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Re: HK Wrote: "I am well aware of my limitations."

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  • mishmisha9
    Hello, Liz! And Everyone! Liz, I m sorry to be so slow in responding to your questions. I ve been a little bit busy lately and haven t had much time to keep up
    Message 1 of 7 , Mar 2, 2006
      Hello, Liz! And Everyone!

      Liz, I'm sorry to be so slow in responding to your questions. I've
      been a little bit busy lately and haven't had much time to keep up
      with the posts here. Finally, today, I was able to go back to the
      chapter in Klemp's newest book you're asking about--"Those Wonderful
      ECK Masters," Chapter 11, entitled "The Mahanta, the Living ECK
      Master--A Modern Prophet SRI HAROLD KLEMP (Wah Z)," pages 201-240,
      by Harold Klemp.

      --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth"
      <ewickings@...> wrote:


      Also from page 232: "The Mahanta, the Living ECK Master also has
      the ability and the authority to alter an individual's fate."



      Hi Mish,

      Liz asks: Just curious about what else this chapter might say
      about "The Mahanta, the LEM has the ability and the authority to
      alter an individual's fate". Could you share a little further on
      what this section says?

      Mish: from pages, 232-233, "The Mahanta, the Living ECK Master also
      has the ability and authority to alter an individual's fate. This,
      of course, is a remarkable benefit. The Master will adjust the
      individual's destiny at certain levels of spiritual unfoldment. In
      this way, excess karma can be burned off in the dream state. So do
      your spiritual exercises. Avoid many unpleasant karmic repayments.
      And soon, your Book of Records will see the Master's notation 'Paid
      in full.'"

      Klemp is promising that karmic debt will be burned off if the chela
      does the the spiritual exercises.

      #####

      Liz asks: Does Klump give himself a way out of this statement, if a
      healing doesn't take place for example? Does he claim sometimes he
      has to let an individual experience their karma...

      Mish: on page 239, Klemp writes, "A Soul in pursuit of spiritual
      revelation may not ever shirk Its responsibilities. Who should care
      most whether you practice the spiritual exercises that the Master
      entrusts to you? You know the answer. The answer is in your hands."
      So, it seems to me that Klemp promises things but if the chela is
      unsuccessful, it is the chela's fault. Klemp is always in a win-win
      position, and can do no wrong. Only the chelas can make mistakes.
      LOL!

      ######

      Liz asks: And another question, is there anything in this book where
      Klump says something about how HI's are like a flock of geese flying
      in formation. When one HI has a problem, a brave stronger HI will
      fly out of formation to help the other?

      Mish: I don't recall reading anything about a flock of geese in this
      book, but I do recall reading it else where. : )

      ######

      Liz writes: Since my mother's health is deteriating as each day
      passes, she sits and waits for Harold to heal her from her disease!
      So if this so called LEM has the ability and the authority to alter
      an individual's fate, why has it taken him 15 years to even
      acknowledge and heal her? (or should I say my mother to acknowledge
      he isn't that all knowing, all powerful Mahanta he proclaims to be.)

      Mish: 15 years is certainly a long time for a devoted follower to
      wait for a healing! On page 210, Klemp writes this, "The Inner
      Master welcomes you in the dream state and speaks to you like an old
      friend. He offers the spiritual help most appropriate that very
      hour. It certainly is a claim that no pastor, priest, or rabbi would
      dare to make. Help for the hour is truly one of the chief benefits
      of the inner teachings of ECK." Klemp is very bold to make such a
      statement, especially in light of the fact that your mother is still
      waiting and deteriating as she waits. Where is this Master who
      claims to have such abilities to "help for the hour?" It appears it
      has been many, many hours--years for your mother who so firmly
      believes in the eckcrap! This, to me, is truly the crime of eckankar-
      -the false promises and hopes.

      ####

      Liz writes: Quotes from his books such as this, is what keeps some
      hard core eckist hanging on to, and expecting a healing from the
      godman of the universe. Just another carrot on a string.... WAKE UP
      PEOPLE, HAROLD IS A FAKE!!!

      Mish: Definitely, Harold is a fake! In Chapter 12, "Your Spiritual
      Destiny A Star of God," pages 241-274, Klemp writes several stories
      involving spiritual healings. Most of these stories involved some
      physical ailment or problem. These problems supposedly stemmed from
      past life experiences. Once the Master showed the chela the source
      of the past life problem, the karmic baggage, the chela was able
      to "heal" in this lifetime. One chela had suffered from leg problems
      most of her life. Here's how she was healed using the spiritual
      exercises of eck, from pages 260-261, "Two days after she'd written
      her spiritual report to the Mahanta asking for help to understand
      that feeling of inferiority, her ankle began to heal at last. . . .
      The Master's response to her letter, which she'd written but not yet
      mailed, . . . He'd let her see a key past life that gave meaning to
      what seemed like undue pain and drudgery in the present. . . .It is
      ever true that healings occur easiest in an atmosphere of
      love. . . ."

      So, this is just one "success" stories of Harold's abilities to help
      chelas with their problems. Even though, the chela did not mail the
      letter to Harold, the chela believed that he received in on the
      inner and thus did the healing. Harold was given credit for helping
      this chela, and Harold has no problem in using this delusional
      chela's story to substantiate and help promote his lies about his
      god-like abilities. And yet, Harold states, "I am well aware of my
      limitations." In other words, is Harold saying he knows he's a fake,
      but yet he can't help himself from being the liar he is!!! This
      entire book helps to feed the narcissitic personality of the writer,
      in my opinion! It is unfortunate, Liz, that chelas, like your
      mother,have allowed their health and well-being to suffer from the
      belief in the false teachings of ECK. I'm sure that it has brought a
      lot of heartache to all the family members who watch the control
      that Klemp and company have on your mother.


      >

      Mish
    • mishmisha9
      ... let ... says ... sits ... individual s ... her? ... knowing, ... the ... HAROLD ... Hi, Liz and All! I wanted to pull up this post again, because Liz asked
      Message 2 of 7 , Mar 17, 2006
        --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth"
        <ewickings@...> wrote:
        >
        > >
        > > Also from page 232: "The Mahanta, the Living ECK Master also has
        > the
        > > ability and the authority to alter an individual's fate."
        > >
        >
        >
        > Hi Mish,
        >
        > Just curious about what else this chapter might say about "The
        > Mahanta, the LEM has the ability and the authority to alter an
        > individual's fate". Could you share a little further on what this
        > section says?
        >
        > Does Klump give himself a way out of this statement, if a healing
        > doesn't take place for example? Does he claim sometimes he has to
        let
        > an individual experience their karma...
        >
        > And another question, is there anything in this book where Klump
        says
        > something about how HI's are like a flock of geese flying in
        > formation. When one HI has a problem, a brave stronger HI will fly
        > out of formation to help the other?
        >
        > Since my mother's health is deteriating as each day passes, she
        sits
        > and waits for Harold to heal her from her disease! So if this so
        > called LEM has the ability and the authority to alter an
        individual's
        > fate, why has it taken him 15 years to even acknowledge and heal
        her?
        > (or should I say my mother to acknowledge he isn't that all
        knowing,
        > all powerful Mahanta he proclaims to be.)
        >
        > Quotes from his books such as this, is what keeps some hard core
        > eckist hanging on to, and expecting a healing from the godman of
        the
        > universe. Just another carrot on a string.... WAKE UP PEOPLE,
        HAROLD
        > IS A FAKE!!!
        >


        Hi, Liz and All!

        I wanted to pull up this post again, because Liz asked some very
        good questions about healings in eck and how eckists look for help
        from the master! : )

        In the Introduction, page 1, in "Those Wonderful ECK Masters," Klemp
        wrote the following:

        ". . . First of all, who are these ECK Masters? What do they do?
        What about people who've benefited by their help?

        And the really big question: What can they do for you?

        The purpose of this book is to answer these questions. You'll learn
        about the wonderful ECK Masters, who they are, and what they've
        already done for others like you. You'll read the real-life stories
        of people who've received assistance with health issues, personal
        concerns, and even finances. Above all, these ECK Masters hold the
        key to love, wisdom, and spiritual freedom."

        What a sale's pitch, huh? LOL! Harold is suggesting to people that
        their health, personal and financial problems will be helped by the
        ECK Masters and eckankar. How misleading and deceptive is this? No
        wonder your mother, Liz, is looking to the master to heal her! How
        many others are being hurt by these false promises! I'm sure this
        Introduction will lure some unsuspecting readers in--they'll buy the
        book, so it's a win for eckankar money wise, and if the reader
        really buys into the crap, the reader will be signing up for
        membership and writing a nice check with the hopes that he/she, too,
        will benefit from the teachings of eck, as suggested by HK's "humble
        volume" that shines "like a beacon to guide" Souls "to God's secret
        kingdom" . . . yada, yada! : )

        Mish
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