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Re: just an opinion

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  • tomleafeater
    ... lift ... community. ... not ... valid ... eckankar ... up. ... was ... that ... Very well said, Rowan. And great insights. People who leave eckankar will
    Message 1 of 3 , Jun 28, 2007
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      --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "rowan_oak22"
      <rowan_oak22@...> wrote:
      > I lurk around these anti-eck sites because I enjoy them. More than
      > that, I respect them. I respect what you all are trying to do.
      > Years ago, a cult awareness site was instrumental in helping to
      > me out of the eck swamp. - Anyway, I decided to join this site
      > because I have a comment. (Perhaps it is more of a gentle
      > suggestion).
      > Many eckists, particularly newer ones, will not leave eckankar
      > because they discern a problem with the eck literature or
      > teachings. They simply lack that insight early on. This is the
      > more likely scenario: An eckist comes to be troubled by something
      > in the behavior, or attitude, or climate in the eckankar
      > Something about some of the members, the higher members, seems off
      > kilter.
      > The new eckist will try to blame themselves, but the doubts and
      > questions linger. They end up on the internet, they end up on anti-
      > eck sites, and they end up leaving the cult. Some of them may take
      > up a deeper study of the eck literature, and start seeing the red
      > flags, manipulation, misinformation, etc.
      > At any rate, their doubts typically start with people, not with the
      > literature. An eckist's first doubts will come from the behavior of
      > eckists themselves. And, although human dynamics are human
      > dynamics, whether in eckankar or the Elk Club, the Elk Club does
      > tout long time members as enlightened.
      > If a person comes here and complains of questionable eckist
      > behavior, it seems to me that is a reasonable complaint. It seems
      > to me it is worth saying. Many people need to go through the
      > process of breaking the spell - the spell that lauds higher
      > initiates as superior.
      > In the last week or so there were some women complaing about
      > relastionships they had in eckankar. I can't recall the specific
      > complaints, but the men they knew, it seems, did not display
      > sterling character. Isn't that important to say? Isn't that a
      > complaint? Can no one imagine the double disillusionment of
      > and eckist?
      > One poster here seemed highly incensed by these women. As if the
      > women were card-carrying eckists, come to look for new members.
      > When, reallly, they were expressing their own process of waking
      > If that angry poster felt that conversation was beneath her, she
      > not required to reply. She could have simply continued with the
      > Wisdom Notes conversation. Nothing prevented her from doing so.
      > Prometheus, some will come here and respond to the harold talks
      > you post. Some will respond to leafeaters exellent philosphical
      > arguments. And some will respond to personal stories of
      > disillsionment. A house needs many windows, as you know.
      > Take care all,
      > Rowan

      Very well said, Rowan. And great insights. People who leave eckankar
      will begin to rediscover themselves in the post-eckankar world they
      live in, and the longer they're away from the pressures of
      organizational comformity, the more individuation will take place
      with them.

      I've shed my skin many times over since I've left eckankar, and I
      love it. As I explore the post-eckankar world, I learn more and keep
      shedding the old eckankar influences. My point of view regarding just
      about everything has changed immensely, and keeps changing as I leave
      behind the past. And again, I love it. God, I really love what is
      happening to me. If I were to run into someone with exactly the point
      of view that I had just after leaving eckankar, I'd probably have
      some disagreements with that person if we got into the details. All
      of the people posting here have very different experiences, views,
      histories. Forcing conformity upon the group will not work.

      Some will come with stories of bad relationships. I had them in
      eckankar too. Some will come with stories of experiences of crazy
      misled RESAs. I had them too. Some will come with stories of
      questionable statements made by Klemp in his writings. I too can
      relate to that. Some will speak of abusive organizational
      experiences. Yep, this happened to me. And on and on. 28 years of
      interaction with eckankar, including meeting Paul Twitchell and the
      other batty masters and many personal relationships with eckists add
      up to a lot of experience.

      There is a strong feeling of discord on the group at the moment, and
      I confess to not understanding all the strange and subtle nuances
      which are simmering beneath the surface, since I haven't read all the
      posts from the last two months I've been away. People questioning
      affiliations, loyalties, time in eckankar, motives. People claiming
      one person is posing as another. People trying to manipulate the
      direction of discussions with manipulative posts. People forming what
      feels like cliques. People trying to control. Resentments seem to
      abound. Feels a lot like eckankar at the moment. Odd, that.

      The attempts at subtlety are not subtle.

      I frankly don't mind this too much. Its fascinating to observe the
      undertones and underlying dynamics. I could be wrong, but I'm also
      assuming that a great deal of email side conversations are going on
      with key members, as they discuss how to "handle" the other members.
      Absolutely fascinating.

      I guess all this is getting less important to me, so I feel I can
      speak directly to issues that some would rather leave unspoken. I
      drive people crazy that way, I admit, since I have a tendency to
      bring everything out into the open. Hee, hee. Maybe they'll ban me
      from the group. Wouldn't that be fun.

      Folks, don't take it all too seriously. The truth is out about
      eckankar. You're all offering your point of views, and as Rowan has
      astutely stated, there is something of value in all that is said that
      diferent people in eckankar will relate to, since eckists are all as
      different as we, ourselves, are. There is more than one way to
      present the real truth about eckankar, and that truth will have
      different nuances for each person. And different people will
      naturally resonate with different aspects of the information that is

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