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5006Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A Book of Circular Thinking?

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  • etznab@aol.com
    Oct 15, 2009
      That is when I began to discover the books we weren't
      supposed to know about. In the nineties I was trying to
      connect the dots, to trace the "history" of "Eckankar"
      all the way back to at least 5,000 years B.C.


      Did you trace anything to Kabir. He seemed to know
      about Kal Niranjan, etc.

      Apparently, Kal Niranjan was the 5th of 16 shabdas
      issued from Sat Purush.

      "When Sat Purush uttered the fifth Shabda, Kal-
      Niranjan was incarnated."


      This page tells about it. And the links go to how the
      lower worlds were created.

      I doubt that is all to be taken literally.

      Wasn't Kabir the first to give written instructions on

      "No written instructions had been put down for the
      followers of ECKANKAR, nor any part of it, until the
      sixteenth century when Kabir, the Hindu mystic poet,
      took it upon himself to unwrap the mysteries of the
      ancient science of Soul Travel."

      [Based on: ECKANKAR, Compiled Writings, Vol. 1
      (Copyright 1975 by Gail T. Gross), by Paul Twitchell,
      p. 59]

      And wasn't Kabir about 21 years older (b. 1440) than
      Rebazar Tarzs ("reportedly" b. 1461)? who allegedly
      gave instructions to Paul Twitchell? (What to write?).


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Rebazar Tarzs <realbizarretarzs@...>
      To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Mon, Oct 12, 2009 3:31 pm
      Subject: Re: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A Book of Circular


      Hi there!
      The intercession part is the part I really don't understand!
      Because of "Key To Secret Worlds" and the previously published
      short articles found in "In My Soul I Am Free,"  I was at odds with
      my Presbyterian minister while taking confirmation classes (not my
      idea, of course, but my parents' idea of a good  time) over this very
      I got the highest grades on everything, even higher than the minister's
      but the minister was always trying to convince me, and wrote stuff in
      the margins
      of my essays, that intercession with "Jesus Christ" was necessary in
      to have any kind of relationship with Spirit.
      And I agree with you about everything else you just said. 
      Was Paul paying Rebazar $160.00 a year? 
      How much did Rebazar pay Fubbi Quantz?
      And so forth all the way back to Gakko?
      It's funny that you mention connecting the dots.
      That is when I began to discover the books we weren't
      supposed to know about. In the nineties I was trying to 
      connect the dots, to trace the "history" of "Eckankar"
      all the way back to at least 5,000 years B.C.
      And by doing so, I was also researching "EK" and "HU"
      throughout history.
      Not exactly exclusive to "Eckankar."
      I think it is just a big psychological circus that takes place,
      say, for an example, at a major seminar. People get all
      psychologically open to auto-suggestion.
      If things go well, it is because of Harold. If not, it is because
      the chela has not been doing his or her "homework." 
      Or they are being "tested" by the Kal.
      Or they are being "tested" by the ECK.
      Harold can dish it out both ways.  And eat the cake himself.
      Again, just like with most religions, people stay with "Eckankar"
      out of fear, not just fear of the "consequences", but fear of the
      unknown - something they are supposed to be conquering
      BECAUSE of Eckankar!
      They can't because they are clinging to the known world. 
      Their little world of "Super Normal" people.
      With alot of these people, most or all of their "friends"
      are in Eckankar.
      What would they think?  And the idea of letting others "below"
      or "beneath" them passing them up in "initiations"!
      What could be worse than that? 
      Or being "demoted" as a person in any way?
      They give all their power to the heirarchy.
      They are powerless to help themselves. Not really, of course,
      but it is psychological.
      Whatever happened to power, wisdom and freedom? 
      The answer, my friend, is blowing in the wind.
      But you knew that!

      --- On Mon, 10/12/09, prometheus_973 <prometheus_973@...>

      From: prometheus_973 <prometheus_973@...>
      Subject: [EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous] Re: A Book of Circular Thinking?
      To: EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Monday, October 12, 2009, 7:34 PM


      Hello All,
      Thanks for sharing your
      comments and the info
      about these books!

      As far as "transcending
      religion" it seems that this
      is what we thought we were
      doing when we joined the
      "path" of Eckankar way back

      Early on, Eckankar seemed
      to have a certain mystique
      about it. The reality, now,
      is that it was never what we
      imagined or desired. This
      PT/HK consciousness is based
      upon delusions, lies, and
      manipulations frozen
      in time as meaningless and
      imagined experiences and
      dreams via Klemp's over-
      simplified and mind numbing
      hypnotic message. This is
      the "real" reason people fall
      asleep during his talks! And,
      there's No spiritual meat

      The Eckankar message is
      merely a redundancy and
      regurgitation of empty 2nd
      and 4th Plane thoughts and

      PT's Eckankar is a New Age/
      Westernized rewrite of the

      Eastern thoughts and dogmas
      once borrowed and plagiarized
      (compiled) from Sant Mat
      religions (etc.), and from
      more knowledgeable/
      enlightened people by
      the trickster Twitchell.

      HK's EK "path" has not only
      become Christianized, but
      has also been exposed as
      just another "Feel Good"
      religious sect that preaches
      one thing and does another!
      It's a Codependent scam!

      Thus, the Klemps' egos
      are feeling pretty good
      right now and the "trickle-
      down effect" is still sustaining
      their EK followers/sheep/
      chickens in the same ways
      as other religions work their
      magic on the numb, dumb,
      fearful, and superstitious

      Still, for Eckists who think
      they can see beyond the
      veil/void it's amazing to
      see that they are quite
      incapable of true change
      and of discovering the
      real path of TRUTH, and
      of experiencing the art
      of the obvious.

      Truth has escaped these
      Eckists and they will forever
      remain a pawn of the KAL
      and under Klemp's trance
      of providing "sales service."

      This, of course, benefits HK's
      selfish motives, and, on the
      other hand, it helps to give
      Eckists a "higher" purpose.
      This is why Klemp feels he
      is doing no harm since it
      provides of service for lost
      Souls until they become advanced
      enough to realize they don't
      need a middleman.

      However, the "catch" lies
      within the promises made
      and the innate desire of
      soul to "Know" God and to
      return Home again. Eckankar
      manipulates this desire with
      "initiations" that are turned
      into a KAL "Trap/Test."

      However, Not Desiring Initiations
      (via a pure heart) is another
      trap/test that has merely been
      disguised while the "desire"
      remains hidden from outer
      sight. Thus, it seems to be
      okay to "imagine" (and still
      higher initiations on
      the "INNER" via the ruse of
      needing a Mahanta for more
      and more of these fake initiations
      in order to expand consciousness
      for more and more spiritual

      Eckists are chasing their tails
      via Twitchell's and Klemp's
      rendition of circular logic and
      thinking. How can Self-Mastery
      and Spiritual Freedom be accomplished
      in THIS LIFETIME when Klemp
      is training Eckists to become
      more and more Codependent
      upon the Mahanta and their
      desires and attachments?

      Look at the ECK stories... they
      all require the intercession and
      help of the Mahanta. Eckists,
      via self-hypnosis and programming,
      (attachment) are being taught
      to call upon the Mahanta for
      anything and everything.. . but
      where is Soul and where is the
      ECK (Holy Spirit)? Just because
      one mouthes certain "charged"
      4th Plane words or thinks he/
      she is "detached" doesn't make

      it so!

      What's interesting is that these
      two Entities (Soul and Holy Spirit)
      don't require money in order
      to maintain (outer and Inner
      initiations) a higher consciousness. ..
      but Klemp does! Initiations aren't
      needed! This is what structured
      (Lower Plane) Hierarchies use in
      order to control groups of people.
      I'm amazed that Eckists can't or
      don't want to see the correlation
      and connect-the- dots.

      Why can't or won't Eckists connect-
      the-dots? It probably has to do
      with their feelings of being "Superior
      Normal" and the delusion that
      gives them "all the answers" in
      order to alleviate their doubts
      and fears. The ego makes a better
      servant than it does a master,
      but with "initiations" and a "RESA
      hierarchy" Eckists can't separate
      ego from Soul.

      Thus, when "Starting To Get It"
      (a 6th, ESA, Staffer at the ESC)
      writes what she did, in the 09/2009
      Letter, one has to wonder...
      What has Klemp been teaching
      his followers since he's been
      in charge?


      realbizarretarzs wrote:

      So true. I really enjoyed your

      I used to do that sort of stuff
      until it became more sad than

      Also, a while back, I forgot
      to mention the books of
      Alan Watts, starting with
      "The Way of Zen" and
      "The Wisdom of Insecurity".

      The second title, of course,
      is a paradox, but one that
      makes sense without having
      to go too far into the book
      to see what he is talking about.

      One doesn't have to be necessarily
      into Zen or even Buddhism to
      understand where he was coming

      His books are very easy to read
      and are somewhat humorous.

      Interestingly, he obtained
      a master's degree in theology
      and "divinity" but went on to
      write twenty to thirty books
      on Zen and Indian and
      philosophies, and the psychology
      of religion, and the importance
      of mysticism insofar as the
      individual transcending man-
      made religion.

      whitemoby wrote:

      Truth can never by systemized,
      no matter how eloquently.


      Rebazar Tarzs wrote:

      In the story, Joseph Knecht,
      after following instructions
      to the letter, but not losing
      his intuition, begins to question
      everything, and comes to
      see "Castilia" (or, insert your
      favorite or not-so-favorite
      community Utopia) as a kind
      of ivory tower, oblivious to
      real life, and thus, reality.

      He begins to realize that,
      after many years, and many
      relationships, Castilia is a
      self-protected society that
      does little, if anything, for
      the world outside its borders,
      and is burderned by a hierarchy
      of personalities and games
      people play.

      I won't reveal any more than
      this, in
      case someone is
      currently reading "Magister
      Ludi: The Glass Bead Game,"
      but I will say this - throughout
      the whole story, Bruce Willis
      is dead.


      No, actually, the truth seeker,
      Knecht (which, in German,
      means servant and/or knight)
      (or so the Germans would have
      us believe) is, to the dumb-
      foundment of his "superiors",
      really looking for truth.

      No substitutes.

      I hope I didn't give away too
      much, as the book is almost
      600 pages long, but, actually,
      I haven't, because there is
      so much truth in the story
      that everytime I re-read it,
      I realize something new.

      I know we used to say that
      about certain ECK books
      (before Harold) but the
      stuff that Paul took from
      others is timeless as well.

      What was kind of amusing
      is that when I read the book
      the first time, Darwin was
      the "Master."

      One of the first main characters

      in the story is the "Music Master."

      prometheus wrote:

      Here's a review from Amazon.com
      of Magister Ludi, Master of the Game:

      "What is the Glass Bead Game?
      It is no less than the highest
      reason that an entire future
      civilization exists. It is the
      grand and ongoing synthesis
      of all knowledge into a unified,
      integrated whole (a Unio Mystica.)

      It is an attempt to forge a
      holographic intellectual world
      where all is interconnected and
      reflected in every part. This is
      a mission to weave the golden
      thread of significance and meaning
      through every part of a culture-
      science and the arts and the
      spiritual are all unified into a
      system of concentric, interpenetrating

      All this is primarily accomplished
      by using the language of music
      and mathematics as common
      universal symbolism (the "glass
      beads" are part of a symbolic
      aid that was once used
      for this purpose.)

      It is no wonder that the book
      places the first origins of the
      game with Pythagoras, Gnostics,
      and Socratic ethics. No wonder
      that the League of Journeyers
      to the East also figure prominently
      in its development. To some
      extent the Game has been the
      goal of all sensitive and introspective
      individuals and groups down
      through the ages.

      All of this stands in stark contrast
      to our own Feuilletonistic Age
      where all knowledge, all culture,
      is unsynthesized, chaotic, and
      largely meaningless babble.

      The crisis that develops from
      this is that even if you accomplish
      this grand synthesis in some isolated
      ivory tower refuge of intellectual
      contemplatives- it isn't enough.

      It is necessary to reach out to the
      entire society once it is achieved
      in the same way that a Bodhisattva
      attempts to enlighten the rest
      mankind instead of individually
      passing onto Nirvana. The entire
      society must be made whole and
      sacred and not just an isolated elite.

      This is the realization that comes
      even to the Magister Ludi, the
      Master of the Game.

      For the game to be ultimately
      meaningful we have to coach
      everyone to eventually become

      ************ ********* ********* ****

      Thus, another reason to justify religion!
      Or, can this same thing (i.e. the inflow/
      outflow principle) be accomplished without
      the religious strings attached? Not by
      Eckankar! ECKists have strings attached
      to their membership donations or else
      they can lose initiations!

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