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Re: Digest Number 1154

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  • drubezarne
    Sharon: To the best of my recollection, Joan Klemp sang some song and kept repeating the same refrain over and over while waving to the audience to sing along.
    Message 1 of 6 , Aug 4, 2008
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      Sharon:

      To the best of my recollection, Joan Klemp sang some song and kept
      repeating the same refrain over and over while waving to the audience
      to sing along. It all got very tedious and tiresome after a while and
      we wondered when is she going to stop. Finally, even Harold had enough
      and he whispered something to her and she stopped. Then he joked how
      he had warned her that once you get on stage you're hooked.

      He then announced her song was not going to replace the Hu chant. He
      tried to make a joke by saying that sometimes he can't get her to shut
      up. He said that's when he wants to use the Russian saying, "Put your
      teeth together!" The audience laughed, although it seemed that some
      uneasy laughter stemmed from the embarrassment of Joan's humiliation.
      Joan just walked off the stage.

      I tell you, his talk was nothing but stories from eckists. He didn't
      even bother interpreting them. At the end of his talk, he just
      restated the stories. For example, he said, "And I told you the story
      of Cindy and her parrot, then there was Motsie the cat who jumped into
      Debbie's lap every night to remind her to Hu, I told you about Dan's
      car breaking down, and so on...

      Oh, and he did start out with a joke he heard from Click and Clack,
      the car talk guys. The joke was good, but not worth the price of the
      seminar.

      Regards
      Liska

      --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Sharon
      <brighttigress@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      >
      > >
      > > 5. Lust - Maybe someone else can take over here.
      > >
      >
      > <snicker> Well, I'd say look to MN for good examples of lust!!
      Both Klemp and bigwig cult attorney Doug Kunin had sleazy affairs with
      girls in the office, and dumped their wives & children to marry their
      mistresses.
      >
      > What happened to Maybury's Laws? Don't remember verbatim, but
      wasn't one something about doing all you have promised to do, and the
      second to respect other people's property?
      >
      > And let us not forget Twitchell, who died in bed at a seminar with a
      young Mrs. Anya Foos - while Gail was off "camping in the mountains"
      with 2nd initiate Darwin Gross!!
      >
      > Which reminds me - Prometheus, I've been looking for something which
      may have been in the Mystic World in the late 80's or early 90's,
      perhaps in his letter on the last page, definitely "members-only"
      stuff. He tells eckists to cut out the bed-hopping at seminars
      because it didn't look good to potential new members, who'd think it
      was Club Med or something. This really stuck in my mind because I'd
      worked in hotel group sales and Club Med was a major pain-in-the-butt,
      always wanting prime dates at rock-bottom prices, and everything you
      can think of thrown in free. The hotel I worked for didn't need their
      business, so I really don't know personally how they "behaved".
      >
      > If you come across this one, would you email me the source? All my
      stuff's in storage. I've got a short list of several people who've
      been asking me about this one for many years.
      >
      > Also, what specifically did Klemp say about Joanie in his talk?
      Does anyone have a transcript? I used to know an HI stenographer
      who'd transcribe & distribute it even though cult headquarters does
      *not* permit that - they have to do a lot of editing for the book
      versions, I suspect.
      >
      > Another transcript I'd love to see is from a few years back, I
      believe it was the first online talk where "someone" distributed the
      name & password to anyone who wanted to hear it free. I started
      listening to it, and Klemp sounded confused, maybe drugged, rambling
      about suicide, I didn't even bother listening to the whole thing.
      >
      > Darn, while I was here there was something else I wanted to say or
      ask, but I've forgotten it!
      >
      > Hope everyone's enjoying summer!
      >
      > Hugs,
      >
      > Sharon
      >
      > PS - Wow, quite a list of links you've got there!! Mine over at ET
      need a lot of work. Anyway, just wanted to mention, if you'd like to
      copy anything from ET's "files" to put here, help yourself - I noticed
      you've got the link to the short version of Gunnar's excellent
      critique, and one of these days I've got to move the long version from
      ET's files to a more easily accessible website. Same with the
      "Raphael" material. Both helped me immensely when I was waking up &
      getting out.
      >
      > When *will* I get back to work? <gg>
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ******************************************************************
      > Don't be deceived by a seemingly innocent program on "Spiritual
      Dreams" or "Past Lives" at your local library or community center!
      It's one of many ways Eckankar and other cults recruit new members.
      Learn the truth before you sign over your mind, heart, soul, and life
      insurance!! See a short intro video at:
      http://youtube.com/watch?v=QJqkK_JDnzc and check out the links at
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eckankartruth
      > *******************************************************************
      >
    • mishmisha9
      Thanks for this first hand account of HK s cruel remarks directed at Joan on stage at the EWWS! I had heard about this, but not as good of an account of HK s
      Message 2 of 6 , Aug 6, 2008
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        Thanks for this first hand account of HK's cruel remarks
        directed at Joan on stage at the EWWS! I had heard about
        this, but not as good of an account of HK's nasty words to
        and about his wife . . . in front of the large audience of
        chelas. I sort of feel sorry for Joan to be treated like that . . .
        I'd have my husband's head on a platter if he embarrassed
        and humiliated me like that!

        Liska, in one of your other posts, you pointed out how HK
        might be a narcissist--he's either that or just plain nuts or
        maybe some of both? Putting others down to advance oneself
        is one of the behaviors of a narcissist--HK, while allowing
        Joan to share the stage with him for a few minutes, was
        definitely keeping her in her place and controlling her. We
        have discussed thelikelihood of Joan being positioned as co-l.e.m.
        so that HK can hold onto the seat of power longer. . . lots of
        discussions regarding this are in the archived messages--check
        out messages beginning in Jan. 2006. I have pointed out how HK
        was paving the way for Joan in obvious in what he wrote in "Those
        Wonderful ECK Masters"--that book was multipurpose.

        Now, I'm looking forward to the next EWWS--to see if Joan
        will indeed be back on stage with HK . . . one thing about
        narcissists, they don't stop until they accomplish what they set
        out to do. They do not like to be thwarted or their sneaky
        intentions "read."

        Mish


        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "drubezarne" <drubezarne@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Sharon:
        >
        > To the best of my recollection, Joan Klemp sang some song and kept
        > repeating the same refrain over and over while waving to the audience
        > to sing along. It all got very tedious and tiresome after a while and
        > we wondered when is she going to stop. Finally, even Harold had enough
        > and he whispered something to her and she stopped. Then he joked how
        > he had warned her that once you get on stage you're hooked.
        >
        > He then announced her song was not going to replace the Hu chant. He
        > tried to make a joke by saying that sometimes he can't get her to shut
        > up. He said that's when he wants to use the Russian saying, "Put your
        > teeth together!" The audience laughed, although it seemed that some
        > uneasy laughter stemmed from the embarrassment of Joan's humiliation.
        > Joan just walked off the stage.
        >
        > I tell you, his talk was nothing but stories from eckists. He didn't
        > even bother interpreting them. At the end of his talk, he just
        > restated the stories. For example, he said, "And I told you the story
        > of Cindy and her parrot, then there was Motsie the cat who jumped into
        > Debbie's lap every night to remind her to Hu, I told you about Dan's
        > car breaking down, and so on...
        >
        > Oh, and he did start out with a joke he heard from Click and Clack,
        > the car talk guys. The joke was good, but not worth the price of the
        > seminar.
        >
        > Regards
        > Liska
        >
        > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Sharon
        > <brighttigress@> wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > >
        > > > 5. Lust - Maybe someone else can take over here.
        > > >
        > >
        > > <snicker> Well, I'd say look to MN for good examples of lust!!
        > Both Klemp and bigwig cult attorney Doug Kunin had sleazy affairs with
        > girls in the office, and dumped their wives & children to marry their
        > mistresses.
        > >
        > > What happened to Maybury's Laws? Don't remember verbatim, but
        > wasn't one something about doing all you have promised to do, and the
        > second to respect other people's property?
        > >
        > > And let us not forget Twitchell, who died in bed at a seminar with a
        > young Mrs. Anya Foos - while Gail was off "camping in the mountains"
        > with 2nd initiate Darwin Gross!!
        > >
        > > Which reminds me - Prometheus, I've been looking for something which
        > may have been in the Mystic World in the late 80's or early 90's,
        > perhaps in his letter on the last page, definitely "members-only"
        > stuff. He tells eckists to cut out the bed-hopping at seminars
        > because it didn't look good to potential new members, who'd think it
        > was Club Med or something. This really stuck in my mind because I'd
        > worked in hotel group sales and Club Med was a major pain-in-the-butt,
        > always wanting prime dates at rock-bottom prices, and everything you
        > can think of thrown in free. The hotel I worked for didn't need their
        > business, so I really don't know personally how they "behaved".
        > >
        > > If you come across this one, would you email me the source? All my
        > stuff's in storage. I've got a short list of several people who've
        > been asking me about this one for many years.
        > >
        > > Also, what specifically did Klemp say about Joanie in his talk?
        > Does anyone have a transcript? I used to know an HI stenographer
        > who'd transcribe & distribute it even though cult headquarters does
        > *not* permit that - they have to do a lot of editing for the book
        > versions, I suspect.
        > >
        > > Another transcript I'd love to see is from a few years back, I
        > believe it was the first online talk where "someone" distributed the
        > name & password to anyone who wanted to hear it free. I started
        > listening to it, and Klemp sounded confused, maybe drugged, rambling
        > about suicide, I didn't even bother listening to the whole thing.
        > >
        > > Darn, while I was here there was something else I wanted to say or
        > ask, but I've forgotten it!
        > >
        > > Hope everyone's enjoying summer!
        > >
        > > Hugs,
        > >
        > > Sharon
        > >
        > > PS - Wow, quite a list of links you've got there!! Mine over at ET
        > need a lot of work. Anyway, just wanted to mention, if you'd like to
        > copy anything from ET's "files" to put here, help yourself - I noticed
        > you've got the link to the short version of Gunnar's excellent
        > critique, and one of these days I've got to move the long version from
        > ET's files to a more easily accessible website. Same with the
        > "Raphael" material. Both helped me immensely when I was waking up &
        > getting out.
        > >
        > > When *will* I get back to work? <gg>
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > ******************************************************************
        > > Don't be deceived by a seemingly innocent program on "Spiritual
        > Dreams" or "Past Lives" at your local library or community center!
        > It's one of many ways Eckankar and other cults recruit new members.
        > Learn the truth before you sign over your mind, heart, soul, and life
        > insurance!! See a short intro video at:
        > http://youtube.com/watch?v=QJqkK_JDnzc and check out the links at
        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eckankartruth
        > > *******************************************************************
        > >
        >
      • drubezarne
        Mish: If HK is a narcissist, I don t think he wants to share the limelight with Joan. Look how we haven t heard of anybody else becoming an ECK Master
        Message 3 of 6 , Aug 7, 2008
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          Mish:

          If HK is a narcissist, I don't think he wants to share the limelight
          with Joan. Look how we haven't heard of anybody else becoming an ECK
          Master including Phil Morimitsu whose recorded experiences seem
          greater than any HK has written about. I'm not saying Phil's
          experiences were real (personally, I don't believe in the existence of
          ECK Masters), but they certainly sounded more interesting than
          anything HK wrote.

          One reason we might have seen HK become defensive in his writings and
          also show his contempt for his followers and former followers could be
          due to this explanation about the narcissist. The Narcissistic Supply
          is the False Self that he projects - in this case Sri Harold Klemp,
          The Mahanta, The Living ECK Master. Here are some quotes from
          Malignant Self Love, Narcissism Revisited by Dr. Sam Vaknin - the
          bracketed words are mine...

          "The narcissist is a person who derives his Ego and Ego functions from
          other people's reactions to an image he invents and projects, called
          the False Self - the Narcissistic Supply. [HK The Mahanta] Since no
          absolute control over the quantity and quality of Narcissistic Supply
          is possible – it is bound to fluctuate – the narcissist's view of
          himself and of his world is correspondingly and equally volatile. As
          "public opinion" ebbs and flows, so do the narcissist's
          self-confidence, self-esteem, sense of self-worth, or, in other words,
          so does his Self. [We've seen this in his periodically defensive
          writings criiticizing former and current H.I.'s as well as
          spiritual/religious paths and their leaders] Even the narcissist's
          convictions are subject to a never-ending process of vetting by others...

          The narcissist does everything with one goal in mind: to attract
          Narcissistic Supply - attention. [How often has he reminded us that he
          is the Mahanta, The Living ECK Master?]

          He judges, praises and condemns – all from the narrowest possible
          point of view: the potential to extract Narcissistic Supply." [The
          example of Joan on stage showed how he would squeeze a laugh from the
          audience at her expense so that he could enhance his Narcissistic Supply.]

          Regards
          Liska

          --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "mishmisha9"
          <mishmisha9@...> wrote:
          >
          > Thanks for this first hand account of HK's cruel remarks
          > directed at Joan on stage at the EWWS! I had heard about
          > this, but not as good of an account of HK's nasty words to
          > and about his wife . . . in front of the large audience of
          > chelas. I sort of feel sorry for Joan to be treated like that . . .
          > I'd have my husband's head on a platter if he embarrassed
          > and humiliated me like that!
          >
          > Liska, in one of your other posts, you pointed out how HK
          > might be a narcissist--he's either that or just plain nuts or
          > maybe some of both? Putting others down to advance oneself
          > is one of the behaviors of a narcissist--HK, while allowing
          > Joan to share the stage with him for a few minutes, was
          > definitely keeping her in her place and controlling her. We
          > have discussed thelikelihood of Joan being positioned as co-l.e.m.
          > so that HK can hold onto the seat of power longer. . . lots of
          > discussions regarding this are in the archived messages--check
          > out messages beginning in Jan. 2006. I have pointed out how HK
          > was paving the way for Joan in obvious in what he wrote in "Those
          > Wonderful ECK Masters"--that book was multipurpose.
          >
          > Now, I'm looking forward to the next EWWS--to see if Joan
          > will indeed be back on stage with HK . . . one thing about
          > narcissists, they don't stop until they accomplish what they set
          > out to do. They do not like to be thwarted or their sneaky
          > intentions "read."
          >
          > Mish
          >
          >
          > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "drubezarne"
          <drubezarne@>
          > wrote:
          > >
          > > Sharon:
          > >
          > > To the best of my recollection, Joan Klemp sang some song and kept
          > > repeating the same refrain over and over while waving to the audience
          > > to sing along. It all got very tedious and tiresome after a while and
          > > we wondered when is she going to stop. Finally, even Harold had enough
          > > and he whispered something to her and she stopped. Then he joked how
          > > he had warned her that once you get on stage you're hooked.
          > >
          > > He then announced her song was not going to replace the Hu chant. He
          > > tried to make a joke by saying that sometimes he can't get her to shut
          > > up. He said that's when he wants to use the Russian saying, "Put your
          > > teeth together!" The audience laughed, although it seemed that some
          > > uneasy laughter stemmed from the embarrassment of Joan's humiliation.
          > > Joan just walked off the stage.
          > >
          > > I tell you, his talk was nothing but stories from eckists. He didn't
          > > even bother interpreting them. At the end of his talk, he just
          > > restated the stories. For example, he said, "And I told you the story
          > > of Cindy and her parrot, then there was Motsie the cat who jumped into
          > > Debbie's lap every night to remind her to Hu, I told you about Dan's
          > > car breaking down, and so on...
          > >
          > > Oh, and he did start out with a joke he heard from Click and Clack,
          > > the car talk guys. The joke was good, but not worth the price of the
          > > seminar.
          > >
          > > Regards
          > > Liska
          > >
          > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Sharon
          > > <brighttigress@> wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > 5. Lust - Maybe someone else can take over here.
          > > > >
          > > >
          > > > <snicker> Well, I'd say look to MN for good examples of lust!!
          > > Both Klemp and bigwig cult attorney Doug Kunin had sleazy affairs with
          > > girls in the office, and dumped their wives & children to marry their
          > > mistresses.
          > > >
          > > > What happened to Maybury's Laws? Don't remember verbatim, but
          > > wasn't one something about doing all you have promised to do, and the
          > > second to respect other people's property?
          > > >
          > > > And let us not forget Twitchell, who died in bed at a seminar with a
          > > young Mrs. Anya Foos - while Gail was off "camping in the mountains"
          > > with 2nd initiate Darwin Gross!!
          > > >
          > > > Which reminds me - Prometheus, I've been looking for something which
          > > may have been in the Mystic World in the late 80's or early 90's,
          > > perhaps in his letter on the last page, definitely "members-only"
          > > stuff. He tells eckists to cut out the bed-hopping at seminars
          > > because it didn't look good to potential new members, who'd think it
          > > was Club Med or something. This really stuck in my mind because I'd
          > > worked in hotel group sales and Club Med was a major pain-in-the-butt,
          > > always wanting prime dates at rock-bottom prices, and everything you
          > > can think of thrown in free. The hotel I worked for didn't need their
          > > business, so I really don't know personally how they "behaved".
          > > >
          > > > If you come across this one, would you email me the source? All my
          > > stuff's in storage. I've got a short list of several people who've
          > > been asking me about this one for many years.
          > > >
          > > > Also, what specifically did Klemp say about Joanie in his talk?
          > > Does anyone have a transcript? I used to know an HI stenographer
          > > who'd transcribe & distribute it even though cult headquarters does
          > > *not* permit that - they have to do a lot of editing for the book
          > > versions, I suspect.
          > > >
          > > > Another transcript I'd love to see is from a few years back, I
          > > believe it was the first online talk where "someone" distributed the
          > > name & password to anyone who wanted to hear it free. I started
          > > listening to it, and Klemp sounded confused, maybe drugged, rambling
          > > about suicide, I didn't even bother listening to the whole thing.
          > > >
          > > > Darn, while I was here there was something else I wanted to say or
          > > ask, but I've forgotten it!
          > > >
          > > > Hope everyone's enjoying summer!
          > > >
          > > > Hugs,
          > > >
          > > > Sharon
          > > >
          > > > PS - Wow, quite a list of links you've got there!! Mine over at ET
          > > need a lot of work. Anyway, just wanted to mention, if you'd like to
          > > copy anything from ET's "files" to put here, help yourself - I noticed
          > > you've got the link to the short version of Gunnar's excellent
          > > critique, and one of these days I've got to move the long version from
          > > ET's files to a more easily accessible website. Same with the
          > > "Raphael" material. Both helped me immensely when I was waking up &
          > > getting out.
          > > >
          > > > When *will* I get back to work? <gg>
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > ******************************************************************
          > > > Don't be deceived by a seemingly innocent program on "Spiritual
          > > Dreams" or "Past Lives" at your local library or community center!
          > > It's one of many ways Eckankar and other cults recruit new members.
          > > Learn the truth before you sign over your mind, heart, soul, and life
          > > insurance!! See a short intro video at:
          > > http://youtube.com/watch?v=QJqkK_JDnzc and check out the links at
          > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eckankartruth
          > > > *******************************************************************
          > > >
          > >
          >
        • mishmisha9
          I am basing this on what HK wrote in Those Wonderful ECK Masters and the fact that HK is not stepping down anytime soon, also referenced in Those Wonderful
          Message 4 of 6 , Aug 7, 2008
          • 0 Attachment
            I am basing this on what HK wrote in "Those Wonderful ECK Masters"
            and the fact that HK is not stepping down anytime soon, also
            referenced in "Those Wonderful ECK Masters." But since he is
            a narcissist, "sharing" with Joan would also require that he
            keep her in a lower position on stage--hence the humiliation.
            As for Phil Morimitsu--of course, a narcissist wouldn't want
            someone more interesting and popular to be elevated. And
            this is why Phil Morimitsu's books are no longer being offered
            by eckankar. But Joan is a good choice to help HK cling to
            the power of his throne--she is his executive secretary and
            therefore, even as a co-l.e.m., she is still working for the boss.
            I think HK is concerned also about the transition that will take
            place when he kicks the bucket. Gail selected Darwin--and that
            was a mess. At least, Joan would have a little more clout in such
            a situation . . . and perhaps, protect HK's empire and image
            after his death.

            Your points about a narcissist are very well taken, but HK is
            plotting how to hang in there for as long as he possibly can. He
            feels the heat of the wolves at his heels, I'm sure. And Joan
            is his best choice to help keep them at bay. I thought it was
            interesting that Joan appeared on stage, but yet I expected it
            when reading how she was being presented in that book-- like
            an eck master. . . . I have posted quotes from the book in the
            messages located in the archives. If I have some time later, I'll
            try to pull some of those up.

            Mish


            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "drubezarne" <drubezarne@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > Mish:
            >
            > If HK is a narcissist, I don't think he wants to share the limelight
            > with Joan. Look how we haven't heard of anybody else becoming an ECK
            > Master including Phil Morimitsu whose recorded experiences seem
            > greater than any HK has written about. I'm not saying Phil's
            > experiences were real (personally, I don't believe in the existence of
            > ECK Masters), but they certainly sounded more interesting than
            > anything HK wrote.
            >
            > One reason we might have seen HK become defensive in his writings and
            > also show his contempt for his followers and former followers could be
            > due to this explanation about the narcissist. The Narcissistic Supply
            > is the False Self that he projects - in this case Sri Harold Klemp,
            > The Mahanta, The Living ECK Master. Here are some quotes from
            > Malignant Self Love, Narcissism Revisited by Dr. Sam Vaknin - the
            > bracketed words are mine...
            >
            > "The narcissist is a person who derives his Ego and Ego functions from
            > other people's reactions to an image he invents and projects, called
            > the False Self - the Narcissistic Supply. [HK The Mahanta] Since no
            > absolute control over the quantity and quality of Narcissistic Supply
            > is possible – it is bound to fluctuate – the narcissist's view of
            > himself and of his world is correspondingly and equally volatile. As
            > "public opinion" ebbs and flows, so do the narcissist's
            > self-confidence, self-esteem, sense of self-worth, or, in other words,
            > so does his Self. [We've seen this in his periodically defensive
            > writings criiticizing former and current H.I.'s as well as
            > spiritual/religious paths and their leaders] Even the narcissist's
            > convictions are subject to a never-ending process of vetting by others...
            >
            > The narcissist does everything with one goal in mind: to attract
            > Narcissistic Supply - attention. [How often has he reminded us that he
            > is the Mahanta, The Living ECK Master?]
            >
            > He judges, praises and condemns – all from the narrowest possible
            > point of view: the potential to extract Narcissistic Supply." [The
            > example of Joan on stage showed how he would squeeze a laugh from the
            > audience at her expense so that he could enhance his Narcissistic Supply.]
            >
            > Regards
            > Liska
            >
            > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "mishmisha9"
            > <mishmisha9@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Thanks for this first hand account of HK's cruel remarks
            > > directed at Joan on stage at the EWWS! I had heard about
            > > this, but not as good of an account of HK's nasty words to
            > > and about his wife . . . in front of the large audience of
            > > chelas. I sort of feel sorry for Joan to be treated like that . . .
            > > I'd have my husband's head on a platter if he embarrassed
            > > and humiliated me like that!
            > >
            > > Liska, in one of your other posts, you pointed out how HK
            > > might be a narcissist--he's either that or just plain nuts or
            > > maybe some of both? Putting others down to advance oneself
            > > is one of the behaviors of a narcissist--HK, while allowing
            > > Joan to share the stage with him for a few minutes, was
            > > definitely keeping her in her place and controlling her. We
            > > have discussed thelikelihood of Joan being positioned as co-l.e.m.
            > > so that HK can hold onto the seat of power longer. . . lots of
            > > discussions regarding this are in the archived messages--check
            > > out messages beginning in Jan. 2006. I have pointed out how HK
            > > was paving the way for Joan in obvious in what he wrote in "Those
            > > Wonderful ECK Masters"--that book was multipurpose.
            > >
            > > Now, I'm looking forward to the next EWWS--to see if Joan
            > > will indeed be back on stage with HK . . . one thing about
            > > narcissists, they don't stop until they accomplish what they set
            > > out to do. They do not like to be thwarted or their sneaky
            > > intentions "read."
            > >
            > > Mish
            > >
            > >
            > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "drubezarne"
            > <drubezarne@>
            > > wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Sharon:
            > > >
            > > > To the best of my recollection, Joan Klemp sang some song and kept
            > > > repeating the same refrain over and over while waving to the audience
            > > > to sing along. It all got very tedious and tiresome after a while and
            > > > we wondered when is she going to stop. Finally, even Harold had enough
            > > > and he whispered something to her and she stopped. Then he joked how
            > > > he had warned her that once you get on stage you're hooked.
            > > >
            > > > He then announced her song was not going to replace the Hu chant. He
            > > > tried to make a joke by saying that sometimes he can't get her to shut
            > > > up. He said that's when he wants to use the Russian saying, "Put your
            > > > teeth together!" The audience laughed, although it seemed that some
            > > > uneasy laughter stemmed from the embarrassment of Joan's humiliation.
            > > > Joan just walked off the stage.
            > > >
            > > > I tell you, his talk was nothing but stories from eckists. He didn't
            > > > even bother interpreting them. At the end of his talk, he just
            > > > restated the stories. For example, he said, "And I told you the story
            > > > of Cindy and her parrot, then there was Motsie the cat who jumped into
            > > > Debbie's lap every night to remind her to Hu, I told you about Dan's
            > > > car breaking down, and so on...
            > > >
            > > > Oh, and he did start out with a joke he heard from Click and Clack,
            > > > the car talk guys. The joke was good, but not worth the price of the
            > > > seminar.
            > > >
            > > > Regards
            > > > Liska
            > > >
            > > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Sharon
            > > > <brighttigress@> wrote:
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > > 5. Lust - Maybe someone else can take over here.
            > > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > <snicker> Well, I'd say look to MN for good examples of lust!!
            > > > Both Klemp and bigwig cult attorney Doug Kunin had sleazy affairs with
            > > > girls in the office, and dumped their wives & children to marry their
            > > > mistresses.
            > > > >
            > > > > What happened to Maybury's Laws? Don't remember verbatim, but
            > > > wasn't one something about doing all you have promised to do, and the
            > > > second to respect other people's property?
            > > > >
            > > > > And let us not forget Twitchell, who died in bed at a seminar with a
            > > > young Mrs. Anya Foos - while Gail was off "camping in the mountains"
            > > > with 2nd initiate Darwin Gross!!
            > > > >
            > > > > Which reminds me - Prometheus, I've been looking for something which
            > > > may have been in the Mystic World in the late 80's or early 90's,
            > > > perhaps in his letter on the last page, definitely "members-only"
            > > > stuff. He tells eckists to cut out the bed-hopping at seminars
            > > > because it didn't look good to potential new members, who'd think it
            > > > was Club Med or something. This really stuck in my mind because I'd
            > > > worked in hotel group sales and Club Med was a major pain-in-the-butt,
            > > > always wanting prime dates at rock-bottom prices, and everything you
            > > > can think of thrown in free. The hotel I worked for didn't need their
            > > > business, so I really don't know personally how they "behaved".
            > > > >
            > > > > If you come across this one, would you email me the source? All my
            > > > stuff's in storage. I've got a short list of several people who've
            > > > been asking me about this one for many years.
            > > > >
            > > > > Also, what specifically did Klemp say about Joanie in his talk?
            > > > Does anyone have a transcript? I used to know an HI stenographer
            > > > who'd transcribe & distribute it even though cult headquarters does
            > > > *not* permit that - they have to do a lot of editing for the book
            > > > versions, I suspect.
            > > > >
            > > > > Another transcript I'd love to see is from a few years back, I
            > > > believe it was the first online talk where "someone" distributed the
            > > > name & password to anyone who wanted to hear it free. I started
            > > > listening to it, and Klemp sounded confused, maybe drugged, rambling
            > > > about suicide, I didn't even bother listening to the whole thing.
            > > > >
            > > > > Darn, while I was here there was something else I wanted to say or
            > > > ask, but I've forgotten it!
            > > > >
            > > > > Hope everyone's enjoying summer!
            > > > >
            > > > > Hugs,
            > > > >
            > > > > Sharon
            > > > >
            > > > > PS - Wow, quite a list of links you've got there!! Mine over at ET
            > > > need a lot of work. Anyway, just wanted to mention, if you'd like to
            > > > copy anything from ET's "files" to put here, help yourself - I noticed
            > > > you've got the link to the short version of Gunnar's excellent
            > > > critique, and one of these days I've got to move the long version from
            > > > ET's files to a more easily accessible website. Same with the
            > > > "Raphael" material. Both helped me immensely when I was waking up &
            > > > getting out.
            > > > >
            > > > > When *will* I get back to work? <gg>
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > ******************************************************************
            > > > > Don't be deceived by a seemingly innocent program on "Spiritual
            > > > Dreams" or "Past Lives" at your local library or community center!
            > > > It's one of many ways Eckankar and other cults recruit new members.
            > > > Learn the truth before you sign over your mind, heart, soul, and life
            > > > insurance!! See a short intro video at:
            > > > http://youtube.com/watch?v=QJqkK_JDnzc and check out the links at
            > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eckankartruth
            > > > > *******************************************************************
            > > > >
            > > >
            > >
            >
          • Elizabeth
            Mish wrote: As for Phil Morimitsu--of course, a narcissist wouldn t want someone more interesting and popular to be elevated. And this is why Phil Morimitsu s
            Message 5 of 6 , Aug 7, 2008
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              Mish wrote:
               
              As for Phil Morimitsu--of course, a narcissist wouldn't want
              someone more interesting and popular to be elevated. And
              this is why Phil Morimitsu's books are no longer being offered
              by eckankar.
               
              -------------------------------------------------------------------
               
              Has it occurred to anyone that when Klemp (eckankar) removes or does not offer a book by a high level eckie, it's usually been because the person / author has left eckankar. 
               
               
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