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Re: Most of what Ekankar teaches is untrue...

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  • ctecvie
    Hello Mish and all, ... ************************* ... or, if they don t borrow them, they sometimes just grossly exaggerate them. On huchat recently, an
    Message 1 of 8 , Jul 26, 2006
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      Hello Mish and all,

      --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "mishmisha9"
      <mishmisha9@...> wrote:

      > good comments and thoughts, you guys!
      >
      > Chelas are encouraged to "borrow" spiritual stories when they give
      > talks at intros and workshops in order to sucker new people into
      >the
      > org.

      *************************
      ... or, if they don't "borrow" them, they sometimes just grossly
      exaggerate them. On huchat recently, an eckist was moving from
      Montana to Minnesota. And I quote:
      "When I left Montana last Friday evening, fires broke out all around
      me, really spooky. Ash covered the road, thousands of acres burned
      and are still burning, even around Billings. Pounding rain, lightning
      strikes all around me. It was the trip of my life. I finally pulled
      out of this mess driving east and through North Dakota, but a quarter
      through North Dakota I saw a cloud that kept lighting up and as I
      drove closer to Minnesota, again lightning all around
      me. But Minnesota is too moist to catch fire." Unquote

      Well, how does that sound? To me, it sounds as if the fires had
      broken out because of the move of this lady. She seems to consider
      herself very much an eck master. When asked, she never says so
      directly of course, but she never denies it either! LOL!

      Asked for the reasons of her move, she states this: "Reason why I
      moved? The Mahanta told me so :-)". And then she goes on saying "The
      outer signs were as follows ..." Well, I don't really see what "the
      mahanta told her so" LOL!

      *************************

      >At some worship services, someone will stand at the back of the
      > room (without being announced) and play a few notes on a flute
      >while
      > the group is singing Hu--real blatant trickery! Stories are very
      > often embellished, either intentionally or because the story teller
      > is delusional--it is all taken as "truth." There is so much fakery,
      > and yet, the chelas accept it as real or at the very least
      >possible,
      > because they want to believe in something greater than themselves.
      > Really sad!
      >
      > But what is really funny is to read some of the discussions on the
      > eck chat sites where some do disagree or try to correct someone
      > else's view--they can be very abrupt, and maybe even harsh, and
      > certainly narrow, but at the end of the post, they will sign off
      > with "love!" LOL! Just really ludicrous! I guess the disagreeable
      > poster found it necessary and true to disagree sharply, but signing
      > off with love made it kind??? Confusion abounds and grows, doesn't
      > it!!

      *************************
      Well, I think they just don't know how harsh they really are. They
      just suppress all the negativity and so cannot deal with their own
      aggressive streak because they don't even know they have it! I know
      many eckists that seem kind enough, but when they don't like
      something, they just won't react or respond. Sometimes this can be
      very unkind or a rebuke, too, towards the sender who might have had
      the kindest intentions!

      Ingrid
    • prometheus_973
      Hi Freefrom, You make some good points. Eckists become like everyone else when it comes to promoting their scam. By Any Means Necessary is one way to justify
      Message 2 of 8 , Jul 26, 2006
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        Hi Freefrom,
        You make some good points. Eckists become like everyone else when it
        comes to promoting their scam. 'By Any Means Necessary' is one way
        to justify the use of negative methods (including deceit) to fight
        the Negative Force (Kal). Two negatives make a positive - right! As
        I implied, Eckists (including Klemp) use the same amoral methods of
        others to justify their missionary/vahana efforts, while feeding
        their own ego. Eckankar's narrow, distorted, jargon based and
        delusional and dogmatic thought processes feed and elevate the ego
        while blocking out and numbing Soul from higher consciousness - this
        is the true by-product of the vahana efforts for the individual
        Eckist. It has nothing to do with Love or the spreading of Truth!

        When Klemp, early on, inadvertantly admits in the PT info on
        Eckankar.org that Twitchell (born 1908) lied about meeting Sudar
        Singh (970th LEM) in India in 1935 at the age of 27 when he was
        lying about his Who's Who achievements what does this say about Love
        or Truth!? Neither have anything to do with the creation of
        Eckankar! Eckankar is not an "Ancient Path" because it is a
        distorted and Werternized version of Radhasoami created by a
        professional liar!

        7th Initiates are Not 8ths on the Inner because the Eck Initiations
        have to be confirmed in the third and final stage on the outer.
        [Maters 4 Discourse, lesson 2] Besides, these "Inner Initiations"
        are false anyway. This is just a ploy to get Eckists to stick around
        when they really know that something is wrong with the Eck teachings
        and their fellow H.I.s. However, it is a clever technique that
        scammers use to put all the blame of guilt and shame (even karma)
        back on the chela/follower/true believer. Very clever, but nothing
        new here either.

        One more thing. When Klemp quotes the Christian Bible - I was just
        wondering about the World Consciousness when this was written versus
        the World Consciousness when Twitchell "wrote" his Eckankar
        information. Why is one still quoted while much of the other is not
        available or reprinted?

        Prometheus




        Freefrom wrote:
        Prometheus wrote:
        Re: Most of what Ekankar teaches is untrue... Twitchell twisted
        facts, and lied about everything. There are no Inner initiations or
        Eck Masters. Rebazar was really a fictionalized version of Kirpal!

        *** These differences in ethics and values just proves, even more
        so, that the Eck Initiations have no correlation to higher
        consciousness. When people accept lies as being a part of their
        belief system what is it that they really and truly believe in? What
        and Who can they trust or do they trust everything that a person in
        authority tells them?

        ***Here's a discussion question for Satsang - Are some lies and
        embellishments okay, and if so, which ones?! And, was it okay that
        Twitchell made embellishments and twisted facts as HK has stated?

        Freefrom:

        And what would be the typical eckist answer? It's not only fine and
        okay, but in their Twitch way of thinking, it is probably NECESSARY.
        lol Therefore, it is also TRUE and KIND, kind in the eckankult
        ruthless way. THis kind of compartmentalized thinking, if we can
        even call it that, er thinking, is so typical of the authoritarian
        cult mentality, the numbing, dumbing down of the intellect and also
        the emotional life, IMO. Switching off feelings is very important to
        a Cult leader like Harold Klemp and his middle management higher
        initiates. The word "kind" then can take on a whole new Cult
        meaning, that in reality is unkind, unloving, and untrue. Eckankult
        takes these little mundane lies that people engage in all the time
        out of courtesy, or whatever, to a completely different level, shall
        we say to a different plane of psuedo reality with their pseudo
        personality, LOL. It is truely unreal. ; o
      • mishmisha9
        Hi, All! I thought I d re-visit this topic thread from last July as it touches on why eckists can feel it is okay to lie--how they will justify the lie s
        Message 3 of 8 , Nov 19, 2006
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          Hi, All!

          I thought I'd re-visit this topic thread from last July as it
          touches on why eckists can "feel" it is okay to lie--how they will
          justify the lie's need and purpose, just as other people do when
          they feel compelled to step away from the truth and substitute
          falsehoods. As you read down this thread, I would like to point out
          the reference I made to the trickery of someone playing a flute in
          the back of the room during an eck worship service. Most eckists and
          seekers attending the worship service that day were not aware that
          this individual was playing a few single notes on the flute during
          the "HU" and contemplation. However, as an intro to the "HU" and
          contemplation activity, it was mentioned that one might possibly
          hear a flute playing which would indicate the Soul plane (5th
          plane). I wonder how many individuals went away from that worship
          service believing that they had experienced/connected to the Soul
          plane during that contemplation activity? This is outright trickery
          for the purpose of keeping eckists delusional and to entice new
          people to join. The flute playing was arranged in advance by the
          spiritual service coordinator and the local director (both H.I.s)--
          it was not something the individual eckist decided to do on his own.
          There were new seekers at that worship service. There are members on
          Hu-Chat who witnessed and even participated in this deception at the
          eck worship service. I'm pulling this up again to show how the eck
          teachings by the very nature of its lies and deceptions mislead
          eckists into the practices of being liars and deceivers. Really sad.
          Unfortunately for them, they cannot point their fingers at the
          detractors this time when in fact these kal eckists are their own
          detractors of truth.

          Mish

          --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "mishmisha9"
          <mishmisha9@...> wrote:
          >
          > --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Freefrom"
          > <eckchains@> wrote:
          > >
          > > --- In
          EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973"
          > > <prometheus_973@> wrote:
          > > >
          > > Re: Most of what Ekankar teaches is untrue...

          *** These differences in ethics and values just
          proves, even more so, that the Eck Initiations have no correlation
          to higher consciousness. When people accept lies as being a part of
          their belief system what is it that they really and truly believe
          in? What and Who can they trust or do they trust everything that a
          person in authority tells them?

          Here's a discussion question for Satsang - Are some lies and
          embellishments okay, and if so, which ones?! And, was it okay that
          Twitchell made embellishments and twisted facts as HK has stated?

          Prometheus
          ***

          And what would be the typical eckist answer? It's not only fine and
          okay, but in their Twitch way of thinking, it is probably
          NECESSARY. lol Therefore, it is also TRUE and KIND, kind in the
          eckankult ruthless way. THis kind of compartmentalized thinking, if
          we can even call it that, er thinking, is so typical of the
          authoritarian cult mentality, the numbing, dumbing down of the
          intellect and also the emotional life, IMO. Switching off feelings
          is very important to a Cult leader like Harold Klemp and his middle
          management higher initiates. The word "kind" then can take on a
          whole new Cult meaning, that in reality is unkind, unloving, and
          untrue. Eckankult takes these little mundane lies that people engage
          in all the time out of courtesy, or whatever, to a completely
          different level, shall we say to a different plane of psuedo reality
          with their pseudo personality, LOL. It is truely unreal. ; o

          Freefrom

          ****************************************************
          good comments and thoughts, you guys!

          Chelas are encouraged to "borrow" spiritual stories when they give
          talks at intros and workshops in order to sucker new people into the
          org. At some worship services, someone will stand at the back of the
          room (without being announced) and play a few notes on a flute while
          the group is singing Hu--real blatant trickery! Stories are very
          often embellished, either intentionally or because the story teller
          is delusional--it is all taken as "truth." There is so much fakery,
          and yet, the chelas accept it as real or at the very least possible,
          because they want to believe in something greater than themselves.
          Really sad!

          But what is really funny is to read some of the discussions on the
          eck chat sites where some do disagree or try to correct someone
          else's view--they can be very abrupt, and maybe even harsh, and
          certainly narrow, but at the end of the post, they will sign off
          with "love!" LOL! Just really ludicrous! I guess the disagreeable
          poster found it necessary and true to disagree sharply, but signing
          off with love made it kind??? Confusion abounds and grows, doesn't
          it!!

          Mish
          >
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