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Fwd: Imagination and Images post

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  • mishmisha9
    ... mishmisha9 wrote: This post under the title Imagination and Images was posted by an eckist named Dave on an eck chat site recently:
    Message 1 of 2 , Feb 4 10:52 PM
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      --- In X-Eckankar_The-Chains-of-Eck@yahoogroups.com,
      "mishmisha9" <mishmisha9@...> wrote:

      This post under the title "Imagination and Images" was
      posted by an eckist named Dave on an eck chat site
      recently:

      "Imagination is real. The images our brain perceives are
      really not from the mind but are real in whatever reality we
      perceive. The brain perceives images, it does not make them.
      What we see on the innerscreen is real. The holy spirit, we call
      it the Eck, forms a matrix according to our beliefs. If you are a non
      believer in God, then that is you matrix. If you are Buddist, then
      Buddha is who you will see on the matrix. Whether you believe it or
      not The Mahanta, The Living Eck Master is the eternal matrix for all life.
      We just perceive it differently from our different beliefs." (unquote)

      Isn't this delusional crock! The more I read such nonsense from
      eckists the more nutty they seem as a group. Well, what can be
      expected when a mentally unbalanced individual calls himself
      Mahanta: "The Mahanta is the highest state of consciousness known
      to the chronicles of mankind . . . " from page 205, Those Wonderful
      ECK Masters by Harold Klemp (a Who's Who of literary intellectuals,
      too--LOL!).

      Mish

      --- End forwarded message ---
    • prometheus_973
      Hi Mish, This ECKist (Dave) really doesn t know or understand his own eckie dogma. Klemp, the LEM/Mahanta, sees words, and thoughts as the NEGATIVE (Lower
      Message 2 of 2 , Feb 5 2:38 PM
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        Hi Mish,
        This ECKist (Dave) really doesn't know or understand his
        own eckie dogma. Klemp, the LEM/Mahanta, sees words,
        and thoughts as the NEGATIVE (Lower World of Illusion)
        source of the IMAGINATION. But weren't the Lower Worlds
        created for Soul to have experiences that teach important
        lessons? Why then do these Eckists want to escape or avoid
        the lessons?

        Well, there's the rub. Eckists, especially H.I.s, are under the
        delusion that they are above it all, and that they have graduated
        and learned and experienced everything that they need to
        in the Lower "outer" Worlds because of their initiation level
        (and the dogma)! They have been tricked to let their guards
        down and to accept this delusion because it makes them "feel"
        superior and detached from the World. However, they also deny
        themselves experiences in relationships that would allow them
        to grow spiritually.

        mishmisha wrote:
        >
        This post under the title "Imagination and Images" was
        posted by an eckist named Dave on an eck chat site
        recently:
        >
        [Eckie Dave]:
        "Imagination is real. The images our brain perceives are
        really NOT FROM THE MIND but are real in whatever reality
        we perceive. The brain perceives images, it does not make
        them. What we see on the innerscreen is real."

        ME: So, I guess he's saying that the IMAGES really come
        from a higher source... the ECK or the ECK Masters, and Not
        from Soul.

        [Dave]: "The holy spirit, we call it the Eck, forms a matrix
        according to our beliefs."

        ME: Yes, I know of the Holy Spirit and of the ECK, but your
        "matrix" is that of a belief in "compiled" dogmas and delusions.

        [Dave]: "If you are a non believer in God, then that is your
        matrix."

        ME: No, non-belief in God is not a matrix. Besides, maybe
        people just don't believe in your idea or concept of "God" or
        of Spirit!

        [Dave]: "If you are Buddist, then Buddha is who you will see
        on the matrix. Whether you believe it or not The Mahanta,
        The Living Eck Master is the eternal matrix for all life. We
        just perceive it differently from our different beliefs." (unquote)

        ME: So, it doesn't matter what someone's "matrix" is. It could
        be someone or something or anything, but it's "really" the
        LEM/Mahanta! It seems that Dave (Eckists) are disrespectful
        of other people's beliefs. No wonder Eckists don't listen to
        what others have to say. Yet, H.K. has stated that the name
        "Eckankar" was created by Twitchell and that PT "compiled"
        the teachings of other Lower World philosophies and religions
        ... some with their own Living Masters.

        I guess that Klemp being the Greatest Consciousness that
        all of the Lower and Higher Worlds of SUGMAD has ever known
        is the only true reality and "matrix" too! Dave really has an active
        imagination doesn't he! Too bad that he doesn't do more outside
        reading or read more Eck Dogma. Still, it probably wouldn't help.
        Dave wants and needs to believe that his Religion is the Best and
        the Highest and that his Preacher knows the truth that he is the
        truth... for Dave and the other needy, greedy, vain, wannabes
        this is their "reality."


        "IMAGINATION. a MENTAL faculty that God has granted Soul
        so that It may enter into the FIRST DOOR of the inner worlds;
        a faculty which permits Soul to PICTURE in THOUGHT. See also
        divine faculty." (pg.93, Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

        "DIVINE FACULTY. The imagination; the inner action, DESIRE,
        PICTURING, EXPECTING." (pg. 49, Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

        "MECHANICAL MANIFESTATIONS. LYING, IMAGINATION, the
        expression of NEGATIVE EMOTIONS, and UNNECESSARY
        TALKING." (pgs. 136-137, Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

        "MENTAL BODY. The body for the Mental Plane; the TRANSFORMER
        FOR THOUGHT between the MIND and the ASTRAL BODY." (pg. 137,
        Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

        "MENTAL PLANE. The Fourth Plane of the LOWER WORLDS; SOURCE
        of philosophy, ethics, moral teachings, and aesthetics; SEAT of
        the UNIVERSAL MIND POWER; the sound here is running water.
        RULED by BRAHM, the NEGATIVE POWER; MAHA KAL LOK. See
        also Worlds of ECK (illus.)." (pg. 137, Eckankar Lexicon by H.K.)

        ME: The problem with Klemp's last definition is that if one looks
        at the "WORLDS OF ECK (ILLUS.)" on page 232 is that OMKAR is
        given as the RULER of the MMENTAL PLANE!

        Also, the MAHA KAL LOK is not mentioned anywhere in Klemp's
        Eckankar Lexicon! However, Twitchell does mention it in his
        Eckankar Dictionary.

        "MAHA KAL LOK. The MIND WORLD; the MENTAL PLANE; the
        FOURTH PLANE." (pg. 91, Eckankar Dictionary by P.T.)

        Also, neither the Eckankar Dictionary or the Eckankar Lexicon
        state that OMKAR is an entity or a RULER. Each state that it is
        the "POWER" of the Mental Plane.

        Anyway, as we can plainly see... Eckankar dogma does not view
        the "imagination" as coming from a higher source and that it is
        actually Created by each Soul.

        Prometheus
        p.s. How does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta and Highest Consciousness
        ever and anywhere screw-up on these definitions he stole from
        Twitchell? Hmmmmm. Maybe HK's a fraud and just inherited a
        scam religion that Twitchell borrowed and "compiled" from other
        sources. Nah, that makes too much sense and the Truth can hurt!

        [Mish, concerning Dave's coments]:
        Isn't this delusional crock! The more I read such nonsense from
        eckists the more nutty they seem as a group. Well, what can be
        expected when a mentally unbalanced individual calls himself
        Mahanta: "The Mahanta is the highest state of consciousness known
        to the chronicles of mankind . . . " from page 205, Those Wonderful
        ECK Masters by Harold Klemp (a Who's Who of literary intellectuals,
        too--LOL!).
        >
        > Mish
        >
        > --- End forwarded message ---
        >
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