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Re: Challenging some of Ekult's absolute truths

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  • prometheus_973
    Welcome to the group Kaye! I enjoy reading your comments. I was wondering how you see the Four Zoas of Eckankar? Recently, in the 03/2006 H.I. Letter, a H.I.
    Message 1 of 3 , Mar 10 10:42 AM
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      Welcome to the group Kaye! I enjoy reading your comments.

      I was wondering how you see the Four Zoas of Eckankar? Recently, in
      the 03/2006 H.I. Letter, a H.I. commented that he no longer saw them
      as, "a list of 'thou shalt nots' similar to the Ten Commandments,"
      BUT sees "the Zoas" as "a flight manual, so to speak."

      In the same article there is a quote by Klemp from the Golden Heart
      chapter 11: "We are responsible for all the ripples created in
      others by our anger, as well as the ripples they in turn pass along
      to the next group. The higher you go as an initiate in ECK, the
      greater your responsibility becomes. The Law of Love becomes very
      exacting."

      Klemp's nasty and unloving comments in the 09/2003 H.I. Letter
      toward the Third Temporary Postal Clerk, that Joan had the run-in
      with regarding the Law of Economy, tends to negate his comments in
      the above quote! Therefore, Klemp Not Only created ripples (Karma)
      through his own anger, but also demonstrated that he lacks higher
      consciousness by Not following the "Law of Love!" This is direct
      proof that the Eck Initiations are a sham! Or, is it that Klemp just
      can't admit that he falls to the lower Astral from time-to-time
      (daily)! In any case, Eckists need to rethink and compare what is
      said over there (09/2003 H.I. Letter) with what is said over here
      (03/2006 H.I. Letter) by Klemp. He talks out of both sides of his
      mouth just as one would expect from the KAL!

      Prometheus




      eyesopen wrote:

      Hello Prometheus and everyone,

      I've been enjoying your posts and wanted to join in, if you don't
      mind.

      As an ex-member turned observer of klemp and ekult, I would like to
      challenge some of ekult's absolute truths.

      1) The concept that twitch/gross/klemp each, in turn, serve as the
      physical manifestation of God.

      ME: Why would the source of ALL that exists in all planes of
      existence both known and unknown to us HAVE to manifest in the
      physical? Especially in such dubious vessels and by such dubious
      methods? Twitch through plagiarism - gross's appointment by twitch's
      widow - klemp by a Machiavellian take over.

      2) The concept that we are all trapped by karma and reincarnation and
      bound to this physical plane until we join ekult and have the lem's
      protection. The lem's claim that he can take on our karma and
      intervene in our lives. The claim that we can "burn off" karma by
      monthly initiate reports, Friday fasts and of course, by those
      initiation levels.

      ME: Doesn't this make a joke of the whole concept of karma? Karma, to
      me, isn't about punishment, BUT is more about lessons in life. If we
      learn the lesson, we move on, if not we repeat it until we do. What
      if reincarnation is optional? We have a beautiful world to live in,
      aside from the problems we create, BUT, let's face it, our world is
      only a dust speck in the whole of existence. Surely there are other
      places and opportunities for continued growth!

      3) Ekult is the path of unconditional love, uplifting spiritual
      growth and the most direct path to God.

      ME: How can you find any sort of love in these teachings? They are
      manipulative and used to implant fear and dependency. How can one
      grow emotionally, mentally and especially spiritually by being
      fearful and dependent?

      Thanks for listening and good night.

      Kaye
    • ctecvie
      Hi Kaye, welcome! Good that you joined us here - I enjoyed your posts on ET very much. ... I remember an ex-eckist saying that, looking at the vessels in
      Message 2 of 3 , Mar 10 10:49 AM
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        Hi Kaye,

        welcome! Good that you joined us here - I enjoyed your posts on ET
        very much.

        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "eyesopen444"
        <eyesopen444@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello Prometheus and everyone,
        >
        > I've been enjoying your posts and wanted to join in, if you don't
        >mind.
        >
        > As an ex-member turned observer of klemp and ekult, I would like to
        > challenge some of ekult's absolute truths.
        >
        > 1) The concept that twitch/gross/klemp each, in turn, serve as the
        > physical manifestation of God.
        >
        > ME: Why would the source of ALL that exists in all planes of
        >existence
        > both known and unknown to us HAVE to manifest in the physical?
        > Especially in such dubious vessels and by such dubious methods?
        >Twitch
        > through plagiarism - gross's appointment by twitch's widow - klemp
        >by
        > a Machiavellian take over.

        I remember an ex-eckist saying that, looking at the vessels in
        question, he rather quit Eckankar than have anything to do with them
        any further! LOL!
        >
        > 2) The concept that we are all trapped by karma and reincarnation
        >and
        > bound to this physical plane until we join ekult and have the lem's
        > protection. The lem's claim that he can take on our karma and
        > intervene in our lives. The claim that we can "burn off" karma by
        > monthly initiate reports, Friday fasts and of course, by those
        > initiation levels.

        This is necessary in order to keep the chelas trapped! The burning
        off of karma is something you have to believe in - you can't prove
        it as long as you are alive! I think this is ridiculous to burn off
        karma by fasting on Friday!
        >
        > ME: Doesn't this make a joke of the whole concept of karma? Karma,
        >to
        > me, isn't about punishment, BUT is more about lessons in life. If
        >we
        > learn the lesson, we move on, if not we repeat it until we do.

        Ah - you have recognized the importance of the "BUT"! LOL! For me,
        karma is just cause and effect. Anything we do has an effect, and
        it's absolutely neutral. It's like going to work - you work and get
        paid - cause and effect = karma. :-))

        >What if
        > reincarnation is optional? We have a beautiful world to live in,
        >aside
        > from the problems we create, BUT, let's face it, our world is only
        >a
        > dust speck in the whole of existence. Surely there are other places
        > and opportunities for continued growth!

        We do have a beautiful world to live in - and eckists, so much like
        any followers of any other religion, just want to leave it behind. I
        never could understand that while still in Eckankar. OK, I
        understand it if life is hard for somebody. I always found life here
        great, and still do!

        >
        > 3) Ekult is the path of unconditional love, uplifting spiritual
        >growth
        > and the most direct path to God.
        >
        > ME: How can you find any sort of love in these teachings? They are
        > manipulative and used to implant fear and dependency. How can one
        >grow
        > emotionally, mentally and especially spiritually by being fearful
        >and
        > dependent?

        You can't grow emotionally in Eckankar! It's impossible because all
        you have to do is to get rid of your emotions. Remember the middle
        path! LOL!
        >
        > Thanks for listening and good night.

        Thanks for posting ... :-)
        Ingrid
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