Re: Where's Harry, Joan, & Marge Klemp?
- Hi Liz and All,
It's true that according to EK speak Soul=Soul, thus,
no Soul was "higher" than another (when It was first
created), but the ECK Initiations (Order of the Peck)
contradict this view. And, Klemp reenforces the view
of inequality by stating that no one is equal due to karmic
effect. Why isn't the "Holding Tank for Karma" (Klemp)
Why should ECKists think that they are more advanced
(higher), or have had karma removed when there is
no indication of this beyond what a normal non-ECKist
experiences! Is there any indication that karma has ever
been removed by Klemp? It's all a promise of what is to
come "after" this life. This is typical of any religion.
Everyone has dream experiences, and many other non-
ECKists do visualizations (as their own Master) greater
than and "higher" than what ECKANKAR teaches!
The Mahanta can't even heal a 7th Initiate of Cancer!
Who, then, qualifies for "protection" and to have Karmic
"effects" removed by this Mahanta! There is simply no
"proof" other than via the mind's imaginings due to
expectation, desire, and mistakes-in-identity with
pre-Eckankar experiences of seeing EK Masters. Others
have the same, and better, "amazing stories" too!
Yes, the Klemps and some staffers at the ESC read
this site, as well as, HU-Chat and Chela-Chat.
Stever reports to his RESA and to the person over
Public Information at the ESC. It was John G. at one
time. These people report to Joan who reports to H.K.
Klemp doesn't seem to care about what happens on
the official "unofficial" ECKANKAR Sites. It's no wonder
that many ECKists have pulled back from the outer
EK org. As long as ECKists put in the time (service)
and money (coin) and make friends with those who
approve of one's nomination for pink slip or position
it's all good... it it makes one feel needed, important,
and more advanced than other ECKists! The busy EK
work, also, keeps one from thinking too much. The
"Leap of Faith" concept works well here!
Many ECKists have just given up posting on the EK
sites... why take the chance of being attacked or insulted.
Why go to the Local ECK Center when they just look
down upon you, talk over you, or correct you as
though their higher initiation means they "know" more
spiritually! How arrogant and unloving while other
H.I.s are fearful to say anything, or are very passive
and don't care at all!
Basically, the whole of the ECKANKAR Corp/Church
is screwed up due to H.K. and there's no one to fix it!
This is why many long-time ECKists have quit caring,
don't follow the Guidelines, and are pissed off! They
aren't to the point of quitting, but at the point of not
caring all that much. They remain ECKists because of
the old friendships that have formed, and because they
have more in common (the EK dogma, etc.) with ECKists.
It's become a social club of sorts with certain ones
barking orders while puffing up their chicken feathers.
What ever happened to Klemp's story with the H.I. FOXes
in the EK Hen House? Why even mention something if
you're not going to take action? People in high positions
do this because it gives others the impression that you
care and that you are paying attention to things. It's all for
show and becomes a feeble attempt at having empathy.
There was really no plan to take action... it was all talk
and for show in order to quiet the troops. I've seen this
same tactic taken in business. Everyone has an opportunity
to get it off their chest, to unload verbally, emotionally,
and mentally. It's all talk! Afterwards, it's business as
usual! Nothing has changed! Except, all of the "trouble
makers" (whistle blowers) have now been identified.
It's obvious that Klemp was untruthful when he gave
ECKists the impression that he cared and was going to
do something about the Negative Vahana ECKists (H.I.
Leaders) on the Internet and in the Local ECK Centers.
These "H.I. FOXES" continue to prove that ECKANKAR
and their Mahanta have NO Special Spiritual Powers
or Authority. It's all fiction... like Harry Potter!
>No one is higher than another! H.I.'s are no better or higher than a new
student in eck... The only difference is, they have developed quite an ego
from being perched on their self made pedestals. Their behavior is pompous
and lacks love and respect! The further up the Klempankar ladder, the more
arrogant and patronizing they become! And since when has Mark A become
Klemp's talking head anyway? Now he feels he is high enough he can speak
>BTW, Klempankar does have people sitting in their ESC offices reading from
the eck and ex eck chat groups... BUT, they are not responsible for the
comments made by their lunatic H.I.s on Hu-chat or Chela-chat. Recall that
these two chat groups (and others based on eckankar) have disclaimers,
strictly enforced by the Klempankar police like Steve R, not to claim they
speak for Klemp, the Mahanta or Klempankar....
>And let's not forget the Klempankar big shot attorneys that advise this rip
off , plagiarized religion on how to just fly under the radar for a non
profit religion, and stay legal.
> -------Original Message-------
Where's Harry, Joan, & Marge Klemp?
> Doesn't Mr. Mahanta, or Joan, or Marge know or
> care what's happening on these ECKANKAR
> "unofficially" sponsored sites (HU-Chat & Chela-
> Chat)? Don't the Klemps' know or care about
> the negative behaviour of H.I. EK Vahanas, and
> what they are saying to one another? Isn't the
> H.I. Leadership Book required Training for
> Vahanas (explorers) and settlers? Does anyone
> Enforce conduct ("effect") within the EK Church?
> I guess Not! But, Why Not? Afterall, Graham got
> Punished (demoted) for sharing a dream experience
> with just a few people (including H.K.). These negative
> EK Vahanas are sharing their vile on the INTERNET!
> Linda (MettaHu) volunteers at the Temple of ECK!
> Steve R. is involved with EK Public Information!
> Mark A. is having Marge Klemp stay at his house
> While she's in town for an EK Workshop!
> These Three (let alone others like Cheryl G.) are
> Nasty and unloving people... without being ECKists!
> Isn't there supposed to be a "higher" standard
> (result) that is represented by a "higher" consciousness!
> Where is it then! After all of these years and higher
> Initiations... it's NO Where to be seen or heard!
> Does Marge Klemp really want to stay in a house
> (Mark's) that is full of negative emotions before giving
> an ECK Workshop... I wouldn't want to take the chance
> with those negative "effects!" What message is Marge
> Conveying to other ECKists... that Mark's continued
> Negativity is okay... with no repercussions? Where's
> her ex... Harry? Is he tuned out to Mark's consciousness?
> Stever is always nervously jumping in (on HU-Chat)
> to "balance" or smooth things out... in a most spiritually
> Immature manner. Spam anyone? But, don't trust him!
> He's such a gossip! Never tell him anything that you don't
> Want your RESA or the ESC to know as well! And, he's a
> Real ladder climber hungry for RESA status.
> BTW- It seems that Linda does some "skimming" too!
> What about "consciousness" and "love" (etc.) mentioned
> in the 12/2007 Mystic World and Wisdom Notes by H.K.
> Her message to Gaby doesn't sound very loving or that
> There is any higher consciousness than a zERO initiate
> Would have! How insulting and KAL like to say "Dear
> Heart" and then attack her by putting her down! How
> Spiritually immature! Linda sounds like a 1st initiate!
> Actually, this is a perfect example of real "ECK love!"
> Linda (MettaHu):
> "Gaby, dear heart, I was teasing you a little bit,
> but of course you insist on taking this too
> Personally. You admitted that you only skimmed
> The posts - that means you didn't really read them
> Carefully, but you were complaining about them,
> Anyway. If you had said that you read the posts
> By Mark, Steve, Michael and myself carefully and
> Thoughtfully, I might take your complaints more
> Seriously, but since you skimmed the posts, I am
> "skimming" your comments about them, too.
> That's fair.
> ECK love, Linda,"