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Re: I received two unwanted emails, one was threatening

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  • prometheus_973
    Actually, there are those in Eckankar that engage in dirty tricks and negative acts in order to protect their Mahanta from being insulted. It s really an ego
    Message 1 of 16 , Jan 1, 2010
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      Actually, there are those in Eckankar that
      engage in dirty tricks and negative acts
      in order to "protect" their Mahanta from
      being insulted. It's really an ego thing.
      The percentage is low, but it's a matter
      of record that ESA site members have
      experienced, and is condoned by Klemp!
      ESC staffers and Joan monitor these anti-
      EK sites.

      If you've ever read some of the chela and
      H.I. postings on HU-Chat or Chela-Chat and
      on A.R.E. you'd see that there is an official
      Eckankar connection or else there would be
      reprisals coming from the ESC (Klemp) to
      prevent and eliminate thses negative behaviours
      from spreading. However, that's not the case
      and, therefore, the nut cases (as above, so
      below) feel that Klemp is turning a Blind-Eye
      to it all. Thus, HK empowers them by giving
      his (silent) approval to it all. It could very well
      be that this sicko is only pretending (as if) to
      dislike Klemp in order to throw us and others
      off his tracks. He's probably an ECK Youth,
      or seems he is because he appears spiritually
      immature. His spiritual growth, more than
      likely, has become stunted via LEM/Mahanta
      Co-Dependency. No Self-Mastery or Spiritual
      Liberation/Freedom in THIS lifetime for him
      or any other ECKist!

      Prometheus

      jonathanjohns wrote:
      >
      > Prometheus,
      > Thnaks for you reply and advice.
      >
      > As I explained in another post I didn't intend for my messages about this to be posted on the message board; I thought I was sending an email directly fto you. That's Yahoo's kooky interface.
      >
      > I thought perhaps the best thing was to ignore the person. They are not going to stop me from posting. I think it is possible that emails of this type could stop some people from speaking out about Eckankar - that is a disturbing thought.
      >
      > Also, the percentage of members of Eckankar who would do something like this is almost zero. So I don't want these emails to be seen as a bad reflection on Eckankar. In my opinion this person is very much an isolated case. I am more than happy to criticise Eckankar when they deserve it, but I can't justify it in this instance.
      >
      > Jonathan
      >
      <prometheus_973@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Hello Jonathan,
      > > Yes, there is a young perverted guy that has
      > > been sending nasty/sexual/threatening emails
      > > using various names and email accounts. Yahoo
      > > can't seem to track his server down except it's
      > > around Sunnydale. It sounds like something a
      > > very unbalanced (off meds probably) and spiritually
      > > immature Soul would do... a prodigy of Mark Alex...
      > > or Marman or ATOM or maybe the Doers? Really,
      > > he sounds Bi-Polar and Deviant.
      > >
      > > I simply Red Flag them and put them in my spam
      > > folder. I don't open them because they all come
      > > from the same person and all seem to support
      > > Twitchell while attacking me and Klemp. Strange
      > > isn't it? Actually, I haven't looked at any of my
      > > emails for about two months. I've been doing
      > > other things, but will get back to ESA with some
      > > 12/2009 Mystic World info soon. Actually, this
      > > nut case is a member of ESA and I know who he
      > > is but haven't booted him.... what's the point.
      > > Just don't open the emails or take it personally...
      > > he's a sicko! Pity and ignore him if anything!
      > > "There but by the Grace of God go I."
      > >
      > > Prometheus
      > >
      > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan Johns <jonathanjohns96@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Prometheus,
      > > >  
      > > > I recently received two unwanted emails, one was threatening. They were mailed on Dec 9 and Dec 10. They were a follow-up to one on my posts on ESA. I read them for the first time around Dec 24.
      > > >  
      > > > What, if anything, should I do about it?
      > > >  
      > > > Alan
      > > >  
      > > >  
      > > >
      > >
      >
    • etznab@aol.com
      I couldn t view the attachment file. Something about an error on the Yahoo server. Still catching up on e-mails (have more to read) but, if someone hasn t
      Message 2 of 16 , Jan 2, 2010
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        I couldn't view the attachment file. Something about
        an error on the Yahoo server.

        Still catching up on e-mails (have more to read) but,
        if someone hasn't already, could I get a text version
        of the e-mail either publicly or privately?

        Etznab

        -----Original Message-----
        From: jonathanjohns96 <jonathanjohns96@...>
        To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Thu, Dec 31, 2009 7:25 pm
        Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: I received two unwanted
        emails, one was threatening

         
        I just noticed that I used my real first name. That's OK because I plan
        on posting my Diary of my inner experiences on the Internet and I was
        going to use my first name.

        Also, I am going to use this unwanted and threatening email to motivate
        me to go back through my posts on ESA and write a short ebook entitled
        something like "Why I left Eckankar: A personal story." I'll post it on
        the Internet as a free PDF.

        By the way people can continbue to address me as Jonathan. I'll use my
        real name in the records of my Diary.

        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan Johns
        <jonathanjohns96@...> wrote:
        >
        > I had no idea my email was going to be posted on the message
        board. But since it did get posted, I maight as well post a more
        detailed version of the email addresses. The first one (sent on the
        9th) was the one that threatened me with sexual violence.
        >  
        >
        >
        > --- On Fri, 1/1/10, Jonathan Johns <jonathanjohns96@...>
        wrote:
        >
        >
        > From: Jonathan Johns <jonathanjohns96@...>
        > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] I received two unwanted
        emails, one was threatening
        > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
        > Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 1:01 AM
        >
        >
        >  
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Prometheus,
        >  
        > I recently received two unwanted emails, one was threatening. They
        were mailed on Dec 9 and Dec 10. They were a follow-up to one on my
        posts on ESA. I read them for the first time around Dec 24.
        >  
        > What, if anything, should I do about it?
        >  
        > Alan
        >  
        >  
        >
      • etznab@aol.com
        One of the reasons I use a pseudo is to steer clear of the nutters who might choose to attack me or my family. Etznab ... From: mishmisha9
        Message 3 of 16 , Jan 2, 2010
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          One of the reasons I use a pseudo is to steer clear
          of the nutters who might choose to attack me or my
          family.

          Etznab

          -----Original Message-----
          From: mishmisha9 <mishmisha9@...>
          To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Thu, Dec 31, 2009 8:56 pm
          Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: I received two unwanted
          emails, one was threatening

           
          Jonathan, I am really sorry you got those disturbing emails.
          There are some really sick people out there . . . you can mark
          them as spam and they will not then be in your regular email
          box . . . and you can ignore them that way. I think many of us
          have had experiences with the nutters!!

          I will look forward to reading your diary/eBook!

          Best wishes,

          Mish

          --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "jonathanjohns96"
          <jonathanjohns96@...> wrote:
          >
          > I just noticed that I used my real first name. That's OK because I
          plan on posting my Diary of my inner experiences on the Internet and I
          was going to use my first name.
          >
          > Also, I am going to use this unwanted and threatening email to
          motivate me to go back through my posts on ESA and write a short ebook
          entitled something like "Why I left Eckankar: A personal story." I'll
          post it on the Internet as a free PDF.
          >
          > By the way people can continbue to address me as Jonathan. I'll
          use my real name in the records of my Diary.
          >
          >
          > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan Johns
          <jonathanjohns96@> wrote:
          > >
          > > I had no idea my email was going to be posted on the message
          board. But since it did get posted, I maight as well post a more
          detailed version of the email addresses. The first one (sent on the
          9th) was the one that threatened me with sexual violence.
          > >  
          > >
          > >
          > > --- On Fri, 1/1/10, Jonathan Johns <jonathanjohns96@>
          wrote:
          > >
          > >
          > > From: Jonathan Johns <jonathanjohns96@>
          > > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] I received two unwanted
          emails, one was threatening
          > > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
          > > Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 1:01 AM
          > >
          > >
          > >  
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Prometheus,
          > >  
          > > I recently received two unwanted emails, one was threatening.
          They were mailed on Dec 9 and Dec 10. They were a follow-up to one on
          my posts on ESA. I read them for the first time around Dec 24.
          > >  
          > > What, if anything, should I do about it?
          > >  
          > > Alan
          > >  
          > >  
          > >
          >
        • jonathanjohns96
          Etznab, I ve thought it over and I have decided that I am not really comfortable forwarding pornographic spam to anyone, no matter the format or whatever. So I
          Message 4 of 16 , Jan 4, 2010
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            Etznab,

            I've thought it over and I have decided that I am not really comfortable forwarding pornographic spam to anyone, no matter the format or whatever. So I hope you understand.

            I'm sure this type of spam occurs all the time on the Internet and on Yahoo's message boards, and Yahoo would need an army of investigators to research it all. So I am going to just move forward.

            Jonathan

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, etznab@... wrote:
            >
            > I couldn't view the attachment file. Something about
            > an error on the Yahoo server.
            >
            > Still catching up on e-mails (have more to read) but,
            > if someone hasn't already, could I get a text version
            > of the e-mail either publicly or privately?
            >
            > Etznab
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: jonathanjohns96 <jonathanjohns96@...>
            > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Thu, Dec 31, 2009 7:25 pm
            > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: I received two unwanted
            > emails, one was threatening
            >
            >  
            > I just noticed that I used my real first name. That's OK because I plan
            > on posting my Diary of my inner experiences on the Internet and I was
            > going to use my first name.
            >
            > Also, I am going to use this unwanted and threatening email to motivate
            > me to go back through my posts on ESA and write a short ebook entitled
            > something like "Why I left Eckankar: A personal story." I'll post it on
            > the Internet as a free PDF.
            >
            > By the way people can continbue to address me as Jonathan. I'll use my
            > real name in the records of my Diary.
            >
            > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan Johns
            > jonathanjohns96@ wrote:
            > >
            > > I had no idea my email was going to be posted on the message
            > board. But since it did get posted, I maight as well post a more
            > detailed version of the email addresses. The first one (sent on the
            > 9th) was the one that threatened me with sexual violence.
            > >  
            > >
            > >
            > > --- On Fri, 1/1/10, Jonathan Johns jonathanjohns96@
            > wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > From: Jonathan Johns jonathanjohns96@
            > > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] I received two unwanted
            > emails, one was threatening
            > > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
            > > Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 1:01 AM
            > >
            > >
            > >  
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Prometheus,
            > >  
            > > I recently received two unwanted emails, one was threatening. They
            > were mailed on Dec 9 and Dec 10. They were a follow-up to one on my
            > posts on ESA. I read them for the first time around Dec 24.
            > >  
            > > What, if anything, should I do about it?
            > >  
            > > Alan
            > >  
            > >  
            > >
            >
          • etznab@aol.com
            I understand. I wasn t able to view the attached picture file, or whatever was attached to your initial posts on the subject. It doesn t matter. Probably best
            Message 5 of 16 , Jan 4, 2010
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              I understand.

              I wasn't able to view the attached picture file, or whatever was
              attached to your initial posts on the subject.

              It doesn't matter. Probably best to just delete it and mark the sender
              as spam. I agree.

              Etznab

              -----Original Message-----
              From: jonathanjohns96 <jonathanjohns96@...>
              To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Mon, Jan 4, 2010 7:26 am
              Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: I received two unwanted
              emails, one was threatening

               
              Etznab,

              I've thought it over and I have decided that I am not really
              comfortable forwarding pornographic spam to anyone, no matter the
              format or whatever. So I hope you understand.

              I'm sure this type of spam occurs all the time on the Internet and on
              Yahoo's message boards, and Yahoo would need an army of investigators
              to research it all. So I am going to just move forward.

              Jonathan

              --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, etznab@... wrote:
              >
              > I couldn't view the attachment file. Something about
              > an error on the Yahoo server.
              >
              > Still catching up on e-mails (have more to read) but,
              > if someone hasn't already, could I get a text version
              > of the e-mail either publicly or privately?
              >
              > Etznab
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: jonathanjohns96 <jonathanjohns96@...>
              > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Thu, Dec 31, 2009 7:25 pm
              > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: I received two unwanted
              > emails, one was threatening
              >
              >  
              > I just noticed that I used my real first name. That's OK because I
              plan
              > on posting my Diary of my inner experiences on the Internet and I
              was
              > going to use my first name.
              >
              > Also, I am going to use this unwanted and threatening email to
              motivate
              > me to go back through my posts on ESA and write a short ebook
              entitled
              > something like "Why I left Eckankar: A personal story." I'll post
              it on
              > the Internet as a free PDF.
              >
              > By the way people can continbue to address me as Jonathan. I'll
              use my
              > real name in the records of my Diary.
              >
              > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan Johns
              > jonathanjohns96@ wrote:
              > >
              > > I had no idea my email was going to be posted on the message
              > board. But since it did get posted, I maight as well post a more
              > detailed version of the email addresses. The first one (sent on
              the
              > 9th) was the one that threatened me with sexual violence.
              > >  
              > >
              > >
              > > --- On Fri, 1/1/10, Jonathan Johns jonathanjohns96@
              > wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > > From: Jonathan Johns jonathanjohns96@
              > > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] I received two unwanted
              > emails, one was threatening
              > > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
              > > Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 1:01 AM
              > >
              > >
              > >  
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Prometheus,
              > >  
              > > I recently received two unwanted emails, one was threatening.
              They
              > were mailed on Dec 9 and Dec 10. They were a follow-up to one on
              my
              > posts on ESA. I read them for the first time around Dec 24.
              > >  
              > > What, if anything, should I do about it?
              > >  
              > > Alan
              > >  
              > >  
              > >
              >
            • ctecvie
              Hi Jonathan, I received one or two too - of the same kind it seems. I just deleted and forgot them. Take care, Ingrid
              Message 6 of 16 , Jan 5, 2010
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                Hi Jonathan,

                I received one or two too - of the same kind it seems. I just deleted and forgot them.

                Take care,
                Ingrid

                --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "jonathanjohns96" <jonathanjohns96@...> wrote:
                >
                > Etznab,
                >
                > I've thought it over and I have decided that I am not really comfortable forwarding pornographic spam to anyone, no matter the format or whatever. So I hope you understand.
                >
                > I'm sure this type of spam occurs all the time on the Internet and on Yahoo's message boards, and Yahoo would need an army of investigators to research it all. So I am going to just move forward.
                >
                > Jonathan
                >
                > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, etznab@ wrote:
                > >
                > > I couldn't view the attachment file. Something about
                > > an error on the Yahoo server.
                > >
                > > Still catching up on e-mails (have more to read) but,
                > > if someone hasn't already, could I get a text version
                > > of the e-mail either publicly or privately?
                > >
                > > Etznab
                > >
                > > -----Original Message-----
                > > From: jonathanjohns96 <jonathanjohns96@>
                > > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
                > > Sent: Thu, Dec 31, 2009 7:25 pm
                > > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: I received two unwanted
                > > emails, one was threatening
                > >
                > >  
                > > I just noticed that I used my real first name. That's OK because I plan
                > > on posting my Diary of my inner experiences on the Internet and I was
                > > going to use my first name.
                > >
                > > Also, I am going to use this unwanted and threatening email to motivate
                > > me to go back through my posts on ESA and write a short ebook entitled
                > > something like "Why I left Eckankar: A personal story." I'll post it on
                > > the Internet as a free PDF.
                > >
                > > By the way people can continbue to address me as Jonathan. I'll use my
                > > real name in the records of my Diary.
                > >
                > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan Johns
                > > jonathanjohns96@ wrote:
                > > >
                > > > I had no idea my email was going to be posted on the message
                > > board. But since it did get posted, I maight as well post a more
                > > detailed version of the email addresses. The first one (sent on the
                > > 9th) was the one that threatened me with sexual violence.
                > > >  
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > --- On Fri, 1/1/10, Jonathan Johns jonathanjohns96@
                > > wrote:
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > From: Jonathan Johns jonathanjohns96@
                > > > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] I received two unwanted
                > > emails, one was threatening
                > > > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
                > > > Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 1:01 AM
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >  
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Prometheus,
                > > >  
                > > > I recently received two unwanted emails, one was threatening. They
                > > were mailed on Dec 9 and Dec 10. They were a follow-up to one on my
                > > posts on ESA. I read them for the first time around Dec 24.
                > > >  
                > > > What, if anything, should I do about it?
                > > >  
                > > > Alan
                > > >  
                > > >  
                > > >
                > >
                >
              • prometheus_973
                In Part 1 Klemp suggests that coffee is bad for ECKists health due to the caffeine. However he never mentions the caffeine in tea. Also, on the news today,
                Message 7 of 16 , Jan 6, 2010
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                  In Part 1 Klemp suggests that "coffee"
                  is bad for ECKists' health due to the
                  caffeine. However he never mentions
                  the caffeine in tea. Also, on the news
                  today, I heard that a study was done
                  that showed that Coffee and Tea may
                  ward off Diabetes. Plus, one can always
                  drink decaf!

                  In the next story below Klemp is complaining
                  about his mother making him drink his
                  milk which had cream in it. Thus when
                  her back was turned he would pour it
                  back into the pitcher and mislead her
                  into thinking he drank it. Today, he stills
                  thinks that this was not a lie and that
                  "stretching the truth" was/is okay. Also,
                  milk in those days, and on the farm,
                  did not have Vitamin-D added, thus,
                  HK came down with rickets, although,
                  no one else in his family did.

                  BTW-Another reason why many people
                  today don't have a Vitamin-D deficiency
                  is due to Starbucks since they put a lot
                  of Vitamin-D enriched milk into their
                  products. Thus, another reason why coffee
                  can be good for the health. Also, in the
                  Middle East coffee is drank in order to
                  protect oneself from heat stroke. Therefore,
                  once again Klemp misses the mark and
                  has taken a narrow-minded and one
                  dimensional approach to the topic of "health."

                  Prometheus


                  prometheus wrote:
                  >
                  > Hello All,
                  > The following is a recollection about
                  > Klemp's youth on the farm, and the
                  > conclusion of his "health hints". However,
                  > there is some Golden-Tongued Wisdom
                  > found here. One of these is when he
                  > says to his mother, "My glass is empty!"
                  > Harry admits that he was "stretching
                  > the truth" which he claims was/is okay.
                  > Thus, his glass was not just "half-empty"
                  > it was/is all "empty." Klemp, today, seems
                  > to think that it was just fine learning to
                  > trick his Mother by lying (stretching the
                  > truth), and to demonstrate deviant behaviour
                  > (pouring the milk back into the pitcher).
                  > Boys will be boys, they say.
                  >
                  > HK: "When I was a boy, there was nowhere
                  > near the amount of nutritional information
                  > so readily available today. My older brother,
                  > Duane, suffered a greatly swollen ear when
                  > he was eight or nine. He was a spectacle
                  > when he arrived at school. Our family doctor
                  > gave him a shot of penicillin, and his ear soon
                  > shrank to normal size.
                  >
                  > In looking back, I suspect that Duane had
                  > a sensitivity to dairy products, for he often
                  > had earaches. BUT ours was a dairy farm;
                  > milk and cheese were a mainstay at mealtimes."
                  >
                  > ME: Well, that's possible. However, the problem
                  > Duane had could be from other causes too.
                  > Klemp is speculating on this, but food allergies
                  > are often overlooked even today. Duane did,
                  > years later, die of Cancer. I wonder why the
                  > Mahanta has to "suspect" this cause of Duane's
                  > problem rather than "know" it to be true when
                  > he, supposedly, has the ability to use the ECK-Vidya.
                  >
                  > HK: "For my part, I would gag at the sight
                  > of a single speck of cream on top of my
                  > glass of milk. BUT Mother insisted I sit at
                  > the breakfast table until the milk was gone.
                  > I really tried to drink it, BUT it just refused
                  > to go down. she was so insistent about it
                  > because I'd had rickets, a bone-deforming
                  > disease, a few years earlier, from a vitamin-
                  > D deficiency. Our farm milk had no added
                  > vitamin D, as did store bought milk. BUT
                  > she did not know that.
                  >
                  > `Drink your milk,' she scolded, "then you
                  > can go outside to play!'
                  >
                  > ME: What Klemp fails to see is that his
                  > mother was telling him to "go outside to
                  > play" and get his Vitamin-D from the sun!
                  >
                  > HK: "Mother had a lot to do, so she could
                  > not keep an eye on me every second.
                  > When she turned her back to wash dishes,
                  > I dumped my milk back into the pitcher
                  > and announced, `My glass is empty!' And
                  > that was the solemn truth. Our parents
                  > taught us not to lie, BUT stretching the
                  > truth was another matter."
                  >
                  > ME: Stretching the truth was another matter
                  > for Twitchell too! Let's face it, Klemp's behaviour
                  > was devious! I never would have done that
                  > and never stretched the truth until I became
                  > a teenager. I, too, had a problem with specks
                  > of cream in my glasses of milk as well. We
                  > had a milkman deliver ours from their dairy.
                  > I would take a spoon and gather the specks
                  > of cream up in it and then wipe the cream off
                  > on a napkin.
                  >
                  > HK: "However, I loved cheese. So I lifted
                  > a stack of slices from the cheese plate
                  > and put them on my dinner plate. Then
                  > I would return for a second and a third
                  > helping, to the utter amazement of my
                  > parents. The younger and the more it
                  > squeaked, the better. I certainly had no
                  > food sensitivity to cheese then, although
                  > I do now."
                  >
                  > ME: It's no wonder that Klemp has a
                  > food allergy to cheese today since he
                  > ate so much as a youth. Maybe HK did,
                  > after all, have an slight allergy to cheese
                  > way back then since his brother had an
                  > allergy to milk. Of course, we've all heard
                  > this "cheesy" story before. Klemp has
                  > told it often. I remember a Seminar, years
                  > ago, where he told us about this. Isn't
                  > this a waste of paper, time, and members'
                  > money?
                  >
                  > HK: "Maybe you will find HINTS in this
                  > letter so you may achieve better health
                  > for you and your family. I trust you will.
                  >
                  > Again, good health is an aid to spiritual
                  > unfoldment." [end]
                  >
                  > ME: I thought that "INITIATIONS" were
                  > `an aid to spiritual unfoldment.' Where
                  > are these? Klemp is side-stepping the
                  > real issue and gives nothing! We've seen
                  > or experienced this advice (hints) before.
                  >
                  > Prometheus
                  >
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