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5342Re: Worship of Personality- Eckankar Style (BTW)

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  • avonblue1212
    Sep 8, 2010
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      Prometheus said:
      This is why ECKists
      aren't supposed to question the ECK Teachings
      beyond their 2nd initiation, or else one
      will be Black Listed on Initiations and/or
      shunned. ECKists aren't permitted to
      sort out the facts from the myth or from
      the distortions and lies that Twitchell handed
      down to D.G. and to Klemp.

      Exactly - the minute you question or doubt (qualities of a rational mind) you're told you must not be doing your spiritual exercises regularly (in other words you are an inferior spiritual being) - which is just more brainwashing and a continuation of the cycle of deception. Or your told "doubt is good" it allows you to dig deeper and immerse yourself more into the "teachings". I like the concept of free thinking and choice.

      --- In EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com, "prometheus_973" <prometheus_973@...> wrote:
      > BTW- It should, also, be pointed out that
      > ECK H.I.s are "higher" than the "God" of all
      > religions since this GOD is no higher than
      > the 4th Plane! Now, explain to me why these
      > H.I. "Gods" cannot communicate completely
      > on the "inner" with the "highest" God... the
      > LEM/Mahanta? Why are these ECKist Gods
      > so limited? Is ECKankar a Big Fat Lie? Yes!
      > Really, think about it. Klemp states in his
      > "Autobiography," on page 385, that the
      > God of all religions is a 4th (Mental) Plane
      > God and most H.I.s are 5th-7th Plane.
      > Now, H.I.s should ask themselves, after
      > their heads deflate, how do I, as well as,
      > Klemp demonstrate this Level of Awareness
      > that is "beyond" God's Consciousness?
      > Okay, wake up! Here's the Catch-22.
      > ECKists cannot experience "God Consciousness,"
      > permanently, unless they become 8th Initiates.
      > So, the 4th Plane God's Consciousness
      > can only be experienced permanently
      > when they become 8th initiates! However,
      > remember that this 4th Plane God is KAL,
      > i.e. the Devil, Satan.
      > BTW- Isn't Sugmad also referred to as "God"
      > in the EK Teachings? Sure! So, 8ths can experience
      > SUGMAD (God) Consciousness on a regular basis?
      > I don't think Klemp would allow this interpretation!
      > HK's too selfish to put even 8ths on that level.
      > It's too close to where he's standing is on the
      > mountain.
      > FYI- I happened to look up "ECK Masters"
      > (12th initiates) in Klemp's 1st Lexicon and
      > read that these guys "have reached a state
      > of consciousness of relative perfection."
      > Yet, isn't this said of our (4th Plane) God?
      > Didn't 14th Plane Klemp once say that he
      > too "wasn't perfect?" Confusing isn't it?
      > That's the whole point! This is why ECKists
      > aren't supposed to question the ECK Teachings
      > beyond their 2nd initiation, or else one
      > will be Black Listed on Initiations and/or
      > shunned. ECKists aren't permitted to
      > sort out the facts from the myth or from
      > the distortions and lies that Twitchell handed
      > down to D.G. and to Klemp.
      > ECKankar is all make believe and comfortable...
      > it's the Easy Way!
      > Prometheus
      > Hello Avonblue and ALL,
      > Klemp is a hypocrite. I saw and heard him
      > chastise a woman at a Spiritual Laws Seminar
      > in Toronto once because during a Q&A she
      > "adoringly" asked him a question. Klemp
      > wanted to make it clear to everyone there
      > that he was Not to be worshipped. His words
      > to her were cruel and overreactive. I felt
      > sorry for her she was crushed. I'm sure
      > Klemp saw this as using "tough love," but
      > in truth he violated the: "Is it True; Is it
      > Necessary; Is it Kind" spiritual rule (of the
      > Buddha) that many ECKists attempt to follow.
      > Then again, at EK Seminars just watch
      > how ECKies hang onto Klemp's every
      > word and laugh and giggle at his nervous
      > and poorly made attempts at humor.
      > ECKists act as though they are in a trance
      > or under a spell... from a Black Magician.
      > And, Klemp eats it up! He loves the silly
      > laughter... all the way to the bank.
      > Yes, ECKists still worship him, but it's
      > because he is the "Mahanta" who is 10
      > Planes of Con. HIGHER than the "God" of:
      > Islam; Christianity; Judaism; Hinduism;
      > et al because these are 4th Plane religions.
      > Klemp states this, of other religions, on
      > page 385 of his "Autobiography." PT
      > stated it as well in the Shariyat. Thus,
      > if "GOD" (Kal, devil, satan) is of 4th Plane
      > and HK as LEM is of the 12th and as
      > Mahanta of the 14th Plane then why
      > wouldn't he be worshipped? BTW- When
      > is Klemp going to start to act like a 14th
      > Plane GOD? Why does "GOD" need snail-
      > mail IROs or "outer" Seminars, etc.?
      > Really, Klemp (even as the 12th Plane LEM)
      > is not only much more "Higher" and spiritually
      > evolved than Muhammad, Jesus, Krishna,
      > Buddha, etc. but also more spiritually advanced
      > and evolved than the "God" these Prophets,
      > and Masters worshipped.
      > Yet, Klemp states that he doesn't want to
      > be "worshipped" even though he has created
      > an "ECK Worship Service" (EWS). However,
      > Who/what is "worshipped" at an EWS? It's
      > Klemp! He states that he is one with the
      > ECK and is the ECK!
      > See, Klemp is using Black Magic and Brainwashing
      > techniques on ECKists. Is this a Catch-22, or
      > some kind of a Paradox? It's really just a manipulation
      > and a lie. Then again, in some ways it is a Catch-
      > 22 for ECKists. Klemp wants to have it both ways,
      > but it's the ECKists' getting screwed. This delusional
      > thinking is just accepted without question. After
      > years and years of overlooking the obvious contradictions
      > one finally gives in and "surrenders" their intellect
      > and rational thinking. This is the "Leap of Faith"
      > that HK has spoken about and it's the same one
      > that the 4th Plane religionists must take in order
      > to accept those lies as well.
      > Prometheus
      > avonblue wrote:
      > I always found it ironic the way eckankar claims its followers are taught to not
      > worship the personality of the master but instead to recognize the inner
      > consciousness of whomever this being happens to be in the physical. Yet with
      > increasing frequency since the Twitch/Gross era, numerous photos of Klemp have
      > been produced and marketed to the ekkie public. Furthermore, as has been noted
      > by others repeatedly, the photo(s) of Klemp are all of the
      > pre-gray/balding/thinner man. I recall numerous conversations and discussions
      > in classes, seminars, literature where eckists (or Klemp himself) would chastise
      > those not able to make the "spiritual" jump from Paul to Darwin or Darwin to
      > Klemp, claiming they were worshipping or "attached" to the man, not recognizing
      > the inner consciousness beyond the physical form.
      > In MIchael Largo's new book, "God's Lunatics" he's created an encyclopedia of
      > the ridiculous and comical to the horrific and maniacal search for god as
      > expressed in every conceivable religious practice throughout the ages (he even
      > cites eckankar with Venusian origins). Most interesting is his description of
      > the Cult of Personality or Celebrity Worship.
      > He claims Khrushchev was the first to use the phrase "cult of personality" in
      > reference to his disapproval of Stalin's massive media campaign to elevate
      > himself to a god. He tells how Hitler, Mao, Saddam, Kim-Jong-II and others of
      > this ilk who "made their omniscient presence a part of daily life through the
      > proliferation of their image." These images, he states, were accompanied by the
      > message of their goodness, wisdom and power and this influence was impossible to
      > escape.
      > Does this sound at all familiar? I find it very revealing of the cult ethics
      > this organization openly utilizes but never professes to. Having been there I
      > know how difficult it is to see the trickery when you're caught in the
      > brainwashing and taught over and over to "trust" the "master" or trust your
      > inner guidance. Of course the inner guidance eckists believe they have has all
      > been expertly crafted from their very first days of participation. How?
      > Remember being taught to avoid the writings of other teachers/practices and only
      > read ek literature in the beginning as it will "confuse you" and slow your
      > progress? If you shun, doubt, disregard the "master" you risk becoming lost in
      > the astral worlds... , really? So we're supposed to accept a farm boy from
      > Wisconsin was sent here to guide us back - that we have no ability or inherent
      > wisdom ourselves? If we don't accept eckankar over any number of crackpot
      > philosophies out there we'll have to return again and again until we do? Wow -
      > I actually believed some of this stuff!!!
      > More interesting but beyond the scope of this post is what neuroscience has
      > revealed about the mind and it's functional ability and deficits as well as what
      > quantum physics has revealed about the seen and unseen physical universe over
      > the last 10 years or so. Seems all the stuff of religion and spirituality is
      > emerging science after all. All the inner powers and gifts that eck claimed to
      > offer was there all along. Take a little time to investigate even the layman
      > books on these subjects - it's fascinating. Of course that's if you can get by
      > the other ek credo that looks at the mind, and rational thought for that matter,
      > as just a lowly bodily function.
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