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Re: Initiation Levels another look ;-)

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  • ewickings
    Hi Noneckster! LOL isn t this all just a load of bullshit... ;-) When you start to dissect these initiations, you get to really see there is no spiritual
    Message 1 of 2 , Mar 4, 2007
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      Hi Noneckster!  LOL  isn't this all just a load of bullshit...  ;-)  When you start to dissect these initiations, you get to really see there is no spiritual growth with any of them. 
       
      Lets take a look at just some of what each initiation brings;
       
      From The Shariyat-Ki-Sugmad, Book Two, Chapter 12:
      The Circles of ECK Initiations
       
      > 1. Acolyte (AH-koh-liet), initiate of the First Circle of ECK,
      > spiritual discipline
       
      > - Not able to leave Eckankar should he/she ever decide to do so
       
       
      ***  Well this can be seen clearly as a fear tactic!  It starts even as one becomes a first initiate.  Now had they said one can never leave the ECK since we all understand what the ECK is according to eckankrap; I might tend to agree that even non eckist can never destroy or discard spirit.  But that isn't what this says!
       
       
      > 2. Arahata (ah-rah-HAH-tah), initiate of the Second Circle of ECK,
      the teacher
       
       
      > - The limited consciousness in man comes into the state of decision:
      What road shall the chela take: the left-hand path of black magic, the right-
      Hand path of white magic or the center road of the purified Soul
       
      ***  So why does the Eck Master claim that his HIs are the right or was it the left hand of the Mahanta?
      And since Klemp called Darwin Gross a Black Magician, who by the way initiated Klemp, wouldn't that also make Klemp a black magician?  LOL
       
       
      > 3. Arhat (AH-rat), initiate of the Third Circle of ECK, the worthy
      > one
       
      > - Comes under the cycle of threes in which every phenomenon, every
      action, every event, every physical and psychological change is the result of an
      instant action of three forces which come under the Kal Niranjan - the
      Positive, the negative, and the neutralizing force
       
      *** Okay, help me out here....  as a second initiate one must make a dicision; what road shall the chela take the left hand path of black magic, the right hand path of white magic or the center road of the purified soul.  Yet the above statement for a third is what?   Every
      action, every event, every physical and psychological change is the result of an instant action of three forces which come under the Kal Niranjan - the Positive, the negative, and the neutralizing force.    Wouldn't the positive be the right hand path, the negative be the left hand path, and the center path be the road of the purified soul, the neutralizing force, the path of the Eck Masters?
       
      > 4. Chiad (chee-AHD), initiate of the Fourth Circle of ECK, intellect
      > or mind
      > - Realization that the five passions of the mind are the enemy that
      > must be overcome
      > - Growth of consciousness is frequently accomplished by certain
      > mental distresses and also by physical illnesses
       
       
      ***  So when Klemp was jumping off bridges and running through airports butt naked, he was still dealing with the mental junk?   
       
      -The highest initiation of the psychic worlds
       
      - Evolution of the mind in the results of the power of sensing time,
      Matter, energy, and space - begins to have an insight on all these
      Phenomena of nature - all illusions 
       
      *** I hear those drugs can be very powerful when it comes to illusions, while being treated in a mental facility.

      > 5. Mahdis (MAH-dees), initiate of the Fifth Circle of ECK, the
      > transfiguration
       
      > - The first few weeks or months, the initiate is on trial and attacks
      upon himself must be expected before he settles into the true ways
      of the Mahdis
       
      > - He who dwells in the Atma Lok has no place to call his home
       
       
      *** So was Klemp a fourth or fifth when he and his first wife set out to move to CA?  Drove without brakes, took a wrong turn and ended up 30 miles out of his way, though still relying on that inner voice he called the Mahanta....  Could it be that Klemp was stuck on the mental plane, riding the fence of that fifth initiation plane with the possibility of no place to live if he got his breaks fixed? 
       
      Does anyone else see how sick these initiation titles really are?  And what a load of BULLSHIT....  anyone and everyone outside of eckankrap goes through life with ISSUES, and they don't get to call them spiritual eck initiations!  SICK.....
       
       
       
      > 6. Shraddha (SHRAHD-dah), initiate of the Sixth Circle of ECK, the
      surrender
      > - Complete sacrifice and uttermost suffering which is preceded by the
      > way of pain and unhappiness
      >
      > - The initiate must lose everything in life that means anything to
      > him and sacrifice himself even unto death
      >
      > - The initiate can work consciously with the ECK Masters and beings
      > of various planes with intelligence and consciousness of what is
      > taking place
      >
      > - Service without complaint
       
       
      ***  YEP I was a 6th, was even told if I hang on and stay in eckankrap, my 7th was coming at the following WW in Oct 2003!  LOL  If a person were to take this list of initiation CHALLENGES to a shrink,  I think they would take one look at this BULLSHIT and say that who ever wrote it was suffering from a very serious mental illness himself... And for another to continue to perpetuate this Paul Twit  BULLSHIT (Klemp), is just as sick! 
       
       
      > 7. Bhakti (BAHK-tee), initiate of the Seventh Circle of ECK, love and
      Devotion, the Shab
       
      > - Now has the right to choose whether he will pursue the rest of the
      > way on the path of Eckankar
      >
      > - The initiate begins to attain direct, conscious experience
      >
      > - By self-surrender, the initiate does not resist life, but goes
      > along with it in an active manner
       
       
      ***  So much for the outer ceremony!  I didn't need it to know I could leave Eckankrap!!!  But let us not forget what the first initiation claims; Not able to leave Eckankar should he/she ever decide to do so!  They start with the brainwashing right away, and by the time an eckie has reached the 7th, after all of the trials and tribulations (they would have had anyway) why would anyone want to leave and have to start this BULLSHIT all over again? 
       
      > 8. Gyanee (gie-YAH-nee), initiate of the Eighth Circle of ECK, the
      > pure disciple
       
       - Now has the right to choose whether he will sacrifice himself to
      > remain upon earth to help with the progress of humanity or whether
      > he will pass onward to the realm of spiritual development outside
      > this planet and into the spiritual regions
      >
       
      ***  Hmmmm maybe Klemp was an 8th when he tried to sacrifice himself to the freezing cold waters by jumping off the bridge.  He "lived" so that must have meant he was to stick around and help with the progress of humanity.  Actually, it was just a failed attempt at SUICIDE!   Let's not take everything written in the eck teachings so damn seriously!   
       
      > - Has now directed his footsteps toward Mastership and can never turn
      > back
       
      *** YEP and with that realization, Klemp ran naked throught an airport to prove he was on his way to Mastership!  ;-)
       
      > - Cannot do anything but obey the wishes of the Mahanta
      >
      > - Has become one of the chosen few who will come to the true
      > knowledge of the Sugmad
       
      *** Are the chosen few suffering from the same mental illnesses as the past 3 Masters? 
       
       
      > 9. Maulani (mah-oo-LAH-nee), initiate of the Ninth Circle of ECK, the
      > vanguard
      > - Given the power to wield the law, or work with the vibrations
      > governing all phases of planetary life
       
      ***  Swordman of the Sugmad?  Wielding their sword....   <screeching to a stop>  what the hECK does that last sentence say anyway?     
       
      > - Given insight of the spiritual unfoldment which lies inevitably
      > ahead of the teaming masses of humanity
      >
      > - Sacrifices everything for his fellow ECKists
       
      *** Just more nonesence and BULLSHIT words that mean NOTHING!  YEP, throw yourself in front of a moving truck to sacrifice yourself for a fellow eckie  ;-),  hey maybe that truck driver was an eckie without brakes, listening to the inner voice of the Mahanta?  ;-)  
       
       
      > 10. Adepiseka (ah-deh-pee-SEH-kah), initiate of the Tenth Circle of
      > ECK, the accepted disciple
      >
      > - Enters into the divine wisdom pool, the true wisdom, the worlds of
      > the true nature of Sugmad
       
      ***  LOL   oh I really like this one; enters into the divine wisdom pool....   reminds me of a gene pool full of lunatics, losers and low life nothings.
       
       
      > - The ECK is the only part of life worth living
       
      ***  Sounds like depression to me
       
      >
      > - Fully understands the three principles of ECK: Soul is eternal;
      > whosoever travels the high path of ECK always dwells in the
      > spiritual planes; Soul always lives in the present
       
       
      *** This is controdictory! Looking back on the 3rd initiation we saw;  the cycle of threes in which every phenomenon, every
      Action, every event, every physical and psychological change is the result of an
      Instant action of three forces which come under the Kal Niranjan - the
      Positive, the negative, and the neutralizing force
       
      I guess cycles and principles are different?  Anyway, if you made it this far,  your brain is mush...
       
      Soul is eternal;  a no brainer.
      Whosoever travels the "HIGH" path of Eck always dwells in the spiritual planes;   one reason why it is the only life worth living?
      Soul always lives in the present;  wouldn't that imply also living in this physical world?  Yet the sentence above contradicts this...   
       
       
      > 11. Kevalshar (KEHV-ahl-shahr), initiate of the Eleventh Circle of
      > ECK, rebirth
      >
      > - World of the unspoken Word, the Voice of Sugmad
      >
      > - Rebirth into God-Realization
      >
      > - Only the Mahanta can serve as the spiritual guide to lead the
      > initiate into this world
      >
      > - Understands Soul exists because of God's love for It
       
       
      ***  MORE BULLSHIT!  And that last sentence;  Understands Soul exists because of God's love for it...  hmmmm that is very simplistic isn't it?  Why spend all that money and years of service and brainwashing only to have the same realization as an 11th, happen from early on in the teachings?  Isn't this part of their Eck Vahana efforts, to teach new souls this very thing from the get go? 
       
       
      >
      > 12. Maharaji (mah-hah-RAH-jee), the Living ECK Master but not the
      > Mahanta
      >
      > - The Master who is of the body, but not yet ready to wear the crown
      >
      > - It is learned that the ECK is not energy of Itself, but It controls
      > and directs energy in all the worlds of God
       
      *** MORE BULLSHIT!  Twisting and turning words, words that mean absolutely the same thing in the end...  WE ARE ALL SPIRITUAL BEINGS HAVING A HUMAN EXPERIENCE!   
       
      BTW what type of crown does a Mahanta wear?  Thorns.....
       
      >
      > 13. Mahanta Maharai (mah-HAHN-tah MAH-hah-rie), initiate of the
      > Thirteenth Circle of ECK, the Living ECK Master aware of his
      > relationship to the Mahanta
       
      *** And because none of us will ever get to this point, we will never know what that sentence just said!!!   BULLSHIT.....
       
      >
      > 14. Mahanta (mah-HAHN-tah), the Living ECK Master, the Vi-Guru, the
      > Light Giver
       
      *** Yeh well the last eckie to leave the Eck campus grounds, don't forget to turn off the lights!   (An old saying about Michiganders leaving the State)  Cause no one will be home......  They all took the last comet outa there!    
       
      If I were god (The ECK, SUGMAD) I would pick from a better gene pool, or should I say divine wisdom pool.... If this is the best and wisest Masters IT can come up with....   LOL  "service without complaint" is a direct "order, threat" as far as I can see!   I say let those poor loser eckies be the sacrificial lambs.  ;-)   
       
      What is your favorite flavor of koolaide????  You know if all of those eckies were to drink the koolaide, we wouldn't notice the loss much, only a handful when compared to the entire normal population!   
       
      -------Original Message-------
       
      Date: 3/4/2007 3:56:01 AM
      Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: Initiation Levels / Worth reading!
       
      This would explain why my brother has endured four failed marriages,
      cancer, panic attacks and depression/anger reactions, as well as an
      inability to tolerate being alone. Even with all of this "burning off
      of "karma", etc., he still holds on to the delusion that somehow
      Eckankar and the living eck master, mahanta, (Klemp) are somehow going
      To save him in the end, of course, should he survive the "even unto
      death" part. It's really very sad that this destructive cult keeps
      such a terrible hold on many, out of fear of leaving this "religion".
      If only he could just wake up to the SCAM that eckankult really is.
       
      noneckster
       
      "....6. Shraddha (SHRAHD-dah), initiate of the Sixth Circle of ECK, the
      Surrender
       
      - Complete sacrifice and uttermost suffering which is preceded by the
      Way of pain and unhappiness
       
      - The initiate must lose everything in life that means anything to
      him and sacrifice himself even unto death
       
      - The initiate can work consciously with the ECK Masters and beings
      Of various planes with intelligence and consciousness of what is
      Taking place
       
      - Service without complaint..."
       
    • prometheus_973
      Hi Liz, Noneckster, and All, For the ECK 10th Initiation it states that Soul always lives in the present. Yet Klemp always reverts back to the PAST when
      Message 2 of 2 , Mar 5, 2007
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        Hi Liz, Noneckster, and All,

        For the ECK 10th Initiation it states that "Soul always
        lives in the present." Yet Klemp always reverts back
        to the PAST when telling a story, or making a point, or
        when giving an analogy as an example.

        BTW- Klemp is also a liar on more than one occasion.
        He contradicts himself and thereby lies! Look at the
        December 2005 H.I. Letter on IFs - ANDs - BUTs (check
        the archives). Even in the current H.I. Letter (03/2007)
        Klemp uses 5 BUTs and 1 IF on the front page after telling
        ECK Leaders (H.I.s) not to use these words with one another.

        "When someone says but, its a nail in the coffin of
        invention. A constant stream of contradictions shuts off
        creativity and a gift that may be offered. And when some-
        one says but, he's stopped listening. So be aware of using
        if. And especially when using but, because it's limiting.
        Move straight ahead. Don't clutter things with if, and, or
        but. It throws a condition under your feet that is a trip wire.
        This is pretty much for ourselves, because in dealing with
        others, you may need to use if, and, or but." [12/2005 H.I.
        Letter]

        Apparently, it's okay to deceive non-ECKists with contradictions
        and to shut off creativity when dealing with "others." It's also
        okay to use "but" and stop listening to "others" and to be
        "limiting." And, it's okay to "clutter things with if" when speaking
        to "others."

        Apparently, Klemp views the lowly H.I. ECKists (5-9) as he does
        the "other" non-ECKists. Really, think about it. He's a 14th and
        these other H.I.s are what... half way to where he is! HK's like the
        High School senior B.M.O.C. and these "other" H.I.s are like 4th,
        5th, and 6th graders to him with his delusions! It's no wonder that
        Klemp disrespects his H.I.s by NOT following his own advice to
        them in The H.I. Letter of December, 2005!

        Prometheus


        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "ewickings" <ewickings@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Hi Noneckster! LOL isn't this all just a load of bullshit... ;-) When
        > you start to dissect these initiations, you get to really see there is no
        > spiritual growth with any of them.
        >
        > Lets take a look at just some of what each initiation brings;
        >
        > From The Shariyat-Ki-Sugmad, Book Two, Chapter 12:
        > The Circles of ECK Initiations
        >
        > > 1. Acolyte (AH-koh-liet), initiate of the First Circle of ECK,
        > > spiritual discipline
        >
        > > - Not able to leave Eckankar should he/she ever decide to do so
        >
        >
        > *** Well this can be seen clearly as a fear tactic! It starts even as one
        > becomes a first initiate. Now had they said one can never leave the ECK
        > since we all understand what the ECK is according to eckankrap; I might tend
        > to agree that even non eckist can never destroy or discard spirit. But that
        > isn't what this says!
        >
        >
        > > 2. Arahata (ah-rah-HAH-tah), initiate of the Second Circle of ECK,
        > the teacher
        >
        >
        > > - The limited consciousness in man comes into the state of decision:
        > What road shall the chela take: the left-hand path of black magic, the
        > right-
        > Hand path of white magic or the center road of the purified Soul
        >
        > *** So why does the Eck Master claim that his HIs are the right or was it
        > the left hand of the Mahanta?
        > And since Klemp called Darwin Gross a Black Magician, who by the way
        > initiated Klemp, wouldn't that also make Klemp a black magician? LOL
        >
        >
        > > 3. Arhat (AH-rat), initiate of the Third Circle of ECK, the worthy
        > > one
        >
        > > - Comes under the cycle of threes in which every phenomenon, every
        > action, every event, every physical and psychological change is the result
        > of an
        > instant action of three forces which come under the Kal Niranjan - the
        > Positive, the negative, and the neutralizing force
        >
        > *** Okay, help me out here.... as a second initiate one must make a
        > dicision; what road shall the chela take the left hand path of black magic,
        > the right hand path of white magic or the center road of the purified soul.
        > Yet the above statement for a third is what? Every
        > action, every event, every physical and psychological change is the result
        > of an instant action of three forces which come under the Kal Niranjan - the
        > Positive, the negative, and the neutralizing force. Wouldn't the positive
        > be the right hand path, the negative be the left hand path, and the center
        > path be the road of the purified soul, the neutralizing force, the path of
        > the Eck Masters?
        >
        >
        > > 4. Chiad (chee-AHD), initiate of the Fourth Circle of ECK, intellect
        > > or mind
        >
        > > - Realization that the five passions of the mind are the enemy that
        > > must be overcome
        > > - Growth of consciousness is frequently accomplished by certain
        > > mental distresses and also by physical illnesses
        >
        >
        > *** So when Klemp was jumping off bridges and running through airports butt
        > naked, he was still dealing with the mental junk?
        >
        > -The highest initiation of the psychic worlds
        >
        > - Evolution of the mind in the results of the power of sensing time,
        > Matter, energy, and space - begins to have an insight on all these
        > Phenomena of nature - all illusions
        >
        > *** I hear those drugs can be very powerful when it comes to illusions,
        > while being treated in a mental facility.
        >
        > > 5. Mahdis (MAH-dees), initiate of the Fifth Circle of ECK, the
        > > transfiguration
        >
        > > - The first few weeks or months, the initiate is on trial and attacks
        > upon himself must be expected before he settles into the true ways
        > of the Mahdis
        >
        > > - He who dwells in the Atma Lok has no place to call his home
        >
        >
        > *** So was Klemp a fourth or fifth when he and his first wife set out to
        > move to CA? Drove without brakes, took a wrong turn and ended up 30 miles
        > out of his way, though still relying on that inner voice he called the
        > Mahanta.... Could it be that Klemp was stuck on the mental plane, riding
        > the fence of that fifth initiation plane with the possibility of no place to
        > live if he got his breaks fixed?
        >
        > Does anyone else see how sick these initiation titles really are? And what
        > a load of BULLSHIT.... anyone and everyone outside of eckankrap goes
        > through life with ISSUES, and they don't get to call them spiritual eck
        > initiations! SICK.....
        >
        >
        >
        > > 6. Shraddha (SHRAHD-dah), initiate of the Sixth Circle of ECK, the
        > surrender
        >
        > > - Complete sacrifice and uttermost suffering which is preceded by the
        > > way of pain and unhappiness
        > >
        > > - The initiate must lose everything in life that means anything to
        > > him and sacrifice himself even unto death
        > >
        > > - The initiate can work consciously with the ECK Masters and beings
        > > of various planes with intelligence and consciousness of what is
        > > taking place
        > >
        > > - Service without complaint
        >
        >
        > *** YEP I was a 6th, was even told if I hang on and stay in eckankrap, my
        > 7th was coming at the following WW in Oct 2003! LOL If a person were to
        > take this list of initiation CHALLENGES to a shrink, I think they would
        > take one look at this BULLSHIT and say that who ever wrote it was suffering
        > from a very serious mental illness himself... And for another to continue to
        > perpetuate this Paul Twit BULLSHIT (Klemp), is just as sick!
        >
        >
        > > 7. Bhakti (BAHK-tee), initiate of the Seventh Circle of ECK, love and
        > Devotion, the Shab
        >
        > > - Now has the right to choose whether he will pursue the rest of the
        > > way on the path of Eckankar
        > >
        > > - The initiate begins to attain direct, conscious experience
        > >
        > > - By self-surrender, the initiate does not resist life, but goes
        > > along with it in an active manner
        >
        >
        > *** So much for the outer ceremony! I didn't need it to know I could leave
        > Eckankrap!!! But let us not forget what the first initiation claims; Not
        > able to leave Eckankar should he/she ever decide to do so! They start with
        > the brainwashing right away, and by the time an eckie has reached the 7th,
        > after all of the trials and tribulations (they would have had anyway) why
        > would anyone want to leave and have to start this BULLSHIT all over again?
        >
        >
        > > 8. Gyanee (gie-YAH-nee), initiate of the Eighth Circle of ECK, the
        > > pure disciple
        >
        > - Now has the right to choose whether he will sacrifice himself to
        > > remain upon earth to help with the progress of humanity or whether
        > > he will pass onward to the realm of spiritual development outside
        > > this planet and into the spiritual regions
        > >
        >
        > *** Hmmmm maybe Klemp was an 8th when he tried to sacrifice himself to the
        > freezing cold waters by jumping off the bridge. He "lived" so that must
        > have meant he was to stick around and help with the progress of humanity.
        > Actually, it was just a failed attempt at SUICIDE! Let's not take
        > everything written in the eck teachings so damn seriously!
        >
        > > - Has now directed his footsteps toward Mastership and can never turn
        > > back
        >
        > *** YEP and with that realization, Klemp ran naked throught an airport to
        > prove he was on his way to Mastership! ;-)
        >
        > > - Cannot do anything but obey the wishes of the Mahanta
        > >
        > > - Has become one of the chosen few who will come to the true
        > > knowledge of the Sugmad
        >
        > *** Are the chosen few suffering from the same mental illnesses as the past
        > 3 Masters?
        >
        >
        > > 9. Maulani (mah-oo-LAH-nee), initiate of the Ninth Circle of ECK, the
        > > vanguard
        >
        > > - Given the power to wield the law, or work with the vibrations
        > > governing all phases of planetary life
        >
        > *** Swordman of the Sugmad? Wielding their sword.... <screeching to a
        > stop> what the hECK does that last sentence say anyway?
        >
        > > - Given insight of the spiritual unfoldment which lies inevitably
        > > ahead of the teaming masses of humanity
        > >
        > > - Sacrifices everything for his fellow ECKists
        >
        > *** Just more nonesence and BULLSHIT words that mean NOTHING! YEP, throw
        > yourself in front of a moving truck to sacrifice yourself for a fellow eckie
        > ;-), hey maybe that truck driver was an eckie without brakes, listening to
        > the inner voice of the Mahanta? ;-)
        >
        >
        > > 10. Adepiseka (ah-deh-pee-SEH-kah), initiate of the Tenth Circle of
        > > ECK, the accepted disciple
        > >
        > > - Enters into the divine wisdom pool, the true wisdom, the worlds of
        > > the true nature of Sugmad
        >
        > *** LOL oh I really like this one; enters into the divine wisdom pool....
        > reminds me of a gene pool full of lunatics, losers and low life nothings.
        >
        >
        > > - The ECK is the only part of life worth living
        >
        > *** Sounds like depression to me
        >
        > >
        > > - Fully understands the three principles of ECK: Soul is eternal;
        > > whosoever travels the high path of ECK always dwells in the
        > > spiritual planes; Soul always lives in the present
        >
        >
        > *** This is controdictory! Looking back on the 3rd initiation we saw; the
        > cycle of threes in which every phenomenon, every
        > Action, every event, every physical and psychological change is the result
        > of an
        > Instant action of three forces which come under the Kal Niranjan - the
        > Positive, the negative, and the neutralizing force
        >
        > I guess cycles and principles are different? Anyway, if you made it this
        > far, your brain is mush...
        >
        > Soul is eternal; a no brainer.
        > Whosoever travels the "HIGH" path of Eck always dwells in the spiritual
        > planes; one reason why it is the only life worth living?
        > Soul always lives in the present; wouldn't that imply also living in this
        > physical world? Yet the sentence above contradicts this...
        >
        >
        > > 11. Kevalshar (KEHV-ahl-shahr), initiate of the Eleventh Circle of
        > > ECK, rebirth
        > >
        > > - World of the unspoken Word, the Voice of Sugmad
        > >
        > > - Rebirth into God-Realization
        > >
        > > - Only the Mahanta can serve as the spiritual guide to lead the
        > > initiate into this world
        > >
        > > - Understands Soul exists because of God's love for It
        >
        >
        > *** MORE BULLSHIT! And that last sentence; Understands Soul exists
        > because of God's love for it... hmmmm that is very simplistic isn't it?
        > Why spend all that money and years of service and brainwashing only to have
        > the same realization as an 11th, happen from early on in the teachings? Isn
        > t this part of their Eck Vahana efforts, to teach new souls this very thing
        > from the get go?
        >
        >
        > >
        > > 12. Maharaji (mah-hah-RAH-jee), the Living ECK Master but not the
        > > Mahanta
        > >
        > > - The Master who is of the body, but not yet ready to wear the crown
        > >
        > > - It is learned that the ECK is not energy of Itself, but It controls
        > > and directs energy in all the worlds of God
        >
        > *** MORE BULLSHIT! Twisting and turning words, words that mean absolutely
        > the same thing in the end... WE ARE ALL SPIRITUAL BEINGS HAVING A HUMAN
        > EXPERIENCE!
        >
        > BTW what type of crown does a Mahanta wear? Thorns.....
        >
        > >
        > > 13. Mahanta Maharai (mah-HAHN-tah MAH-hah-rie), initiate of the
        > > Thirteenth Circle of ECK, the Living ECK Master aware of his
        > > relationship to the Mahanta
        >
        > *** And because none of us will ever get to this point, we will never know
        > what that sentence just said!!! BULLSHIT.....
        >
        > >
        > > 14. Mahanta (mah-HAHN-tah), the Living ECK Master, the Vi-Guru, the
        > > Light Giver
        >
        > *** Yeh well the last eckie to leave the Eck campus grounds, don't forget to
        > turn off the lights! (An old saying about Michiganders leaving the State)
        > Cause no one will be home...... They all took the last comet outa there!
        >
        >
        > If I were god (The ECK, SUGMAD) I would pick from a better gene pool, or
        > should I say divine wisdom pool.... If this is the best and wisest Masters
        > IT can come up with.... LOL "service without complaint" is a direct
        > order, threat" as far as I can see! I say let those poor loser eckies be
        > the sacrificial lambs. ;-)
        >
        > What is your favorite flavor of koolaide???? You know if all of those
        > eckies were to drink the koolaide, we wouldn't notice the loss much, only a
        > handful when compared to the entire normal population!
        >
        > -------Original Message-------
        >
        > From: Non ekster
        > Date: 3/4/2007 3:56:01 AM
        > To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: Initiation Levels / Worth reading!
        >
        > This would explain why my brother has endured four failed marriages,
        > cancer, panic attacks and depression/anger reactions, as well as an
        > inability to tolerate being alone. Even with all of this "burning off
        > of "karma", etc., he still holds on to the delusion that somehow
        > Eckankar and the living eck master, mahanta, (Klemp) are somehow going
        > To save him in the end, of course, should he survive the "even unto
        > death" part. It's really very sad that this destructive cult keeps
        > such a terrible hold on many, out of fear of leaving this "religion".
        > If only he could just wake up to the SCAM that eckankult really is.
        >
        > noneckster
        >
        > "....6. Shraddha (SHRAHD-dah), initiate of the Sixth Circle of ECK, the
        > Surrender
        >
        > - Complete sacrifice and uttermost suffering which is preceded by the
        > Way of pain and unhappiness
        >
        > - The initiate must lose everything in life that means anything to
        > him and sacrifice himself even unto death
        >
        > - The initiate can work consciously with the ECK Masters and beings
        > Of various planes with intelligence and consciousness of what is
        > Taking place
        >
        > - Service without complaint..."
        >
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