Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Fwd: HK/Eckankar Continues to Rewrite History!

Expand Messages
  • mishmisha9
    Hi, All! Happy Columbus Day! : ) In honor of Columbus Day, I am pulling up this post from Jan. 2006 in which I cite HK in his book Those Wonderful ECK
    Message 1 of 7 , Oct 7, 2007
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi, All!

      Happy Columbus Day! : )

      In honor of Columbus Day, I am pulling up this post from
      Jan. 2006 in which I cite HK in his book "Those Wonderful
      ECK Masters" giving credit to Fubbi Quantz for assisting
      Columbus in discovering America. I think it only fitting that
      we remember Fubbi and Klemp when honoring Columbus! LOL!

      Here's the old post that shows how historically incorrect Klemp
      and his org would like his chelas to be:

      --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
      "mishmisha9" <mishmisha9@...> wrote:

      Hi, All!

      I believe eckist parents need to be concerned about what HK/Eckankar
      is teaching in regards to history. From HK's newest book, "Those
      Wonderful Eck Masters," page 87 comes this history lesson:

      "Fubbi Quantz once served as the Mahanta, the Living ECK Master.
      This was during the time of Buddha, around the sixth century BC.
      After completing his mission, he immortalized his body and continues
      to serve the spiritual needs of mankind. He later served as teacher
      of Firdusi, the Persian poet, and was also the spiritual guide of
      Columbus. It was Fubbi Quantz who inspired Columbus to sail to the
      Americas, to open the vast store-house of new sorely needed sources
      of fruits, grains, legumes, vegetables, and especially protein
      there.

      It was then the late fifteenth century. In his travels around
      Europe, Fubbi Quantz had witnessed the appalling health of the
      European people. It was in a shocking state. They had little energy
      left over after a day's work for contemplation or reflection, the
      moment of quiet which is the sweet drink of Soul. So Fubbi Quantz
      gave Columbus a vision one night. In it he showed the potential of
      the New World. This vision fired the imagination of Columbus and
      thus set into motion the events that led him to sail his three tiny
      ships westward into unknown waters. In the Americas, then, European
      explorers found both precious minerals and abundant stores of life-
      giving foods. Thus, Fubbi Quantz revived the food stock and
      nutrition of the Old World."

      I don't know what HK is drinking/smoking these days, but what a
      fairy tale he spins here in his new book! But, in reality, this
      story about the ECK Master Fubbi Quantz clearly shows that this is
      all fakery and lies! LOL!

      But on a very serious note, how can Eckists read this sort of stuff
      and continue to support it? Come on, people, do a reality check and
      get out of that crazy lying cult org!

      What Klemp is really selling is "service." Fubbi is portrayed as
      doing a "service" to mankind, and Klemp wants all eckists now to
      do "service" for the mahanta's mission. However, it seems the Law of
      Noninterference is being overlooked in this fabrication of history.
      Karma, free will, and man's spiritual evolution with that of Soul
      and of Spirit should not be interfered with by fictional eck
      masters, sometimes disguised as angels. LOL!

      Klemp's story about Fubbi is a myth--it's a lie. Every eckist out
      there should be highly embarrassed to have the public reading this
      trash and distortion of historical facts. Fubbi does not exist and
      never did, as evidenced in Klemp's story in "Those Wonderful ECK
      Masters!" This one fresh example indicates the whole of eckankar is
      filled with lies and distortions of truth that any rational person
      cannot overlook. Everything in eckankar needs to be questioned! Sane
      people would view this book as a joke, and shaking their heads, move
      on and away from it as quickly as possible!

      Mish

      --- End forwarded message ---
    • Ed Kusi
      Hi Mish and All, Wasn t it RT who was Colombus guide? I remember reading this in one of PT s books. But of course, its all the old fakery of creating mythical
      Message 2 of 7 , Oct 8, 2007
      • 0 Attachment
        Hi Mish and All,
        Wasn't it RT who was Colombus' guide? I remember reading this in one of PT's books. But of course, its all the old fakery of creating mythical figures and placing them in history as if they existed. The dicey one for Eckankar in this is the elusive Eck Master Sudar Singh whose existence Klempus and his org are still clutching at straws to prove. 
        Happy Columbus Day!
        Pretujari

        mishmisha9 <mishmisha9@...> wrote:

        Hi, All!

        Happy Columbus Day! : )

        In honor of Columbus Day, I am pulling up this post from
        Jan. 2006 in which I cite HK in his book "Those Wonderful
        ECK Masters" giving credit to Fubbi Quantz for assisting
        Columbus in discovering America. I think it only fitting that
        we remember Fubbi and Klemp when honoring Columbus! LOL!

        Here's the old post that shows how historically incorrect Klemp
        and his org would like his chelas to be:

        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAn onymous@yahoogro ups.com
        "mishmisha9" <mishmisha9@ ...> wrote:

        Hi, All!

        I believe eckist parents need to be concerned about what HK/Eckankar
        is teaching in regards to history. From HK's newest book, "Those
        Wonderful Eck Masters," page 87 comes this history lesson:

        "Fubbi Quantz once served as the Mahanta, the Living ECK Master.
        This was during the time of Buddha, around the sixth century BC.
        After completing his mission, he immortalized his body and continues
        to serve the spiritual needs of mankind. He later served as teacher
        of Firdusi, the Persian poet, and was also the spiritual guide of
        Columbus. It was Fubbi Quantz who inspired Columbus to sail to the
        Americas, to open the vast store-house of new sorely needed sources
        of fruits, grains, legumes, vegetables, and especially protein
        there.

        It was then the late fifteenth century. In his travels around
        Europe, Fubbi Quantz had witnessed the appalling health of the
        European people. It was in a shocking state. They had little energy
        left over after a day's work for contemplation or reflection, the
        moment of quiet which is the sweet drink of Soul. So Fubbi Quantz
        gave Columbus a vision one night. In it he showed the potential of
        the New World. This vision fired the imagination of Columbus and
        thus set into motion the events that led him to sail his three tiny
        ships westward into unknown waters. In the Americas, then, European
        explorers found both precious minerals and abundant stores of life-
        giving foods. Thus, Fubbi Quantz revived the food stock and
        nutrition of the Old World."

        I don't know what HK is drinking/smoking these days, but what a
        fairy tale he spins here in his new book! But, in reality, this
        story about the ECK Master Fubbi Quantz clearly shows that this is
        all fakery and lies! LOL!

        But on a very serious note, how can Eckists read this sort of stuff
        and continue to support it? Come on, people, do a reality check and
        get out of that crazy lying cult org!

        What Klemp is really selling is "service." Fubbi is portrayed as
        doing a "service" to mankind, and Klemp wants all eckists now to
        do "service" for the mahanta's mission. However, it seems the Law of
        Noninterference is being overlooked in this fabrication of history.
        Karma, free will, and man's spiritual evolution with that of Soul
        and of Spirit should not be interfered with by fictional eck
        masters, sometimes disguised as angels. LOL!

        Klemp's story about Fubbi is a myth--it's a lie. Every eckist out
        there should be highly embarrassed to have the public reading this
        trash and distortion of historical facts. Fubbi does not exist and
        never did, as evidenced in Klemp's story in "Those Wonderful ECK
        Masters!" This one fresh example indicates the whole of eckankar is
        filled with lies and distortions of truth that any rational person
        cannot overlook. Everything in eckankar needs to be questioned! Sane
        people would view this book as a joke, and shaking their heads, move
        on and away from it as quickly as possible!

        Mish

        --- End forwarded message ---



        Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links.

      • mishmisha9
        Hi, Pretujari! You are correct about Rebazar being claimed as a guide for Columbus. Also, in another post, back in Jan. 2006, I posted this excerpt from
        Message 3 of 7 , Oct 8, 2007
        • 0 Attachment
          Hi, Pretujari!

          You are correct about Rebazar being claimed as a guide for
          Columbus. Also, in another post, back in Jan. 2006, I posted
          this excerpt from Klemp's "Those Wonderful ECK Masters:"

          In the chapter devoted to Rebazar Tarzs, in "Those Wonderful ECK
          Masters," page 95, HK had this comment about Rebazar's connection
          with Columbus:

          "ECK legend, in fact, has it that Rebazar, along with Fubbi Quantz,
          was involved with the inner guidance of Christopher Columbus."

          Interesting that HK uses the term "legend" in regards to this fable
          he and Twitch have made up! : ) (end of re-post excerpt)

          Also, in this later post I corrected the page number for the story
          about Fubbi--it's found on page 27 rather than page 87 in "Those
          Wonderful ECK Masters." I didn't catch that when I had reposted
          the Fubbi post. Sorry for the confusion on that.

          Thanks for your post--nice to see you here again!

          Mish

          --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Ed Kusi
          <pretujari@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi Mish and All,
          > Wasn't it RT who was Colombus' guide? I remember reading this
          in one of PT's books. But of course, its all the old fakery of creating
          mythical figures and placing them in history as if they existed. The
          dicey one for Eckankar in this is the elusive Eck Master Sudar Singh
          whose existence Klempus and his org are still clutching at straws
          to prove.
          > Happy Columbus Day!
          > Pretujari
          >
          > mishmisha9 <mishmisha9@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi, All!
          >
          > Happy Columbus Day! : )
          >
          > In honor of Columbus Day, I am pulling up this post from
          > Jan. 2006 in which I cite HK in his book "Those Wonderful
          > ECK Masters" giving credit to Fubbi Quantz for assisting
          > Columbus in discovering America. I think it only fitting that
          > we remember Fubbi and Klemp when honoring Columbus! LOL!
          >
          > Here's the old post that shows how historically incorrect Klemp
          > and his org would like his chelas to be:
          >
          > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
          > "mishmisha9" <mishmisha9@> wrote:
          >
          > Hi, All!
          >
          > I believe eckist parents need to be concerned about what HK/Eckankar
          > is teaching in regards to history. From HK's newest book, "Those
          > Wonderful Eck Masters," page 27 comes this history lesson:
          >
          > "Fubbi Quantz once served as the Mahanta, the Living ECK Master.
          > This was during the time of Buddha, around the sixth century BC.
          > After completing his mission, he immortalized his body and continues
          > to serve the spiritual needs of mankind. He later served as teacher
          > of Firdusi, the Persian poet, and was also the spiritual guide of
          > Columbus. It was Fubbi Quantz who inspired Columbus to sail to the
          > Americas, to open the vast store-house of new sorely needed sources
          > of fruits, grains, legumes, vegetables, and especially protein
          > there.
          >
          > It was then the late fifteenth century. In his travels around
          > Europe, Fubbi Quantz had witnessed the appalling health of the
          > European people. It was in a shocking state. They had little energy
          > left over after a day's work for contemplation or reflection, the
          > moment of quiet which is the sweet drink of Soul. So Fubbi Quantz
          > gave Columbus a vision one night. In it he showed the potential of
          > the New World. This vision fired the imagination of Columbus and
          > thus set into motion the events that led him to sail his three tiny
          > ships westward into unknown waters. In the Americas, then, European
          > explorers found both precious minerals and abundant stores of life-
          > giving foods. Thus, Fubbi Quantz revived the food stock and
          > nutrition of the Old World."
          >
          > I don't know what HK is drinking/smoking these days, but what a
          > fairy tale he spins here in his new book! But, in reality, this
          > story about the ECK Master Fubbi Quantz clearly shows that this is
          > all fakery and lies! LOL!
          >
          > But on a very serious note, how can Eckists read this sort of stuff
          > and continue to support it? Come on, people, do a reality check and
          > get out of that crazy lying cult org!
          >
          > What Klemp is really selling is "service." Fubbi is portrayed as
          > doing a "service" to mankind, and Klemp wants all eckists now to
          > do "service" for the mahanta's mission. However, it seems the Law of
          > Noninterference is being overlooked in this fabrication of history.
          > Karma, free will, and man's spiritual evolution with that of Soul
          > and of Spirit should not be interfered with by fictional eck
          > masters, sometimes disguised as angels. LOL!
          >
          > Klemp's story about Fubbi is a myth--it's a lie. Every eckist out
          > there should be highly embarrassed to have the public reading this
          > trash and distortion of historical facts. Fubbi does not exist and
          > never did, as evidenced in Klemp's story in "Those Wonderful ECK
          > Masters!" This one fresh example indicates the whole of eckankar is
          > filled with lies and distortions of truth that any rational person
          > cannot overlook. Everything in eckankar needs to be questioned! Sane
          > people would view this book as a joke, and shaking their heads, move
          > on and away from it as quickly as possible!
          >
          > Mish
          >
          > --- End forwarded message ---
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ---------------------------------
          > Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links.
          >
        • prometheus_973
          Legend-A nonhistorical or unverifiable story handed down by tradition from earlier times and popularly accepted as historical. [Random House, Webster s
          Message 4 of 7 , Oct 8, 2007
          • 0 Attachment
            "Legend-A nonhistorical or unverifiable story handed down
            by tradition from earlier times and popularly accepted as
            historical." [Random House, Webster's College Dictionary]

            KLEMP: "ECK legend, in fact, has it has it that Rebazar, along
            with Fubbi Quantz, was involved with the inner guidance of
            Chistopher Columbus." [Those Wonderful ECK Masters, pg.95]

            The earliest this EK legend/myth/lie was handed down is when
            Twitchell first created it! This "in fact" is the real truth.

            Also, notice how vague and wishy-washy Klemp is! Why wouldn't
            the greatest Mahanta ever (HK) be able to travel back into time
            and "see" this inner influence for himself, and then share or verify
            this information (legend) with the public in this book?

            Really! WHY can't HK verify this "LEGEND" with Rebazar and Fubbi
            IF this really did occur?

            Instead, Klemp PLAYS WITH WORDS as he implies that the
            "ECK legend" is "fact." I once saw a magician "in fact" make
            a jumbo jet disappear! But was it True? No, of course Not!
            But, this story about Columbus, Rebazar and Fubbi is true
            right! LOL!

            Why is it that this is being said to be "inner guidance" when
            Columbus was Not an ECK Chela of Fubbi or Rebazar?

            What happened to the ECK Spiritual Law of Non-interference?

            These hypocrites and conmen need to get their stories
            straight! That's probably why Klemp leaves so much wiggle
            room for ECKists to fill-in the blanks via their imaginations.

            So, I wonder how many ECKists really believe this crap?

            It would, therefore, seem that Everything and Everyone
            is influenced (on the inner) by all of these ECK Masters!

            Do ECKists really believe this? This is what Klemp, in fact,
            is saying!

            *****

            On another note - Oct. 22, 2007 falls on a Monday, but
            Oct. 22, 2008 is on Wednesday right (?) due to leap year,
            and Oct. 22, 2009 is on Thursday, correct?!

            I was just looking at when the day of the week that the "ROD"
            could be passed. So, what will be the ploy of Klemp to fit this
            into his plans? Monday Oct. 22 is After the seminar right!
            Therefore it would be too late to announce it, or would HK
            tell of this exchange in advance? It seems like time (midnight)
            and date (Oct. 22) is a factor of something that is supposed to
            happen on the higher "Inner" planes where there is no time or
            space! WHY is that?

            In fact, it's probably just another flaw in the historical "legend"
            of Eckankar that Twitchell created in order to create a lineage
            of Masters, thereby, validating himself as one of them.

            Prometheus




            mish wrote:
            >
            >
            > Hi, All!
            >
            > Happy Columbus Day! : )
            >
            > In honor of Columbus Day, I am pulling up this post from
            > Jan. 2006 in which I cite HK in his book "Those Wonderful
            > ECK Masters" giving credit to Fubbi Quantz for assisting
            > Columbus in discovering America. I think it only fitting that
            > we remember Fubbi and Klemp when honoring Columbus! LOL!
            >
            > Here's the old post that shows how historically incorrect Klemp
            > and his org would like his chelas to be:
            >
            > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
            > "mishmisha9" <mishmisha9@> wrote:
            >
            > Hi, All!
            >
            > I believe eckist parents need to be concerned about what HK/Eckankar
            > is teaching in regards to history. From HK's newest book, "Those
            > Wonderful Eck Masters," page 87 comes this history lesson:
            >
            > "Fubbi Quantz once served as the Mahanta, the Living ECK Master.
            > This was during the time of Buddha, around the sixth century BC.
            > After completing his mission, he immortalized his body and continues
            > to serve the spiritual needs of mankind. He later served as teacher
            > of Firdusi, the Persian poet, and was also the spiritual guide of
            > Columbus. It was Fubbi Quantz who inspired Columbus to sail to the
            > Americas, to open the vast store-house of new sorely needed sources
            > of fruits, grains, legumes, vegetables, and especially protein
            > there.
            >
            > It was then the late fifteenth century. In his travels around
            > Europe, Fubbi Quantz had witnessed the appalling health of the
            > European people. It was in a shocking state. They had little energy
            > left over after a day's work for contemplation or reflection, the
            > moment of quiet which is the sweet drink of Soul. So Fubbi Quantz
            > gave Columbus a vision one night. In it he showed the potential of
            > the New World. This vision fired the imagination of Columbus and
            > thus set into motion the events that led him to sail his three tiny
            > ships westward into unknown waters. In the Americas, then, European
            > explorers found both precious minerals and abundant stores of life-
            > giving foods. Thus, Fubbi Quantz revived the food stock and
            > nutrition of the Old World."
            >
            > I don't know what HK is drinking/smoking these days, but what a
            > fairy tale he spins here in his new book! But, in reality, this
            > story about the ECK Master Fubbi Quantz clearly shows that this is
            > all fakery and lies! LOL!
            >
            > But on a very serious note, how can Eckists read this sort of stuff
            > and continue to support it? Come on, people, do a reality check and
            > get out of that crazy lying cult org!
            >
            > What Klemp is really selling is "service." Fubbi is portrayed as
            > doing a "service" to mankind, and Klemp wants all eckists now to
            > do "service" for the mahanta's mission. However, it seems the Law of
            > Noninterference is being overlooked in this fabrication of history.
            > Karma, free will, and man's spiritual evolution with that of Soul
            > and of Spirit should not be interfered with by fictional eck
            > masters, sometimes disguised as angels. LOL!
            >
            > Klemp's story about Fubbi is a myth--it's a lie. Every eckist out
            > there should be highly embarrassed to have the public reading this
            > trash and distortion of historical facts. Fubbi does not exist and
            > never did, as evidenced in Klemp's story in "Those Wonderful ECK
            > Masters!" This one fresh example indicates the whole of eckankar is
            > filled with lies and distortions of truth that any rational person
            > cannot overlook. Everything in eckankar needs to be questioned! Sane
            > people would view this book as a joke, and shaking their heads, move
            > on and away from it as quickly as possible!
            >
            > Mish
            >
            > --- End forwarded message ---
            >
          • prometheus_973
            The History Channel was recently showing Columbus: The Lost Voyage. It was interesting to see that Columbus discovered the New World, but Not the United
            Message 5 of 7 , Oct 13, 2007
            • 0 Attachment
              The History Channel was recently showing "Columbus:
              The Lost Voyage." It was interesting to see that Columbus
              discovered the "New World," but Not the United States.

              This "New World" was actually the Dominican Republic,
              and this is where Columbus sailed to on his first three
              voyages. On his four and final voyage he landed in
              South America (Venezuela). Way to go Reb and Fub!

              And, guess what else?! Columbus was a cruel, brutal, and
              inhumane Governor to both the natives (he enslaved) and
              to others under his charge.

              All Columbus cared about was mining gold and silver and
              taking this back to Spain for his share. There was never any
              mention of bringing back "protein." This is the true History
              and facts (reality) of Columbus' voyages. The Rebazar and
              Fubbi crap (ECK Legend) is a big fat lie and a distortion of Truth!

              BTW- I discovered that Europe already had access to corn,
              or maze, so that wasn't a protein source that was needed.

              It is interesting that Columbus thought that God was speaking
              to him... I guess that this "Divine Communication" justified his
              actions regardless of who it harmed. Maybe this is why Klemp
              uses this story to insert Rebazar and Fubbi. Khan "swooned"
              so, therefore, he must be spiritually connected to Twitchell's
              fake Eck masters too! It's all a ploy to use half-truths to make
              the lie seem real.

              Delusion runs rampant throughout this country and the world!
              It reminds me of what I see on American Idol Rewind when I see
              these young people being told that they can't sing! LOL! It's so
              obvious that most of these people (99%) can't sing, but they
              actually believe that they can sing... and that they can sing well!
              People, whom they trust, tell them that they can sing and they
              come to believe this. Why would someone who loves them lie
              to them?! Therefore, they tie their hopes and dreams to a star
              and live in their fantasy land of delusion. But now, they are
              awaken to the truth! They can't sing afterall! They get angry
              and lash out, or cry, or continue to deny the truth. The same
              applies to learning the truth about the fraud behind Eckankar
              which includes the fake masters (lineage) and initiations.

              Prometheus





              prometheus wrote:
              >
              > "Legend-A nonhistorical or unverifiable story handed down
              > by tradition from earlier times and popularly accepted as
              > historical." [Random House, Webster's College Dictionary]

              KLEMP: "ECK legend, in fact, has it has it that Rebazar, along
              with Fubbi Quantz, was involved with the inner guidance of
              Chistopher Columbus." [Those Wonderful ECK Masters, pg.95]

              > The earliest this EK legend/myth/lie was handed down is when
              > Twitchell first created it! This "in fact" is the real truth.
              >
              > Also, notice how vague and wishy-washy Klemp is! Why wouldn't
              > the greatest Mahanta ever (HK) be able to travel back into time
              > and "see" this inner influence for himself, and then share or verify
              > this information (legend) with the public in this book?
              >
              > Really! WHY can't HK verify this "LEGEND" with Rebazar and Fubbi
              > IF this really did occur?
              >
              > Instead, Klemp PLAYS WITH WORDS as he implies that the
              > "ECK legend" is "fact." I once saw a magician "in fact" make
              > a jumbo jet disappear! But was it True? No, of course Not!
              > But, this story about Columbus, Rebazar and Fubbi is true
              > right! LOL!
              >
              > Why is it that this is being said to be "inner guidance" when
              > Columbus was Not an ECK Chela of Fubbi or Rebazar?
              >
              > What happened to the ECK Spiritual Law of Non-interference?
              >
              > These hypocrites and conmen need to get their stories
              > straight! That's probably why Klemp leaves so much wiggle
              > room for ECKists to fill-in the blanks via their imaginations.
              >
              > So, I wonder how many ECKists really believe this crap?
              >
              > It would, therefore, seem that Everything and Everyone
              > is influenced (on the inner) by all of these ECK Masters!
              >
              > Do ECKists really believe this? This is what Klemp, in fact,
              > is saying!
              >
              > *****
              >
              > On another note - Oct. 22, 2007 falls on a Monday, but
              > Oct. 22, 2008 is on Wednesday right (?) due to leap year,
              > and Oct. 22, 2009 is on Thursday, correct?!
              >
              > I was just looking at when the day of the week that the "ROD"
              > could be passed. So, what will be the ploy of Klemp to fit this
              > into his plans? Monday Oct. 22 is After the seminar right!
              > Therefore it would be too late to announce it, or would HK
              > tell of this exchange in advance? It seems like time (midnight)
              > and date (Oct. 22) is a factor of something that is supposed to
              > happen on the higher "Inner" planes where there is no time or
              > space! WHY is that?
              >
              > In fact, it's probably just another flaw in the historical "legend"
              > of Eckankar that Twitchell created in order to create a lineage
              > of Masters, thereby, validating himself as one of them.
              >
              > Prometheus
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > mish wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > > Hi, All!
              > >
              > > Happy Columbus Day! : )
              > >
              > > In honor of Columbus Day, I am pulling up this post from
              > > Jan. 2006 in which I cite HK in his book "Those Wonderful
              > > ECK Masters" giving credit to Fubbi Quantz for assisting
              > > Columbus in discovering America. I think it only fitting that
              > > we remember Fubbi and Klemp when honoring Columbus! LOL!
              > >
              > > Here's the old post that shows how historically incorrect Klemp
              > > and his org would like his chelas to be:
              > >
              > > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
              > > "mishmisha9" <mishmisha9@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Hi, All!
              > >
              > > I believe eckist parents need to be concerned about what HK/Eckankar
              > > is teaching in regards to history. From HK's newest book, "Those
              > > Wonderful Eck Masters," page 87 comes this history lesson:
              > >
              > > "Fubbi Quantz once served as the Mahanta, the Living ECK Master.
              > > This was during the time of Buddha, around the sixth century BC.
              > > After completing his mission, he immortalized his body and continues
              > > to serve the spiritual needs of mankind. He later served as teacher
              > > of Firdusi, the Persian poet, and was also the spiritual guide of
              > > Columbus. It was Fubbi Quantz who inspired Columbus to sail to the
              > > Americas, to open the vast store-house of new sorely needed sources
              > > of fruits, grains, legumes, vegetables, and especially protein
              > > there.
              > >
              > > It was then the late fifteenth century. In his travels around
              > > Europe, Fubbi Quantz had witnessed the appalling health of the
              > > European people. It was in a shocking state. They had little energy
              > > left over after a day's work for contemplation or reflection, the
              > > moment of quiet which is the sweet drink of Soul. So Fubbi Quantz
              > > gave Columbus a vision one night. In it he showed the potential of
              > > the New World. This vision fired the imagination of Columbus and
              > > thus set into motion the events that led him to sail his three tiny
              > > ships westward into unknown waters. In the Americas, then, European
              > > explorers found both precious minerals and abundant stores of life-
              > > giving foods. Thus, Fubbi Quantz revived the food stock and
              > > nutrition of the Old World."
              > >
              > > I don't know what HK is drinking/smoking these days, but what a
              > > fairy tale he spins here in his new book! But, in reality, this
              > > story about the ECK Master Fubbi Quantz clearly shows that this is
              > > all fakery and lies! LOL!
              > >
              > > But on a very serious note, how can Eckists read this sort of stuff
              > > and continue to support it? Come on, people, do a reality check and
              > > get out of that crazy lying cult org!
              > >
              > > What Klemp is really selling is "service." Fubbi is portrayed as
              > > doing a "service" to mankind, and Klemp wants all eckists now to
              > > do "service" for the mahanta's mission. However, it seems the Law of
              > > Noninterference is being overlooked in this fabrication of history.
              > > Karma, free will, and man's spiritual evolution with that of Soul
              > > and of Spirit should not be interfered with by fictional eck
              > > masters, sometimes disguised as angels. LOL!
              > >
              > > Klemp's story about Fubbi is a myth--it's a lie. Every eckist out
              > > there should be highly embarrassed to have the public reading this
              > > trash and distortion of historical facts. Fubbi does not exist and
              > > never did, as evidenced in Klemp's story in "Those Wonderful ECK
              > > Masters!" This one fresh example indicates the whole of eckankar is
              > > filled with lies and distortions of truth that any rational person
              > > cannot overlook. Everything in eckankar needs to be questioned! Sane
              > > people would view this book as a joke, and shaking their heads, move
              > > on and away from it as quickly as possible!
              > >
              > > Mish
              > >
              > > --- End forwarded message ---
              > >
              >
            • prometheus_973
              Hi All, I thought I d combine some posts on the Columbus- Rebazar-Fubbi Lie that Klemp promotes. Klemp distorts the facts. At the same time, IF what he states
              Message 6 of 7 , Oct 14, 2007
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi All,
                I thought I'd combine some posts on the Columbus-
                Rebazar-Fubbi Lie that Klemp promotes. Klemp distorts
                the facts. At the same time, IF what he states was true,
                then Rebazar and Fubbi and the Mahanta Consciousness
                must take responsibility for ALL OF THE NEGATIVE ACTIONS
                AND RESULTS OF COLUMBUS' VOYAGES!

                Understanding the basis of this fiction [ECK Legend] where
                Rebazar and Fubbi influence Columbus on the "Inner Planes,"
                for the good of the whole, is very relevant to seeing through
                the Myth/Legend/Miracles and half-truths that all religions
                use to deceive, to confuse, and to control their followers.

                All religions do this, with their own unique spin, via giving
                their followers faith, hope, and beliefs, as well as, the imagination
                needed to alleivate their fears and to "answer" their questions
                through prayer (etc.), scripture, or within (the inner). The faithful
                must place their trust in the same lower "truths" their "enlightened"
                leaders have fed them and their ancestors over generations.

                Newer religions like Eckankar are no better than the older ones!
                ECKists don't seem to understand that The ECK Initiations Are
                A KAL Trap! The belief in the initiations, and the social aspect,
                i.e. Eck friends, are what keep many people from leaving the Org!
                Look at all of that time and those initiations [stature, (pride) or
                security, (from fear/unknown)] that they have invested!

                Plus, what do Eckists replace (Eckankar) their religion with? Freedom!
                They can replace their religion with the Freedom of Soul! This
                is how it was meant to be! The Eck initiations were created by
                Twitchell so that he would have the highest... it was his idea
                so why not have the highest (the 14th)! Really! it's that simple!

                Eckists really need to use some common sense and their minds
                just as they do to prevent themselves from falling into other
                scams while in this world! And, there's nothing wrong with
                using some Logic either!

                Prometheus


                Hi Etznab, Mish, Sharon, and All,
                Even though Europe had been undergoing a "Little Ice Age"
                (1300-1850) there was a greater desire for those with Power
                and Money to seek more and even greater riches and power!

                Therefore, Klemp's story of Rebazar and Fubbi influencing
                Columbus on the "Inner" and misdirecting CC and his course
                to India for the Greater Good, "protein" for Europeans, seems
                strange and anti-ECK! This "inner plane" influence was a Lower
                Plane, psychic, or Kal act! It is Not an act of Detachment (Vairag)
                or of Non-attachment. [Actually, Columbus thought he could
                just sail West to India. And, if LAND wasn't there one could!]

                I really doubt that most ECKists have thought this out or have
                looked at the implications of this ECK Legend "in fact."

                FIRST, What happened to the Law of Non-interference? Why
                is the "Inner" manipulation/mind-control by others (REBAZAR
                & FUBBI) who are either real or ficticious seen as okay by Klemp?

                SECOND, due to the "Little Ice Age," in Europe, the closest source
                of other grains (sources of protein for both humans and livestock)
                Unaffected By The Cold are the countries to the South which have
                been (for centuries) a source of trade.

                THIRD, Europe had more sources of protein grains (and fruit and
                vegetables) than the Americas. And, Europe had domesticated animals!
                What Dependable sources of protein (crops) did the Americas have
                except for Corn? Not as many!

                The Americas didn't have domesticated animals (until the Europeans
                brought their own) and meat is the best source of protein! Therefore,
                the native people could not depend on hunting enough meat! This
                is why the countries that have the best sources of protein (grains,
                domesticated animals for meat, eggs, cheese, milk, etc.) have more
                advanced civilizations. The body and mind need protein.

                FOURTH, due to the discovery by Columbus (and Rebazar & Fubbi)
                others followed and TOBACCO was, also, brought back to Europe.

                FIFTH, What happened to the indigenous people that Columbus,
                and those who came after him, came in contact with? They were
                murdered, raped, died from diseases, and enslaved due to the
                search for Gold and Silver! Rebazar and Fubbi are responsible for
                this! I wonder what the Central & South American ECK Chelas think
                about this Columbus-Rebazar-Fubbi Story?

                SIXTH, WHY are ECK Masters concerned with the Greater "Good,"
                or health, of these Europeans over others throughout history?
                Maybe Klemp can point out some other humantarian aid that
                the ECK Masters have given Without Consent (via the INNER) to
                other groups of people, or for the Good of the Whole...
                and Civilization. Klemp preaches a non-involved and passive
                view of world affairs.

                BTW - On Amazon.com one can look at the index of
                "The LITTLE ICE AGE: How Climate Made History 1300-1850"
                by Brian Fagan.

                Prometheus


                Mish wrote:

                HI, Etznab and All!

                I didn't see the PBS show on Columbus, but in my studies of history
                and of Columbus, I understand that Columbus was commissioned to
                search for a water route to the East, for safer access to the treasures
                there, rather than going the dangerous land way. Gold was one of the
                riches being sought as well as spices and other desired things in
                Europe--however, never did I learn or hear that Europe was in need
                of protein!!! LOL! It amazes me that Klemp "dreamed" that idea up,
                but maybe he just tests from time to time to see how gullible his
                chelas are. I mean Klemp can't survive with too many smart people
                under his command--so, making up dumb stories, seems to just
                attract the extremely gullible, delusional and easily manipulated
                kinds of people that Klemp likes best! Believing the story about
                Fubbi and Rebazar assisting Columbus just indicates that if one
                can believe that, then the rest of the eckankar crap is also
                believeable! How else do con men choose their victims, but to see
                how gullible some people are? If a person is in the same class of
                people who accepts the words of an authority figure without question
                then that person is just another gullible person who happens to be
                in a different group from the other gullible people in the world--but
                still that person is gullible.

                Also this minority way of thinking in eckankar might seem novel,
                but it doesn't mean that eckists are anymore special or enlightened
                than any other people on this earth. However, such eck stories
                that distort and erroneously inform, really just highlights how
                dumb the teachings are and how gullible the chelas are to let it
                slide by them! : )

                After joining eckankar one discovers that it can't deliver the promises
                it makes. The excuse given is that one needs more initiations in order
                to open and expand one's consciousness. Still this does not work
                either. This is why eckankar relies upon one's imagination to fulfill
                one's desires--including the desire to belong to a religion. The problem
                with this is that the 30 year plus eckists have come full circle, because
                everyone, including non-eckists, have imaginations and are no less
                spiritually advanced than these high inititates. So it all comes down
                to imagination and delusion, and this is how eckankar works for
                some people!

                Mish

                etznab wrote:

                Mish,

                There was a story about Columbus discovering America on PBS,
                Channel 9 recently. I didn't get time to watch it, but I heard that the
                voyage did have something to do with one mineral in particular -
                GOLD!

                Etznab

                mish wrote:


                Hi, All!

                Happy Columbus Day! : )

                In honor of Columbus Day, I am pulling up this post from
                Jan. 2006 in which I cite HK in his book "Those Wonderful
                ECK Masters" giving credit to Fubbi Quantz for assisting
                Columbus in discovering America. I think it only fitting that
                we remember Fubbi and Klemp when honoring Columbus! LOL!

                Here's the old post that shows how historically incorrect Klemp
                and his org would like his chelas to be:

                mish wrote:

                Hi, All!

                I believe eckist parents need to be concerned about what HK/Eckankar
                is teaching in regards to history. From HK's newest book, "Those
                Wonderful Eck Masters," page 87 comes this history lesson:

                "Fubbi Quantz once served as the Mahanta, the Living ECK Master.
                This was during the time of Buddha, around the sixth century BC.
                After completing his mission, he immortalized his body and continues
                to serve the spiritual needs of mankind. He later served as teacher
                of Firdusi, the Persian poet, and was also the spiritual guide of
                Columbus. It was Fubbi Quantz who inspired Columbus to sail to the
                Americas, to open the vast store-house of new sorely needed sources
                of fruits, grains, legumes, vegetables, and especially protein
                there.

                It was then the late fifteenth century. In his travels around
                Europe, Fubbi Quantz had witnessed the appalling health of the
                European people. It was in a shocking state. They had little energy
                left over after a day's work for contemplation or reflection, the
                moment of quiet which is the sweet drink of Soul. So Fubbi Quantz
                gave Columbus a vision one night. In it he showed the potential of
                the New World. This vision fired the imagination of Columbus and
                thus set into motion the events that led him to sail his three tiny
                ships westward into unknown waters. In the Americas, then, European
                explorers found both precious minerals and abundant stores of life-
                giving foods. Thus, Fubbi Quantz revived the food stock and
                nutrition of the Old World."

                I don't know what HK is drinking/smoking these days, but what a
                fairy tale he spins here in his new book! But, in reality, this
                story about the ECK Master Fubbi Quantz clearly shows that this is
                all fakery and lies! LOL!

                But on a very serious note, how can Eckists read this sort of stuff
                and continue to support it? Come on, people, do a reality check and
                get out of that crazy lying cult org!

                What Klemp is really selling is "service." Fubbi is portrayed as
                doing a "service" to mankind, and Klemp wants all eckists now to
                do "service" for the mahanta's mission. However, it seems the Law of
                Noninterference is being overlooked in this fabrication of history.
                Karma, free will, and man's spiritual evolution with that of Soul
                and of Spirit should not be interfered with by fictional eck
                masters, sometimes disguised as angels. LOL!

                Klemp's story about Fubbi is a myth--it's a lie. Every eckist out
                there should be highly embarrassed to have the public reading this
                trash and distortion of historical facts. Fubbi does not exist and
                never did, as evidenced in Klemp's story in "Those Wonderful ECK
                Masters!" This one fresh example indicates the whole of eckankar is
                filled with lies and distortions of truth that any rational person
                cannot overlook. Everything in eckankar needs to be questioned! Sane
                people would view this book as a joke, and shaking their heads, move
                on and away from it as quickly as possible!

                Mish
              • prometheus_973
                Klemp s The Wisdom Notes FALL 1984 talks about Columbus, Fubbi Quantz, and the need for Protein in Europe! This is repeated in Klemp s 2005 Those Wonderful
                Message 7 of 7 , Sep 5, 2008
                • 0 Attachment
                  Klemp's "The Wisdom Notes" FALL 1984
                  talks about Columbus, Fubbi Quantz, and
                  the need for Protein in Europe! This is
                  repeated in Klemp's 2005 "Those Wonderful
                  ECK Masters" (TWEM) - 21 years later!

                  The Wisdom Notes - FALL 1984:

                  "Frankly, the human race is up against a
                  crisis as compelling as that which Fubbi
                  Quantz faced before the discovery of
                  America.

                  The practice of the Spiritual Exercises of
                  ECK is about the only solution to meet it.

                  The problem in the late fifteenth century
                  was that nutrition of the European people
                  was in a shocking state.

                  The people had little energy left over after
                  the day's work for contemplation, the moment
                  of quiet which is the sweet drink of Soul.

                  FUBBI QUANTZ thus set into motion the
                  events that led COLUMBUS to sail his three
                  tiny ships westward into unknown waters
                  for the discovery of the Americas, where
                  abundant food could be gotten to revive
                  the food stock of the Old World." [end]

                  ***
                  ME: So, What has Klemp done for people
                  in AMERICA who have less vacation time
                  and CONTEMPLATION time than their
                  EUROPEAN counterparts? It has been 21
                  years since HK first told this story about
                  the need for the "Spiritual Exercises" and
                  a time for "contemplation" by all people.
                  FUBBI intervened (on the outer -Lower Worlds)
                  for the higher GOOD and broke the Law of
                  Non-Interference, so why hasn't KLEMP done
                  anything? It's actually getting worse with
                  Klemp in charge!
                  ***

                  Here's Klemp's quote from TWEM (page 87):

                  "... It was Fubbi Quantz who inspired Columbus
                  to sail to the Americas, to open the vast store-
                  house of new sorely needed sources of fruits,
                  grains, legumes, vegetables, and especially protein
                  there.

                  It was then the late fifteenth century. In his
                  travels around Europe, Fubbi Quantz had witnessed
                  the appalling health of the European people.
                  It was in a shocking state.

                  They had little energy left over after a day's
                  work for contemplation or reflection, the moment
                  of quiet which is the sweet drink of Soul.

                  So Fubbi Quantz gave Columbus a vision one night.
                  In it he showed the potential of the New World.

                  This vision fired the imagination of Columbus and
                  thus set into motion the events that led him to sail
                  his three tiny ships westward into unknown waters.

                  In the Americas, then, European explorers found
                  BOTH PRECIOUS minerals and abundant stores of
                  life-giving foods. Thus, Fubbi Quantz revived the
                  food stock and nutrition of the Old World." [end]

                  Prometheus

                  *************************************************
                  History or Another PT/HK Distortion?
                  Columbus, Fubbi & Rebazar- A Search for Protein!

                  [From Message # 2946]
                  prometheus wrote:
                  >
                  The History Channel was recently showing "Columbus:
                  The Lost Voyage." It was interesting to see that Columbus
                  discovered the "New World," but Not the United States.
                  >
                  This "New World" was actually the Dominican Republic,
                  and this is where Columbus sailed to on his first three
                  voyages. On his four and final voyage he landed in
                  South America (Venezuela). Way to go Reb and Fub!
                  >
                  And, guess what else?! Columbus was a cruel, brutal, and
                  inhumane Governor to both the natives (he enslaved) and
                  to others under his charge.
                  >
                  All Columbus cared about was mining gold and silver and
                  taking this back to Spain for his share. There was never any
                  mention of bringing back "protein." This is the true History
                  and facts (reality) of Columbus' voyages. The Rebazar and
                  Fubbi crap (ECK Legend) is a big fat lie and a distortion of Truth!
                  >
                  BTW- I discovered that Europe already had access to corn,
                  or maze, so that wasn't a protein source that was needed.
                  >
                  It is interesting that Columbus thought that God was speaking
                  to him... I guess that this "Divine Communication" justified his
                  actions regardless of who it harmed. Maybe this is why Klemp
                  uses this story to insert Rebazar and Fubbi. Khan "swooned"
                  so, therefore, he must be spiritually connected to Twitchell's
                  fake Eck masters too! It's all a ploy to use half-truths to make
                  the lie seem real.
                  >
                  Delusion runs rampant throughout this country and the world!
                  It reminds me of what I see on American Idol Rewind when I see
                  these young people being told that they can't sing! LOL! It's so
                  obvious that most of these people (99%) can't sing, but they
                  actually believe that they can sing... and that they can sing well!
                  People, whom they trust, tell them that they can sing and they
                  come to believe this. Why would someone who loves them lie
                  to them?! Therefore, they tie their hopes and dreams to a star
                  and live in their fantasy land of delusion. But now, they are
                  awaken to the truth! They can't sing afterall! They get angry
                  and lash out, or cry, or continue to deny the truth. The same
                  applies to learning the truth about the fraud behind Eckankar
                  which includes the fake masters (lineage) and initiations.
                  >
                  Prometheus
                  prometheus wrote:
                  > >
                  "Legend-A nonhistorical or unverifiable story handed down
                  by tradition from earlier times and popularly accepted as
                  historical." [Random House, Webster's College Dictionary]
                  >
                  KLEMP: "ECK legend, in fact, has it has it that Rebazar, along
                  with Fubbi Quantz, was involved with the inner guidance of
                  Chistopher Columbus." [Those Wonderful ECK Masters, pg.95]
                  >
                  The earliest this EK legend/myth/lie was handed down is when
                  Twitchell first created it! This "in fact" is the real truth.
                  > >
                  Also, notice how vague and wishy-washy Klemp is! Why wouldn't
                  the greatest Mahanta ever (HK) be able to travel back into time
                  and "see" this inner influence for himself, and then share or verify
                  this information (legend) with the public in this book?
                  > >
                  Really! WHY can't HK verify this "LEGEND" with Rebazar and Fubbi
                  IF this really did occur?
                  > >
                  Instead, Klemp PLAYS WITH WORDS as he implies that the
                  "ECK legend" is "fact." I once saw a magician "in fact" make
                  a jumbo jet disappear! But was it True? No, of course Not!
                  But, this story about Columbus, Rebazar and Fubbi is true
                  right! LOL!
                  > >
                  Why is it that this is being said to be "inner guidance" when
                  Columbus was Not an ECK Chela of Fubbi or Rebazar?
                  > >
                  What happened to the ECK Spiritual Law of Non-interference?
                  > >
                  These hypocrites and conmen need to get their stories
                  straight! That's probably why Klemp leaves so much wiggle
                  room for ECKists to fill-in the blanks via their imaginations.
                  > >
                  So, I wonder how many ECKists really believe this crap?
                  > >
                  It would, therefore, seem that Everything and Everyone
                  is influenced (on the inner) by all of these ECK Masters!
                  > >
                  Do ECKists really believe this? This is what Klemp, in fact,
                  is saying!
                  > >
                  *****
                  The ROD OF EK POWER & The Lower Worlds of KAL-

                  On another note - Oct. 22, 2007 falls on a Monday, but
                  Oct. 22, 2008 is on Wednesday due to leap year, and Oct.
                  22, 2009 is on Thursday, correct?!
                  > >
                  I was just looking at when the day of the week that the "ROD"
                  could be passed. So, what will be the ploy of Klemp to fit this
                  into his plans? Monday Oct. 22 is After the seminar right!
                  Therefore it would be too late to announce it, or would HK
                  tell of this exchange in advance? It seems like time (midnight)
                  and date (Oct. 22) is a factor of something that is supposed to
                  happen on the higher "Inner" planes where there is no time or
                  space! WHY is that?
                  > >
                  In fact, it's probably just another flaw in the historical "legend"
                  of Eckankar that Twitchell created in order to create a lineage
                  of Masters, thereby, validating himself as one of them.
                  > >
                  Prometheus
                  > >
                  mish wrote:

                  Hi, All!
                  > > >
                  Happy Columbus Day! : )
                  > > >
                  In honor of Columbus Day, I am pulling up
                  this post from Jan. 2006 in which I cite HK
                  in his book "Those Wonderful ECK Masters"
                  giving credit to Fubbi Quantz for assisting
                  Columbus in discovering America. I think
                  it only fitting that we remember Fubbi and
                  Klemp when honoring Columbus! LOL!
                  > > >
                  Here's the old post that shows how historically
                  incorrect Klemp and his org would like his chelas to be:
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  "mishmisha9" wrote:
                  > > >
                  Hi, All!
                  > > >
                  I believe eckist parents need to be concerned
                  about what HK/Eckankar is teaching in regards
                  to history. From HK's newest book, "Those
                  Wonderful Eck Masters," page 87 comes this
                  history lesson:
                  > > >
                  "Fubbi Quantz once served as the Mahanta,
                  the Living ECK Master. This was during the
                  time of Buddha, around the sixth century BC.
                  After completing his mission, he immortalized
                  his body and continues to serve the spiritual
                  needs of mankind. He later served as teacher
                  of Firdusi, the Persian poet, and was also the
                  spiritual guide of Columbus. It was Fubbi Quantz
                  who inspired Columbus to sail to the Americas,
                  to open the vast store-house of new sorely
                  needed sources of fruits, grains, legumes,
                  vegetables, and especially protein there.
                  > > >
                  It was then the late fifteenth century. In his
                  travels around Europe, Fubbi Quantz had
                  witnessed the appalling health of the
                  European people. It was in a shocking state.
                  They had little energy left over after a day's
                  work for contemplation or reflection, the
                  moment of quiet which is the sweet drink
                  of Soul. So Fubbi Quantz gave Columbus
                  a vision one night. In it he showed the potential
                  of the New World. This vision fired the imagination
                  of Columbus and thus set into motion the
                  events that led him to sail his three tiny
                  ships westward into unknown waters. In
                  the Americas, then, European explorers
                  found both precious minerals and abundant
                  stores of life-giving foods. Thus, Fubbi
                  Quantz revived the food stock and
                  nutrition of the Old World."
                  > > >
                  I don't know what HK is drinking/smoking
                  these days, but what a fairy tale he spins
                  here in his new book! But, in reality, this
                  story about the ECK Master Fubbi Quantz
                  clearly shows that this is all fakery and lies! LOL!
                  > > >
                  But on a very serious note, how can Eckists
                  read this sort of stuff and continue to support
                  it? Come on, people, do a reality check and
                  get out of that crazy lying cult org!
                  > > >
                  What Klemp is really selling is "service."
                  Fubbi is portrayed as doing a "service"
                  to mankind, and Klemp wants all eckists
                  now to do "service" for the mahanta's
                  mission. However, it seems the Law of
                  Noninterference is being overlooked
                  in this fabrication of history. Karma,
                  free will, and man's spiritual evolution
                  with that of Soul and of Spirit should
                  not be interfered with by fictional eck
                  masters, sometimes disguised as angels. LOL!
                  > > >
                  Klemp's story about Fubbi is a myth--
                  it's a lie. Every eckist out there should
                  be highly embarrassed to have the public
                  reading this trash and distortion of historical
                  facts. Fubbi does not exist and never did,
                  as evidenced in Klemp's story in "Those
                  Wonderful ECK Masters!" This one fresh
                  example indicates the whole of eckankar
                  is filled with lies and distortions of truth
                  that any rational person cannot overlook.
                  Everything in eckankar needs to be questioned!
                  Sane people would view this book as a joke,
                  and shaking their heads, move on and away
                  from it as quickly as possible!
                  > > >
                  Mish
                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.