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Re: DG and HK had SECRET MEETINGS Without SOUND & LIGHT

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  • ctecvie
    Hello Mish and Prometheus! ... are ... under ... Oh yes - he keeps recycling and recycling things - and sometimes he takes whole discourses and publishes them!
    Message 1 of 9 , Jun 18, 2005
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      Hello Mish and Prometheus!

      > Good post revealing this bit of the Gross/Klemp story! It is
      > mentioned in both of Klemp's autobiographical books. Both books
      are
      > basically the same, but Klemp republishes many of his writings
      under
      > new titles--anyone notice that?
      Oh yes - he keeps recycling and recycling things - and sometimes he
      takes whole discourses and publishes them! I remember having noticed
      that with a youth discourse series - it did make me wonder but that
      was all at the time! :-) "The "modern prophet" is a recycling as
      well ...

      > I did because I read all of his
      > transcripts and some other books in a year's time. Much was
      > extremely redundant! Why, did he do this? Well, it keeps people
      > buying new books--keeps the money rolling in. I think it is an
      > indicator of how easily brainwashed and misled people can be in
      such
      > situations. I wonder if Harold even chuckles to himself at how
      > gullible people are when they keep spending time and money on his
      > recycled books??

      It took me a bit longer to notice ... but finally I did through the
      years. :-) Oh, I think Harold doesn't even notice the gullibility -
      in a sense, it's sad because that way, he misses a good laugh from
      time to time! ;-))
      >
      > One story he tells in both of his autobio-books is the one where
      he
      > was a very young boy and an adult made a joke with other men at
      > little "Harold's" expense. It embarrassed Harold greatly, and it
      > seems to this day, he has not gotten over it. He seems to hold a
      lot
      > of anger about it. I wonder why he can't reflect on it with
      > adult "eyes?" Why does he continue to see it negatively instead of
      > as a positive learning experience. The man just made a funny joke
      to
      > create laughter and fun with the group of farmers who were working
      > together that one day. It was a social thing, and I'm sure the man
      > did not realize that sensitive little Harold was so offended--and
      > still is to this day!

      A good psychotherapeutic session would have had him rid of that -
      but apparently he needs that because, were it otherwise, how could
      he tell those stories? He needs something to tell - and perhaps
      that's why anything related to psychology / psychotherapy is
      regarded as much "lesser" than Eckankar ...
      >
      > This anger is definitely a flaw that has been long standing with
      > Harold, and it explains why as L.E.M. he can so easily dish it out
      > but can't take it. He demonstrates this angry behavior in some of
      > his talks and writings (other stories)--and it also explains why
      he
      > comes down hard on some of his "miscreant" followers. It trickles
      > down through the organization, as well, as H.I. leaders emulate
      his
      > behavior and mistreat other Eckists: the silent treatment,
      shunning,
      > taking away initiations and positions and so forth.

      There's a saying in my language that goes like that: as the master,
      so the follower - it's easy to see in Eckankar! :-)
      >
      > Well, what an experience Eckankar has been! : )

      It definitely has been - and good that it "has been"! :-)

      Ingrid
    • prometheus_973
      Hi Ingrid, Yes, it s too bad, in one sense, that HK isn t aware of his followers gullibility or lack of critical thinking... he would be having some good
      Message 2 of 9 , Jun 18, 2005
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        Hi Ingrid,

        Yes, it's too bad, in one sense, that HK isn't aware of his
        followers gullibility or lack of critical thinking... he would be
        having some good laughs! But, it's even sadder that HK isn't aware
        of his own delusions, gullibility, and lack if consciousness.
        Actually, maybe it's not so sad. If HK was more aware he might be
        more clever (a better con-man) in hiding these facts than he has
        been. Of course the Eckist ego, through the use of the "As If"
        effect, also tends to hide the Truth from Soul via delusion as well.

        Prometheus


        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "ctecvie"
        <ctecvie@y...> wrote:
        > Hello Mish and Prometheus!
        >
        > > Good post revealing this bit of the Gross/Klemp story! It is
        > > mentioned in both of Klemp's autobiographical books. Both books
        > are
        > > basically the same, but Klemp republishes many of his writings
        > under
        > > new titles--anyone notice that?
        > Oh yes - he keeps recycling and recycling things - and sometimes
        he
        > takes whole discourses and publishes them! I remember having
        noticed
        > that with a youth discourse series - it did make me wonder but
        that
        > was all at the time! :-) "The "modern prophet" is a recycling as
        > well ...
        >
        > > I did because I read all of his
        > > transcripts and some other books in a year's time. Much was
        > > extremely redundant! Why, did he do this? Well, it keeps people
        > > buying new books--keeps the money rolling in. I think it is an
        > > indicator of how easily brainwashed and misled people can be in
        > such
        > > situations. I wonder if Harold even chuckles to himself at how
        > > gullible people are when they keep spending time and money on
        his
        > > recycled books??
        >
        > It took me a bit longer to notice ... but finally I did through
        the
        > years. :-) Oh, I think Harold doesn't even notice the gullibility -

        > in a sense, it's sad because that way, he misses a good laugh from
        > time to time! ;-))
        > >
        > > One story he tells in both of his autobio-books is the one where
        > he
        > > was a very young boy and an adult made a joke with other men at
        > > little "Harold's" expense. It embarrassed Harold greatly, and it
        > > seems to this day, he has not gotten over it. He seems to hold a
        > lot
        > > of anger about it. I wonder why he can't reflect on it with
        > > adult "eyes?" Why does he continue to see it negatively instead
        of
        > > as a positive learning experience. The man just made a funny
        joke
        > to
        > > create laughter and fun with the group of farmers who were
        working
        > > together that one day. It was a social thing, and I'm sure the
        man
        > > did not realize that sensitive little Harold was so offended--
        and
        > > still is to this day!
        >
        > A good psychotherapeutic session would have had him rid of that -
        > but apparently he needs that because, were it otherwise, how could
        > he tell those stories? He needs something to tell - and perhaps
        > that's why anything related to psychology / psychotherapy is
        > regarded as much "lesser" than Eckankar ...
        > >
        > > This anger is definitely a flaw that has been long standing with
        > > Harold, and it explains why as L.E.M. he can so easily dish it
        out
        > > but can't take it. He demonstrates this angry behavior in some
        of
        > > his talks and writings (other stories)--and it also explains why
        > he
        > > comes down hard on some of his "miscreant" followers. It
        trickles
        > > down through the organization, as well, as H.I. leaders emulate
        > his
        > > behavior and mistreat other Eckists: the silent treatment,
        > shunning,
        > > taking away initiations and positions and so forth.
        >
        > There's a saying in my language that goes like that: as the
        master,
        > so the follower - it's easy to see in Eckankar! :-)
        > >
        > > Well, what an experience Eckankar has been! : )
        >
        > It definitely has been - and good that it "has been"! :-)
        >
        > Ingrid
      • Greg and Liz
        ... buying new books--keeps the money rolling in. I think it is an indicator of how easily brainwashed and misled people can be in such situations. *** I
        Message 3 of 9 , Jun 19, 2005
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          mishmisha9 <mishmisha9@...> wrote:

          > Both books are basically the same, but Klemp republishes many of his writings under new titles--anyone notice that? 

          >snip<

          > Why, did he do this? Well, it keeps people
          buying new books--keeps the money rolling in. I think it is an
          indicator of how easily brainwashed and misled people can be in such situations.

          ***  I would have to say that Harold is not very good at authoring books!  He may have been an editor, but a writer he wasn't!  I also have to believe (and heard from mom who worked at esc for years) that the editors (who were establishes writes *some of them*) at esc recognized this in him and was able to work around his lack of skills by publishing his talks, and republishing his same ol shit, different title.....  don't forget he also created most of his stories from Initiate reports or stuff others wrote in about, in the hopes it would get published in the cult mystic news.   

          I never did see much spiritual "meat" to digest in his talks or books....  mostly slept through his seminar talks!  Mom used to say it was okay, since soul could still hear every word the mahanta spewed!   LOL

        • mishmisha9
          Well, what did we ever see in Harold then? Not good at writing and/or giving great talks? He certainly does not have charisma or looks either! LOL! It seems to
          Message 4 of 9 , Jun 19, 2005
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            Well, what did we ever see in Harold then? Not good at writing
            and/or giving great talks? He certainly does not have charisma or
            looks either! LOL! It seems to be a mystery!


            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Greg and Liz
            <whitefeatherliz@y...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > mishmisha9 <mishmisha9@y...> wrote:
            > > Both books are basically the same, but Klemp republishes many of
            his writings under new titles--anyone notice that?
            >
            > >snip<
            >
            > > Why, did he do this? Well, it keeps people
            > buying new books--keeps the money rolling in. I think it is an
            > indicator of how easily brainwashed and misled people can be in
            such situations.
            >
            > *** I would have to say that Harold is not very good at authoring
            books! He may have been an editor, but a writer he wasn't! I also
            have to believe (and heard from mom who worked at esc for years)
            that the editors (who were establishes writes *some of them*) at esc
            recognized this in him and was able to work around his lack of
            skills by publishing his talks, and republishing his same ol shit,
            different title..... don't forget he also created most of his
            stories from Initiate reports or stuff others wrote in about, in the
            hopes it would get published in the cult mystic news.
            >
            > I never did see much spiritual "meat" to digest in his talks or
            books.... mostly slept through his seminar talks! Mom used to say
            it was okay, since soul could still hear every word the mahanta
            spewed! LOL
          • Greg and Liz
            ... *** I can only speak for myself; being raised in the cult from a young age, we were told that we are to follow who ever holds the rod of eck power at the
            Message 5 of 9 , Jun 20, 2005
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              mishmisha9 <mishmisha9@...> wrote:

              >Well, what did we ever see in Harold then? Not good at writing and/or giving great talks? He certainly does not have charisma or looks either! LOL! It seems to be a mystery!

              *** I can only speak for myself;  being raised in the cult from a young age, we were told that we are to follow who ever holds the rod of eck power at the time.  Not to question why!  You know the hitch....  

            • mishmisha9
              Yeah, you were young and innocent! LOL! I don t have an excuse--I guess mine was a mental slip of some sort regarding right discrimination. Mish ... and/or
              Message 6 of 9 , Jun 20, 2005
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                Yeah, you were young and innocent! LOL! I don't have an excuse--I
                guess mine was a mental slip of some sort regarding right
                discrimination.

                Mish

                --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, Greg and Liz
                <whitefeatherliz@y...> wrote:
                >
                >
                > mishmisha9 <mishmisha9@y...> wrote:
                > >Well, what did we ever see in Harold then? Not good at writing
                and/or giving great talks? He certainly does not have charisma or
                looks either! LOL! It seems to be a mystery!
                >
                >
                > *** I can only speak for myself; being raised in the cult from a
                young age, we were told that we are to follow who ever holds the rod
                of eck power at the time. Not to question why! You know the hitch....
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