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12/2006 H.I. Letter - Ask the Master #2 of 2

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  • prometheus_973
    Hi All, This is also a question(s) from a RESA. Q: I am studying chapter 12, The Circles of ECK Initiations, in The Shariyat-Ki-Sugmad, Book Two. I hear a
    Message 1 of 1 , Dec 8 8:08 PM
      Hi All,
      This is also a question(s) from a RESA.

      Q: "I am studying chapter 12, 'The Circles of ECK
      Initiations,' in The Shariyat-Ki-Sugmad, Book Two.
      I hear a few chelas and even some H.I.'s say
      initiations aren't important. It doesn't matter
      if you are a Second, Third, Fourth, or a Fifth

      My question is, how do we answer these chelas?
      Is there more I can do as a RESA to help H.I.'s
      continue to be a shining example for others in
      the area? And finally, is the Fifth Initiation
      attainable by all?"

      ME: It seems like this RESA is rather inexperienced.
      Most chelas say that the initiations aren't important
      because they don't want to focus on what they
      don't have or on future desires and attachments
      to a number. Besides, a higher initiation number
      doesn't guarantee that one has a higher

      HK's answer:
      "You pose well-considered questions.
      Let's take the issues from the top.

      The ECK Initiations are not important?

      These people are fooling themselves."

      ME: I think that Klemp is doing the fooling!

      HK: "The initiations are doorways to heaven.
      Without knowing it, they are broadcasting their
      own spiritual unworthiness."

      ME: What a load of crap! How is it that H.I.
      foxes are outside the henhouse if the
      initiations are valid? These "unworthy"Eckists
      are probably the only ones with a true grasp of

      HK: "And how do you answer them? Perhaps the
      best response is, 'Are you sure they're not
      important?' Then say no more."

      ME: Yes, that will show them what's important
      and put them in their place! How arrogant and
      unfeeling of Klemp! See what he's teaching his
      RESAs. Those initiation carrots are important
      to keep dangling in front of the suckers.

      HK: "What can you do to help H.I.'s continue to
      be a shining example for others in the area?
      Ask qualified H.I.'s to accept leadership roles."

      ME: Some of these same qualified H.I.s are the
      foxes raiding the lower initiate henhouse!

      HK: "IF one should stumble, point out the error
      and help him correct it. Hold each accountable.
      BUT also understand that people do stumble,
      because living is learning. So give him a chance
      to turn around on his own."

      ME: So, does this mean that the foxes are to be
      given a chance to "turn around" on their own?
      Can leopards change their spots too? Really
      though... all HK is talking about is Vahana crap!
      This has nothing to do with spirituality, but
      everything to do with making rank!

      HK: "Is the Fifth Initiation attainable by all? Yes,
      it is attainable, though not a certainty."

      ME: It would have been more interesting to have
      asked if the 8th or 9th or 14th was attainable
      by all. Of course, the same answer would apply
      just not in this lifetime! : )

      HK: "And even when one receives it, he may not
      reach the true, full initiation, Self-Realization,
      for a long time. It depends upon his state of

      ME: See! Why should Eckists care about Initiations
      when what is really important is one's state of

      And, according to Eckankar dogma one has to
      attain the 6th before they have completed the
      Fifth. The catch is that some of these Kal-Eck H.I.
      foxes are fully "Self-Realized" 6ths & 7ths! How
      does Klemp explain that away?

      It is a sad state for Eckists when their own LEM/
      Mahanta emphasizes an initiation number over
      true consciousness! The con of Twitchell

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