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Re: women as eckmasters ...now??

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  • mishmisha9
    Hi, Leanne! I believe it serves Klemp s purpose to bring out the female eck masters since it will allow him to place Joan in a position of authority beside
    Message 1 of 9 , Jul 3, 2008
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      Hi, Leanne!

      I believe it serves Klemp's purpose to bring out the
      female eck masters since it will allow him to place Joan
      in a position of authority beside him, like co-L.E.M.
      After reading his book "Those Wonderful ECK Masters,"
      it seems that Klemp is inserting the idea in a somewhat
      subtle way that Joan would be elevated to eck master.
      However, for the slow learning chela, when reflecting
      back to this book, it is obvious that Joan had already
      become an eck master, just like Kata Daki. Klemp spins
      Joan into some of the stories showing how she is acting
      like an eck master--well, the book is interesting to read
      when you look for this subtle slight of hand that Klemp
      is doing regarding Joan.

      Klemp is looking at his age and energy in staying at the
      helm of the eck org. He had asserted at one time that he
      would hold the leadership position 10 to 20 years, but he
      has well exceeded it now. And it doesn't look like he is anytime
      soon ready to step down.

      In "Those Wonderful ECK Masters," pages 235-236, Klemp
      addresses how long he would serve as L.E.M and if any initiates
      were in training. He wrote: ". . . a few initiates were indeed
      in training for leadership in ECK, but no one was ready yet
      to assume the responsibility. It might take several years or
      many more for the first one to complete all the tests. Accordingly,
      the Master would continue for another cycle as the Mahanta,
      the Living ECK Master."

      So, H.I.'s and the power players like Peter Skelsky still have
      a long wait to become the next chosen one. Quite a contrast
      to how long Klemp waited! LOL! But Klemp is still holding on
      to the power and seems intent not to let go--and the "another
      cycle" would be how long, 12 years?

      Klemp needs Joan though because he can't trust sharing the
      limelight with anyone else. He most likely fears that he might
      suffer the same fate as Darwin--he might have done unto him
      what he did to Gross! : )

      Klemp paves the way for Joan becoming a female eck master
      by giving Kata Daki the same attention he does to the other
      eck masters in "Those Wonderful ECK Masters," by devoting
      a chapter to each, including a chapter for this female eck master.
      Klemp explains that now is the time for the female masters to
      appear with this explanation on page 63:

      "Before we get too far along, we need to say a word about
      the female members of the Vairagi Order. There are precious
      few of them in relation to the number of males, and it is for
      a good reason. In past ages, and sometimes even today, it
      was easier for a male to move about in harsh societies and
      environments. So a Soul that had earned the right to incarnate
      into a lifetime devoted to the quest for Mastership often chose
      a male body. It was simply easier to get around in. That is not
      to say the individual's quest for truth was easier. It was not. . . . "

      Note that nothing is mentioned here about the Masculine Principle
      that was taught in the earlier eck teachings as a prerequisite
      in becoming an eck master, or that Vairagi Adepts are only 'just
      men.' Klemp is opening the door for female leadership, but of
      course, that would be Joan and only Joan. He might even have
      reflected back on the messy position in choosing PT's predecessor,
      as to how much easier it would have been if Gail had had some
      official authority as an eck master instead of using a dream
      by a lover and future wife of Darwin Gross as justification! This
      brought into question the authority and validity of Gross as LEM
      and his authority to pass his title and powers on to Klemp.

      So, bringing out female eck masters today fits in with the
      continuing conning of the chelas--Klemp is revising the teachings
      to suit his specific purposes. He needs Joan to have some legitimate
      power in order to help him hold onto the reins of the eck org.

      Role and rolling, very funny! : )

      Mish

      --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Leanne Thompson
      <le_anne_thompson@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      > I read somewhere that there couldn't be any women eck masters (something to do with
      energies. I think ego.) ANd now they are comming up with kata daki. And Joan Klemps
      role(maybe they roll in bed). Funny how they are changing their tune now. Whatever
      happened to Grahm ???? who was kicked out and ford johnson had him write his
      experiences in a book?
      >  
      > Leanne
      >
    • prometheus_973
      Hello All, I think Mish explained Klemp s slight of hand tactics rather well! Yes, in 2005 when Those Wonderful EK Masters was written Klemp talked about being
      Message 2 of 9 , Jul 4, 2008
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        Hello All,
        I think Mish explained Klemp's slight of hand tactics
        rather well! Yes, in 2005 when Those Wonderful EK
        Masters was written Klemp talked about being around
        for another (12 year) cycle. Therefore, Klemp is planning
        to stay for Three 12 year cycles, or 36 years. So, HK's
        reign is to be from 1981-2017! Or, would that be 2018!
        Klemp was 39 years old (1942) when DG made him the
        LEM. Klemp is 66 years old now, as is, his first wife and
        8th initiate Marge. I think Gail (who "made" Darwin) is
        67 years old and Joan is still 65. Anyway, Klemp doesn't
        want to let go of all his powers (as Mahanta) until he is
        75 or 76 years old! This is Why HK needs Joan to help
        him with the running of the org.

        Therefore, Klemp needs to pave the way for Joan becoming
        the next LEM or Co-LEM. For Klemp to say that there is
        no one ready after 27 years is a lie! Besides, some of these
        ECKists have been members as long as he has, thus, they
        have been "in training" for 40 years! Anyway, this is why
        Klemp is placing Joan on the same level with Kata Daki (KD).
        Even Kata Daki is a fake EK Master and was created 9 years
        after Twitchell's sister's (Kay-Dee) death. Anyway, this is
        what the older H.I.s have to look forward to. Eventually,
        (by 2017 or 2018) someone, Marge and Harold's daughter's
        age, will become the next Emperor of Eckankar.

        On another note:
        As far as when Twitchell first created and spoke of Rebazar?
        I think PT probably created RT around 1955. This was when
        Kirpal Singh first came to the U.S. and this was when Twitchell
        was initiated by Kirpal. PT had been writing fiction, plagiarizing,
        exaggerating (to extremes at times) and using name and word
        substitution in his articles from almost day one! IMO Twit simply
        used Kirpal's status and example and Ruhani Satsang dogma
        to form the basis for his fictional character of (master) Rebazar
        Tarzs.

        Prometheus


        Leanne wrote:
        I read somewhere that there couldn't be any women
        eck masters (something to do with energies. I think ego .)
        ANd now they are comming up with kata daki. And Joan
        Klemps role (maybe they roll in bed). Funny how they
        are changing their tune now. Whatever happened to Grahm ????
        who was kicked out and ford johnson had him write his
        experiences in a book?


        Mish wrote:
        [snip]
        "Note that nothing is mentioned here about the Masculine Principle
        that was taught in the earlier eck teachings as a prerequisite
        to becoming an eck master, or that Vairagi Adepts are only 'just
        men.' Klemp is opening the door for female leadership, but of
        course, that would be Joan and only Joan. He might even have
        reflected back on the messy position in choosing PT's successor,
        as to how much easier it would have been if Gail had had some
        official authority as an eck master instead of using a dream
        by a lover and future wife of Darwin Gross as justification! This
        brought into question the authority and validity of Gross as LEM
        and his authority to pass his title and powers on to Klemp."


        Etznab wrote:
        "Doing research about Eckankar
        history for educational purposes
        I am attempting to clarify some
        dates.

        Primarily, When did Paul and
        Gail get married? (I assume 1964,
        but not certain of day and month)
        And, when did Rebazar Tarzs first
        appear in print.

        I'd asked "these" questions on
        A.R.E., but so far no response.

        Do you have the date someplace
        in your archives for when Paul and
        Gail were married? Want to hazard
        a guess when the name Rebazar Tarzs
        first appeared in print?"
      • Leanne Thompson
        Will klemp collect social security as a man or eck master?   Leanne ... From: prometheus_973 Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous]
        Message 3 of 9 , Jul 4, 2008
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          Will klemp collect social security as a man or eck master?

           

          Leanne

          --- On Fri, 7/4/08, prometheus_973 <prometheus_973@...> wrote:

          From: prometheus_973 <prometheus_973@...>
          Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Women Eckmasters... Now or Never Were???
          To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Friday, July 4, 2008, 11:08 AM

          Hello All,
          I think Mish explained Klemp's slight of hand tactics
          rather well! Yes, in 2005 when Those Wonderful EK
          Masters was written Klemp talked about being around
          for another (12 year) cycle. Therefore, Klemp is planning
          to stay for Three 12 year cycles, or 36 years. So, HK's
          reign is to be from 1981-2017! Or, would that be 2018!
          Klemp was 39 years old (1942) when DG made him the
          LEM. Klemp is 66 years old now, as is, his first wife and
          8th initiate Marge. I think Gail (who "made" Darwin) is
          67 years old and Joan is still 65. Anyway, Klemp doesn't
          want to let go of all his powers (as Mahanta) until he is
          75 or 76 years old! This is Why HK needs Joan to help
          him with the running of the org.

          Therefore, Klemp needs to pave the way for Joan becoming
          the next LEM or Co-LEM. For Klemp to say that there is
          no one ready after 27 years is a lie! Besides, some of these
          ECKists have been members as long as he has, thus, they
          have been "in training" for 40 years! Anyway, this is why
          Klemp is placing Joan on the same level with Kata Daki (KD).
          Even Kata Daki is a fake EK Master and was created 9 years
          after Twitchell's sister's (Kay-Dee) death. Anyway, this is
          what the older H.I.s have to look forward to. Eventually,
          (by 2017 or 2018) someone, Marge and Harold's daughter's
          age, will become the next Emperor of Eckankar.

          On another note:
          As far as when Twitchell first created and spoke of Rebazar?
          I think PT probably created RT around 1955. This was when
          Kirpal Singh first came to the U.S. and this was when Twitchell
          was initiated by Kirpal. PT had been writing fiction, plagiarizing,
          exaggerating (to extremes at times) and using name and word
          substitution in his articles from almost day one! IMO Twit simply
          used Kirpal's status and example and Ruhani Satsang dogma
          to form the basis for his fictional character of (master) Rebazar
          Tarzs.

          Prometheus

          Leanne wrote:
          I read somewhere that there couldn't be any women
          eck masters (something to do with energies. I think ego .)
          ANd now they are comming up with kata daki. And Joan
          Klemps role (maybe they roll in bed). Funny how they
          are changing their tune now. Whatever happened to Grahm ????
          who was kicked out and ford johnson had him write his
          experiences in a book?

          Mish wrote:
          [snip]
          "Note that nothing is mentioned here about the Masculine Principle
          that was taught in the earlier eck teachings as a prerequisite
          to becoming an eck master, or that Vairagi Adepts are only 'just
          men.' Klemp is opening the door for female leadership, but of
          course, that would be Joan and only Joan. He might even have
          reflected back on the messy position in choosing PT's successor,
          as to how much easier it would have been if Gail had had some
          official authority as an eck master instead of using a dream
          by a lover and future wife of Darwin Gross as justification! This
          brought into question the authority and validity of Gross as LEM
          and his authority to pass his title and powers on to Klemp."

          Etznab wrote:
          "Doing research about Eckankar
          history for educational purposes
          I am attempting to clarify some
          dates.

          Primarily, When did Paul and
          Gail get married? (I assume 1964,
          but not certain of day and month)
          And, when did Rebazar Tarzs first
          appear in print.

          I'd asked "these" questions on
          A.R.E., but so far no response.

          Do you have the date someplace
          in your archives for when Paul and
          Gail were married? Want to hazard
          a guess when the name Rebazar Tarzs
          first appeared in print?"


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