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Re: Where's Harry, Joan, & Marge Klemp?

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  • prometheus_973
    Hi Liz and All, It s true that according to EK speak Soul=Soul, thus, no Soul was higher than another (when It was first created), but the ECK Initiations
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 28, 2008
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      Hi Liz and All,
      It's true that according to EK speak Soul=Soul, thus,
      no Soul was "higher" than another (when It was first
      created), but the ECK Initiations (Order of the Peck)
      contradict this view. And, Klemp reenforces the view
      of inequality by stating that no one is equal due to karmic
      effect. Why isn't the "Holding Tank for Karma" (Klemp)
      helping out?

      Why should ECKists think that they are more advanced
      (higher), or have had karma removed when there is
      no indication of this beyond what a normal non-ECKist
      experiences! Is there any indication that karma has ever
      been removed by Klemp? It's all a promise of what is to
      come "after" this life. This is typical of any religion.
      Everyone has dream experiences, and many other non-
      ECKists do visualizations (as their own Master) greater
      than and "higher" than what ECKANKAR teaches!

      The Mahanta can't even heal a 7th Initiate of Cancer!
      Who, then, qualifies for "protection" and to have Karmic
      "effects" removed by this Mahanta! There is simply no
      "proof" other than via the mind's imaginings due to
      expectation, desire, and mistakes-in-identity with
      pre-Eckankar experiences of seeing EK Masters. Others
      have the same, and better, "amazing stories" too!

      Yes, the Klemps and some staffers at the ESC read
      this site, as well as, HU-Chat and Chela-Chat.

      Stever reports to his RESA and to the person over
      Public Information at the ESC. It was John G. at one
      time. These people report to Joan who reports to H.K.
      Klemp doesn't seem to care about what happens on
      the official "unofficial" ECKANKAR Sites. It's no wonder
      that many ECKists have pulled back from the outer
      EK org. As long as ECKists put in the time (service)
      and money (coin) and make friends with those who
      approve of one's nomination for pink slip or position
      it's all good... it it makes one feel needed, important,
      and more advanced than other ECKists! The busy EK
      work, also, keeps one from thinking too much. The
      "Leap of Faith" concept works well here!

      Many ECKists have just given up posting on the EK
      sites... why take the chance of being attacked or insulted.
      Why go to the Local ECK Center when they just look
      down upon you, talk over you, or correct you as
      though their higher initiation means they "know" more
      spiritually! How arrogant and unloving while other
      H.I.s are fearful to say anything, or are very passive
      and don't care at all!

      Basically, the whole of the ECKANKAR Corp/Church
      is screwed up due to H.K. and there's no one to fix it!
      This is why many long-time ECKists have quit caring,
      don't follow the Guidelines, and are pissed off! They
      aren't to the point of quitting, but at the point of not
      caring all that much. They remain ECKists because of
      the old friendships that have formed, and because they
      have more in common (the EK dogma, etc.) with ECKists.
      It's become a social club of sorts with certain ones
      barking orders while puffing up their chicken feathers.

      What ever happened to Klemp's story with the H.I. FOXes
      in the EK Hen House? Why even mention something if
      you're not going to take action? People in high positions
      do this because it gives others the impression that you
      care and that you are paying attention to things. It's all for
      show and becomes a feeble attempt at having empathy.
      There was really no plan to take action... it was all talk
      and for show in order to quiet the troops. I've seen this
      same tactic taken in business. Everyone has an opportunity
      to get it off their chest, to unload verbally, emotionally,
      and mentally. It's all talk! Afterwards, it's business as
      usual! Nothing has changed! Except, all of the "trouble
      makers" (whistle blowers) have now been identified.

      It's obvious that Klemp was untruthful when he gave
      ECKists the impression that he cared and was going to
      do something about the Negative Vahana ECKists (H.I.
      Leaders) on the Internet and in the Local ECK Centers.
      These "H.I. FOXES" continue to prove that ECKANKAR
      and their Mahanta have NO Special Spiritual Powers
      or Authority. It's all fiction... like Harry Potter!


      Elizabeth wrote:
      No one is higher than another! H.I.'s are no better or higher than a new
      student in eck... The only difference is, they have developed quite an ego
      from being perched on their self made pedestals. Their behavior is pompous
      and lacks love and respect! The further up the Klempankar ladder, the more
      arrogant and patronizing they become! And since when has Mark A become
      Klemp's talking head anyway? Now he feels he is high enough he can speak
      FOR Klemp?
      BTW, Klempankar does have people sitting in their ESC offices reading from
      the eck and ex eck chat groups... BUT, they are not responsible for the
      comments made by their lunatic H.I.s on Hu-chat or Chela-chat. Recall that
      these two chat groups (and others based on eckankar) have disclaimers,
      strictly enforced by the Klempankar police like Steve R, not to claim they
      speak for Klemp, the Mahanta or Klempankar....
      And let's not forget the Klempankar big shot attorneys that advise this rip
      off , plagiarized religion on how to just fly under the radar for a non
      profit religion, and stay legal.
      > -------Original Message-------
      From: prometheus
      Where's Harry, Joan, & Marge Klemp?
      > Doesn't Mr. Mahanta, or Joan, or Marge know or
      > care what's happening on these ECKANKAR
      > "unofficially" sponsored sites (HU-Chat & Chela-
      > Chat)? Don't the Klemps' know or care about
      > the negative behaviour of H.I. EK Vahanas, and
      > what they are saying to one another? Isn't the
      > H.I. Leadership Book required Training for
      > Vahanas (explorers) and settlers? Does anyone
      > Enforce conduct ("effect") within the EK Church?
      > I guess Not! But, Why Not? Afterall, Graham got
      > Punished (demoted) for sharing a dream experience
      > with just a few people (including H.K.). These negative
      > EK Vahanas are sharing their vile on the INTERNET!
      > Linda (MettaHu) volunteers at the Temple of ECK!
      > Steve R. is involved with EK Public Information!
      > Mark A. is having Marge Klemp stay at his house
      > While she's in town for an EK Workshop!
      > These Three (let alone others like Cheryl G.) are
      > Nasty and unloving people... without being ECKists!
      > Isn't there supposed to be a "higher" standard
      > (result) that is represented by a "higher" consciousness!
      > Where is it then! After all of these years and higher
      > Initiations... it's NO Where to be seen or heard!
      > Does Marge Klemp really want to stay in a house
      > (Mark's) that is full of negative emotions before giving
      > an ECK Workshop... I wouldn't want to take the chance
      > with those negative "effects!" What message is Marge
      > Conveying to other ECKists... that Mark's continued
      > Negativity is okay... with no repercussions? Where's
      > her ex... Harry? Is he tuned out to Mark's consciousness?
      > Stever is always nervously jumping in (on HU-Chat)
      > to "balance" or smooth things out... in a most spiritually
      > Immature manner. Spam anyone? But, don't trust him!
      > He's such a gossip! Never tell him anything that you don't
      > Want your RESA or the ESC to know as well! And, he's a
      > Real ladder climber hungry for RESA status.
      > BTW- It seems that Linda does some "skimming" too!
      > What about "consciousness" and "love" (etc.) mentioned
      > in the 12/2007 Mystic World and Wisdom Notes by H.K.
      > Her message to Gaby doesn't sound very loving or that
      > There is any higher consciousness than a zERO initiate
      > Would have! How insulting and KAL like to say "Dear
      > Heart" and then attack her by putting her down! How
      > Spiritually immature! Linda sounds like a 1st initiate!
      > Actually, this is a perfect example of real "ECK love!"
      > Linda (MettaHu):
      > "Gaby, dear heart, I was teasing you a little bit,
      > but of course you insist on taking this too
      > Personally. You admitted that you only skimmed
      > The posts - that means you didn't really read them
      > Carefully, but you were complaining about them,
      > Anyway. If you had said that you read the posts
      > By Mark, Steve, Michael and myself carefully and
      > Thoughtfully, I might take your complaints more
      > Seriously, but since you skimmed the posts, I am
      > "skimming" your comments about them, too.
      > That's fair.
      > ECK love, Linda,"
      > Prometheus
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