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Re: Sickness Surfaces again with a New Face

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  • prometheus_973
    Great Post! All of this shows how Klemp uses the Catch-22 method of rule. He specializes in giving advice to others while never applying it to himself. This
    Message 1 of 7 , Jun 23, 2006
      Great Post!
      All of this shows how Klemp uses the Catch-22 method of rule. He
      specializes in giving advice to others while never applying it to
      himself. This delusional and anti-social attitude shows an
      arrogance, a lack of empathy, and a disconnect from humanity and to
      Eck chelas. Klemp contradicts himself often and shows no concern
      about this because he disrespects the Eck puppets who follow his
      nonsense. Klemp talks out of both sides of his mouth as would any
      Kal agent.

      Here's an example of more Klemp contradictions: "When someone says
      BUT, it's a nail in the coffin of invention. A constant stream of
      contradictions shuts off creativity and a gift that may be offered.
      And when someone say BUT he's stopped listening. SO BE AWARE OF
      USING IF. AND ESPECIALLY WHEN USING BUT, BECAUSE IT'S LIMITING...
      THIS IS PRETTY MUCH FOR OURSELVES, because in dealing with others,
      you may need to use if, and, or but." [The H.I. Letter, December
      2005 (My caps)]

      Eckists should now read every Mystic World, H.I. Letter, and Letter
      of Light article (Wisdom Notes too) by Klemp since 12/2005, and look
      for IFs and especially for BUTs that Klemp continues to use!

      In the JUNE 2006 "THE WISDOM NOTES" Klemp uses FOUR BUTs!

      So, is Klemp simply unaware of what he has previously said and is
      doing? That's a scary thought for Eckists! What else is screwed up
      due to a lack of attentiveness, and how can he be doing all he
      claims or be ALL KNOWING and POWERFUL as the Mahanta?!

      Or, is Klemp just a liar and con-man, too, and could care less about
      what he says and does? Afterall, most Eckists are basically
      followers and "followers" are both passive and trusting. They don't
      question things because they NEED Eckankar and something outside of
      themSelves to believe in. Questions need Answers and most Eckists
      don't want to really hear those answers, therefore, they don't ask
      the "difficult" questions. Eckists tend to Only ask easy questions
      because these are basically done for re-enforcement of what they
      have already accepted on faith. If the mind wants to believe in and
      accept something then it will find ways to do so. This is why Klemp
      pushes Eckists to use their "Imaginations" and to place mental
      energy and attention on the Mahanta.

      HK, also, sees himself as a law unto himself (just like Twitch
      proclaimed) and that means he can implement the CATCH-22 rule
      anytime he sees fit!

      BTW, in the June 2006 "The Wisdom Notes" Klemp states:

      "Many spiritual issues come to my attention, notably cases of
      ECKists who refuce to accept apparant misfortunes as blessings. They
      try to blame misfortunes on others. BUT who are they fooling? Only
      themselves. The Christian Bible puts it like this: 'Be not deceived;
      God is not mocked.'"

      Can we trust what HK has said because he negates it with the "BUT."
      Here's more Klemp crap from the next paragraph:

      "One such case is that of a middle-aged and lontime ECK Initiate. He
      readily gripes about conditions of his youth as responsible for his
      unrest and unhappiness. Yet surely not himself!"

      Why would a loving Mahanta with any empathy say something like this?
      Who is this anyway - Doug Marman? Should this have been shared in a
      Wisdom Note!?

      Klemp goes on in the next paragraph to say:

      "Whatever comes along in your life, it's good to remember that it's
      always a gift from the Holy Spirit, to strengthen you. There will be
      days when you seriously wonder IF you can bear up to one more such
      gift, even one short hour more of purification. BUT you can. It does
      take lots of love and trust, though."

      See, Klemp uses another "BUT" to negate his comments again! And,
      isn't it interesting that when Eckists do experience the KARMA that
      is not removed by the Mahanta that it becomes a "PURIFICATION" for
      them. Why, then, do Eckists need the Mahanta? Step up to the plate
      and take responsibility and become your own Master. Klemp will
      always make excuses and put it back on you anyway! Oh well, you can
      lead a horse to water BUT you can't make him drink! LOL!

      Prometheus




      ********************************************************************
      "The problem surrounding healing is karmic. The ill person once
      broke a divine principle through ignorance. Psychic healing can ease
      the symptoms for a while, but eventually the sickness surfaces again
      with a new face." by Harold Klemp: Spiritual Wisdom on Health and
      Healing, page 45

      *** You know I have to laugh every time Harold Klemp writes
      something like this in his books, discourses or even when he speaks
      about illnesses to his chelas! He is the perfect example of how
      Karma works when a person brakes a divine principle through
      ignorance! Should the Eck chelas listen to Klemp or the first Eck
      Master Paul Twitchell, concerning Karma and illness? ;-)

      Klemp writes:
      "It is surprising that some ECK initiates never make a connection
      between the Master's physical illness and their own spiritual
      unfoldment. They think, Why is he sick? Karma? How many fail to
      consider that an intense trial of spiritual purification among the
      chelas and people everywhere goes first through the universal body
      of the Mahanta. Those effects naturally show up in the Master's life
      as health or other reverses." - Harold Klemp, H.I. Letter, March
      1996

      *** So basically it is the lowly people of the entire universe and
      the Eck Chela's fault for why Klemp is so ill. (Klemp claims to be
      the holding tank for the Karma of the entire Universe)

      Paul Twitchell writes:
      "No master will ever take over the karma of anyone. He knows better
      for it will destroy his own health and drive him into despair." -
      All About ECK, page 43, Paul Twitchell

      Klemp writes:
      "The Rod of ECK Power gets too hot to handle beyond the time of your
      mission and you have to let it go. Or the Rod of ECK Power will burn
      you to a crisp. That means your health will go to destruction.
      Darwin Gross had to pass it. When my time comes I have to pass it."
      Harold Klemp, Eck H.I. Meeting, 1983 World Wide Of Eck, Los Angeles,
      California

      *** So will there be a New Face added to the Mythical Eck Master
      line up? Or will the board members decide to come clean and tell the
      truth about the lies behind Eckankar? Not likely! LOL
    • prometheus_973
      Hi Everyone, I inserted some more comments on down in this post and changed the title. Thanks again Liz for your original post that got me started. Prometheus
      Message 2 of 7 , Jun 24, 2006
        Hi Everyone,
        I inserted some more comments on down in this post and changed the
        title. Thanks again Liz for your original post that got me started.

        Prometheus wrote:

        Great Post!
        All of this shows how Klemp uses the Catch-22 method of rule. He
        specializes in giving advice to others while never applying it to
        himself. This delusional and anti-social attitude shows an
        arrogance, a lack of empathy, and a disconnect from humanity and to
        Eck chelas. Klemp contradicts himself often and shows no concern
        about this because he disrespects the Eck puppets who follow his
        nonsense. Klemp talks out of both sides of his mouth as would any
        Kal agent.

        *BTW, Here's some info on what the "CATCH-22" rule/logic refers to:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch-22


        Here's an example of more Klemp contradictions:

        "When someone says BUT, it's a nail in the coffin of invention. A
        constant stream of contradictions shuts off creativity and a gift
        that may be offered. And when someone say BUT he's stopped
        listening. SO BE AWARE OF USING IF. AND ESPECIALLY WHEN USING BUT,
        BECAUSE IT'S LIMITING... THIS IS PRETTY MUCH FOR OURSELVES, because
        in dealing with others, you may need to use if, and, or but." [The
        H.I. Letter, December 2005 (My caps)]

        Eckists should now read every Mystic World, H.I. Letter, and Letter
        of Light article (Wisdom Notes too) by Klemp since 12/2005, and look
        for IFs and especially for BUTs that Klemp continues to use!

        In the JUNE 2006 "THE WISDOM NOTES" Klemp uses FOUR BUTs!

        So, is Klemp simply unaware of what he has previously said and is
        doing? That's a scary thought for Eckists! What else is screwed up
        due to a lack of attentiveness, and how can he be doing all he
        claims or be ALL KNOWING and POWERFUL as the Mahanta?!

        Or, is Klemp just a liar and con-man, too, and could care less about
        what he says and does? Afterall, most Eckists are basically
        followers and "followers" are both passive and trusting. They don't
        question things because they NEED Eckankar and something outside of
        themSelves to believe in. Questions need Answers and most Eckists
        don't want to really hear those answers, therefore, they don't ask
        the "difficult" questions. Eckists tend to Only ask easy questions
        because these are basically done for re-enforcement of what they
        have already accepted on faith. If the mind wants to believe in and
        accept something then it will find ways to do so. This is why Klemp
        pushes Eckists to use their "Imaginations" and to place mental
        energy and attention on the Mahanta.

        HK, also, sees himself as a law unto himself (just like Twitch
        proclaimed) and that means he can implement the CATCH-22 rule
        anytime he sees fit!

        BTW, in the June 2006 "The Wisdom Notes" Klemp states:

        "Many spiritual issues come to my attention, notably cases of
        ECKists who refuce to accept apparant misfortunes as blessings. They
        try to blame misfortunes on others. BUT who are they fooling? Only
        themselves. The Christian Bible puts it like this: 'Be not deceived;
        God is not mocked.'"

        Can we trust what HK has said because he negates it with the "BUT."
        Here's more Klemp crap from the next paragraph:

        "One such case is that of a middle-aged and lontime ECK Initiate. He
        readily gripes about conditions of his youth as responsible for his
        unrest and unhappiness. Yet surely not himself!"

        Why would a loving Mahanta with any empathy say something like this?
        Who is this anyway - Doug Marman? Should this have been shared in a
        Wisdom Note!?

        Klemp goes on in the next paragraph to say:

        "Whatever comes along in your life, it's good to remember that it's
        always a gift from the Holy Spirit, to strengthen you. There will be
        days when you seriously wonder IF you can bear up to one more such
        gift, even one short hour more of purification. BUT you can. It does
        take lots of love and trust, though."

        See, Klemp uses another "BUT" to negate his comments again! And,
        isn't it interesting that when Eckists do experience the KARMA that
        is not removed by the Mahanta that it becomes a "PURIFICATION" for
        them. Why, then, do Eckists need the Mahanta? Step up to the plate
        and take responsibility and become your own Master. Klemp will
        always make excuses and put it back on you anyway! Oh well, you can
        lead a horse to water BUT you can't make him drink! LOL!
        *******************************************************************

        In The H.I. Letter - JUNE, 2006 Klemp uses just two "BUTs," however,
        it's what he negates according to his own standards, that he
        borrowed from Kant, that I find interesting. Klemp also has to quote
        from Twitchell's "Stranger by the River" since he, himself, has
        never written anything equivalent to this! : )

        HK: "It flows into all worlds below, through all of creation. It
        flows outward. BUT then, very unlike the great earthly river, It
        reverses course. The awsome Life Stream flows back through creation
        and once more into the heart of God, the Ocean of Love and Mercy."

        Actually, this whole H.I. Letter is disappointing! Where's the meat -
        the spiritual food? Klemp just repepeats the same old simplistic
        dogma over and over as though everyone is a newbie to Eck. Such is
        his consciousness! Anyway here's the continuation and the next thing
        that Klemp negates.

        HK: "The seeker knew some of this. BUT only a true Master could
        impart the deep secrets of God. And then he saw him--his Master, the
        wonderful ECK Master Rebazar Tarzs."

        So, Klemp, once again, is re-enforcing the belief in the fictitious
        Rebazar because Eckankar was founded upon his existence by Twitchell.
        WITHOUT THE BELIEF IN REBAZAR THERE IS NO Eckankar, Eck Masters,
        Mahanta, and Initiations!

        At the start of Klemp's front page article in June 2006 H.I. Letter
        he talks about a phrase in the lyrics to a Hank Williams song. The
        phrase was, 'the waltz of the wind.'

        I find this to be another contradiction by Klemp because in his
        October 2005 EWWS talk he states that, "Every thought, word or deed
        either purifies or pollutes the body" and this is why HK got rid of
        all of his CDs that had just "one negative song" on them. Klemp
        stated that he had a lot of Country Western 'tear jerker' songs that
        he gave away. Funny, Why would the LEM/Mahanta give "negative" songs
        to others, unless, HK was an agent for the Kal!

        Anyway Klemp, once again, is talking about Country Western music and
        Hank Williams and is using some lyrics he has recently listened to
        for his talk. Now HK didn't specify Hank "Sr." or "Jr." which is
        another oversight of detail that makes me question HK's mental
        state. So, it seems Klemp didn't pitch every Country Western CD.

        Just for the fun of it I looked up some Hank Sr. song titles that
        Klemp might still enjoy:

        -Are You Walking And A-Talking With the Lord
        -Cold Cold Heart
        -Be Careful of Stones That You Throw
        -My Love For You (Has Turned to Hate)
        -Alone and Forsaken
        -Howlin' At the Moon
        -Jesus Died For Me
        -May You Never Be Alone Like Me
        -30 Pieces of Silver or *Remember Darwin
        -A Home in Heaven
        -My Bucket's Got A Hole In It
        -Moanin' The Blues
        -Why Should I Cry
        -I Told A Lie To My Heart
        And the next one I thought would fit him perfectly : )
        -Two Faced Preacher

        ********************************************************************
        HK: "The problem surrounding healing is karmic. The ill person once
        broke a divine principle through ignorance. Psychic healing can ease
        the symptoms for a while, but eventually the sickness surfaces again
        with a new face." by Harold Klemp: Spiritual Wisdom on Health and
        Healing, page 45

        *** You know I have to laugh every time Harold Klemp writes
        something like this in his books, discourses or even when he speaks
        about illnesses to his chelas! He is the perfect example of how
        Karma works when a person brakes a divine principle through
        ignorance! Should the Eck chelas listen to Klemp or the first Eck
        Master Paul Twitchell, concerning Karma and illness? ;-)

        Klemp writes:
        "It is surprising that some ECK initiates never make a connection
        between the Master's physical illness and their own spiritual
        unfoldment. They think, Why is he sick? Karma? How many fail to
        consider that an intense trial of spiritual purification among the
        chelas and people everywhere goes first through the universal body
        of the Mahanta. Those effects naturally show up in the Master's life
        as health or other reverses." - Harold Klemp, H.I. Letter, March
        1996

        *** So basically it is the lowly people of the entire universe and
        the Eck Chela's fault for why Klemp is so ill. (Klemp claims to be
        the holding tank for the Karma of the entire Universe)

        Paul Twitchell writes:
        "No master will ever take over the karma of anyone. He knows better
        for it will destroy his own health and drive him into despair." -
        All About ECK, page 43, Paul Twitchell

        Klemp writes:
        "The Rod of ECK Power gets too hot to handle beyond the time of your
        mission and you have to let it go. Or the Rod of ECK Power will burn
        you to a crisp. That means your health will go to destruction.
        Darwin Gross had to pass it. When my time comes I have to pass it."
        Harold Klemp, Eck H.I. Meeting, 1983 World Wide Of Eck, Los Angeles,
        California

        *** So will there be a New Face added to the Mythical Eck Master
        line up? Or will the board members decide to come clean and tell the
        truth about the lies behind Eckankar? Not likely! LOL
      • prometheus_973
        Hi All, I find it interesting that Klemp has eliminated a great number of Twitchell s books and that Eckists don t seem to be concerned. Perhaps, Klemp s spin
        Message 3 of 7 , Jun 25, 2006
          Hi All,
          I find it interesting that Klemp has eliminated a great number of
          Twitchell's books and that Eckists don't seem to be concerned.

          Perhaps, Klemp's spin on this is that he is bringing Eckankar into
          the 21st Century and, therefore, the purpose of having a Living
          Master is to have a current version of truth. Also, a Living Master
          can "teach" while explaining away (and correcting) any confusions in
          dogma, etc. that might still linger from the past and, thus, a
          living link is needed to keep the teachings "pure" and alive.
          Actually, this is more the Radhasoami explaination for having a
          Living Master than Klemp's, although, Klemp does mimic this
          explaination, to various degrees, as well.

          However, how does eliminating or correcting the ECK teachings of
          Twitchell keep them PURE? That's like separating the straw from a
          cow pattie and saying, There, now it's pure!

          Klemp has, thus, re-molded Eckankar to look more and more Christian.
          This is because of his own background and training and this is why
          Klemp quotes from the Bible as much as he does and why there are
          Worship Services, Choirs, A Song Book, Clerics, Missionaries,
          Donations, a Hierarchy, and a God called God! After all Eckankar is
          Not called - the Religion of the Light and Sound of Sugmad!

          Actually, much of Twitchell's written work is fiction, distortions,
          and plagiarisms. And, unfortunately, PT's philosophy and his scam
          are all intertwind. Therefore, Klemp has kept some material and
          eliminated the rest. Unfortunately, for Klemp, he had no choice but
          to keep some of the plagiarized material because it was in the Holy
          Shariyats of Eckankar. Also, HK kept "Stranger by the River" because
          he needs the Rebazar connection and this is an important book for a
          spiritual seeker to relate to and one that HK could never duplicate!

          However, why isn't "Dialogues With the Master" offered anymore? This
          is a book that has Rebazar doing most of the talking. One would
          think that Klemp would want to share this wisdom coming from "the
          wonderful ECK Master Rebazar Tarzs!"

          Well, I'll have to continue this topic later. Please feel free to
          add more to the discussion and ponderings.

          Prometheus


          Liz wrote:
          HK: "The problem surrounding healing is karmic. The ill person once
          broke a divine principle through ignorance. Psychic healing can ease
          the symptoms for a while, but eventually the sickness surfaces again
          with a new face." by Harold Klemp: Spiritual Wisdom on Health and
          Healing, page 45

          *** You know I have to laugh every time Harold Klemp writes
          something like this in his books, discourses or even when he speaks
          about illnesses to his chelas! He is the perfect example of how
          Karma works when a person brakes a divine principle through
          ignorance! Should the Eck chelas listen to Klemp or the first Eck
          Master Paul Twitchell, concerning Karma and illness? ;-)

          Klemp writes:
          "It is surprising that some ECK initiates never make a connection
          between the Master's physical illness and their own spiritual
          unfoldment. They think, Why is he sick? Karma? How many fail to
          consider that an intense trial of spiritual purification among the
          chelas and people everywhere goes first through the universal body
          of the Mahanta. Those effects naturally show up in the Master's life
          as health or other reverses." - Harold Klemp, H.I. Letter, March
          1996

          *** So basically it is the lowly people of the entire universe and
          the Eck Chela's fault for why Klemp is so ill. (Klemp claims to be
          the holding tank for the Karma of the entire Universe)

          Paul Twitchell writes:
          "No master will ever take over the karma of anyone. He knows better
          for it will destroy his own health and drive him into despair." -
          All About ECK, page 43, Paul Twitchell

          Klemp writes:
          "The Rod of ECK Power gets too hot to handle beyond the time of your
          mission and you have to let it go. Or the Rod of ECK Power will burn
          you to a crisp. That means your health will go to destruction.
          Darwin Gross had to pass it. When my time comes I have to pass it."
          Harold Klemp, Eck H.I. Meeting, 1983 World Wide Of Eck, Los Angeles,
          California

          *** So will there be a New Face added to the Mythical Eck Master
          line up? Or will the board members decide to come clean and tell the
          truth about the lies behind Eckankar? Not likely! LOL
        • mishmisha9
          A more correct explanation for Klemp s sickliness is that he has poisoned his Soul with lies and scams. He s a dishonest heap of . . . crap! Too bad so many
          Message 4 of 7 , Jun 25, 2006
            A more correct explanation for Klemp's sickliness is that he has
            poisoned his Soul with lies and scams. He's a dishonest heap
            of . . . crap! Too bad so many fall for his scam!

            Mish

            --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, ewickings@...
            wrote:
            >
            > Not only is Klemp delusional, he has set himself up as a martyr!
            What a
            > guy...
            >
            >
            > Thank you Mahanta for your selfless sacrifice to the entire
            universe. ;-)
            >
            >
            > Just thought I would finish my thoughts on this topic,
            > and wish everyone a nice weekend!
            > TGIF
            >
            > Liz
            > -------------------------------------------------------------------
            -----------
            > ----------------
            > Klemp writes:
            > "It is surprising that some ECK initiates never make a connection
            > between the Master's physical illness and their own spiritual
            > unfoldment. They think, Why is he sick? Karma? How many fail to
            > consider that an intense trial of spiritual purification among the
            > chelas and people everywhere goes first through the universal
            body of
            > the Mahanta. Those effects naturally show up in the Master's life
            as
            > health or other reverses." - Harold Klemp, H.I. Letter, March 1996
            >
            > *** So basically it is the lowly people of the entire universe
            and the Eck
            > Chela's fault for why Klemp is so ill. (Klemp claims to be the
            holding tank
            > for the Karma of the entire
            > Universe)
            >
          • prometheus_973
            Hi Again, It is interesting that Twitchell eliminated Chastity (and vegetarianism) from the Eck teachings. The Virture of Chastity has only one opposing
            Message 5 of 7 , Jun 25, 2006
              Hi Again,
              It is interesting that Twitchell eliminated Chastity (and
              vegetarianism) from the Eck teachings. The Virture of Chastity has
              only one opposing Passion and that is Lust. Twitchell changed this
              and Eckists still haven't figured out why it is so difficult for
              them to match the 5 Passions to the 5 Virtures! LOL!

              Radhasoami and Paul's real Master, Kirpal Singh, had two issues of
              dogma that the Western students had problems with. Twitchell flip-
              flop on these issues, at one time, himself.

              PT: "There are thousands of paths to God. Yes, we realize that. Any
              church, any group, any cult, any of those eventually will lead to
              God... Now, it was like St. Francis said that all we care for in our
              lives is purity, chastity and freedom, and they are all incidential,
              go together. So in the liberation of ourselves, our Soul of Itself,
              then that's all we are looking for is freedom and chastity and
              purity. Now, why do we say this in the sense of these three things?
              It's simply because, as St. Francis said, 'They go together.' If you
              are liberated from all things here by being in the God-conscious
              state, then you are yourself free from everything else." [The Way of
              Eckankar Series By Sri Paul Twitchell, pages 25-26, circa 1967]

              So, this is one more reason for Klemp to destroy these older
              writings of Twitchell.

              However, why were the older writings of Darwin Gross the 972nd
              LEM/Mahanta destroyed by Klemp? When "From Heaven to the Prairie"
              was written Darwin was giving Klemp his 8th and 9th Initiations!
              This is a historical book for Eckankar. Why is Klemp destroying the
              written history of an Eck Master and Mahanta? What does Klemp fear
              and why? Censorship pollutes the Eck teachings! Did Gross become a
              Black Magician overnight?

              This is one more question for Eckists to ask Klemp, except, they
              can't! Who would dare! You'd never get another initiation, or if you
              worked at the ESC you'd be fired - subtley of course! So, If Darwin
              was a Black Magician and thief then he wasn't qualified to give the
              initiations but everyone got them anyway. Therefore, none of those
              who got initiations with DG's name on the pink slip deserved them -
              including Klemp! Or, let's say that DG didn't turn into a thief and
              Black Magician until after Klemp became the LEM. This would mean
              that all books and discourses that Gross wrote were valid Eck
              Teachings. So, why aren't they made available to Eckists?!

              Oh well, I just had more thoughts on the subject. : )

              Prometheus







              I find it interesting that Klemp has eliminated a great number of
              Twitchell's books and that Eckists don't seem to be concerned.

              Perhaps, Klemp's spin on this is that he is bringing Eckankar into
              the 21st Century and, therefore, the purpose of having a Living
              Master is to have a current version of truth. Also, a Living Master
              can "teach" while explaining away (and correcting) any confusions in
              dogma, etc. that might still linger from the past and, thus, a
              living link is needed to keep the teachings "pure" and alive.
              Actually, this is more the Radhasoami explaination for having a
              Living Master than Klemp's, although, Klemp does mimic this
              explaination, to various degrees, as well.

              However, how does eliminating or correcting the ECK teachings of
              Twitchell keep them PURE? That's like separating the straw from a
              cow pattie and saying, There, now it's pure!

              Klemp has, thus, re-molded Eckankar to look more and more Christian.
              This is because of his own background and training and this is why
              Klemp quotes from the Bible as much as he does and why there are
              Worship Services, Choirs, A Song Book, Clerics, Missionaries,
              Donations, a Hierarchy, and a God called God! After all Eckankar is
              Not called - the Religion of the Light and Sound of Sugmad!

              Actually, much of Twitchell's written work is fiction, distortions,
              and plagiarisms. And, unfortunately, PT's philosophy and his scam
              are all intertwind. Therefore, Klemp has kept some material and
              eliminated the rest. Unfortunately, for Klemp, he had no choice but
              to keep some of the plagiarized material because it was in the Holy
              Shariyats of Eckankar. Also, HK kept "Stranger by the River" because
              he needs the Rebazar connection and this is an important book for a
              spiritual seeker to relate to and one that HK could never duplicate!

              However, why isn't "Dialogues With the Master" offered anymore? This
              is a book that has Rebazar doing most of the talking. One would
              think that Klemp would want to share this wisdom coming from "the
              wonderful ECK Master Rebazar Tarzs!"

              Well, I'll have to continue this topic later. Please feel free to
              add more to the discussion and ponderings.

              Prometheus
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