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Re: Rebazar Plagiarized Too!

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  • prometheus_973
    Hello Sharon and All, Yes, ECKists do tend to grab-at-straws for ekplanations in defense of their fake religion. However, if a Soul could run two bodies,
    Message 1 of 3 , Apr 11, 2009
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      Hello Sharon and All,
      Yes, ECKists do tend to grab-at-straws
      for ekplanations in defense of their fake
      religion. However, if a Soul could run "two"
      bodies, simultaneously, on the physical plane
      (as Twitch one mentioned) then they would
      be opposites. One would be a positive one
      and the other would be negative. Twit's Soul,
      would, thus, Not have been Julian P. Johnson!
      However, he might have been Stalin!

      Prometheus


      Sharon wrote:

      Back at alt.religion. eckankar years ago,
      an eckist posted just about the most ridiculous
      ecksplanation for the plagiarism that I've ever
      heard - Twitch wrote somewhere that a "soul"
      could run more than one body, so perhaps Twitch
      was actually running Julian Johnson's body when
      he wrote "Path of the Masters", therefore there's
      no plagiarism because you can't plagiarize yourself!  
      Isn't that a hoot!

      There are a few "newer" plagiarism examples
      in the files over at ET that may not be posted
      anywhere else:  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/
      eckankartruth/files

      Someone posted awhile back that they'd spotted
      material in the SKS that came from Ouspensky/
      Gurdjieff but their books were in storage - if
      anyone's interesting in comparing the books
      let me know and I'll look up more specific info.

      Have a great weekend, everyone!

      Sharon
      ______________________________________________________________

      Rebazar Plagiarized Too!

      Prometheus wrote:

      > Did the (fake) ECKankar master of Twitchell,
      > Rebazar Tarzs, plagiarize Julian Johnson's
      > "The Path of the Master's," or did Julian
      > Johnson plagiarize Rebazar?
      >
      > What has Rebazar written without Twitchell's
      > help and when was it written? Nothing was
      > heard from Rebazar prior to when... 1969?
      > It could be that Twitchell mentioned RT in
      > his Orion articles, but PT doesn't have RT
      > actually speaking in his books prior to 1969.
      >
      > Rebazar states (according to Paul Twitchell,
      > page 131, "The Far Country"):
      >
      > "There is little wonder that men take to
      > religion, even if they have to invent one."
      >
      > ME: Like PT did!
      >
      > RT: "Voltaire said that religion is the solace
      > of the weak."
      >
      > ME: I agree!
      >
      > RT: "Nietszche repeated this in his writings
      > and talks. But be that as it may, the weak
      > and the trapped need some support, and
      > far be it from me to deny them. I wouldn't
      > take their religion away, even if I knew full
      > well that it could be done."
      >
      > ME: I'm attempting to show ECKists the
      > Truth rather than religious lies and myth.
      >
      > RT: "Religion has always been a haven for
      > the millions who mourn and suffer. It is
      > undeniable that it has been generally the
      > unhappy who have sought relief in religion;
      > any religion which happened to be near them,
      > and who can blame them. It's like a drowning
      > man grasping at a straw."
      >
      > ME: Actually, there are also those seeking
      > God and the spiritual life and the answers
      > to the unknown.
      >
      > However, what's even more interesting is
      > that these same exact words, spoken by
      > ECK Master Rebazar Tarzs (The Torchbearer
      > of ECKankar) via Paul Twitchell, are in the
      > first paragraph of Chapter 2 in "The Path of
      > the Masters" (1939 copyright).
      >
      > So who spoke these words first? Was it
      > Julian P. Johnson in 1939, or was it Rebazar
      > Tarzs via Paul Twitchell in 1970? Or, did
      > Rebazar say these same exact words prior
      > to 1939 and Johnson was somehow able
      > to retrieve and copy them?
      >
      > Nah! Twitchell was a liar and a plagiarist!
      > PT created Rebazar, as an alter ego, in order
      > to initiate himself, and create his own religion!
      >
      > Prometheus
      >
      >
      > Hello Whitemoby,
      > Welcome to the site. I'll give you some
      > info on PT's plagiarized "Flute" passages
      > and point you toward more.
      >
      > First, check out the LINKS section, here
      > on this site, for plagiarisms. Also, there's
      > a LINK toward the bottom of the page with
      > "Flute" info.
      >
      > Second, buy a SCP Journal-There's a
      > LINK that tells about it and takes you
      > to that site where you can purchase
      > one (it's very inexpensive). Actually,
      > this would, even, be a great historic
      > reference/resource for ECKists too
      > because of the early info given (dates,
      > etc.), and the pics of Gail and Paul
      > are very nice!
      >
      > Third, go to the FILES section here
      > (for members only) and read or skim
      > through Chapters 6-10 of "Confessions
      > of a God Seeker" for more info on PT's
      > plagiarisms.
      >
      > Fourth, I'll look through my copy of
      > "Flute" and see if I can find something.
      >
      > Okay- On page 47, bottom, of "Flute"
      > (1970 1st printing) Paul states,
      >
      > "Each generally knows something different
      > about Truth than the other will know.
      > For example: Bacon, Spinoza, Voltaire,
      > Emerson, Berkeley, Kant, Hegel, Spencer,
      > Schopenhauer and Darwin contributed
      > something to the knowledge of Truth
      > because the quality of matter in a given
      > place and under given conditions is
      > limited."
      >
      > This same quote is on page 9 (in my
      > copy) of "The Path of the Masters."
      > It's word for word. The only difference
      > is that Twit omitted Nietzsche's name,
      > however, PT had all of the other names
      > in the same order as they are listed in
      > "The Path of the Masters!"
      >
      > It should be pointed out, too, that the
      > author of "The Path of the Masters"
      > (1939 copyright), Julian P. Johnson, was
      > only giving his "opinion" in this quote
      > that Twitchell used. Thus, there is No
      > real universal "Truth" being "compiled,"
      > and passed on to ECKists (by Twit) as
      > Klemp suggests. These comments are
      > only one's (Johnson's) personal opinions/
      > view. This is why the argument of Twitchell
      > being a "Compiler of Truth" doesn't hold
      > water!
      >
      > It appears Twitchell was doing a rewrite
      > of "The Flute of God" while, simultaneously,
      > writing "The Far Country" in 1970. The
      > copyright of "Flute" is 1969 but the first
      > printing was 1970.
      >
      > Thus, on page 131 of "The Far Country,"
      > PT (RT) decides to discuss Nietzsche (the
      > name he omitted from the above mentioned
      > plagiarism in "Flute").
      >
      > These same quotes (supposedly being
      > said by Rebazar Tarzs) beginning with:
      >
      > 'There is little wonder...' and 'Religion has
      > always been...' are mentioned word for word
      > at the beginning of Chapter 2 in "The Path
      > of the Masters."
      >
      > BTW- In Chapter 6, page 75, of "Flute" there
      > is another plagiarism. The paragraph starts
      > out with, "The Supreme has been called various
      > names in different languages, but it is known
      > to those who recognize the real wisdom as HU,
      > the name of the nameless one."
      >
      > This quote, and more, are from the 1923
      > copyright, pages 64-65, of "The Mysticism
      > of Sound" by Hazrat Inayat Khan.
      >
      > Also, I found it very interesting that Klemp
      > used many parts of "The Flute of God" for
      > his September 2004 "H.I. Letter:" Chapter 8,
      > "The Appeal of Man to God;" Chapter 9, "The
      > Shape of the Altar;" Chapter 12, "The Borders
      > of Heaven."
      >
      > Anyway, I hope this information has helped
      > you with your research.
      >
      > Prometheus
      >
      >
      > whitemoby22 wrote:
      >
      > I am researching Twitchell's "Flute of God".
      > I am searching for plagarized passages.
      > Can anyone here provide examples?
      > Or point me in the right direction?
      >
      > Thanks...
      >
    • etznab@aol.com
      I thought the running of more than one body might explain how Paul Twitchell went to France & India :) However it s even more a stretch (IMO) the example you
      Message 2 of 3 , Apr 11, 2009
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        I thought the running of more than one body might
        explain how Paul Twitchell went to France & India :)

        However it's even more a stretch (IMO) the example
        you just cited. If Paul T. was in Julian Johnson's body,
        I'd call that possession!

        Etznab

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Sharon <brighttigress@...>
        To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Sat, 11 Apr 2009 1:59 pm
        Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Digest Number 1376








        Back at alt.religion. eckankar years ago, an eckist posted just about
        the most ridiculous ecksplanation for the plagiarism that I've ever
        heard - Twitch wrote somewhere that a "soul" could run more than one
        body, so perhaps Twitch was actually running Julian Johnson's body when
        he wrote "Path of the Masters", therefore there's no plagiarism because
        you can't plagiarize yourself!   Isn't that a hoot!

        There are a few "newer" plagiarism examples in the files over at ET
        that may not be posted anywhere else: 
        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eckankartruth/files

        Someone posted awhile back that they'd spotted material in the SKS that
        came from Ouspensky/Gurdjieff but their books were in storage - if
        anyone's interesting in comparing the books let me know and I'll look
        up more specific info.

        Have a great weekend,
        everyone!

        Sharon
        ______________________________________________________________
        1a. Rebazar Plagiarized Too!
        Posted by: "p
        rometheus_973" prometheus_973@...
        prometheus_973
        Date: Fri Apr 10, 2009 6:31 pm ((PDT))

        Did the (fake) ECKankar master of Twitchell,
        Rebazar Tarzs, plagiarize Julian Johnson's
        "The Path of the Master's," or did Julian
        Johnson plagiarize Rebazar?

        What has Rebazar written without Twitchell's
        help and when was it written? Nothing was
        heard from Rebazar prior to when... 1969?
        It could be that Twitchell mentioned RT in
        his Orion articles, but PT doesn't have RT
        actually speaking in his books prior to 1969.

        Rebazar states (according to Paul Twitchell,
        page 131, "The Far Country"):

        "There is little wonder that men take to
        religion, even if
        they have to invent one."

        ME: Like PT did!

        RT: "Voltaire said that religion is the solace
        of the weak."

        ME: I agree!

        RT: "Nietszche repeated this in his writings
        and talks. But be that as it may, the weak
        and the trapped need some support, and
        far be it from me to deny them. I wouldn't
        take their religion away, even if I knew full
        well that it could be done."

        ME: I'm attempting to show ECKists the
        Truth rather than religious lies and myth.

        RT: "Religion has always been a haven for
        the millions who mourn and suffer. It is
        undeniable that it has been generally the
        unhappy who have sought relief in religion;
        any religion which happened to be near them,
        and who can blame them. It's like a drowning
        man grasping at a straw."

        M
        E: Actually, there are also those seeking
        God and the spiritual life and the answers
        to the unknown.

        However, what's even
        more interesting is
        that these same exact words, spoken by
        ECK Master Rebazar Tarzs (The Torchbearer
        of ECKankar) via Paul Twitchell, are in the
        first paragraph of Chapter 2 in "The Path of
        the Masters" (1939 copyright).

        So who spoke these words first? Was it
        Julian P. Johnson in 1939, or was it Rebazar
        Tarzs via Paul Twitchell in 1970? Or, did
        Rebazar say these same exact words prior
        to 1939 and Johnson was somehow able
        to retrieve and copy them?

        Nah! Twitchell was a liar and a plagiarist!
        PT created Rebazar, as an alter ego, in order
        to initiate himself, and create his own religion!

        Prometheus


        Hello Whitemoby,
        Welcome to the site. I'll give you some
        info on PT's plagiarized "Flute" passages
        and point you toward more.

        First, check out the LINKS section, here
        on this site, for plagiarisms. Also, there's
        a LINK toward the bottom of the page with
        "Flute"
        info.

        Second, buy a SCP Journal-There's a
        LINK that tells about it and takes you
        to that site where you can purchase
        one (it's very inexpensive). Actually,
        this would, even, be a great historic
        reference/resource for ECKists too
        because of the early info given (dates,
        etc.), and the pics of Gail and Paul
        are very nice!

        Third, go to the FILES section here
        (for members only) and read or skim
        0Athrough Chapters 6-10 of "Confessions

        of a God Seeker" for more info on PT's
        plagiarisms.

        Fourth, I'll look through my copy of
        "Flute" and see if I can find something.

        Okay- On page 47, bottom, of "Flute"
        (1970 1st printing) Paul states,

        "Each generally knows something different
        about Truth than the other will know.
        For example: Bacon, Spinoza, Voltaire,
        Emerson, Berkeley, Kant, Hegel, Spencer,
        Schopenhauer and Darwin contributed
        something to the knowledge of Truth
        because
        the quality of matter in a given
        place and under given conditions is
        limited."

        This same quote is on page 9 (in my
        copy) of "The Path of the Masters."
        It's word for word. The only difference
        is that Twit omitted Nietzsche's name,
        however, PT had all of the other names
        in the same order as they are listed in
        "The Path of the Masters!"

        It should be pointed out, too, that the
        author of "The Path of the Masters"
        (1939 copyright), Julian P. Johnson, was
        only giving his "opinion" in this quote
        that Twitchell used. Thus, there is No
        real universal "Truth" being "compiled,"
        and passed on to ECKists (by Twit) as
        Klemp suggests. These comments are
        only one's (Johnson's) personal opinions/
        view. This is why the argument of Twitchell
        being a "Compiler of Truth" doesn't hold
        water!

        It appears Twitchell was doing a rewrite
        of "The Flute of God" while, simultaneously,
        writing "The Far
        Country" in 1970. The
        copyright of "Flute"
        is 1969 but the first
        printing was 1970.

        Thus, on page 131 of "The Far Country,"
        PT (RT) decides to discuss Nietzsche (the
        name he omitted from the above mentioned
        plagiarism in "Flute").

        These same quotes (supposedly being
        said by Rebazar Tarzs) beginning with:

        'There is little wonder...' and 'Religion has
        always been...' are mentioned word for word
        at the beginning of Chapter 2 in "The Path
        of the Masters."

        BTW- In Chapter 6, page 75, of "Flute" there
        is another plagiarism. The paragraph starts
        out with, "The Supreme has been called various
        names in different languages, but it is known
        to those who recognize the real wisdom as HU,
        the name of the nameless one."

        This quote, and more, are from the 1923
        copyright, pages 64-65, of "The Mysticism
        of Sound" by Hazrat Inayat Khan.

        Also, I found it very interesting that
        Klemp
        used many parts of "The Flute of God" for
        his September 2004 "H.I. Letter:" Chapter 8,
        "The Appeal of Man to God;" Chapter 9, "The
        Shape of the Altar;" Chapter 12, "The Borders
        of Heaven."

        Anyway, I hope this information has helped
        you with your research.

        Prometheus


        whitemoby22 wrote:

        I am researching Twitchell's "Flute of God".
        I am searching for plagarized passages.
        Can anyone here provide examples?
        Or point me in the right direction?

        Thanks...
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