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PT On Music - I Have Spoken!

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  • prometheus_973
    Hello All, I wonder how many ECKists have read these words of their founder and self-appointed Mahanta, and if they ever think of how this is applied to what
    Message 1 of 17 , Sep 15, 2007
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      Hello All,
      I wonder how many ECKists have read these words
      of their founder and self-appointed Mahanta, and
      if they ever think of how this is applied to what
      Klemp is telling them or if there is a conflict?



      prometheus wrote:
      >
      > On page 166 Twitchell states that Claude Debussy was
      > "UNCONSCIOUSLY USED by the ECK MASTERS to bring
      > back again NATURE MUSIC... the music of the gnomes,
      > the fairies, the water spirits, and the spirits of clouds
      > and fire."
      >
      > Apparently PT doesn't mind violating the Law of Soul
      > or the Law of Noninterference.
      >
      > PT: "IF the Living ECK Master THINKS it is fit to do so,
      > he ENCOURAGES and LIFTS the the CONSCIOUSNESS
      > of those who are musically talented... those who have
      > talent and try to USE the MAHANTA, the Living ECK Master,
      > or the ECK either in IGNORANCE or KNOWINGLY, SUFFER
      > in the END WITH TERRIBLE DISASTERS." [pgs.166-167]
      >
      > It seems PT enjoys using threats! On another note-
      > Twitchell only mentions the "MAHANTA, the Living ECK
      > Master in the last few pages of this book. Once on page
      > 167, once on page 168, and once on page 170!
      >
      > Here's what Twitchell had to say about the MAHANTA,
      > the Living ECK Master on page 170:
      >
      > "The line of music both Destructive and Positive has
      > been somewhat outlined here into the modern age.
      > THE FUTURE SAYS that the Influence of Music will bring
      > about BENEFITS to THOSE who can ACCEPT them, BUT
      > EVENTUALLY the discordant elements WILL CAUSE the
      > end of the material worlds in the last cycle, the Kali
      > Yuga, to prepare man again for the GOLDEN AGE to
      > come and the NEXT MAHANTA, the LIVING ECK MASTER,
      > WHO WILL SERVE MANKIND THROUGHOUT the NEXT
      > CYCLE of TIME."
      >
      > What did Twitchell mean by the "NEXT" MAHANTA/LEM
      > in the "NEXT" Cycle of Time? Is this why Darwin stated,
      > and thought, that PT would be the Mahanta for the next
      > 1,000 years or longer?!
      >
      > In the section titled: THE LONGEVITY OF THE ANCIENT
      > ADEPTS (pgs. 81-86) Twitchell seems obsessed with
      > living a long life. Twit even mentions many non-adepts
      > that he claims lived at 105-1000 or more years. PT
      > talks about the "longevity of St. John the Apostle...
      > no account has been given of his death..." And, of
      > a man who "wrote the Revelations on the Isle of Patmos
      > ... living during the Middle Ages... under the name
      > Prester John. This would have made him about 1000
      > years old." [pg. 83]
      >
      > PT also states:
      > "Longevity is a fact well known to anyone who is capable
      > of doing Soul Travel." [pg. 83]
      >
      > Yet, Twitchell (1908-1971) was only 63 when he died!
      > This just goes to show that Twitchell had no idea, at all,
      > that he was going to die when he did, or that he planned
      > to sacrifice himself (by eating poison) and die at a young
      > age. PT just made up a story that someone had intentionally
      > poisoned him in a visit to Spain. It was probably just common
      > food poisoning that he experienced and this weaken his
      > already bad heart.
      >
      > Here's more interesting info (exaggerations & fact twisting):
      >
      > "Since the advent of ECKANKAR into the modern world,
      > STARTING ABOUT 1935..."
      >
      > Now, who began this "advent?" Isn't it strange that this
      > is the same year that Klemp gives (on ECKANKAR.org)
      > for Twitchell's FIRST trip to India where HK claims PT
      > met SUDAR SINGH. However, since Klemp gives 1908
      > as Twitchell's birth year (Marman gives 1909) this makes
      > Twitchell 27 years old in 1935. And, HK states that at
      > age 27 is when PT was "exaggerating" and "twisting facts"
      > to get into Who's Who in Kentucky! Therefore, this 1935
      > date for the ADVENT OF ECKANKAR INTO THE MODERN
      > WORLD is a LIE!
      >
      > Twitchell continues: "It appears that this ancient teaching
      > which made its way back into the attention of the world,
      > after lying dormant for centuries, is here for a purpose.
      > That is to bring greater spiritual strength to all those who
      > become its followers." [pg. 123]
      >
      > Therefore, we now see that ECKANKAR was created by
      > Twitchell (in part) to help people to BELIEVE in another
      > form of RELIGION so as to help those FOLLOWERS to
      > develop "Greater Spiritual Strength." However, shouldn't
      > "followers" be set free when they have developed those
      > "greater spiritual strengths?"
      >
      > Or, is it that WHEN these "followers" have gained these
      > "SPIRITUAL STRENGTHS" they will realize it and NO LONGER
      > NEED TO BE "FOLLOWERS" or NEED ECKANKAR!
      >
      > One more thing and here's a good one! This seems to have
      > been included at the end of the book by Gail. Since she once
      > thought he was born in 1922 didn't this make her wonder?
      > What kind of lie did PT use to explain this I wonder? On page
      > 186 is a paragraph (an excerpt) titled:
      >
      > "Talks in Dublin, Ireland August, 1928" [when PT was
      > 10 years old?] It starts out-
      >
      > "My greatest problem with people is dealing, not with
      > skeptics or non-believers, but with those with failure-
      > consciousness..."
      >
      > Well, Paul certaintly made a success with his newly created
      > vocation... whodathunk! Too bad it was short lived for him,
      > but a bit longer for Gross. HK really made out! Yep, PT just
      > needed enough people to believe and get the ball rolling and
      > on the band-wagon and join early on in order to get in on
      > the ground floor of his multi-level pyramid (hierarchy) of his
      > Eckankar scheme/religion. What's funny is that most chelas
      > just get paid with worthless initiations - but I guess they do
      > make people feel good and imagine that they have more!
      >
      > Prometheus
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ************************************************************
      > PT: Wagner Studied Under Yaubl Sacabi in Agam Des
      > and put HU in his music.
      >
      > prometheus wrote:
      > >
      > > Hello All,
      > > I was inspired to look at "ECKANKAR: Compiled Writings,
      > > Volume I" written by Paul Twitchell in or around 1968-1969.
      > > [The Copyright is 1975 by Gail T. Gross]
      > >
      > > First, here are some comments Twitchell shares about STRAVINSKY:
      > >
      > > "...Stravinsky had created the music of discord and inharmonies.
      > > This kind of music began to break up the fixed patterns of thought
      > > throughout the world... The disharmony in these pieces of music
      > > will start breaking up set ideas, opinions and habits that one
      has.
      > > The establishment of a new pattern of thinking with the composers
      > > of music always causes problems in our social structure."
      > > [pgs. 152-153]
      > >
      > > Next, here's, also, some of what Twitchell had to say about
      Hitler's
      > > favorite composer:
      > >
      > > "WAGNER tried his best to give the world the basic word of the
      > > SOUND CURRENT. He had studied under the great ECK Master,
      > > YAUBL SACABI, in the spiritual city of AGAM DES {on the 9th
      Plane!}.
      > > He knew the principles of ECKANKAR and tried to apply them...
      > > When a person who has a good ear for music AND who KNOWS
      > > the works of ECK listens closely to Wagner's Parsifal and
      > > Tannhauser, he will hear clearly the sacred word HU in them. It
      > > can also be heard in his other major works..." [pgs.153-154]
      > >
      > > So, how can Klemp say that most music is negative when
      > > PT claims that Stravinsky is just breaking up the old thought
      > > patterns of his listeners in order to get them to change to and
      > > view other patterns. And, that Wagner's music contains the HU!
      > > Why is Klemp so Negative... other than being a KAL Agent?!
      > >
      > > And, isn't it interesting that Wagner (way back then) traveled
      > > to the 9th PLANE City of Agam Des to study under ECK Master
      > > Yaubl Sacabi and placed HU in his music! Amazing!
      > >
      > > I wonder if Wagner saw any UFO's while at AGAM DES?!
      > > WHY UFO's AT THE 9th PLANE CITY OF AGAM DES YOU SAY!
      > > Because Twitchell states in these same COMPILED WRITINGS:
      > >
      > > "Many of THOSE {aliens} in the FLYING SAUCERS and those
      > > who are able to project themselves directly to this earth
      > > planet COME FIRST TO AGAM DES in order to ACQUAINT
      > > THEMSELVES with the standard COARSER VIBRATIONS,
      > > LIKE THOSE WHICH EXIST IN THIS PLANET."
      > >
      > > On page 110 Twitchell states: "The logical explanation for
      > > UFOs is that they are NOT VISITORS FROM OUTER SPACE,
      > > secret developments by any government, NOR the result
      > > of mass hysteria. THEY ARE perfectly natural ASTRAL
      > > PROJECTIONS of the PSYCHIC WORLD... The UFO experience
      > > is generally a SUBJECTIVE ONE, something like RELIGIOUS
      > > or EMOTIONAL OCCURRENCES." Astral/Psychic like with the
      > > Eckankar Religious Experience too!
      > >
      > > Isn't it, also, interesting how Klemp uses much of Twitchell's
      > > old material for his talks and yet HK has stopped printing
      > > Paul's books and other writings! Don't PT's books contain
      > > ECK History that should be available for all ECKists to read?
      > > What does Klemp Fear... the Truth?
      > >
      > > Prometheus
      >
      > *****************************************************************
      >
      > > prometheus wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Hi All,
      > > >
      > > > Peter Anton's notes on Klemp's 2005 EWWS talk on the subject of
      > > > music is interesting because it is so narrow mined!
      > > >
      > > > Twitchell long ago (1966) in "The Way Of Eckankar Series" on
      pages
      > > > 113, 114, and 121 discussed his preference for classical music.
      He
      > > > mentions Beethoven, Stravinsky's "The Firebird," and Wagner's
      > > > operas.
      > > >
      > > > Klemp is quoted by Peter for having, "got rid of all negative
      songs
      > > > EVEN if there was only ONE on a CD." [My Caps] This seems like
      over-
      > > > kill or throwing the baby out with the bath water doesn't it!
      Why
      > > > not just change tracks! DUH! Klemp's stupid remarks get worse!
      > > >
      > > > It seems that Klemp, "had a lot of Country Western 'tear
      jerker'
      > > > songs which he gave them away because someone could benefit
      from
      > > > them." So Klemp admits to passing "negative songs" on to
      someone
      > > > else! Is this the KAL or the Mahanta doing this or are they one
      and
      > > > the same? The same it would seem! Really though... why would
      the
      > > > Mahanta give negative songs to someone?!
      > > >
      > > > Peter states that Klemp has finally "started listening to
      classical
      > > > music." I find this ironic because Klemp (the Mahanta) "has
      been
      > > > listening to negative tear jerker Country Western music" for
      how
      > > > many years now? It seems this LEM/Mahanta and "special
      incarnation
      > > > of the SUGMAD" (Eckankar Lexicon) is not living up to his PR,
      and
      > > > talks the talk but doesn't walk the walk!
      > > >
      > > > Klemp states that the current Mahanta consciousness is more
      > > > advanced than Twitchell's was, but Twitchell listened to
      classical
      > > > music in 1966! Why has Klemp been such a slacker for all these
      years?
      > > >
      > > > However, is all Classical music positive? And, is all Country
      > > > Western music negative? For instance, Beethoven's Ninth,
      Mozart's
      > > > Requiem, and Stravinsky's Death of Petrouchka (IMO) are not all
      that
      > > > positive. And are some of Wagner's operas positive and are some
      > > > negative? Wagner was a very dramatic conductor and his works as
      a
      > > > composer were dramatic (emotional) as well. Would you throw out
      a
      > > > whole CD because there was one opera that you didn't like? See
      how
      > > > stupid of a statement that was by Klemp! Yet, Eckists will
      never see
      > > > this because they don't truly listen or question anything.
      > > >
      > > >
      ******************************************************************
      > > >
      > > > Anyway, I'll end with the lyrics to a song performed by Johnny
      Cash.
      > > >
      > > > Highwayman
      > > >
      > > > I was a highwayman. Along the coach roads I did ride
      > > > With sword and pistol by my side
      > > > Many a young maid lost her baubles to my trade
      > > > Many a soldier shed his lifeblood on my blade
      > > > The bastards hung me in the spring of twenty-five
      > > > But I am still alive.
      > > >
      > > > I was a sailor. I was born on the tide
      > > > And with the seas I did abide.
      > > > I sailed a schooner round the Horn to Mexico
      > > > I went aloft and furled the mainsail in a blow
      > > > And when the yards broke off they said I got killed
      > > > But I am living still.
      > > >
      > > > I was a dam builder across the river deep and wide
      > > > Where steel and water did collide
      > > > A place called Boulder on the wild Colorado
      > > > I slipped and fell into wet concrete below
      > > > They buried me in that great tomb that knows no sound
      > > > But I am still around...I'll always be around..and around and
      > > > around and around and around
      > > >
      > > > I fly a starship across the Universe divide
      > > > And when I reach the other side
      > > > I'll find a place to rest my spirit if I can
      > > > Perhaps I may become a highwayman again
      > > > Or I may simply be a single drop of rain
      > > > But I will remain
      > > > And I'll be back again, and again and again and again and
      again..
      > > >
      *****************************************************************
      > > >
      > > > Maybe Klemp threw out one too many Country Western CDs before
      > > > listening again to this one... or would it have mattered to
      him?
      > > > Probably not... he once admitted that he never was much for
      > > > listening.
      > > >
      > > > Prometheus
      > > >
      > >
      >
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