancient past. Today, most
              > > > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
              > > > (and more negative versus positive)
              > > > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
              > > > a bipolar narcissistic world.
              > > >
              > > > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
              > > > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
              > > > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
              > > > in order to leave the body through
              > > > the top of the head.
              > > >
              > > > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
              > > > another name for God other than
              > > > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
              > > > the "c."
              > > >
              > > > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
              > > > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
              > > > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
              > > > their truth as a religion. One can take
              > > > and use some of what another has
              > > > learned via their own revelations into
              > > > the Divine in order to prime one's own
              > > > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
              > > > up to You directing You.
              > > >
              > > > We all need to become our own spiritual
              > > > leader/teacher and take responsibility
              > > > instead of following others. I'll admit
              > > > that Jesus did have some very good
              > > > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
              > > > who lead us today, religious/political,
              > > > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
              > > > They all give lip service to those lessons
              > > > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
              > > > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
              > > > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
              > > > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
              > > > almost all of his initiations including the
              > > > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
              > > > who say one thing and and do another.
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > Prometheus
              > > >
              > >
              >
            • etznab@aol.com
              I believe God, so to speak, can only be aware of itself in it s creations. That was very profound Diane. I thought your other message was, too. ... From:
              Message 6 of 7 , Sep 27, 2011
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                "I believe God, so to speak, can only be aware of itself in it's
                creations."

                That was very profound Diane. I thought your other message was, too.

                -----Original Message-----
                From: dianastanley43 <dianastanley43@...>
                To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous
                <EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Tue, Sep 27, 2011 12:29 pm
                Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: a grain of truth

                 
                I'm afraid my quantum phyisics is showing.Instead of atom you could say
                unit of counciousness. I see counciousness as something all things
                exist in not that it exists in us although it seems like it as we are
                used to feeling sepperate from all other things.
                I believe God,so to speak,can only beaware of itself in it's creations.
                So in a way we are the body and mind of IT. I didn't put it very well
                but when you talk on this level it is hard to find the right words. Why
                this happened I have no idea.
                Diana

                --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
                <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hello Diana,
                > interesting and thought provoking!
                > I see it somewhat semantically
                > different (I think).
                >
                > Maybe it's that all consciousness
                > Is divided into individual states/
                > units/Souls. But I also see that
                > all "units" are unified and share
                > the (non-religious) Divine essence
                > of Being. I don't really see the
                > "atom" correlation as much since
                > human thoughts are extremely
                > powerful while not containing
                > atoms, although, thoughts can
                > control and manipulate atoms
                > in/of the physical universe.
                >
                > I don't see that consciousness
                > is comprised of atoms, either,
                > since thoughts are not comprised
                > of atoms, although, the atoms
                > that comprise our bodies and
                > minds create thoughts (dreams)
                > and individual consciousness.
                > Brain chemistry and its pathways
                > are important, as well, so sometimes
                > it's the arrangement of various
                > atoms and their interactions
                > with/to one another.
                >
                > I will say that it appears that
                > there are almost infinite degrees
                > and combinations for these atoms
                > to be arranged and to function
                > at any given point in time. Thus,
                > "Truth" becomes more a social/
                > religious/scientific term and
                > theory is merely a degree of
                > faith via observation.
                >
                > As far as consciousness remaining
                > after the individual dies... I don't
                > know. Where is it? What impact does
                > it have, and on whom or what? Who
                > says it does remain and how do they
                > know? It sounds like a nice thought
                > and a reassuring pov, but....? Then,
                > again, there's the "Soul" view which
                > is very similar.
                >
                > The one thing that I've observed and
                > experienced is that there are individual
                > (Soul) patterns, choices, and fate, as
                > well as, "nudges" and quiet "whispers"
                > that we all experience during our lives.
                > IMO, people are merely the human/individual
                > and physical expressions of the Divine
                > Consciousness while Soul/Spirit is the
                > conduit and observer within. However,
                > many are unaware of or reject this, and
                > similar philosophies, and choose to follow
                > ego and/or religion.
                >
                >
                > Prometheus
                >
                >
                >
                > dianastanley wrote:
                > >
                > > Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self,
                that counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and
                when a form is available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which
                to know it self. Someone said counciousness is like a whale looking at
                its own tail. we are the tail. Because we are in seppret forms
                counsessness itdendifies with the individual form and comes to believe
                it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that as children. We
                have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different from
                everyone else.
                >
                > > Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of
                counciousness in it.
                > > when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
                > > of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
                > > Diana
                >
                > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com,
                "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > Hello Tyson,
                > > > Welcome to the site. I'd like
                > > > to respond to your comments.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Tyson wrote:
                > > >
                > > > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are
                eternal thus we always
                > > > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT
                THIS WORLD THAT WE ARE
                > > > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some
                spiritual experiences
                > > > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or
                be a mediocre fiction
                > > > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big
                lie of mahanta
                > > > consciousness."
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
                > > > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
                > > > ETC. from personal and private experiences
                > > > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
                > > > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
                > > > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
                > > > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
                > > > yet, we are one with one another via the
                > > > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus,
                Siddharta, Krishna ect..) paul
                > > > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body
                experiences and a con mans
                > > > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken
                in us what we already
                > > > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which
                is learning to open the
                > > > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the
                celestial sound current.
                > > > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in
                his own self seeking
                > > > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own
                selfish means. Sat nam
                > > > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches
                love, he hides from the
                > > > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come
                to believe that
                > > > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant
                to be a religion only
                > > > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The
                nine silent ones do
                > > > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > ME: Those mentioned above were
                > > > "extroverted" masters. However,
                > > > IMO, there are many more who are
                > > > "introverted" masters and many of
                > > > those live "now" and are/were not
                > > > of the ancient past. Today, most
                > > > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
                > > > (and more negative versus positive)
                > > > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
                > > > a bipolar narcissistic world.
                > > >
                > > > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
                > > > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
                > > > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
                > > > in order to leave the body through
                > > > the top of the head.
                > > >
                > > > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
                > > > another name for God other than
                > > > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
                > > > the "c."
                > > >
                > > > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
                > > > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
                > > > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
                > > > their truth as a religion. One can take
                > > > and use some of what another has
                > > > learned via their own revelations into
                > > > the Divine in order to prime one's own
                > > > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
                > > > up to You directing You.
                > > >
                > > > We all need to become our own spiritual
                > > > leader/teacher and take responsibility
                > > > instead of following others. I'll admit
                > > > that Jesus did have some very good
                > > > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
                > > > who lead us today, religious/political,
                > > > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
                > > > They all give lip service to those lessons
                > > > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
                > > > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
                > > > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
                > > > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
                > > > almost all of his initiations including the
                > > > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
                > > > who say one thing and and do another.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Prometheus
                > > >
                > >
                >
              • prometheus_973
                Hello Diana and All, I try to steer away from any mention of Quantum Physics or Quantum Mechanics because I don t understand it and because too many scammers
                Message 7 of 7 , Sep 28, 2011
                • 0 Attachment
                  Hello Diana and All,
                  I try to steer away from
                  any mention of "Quantum
                  Physics or Quantum Mechanics"
                  because I don't understand
                  it and because too many
                  scammers use these terms
                  as catch words.

                  Way back, after the Beatles
                  and before Eckankar, I was
                  a TMer and followed Maharishi.
                  He only had a Bachelors degree
                  in Physics (I was told), but spoke
                  as an expert on Quantum Mechanics
                  in relation to Transcendental
                  Meditation (TM) and Unity Consciousness.

                  Another scammer (from Canada)
                  who claims to use Quantum Physics,
                  in healing, is Adam Dreamhealer.
                  I'm surprised Klemp hasn't used
                  this approach to spirituality.

                  Yes, it would be logical that what
                  we call "God" (by various names)
                  would be conscious of Itself. The
                  question is more along the line
                  of, How much (if any) of this GOD
                  Consciousness can we experience?
                  I guess that, too, depends upon
                  us and each personal, conscious,
                  and subconscious definition of
                  who or what God is, as well as,
                  numerous other subjective factors.

                  We could say, and assume,
                  that God is all consciousness
                  and that this consciousness
                  holds the physical universe(s)
                  together while influencing
                  other matter and non-matter.

                  Could the universe be on auto
                  pilot? Or, are there other factors?
                  Maybe not!


                  But, if God is everything, then,
                  It is part of us and we are part
                  of It. However, to what degree
                  is our consciousness in proportion
                  to God's consciousness? Does
                  our intellect factor into this equation?
                  To what degree are we able to
                  visualize, imagine, dream, or
                  delude ourselves? Why do we
                  worship and follow others when
                  what they (supposedly) say/said
                  and do/did was their own individual
                  glimpse (or not) into the God
                  Consciousness?

                  A true teacher shows one "how"
                  to think, Not "what" to think!

                  Anyway, it's an interesting
                  topic and is difficult to approach
                  without sounding like I'm parroting
                  someone or something else as
                  the Eckists and other religionists
                  do. Critical thinking seems to be
                  a mind function that religionists
                  have relinquished over blind faith.

                  Prometheus




                  dianastanley wrote:
                  I'm afraid my quantum phyisics
                  is showing. Instead of atom you
                  could say unit of counciousness.
                  I see counciousness as something
                  all things exist in not that it exists
                  in us although it seems like it as
                  we are used to feeling sepperate
                  from all other things.

                  I believe God, so to speak, can
                  only beaware of itself in it's creations.
                  So in a way we are the body and
                  mind of IT. I didn't put it very well
                  but when you talk on this level it
                  is hard to find the right words.
                  Why this happened I have no
                  idea.

                  Diana

                  prometheus wrote:
                  >
                  > Hello Diana,
                  > interesting and thought provoking!
                  > I see it somewhat semantically
                  > different (I think).
                  >
                  > Maybe it's that all consciousness
                  > Is divided into individual states/
                  > units/Souls. But I also see that
                  > all "units" are unified and share
                  > the (non-religious) Divine essence
                  > of Being. I don't really see the
                  > "atom" correlation as much since
                  > human thoughts are extremely
                  > powerful while not containing
                  > atoms, although, thoughts can
                  > control and manipulate atoms
                  > in/of the physical universe.
                  >
                  > I don't see that consciousness
                  > is comprised of atoms, either,
                  > since thoughts are not comprised
                  > of atoms, although, the atoms
                  > that comprise our bodies and
                  > minds create thoughts (dreams)
                  > and individual consciousness.
                  > Brain chemistry and its pathways
                  > are important, as well, so sometimes
                  > it's the arrangement of various
                  > atoms and their interactions
                  > with/to one another.
                  >
                  > I will say that it appears that
                  > there are almost infinite degrees
                  > and combinations for these atoms
                  > to be arranged and to function
                  > at any given point in time. Thus,
                  > "Truth" becomes more a social/
                  > religious/scientific term and
                  > theory is merely a degree of
                  > faith via observation.
                  >
                  > As far as consciousness remaining
                  > after the individual dies... I don't
                  > know. Where is it? What impact does
                  > it have, and on whom or what? Who
                  > says it does remain and how do they
                  > know? It sounds like a nice thought
                  > and a reassuring pov, but....? Then,
                  > again, there's the "Soul" view which
                  > is very similar.
                  >
                  > The one thing that I've observed and
                  > experienced is that there are individual
                  > (Soul) patterns, choices, and fate, as
                  > well as, "nudges" and quiet "whispers"
                  > that we all experience during our lives.
                  > IMO, people are merely the human/individual
                  > and physical expressions of the Divine
                  > Consciousness while Soul/Spirit is the
                  > conduit and observer within. However,
                  > many are unaware of or reject this, and
                  > similar philosophies, and choose to follow
                  > ego and/or religion.
                  >
                  >
                  > Prometheus
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > dianastanley wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hi everyone. I have come to the understanding for my self, that
                  counciousness is not divided into individual souls. It is one and when a form is
                  available it manifestest as it needs a vehicle in which to know it self. Someone
                  said counciousness is like a whale looking at its own tail. we are the tail.
                  Because we are in seppret forms counsessness itdendifies with the individual
                  form and comes to believe it is seperat from all other forms. We are tought that
                  as children. We have a name and a body that is male or female. we are different
                  from everyone else.
                  >
                  > > Every living form from flowers to people have an atom of counciousness in
                  it.
                  > > when the body dies counciousness returns to itself.
                  > > of course that may be all bullsh-t but right now I believe it!
                  > > Diana
                  >
                  > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
                  <prometheus_973@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > Hello Tyson,
                  > > > Welcome to the site. I'd like
                  > > > to respond to your comments.
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > Tyson wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > "Eckankars grain of truth is that we are soul and we are eternal thus we
                  always
                  > > > manifest somewhere in gods kingdom. IT IS AN ILLUSION OT THIS WORLD THAT
                  WE ARE
                  > > > NOT ALREADY IN THE PRESENSE OF GOD. Paul had some spiritual experiences
                  > > > unfortunately he was unwilling to work a regular job, or be a mediocre
                  fiction
                  > > > writer, or just another spiritual writer. Thus the big lie of mahanta
                  > > > consciousness."
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > ME: IMO all religions are false teachings.
                  > > > One can only come to "Know" about Soul,
                  > > > ETC. from personal and private experiences
                  > > > during a lifetime. Tick tock, tick tock... time
                  > > > is running out for Eckists to see beyond the
                  > > > false teachings of Twitchell and Klemp. We
                  > > > are both dual as Soul and as persons and,
                  > > > yet, we are one with one another via the
                  > > > Divine essence/creative/destructive force.
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > "There are spiritual travelers (masters, Jesus, Siddharta, Krishna ect..)
                  paul
                  > > > was not one of them. He had some cool out of the body experiences and a
                  con mans
                  > > > mind.Teachers or masters are there only to help awaken in us what we
                  already
                  > > > know but have forgotten. I myself practice Sahaji which is learning to
                  open the
                  > > > spiritual eye so one can see and hear the music of the celestial sound
                  current.
                  > > > To have an experience with this is a blessing. Paul in his own self
                  seeking
                  > > > vanity, used something beautiful and sacred for his own selfish means. Sat
                  nam
                  > > > means truth. Regardless of the fact that harold teaches love, he hides
                  from the
                  > > > truth also for selfish means. In this world I have come to believe that
                  > > > selfishness is the first sin. Ek Ong Kar was never meant to be a religion
                  only
                  > > > ameans to awaken to spirit, never meant for profit. The nine silent ones
                  do
                  > > > exist yet another grain ot truth in pauls fiction."
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > ME: Those mentioned above were
                  > > > "extroverted" masters. However,
                  > > > IMO, there are many more who are
                  > > > "introverted" masters and many of
                  > > > those live "now" and are/were not
                  > > > of the ancient past. Today, most
                  > > > extroverts have demonic, self-centered
                  > > > (and more negative versus positive)
                  > > > tendencies/characteristics. It's become
                  > > > a bipolar narcissistic world.
                  > > >
                  > > > BTW- The Spiritual Eye or Tisra Til
                  > > > is merely the 6th Astral Chakra. The
                  > > > 7th or Crown Chakra is easier to use
                  > > > in order to leave the body through
                  > > > the top of the head.
                  > > >
                  > > > Also, The Path of the Masters gives
                  > > > another name for God other than
                  > > > Ek Ong Kar... it's Ekankar. Paul added
                  > > > the "c."
                  > > >
                  > > > And, I don't believe in any Nine Silent
                  > > > Ones nor anything coming from Sant
                  > > > Mat. It's all bullshit. One cannot share
                  > > > their truth as a religion. One can take
                  > > > and use some of what another has
                  > > > learned via their own revelations into
                  > > > the Divine in order to prime one's own
                  > > > pump, so to speak, but after that it's
                  > > > up to You directing You.
                  > > >
                  > > > We all need to become our own spiritual
                  > > > leader/teacher and take responsibility
                  > > > instead of following others. I'll admit
                  > > > that Jesus did have some very good
                  > > > lessons to teach. Unfortunately, those
                  > > > who lead us today, religious/political,
                  > > > cannot hold a candle to those teachings.
                  > > > They all give lip service to those lessons
                  > > > of love, empathy, tolerance, forgiveness,
                  > > > and compassion. Look at Klemp! Did he
                  > > > forgive Darwin? No! HK's never even mentioned
                  > > > Darwin's death! Yet, Darwin gave Harold
                  > > > almost all of his initiations including the
                  > > > 12th! People, like Klemp, are hypocrites
                  > > > who say one thing and and do another.
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > Prometheus
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