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Some EK Tidbits

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  • prometheus_973
    Lotus of the Fiery Light. Crown Chakra; set of Ten Laws the seeker of God must understand before going into the ANAMI LOK; the golden Light which is Never
    Message 1 of 6 , Dec 13, 2007
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      "Lotus of the Fiery Light. Crown Chakra; set of Ten Laws
      the seeker of God must understand before going into the
      ANAMI LOK; the golden Light which is Never Manifested;
      the Formless and Silent." [Eckankar Lexicon, pg. 126]

      ME: Isn't it strange that one goes from the Astral "Crown"
      Chakra [pg.39] to the Highest (10th) Plane, Anami Lok,
      where the SUGMAD resides?

      Why does Klemp still teach chelas the lower Tisra Til
      Chakra? Where's the evolution in the ECK teachings
      after 25 years with Klemp?

      And, Why does the SUGMAD reside on the Anami Lok [pg.9],
      or 10th Plane, when Klemp claims he is on a Higher Plane...
      the 14th? Why isn't HK being more responsible to his chelas?
      He should be working for them Not vice versa! That's his job!

      ****************************************************************

      FYI:
      We alone are responsible for our spiritual life, and our
      material beingness. A (real) master will tell you what and
      how to do the right things with the proper techniques,
      but he always leaves the doing to the individual. Since
      Soul is the final step in one's becomingness, then it is up
      to Soul to create its own course of action to the ultimate
      peak of all things, God.

      Nobody can do it for you. If Soul is the effect of something,
      then It must always change this, take the initiative and become
      cause. That and that alone! Soul can always be cause, can
      take care of Itself. Of course, It can be effect, but It must be
      Knowing effect, never unknowing.

      Soul must always look at life this way. Naturally we are the
      effect of the most of life, constantly, but to be effect, unknowingly,
      is a step backwards for Soul's evolution.

      We can say that Spirit is actually that great sound current
      which Soul rides upon in Its return journey to Its true Home.
      However, Soul must be in control of Its own destiny whether
      under the (supposed) protection of a Master or of God. This
      is always true, and of course, Soul is God, ITSELF!

      Prometheus
    • Non ekster
      This post kind of freaks me out. It comes across as eckankarish, sort of like eck master talk. I m sorry, but it just seems too Grandiose, imo. I prefer a more
      Message 2 of 6 , Dec 14, 2007
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        This post kind of freaks me out. It comes across as eckankarish, sort
        of like eck master talk. I'm sorry, but it just seems too Grandiose,
        imo. I prefer a more down to earth "spirtuality" grounded in the
        ordinary, or shall we say the extra ordinary. It's the Grandiose that
        finally drove me from eckankarp and I must admit it bothers me to see
        the same type of Grandiose claims outside of eckankar. Just my
        opinion, for what it's worth.

        Nonekster ; )

        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
        <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
        >
        "Lotus of the Fiery Light. Crown Chakra; set of Ten Laws
        the seeker of God must understand before going into the
        ANAMI LOK; the golden Light which is Never Manifested;
        the Formless and Silent." [Eckankar Lexicon, pg. 126]

        ME: Isn't it strange that one goes from the Astral "Crown"
        Chakra [pg.39] to the Highest (10th) Plane, Anami Lok,
        where the SUGMAD resides?

        Why does Klemp still teach chelas the lower Tisra Til
        Chakra? Where's the evolution in the ECK teachings
        after 25 years with Klemp?

        And, Why does the SUGMAD reside on the Anami Lok [pg.9],
        or 10th Plane, when Klemp claims he is on a Higher Plane...
        the 14th? Why isn't HK being more responsible to his chelas?
        He should be working for them Not vice versa! That's his job!

        ****************************************************************

        FYI:
        We alone are responsible for our spiritual life, and our
        material beingness. A (real) master will tell you what and
        how to do the right things with the proper techniques,
        but he always leaves the doing to the individual. Since
        Soul is the final step in one's becomingness, then it is up
        to Soul to create its own course of action to the ultimate
        peak of all things, God.

        Nobody can do it for you. If Soul is the effect of something,
        then It must always change this, take the initiative and become
        cause. That and that alone! Soul can always be cause, can
        take care of Itself. Of course, It can be effect, but It must be
        Knowing effect, never unknowing.

        Soul must always look at life this way. Naturally we are the
        effect of the most of life, constantly, but to be effect, unknowingly,
        is a step backwards for Soul's evolution.

        We can say that Spirit is actually that great sound current
        which Soul rides upon in Its return journey to Its true Home.
        However, Soul must be in control of Its own destiny whether
        under the (supposed) protection of a Master or of God. This
        is always true, and of course, Soul is God, ITSELF!

        Prometheus
      • prometheus_973
        Hi Non-ekster, In regard to the FYI comments: Well, I m not so sure if I agree that it s all that Grandiose in it s current form compared to what it was in
        Message 3 of 6 , Dec 14, 2007
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          Hi Non-ekster,
          In regard to the "FYI" comments:
          Well, I'm not so sure if I agree that it's all that
          "Grandiose" in it's current form compared to
          what it was in its original form! I did tone it
          down some via paraphrasing. I, also, paraphrased
          it some to make it sound somewhat less Eckie
          than it was in the original plagiarized/paraphrased
          form that Twitchell used in "The Flute of God"
          page 13. But, it is ECKie, although, what was said
          is also how Radhasoami and Ruhani Satsang and
          certain other religions see things as well.

          I'm thinking that the dogma from these other
          belief systems were the original sources of the
          comments that Twit used as he paraphrased
          and plagiarized "Flute" as well as his other works.
          Paul was never that good of a writer, or master,
          for his work, or himself, to stand on its own merit.
          He needed the assistance of other written sources
          as he pieced together what sounded best.

          I did this in fun and to see how many ECKists
          reading ESA would have a problem with what
          the 1st LEM/Mahanta (Twitchell) had to say by
          thinking they were my words. It's natural that
          a former ECKist would have a problem with it
          and recognize it as eckancrap!

          Hope you didn't mind the humor behind it.

          Prometheus

          p.s. As far as the EK Lexicon's Crown Chakra,
          "Lotus of the Fiery Light," [p.126] to reach the
          Anami Lok... that's more Radhasoami and Ruhani
          Satsang belief too! ECKists can't see this either!
          BTW "Sahasra-dal-Kanwal" can be found on page
          179 of the EK Lexicon and on pages 259, 445,
          and 530 of "The Path of the Masters."

          **********************************************
          Non ekster wrote:
          >
          > This post kind of freaks me out. It comes across as eckankarish, sort
          > of like eck master talk. I'm sorry, but it just seems too Grandiose,
          > imo. I prefer a more down to earth "spirtuality" grounded in the
          > ordinary, or shall we say the extra ordinary. It's the Grandiose that
          > finally drove me from eckankarp and I must admit it bothers me to see
          > the same type of Grandiose claims outside of eckankar. Just my
          > opinion, for what it's worth.
          >
          > Nonekster ; )
          >
          prometheus wrote:
          > >
          > "Lotus of the Fiery Light. Crown Chakra; set of Ten Laws
          > the seeker of God must understand before going into the
          > ANAMI LOK; the golden Light which is Never Manifested;
          > the Formless and Silent." [Eckankar Lexicon, pg. 126]
          >
          > ME: Isn't it strange that one goes from the Astral "Crown"
          > Chakra [pg.39] to the Highest (10th) Plane, Anami Lok,
          > where the SUGMAD resides?
          >
          > Why does Klemp still teach chelas the lower Tisra Til
          > Chakra? Where's the evolution in the ECK teachings
          > after 25 years with Klemp?
          >
          > And, Why does the SUGMAD reside on the Anami Lok [pg.9],
          > or 10th Plane, when Klemp claims he is on a Higher Plane...
          > the 14th? Why isn't HK being more responsible to his chelas?
          > He should be working for them Not vice versa! That's his job!
          >
          > ****************************************************************
          >
          > FYI:
          > We alone are responsible for our spiritual life, and our
          > material beingness. A (real) master will tell you what and
          > how to do the right things with the proper techniques,
          > but he always leaves the doing to the individual. Since
          > Soul is the final step in one's becomingness, then it is up
          > to Soul to create its own course of action to the ultimate
          > peak of all things, God.
          >
          > Nobody can do it for you. If Soul is the effect of something,
          > then It must always change this, take the initiative and become
          > cause. That and that alone! Soul can always be cause, can
          > take care of Itself. Of course, It can be effect, but It must be
          > Knowing effect, never unknowing.
          >
          > Soul must always look at life this way. Naturally we are the
          > effect of the most of life, constantly, but to be effect, unknowingly,
          > is a step backwards for Soul's evolution.
          >
          > We can say that Spirit is actually that great sound current
          > which Soul rides upon in Its return journey to Its true Home.
          > However, Soul must be in control of Its own destiny whether
          > under the (supposed) protection of a Master or of God. This
          > is always true, and of course, Soul is God, ITSELF!
          >
          > Prometheus
          >
        • Non ekster
          Oh, silly me. I guess I didn t realize that you were making a joke. It s sometimes difficult to see that in writing, especially if there is no LOL or : ).
          Message 4 of 6 , Dec 14, 2007
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            Oh, silly me. I guess I didn't realize that you were making a joke.
            It's sometimes difficult to see that in writing, especially if there
            is no LOL or : ).

            HOwever, I have come across many individuals over the years who do
            make rather Grandiose claims in the name of religious or spiritual
            Ideology, and I have yet to meet one who could live up to their own
            extreme expectations. If SOUL is really the strongest power in the
            Universe, then it would seem that there would be many super human acts
            being demonstrated all the time. Instead, what we see, at its best, is
            the ability to overcome cancer or have it go into remission. The stem
            cells we do have in our bodies are pretty amazing at being able to
            mend torn skin tissue or even some internal organs. Even the brain,
            apparently, is much more plastic than once was previously thought. But
            the lowly salamander has us beat in this category, yet still
            eventually dies. They can grow a whole limb back if it gets chopped
            off by some scientist. lol

            Most of us as we age still have a lot of problems overcoming something
            as simple as the effects of gravity. : )

            Nonekster ; )

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
            <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
            >
            Re: Some EK Tidbits

            Hi Non-ekster,
            In regard to the "FYI" comments:
            Well, I'm not so sure if I agree that it's all that
            "Grandiose" in it's current form compared to
            what it was in its original form! I did tone it
            down some via paraphrasing. I, also, paraphrased
            it some to make it sound somewhat less Eckie
            than it was in the original plagiarized/paraphrased
            form that Twitchell used in "The Flute of God"
            page 13. But, it is ECKie, although, what was said
            is also how Radhasoami and Ruhani Satsang and
            certain other religions see things as well.

            I'm thinking that the dogma from these other
            belief systems were the original sources of the
            comments that Twit used as he paraphrased
            and plagiarized "Flute" as well as his other works.
            Paul was never that good of a writer, or master,
            for his work, or himself, to stand on its own merit.
            He needed the assistance of other written sources
            as he pieced together what sounded best.

            I did this in fun and to see how many ECKists
            reading ESA would have a problem with what
            the 1st LEM/Mahanta (Twitchell) had to say by
            thinking they were my words. It's natural that
            a former ECKist would have a problem with it
            and recognize it as eckancrap!

            Hope you didn't mind the humor behind it.

            Prometheus

            p.s. As far as the EK Lexicon's Crown Chakra,
            "Lotus of the Fiery Light," [p.126] to reach the
            Anami Lok... that's more Radhasoami and Ruhani
            Satsang belief too! ECKists can't see this either!
            BTW "Sahasra-dal-Kanwal" can be found on page
            179 of the EK Lexicon and on pages 259, 445,
            and 530 of "The Path of the Masters."

            **********************************************
            Non ekster wrote:
            >
            > This post kind of freaks me out. It comes across as eckankarish, sort
            > of like eck master talk. I'm sorry, but it just seems too Grandiose,
            > imo. I prefer a more down to earth "spirtuality" grounded in the
            > ordinary, or shall we say the extra ordinary. It's the Grandiose that
            > finally drove me from eckankarp and I must admit it bothers me to see
            > the same type of Grandiose claims outside of eckankar. Just my
            > opinion, for what it's worth.
            >
            > Nonekster ; )
            >
            prometheus wrote:
            > >
            > "Lotus of the Fiery Light. Crown Chakra; set of Ten Laws
            > the seeker of God must understand before going into the
            > ANAMI LOK; the golden Light which is Never Manifested;
            > the Formless and Silent." [Eckankar Lexicon, pg. 126]
            >
            > ME: Isn't it strange that one goes from the Astral "Crown"
            > Chakra [pg.39] to the Highest (10th) Plane, Anami Lok,
            > where the SUGMAD resides?
            >
            > Why does Klemp still teach chelas the lower Tisra Til
            > Chakra? Where's the evolution in the ECK teachings
            > after 25 years with Klemp?
            >
            > And, Why does the SUGMAD reside on the Anami Lok [pg.9],
            > or 10th Plane, when Klemp claims he is on a Higher Plane...
            > the 14th? Why isn't HK being more responsible to his chelas?
            > He should be working for them Not vice versa! That's his job!
            >
            > ****************************************************************
            >
            > FYI:
            > We alone are responsible for our spiritual life, and our
            > material beingness. A (real) master will tell you what and
            > how to do the right things with the proper techniques,
            > but he always leaves the doing to the individual. Since
            > Soul is the final step in one's becomingness, then it is up
            > to Soul to create its own course of action to the ultimate
            > peak of all things, God.
            >
            > Nobody can do it for you. If Soul is the effect of something,
            > then It must always change this, take the initiative and become
            > cause. That and that alone! Soul can always be cause, can
            > take care of Itself. Of course, It can be effect, but It must be
            > Knowing effect, never unknowing.
            >
            > Soul must always look at life this way. Naturally we are the
            > effect of the most of life, constantly, but to be effect, unknowingly,
            > is a step backwards for Soul's evolution.
            >
            > We can say that Spirit is actually that great sound current
            > which Soul rides upon in Its return journey to Its true Home.
            > However, Soul must be in control of Its own destiny whether
            > under the (supposed) protection of a Master or of God. This
            > is always true, and of course, Soul is God, ITSELF!
            >
            > Prometheus
            >
          • prometheus_973
            Hi Non-eckster and All, What I really found interesting with the Flute quote was PT saying that Soul is God, ITSELF. Twitchell must have made some changes
            Message 5 of 6 , Dec 14, 2007
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              Hi Non-eckster and All,
              What I really found interesting with the "Flute" quote
              was PT saying that "Soul is God, ITSELF."

              Twitchell must have made some changes and tweaked his
              new religious belief system after writing The Flute of God.
              The ECK dogma now states, "SOUL IS A SPARK OF GOD."

              PT: "Soul must be in control of Its own destiny whether
              under the protection of the Master or of God. This is
              always true, and of course, Soul is God, ITSELF!" [pg.13]

              Also, I find it interesting that Twitchell is saying that
              Soul is EITHER under the protection of the Master or
              of God and, therefore, Does Not Need the/a Master...
              only God... except Soul is God! So, It only needs "ITSELF!"

              "Soul must be in control of Its own destiny," therefore,
              Soul can go straight to the source and avoid the Middleman/
              Master and the annual membership donation ($) and the
              rest of the egos' game playing!

              BTW- Sorry I freaked you out! LOL!

              Prometheus


              Non ekster wrote:
              >
              > Oh, silly me. I guess I didn't realize that you were making a joke.
              > It's sometimes difficult to see that in writing, especially if there
              > is no LOL or : ).
              >
              > HOwever, I have come across many individuals over the years who do
              > make rather Grandiose claims in the name of religious or spiritual
              > Ideology, and I have yet to meet one who could live up to their own
              > extreme expectations. If SOUL is really the strongest power in the
              > Universe, then it would seem that there would be many super human acts
              > being demonstrated all the time. Instead, what we see, at its best, is
              > the ability to overcome cancer or have it go into remission. The stem
              > cells we do have in our bodies are pretty amazing at being able to
              > mend torn skin tissue or even some internal organs. Even the brain,
              > apparently, is much more plastic than once was previously thought. But
              > the lowly salamander has us beat in this category, yet still
              > eventually dies. They can grow a whole limb back if it gets chopped
              > off by some scientist. lol
              >
              > Most of us as we age still have a lot of problems overcoming something
              > as simple as the effects of gravity. : )
              >
              > Nonekster ; )
              >
              > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
              > <prometheus_973@> wrote:
              > >
              > Re: Some EK Tidbits
              >
              > Hi Non-ekster,
              > In regard to the "FYI" comments:
              > Well, I'm not so sure if I agree that it's all that
              > "Grandiose" in it's current form compared to
              > what it was in its original form! I did tone it
              > down some via paraphrasing. I, also, paraphrased
              > it some to make it sound somewhat less Eckie
              > than it was in the original plagiarized/paraphrased
              > form that Twitchell used in "The Flute of God"
              > page 13. But, it is ECKie, although, what was said
              > is also how Radhasoami and Ruhani Satsang and
              > certain other religions see things as well.
              >
              > I'm thinking that the dogma from these other
              > belief systems were the original sources of the
              > comments that Twit used as he paraphrased
              > and plagiarized "Flute" as well as his other works.
              > Paul was never that good of a writer, or master,
              > for his work, or himself, to stand on its own merit.
              > He needed the assistance of other written sources
              > as he pieced together what sounded best.
              >
              > I did this in fun and to see how many ECKists
              > reading ESA would have a problem with what
              > the 1st LEM/Mahanta (Twitchell) had to say by
              > thinking they were my words. It's natural that
              > a former ECKist would have a problem with it
              > and recognize it as eckancrap!
              >
              > Hope you didn't mind the humor behind it.
              >
              > Prometheus
              >
              > p.s. As far as the EK Lexicon's Crown Chakra,
              > "Lotus of the Fiery Light," [p.126] to reach the
              > Anami Lok... that's more Radhasoami and Ruhani
              > Satsang belief too! ECKists can't see this either!
              > BTW "Sahasra-dal-Kanwal" can be found on page
              > 179 of the EK Lexicon and on pages 259, 445,
              > and 530 of "The Path of the Masters."
              >
              > **********************************************
              > Non ekster wrote:
              > >
              > > This post kind of freaks me out. It comes across as eckankarish, sort
              > > of like eck master talk. I'm sorry, but it just seems too Grandiose,
              > > imo. I prefer a more down to earth "spirtuality" grounded in the
              > > ordinary, or shall we say the extra ordinary. It's the Grandiose that
              > > finally drove me from eckankarp and I must admit it bothers me to see
              > > the same type of Grandiose claims outside of eckankar. Just my
              > > opinion, for what it's worth.
              > >
              > > Nonekster ; )
              > >
              > prometheus wrote:
              > > >
              > > "Lotus of the Fiery Light. Crown Chakra; set of Ten Laws
              > > the seeker of God must understand before going into the
              > > ANAMI LOK; the golden Light which is Never Manifested;
              > > the Formless and Silent." [Eckankar Lexicon, pg. 126]
              > >
              > > ME: Isn't it strange that one goes from the Astral "Crown"
              > > Chakra [pg.39] to the Highest (10th) Plane, Anami Lok,
              > > where the SUGMAD resides?
              > >
              > > Why does Klemp still teach chelas the lower Tisra Til
              > > Chakra? Where's the evolution in the ECK teachings
              > > after 25 years with Klemp?
              > >
              > > And, Why does the SUGMAD reside on the Anami Lok [pg.9],
              > > or 10th Plane, when Klemp claims he is on a Higher Plane...
              > > the 14th? Why isn't HK being more responsible to his chelas?
              > > He should be working for them Not vice versa! That's his job!
              > >
              > > ****************************************************************
              > >
              > > FYI:
              > > We alone are responsible for our spiritual life, and our
              > > material beingness. A (real) master will tell you what and
              > > how to do the right things with the proper techniques,
              > > but he always leaves the doing to the individual. Since
              > > Soul is the final step in one's becomingness, then it is up
              > > to Soul to create its own course of action to the ultimate
              > > peak of all things, God.
              > >
              > > Nobody can do it for you. If Soul is the effect of something,
              > > then It must always change this, take the initiative and become
              > > cause. That and that alone! Soul can always be cause, can
              > > take care of Itself. Of course, It can be effect, but It must be
              > > Knowing effect, never unknowing.
              > >
              > > Soul must always look at life this way. Naturally we are the
              > > effect of the most of life, constantly, but to be effect, unknowingly,
              > > is a step backwards for Soul's evolution.
              > >
              > > We can say that Spirit is actually that great sound current
              > > which Soul rides upon in Its return journey to Its true Home.
              > > However, Soul must be in control of Its own destiny whether
              > > under the (supposed) protection of a Master or of God. This
              > > is always true, and of course, Soul is God, ITSELF!
              > >
              > > Prometheus
              > >
              >
            • prometheus_973
              HI All, Twitchell says many things in Flute of God that he needed to backtrack upon and tweak later in order to change the direction of ECKANKAR. EK,
              Message 6 of 6 , Dec 17, 2007
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                HI All,
                Twitchell says many things in "Flute of God"
                that he needed to backtrack upon and "tweak"
                later in order to "change" the direction of ECKANKAR.

                EK, PT's new vocation and long term retirement
                plan, needed to resemble other typically "on-going"
                religions whereby a "Master" is always needed by
                the followers. The need for "Initiations" keeps
                people in line and (ironically) always desiring more.
                This "dangling carrot" of desire is a spiritual Catch-22
                which works very well with any scam religious or not!

                If one always uses a crutch (needing a "master") how
                will they ever be able to walk on their own? Without
                self-intervention the continued mental/psychological
                reenforcement of dogma can become a convenient tool
                for more dependency and irresponsibility. As PT stated
                early on, Soul needs to take ownership as Cause... as God,
                ITSELF!

                The copyright for "The Flute of God" is 1969 and
                the 1st printing was 1970. Many edits (more tweaking)
                came afterwards.

                It is interesting to note that the 1960's brought
                forth a renewed interest in Eastern Religious thought
                along with a new drug era with the use of LSD. Guru
                Ram Dass and others used LSD to explore their own
                spirituality. Ram Dass was a student of Meher Baba
                (as was Twitchell at one time). Ram Dass also wrote
                a book in 1971 titled "Be Here Now" and stated "Just Be."

                Anyway, here are more quotes by Twitchell from The
                Flute of God:

                "So the whole Truth, IS. And nothing more. It is that
                WE MUST FIND OUR OWN WAY TO GOD. THERE IS NO
                TEACHER, LIVING OR PAST, WHO CAN GIVE US THE
                ACTUAL UNDERSTANDING OF TRUTH.

                A TEACHER CAN ONLY PUT OUR FEET ON THE PATH
                AND POINT THE WAY. THAT IS ALL. IT IS WHOLLY
                DEPENDENT ON THE INDIVIDUAL TO MAKE HIS WAY
                TO TRUTH...

                WE ARE EACH GOD, ITSELF. RATHER THAN JUST A
                PART OF THE GREAT WHOLE OF TRUTH... JUST BE!

                ... we are never there, but always HERE, NOW. HERE
                and NOW put us in the present moment. Nothing
                should be projected into space or into the FUTURE."
                [pg. 14]

                So, why is it that these long-time ECKists STILL need
                ECKANKAR? If they want to be Cause or to donate time
                and money and their "truth" then why do they need
                either ECKANKAR or Klemp?

                AH! They need to keep that EK membership card up-
                to-date ($) in order to be eligible for even MORE initiations...
                in the FUTURE! Plus, it feels good, safe, and secure to
                have a "high" initiation number written on an "exclusive"
                membership club card! Whoopee!

                With Klemp it's all about "love" versus LOVE as he claims
                he "heals, enlightens, and inspires." But, if he "protected"
                EK Chelas in the first place Why would he need to "heal"
                them?

                And Klemp still teaches the old Astral (6th Chakra)
                Spiritual Eye technique while ECKists seem oblivious!
                Perhaps Klemp, the Black Magician, continues to
                "enchant" these ECKists!


                Prometheus


                > prometheus wrote:
                > >
                > > Hi Non-eckster and All,
                > > What I really found interesting with the "Flute" quote
                > > was PT saying that "Soul is God, ITSELF."
                > >
                > > Twitchell must have made some changes and tweaked his
                > > new religious belief system after writing The Flute of God.
                > > The ECK dogma now states, "SOUL IS A SPARK OF GOD."
                > >
                > > PT: "Soul must be in control of Its own destiny whether
                > > under the protection of the Master or of God. This is
                > > always true, and of course, Soul is God, ITSELF!" [pg.13]
                > >
                > > Also, I find it interesting that Twitchell is saying that
                > > Soul is EITHER under the protection of the Master or
                > > of God and, therefore, Does Not Need the/a Master...
                > > only God... except Soul is God! So, It only needs "ITSELF!"
                > >
                > > "Soul must be in control of Its own destiny," therefore,
                > > Soul can go straight to the source and avoid the Middleman/
                > > Master and the annual membership donation ($) and the
                > > rest of the egos' game playing!
                > >
                > > BTW- Sorry I freaked you out! LOL!
                > >
                > > Prometheus
                > >
                > >
                > > Non ekster wrote:
                > > >
                > > > Oh, silly me. I guess I didn't realize that you were making a joke.
                > > > It's sometimes difficult to see that in writing, especially if there
                > > > is no LOL or : ).
                > > >
                > > > HOwever, I have come across many individuals over the years who do
                > > > make rather Grandiose claims in the name of religious or spiritual
                > > > Ideology, and I have yet to meet one who could live up to their own
                > > > extreme expectations. If SOUL is really the strongest power in the
                > > > Universe, then it would seem that there would be many super human acts
                > > > being demonstrated all the time. Instead, what we see, at its best, is
                > > > the ability to overcome cancer or have it go into remission. The stem
                > > > cells we do have in our bodies are pretty amazing at being able to
                > > > mend torn skin tissue or even some internal organs. Even the brain,
                > > > apparently, is much more plastic than once was previously thought. But
                > > > the lowly salamander has us beat in this category, yet still
                > > > eventually dies. They can grow a whole limb back if it gets chopped
                > > > off by some scientist. lol
                > > >
                > > > Most of us as we age still have a lot of problems overcoming something
                > > > as simple as the effects of gravity. : )
                > > >
                > > > Nonekster ; )
                > > >
                > > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
                > > > <prometheus_973@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > Re: Some EK Tidbits
                > > >
                > > > Hi Non-ekster,
                > > > In regard to the "FYI" comments:
                > > > Well, I'm not so sure if I agree that it's all that
                > > > "Grandiose" in it's current form compared to
                > > > what it was in its original form! I did tone it
                > > > down some via paraphrasing. I, also, paraphrased
                > > > it some to make it sound somewhat less Eckie
                > > > than it was in the original plagiarized/paraphrased
                > > > form that Twitchell used in "The Flute of God"
                > > > page 13. But, it is ECKie, although, what was said
                > > > is also how Radhasoami and Ruhani Satsang and
                > > > certain other religions see things as well.
                > > >
                > > > I'm thinking that the dogma from these other
                > > > belief systems were the original sources of the
                > > > comments that Twit used as he paraphrased
                > > > and plagiarized "Flute" as well as his other works.
                > > > Paul was never that good of a writer, or master,
                > > > for his work, or himself, to stand on its own merit.
                > > > He needed the assistance of other written sources
                > > > as he pieced together what sounded best.
                > > >
                > > > I did this in fun and to see how many ECKists
                > > > reading ESA would have a problem with what
                > > > the 1st LEM/Mahanta (Twitchell) had to say by
                > > > thinking they were my words. It's natural that
                > > > a former ECKist would have a problem with it
                > > > and recognize it as eckancrap!
                > > >
                > > > Hope you didn't mind the humor behind it.
                > > >
                > > > Prometheus
                > > >
                > > > p.s. As far as the EK Lexicon's Crown Chakra,
                > > > "Lotus of the Fiery Light," [p.126] to reach the
                > > > Anami Lok... that's more Radhasoami and Ruhani
                > > > Satsang belief too! ECKists can't see this either!
                > > > BTW "Sahasra-dal-Kanwal" can be found on page
                > > > 179 of the EK Lexicon and on pages 259, 445,
                > > > and 530 of "The Path of the Masters."
                > > >
                > > > **********************************************
                > > > Non ekster wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > This post kind of freaks me out. It comes across as eckankarish, sort
                > > > > of like eck master talk. I'm sorry, but it just seems too Grandiose,
                > > > > imo. I prefer a more down to earth "spirtuality" grounded in the
                > > > > ordinary, or shall we say the extra ordinary. It's the Grandiose that
                > > > > finally drove me from eckankarp and I must admit it bothers me to see
                > > > > the same type of Grandiose claims outside of eckankar. Just my
                > > > > opinion, for what it's worth.
                > > > >
                > > > > Nonekster ; )
                > > > >
                > > > prometheus wrote:
                > > > > >
                > > > > "Lotus of the Fiery Light. Crown Chakra; set of Ten Laws
                > > > > the seeker of God must understand before going into the
                > > > > ANAMI LOK; the golden Light which is Never Manifested;
                > > > > the Formless and Silent." [Eckankar Lexicon, pg. 126]
                > > > >
                > > > > ME: Isn't it strange that one goes from the Astral "Crown"
                > > > > Chakra [pg.39] to the Highest (10th) Plane, Anami Lok,
                > > > > where the SUGMAD resides?
                > > > >
                > > > > Why does Klemp still teach chelas the lower Tisra Til
                > > > > Chakra? Where's the evolution in the ECK teachings
                > > > > after 25 years with Klemp?
                > > > >
                > > > > And, Why does the SUGMAD reside on the Anami Lok [pg.9],
                > > > > or 10th Plane, when Klemp claims he is on a Higher Plane...
                > > > > the 14th? Why isn't HK being more responsible to his chelas?
                > > > > He should be working for them Not vice versa! That's his job!
                > > > >
                > > > > ****************************************************************
                > > > >
                > > > > FYI:
                > > > > We alone are responsible for our spiritual life, and our
                > > > > material beingness. A (real) master will tell you what and
                > > > > how to do the right things with the proper techniques,
                > > > > but he always leaves the doing to the individual. Since
                > > > > Soul is the final step in one's becomingness, then it is up
                > > > > to Soul to create its own course of action to the ultimate
                > > > > peak of all things, God.
                > > > >
                > > > > Nobody can do it for you. If Soul is the effect of something,
                > > > > then It must always change this, take the initiative and become
                > > > > cause. That and that alone! Soul can always be cause, can
                > > > > take care of Itself. Of course, It can be effect, but It must be
                > > > > Knowing effect, never unknowing.
                > > > >
                > > > > Soul must always look at life this way. Naturally we are the
                > > > > effect of the most of life, constantly, but to be effect, unknowingly,
                > > > > is a step backwards for Soul's evolution.
                > > > >
                > > > > We can say that Spirit is actually that great sound current
                > > > > which Soul rides upon in Its return journey to Its true Home.
                > > > > However, Soul must be in control of Its own destiny whether
                > > > > under the (supposed) protection of a Master or of God. This
                > > > > is always true, and of course, Soul is God, ITSELF!
                > > > >
                > > > > Prometheus
                > > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >
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