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Re: Fwd: Imagination and Images post

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  • prometheus_973
    Hi Mish, This ECKist (Dave) really doesn t know or understand his own eckie dogma. Klemp, the LEM/Mahanta, sees words, and thoughts as the NEGATIVE (Lower
    Message 1 of 2 , Feb 5, 2007
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      Hi Mish,
      This ECKist (Dave) really doesn't know or understand his
      own eckie dogma. Klemp, the LEM/Mahanta, sees words,
      and thoughts as the NEGATIVE (Lower World of Illusion)
      source of the IMAGINATION. But weren't the Lower Worlds
      created for Soul to have experiences that teach important
      lessons? Why then do these Eckists want to escape or avoid
      the lessons?

      Well, there's the rub. Eckists, especially H.I.s, are under the
      delusion that they are above it all, and that they have graduated
      and learned and experienced everything that they need to
      in the Lower "outer" Worlds because of their initiation level
      (and the dogma)! They have been tricked to let their guards
      down and to accept this delusion because it makes them "feel"
      superior and detached from the World. However, they also deny
      themselves experiences in relationships that would allow them
      to grow spiritually.

      mishmisha wrote:
      >
      This post under the title "Imagination and Images" was
      posted by an eckist named Dave on an eck chat site
      recently:
      >
      [Eckie Dave]:
      "Imagination is real. The images our brain perceives are
      really NOT FROM THE MIND but are real in whatever reality
      we perceive. The brain perceives images, it does not make
      them. What we see on the innerscreen is real."

      ME: So, I guess he's saying that the IMAGES really come
      from a higher source... the ECK or the ECK Masters, and Not
      from Soul.

      [Dave]: "The holy spirit, we call it the Eck, forms a matrix
      according to our beliefs."

      ME: Yes, I know of the Holy Spirit and of the ECK, but your
      "matrix" is that of a belief in "compiled" dogmas and delusions.

      [Dave]: "If you are a non believer in God, then that is your
      matrix."

      ME: No, non-belief in God is not a matrix. Besides, maybe
      people just don't believe in your idea or concept of "God" or
      of Spirit!

      [Dave]: "If you are Buddist, then Buddha is who you will see
      on the matrix. Whether you believe it or not The Mahanta,
      The Living Eck Master is the eternal matrix for all life. We
      just perceive it differently from our different beliefs." (unquote)

      ME: So, it doesn't matter what someone's "matrix" is. It could
      be someone or something or anything, but it's "really" the
      LEM/Mahanta! It seems that Dave (Eckists) are disrespectful
      of other people's beliefs. No wonder Eckists don't listen to
      what others have to say. Yet, H.K. has stated that the name
      "Eckankar" was created by Twitchell and that PT "compiled"
      the teachings of other Lower World philosophies and religions
      ... some with their own Living Masters.

      I guess that Klemp being the Greatest Consciousness that
      all of the Lower and Higher Worlds of SUGMAD has ever known
      is the only true reality and "matrix" too! Dave really has an active
      imagination doesn't he! Too bad that he doesn't do more outside
      reading or read more Eck Dogma. Still, it probably wouldn't help.
      Dave wants and needs to believe that his Religion is the Best and
      the Highest and that his Preacher knows the truth that he is the
      truth... for Dave and the other needy, greedy, vain, wannabes
      this is their "reality."


      "IMAGINATION. a MENTAL faculty that God has granted Soul
      so that It may enter into the FIRST DOOR of the inner worlds;
      a faculty which permits Soul to PICTURE in THOUGHT. See also
      divine faculty." (pg.93, Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

      "DIVINE FACULTY. The imagination; the inner action, DESIRE,
      PICTURING, EXPECTING." (pg. 49, Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

      "MECHANICAL MANIFESTATIONS. LYING, IMAGINATION, the
      expression of NEGATIVE EMOTIONS, and UNNECESSARY
      TALKING." (pgs. 136-137, Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

      "MENTAL BODY. The body for the Mental Plane; the TRANSFORMER
      FOR THOUGHT between the MIND and the ASTRAL BODY." (pg. 137,
      Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

      "MENTAL PLANE. The Fourth Plane of the LOWER WORLDS; SOURCE
      of philosophy, ethics, moral teachings, and aesthetics; SEAT of
      the UNIVERSAL MIND POWER; the sound here is running water.
      RULED by BRAHM, the NEGATIVE POWER; MAHA KAL LOK. See
      also Worlds of ECK (illus.)." (pg. 137, Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

      ME: The problem with Klemp's last definition is that if one looks
      at the "WORLDS OF ECK (ILLUS.)" on page 232 is that OMKAR is
      given as the RULER of the MMENTAL PLANE!

      Also, the MAHA KAL LOK is not mentioned anywhere in Klemp's
      Eckankar Lexicon! However, Twitchell does mention it in his
      Eckankar Dictionary.

      "MAHA KAL LOK. The MIND WORLD; the MENTAL PLANE; the
      FOURTH PLANE." (pg. 91, Eckankar Dictionary by P.T.)

      Also, neither the Eckankar Dictionary or the Eckankar Lexicon
      state that OMKAR is an entity or a RULER. Each state that it is
      the "POWER" of the Mental Plane.

      Anyway, as we can plainly see... Eckankar dogma does not view
      the "imagination" as coming from a higher source and that it is
      actually Created by each Soul.

      Prometheus
      p.s. How does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta and Highest Consciousness
      ever and anywhere screw-up on these definitions he stole from
      Twitchell? Hmmmmm. Maybe HK's a fraud and just inherited a
      scam religion that Twitchell borrowed and "compiled" from other
      sources. Nah, that makes too much sense and the Truth can hurt!

      [Mish, concerning Dave's coments]:
      Isn't this delusional crock! The more I read such nonsense from
      eckists the more nutty they seem as a group. Well, what can be
      expected when a mentally unbalanced individual calls himself
      Mahanta: "The Mahanta is the highest state of consciousness known
      to the chronicles of mankind . . . " from page 205, Those Wonderful
      ECK Masters by Harold Klemp (a Who's Who of literary intellectuals,
      too--LOL!).
      >
      > Mish
      >
      > --- End forwarded message ---
      >
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