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5335Re: EK: Lust vs Discrimination; Path: Lust vs Chastity (P.S.)

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  • prometheus_973
    Sep 4, 2010
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      Hello Jonathan,

      I reread what I had previously written
      and thought I should give some
      clarification on Maharishi's instructions
      for us to remain chaste during the
      TM "Program" for Siddha training.
      This 1st Phase of training was an intense
      two week course in the Catskills. Other
      than for this training we, as householders
      or "Citizen" Siddhas, were not instructed
      to practice chastity. Plus, we "couples"
      complied because we wanted the best
      results for the money. This was an expensive
      course ($3,000 each), even, for way back
      in the '70s!

      FYI- The Sutras, like the one used for
      the Flying Technique, came from Patanjali.
      You can find some of these in the 1953
      book "How To Know God" translated
      by Swami Prabhavananda and Christopher
      Isherwood.

      BTW-The Sutra for the TM
      "Flying Technique" is thus:

      But first this-

      The clearing of the mind is
      like pouring pure clear water
      into a bottle of ink. The ink
      (your thoughts) will flow out
      as the water flows in. Eventually
      the ink in the bottle will be
      replaced by clear pure water.

      Sit comfortably in a quiet
      room. Close your eyes and
      quiet your mind. Breathe easily,
      gently, and naturally... don't
      allow any attention to be placed
      upon your thoughts or upon
      your breathing. Let both be
      natural. Gently clear and quiet
      your mind without forcing it.
      Let Go of all the thoughts rushing
      in. Don't hold onto any of them
      even if it seems fun to follow
      them. Let All of these thoughts,
      Ever So Gently, go into the ethers.
      Take your time and relax until
      your mind and breathing settle
      down naturally.

      Now visualize yourself holding
      a ball of cotton. In the bright
      light of day take your fingers
      and pull it apart! Now, see the
      loose fibers gently floating
      in the air and rising upwards.

      As you visualize this think...
      "Light As Cotton Fiber!"

      Feel the spiritual energy in
      the Crown Chakra ready to
      descend downwards through
      the Kundalini! Repeat this!




      prometheus wrote:
      >
      > Hello Jonathan,
      > I'm not sure if speaking to a Hindu and/or a Sikh
      > would give clarification to your question. That's
      > like asking a "Christian" a question about belief.
      > What dogma does the Christian follow? There are
      > so many beliefs and each individual interprets it
      > differently.
      >
      > As I mentioned most "householders," or normal
      > people, are expected to practice chastity when
      > the woman can no longer produce offspring.
      > Thus, there is no sex outside or inside of marriage
      > beyond a certain stage of life. Having sex inside
      > of marriage when the woman can no longer reproduce
      > is seen as the same as having sex outside of the
      > marriage... it's still lust and this is an attachment
      > to worldly desires... and to a lower chakra (consciousness).
      >
      > BTW- I was in TM for six years before joining Eckankar
      > and was a Siddha. Although not a Governor I volunteered
      > as a "checker" and had duties somewhat to that of an ESA.
      > I had to make sure people were meditating properly
      > and were comfortable with their mantra. People were
      > discouraged from writing them down and would at
      > times forget them. It would be two or three syllables
      > but the way the mantra was pronounced would naturally
      > "change." Actually, the key word was "natural." Sometimes
      > I would step out of the room and consult my "list" before
      > going back in to help them remember their mantra.
      >
      > The kundalini was used to direct energy down
      > through the chakras in order do the flying technique,
      > and we were instructed not to have sex during the
      > "program."
      >
      > The "flying technique" was supposed to cause levitation
      > and was a physical side effect to Higher Consciousness.
      > But, the only "effect" I ever saw was hopping. However,
      > when one was sitting in a full lotus position and chanted
      > the sutra (with the visualization) the energy channeled
      > through the kundalini did produce an electrical charge.
      > Of course there was a certain amount of expectation but
      > we were simply being open to whatever. The result was
      > like touching an electrical wire to a frog's leg and getting
      > a muscle response. Therefore, the hopping (on thick high
      > density foam mattresses) was effortless and could be
      > done, easily, and with minimal exertion for 20 minutes.
      >
      > However, TM was a very expensive and distracting ruse
      > and with more discipline than Eckankar requires.
      > I'm kind of surprised that I took the bait with Eckankar
      > after that. But, at least I did remain skeptical and this
      > enabled me to be more open minded when Ford's book
      > came out.
      >
      > Prometheus
      >
      >
      > jonathan wrote
      >
      >
      > Promethes,
      >
      > Thanks for the two additional messages clarifying things. It's an interesting
      > subject.
      >
      > I'd really love to talk to a Hindu or Sikh from India and ask them exactly what
      > these gurus mean by "lust" and "chastity." I am getting the intuitive impression
      > that for them, "lust" is ANY sex outside marriage. In other words, people can
      > only have sex during marriage, so any sex that takes place outside marriage
      > obviously results from the fact that they can't control their sex drive. And so
      > they automatically call this "lust."
      >
      > I was in TM (Transcendental Meditation) for about two years before joining
      > Eckankar. I read Maharishi's little paperback book. He spent a LOT of time
      > talking about how important it is to "sublimate the sex drive and direct it
      > toward something else." So sublimating the sex drive, or controlling it, is
      > extremely important in Hinduism.
      >
      > Somebody told me that married Hindus are expected to stop having sex after they
      > stop having children. I had a Chinese girlfriend who was born in Taiwan, but
      > mostly raised in the USA. She once told me that her parents had intercourse only
      > two times. Incredulous, I asked "How do you know that?" She replied "Once for
      > me, and once for my sister." The point is that I am getting the impression that
      > Hindus almost seem to believe that sex is only for procreation.
      >
      > I think all of this may be important to figuring out where Kirpal Singh was
      > "coming from" when he was discussing lust and chastity.
      >
      > But you are right in your analysis of Twitchell. His version is not at all the
      > same as Kirpal's version. I think you did a good job documenting what Twitchell
      > did.
      >
      > Jonathan
      >
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