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Re: Is Klemp a Terrorist? 9/11/89 - 9/11/01 a 12 Year Cycle

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  • prometheus_973
    What does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta have to fear? Doesn t he give his protection to ECKists? Why then do ECKists still need to go through Metal Detectors and have
    Message 1 of 16 , Sep 14, 2006
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      What does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta have to fear? Doesn't he give his
      protection to ECKists? Why then do ECKists still need to go through
      Metal Detectors and have their bags searched, at the ECK World Wide
      Seminar (EWWS), before going into the Main Hall for Klemp's talks?
      This is more proof that shows Klemp is Not what he claims to be!
      Eckists are very afraid... of the Truth!

      mishmisha wrote:
      Hi, All!

      Today is a day of remembrance of the attacks on the WTC and the
      Pentagon 5 years ago. A lot of people, including eckists, are still
      trying to make sense out of this tragic event. The connection that
      one eckist on HuChat was attempting was to tie the 9/11/01 to Klemp
      plunging his shovel in the ground on 9/11/89 in Chanhassen, to begin
      construction of the eck temple. This eckist intricately drew
      parallels to the two events, linking them up as an important 12 Year
      Cycle in eckankar--giving it eck significance, and in doing so, he
      connected the mahanta to the actions of the terrorists who attacked
      the WTC and the Pentagon. As Prometheus points out eckists are not
      to see the negative connections to the mahanta, so I guess this
      eckist is sorely lacking in eck education/etiquette! : ) But maybe
      he is not alone in this thinking? Attached below are my original
      post and Prometheus' reply.

      On an added note, I was reading TIME magazine, the Sept, 11, 2006
      edition, "What We Lost." Inside, there is an article on the
      conspiracy myths of 9/11 which might help explain our need to look
      for links tying in conspiracies to major tragic events--including
      suggesting that the mahanta might have been part of the terrorist
      activities. The article by Lev Grossman begins with this
      header: "Why the 9/11 Conspiracies Won't Go Away . . . Turns out, we
      need grand theories to make sense of grand events, or the world just
      seems too random."

      The article goes on to explain: "There are psychological
      explanations for why conspiracy theories are so seductive. Academics
      who study them argue that they meet a basic human need: to have the
      magnitude of any given effect be balanced by the magnitude of the
      cause behind it. A world in which tiny causes can have huge
      consequences feels scary and unreliable. Therefore a grand disaster
      like Sept. 11 needs a grand conspiracy behind it. 'We tend to
      associate major events--a President or princess dying--with major
      causes,' says Patrick Leman, a lecturer in psychology at Royal
      Holloway University of London, who has conducted studies on
      conspiracy belief.'If we think big events like a President being
      assassinated can happen at the hands of a minor individual, that
      points to the the unpredictability and randomness of life and
      unsettles us.' In that sense, the idea that there is a malevolent
      controlling force orchestrating global events is, in a perverse way,
      comforting."

      My hunch is that the eckist who was weaving in a 12 Year Cycle in
      eck to the events of 9/11/01 was simply trying to comfort himself by
      attempting to validate his belief in the power of his beloved
      mahanta, but in so doing, he actually turned his mahanta into an
      agent for the kal. Of course, those of us who view Klemp and his org
      as a cult, see this as the bigger picture; but of course, we know
      Klemp has no powers to control others or to orchestrate such worldly
      events! However, scamming people into believing in a bogus religion
      is definitely a conspiracy and as such has long range negative
      effects on those who fall for the scam until they, like us (former
      eckists) eventually come to recognize their own gulliability in
      being duped by the eck lies and deceptions. The realization of our
      gulliability is an awareness that will lead people, including some
      eckists eventually, to higher consciousness. The ties that
      unbind and liberate us back to being free thinkers and masters of
      our fate!

      Bringing our experiences and what we have gleaned from our "eck"
      experiences in posts to this site serve the purpose of helping
      others confused and questioning the eck leadership and org to come
      to this greater awareness. For me, a strong sense of duty to share
      my perspectives and experiences guides me to participate on this
      site. Looking back, it is really funny to see how I fell for the eck
      scam. I find it amusing as well as enlightening that it could happen
      to me! : )

      BTW, welcome Makizor and Victorious Traveler for joining our group!

      I've attached the earlier posts so one can easily access what was
      posted previously!

      Mish

      Prometheus wrote:

      It seems that Klemp's Connection (as Peter points out) to the
      Negative Events of 9/11/2001 do connect HK to the Kal! However,
      while ECKists are supposed to pay attention to details they are Not
      to see Negative connections to their Mahanta. This is the Catch-22
      rule that Klemp lives by. Of course, the Catch-22 rule was created
      by the Kal. Klemp, Gross, and Twitchell's Eckankar can't stand up to
      the Truth. Those Eckists who continue to believe these distortions
      and close their eyes and minds to Truth are only fooling themselves.

      Prometheus

      mishmisha wrote:

      Hi, All!
      I thought I would bring this post back to the front page since we
      are on the eve of the 5th year anniversary since the devastating
      attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, Sept. 11, 2001.
      As a further note, I have read some discussions by eckists who
      believe that no eckists perished in these attacks, as they were
      delayed or had changes of plans that kept them away from their jobs
      in the WTC and the Pentagon that day--they believe this is because
      eckists were protected by the mahanta. However, how do eckists
      account for the stories of other non-eckists who also did not go to
      work that day or were late, etc. and they too were spared the
      horrors of the day?? I have friends whose son and daughter-in-law
      would have been in the area, if not in the WTC that fateful day, but
      they had car trouble and were at a dealership looking to buy a new
      car. These are Christians who know nothing about eckankar or the
      mahanta. If no eckists were at all at the WTC or the Pentagon that
      day, I rather think it would be more because no eckists worked at
      those places in 2001! After all, eckists are quite a minority,
      religiously speaking--quite the minority in more ways than one! Just
      a small school of small fish in a very large pond!: )

      Below is the repost in which another eckist saw a connection between
      Harold Klemp (a twelve year cycle) and the terrorist attacks, which
      then asks the question, "Is Harold Klemp a Terrorist?" LOL!

      Hi, All!
      I just read a couple of interesting posts (kinda interesting, that
      is) on an eck chat site. One eckist came to an "awesome
      realization." Here's his post:


      ********************************************************************

      "I just came to an Awesome Realization this morning. I was watching
      the Temple of Eck video one last time before returning it to my
      local Eck Center during a Satsang Class I'm attending. Toward the
      end of the tape Something Caught My Eye that I Almost Missed and
      Might Have Regarded Only Casually, BUT I Reversed The Tape to see it
      again. It was the Date that Sri Harold Broke Ground for the Temple--
      SEPTEMBER 11, 1989. The narrator stated the Time as 10:30 am (which
      would be Central Time Daylight Time in Minnesota).

      This is Exactly 12 Years Before the Events Surrounding the Attack on
      the Twin Towers of the World Trade Center Took Place. The First
      Plane Hit at 8:46 am and the Second at 9:02 am Eastern daylight Time
      (which is 1 hour later than Central Time). The First Tower Fell at
      10:05 am and the Second at 10:28 am. (Source:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_11,_2001 attacks)

      Exactly Twelve Years After Sri Harold Klemp Pierced the Earth with
      his Shovel, the Second Plane Had Hit its Tower 28 Minutes Earlier
      and the First Tower was to Fall 28 minutes Later.

      I'm Just Reporting the Facts. I can't help but entertain various
      interpretations, but will keep them to myself for now as they might
      interfere with the significance that any of you might see." [My caps]


      *********************************************************************
      ME: It seems this eckist is trying to tie the attack on the World
      Trade Center to his beloved mahanta! LOL! Well, I guess if there is
      a connection with HK piercing the earth with a shovel 12 years
      earlier to the 9-11-2001 tragedy, then I guess we might need to
      label HK as a terrorist?? I mean did he have a part in the death of
      thousands of people, was he a part of the conspiracy to bring the
      Twin Towers down? I wonder if HK knows Osama bin Laden personally?
      Perhaps, Osama bin Laden is yet another eck master--not mentioned
      with the ones in "Those Wonderful ECK Masters" book, but perhaps
      there will be a story about him in the next master's book, along
      with further promotion of Joan being an eck master in training to
      become co-L.E.M. : )

      Well, more importantly, though, I have to wonder what is going
      through this eckist's mind in trying to link one thing to another,
      by applying the eck beliefs in the cycle of twelves. Interesting how
      people want to attach significance of important historical dates to
      their belief systems, i.e. eckankar. HK and his mighty powerful
      shovel began a course of destruction for what purpose?? Just more
      delusion building on delusion IMO! : )

      *********************************************************************
      Another eckist responded to this post:

      "Most of the Temple tour guides are aware of this. The cycles of 12
      are apparently very powerful. Can't say much more than that because
      I don't really understand it that well, myself. . . . "


      *********************************************************************

      ME: I would imagine it is difficult for eckists to understand the
      ways of their master--a master who goes off on a temporary postal
      worker just doing his job and who calls disgruntled eckists losers.
      Now we have the 9-11-2001 terrorist connection! Pretty scary
      mahanta! LOL!

      Mish
    • Elizabeth
      ... *** A good question! The answer might be that Klemp isn t all that knowing and powerful God Man he claims to be. If he was than he wouldn t be worried
      Message 2 of 16 , Sep 14, 2006
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        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
        <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
        >
        > What does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta have to fear? Doesn't he give his
        > protection to ECKists? Why then do ECKists still need to go through
        > Metal Detectors and have their bags searched, at the ECK World Wide
        > Seminar (EWWS), before going into the Main Hall for Klemp's talks?
        > This is more proof that shows Klemp is Not what he claims to be!
        > Eckists are very afraid... of the Truth!
        >
        >

        *** A good question! The answer might be that Klemp isn't all that
        knowing and powerful God Man he claims to be. If he was than he
        wouldn't be worried about ex eckist or whom ever, that might show up
        at the WW to infiltrate his little organization, and cause trouble.
      • prometheus_973
        Hi Liz, Actually the Metal Detectors and bag searches didn t happen until after 9/11/2001. It doesn t have anything to do with people standing up to shout out
        Message 3 of 16 , Sep 14, 2006
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          Hi Liz,
          Actually the Metal Detectors and bag searches didn't happen until
          after 9/11/2001. It doesn't have anything to do with people standing
          up to shout out and disrupt his talks. I've seen that happen before
          and people could do that anyway with or without the other security
          (fear) features. Besides, why would anyone want to harm Klemp AFTER
          9/11 if they never tried BEFORE 9/11? The Security is for Klemp and
          nobody else! BUT, why should HK be afraid? Maybe he's fearful and
          paranoid because he's always been rather anti-social and reclusive?

          Yes, it's true that Klemp has No real Spiritual Powers except in the
          deluded minds of his followers/servants and in the false teachings
          of the first Scammer Paul Twitchell. Klemp is very controlling,
          unknowing and unloving, although, he'd never admit to any of this
          due to his inflated ego and stubborn narrow-minded nature.

          Look for some 09/2006 H.I. Letter information coming soon!

          Prometheus

          Elizabeth wrote:
          Prometheus wrote:

          What does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta have to fear? Doesn't he give his
          protection to ECKists? Why then do ECKists still need to go through
          Metal Detectors and have their bags searched, at the ECK World Wide
          Seminar (EWWS), before going into the Main Hall for Klemp's talks?
          This is more proof that shows Klemp is Not what he claims to be!
          Eckists are very afraid... of the Truth!

          *** A good question! The answer might be that Klemp isn't all that
          knowing and powerful God Man he claims to be. If he was than he
          wouldn't be worried about ex eckist or whom ever, that might show up
          at the WW to infiltrate his little organization, and cause trouble.
        • mishmisha9
          Hi, All! I think as well that these actions demonstrate fear and it trickles down to the chelas--just another fear tactic. But who would really care that much
          Message 4 of 16 , Sep 15, 2006
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            Hi, All!

            I think as well that these actions demonstrate fear and it trickles
            down to the chelas--just another fear tactic. But who would really
            care that much about a miniscule religion like eckankar and its
            little godman to threaten it??? It's just a bunch of nonsense to try
            to look important and to also make chelas jump through more hoops,
            like little circus animals really! : )

            But I have to admit, it would be fun to witness someone stand up and
            shout at Klemp when he's giving one of his silly talks! Now, that
            would be interesting . . . to see how Klemp would handle it. Well, I
            guess, it's his show so one needs to be polite or not be there at
            all! Yep, I'm not going to the EWWS this year, again! LOL!

            Mish

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
            <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi Liz,
            > Actually the Metal Detectors and bag searches didn't happen until
            > after 9/11/2001. It doesn't have anything to do with people
            standing
            > up to shout out and disrupt his talks. I've seen that happen
            before
            > and people could do that anyway with or without the other security
            > (fear) features. Besides, why would anyone want to harm Klemp
            AFTER
            > 9/11 if they never tried BEFORE 9/11? The Security is for Klemp
            and
            > nobody else! BUT, why should HK be afraid? Maybe he's fearful and
            > paranoid because he's always been rather anti-social and
            reclusive?
            >
            > Yes, it's true that Klemp has No real Spiritual Powers except in
            the
            > deluded minds of his followers/servants and in the false teachings
            > of the first Scammer Paul Twitchell. Klemp is very controlling,
            > unknowing and unloving, although, he'd never admit to any of this
            > due to his inflated ego and stubborn narrow-minded nature.
            >
            > Look for some 09/2006 H.I. Letter information coming soon!
            >
            > Prometheus
            >
            > Elizabeth wrote:
            > Prometheus wrote:
            >
            > What does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta have to fear? Doesn't he give his
            > protection to ECKists? Why then do ECKists still need to go
            through
            > Metal Detectors and have their bags searched, at the ECK World
            Wide
            > Seminar (EWWS), before going into the Main Hall for Klemp's talks?
            > This is more proof that shows Klemp is Not what he claims to be!
            > Eckists are very afraid... of the Truth!
            >
            > *** A good question! The answer might be that Klemp isn't all
            that
            > knowing and powerful God Man he claims to be. If he was than he
            > wouldn't be worried about ex eckist or whom ever, that might show
            up
            > at the WW to infiltrate his little organization, and cause trouble.
            >
          • prometheus_973
            ECKists are preparing to make an outer pilgrimage to the 2006 EWWS. Why? And, are there Metal Detectors and Bag Searches at the other Golden Wisdom Temples on
            Message 5 of 16 , Oct 7, 2006
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              ECKists are preparing to make an outer pilgrimage to the 2006 EWWS.
              Why? And, are there Metal Detectors and Bag Searches at the other
              Golden Wisdom Temples on the physical Plane or on the "inner" at the
              other Lower Plane Golden Wisdom Temples of ECK??

              Hi Liz, (revised)
              Actually the Metal Detectors and Bag Searches didn't happen until
              After 9/11/2001. It doesn't have anything to do with people standing
              up to shout out and disrupt his talks. I've seen that happen before
              and they were led out to the hallway... no big deal really.
              Sometimes normal/loyal ECKists will just get a little more out of
              balance at these Seminars and tempers flare, etc. Also,
              ECKists/people could shout out anyway with or without the security
              (fear) features. Besides, why would anyone want to harm Klemp (AFTER
              9/11) if they never tried BEFORE (9/11)? There was much more
              animosity and hurt feelings around 1983-1984 when Gross (the 972nd
              LEM/Mahanta) was being mistreated by Klemp and Company.

              The Security is for Klemp and nobody else! This is why Metal
              Detectors and Bag Searches are Only done when he is to speak in the
              Main Hall.

              On another note: Why are there searches at the Temple of ECK?
              ECKists can't bring bags in with them on the Temple tours! Are
              Eckists searched at every ECK Worship Service or just during the
              Temple Tours? WHY? Why the fear? 99.9% of these people are ECKists!
              This was never done before 9/11/2001.

              Why should HK, the LEM/Mahanta, be afraid? HK's fearful and paranoid
              because he's always been rather anti-social, reclusive, and
              judgmental of others. He's an idiot and a scammer! Lately, I think
              Klemp has been worried about that Negative Karma he's built up over
              the years. The rationalizing about being the "fix" as a pseudo
              saviour/master for ECKists to follow doesn't mean a thing any
              longer. Klemp can no longer fool even himself about the real Truth!

              Yes, it's true that Klemp has No real Spiritual Powers, except, in
              the deluded minds of his followers/servants and in the false
              teachings of the first Scammer Paul Twitchell. Klemp is very
              controlling, unknowing and unloving, although, he'd never admit to
              any of this due to his inflated ego and stubborn narrow-minded
              nature.

              Prometheus

              Elizabeth wrote:
              Prometheus wrote:

              What does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta have to fear? Doesn't he give his
              protection to ECKists? Why then do ECKists still need to go through
              Metal Detectors and have their bags searched, at the ECK World Wide
              Seminar (EWWS), before going into the Main Hall for Klemp's talks?
              This is more proof that shows Klemp is Not what he claims to be!
              Eckists are very afraid... of the Truth!

              *** A good question! The answer might be that Klemp isn't all that
              knowing and powerful God Man he claims to be. If he was than he
              wouldn't be worried about ex eckist or whom ever, that might show up
              at the WW to infiltrate his little organization, and cause trouble.
            • pretujari
              Hi All, There s an African proverb which states that A scared man runs away when there is no one after him Pretujari ... EWWS. ... the ... standing ...
              Message 6 of 16 , Oct 7, 2006
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                Hi All,
                There's an African proverb which states that 'A scared man runs away
                when there is no one after him"

                Pretujari

                --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
                <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
                >
                > ECKists are preparing to make an outer pilgrimage to the 2006
                EWWS.
                > Why? And, are there Metal Detectors and Bag Searches at the other
                > Golden Wisdom Temples on the physical Plane or on the "inner" at
                the
                > other Lower Plane Golden Wisdom Temples of ECK??
                >
                > Hi Liz, (revised)
                > Actually the Metal Detectors and Bag Searches didn't happen until
                > After 9/11/2001. It doesn't have anything to do with people
                standing
                > up to shout out and disrupt his talks. I've seen that happen
                before
                > and they were led out to the hallway... no big deal really.
                > Sometimes normal/loyal ECKists will just get a little more out of
                > balance at these Seminars and tempers flare, etc. Also,
                > ECKists/people could shout out anyway with or without the security
                > (fear) features. Besides, why would anyone want to harm Klemp
                (AFTER
                > 9/11) if they never tried BEFORE (9/11)? There was much more
                > animosity and hurt feelings around 1983-1984 when Gross (the 972nd
                > LEM/Mahanta) was being mistreated by Klemp and Company.
                >
                > The Security is for Klemp and nobody else! This is why Metal
                > Detectors and Bag Searches are Only done when he is to speak in
                the
                > Main Hall.
                >
                > On another note: Why are there searches at the Temple of ECK?
                > ECKists can't bring bags in with them on the Temple tours! Are
                > Eckists searched at every ECK Worship Service or just during the
                > Temple Tours? WHY? Why the fear? 99.9% of these people are
                ECKists!
                > This was never done before 9/11/2001.
                >
                > Why should HK, the LEM/Mahanta, be afraid? HK's fearful and
                paranoid
                > because he's always been rather anti-social, reclusive, and
                > judgmental of others. He's an idiot and a scammer! Lately, I think
                > Klemp has been worried about that Negative Karma he's built up
                over
                > the years. The rationalizing about being the "fix" as a pseudo
                > saviour/master for ECKists to follow doesn't mean a thing any
                > longer. Klemp can no longer fool even himself about the real
                Truth!
                >
                > Yes, it's true that Klemp has No real Spiritual Powers, except, in
                > the deluded minds of his followers/servants and in the false
                > teachings of the first Scammer Paul Twitchell. Klemp is very
                > controlling, unknowing and unloving, although, he'd never admit to
                > any of this due to his inflated ego and stubborn narrow-minded
                > nature.
                >
                > Prometheus
                >
                > Elizabeth wrote:
                > Prometheus wrote:
                >
                > What does Klemp the LEM/Mahanta have to fear? Doesn't he give his
                > protection to ECKists? Why then do ECKists still need to go
                through
                > Metal Detectors and have their bags searched, at the ECK World
                Wide
                > Seminar (EWWS), before going into the Main Hall for Klemp's talks?
                > This is more proof that shows Klemp is Not what he claims to be!
                > Eckists are very afraid... of the Truth!
                >
                > *** A good question! The answer might be that Klemp isn't all
                that
                > knowing and powerful God Man he claims to be. If he was than he
                > wouldn't be worried about ex eckist or whom ever, that might show
                up
                > at the WW to infiltrate his little organization, and cause trouble.
                >
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